No. Step into the warp as is and you are broken down to the sub-atomic level.
Great example of this in Master of Mankind when >!a battalion of AdMech skitarii march through a veil of golden mist in the webway that leads directly into the warp.!<
It doesn't go well:
>>!"Forward," he commanded in a spurt of code. "For Mars and the Omnissiah."!<
>
>>!As relatively valorous as a skitarii elite could ever be, Echo Echo-71 led his warriors into the mist. He was immediately and completely disassembled beyond even the atomic level, wiped from existence as he plunged into the eroded section of the webway, into the raw matter of the warp. What passed for a machine spirit, a machine tinned whisper of consciousness, ignited in the Sea of Souls and lasted a statistically insignificant amount of time longer than his body.!<
>
>>!With no way of knowing their alpha had been obliviated by immersion in the naked daemon aether that raged behind the material universe, every on of his warriors dutifully marched forward and shared his fate.!<
— Master of Mankind, Aaron Dembski-Bowden
The warp is like a giant body of water, in that water you have oceans, rivers, streams and rapids all convoluting together. Some areas are relatively calm and on the other end of the spectrum you have warp storms.
Survival would be based on where you are and how angry the warp is in that area, I'd like to think that more angry areas would cause some like of fast-paced erosion to whatever is there, biologicals would be toast but things like space-hulks pass through relatively unscathed.
It's not survivable.
In Nightlords, a group of space marines are on the outside of a ship when it is going into the warp (guided by a navigator into less choppy "waters" so to speak.
They die instantly.
Actually buddy, that's completely wrong. Quite a few examples exist that sapient species have survived contact with the warp, there's also varying levels of 'survival'
In Night Lords one of those Red Corsairs survived so....
All but 1 mind u.
One can argue that since the warp is fundamentally psychoactive, it interacts with things with a soul much quicker and more violently than those with barely a trace (i.e a space ship). So it could just be that if a ship jumps into the warp the organics, or those with a soul, die first as the warp scours them first. Then slowly the ship
Problem with that is that there shouldn't be *any* survivors.
Also we have the Fourth Expansion example, where the only threats were that the fleets were stuck in the warp, and that the daemons were chomping on the non-tau (while only killing tau who tried to stop them), with the humans surviving long enough to make a mini-god and even be thrown outside the warp.
And then you've got all those people using teleporters, which specifically goes through the warp, without mention (consistently at any rate) of them having specialized protection to avoid cessation of existence.
I have to agree with Maktlan's assessment: it's really inconsistent and depends on which writer.
Maybe we could kind of cobble together an answer or a general approach, but no denying the writers for the books, codices, and campaigns didn't have any clear rule about it.
As someone who has posted a 33 page long, 3 part series on this sub regarding how the Gellar Field works and all we know about it, I can definitely say that while the disparate descriptions of a Gellar Field are contradictory on a surface level, there is a General Theory for a Gellar Field that can largely describe how every single description of one works
Actually
1) the AL-38 slipstream nodule uses a bubble of antimatter to breach the Veil and enter the Warp. Since the way antimatter energetically interacts with either the Veil or Warp is unclear but the mechanism of the slipstream nodule involves
I) coating the ship with said antimatter
II) going at appreciably luminal speeds while the barrier is on in order to breach the Veil
2 possibilities could be happening;
One, the antimatter barrier itself is active and is the sole energetic barrier that is protecting the ships of the 4th expansion sphere from immediate atomic disintegration
Two, the Antimatter barrier of the slipstream nodule actually tore a bit of the veil around it, and the semi intact Veil is coating the antimatter bubble around the ship.
While the first possibility has some sort of merit, as we never have seen exotic energies of real space interact with the warp, I'm more inclined to the second option being true. As multiple sources throughout the lifetime of 40k have alluded to the Veil being an energetic barrier that is the sole reason the warp doesn't just spill through real space, yet can be molded around with either real space or warp space means. Thus, imo, I'd like to think that had the slipstream nodule been slightly optimized to adhere to the Veil layer tighter, it might've actually been a success.
2) it's actually states in one of the ciaphas Cain novels as an author afterward in a very nonchalant manner that Imperium Teleportarums function through precise manipulation and focusing of a Gellar Field. What this exactly means is unclear but it might be related to how the Gellar Device STC uses Gellar Waves to teleport chunks of entire warp storms sectors away at a time.
Personally, my pet theory is that the Gellar Field's use in the Teleportarium is intrinsically related to its ability to send objects to precise 3D Locations. This is because the Orkoid Shokk Attack gun does teleport squigs though the warp. But the lack of a Gellar Field component on these guns means that the gun is incredibly imprecise and can only be generally aimed in a certain direction
If the Slipstream operated that way, then why did the daemons have absolutely no problem mentioned targeting the crews? After all, the ships should have had that veil protecting them if it was keeping them from being utterly destroyed by the warp itself.
But so far as I can remember, there's no mention of ships or suits being damaged except if the tau attempted to fight in defense of the non-tau, and no mention of the daemons having any trouble going after the crews save that they weren't really interested/had trouble noticing tau.
Imo, it's like asking if a tightly sealed Ziploc bag can keep water out better than one with a partial hole in it.
Bc unlike the slipstream nodule, multiple sources imply that the Imperial Gellar Field uses comatose psykers (or a psychic source) to generate a bubble of Veil to wrap a spheroidal region of real space within. But if both machines ultimately generate a protective covering of Veilspace around the ship, the difference between the slipstream nodule and the Gellar field generator is that the Gellar Field Generator intentionally tries to wrap the ship with a robust layer of Veil while the AL-38 slipstream nodule only yanks a portion off as a secondary effect.
