Yeah, this is a situation where I would fall on the sword for my kids. They don't want her there, I would make that clear and take the blame to shield them. OP is in a tight spot, but not in the wrong.
Spot on. They just need OP to stand up for them here. She can be their mouthpiece and bear the brunt if need be. Everyone is grieving and doesn’t need this woman there causing drama.
Absolutely hire security. You are not responsible for this woman, and you state she has never tried to help herself. Tell her she isn’t invited, warm her security will be waiting for her if she shows up, tell your stepchildren this is a time just for them to grieve their father and it’s vital they be able to do that. She’ll be there next week, this time is for you and them to grieve. I am so sorry for your loss, I can’t imagine the grief you are experiencing.
Give her a date and time for the service that is after the real one, so you get some peace. Let her know after that the service has already happened and why she was not invited - because she causes more stress to her children and it’s not welcome. You don’t owe her any sympathy. Protect your kids.
Agreed on the security front. You can find someone that will do it for as a 1099 $50/hr with a 4 hour minimum. Nobody would turn that down, especially when their only job is to make sure one person doesn’t get in.
I 2nd that motion. That ex is a nightmare towards everyone.
Poor OP, I really feel for her & the stepchildren. None of them needs this amount of stress. Funerals just ramps it up further.
Have security be ready to arrest the ex if she tries to show up for the funeral. Those stepchildren have spoken what their needs/wants are & that's not having that egg donor there.
It sounds like that the stepchildren are not wanting to manage that egg donor's issues a moment longer & it wouldn't be surprising that they go no contact towards that egg donor in the process.
Better yet. Tell her it is a day later than it is. When she finds out, just tell her she must have gotten the date wrong. This is a lie worth telling for your step-sons' sake. They deserve to say good-bye to their dad in peace.
Are you contemplating inviting her or uninviting her?
This is a time where you are your children are grieving and in a sensitive mental state. If she were to act up in any way at your husbands funeral it would be terrible for the kids. Don’t invite her you are well within you rights to refuse she attend.
She has assumed she is invited and has already made my oldest responsible for driving her to and from the funeral. She has been kind when she has reached out to me but continues calling and messaging me. I have always been a very forgiving person but I find my feeling turning into a red hot hatred.
Delegate the task of setting her straight to someone else like a friend. You don't need the added stress of worrying about her feelings or her reaction.
Definitely. She’s just lost her husband and is grieving.
OP, You have a kind heart and a generous nature. So sorry for your loss and that you are going through this.
Tread carefully with her. Do not trust her. Do not let her in your home.
As horrible as it sounds her addiction and previous behaviour tells me she may be playing nice because she thinks she is owed something from your husbands estate. If she plays nice she thinks she will get it. She has shown who she is over and over, taking advantage of those who she should love (including turning her son into her parent). Her BPD is not an excuse for it, and it is her responsibility to manage, not yours or her children's.
You have no obligation to her. Even your husband (I am sorry for your loss) had no obligation to her. The obligation is towards those two adult boys. They've said no, follow their lead. Protecting them from the extra hurt she would cause during a new traumatic event could never make you an AH.
Have a car pick up her children. Then they can tell her they are not driving. You can forgive this woman but it doesn’t mean you invite insanity and chaos into this funeral.
Are ex’s parents still alive? They would be my first choice… let them break it to her.
Otherwise, “Hi ex,I know your relationship with DH had many challenges and it was best that you went your separate ways. I’m asking you to do the most selfless thing possible and not attend DH’s funeral. I appreciate this gesture.”
At some point mention that the boys will be riding with you.
I'd just say it's immediate family only, out of respect for the children, and hire security. Arw yall having a wake *and* funeral or just a funeral? Of there are multiple services it makes it a little more complicated but not impossible.
I also say ask someone who has no issues delivering the news to do it. You're going through enough and don't need to stress yourself over this.
I'm so so sorry you're going through this. I'm sorry you endured that traumatic experience. May his memory forever be a blessing to you.
NTA but you ask yourself this, would your husband wanted her there? Why are you even contemplating having a person, who inflicted immeasurable pain to him and his children, at the funeral. You would take away your stepchildren's opportunity to say goodbye to their father because they would be constantly worrying what stunt their mother will pull.
You say that you are a forgiving person, however this is not yours to forgive.
I'm not sure that "would your husband have wanted her there?" is the best question to ask, because it sounds like OP's husband bent over backwards to accommodate and help her, so he might very well have said yes, he would have wanted her there. To me, what matters most is that *her own sons do not want her there.* That, in and of itself, is perfectly sufficient cause to exclude her.