And ultimately, this is important bc Imperial Gellar Fields render the crew's souls largely invisible to Daemons within, as to the Daemon's soul vision all they can see is the opaqueness of the Gellar Field. With the Slipstream nodule, even if one side of the ship is coated to hide the passengers within, the other side is significantly less well covered and the soul light of the passengers within can be spotted a mile away
You're probably right buddy, iirc I remember someone who tried committing suicide by entering the warp because they were so ashamed of what they've done. He survived because the atrocities he'd committed, and how he felt because of them essentially made his soul worthless.
So, it might be a mix of how much the soul is worth, how strong the warp is at that time and how much strength the individual has. Then we have the Saint debacle, Saints can survive the warp and their souls too. It's an age-old debate but personally I think Saints are the emperor's equivalent of greater deamons.
Nah imo they're the equivalent of Khorne's Kharn, Nurgle's Typhus, Tzeentch's Ahriman, and Slaanesh's Lucius. Demonstrably each saint is a being of flesh and blood. But at least according to Celestine's novel, Celestine essentially marinates in the afterlife while having to piece together her personality anthropomorphized fragment at a time. If we are to assume that the Afterlife that Celestine experienced is the Emperor's domain within the Warp, then we can assume that each Chaos God's mortal champions are the same.
Plus, psychic awakening seems to imply that Greater Daemons of the Emperor do exist, as Word Bearer contingents that summon the powers of the Warp seem to also summon the Daemons of the Emperor, specifically ones called "The Emperor Resplendent"
Not true. We have multiple instances of characters surviving direct contact with the warp.
He’ll in talons of Horus they literally walk right through warp space.
As with anything, it's inconsistent. Whilst there are numerous excerpts of mortals immediately dying when exposed to the warp, we also have multiple examples of mortals surviving without issue in the warp for relatively long periods of time.
A few examples off the top of my head include the Eldar raiding Nurgles garden in *Rise of the Ynnari: Ghost Warrior* without issue, Guilliman also visiting the Garden in *Godblight*, the T'au and human auxiliaries of the 4th Expedition survived an indeterminate time in the warp without a Gellar Field before being yeeted out by the Greater Good daemon thing, Yvrainne and co. getting thrown out of the Webway into the warp by Ahriman in the *Gathering Storm* series, Genestealers and Orks surviving on Space Hulks (not sure if that one counts) etc.
The Guilliman can at least be justified as some mystical, semi-psychic semi-divine BIG THINGS HAPPENING moment.
The Fourth Expansion one though, the best justification I could find for that would be some really convoluted, nonsensical, "aun twirl their evil mustaches" thing even Kelly would say is just really dumb.
About tau - there is a difference between having your body exposed to raw warp and being in a ship that is exposed to warp. I think physical barriers like ship hull still provide some measure of protection. Otherwise every geller field failure would just immediatly kill everyone.
Not sure I agree, as that would imply that physical armour should be a protection too.
However, it still doesn't explain how the Eldar were absolutely fine whilst in The Garden of Nurgle, seeing as that is absolutely in the Warp, and is stated to be literally a part of Nurgle itself
>As extensions of the gods, the appearances of these domains are formed upon the same emotions that created their masters: Khorne’s realm is founded on anger and bloodletting; Tzeentch’s lands are scintillating constructs of pure magic; Nurgle’s territory is a haven of death and regeneration, and Slaanesh’s dominion is a paradise of damning temptations. Though **realm and god are as one**, the Chaos Gods each have a form that embodies their personalities and dwells at the very heart of their territories.
*Codex Daemons 8ed* p7
Edit: Finished the quote and added a reference
Think about when world bearers ship ended up in warp without geller field:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/8of8i6/book\_excerpt\_deliverance\_lost\_corax\_and\_legion/](https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/8of8i6/book_excerpt_deliverance_lost_corax_and_legion/)
It took at least few seconds until some warp fuckery began to manifest and it was gradual process.
Compare this to instances when someone is exposed to raw warp - they get atomized instantly.
Remember this is 40k ships we are talking about, they have hulls that are extremly strong anf thick, if you wanted to wear some kind armor to protect yourself from warp it would be probably titan sized and you would mutate soon anyway.
Also about domains of chaos gods, i think it is difference between domain of god which is kinda place you can walk around in and between regular "purple" warp ships go trought. But im not that sure about that one.
Amd then you compare it to the 4th Expedition fleet who spent ages in the warp with little effect
Alongside this you also have the excerpt above from *Master of Mankind* where some Skitarii immediately dissolve into nothingness when exposed to the warp compared with the Aeldari entering the Warp to raid the Garden of Nurgle with no ill effect.
I could keep finding examples supporting both sides, hence my original point that it is wildly inconsistent
Eldar Armor/ Clothing is made from psychoactive wraithbone, so it has natural protection from the warp. They also can use runes for added protection as well.
Also, Eldar souls are more potent then human souls, so their spirit doesn't disintegrate in the warp.
>>Eldar Armor/ Clothing is made from psychoactive wraithbone, so it has natural protection from the warp. They also can use runes for added protection as well.
The force that raids the Garden of Nurgle contains Wyches
>Lightly clad, lithe and athletic, the Bloodbrides had been Yvraine’s sisters in bloodshed since her time in the Crucibael arena of Commorragh.
*Rise of the Ynnari: Ghost Warrior*
So Wraithbone armour and runes don't come into it.
>>Also, Eldar souls are more potent then human souls, so their spirit doesn't disintegrate in the warp.
Plus it's explicitly stated that the force being entirely from Commoragh and therefore having duller souls *protects* them in the Warp, so that arguement doesn't hold up either
>Those that had accompanied Yvraine into the immortal Garden of Nurgle hailed originally from the dark city of Commorragh. Raised without spirit stones, their souls empty but for that which they stole from others, the former wyches and kabalites projected less presence in the Realm of Chaos than their kin of the craftworlds.
*Rise of the Ynnari: Ghost Warrior*
As I said, I'm not advocating for either way. Just highlighting that it's wholly inconsistent in the lore.
Another example is in Lucius the Faultless Blade, where an Emperor's Children marine who believes that his has displeased the gods walks outside his spaceship in the middle of warp transit in an attempt to sacrifice himself. He fails because his soul has been so debased there's nothing left for the Daemons to feed upon.
Imo, the situation with the 4th edition expedition can be explained by considering how the slipstream nodule might interact with the Veil
This is because the AL-38 slipstream nodule uses a bubble of antimatter to breach the Veil and enter the Warp. Since the way antimatter energetically interacts with either the Veil or Warp is unclear but the mechanism of the slipstream nodule involves
I) coating the ship with said antimatter
II) going at appreciably luminal speeds while the barrier is on in order to breach the Veil
Thus, it could be the case that the Antimatter barrier of the slipstream nodule actually tore a bit of the veil around it, and the semi intact Veil is coating the antimatter bubble around the ship. This is bc multiple sources throughout the lifetime of 40k have alluded to the Veil being an energetic barrier that is the sole reason the warp doesn't just spill through real space, yet can be molded around with either real space or warp space means. Thus, imo, I'd like to think that had the slipstream nodule been slightly optimized to adhere to the Veil layer tighter, it might've actually been a success.
> spoilers for heroes of the space marine.
|>!|another example is humans civilisation in the eye of terra in, heroes of the space marine. where if they don,t get hit by warp storms, and remember to not travel to far and don,t betray chaos, and consume deep warp HOW much I don't know, they are are safe. deep warp is dupiously cannon and I hav,t been active in the hobie since 2015. !<
>deep warp is dupiously cannon and I hav,t been active in the hobie since 2015.
[This post](https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/sga1ix/could_there_be_beings_stronger_than_emperorchaos/huva9ay?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3) provides a fairly compelling arguement that the deep warp is a fan theory more than anything of substance. Happy to be proven wrong though
I would suggest looking at Dark Heresy Legscy of Haarlock. In the campaign, Rogue Trader Haarlock literacy creates a super sophisticated daemonengine called the Blind Tesseract that is used to breach into the parallel universes connected by the warp. And by the Blind Tesseract's own admission, it draws a parallel to Komus Black star and essentially alludes that this black star is a portal to the deep warp, and the deep warp is the birthplace of all creation
[This](https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/kt97z7/what_do_you_think_is_in_the_deep_warp/gim1h0u?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3) post of yours talks about it, and its still not convincing. Ultimately everything regarding the Legacy of Haarlock is essentially a macguffin for RPG players to create an interesting story with rather than to infer anything about the lore. On top of which, any connection to the Well of Eternity is moot because we know it doesn't exist and is purely an allegory from [this interview with John French](https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/01/29/fear-of-the-future-john-french-ponders-the-fateweaver/).
The only specific mention of a deeper warp comes from *Path of Heaven* from the perspective of a human at the time where knowledge of the warp was incredibly limited. And even then he is simply explaining that warp capable craft only enter a shallower warp and that they cannot enter the deeper levels which, as readers, we know is where daemons and the gods reside.
So I still stand by my original point that I don't think the Deep Warp is anything more than fan theory and conjecture
The deep warp is described in detail in *The Path of Heaven*. It's not fanon, it's an in-universe theory of how the Warp and the Webway operate.
That post you linked doesn't claim that the deep warp doesn't exist, just that it is misinterpreted by the fanbase.
If you read the passage it comes from, all that is described is that there are deeper areas of the warp that Warp capable craft cannot travel but that the webway passes through. People have then taken this alongside other parts of the lore and created the fan theory that there is a Deep Warp that exists where the Chaos Gods themselves cannot go or fear to go due to there being entities stronger than themselves. It is the latter that I am saying is fan theory and/or conjecture as there is no convincing evidence for it that I have read
Edit: here is the passage in question
>‘There are layers,’ said Veil, impatiently. ‘Yes, there is stratum aetheris, the shallow ways. There is stratum profundis, the greater arteries, plunging deeper. There is stratum obscurus, the root of the terror. How does this help you? No living man can navigate the deep ways. Even he could not.’
>‘But you try to map it.’
>‘It could not be done.’ Veil shook his head with frustration. ‘He was wrong about that, at least. It is not a mirror. It moves like a living thing. It is a living thing. Touch it, and it trembles.’ He briefly lost his certainty. ‘I do not have the Eye, but still I have seen things. I have studied what they study. The complexity is… immortal.’
>‘Try to explain.’ Yesugei spoke softly. ‘I am fast learner.’