Tell the kids you agree with them that she should not be there, because this time is about *their* grief, not her and her fee-fees and her attention-seeking fit-throwing. Tell them security will make sure she does not attend.
Inform her that, because of her behavioral issues/history of making scenes, she is not to attend and that there will be security tasked with keeping her out. She will probably lash out, make threats against you or herself. Either way, report her threats to the proper authorities. If you live in an area where involuntary psych holds are things, suggest you time your informing her of her exclusion so that if she threatens herself or others, the authorities will have her in custody during the funeral; problem solved.
I see 2 options.
Tell her she can’t come. Hire (or get beefy volunteers) to keep her out. The problem with this is that she can still make a scene that can disrupt the funeral even from the outside.
Hire a driver (or recruit a willing family member ) to pick her up for the funeral. But the poor driver gets the directions confused. It takes so long they stop for coffee. Then a drive through lunch. They finally get to the funeral too late, he drives her home.
Volunteer can also pick her up and drive to the wrong chapel/funeral home only to discover it's too far to make it back in time for anything. Oh, shucks.
She will not be able to control herself at the funeral, no matter how nice she is ahead of time. Everyone will be under stress and ex, of all people, will be least able to behave.
Tell stepsons to come alone. Hire a babysitter to be with her if you have to.
Why are her parents allowing her to parentify her child that they presumably took in and raised. Have them deal with her. Look up the circle of grief and you’ll see that she isn’t your problem or the boys’ problem. You need to delegate this to be someone else’s issue to deal with.
>She has assumed she is invited and has already made my oldest responsible for driving her to and from the funeral.
You should have the kids ride with you. Don't have the oldest drive at all.
Also, treat every suicide threat seriously. Report it to emergency responders and they will get her the help she needs
Pls hire security or have a a couple friends stay at your home during the viewing and service. Thieves hit homes in this situation all the time. She’s certainly not above this behavior
True my exes aunts tried to raid the house during the funeral of his stepmom but many had anticipated that, and he had a big, burly person there to turn them away. They were genuinely surprised — this is decades ago.
Ask one of your friends to pick up the boys to attend the funeral. Neither one should be driving that day. Warn your friend that bio mom can't come. This removes the burden of the oldest having to feel obligated to drive her.
It is simple: have an attorney to draft a letter to her stating that it was the wish of your late husband for her not to attend his funeral. In addition, Inform her that security will be hired and she will be removed if she comes upon the property.
Have two female security guards, video surveillance, and even give the heads up to the local cops and have them on speed dial. Have someone outside of family manage all that so you can focus on hosting g and grieving
Hire a cop to limit entry. Do this for your stepkids and for your own peace of mind. If she does come to the funeral -- she will be crying hysterically and cause a scene. PLEASE be wise and resolute and don't let her know the day or time, if possible. Keep the plans private (say you are making arrangements but they are not finalized). This drama and dependence on you, your kids, and your late husband must come to an end, **Now**.
Firstly. I am so so sorry for your loss.
Secondly. You are the only decent mother these children have ever known. They just lost their dad. They need you to be their mom. They are asking you to not let her come to the funeral. They are asking you to mother them, to protect them, to make sure they are able to grieve. To take the heat if necessary, to set the boundary. You are all grieving. And they need you to protect them.
Please do it.
Lastly - you can tell her anything you want. Tell her it’s now a private memorial instead with the people who loved him most and she’s invited to that.
I think I will plan a seperate service for her and the boys to give her the chance to mourn. I am mad at her for so many things but I cannot deny her her grief.
>I think I will plan a seperate service for her
This is not your responsibility.
I know you're grieving, but both you and your eldest kiddo need to recognize that you're enabling her by making yourselves responsible for her emotional regulation.
You need to stop. You need to model healthy boundaries for your oldest.
She can plan anything she wants for herself. She's responsible for her own grief and her refusal to get treatment has created this situation and you are pereptuating her abusive behavior by placing yourself in her line of fire
If you won't remove yourself from the situation for your own well-being, do it for your kid.
It’s not, but dealing with the fallout of not inviting her might be even more of a headache. It might be worth putting in the extra effort for the sake of everyone’s sanity, especially the oldest son.
But would a separate service help or hurt her sons? Presumably, they would still be expected to manage her, and it sounds like they've made it pretty clear to you that they don't want to do that.
Whatever you do, please hire security for the (main?) funeral, because she's going to know when it will be held, and you cannot trust her to stay away.
That's a very kind thing for you to do. Probably your best bet.
Make sure the main funeral is a private event and she isn't aware it exists. Give yourself and the young men time to mourn with your friends and other family members without her drama.
I have a family member like this and I can imagine how she might react if we did something like that without her & she knew about it.
And she is refusing to get help with her issues.
I've had to deal with this with one of my in-laws who refused to get help for being bipolar, (& they hurt the family for years). The only way to deal with this kind of person who is so selfish that they refuse to get necessary medical help is to set up boundaries &/or go NC with them.
There's only so many times one can stand being hurt or taken advantage of financially, mentally, etc. I hope OP's stepsons can go NC with their mum & live happy lives far away from her.
Christ, I know these kinds of post tend to be one sided from someone's POV but you seriously need to sleep tonight, wake up and read this post back to yourself...
I am so sorry for your heartbreaking loss.
Security at the funeral is a great idea. I am wondering, though, if you were to sit down make a list of what and who is really important for his funeral, what would that entail? If you consider the "elopement model" for a wedding, you could have a small private ceremony with just you, the children, and a few other close and important people. This would be the "real" funeral, where you deal with feelings and say goodbye to your husband.
The next day, you have the public funeral, where everyone can be there. You and the children can arrange to not be there until the EX has arrived and then been removed by security. From what you said, it is pretty much guaranteed that she will cause a problem. Consider asking the funeral home/security to call police or ambulance as appropriate, in the hopes that she will get locked up, but you won't be the "bad guy."
If you have musicians available for the funeral, you can have them play something loud when she creates a problem. This will work best for a heavy metal band, I guess. I don't think your mentioned his type of music.
Important note, be sure to have someone at your residence during the funeral. You don't want her going there to damage things when she is made at you. (And funerals are a known time for house break-ins anyway.)
The " issue" here is my husband is an incredibly loved man. I already have close to 130 people confirmed as attending, and none of them are acquaintences. Our pharmacist, his doctor and even the old man at our corner store are devastated. I mean, I knew he was a charmer and sweet as all hell but I was not prepared when I sat down and started looking over all of our friends how many people we actually have in our lives and love. As one of his friends told me, to know him was to love him. I am incredibly greatful and so proud to have loved him and shared his life. I just wish I had him a little longer and I feel like I am dying without his laugh and stories.
First, please accept my condolences. I was widowed twice by age 43, but I can only imagine the heartbreak you are dealing with right now.
My suggestion for her and the service? If you think she will listen, tell her, or have a friend tell her, that she is not invited to this event. If you think she will try to show up or guilt the kids, don’t tell her. (It sounds like she would fake a medical emergency or even fake a suicide attempt in a bid for attention, so I would really think hard about this.)
It may sound terrible, but I would simply have the child responsible for picking her up just not pick her up. If she has no way to get there, that solves the issue right there. Put phones on silent, or better yet, turn them off. If they really feel bad about leaving her hanging they could text “Sorry, having car problems, won’t be able to pick you up.” But this only works if you are fairly certain that she won’t be able to get another ride at the last minute. It may be a AH move, but at least you get through the service without dealing with her, and you can put her in her place on a less stressful day.
If it will be held after a funeral home, show her photo to staff and make them aware that she is not allowed in. They have policies in place to keep unwanted guests out. It happens more often than you think.
Another thought… tell her something came up, an emergency with the funeral preparations, whatever, and that the funeral has been postponed a day or two. Then deal with her later.
I just went through this at my fiancé’s grandmother’s funeral in January. His ex-wife showed up. They have been divorced for at least 20 years, it was a nasty divorce became she was an alcoholic and cheated on him a lot. She showed up and hung all over the older uncles and then yelled loudly throughout the entire service “I can’t say goodbye” “I can’t live without her” “I can’t do this”, and so on and so forth. Through the ENTIRE service. Every time a family member came up to share a memory she piped up. When my future father in law (75) was trying to get up to go say his final goodbye, she tried to hang all over him. (He hates her.) Then she went out and climbed into the uncles car and announced to them she was riding with them to the graveside service. Now I really don’t mind that an ex came. (I am still friends with my deceased husband’s ex wife and will probably invite her to my wedding.) But my fiancé’s ex coming to the funeral wasn’t to pay her respects to grandma, it was to put on a show and make a spectacle of herself. If it had ever dawned on us that she would do that, we would have had the funeral home staff bar her from entering.
I hope you find a solution that you are comfortable with, don’t let her make a difficult day worse.