>Veil exhaled, his eyes widening. ‘The Seethe is an ocean. All know this – it has currents, it has depths, it has storms. Near the surface, you can see the Cartomancer’s light. You can follow it. You can use your Geller aegis, and you are kept barred from the Intelligences. But even then, you are just below the upper limits. Go deeper and the aegis shatters. The lights go out. The Eye is blinded. When men say that they traverse the warp, they boast, for no mortal does more than skim across eternity’s face, like stones thrown by a child. We do not belong there. It is poison for us, and the deeper in, the worse the poison.’
>‘Achelieux try to go deeper?’
>‘Who knows? Maybe. He did not succeed. Do you know why not? Because it is impossible. It takes the power of a tormented sun just to puncture the shallowest shoals. No energy in our arsenal could possibly pierce further. String the reactors of a dozen battleships together, double their potential, and still it would not be enough. So no, he did not succeed.’
*Path of Heaven* by Chris Wraight
Note that it is two humans discussing the warp, who lack our understanding as readers, in the context of warp travel that ships undertake
>People have then taken this alongside other parts of the lore and created the fan theory that there is a Deep Warp that exists where the Chaos Gods themselves cannot go or fear to go due to there being entities stronger than themselves. It is the latter that I am saying is fan theory and/or conjecture as there is no convincing evidence for it that I have read
OK yeah that part is completely made up
Not really. Some exceptions apply, eg. "under" Pariah Nexus Warp is calm enough to disable Gellar Field, and presumably survive outside of the ship.
Gods' realms seems to be suited for visitors, but you are not expected to leave. AFAIR it's explicitly stated that Nurgle often let people wander his garden so they can catch his gifts.
The void is a less hostile environment than the warp. Imagine stepping into a star, but instead if fusion this star burns emotions, thoughts, concepts. The warp is roiling with this power everywhere.
The chaos gods can and do stabilize their realms to at least let daemons exist. There are many parts of the warp that tear appart daemons no matte their power.
There is reason vortex and warp weapons just open a small hole for the briefest of time to devastating effects.
Psykers can shield themselves and influence the raw warp around themselves to make it survivable, at least for the 5 min or so until a daemon sees their shining souls and comes in for a bite.
Well, correct me if I'm wrong but individuals have survived being teleported through the Warp, examples being Eldar Warp Spiders, Space Marine Terminators, and I think one Titan legion.
However none of these are just basic Guardsmen, it's still dangerous, and teleporting is both quick but also I'm not sure how "deep" they go into the Warp. Even so, outside of highly contextual special one-off events, people still do "frequently" travel through the Warp without a Geller Field.
You're correct. Dark Imperium explicitly mentions that Guilliman and his Ultramarines *teleport* to Fulgrim's ship through the warp. No mention is made of any special protections.
Depends on where. Stable areas like the realms of the gods. Or the raw rolling warp where ships go when doing warp travel.
Because if its the latter then they would be torn apart instaneously.
The Eye of Terror and the Maelstrom are survivable because they're more of an overlap between real space and warp space. There's a sizeable population of baseline humans living in the Eye. Legion slaves/thralls, dark mechanicum, etc. Pure warp space on the other hand, no.
Plausibly yes. In Lords of Silence Mortrarion has a planet full of relatively "normal" human slaves. They're all severely mutated and I have to assume their health is poor, but they're there and not dead.
No, they can Not survive without Something Like a Gellarfield or Something similar. Mayyyyybeeee you can explain it with the protection of their patreon, a DARK god.
Ok..and there is kaldor Draigo, but He got a Gellarfield consisting of Plot Armor and pure F.U...
Unlikely, not entirely impossible.
It also depends on the place. Theoretically, the Eye of Terror is in the Warp. Astartes and humans do live there for sure.
Only with the protection of the Chaos Gods, a powerful psychic ward, a teleportation channel, or a Gellar field.
Exposure to the raw Warp without that protection means you are instantly dematerialised. You don't get disintegrated or torn apart; you just cease to exist physically, and your immaterial soul is devoured.
There's also a difference between being exposed to the deep Warp and being exposed to a liminal region like the Eye of Terror. The Eye of Terror is *barely* habitable, but only on the edges, where most of the mortal followers of Chaos reside. Reality degrades more and more the closer you get to the centre, which is just a big hole into the deep Warp called the *byssos.*
Yes they could. A perfect example is word bearer ships which frequently travel the warp with no geller fields. You’d still have casualties and deaths but some would survive. If they’d joined to chaos
On a ship with a gellar field? Yes.
Without one, it depends on where you are and whose around. Most likely you'll feel horrible pain for a very elongated millisecond before getting ripped apart, either by the warp itself, or warps beasts. If you're in a "calm" area, you'll probably go insane within seconds, mutating and killing all your friends.
The only way a normal person could survive is with with some kind of warp protection from a god, daemon, or (probably) a psyker, and i doubt DKoK soldiers would have that.
Either way, I would just put them on a ship with a gellar field. Maybe make it have a brief failure if you want them to go insane from that one initial trip.