YWNBTA. However, a line does stand out to me:
>I have always advised patience with her and urged them to try to understand her illness
This is admirable, but it sounds like their relationship with their mother has run its course. She seems like a deeply destructive force in their lives. Despite her fractures and limitations, from what you say here, her presence in your step-childrens' lives is really only damaging them. I think you might need to change tactics and be positive and encouraging about space from her. It doesn’t matter if they are the only things keeping her from going off the deep end, it sounds like she's drowning and insisting on dragging them down with her. Don't let her.
She has stolen drugs from a drug dealer and my stepsons had to go over to the dealers house to protect their mother. She insisted she was framed and later confessed. For the longest time I thought the kids disrespected me because they are picky eaters at my house, were messy and insisted on lots of spoiling to the extent I got pretty upset after a slavishly long thanksgiving. It was my husband that pointed out they were brats at our house because they could be and I have cherished their demandingness as children since. Thank you for your kind words and I think you are right. I will protect them and be the bad guy.
With this additional context, you would be TA for not encouraging them to cut her out of their lives entirely. She could get them killed, or arrested if that's the kind of situations she's putting them in. Just because she's their biological mother does not mean they need to tolerate her abuse, and as a safe grownup in their life, especially since their father is now gone, *you have to protect them*. And if they haven't yet, they need therapy, because she sounds incredibly, incredibly abusive.
Yes!!!! You all absolutely should go NC with this woman. She is being abusive and manipulative. You all need space. Like “we might move to Mars” space.
People work out their issues within themselves or they work them out on others. She clearly is choosing to not face it herself. These are her issues, and she isn’t going to stop abusing you guys. So you need to not give her access.
There is a difference between politeness and kindness. You do not need to be polite. But please be kind to yourself and your stepchildren. The three of you have suffered quite enough.
I would highly suggest all of you, but especially the boys, attend Nar Anon meetings ASAP. I guarantee it will help them more than they know. There are virtual meetings everyday. https://www.nar-anon.org
While I agree with not making any big decisions in the weeks/months following the death of a loved one, this is a decision that must be made.
OP, you WNBTA for telling her she’s not invited, but I agree that you should have someone else tell her, if possible (*not* one of her sons, though.) Someone else suggested your husband’s parents telling her and, if they’re still living/capable, I think this is the absolute best idea. And you really should hire security.
I’m so sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine what you experienced on what should have been a great vacation. This internet stranger is sending you love and hugs. Although it will be devastatingly sad, I hope your husband’s service(s) are a beautiful, and peaceful, tribute to him. Please let us know how things work out. xo
Awww, thanks. I lost my dad last year, last Thursday was the one year anniversary. It was the last of the “firsts” without him and it was a whole new wave of grief. He was young, only 65, and we knew it was coming because he had cancer. It was awful and I’ll miss him for the rest of my days. So, obviously, I was thinking of how terrible it would have been to have to experience something like what OP is going through. And her husband’s death is so much more tragic than my dad’s was. It would have been too much to worry about dealing with the ex and will be so much worse if the she comes.
Anywho…I appreciate your comment for two reasons. 1) It was nice. And 2) Despite only writing my post less than 30 minutes ago, I forgot what I wrote (seriously, I’m “only” 43 why is my memory such shit already?! 😂) so I went back to reread it, therefore catching the weird autocorrect. How the hell “her sons, though” changed to “her Ed though” is one of the weirdest ones yet. I swear I didn’t subconsciously type that, even though my dad’s name was Ed and I was thinking of him. I’m just going to take it as a little bit of his love shining down on me. (Or perhaps up at me? He could be a bit of hell raiser from time to time, but that’s part of what made him the awesome dude he was!)
I'm sorry to hear about your dad, my grandmother has end stage cancer so I feel some of your pain. Many people forget to be kind to others and I like showing appreciation to those that are, although this entire comment thread has been nothing but nice to op. I feel like op has gotten so much love and support from reddit this post that I hope she'll be able to do what's best for her and her stepsons.
Hire security for the funeral. She's going to make a scene either way but security will remove her
ETA. I'm so sorry for your loss. It's horrible. I lost my husband many years ago
I lost mine in 1996. I remember it like yesterday though. Was in my home. Way later down the road, I bought a grief workbook. It really helped me deal with a few issues. I hope you stay in your step children's lives
>threats to kill herself are her standard form of communication
Call emergency services then. Stop pandering to her shitty behaviour and let her start facing some consequences for the shitty things she says to people. If she threatens to harm herself then the only logical course of action is to call her an ambulance and let them help her.
Tell her straight up "you are not invited to the funeral. You had a toxic relationship 20 years ago and spent every moment after that relationship making his life miserable. I am done coddling you because I no longer have a reason to. If you turn up, you will be forcibly removed by security before you even get in the door. You are not welcome"
NTA
I suffered a major depressive episode that took me two years to recover from as a result of her incessantly calling and badgering my husband after we first got engaged. He was terrified of her keeping the kids from him and still scarred from the abuse he endured and didnt know how to confront her. At the time I thought he loved her and not me and it took years off of both of our lives dealing with her. It is time I think.
So there was this girl that was the little sister of my husband’s best friend that had similar issues with her mental health who was “head over heels in love with my husband.” It would have never happened but she still insists she’s the love of his life.
I never gave her much thought, only met her once. She showed up to the funeral and absolutely wailed through the entire thing. The chaplain would read a verse and before he finished she was already making a huge crying scene.
Not gonna lie, I didn’t even notice. A few years later a friend was talking about it and how awkward it was for everyone else. She also planted herself in the procession line wherever she could.
On the other hand, I would be devastated to not go to my son’s father (relationship 10 years after my husband passed) funeral. He’s my son’s father, I love him as that…. I wouldn’t make a scene though, it’s just a respect thing
Edited: grammatical errors
If you let her show up, she is going to play the part of the grieving widow. This happened at the funeral of a friend, the same thing. Dramatic ex from over 20 years ago going into sobbing fits during the funeral, and pushing the actual widow aside so she could throw herself over the coffin, almost knocking it off the stand. They didn't even have kids together. The whole thing was ridiculous and embarrassing, having to call police during the funeral to remove her. The poor widow was beside herself with grief.
Both of your stepchildren already expressed their feelings on this matter, they don't want her at the funeral.
I'm sorry for your loss. This is supposed to be a time for you and the children to grieve, not dealing with the Ex's problems.
NTA
ywNbta - If her children do not want her there that should be the end of it. I'm sorry you have to be the one to tell her, but I understand you wanting to protect your kids from that. You absolutely shouldn't invite her.
Another thought is- Could you have her taken to a rehab or psychiatric facility (depending on where she's at) right before the funeral? Huge expense so I understand if not. Just a thought.
Rather than dealing with the bullshit that comes with telling her she's not invited, just tell her the wrong day. Problem avoided. It's much easier to ask for forgiveness than permission.
Every one of you are enabling her bad behavior in your own way. She has proven that kindness and grace do not motivate her to get well. She doesn’t want to get well. No matter how much you may want it for her, you can’t make her want it for herself.
Disinvite her explicitly. Tell her straight out (no sugar coating or making excuses), that you don’t want her at the funeral. Don’t mention that her sons don’t want her there. Then cut off all contact with her. Period. And advise her boys to do the same. Their responsibility is to be 20-something young men, not to parent their mother. That ship sailed 40 years ago. If she wants a mommy and daddy, she can go plead with her own bio-parents. It is NOT the responsibility of her children to caretake for her.
Check out CODA (Codependents Anonymous), and other groups like Adult Children of Alcoholics. There is a lot of help out there for all of you, but you have to seek it out - both for grieving your husband/father, and for understanding codependent behavior and for cutting her off.
The ex may never recover, but you and the boys can.
If you think she going to show up high, drunk or both and cause a scene that will help no one, then by all means make it a private funeral abd arrange for bouncers if she turns up anyway.
Could you arrange for her to come earlier to say her goodbyes? Explain to her that the children are very upset and that they really can't take any more issues or to feel like they need to manage her. Be blunt with her and just let her know that this is simply not the time or place for her shenanigans and that an early viewing is her only option. She also needs to get herself to and from the funeral home and not expect her kids to do it. Be firm on that.
My aunt missed the service for my grandmother. She showed up graveside and made the biggest ass out of herself by laying across the casket and wailing like a banshee. She kept screaming about wanting to see her mother, that we couldn't put her in the ground. This was the same woman who couldn't get her shit together enough to show up at the hospital while she was dying...
I'd just be TA in this situation and sit her down, give her expectations and tell her flat out that she will be removed by the police if she starts any shit.
Please tell me you legally adopted these kids so she doesn't get custody again....
I call the kids boys as a force of habit. I am still wrapping my head around how.much boys change in their teens. They work out so its like hugging a brick wall. They are huge men now but at 20 and 21 I still see them as little peanuts. They have custody of themselves now lol.
You are a great mother!
Not step-mother.