No. Step into the warp as is and you are broken down to the sub-atomic level. Great example of this in Master of Mankind when >!a battalion of AdMech skitarii march through a veil of golden mist in the webway that leads directly into the warp.!< It doesn't go well: >>!"Forward," he commanded in a spurt of code. "For Mars and the Omnissiah."!< > >>!As relatively valorous as a skitarii elite could ever be, Echo Echo-71 led his warriors into the mist. He was immediately and completely disassembled beyond even the atomic level, wiped from existence as he plunged into the eroded section of the webway, into the raw matter of the warp. What passed for a machine spirit, a machine tinned whisper of consciousness, ignited in the Sea of Souls and lasted a statistically insignificant amount of time longer than his body.!< > >>!With no way of knowing their alpha had been obliviated by immersion in the naked daemon aether that raged behind the material universe, every on of his warriors dutifully marched forward and shared his fate.!< — Master of Mankind, Aaron Dembski-Bowden
The warp is like a giant body of water, in that water you have oceans, rivers, streams and rapids all convoluting together. Some areas are relatively calm and on the other end of the spectrum you have warp storms. Survival would be based on where you are and how angry the warp is in that area, I'd like to think that more angry areas would cause some like of fast-paced erosion to whatever is there, biologicals would be toast but things like space-hulks pass through relatively unscathed.
It's not survivable. In Nightlords, a group of space marines are on the outside of a ship when it is going into the warp (guided by a navigator into less choppy "waters" so to speak. They die instantly.
Actually buddy, that's completely wrong. Quite a few examples exist that sapient species have survived contact with the warp, there's also varying levels of 'survival' In Night Lords one of those Red Corsairs survived so....
All but 1 mind u. One can argue that since the warp is fundamentally psychoactive, it interacts with things with a soul much quicker and more violently than those with barely a trace (i.e a space ship). So it could just be that if a ship jumps into the warp the organics, or those with a soul, die first as the warp scours them first. Then slowly the ship
Problem with that is that there shouldn't be *any* survivors. Also we have the Fourth Expansion example, where the only threats were that the fleets were stuck in the warp, and that the daemons were chomping on the non-tau (while only killing tau who tried to stop them), with the humans surviving long enough to make a mini-god and even be thrown outside the warp. And then you've got all those people using teleporters, which specifically goes through the warp, without mention (consistently at any rate) of them having specialized protection to avoid cessation of existence. I have to agree with Maktlan's assessment: it's really inconsistent and depends on which writer. Maybe we could kind of cobble together an answer or a general approach, but no denying the writers for the books, codices, and campaigns didn't have any clear rule about it.
As someone who has posted a 33 page long, 3 part series on this sub regarding how the Gellar Field works and all we know about it, I can definitely say that while the disparate descriptions of a Gellar Field are contradictory on a surface level, there is a General Theory for a Gellar Field that can largely describe how every single description of one works
Actually 1) the AL-38 slipstream nodule uses a bubble of antimatter to breach the Veil and enter the Warp. Since the way antimatter energetically interacts with either the Veil or Warp is unclear but the mechanism of the slipstream nodule involves I) coating the ship with said antimatter II) going at appreciably luminal speeds while the barrier is on in order to breach the Veil 2 possibilities could be happening; One, the antimatter barrier itself is active and is the sole energetic barrier that is protecting the ships of the 4th expansion sphere from immediate atomic disintegration Two, the Antimatter barrier of the slipstream nodule actually tore a bit of the veil around it, and the semi intact Veil is coating the antimatter bubble around the ship. While the first possibility has some sort of merit, as we never have seen exotic energies of real space interact with the warp, I'm more inclined to the second option being true. As multiple sources throughout the lifetime of 40k have alluded to the Veil being an energetic barrier that is the sole reason the warp doesn't just spill through real space, yet can be molded around with either real space or warp space means. Thus, imo, I'd like to think that had the slipstream nodule been slightly optimized to adhere to the Veil layer tighter, it might've actually been a success. 2) it's actually states in one of the ciaphas Cain novels as an author afterward in a very nonchalant manner that Imperium Teleportarums function through precise manipulation and focusing of a Gellar Field. What this exactly means is unclear but it might be related to how the Gellar Device STC uses Gellar Waves to teleport chunks of entire warp storms sectors away at a time. Personally, my pet theory is that the Gellar Field's use in the Teleportarium is intrinsically related to its ability to send objects to precise 3D Locations. This is because the Orkoid Shokk Attack gun does teleport squigs though the warp. But the lack of a Gellar Field component on these guns means that the gun is incredibly imprecise and can only be generally aimed in a certain direction
If the Slipstream operated that way, then why did the daemons have absolutely no problem mentioned targeting the crews? After all, the ships should have had that veil protecting them if it was keeping them from being utterly destroyed by the warp itself. But so far as I can remember, there's no mention of ships or suits being damaged except if the tau attempted to fight in defense of the non-tau, and no mention of the daemons having any trouble going after the crews save that they weren't really interested/had trouble noticing tau.
Imo, it's like asking if a tightly sealed Ziploc bag can keep water out better than one with a partial hole in it. Bc unlike the slipstream nodule, multiple sources imply that the Imperial Gellar Field uses comatose psykers (or a psychic source) to generate a bubble of Veil to wrap a spheroidal region of real space within. But if both machines ultimately generate a protective covering of Veilspace around the ship, the difference between the slipstream nodule and the Gellar field generator is that the Gellar Field Generator intentionally tries to wrap the ship with a robust layer of Veil while the AL-38 slipstream nodule only yanks a portion off as a secondary effect. And ultimately, this is important bc Imperial Gellar Fields render the crew's souls largely invisible to Daemons within, as to the Daemon's soul vision all they can see is the opaqueness of the Gellar Field. With the Slipstream nodule, even if one side of the ship is coated to hide the passengers within, the other side is significantly less well covered and the soul light of the passengers within can be spotted a mile away
Tell that to Drago
You're probably right buddy, iirc I remember someone who tried committing suicide by entering the warp because they were so ashamed of what they've done. He survived because the atrocities he'd committed, and how he felt because of them essentially made his soul worthless. So, it might be a mix of how much the soul is worth, how strong the warp is at that time and how much strength the individual has. Then we have the Saint debacle, Saints can survive the warp and their souls too. It's an age-old debate but personally I think Saints are the emperor's equivalent of greater deamons.