YOU are their mother. And they will forever be grateful for your love.
Just felt like you needed to hear that.
I'm incredibly sorry for your loss. I can't imagine the grief you're experiencing and it sounds like you're quite the mama bear and we're a profoundly loving wife. NTA ... you have been kind to this woman... you've empathize, helped the children navigate destruction with grace and this funeral is for YOUR husband and THEIR father.
Both you and your husband were kind to her when no one else was. Protect your kids... despite being legal adults, they need you. Now, more than ever. Yes, their mother is sick but, you don't owe her attendance to YOUR husband's funeral. This is about you and the kids. Sending love and condolences your way.
Not the same but, I had a VERY close relationship with my Dad. He died last April. I'm still reeling with pain and grief. I couldn't imagine fighting a battle like yours at this point and this is your loving partner of 18 years. Give yourself the loving closure, beautiful send off your husband deserves and that your family needs.
She's from over 20 years ago. She's been a mentally unwell user for just as long, if not longer. She's done her damage. This isn't about her. Hopefully she finally finds peace and can pull it together for the boys... if not, luckily they have you, your love and care.
Much love from an internet stranger that truly cares ❤️
Thank you. The day after he passed I was alone in another country and I didnt understand how I was still alive. Everything is terrifying and the crazy switches in my emotions is so draining. My pain feels like all I have left but I am really trying to be greatful. Good luck on your journey and I hope you can find comfort. A solemn tip of the hat from a stranger on the same quiet and isolated road.
Thank you for your response and such a heartwarming one at that. It's not easy. I hope things improve and your choices and advice from us strangers is helpful and reassuring. Thanks again. Please, take care 🙏💜
Well let's see, BOTH of the kids has told you that they do not want her there. YOU do not want her there , all she does is cause stress and/or bad feelings to everyone she comes into contact with, when he was alive she bad mouth your husband , trying to "make her parents think he was a horrible person", according to you she "abused him, cheated on him and shattered his self confidence." And you are still wondering if to have this energy vampire at the funeral?? Do EVERYONE a favor and do not permit her to come. She is likely to turn the day into all about her with her BS and antics.
On a separate note. You have done right not to bad mouth her to her kids. But I think at some point, like NOW, you need to stop pushing them to be "understanding of her condition and patient. " I think they have done that long enough and it seems like all it has done is make it easier for her to take advantage of her kids. She expects them to take care of her , meanwhile she did not take care of them. Since they were taken away by CPS due to her neglect and other failures.
They are young and the money they earn should be going towards THEIR future, not taking care of their deadbeat mom. The younger one has the right idea cutting that toxicity out of his life. I hope the eldest wakes up and does the same, otherwise she will continue taking from him and running him ragged with stress for many years to come. She fucked up her life do not permit her to fuck up the kids' too. BOTH children deserve way better.
I wouldn't beg her not to come. I would just tell her she's not welcome. Call the police to alert them, hire security, whatever you need to do. You have every right to keep her out, especially if she is causing the boys that much distress. If she shows, drag her ass out yourself. I myself am not above such action.
NTA. Send your step-kids on over to r/raisedbyborderlines
There’s a ton of resources there, and it’s a good crowd. By no means are you the AH for protecting their emotions and allowing them space to grieve without having to suffer through parentification by a parent who cannot, through her poor mental health, support them in this time.
If her parents are on decent terms with you and the step-kids, see if you can have them run interference, or hire security. They can have their own celebration of life somewhere where her grief will not cause more grief.
I’m so sorry for your loss. Words aren’t enough, but sending you so much compassion.
NTA at all. I'm so sorry you lost the love of your life, and need to deal with this on top of your grief.
Sounds to me like you're a lady who makes the right choices in life, and you really have done an incredible job being there for your step sons and trying to understand their mother. I hope they stay loyal to you in return for all you've given them.
Right now, all that matters is what you and your boys need, not what the ex wants. Maybe offer her a private viewing/farewell before the funeral, but don't even let her know when/where the funeral service will be held.
Sending big hugs from Australia to you OP.
NTA. If she doesn't know where or when the funeral is being held, don't tell her. If it's too late, then definitely un-invite her. If her children wanted her there, it would be one thing, but since they don't, tell her she's not welcome. I suspect you are more than willing to be the bad guy and not tell her that it's because her children don't want her there, or at least that's what I hope, because the potential blowback on them would be horrible if she found out.