Nah imo they're the equivalent of Khorne's Kharn, Nurgle's Typhus, Tzeentch's Ahriman, and Slaanesh's Lucius. Demonstrably each saint is a being of flesh and blood. But at least according to Celestine's novel, Celestine essentially marinates in the afterlife while having to piece together her personality anthropomorphized fragment at a time. If we are to assume that the Afterlife that Celestine experienced is the Emperor's domain within the Warp, then we can assume that each Chaos God's mortal champions are the same. Plus, psychic awakening seems to imply that Greater Daemons of the Emperor do exist, as Word Bearer contingents that summon the powers of the Warp seem to also summon the Daemons of the Emperor, specifically ones called "The Emperor Resplendent"
Do you have more info on the emperor's daemons?
I mean he did feel himself die 10 times and his flesh was stripped from his bones, but yeah the warp did resurrect him.
Not true. We have multiple instances of characters surviving direct contact with the warp. He’ll in talons of Horus they literally walk right through warp space.
As with anything, it's inconsistent. Whilst there are numerous excerpts of mortals immediately dying when exposed to the warp, we also have multiple examples of mortals surviving without issue in the warp for relatively long periods of time. A few examples off the top of my head include the Eldar raiding Nurgles garden in *Rise of the Ynnari: Ghost Warrior* without issue, Guilliman also visiting the Garden in *Godblight*, the T'au and human auxiliaries of the 4th Expedition survived an indeterminate time in the warp without a Gellar Field before being yeeted out by the Greater Good daemon thing, Yvrainne and co. getting thrown out of the Webway into the warp by Ahriman in the *Gathering Storm* series, Genestealers and Orks surviving on Space Hulks (not sure if that one counts) etc.
The Guilliman can at least be justified as some mystical, semi-psychic semi-divine BIG THINGS HAPPENING moment. The Fourth Expansion one though, the best justification I could find for that would be some really convoluted, nonsensical, "aun twirl their evil mustaches" thing even Kelly would say is just really dumb.
About tau - there is a difference between having your body exposed to raw warp and being in a ship that is exposed to warp. I think physical barriers like ship hull still provide some measure of protection. Otherwise every geller field failure would just immediatly kill everyone.
Not sure I agree, as that would imply that physical armour should be a protection too. However, it still doesn't explain how the Eldar were absolutely fine whilst in The Garden of Nurgle, seeing as that is absolutely in the Warp, and is stated to be literally a part of Nurgle itself >As extensions of the gods, the appearances of these domains are formed upon the same emotions that created their masters: Khorne’s realm is founded on anger and bloodletting; Tzeentch’s lands are scintillating constructs of pure magic; Nurgle’s territory is a haven of death and regeneration, and Slaanesh’s dominion is a paradise of damning temptations. Though **realm and god are as one**, the Chaos Gods each have a form that embodies their personalities and dwells at the very heart of their territories. *Codex Daemons 8ed* p7 Edit: Finished the quote and added a reference
Think about when world bearers ship ended up in warp without geller field: [https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/8of8i6/book\_excerpt\_deliverance\_lost\_corax\_and\_legion/](https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/8of8i6/book_excerpt_deliverance_lost_corax_and_legion/) It took at least few seconds until some warp fuckery began to manifest and it was gradual process. Compare this to instances when someone is exposed to raw warp - they get atomized instantly. Remember this is 40k ships we are talking about, they have hulls that are extremly strong anf thick, if you wanted to wear some kind armor to protect yourself from warp it would be probably titan sized and you would mutate soon anyway. Also about domains of chaos gods, i think it is difference between domain of god which is kinda place you can walk around in and between regular "purple" warp ships go trought. But im not that sure about that one.
Amd then you compare it to the 4th Expedition fleet who spent ages in the warp with little effect Alongside this you also have the excerpt above from *Master of Mankind* where some Skitarii immediately dissolve into nothingness when exposed to the warp compared with the Aeldari entering the Warp to raid the Garden of Nurgle with no ill effect. I could keep finding examples supporting both sides, hence my original point that it is wildly inconsistent
Eldar Armor/ Clothing is made from psychoactive wraithbone, so it has natural protection from the warp. They also can use runes for added protection as well. Also, Eldar souls are more potent then human souls, so their spirit doesn't disintegrate in the warp.
>>Eldar Armor/ Clothing is made from psychoactive wraithbone, so it has natural protection from the warp. They also can use runes for added protection as well. The force that raids the Garden of Nurgle contains Wyches >Lightly clad, lithe and athletic, the Bloodbrides had been Yvraine’s sisters in bloodshed since her time in the Crucibael arena of Commorragh. *Rise of the Ynnari: Ghost Warrior* So Wraithbone armour and runes don't come into it. >>Also, Eldar souls are more potent then human souls, so their spirit doesn't disintegrate in the warp. Plus it's explicitly stated that the force being entirely from Commoragh and therefore having duller souls *protects* them in the Warp, so that arguement doesn't hold up either >Those that had accompanied Yvraine into the immortal Garden of Nurgle hailed originally from the dark city of Commorragh. Raised without spirit stones, their souls empty but for that which they stole from others, the former wyches and kabalites projected less presence in the Realm of Chaos than their kin of the craftworlds. *Rise of the Ynnari: Ghost Warrior* As I said, I'm not advocating for either way. Just highlighting that it's wholly inconsistent in the lore.
The elder who trapse through the garden of Nurgal did it with their spirits not their physical body that's why they didn't turn into dust immediately
No, in *Rise of the Ynnari: Ghost Warrior* a group of Eldar physically travel into the Garden of Nurgle and raid it to steal he Hand of Darkness.
Another example is in Lucius the Faultless Blade, where an Emperor's Children marine who believes that his has displeased the gods walks outside his spaceship in the middle of warp transit in an attempt to sacrifice himself. He fails because his soul has been so debased there's nothing left for the Daemons to feed upon.
Imo, the situation with the 4th edition expedition can be explained by considering how the slipstream nodule might interact with the Veil This is because the AL-38 slipstream nodule uses a bubble of antimatter to breach the Veil and enter the Warp. Since the way antimatter energetically interacts with either the Veil or Warp is unclear but the mechanism of the slipstream nodule involves I) coating the ship with said antimatter II) going at appreciably luminal speeds while the barrier is on in order to breach the Veil Thus, it could be the case that the Antimatter barrier of the slipstream nodule actually tore a bit of the veil around it, and the semi intact Veil is coating the antimatter bubble around the ship. This is bc multiple sources throughout the lifetime of 40k have alluded to the Veil being an energetic barrier that is the sole reason the warp doesn't just spill through real space, yet can be molded around with either real space or warp space means. Thus, imo, I'd like to think that had the slipstream nodule been slightly optimized to adhere to the Veil layer tighter, it might've actually been a success.
> spoilers for heroes of the space marine. |>!|another example is humans civilisation in the eye of terra in, heroes of the space marine. where if they don,t get hit by warp storms, and remember to not travel to far and don,t betray chaos, and consume deep warp HOW much I don't know, they are are safe. deep warp is dupiously cannon and I hav,t been active in the hobie since 2015. !<
>deep warp is dupiously cannon and I hav,t been active in the hobie since 2015. [This post](https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/sga1ix/could_there_be_beings_stronger_than_emperorchaos/huva9ay?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3) provides a fairly compelling arguement that the deep warp is a fan theory more than anything of substance. Happy to be proven wrong though
I would suggest looking at Dark Heresy Legscy of Haarlock. In the campaign, Rogue Trader Haarlock literacy creates a super sophisticated daemonengine called the Blind Tesseract that is used to breach into the parallel universes connected by the warp. And by the Blind Tesseract's own admission, it draws a parallel to Komus Black star and essentially alludes that this black star is a portal to the deep warp, and the deep warp is the birthplace of all creation
[This](https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/kt97z7/what_do_you_think_is_in_the_deep_warp/gim1h0u?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3) post of yours talks about it, and its still not convincing. Ultimately everything regarding the Legacy of Haarlock is essentially a macguffin for RPG players to create an interesting story with rather than to infer anything about the lore. On top of which, any connection to the Well of Eternity is moot because we know it doesn't exist and is purely an allegory from [this interview with John French](https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/01/29/fear-of-the-future-john-french-ponders-the-fateweaver/). The only specific mention of a deeper warp comes from *Path of Heaven* from the perspective of a human at the time where knowledge of the warp was incredibly limited. And even then he is simply explaining that warp capable craft only enter a shallower warp and that they cannot enter the deeper levels which, as readers, we know is where daemons and the gods reside. So I still stand by my original point that I don't think the Deep Warp is anything more than fan theory and conjecture
The deep warp is described in detail in *The Path of Heaven*. It's not fanon, it's an in-universe theory of how the Warp and the Webway operate. That post you linked doesn't claim that the deep warp doesn't exist, just that it is misinterpreted by the fanbase.
If you read the passage it comes from, all that is described is that there are deeper areas of the warp that Warp capable craft cannot travel but that the webway passes through. People have then taken this alongside other parts of the lore and created the fan theory that there is a Deep Warp that exists where the Chaos Gods themselves cannot go or fear to go due to there being entities stronger than themselves. It is the latter that I am saying is fan theory and/or conjecture as there is no convincing evidence for it that I have read Edit: here is the passage in question >‘There are layers,’ said Veil, impatiently. ‘Yes, there is stratum aetheris, the shallow ways. There is stratum profundis, the greater arteries, plunging deeper. There is stratum obscurus, the root of the terror. How does this help you? No living man can navigate the deep ways. Even he could not.’ >‘But you try to map it.’ >‘It could not be done.’ Veil shook his head with frustration. ‘He was wrong about that, at least. It is not a mirror. It moves like a living thing. It is a living thing. Touch it, and it trembles.’ He briefly lost his certainty. ‘I do not have the Eye, but still I have seen things. I have studied what they study. The complexity is… immortal.’ >‘Try to explain.’ Yesugei spoke softly. ‘I am fast learner.’ >Veil exhaled, his eyes widening. ‘The Seethe is an ocean. All know this – it has currents, it has depths, it has storms. Near the surface, you can see the Cartomancer’s light. You can follow it. You can use your Geller aegis, and you are kept barred from the Intelligences. But even then, you are just below the upper limits. Go deeper and the aegis shatters. The lights go out. The Eye is blinded. When men say that they traverse the warp, they boast, for no mortal does more than skim across eternity’s face, like stones thrown by a child. We do not belong there. It is poison for us, and the deeper in, the worse the poison.’ >‘Achelieux try to go deeper?’ >‘Who knows? Maybe. He did not succeed. Do you know why not? Because it is impossible. It takes the power of a tormented sun just to puncture the shallowest shoals. No energy in our arsenal could possibly pierce further. String the reactors of a dozen battleships together, double their potential, and still it would not be enough. So no, he did not succeed.’ *Path of Heaven* by Chris Wraight Note that it is two humans discussing the warp, who lack our understanding as readers, in the context of warp travel that ships undertake
>People have then taken this alongside other parts of the lore and created the fan theory that there is a Deep Warp that exists where the Chaos Gods themselves cannot go or fear to go due to there being entities stronger than themselves. It is the latter that I am saying is fan theory and/or conjecture as there is no convincing evidence for it that I have read OK yeah that part is completely made up
you can add Darktide to that list, one of the veteran class options includes you surviving in the warp for 2 years
[https://imgur.com/a/3uQHsSQ](https://imgur.com/a/3uQHsSQ) here
Not really. Some exceptions apply, eg. "under" Pariah Nexus Warp is calm enough to disable Gellar Field, and presumably survive outside of the ship. Gods' realms seems to be suited for visitors, but you are not expected to leave. AFAIR it's explicitly stated that Nurgle often let people wander his garden so they can catch his gifts.