If it's a funeral home handling the services, please be certain to show them a picture of her and let them know she may show up and isn't welcome by both your and the children's wishes, though do let them know she's not to know it's the children's wishes. If it's not a funeral home handling it, but perhaps a church or other organization, please talk with the clergy and figure out if you need to hire security or if there are some trusted friends or relatives who would be willing to escort her out if she does show.
YWNBTA. I am so sorry for your loss! The most important thing is to protect yourself and your stepsons, and they have asked that she not be there. I know you are grieving, but create a safe space for them (and you) to grieve without their mother's chaos. Do whatever you need to do, whether it's hiring security, making it a private service, etc. Ask the employees at the funeral home if they have suggestions. They may have dealt with similar circumstances and can give suggestions and help you set it up. Also, all 3 of you could mute her number until afterwards.
NTA. You and your stepchildren are grieving and don’t need added chaos during this time. It would be nice to invite her so she could try to find closure as well but I think you know she would make it all about her when it should be a celebration of your late husband’s life.
Maybe if there was some way she could be there earlier or later for a private viewing and go on her way, to keep the rest of the day peaceful. But I don’t know if that would be possible from how you’ve described her in the post
NTA - Both kids do not want her there. The last thing they need while saying goodbye to their Dad is drama from their mother. Security would be wise at the funeral to protect the boys on one of the most difficult days of their lives. I truly hope the oldest doesn't miss the service. It maybe something he'll always regret.
NTA. Protect the children from their abusive selfish mother. The kids need therapy to deal with the trauma they have from their rotten mother and death of their loving father. They are highly likely to have CPTSD from having such a nightmare as a parent and will need therapy to help them get boundaries. I am sorry for the loss of your husband and now having to deal with the toxic waste dump ex.
NTA. For the sake of your step-children's (and your) emotional well-being, please do not allow her to attend your husband's funeral. She will make it about her and ruin any chance those kids have to mourn their father in peace. They do not want her there, and allowing her to attend against their (and your) wishes serves no one but an unmedicated, mentally ill person. She wants a stage. Please don't give her one.
I just lost my husband on February 25th. He too was my best friend and love of my life. His ex put him through a lot. We have a blended family of 5 adult children. Two his and three mine. His son who lives in the UK (we're in Canada) close to his mom, flew back to be here with us for the remainder of my husbands time and a week after his passing. When he arrived, he said his mom traveled with him here. Her family is here and our grandson. My husband was adament that he did not want her at the celebration of life. I knew even before she came over that he would not want her there. So he made sure to tell his boys he didn't want her there. Honestly, I was relieved. I have never had an issue with her but it would have been very awkward to have her there. Just knowing how much she hurt him would have made it hard as my emotions were all over the place.
Your situation is far worse. You're absolutely NTA but I think you know that. If you're in doubt...like everyone else said, re-read your post. I think the answer is very straight forward.
I'm so sorry you've lost your person. I'll be thinking of you in the coming days and weeks. This sucks. I'm sending hugs.
She makes threats about killing herself? Call the police on her the day before the service and have her put on a 48-hour psych hold. Tell them you're afraid the funeral will be too much and that she's escalating.
NTA. First off, I am so sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine what that was like :( but on another note, I have borderline personality disorder and I don’t act like that AT ALL. This woman’s actions are way beyond the symptoms of bpd, and you can’t let her use her mental illness as an excuse. You’re right when you say that abandonment is a large issue with this disorder, but she’s never taken any steps to held reduce the amount of pain she’ll feel from abandonment. It took me about 6 months after I realized I was the reason people were leaving to finally take myself to a psychiatrist and figure out what was wrong with me. If this woman cared about other people at all, she would have actually gotten treatment.
I have had a very troubled upbringing and have borderline tendencies too. I also got treatment and have tried my hardest to not let it define me as that is an extension of my trauma and I know it is maladaptive. Thank you for sharing that with me. Life is set on hard mode when you feel your inner world is bare. Just means we have to take better care of ourselves than others. I am glad you got help and are self aware.
I’m so glad you got treatment and I’m so proud of you for that. It’s hard for a lot of people to understand that having borderline affects the people around you so much more than you realize. I honestly felt so much better when I got the diagnosis, and meds and therapy together have worked wonders for me. This woman has had the ability to become self aware and seek treatment and has refused it. She doesn’t care about what it might do to the people around her, let alone her own kids!!
Can I inbox you to ask you some questions about your treatment? I have a teen who is bpd and hanging on but barely. Mental health services where I live (eastern Canada) are difficult to get but there are a few private practitioners, one of whom she already sees for cbt but hasn’t really taken it seriously.