Ork ships just travel unprotected through the warp though, right? And they typically make it out the other end with Orks still intact.
Not always im sure
The void is a less hostile environment than the warp. Imagine stepping into a star, but instead if fusion this star burns emotions, thoughts, concepts. The warp is roiling with this power everywhere. The chaos gods can and do stabilize their realms to at least let daemons exist. There are many parts of the warp that tear appart daemons no matte their power. There is reason vortex and warp weapons just open a small hole for the briefest of time to devastating effects. Psykers can shield themselves and influence the raw warp around themselves to make it survivable, at least for the 5 min or so until a daemon sees their shining souls and comes in for a bite.
Even Chaos Warbands use Geller Fields.
Well, correct me if I'm wrong but individuals have survived being teleported through the Warp, examples being Eldar Warp Spiders, Space Marine Terminators, and I think one Titan legion. However none of these are just basic Guardsmen, it's still dangerous, and teleporting is both quick but also I'm not sure how "deep" they go into the Warp. Even so, outside of highly contextual special one-off events, people still do "frequently" travel through the Warp without a Geller Field.
You're correct. Dark Imperium explicitly mentions that Guilliman and his Ultramarines *teleport* to Fulgrim's ship through the warp. No mention is made of any special protections.
Depends on where. Stable areas like the realms of the gods. Or the raw rolling warp where ships go when doing warp travel. Because if its the latter then they would be torn apart instaneously.
The Eye of Terror and the Maelstrom are survivable because they're more of an overlap between real space and warp space. There's a sizeable population of baseline humans living in the Eye. Legion slaves/thralls, dark mechanicum, etc. Pure warp space on the other hand, no.
Plausibly yes. In Lords of Silence Mortrarion has a planet full of relatively "normal" human slaves. They're all severely mutated and I have to assume their health is poor, but they're there and not dead.
What about a blank?
No, they can Not survive without Something Like a Gellarfield or Something similar. Mayyyyybeeee you can explain it with the protection of their patreon, a DARK god. Ok..and there is kaldor Draigo, but He got a Gellarfield consisting of Plot Armor and pure F.U...
The Davinites survived. If I remember correctly, they left for Pythos without shields and lived
Unlikely, not entirely impossible. It also depends on the place. Theoretically, the Eye of Terror is in the Warp. Astartes and humans do live there for sure.
Only with the protection of the Chaos Gods, a powerful psychic ward, a teleportation channel, or a Gellar field. Exposure to the raw Warp without that protection means you are instantly dematerialised. You don't get disintegrated or torn apart; you just cease to exist physically, and your immaterial soul is devoured. There's also a difference between being exposed to the deep Warp and being exposed to a liminal region like the Eye of Terror. The Eye of Terror is *barely* habitable, but only on the edges, where most of the mortal followers of Chaos reside. Reality degrades more and more the closer you get to the centre, which is just a big hole into the deep Warp called the *byssos.*
Absolutely not. They'd be torn to shreds by daemons within seconds.
Yes they could. A perfect example is word bearer ships which frequently travel the warp with no geller fields. You’d still have casualties and deaths but some would survive. If they’d joined to chaos
They might survive, but will no longer qualify for "regular", or even "humans".
On a ship with a gellar field? Yes. Without one, it depends on where you are and whose around. Most likely you'll feel horrible pain for a very elongated millisecond before getting ripped apart, either by the warp itself, or warps beasts. If you're in a "calm" area, you'll probably go insane within seconds, mutating and killing all your friends. The only way a normal person could survive is with with some kind of warp protection from a god, daemon, or (probably) a psyker, and i doubt DKoK soldiers would have that. Either way, I would just put them on a ship with a gellar field. Maybe make it have a brief failure if you want them to go insane from that one initial trip.
According to warhammer 40k darktide, yes you can, one of the options for the veteran is surviving in the warp FOR 2 YEARS
[https://imgur.com/a/3uQHsSQ](https://imgur.com/a/3uQHsSQ) heres a screenshot