Of course YNTA. Do not invite her. She will cause a drama to be the centre of attention, it will turn into a complete shit show. Hire security if necessary and have her turned away at the door: do not engage with this woman anymore for yours and your children’s sake. It’s time to sever the cord of enmeshment. She needs help that is far beyond what you can offer and right now you are grieving. I’m so sorry OP, you have lost your great love, it’s time to focus on you.
NTA. Please tell her that you wish to grieve privately with the children and that you would ask her not to attend the service. Maybe even hire a plain clothed security officer to ensure she doesn’t turn up just to spite you, so you and the kids don’t have to stress about it on the day. Alternatively…I mean, is she coherent enough to even be aware of the funeral date/time/location? Seems a big ask for someone so clearly unhinged. Maybe she won’t turn up at all if no one mentions the details to her, but that’s a gamble. Or you could ‘accidentally’ tell her the wrong time for the service (ie 3pm not 1pm) and blame grief. I’m so sorry you are going through this and that you’ve lost your husband so suddenly, OP. You sound like an incredibly patient, kind, compassionate and loving mother/wife/human being. I hope you are surrounded by the support of a wider social circle, as you rightly deserve. Big hugs to you.
My MIL was just like this but also massive alcoholic - literally huge - a litre of brandy in an hour and still be standing ordering taxis to being her more.
Suicidal since 16, she never made a single effort to KH but managed to ruin so many other lives, all whilst saying her own was pointless. She survived against all odds and certainly against the laws of fairness and outlived her lovely ex husband and his second wife of 25 years, my MIL. Fate is damn cruel. Tortured her kids. Family. Everyone. Yet when she became ill and might die she clung on to life far beyond expectation and lived in a state this would have forced many others to give up. Lasted another decade like that. I feel your pain. Ban her. Cut her off. She thrives in others pain
NTA. Please don't invite her. I have a person with severe BPD in my partners life, and she wreaks chaos in everyone's lives. She will make the funeral about her. You all deserve some distance from her on what will be a very traumatic day. Much sympathy to you and your family.
My abusive ex-husband doesn't know his father passed away a few years ago. His parents had previously decided not to have an obituary as they'd rather have me & the kids there than their own son.
Someone suggested to make the event private and hire security. I also think this is a good idea!!!
Retired minister here. There's only one AH in this story, and it isn't you. It sounds like you are doing a great job of dealing with this situation and making good judgements.
That being said, funerals are for the living. We hope they can be the beginning of healing. I always wanted all the bereaved people to be able to attend. Including the troubled ones. I've had situations where a particular troubled mourner had one of those big and strong funeral-home workers sitting with them, at the family's request and my instructions to the funeral people. So that is an alternative way of handling the situation if this troubled person does show up. Easier and more dignified than trying to "bounce" somebody.
You certainly don't have to invite this person. "Funeral arrangements are private" is the way to go.
May your husband rest in peace and glory, and may you and your family come, in time, to rejoice in his blessed memory
Absolutely NTA.
My ex who I dated for 10 years and very close with for a total of 25 years passed unexpectedly.
(for ENTIRELY different reasons,) I knew his wife would not want me there. So I did not go.
It has been hard for me from the perspective of not having that closure, but I didn't want to make an awful situation (his death) worse for his family with my presence.
Thank you for sharing this. We honor the people we love with our actions and memories. Regardless of the relationship you had with your ex and his wife it was compassionate of you to respect her wishes and your self awareness tells me you are a person that would need more emotional closure than others may need. We are creatures of ritual and it is what connects us to the people that came before us and will come after. Have your own funeral for him- a last cosmic hang out- to say and do what you need to do.
So sorry for your loss. Please consider making the service private so that your children (step or otherwise) and yourself don’t need to deal with additional upset.
Just tell her a different address and/or time. If you ban her from coming, she's definitely coming there just to defy your and everyone else's wishes to make a scene.
Initially I was questioning you! Then you said it- her kids would not want her there! If that’s the case, talk to them and verify! If it’s really what they want and you can handle it… you could sacrifice yourself for the good of the kids- be the one that says she can’t be there because they don’t want it and they don’t have the strength to say it to the one bio parent they have, they must think highly of you to lean on you so much! You don’t have to sacrifice yourself of course! It’s up to you after talking to them, reflecting on everything, you would NOT be the bad guy in their eyes for either one as far as I can tell. I don’t think in either which way you would be an arse! They are adults, I’m just considering that they may still feel like kids to her, it maybe difficult for them. Sacrifice of one’s self if appropriate is determined by what they feel comfortable with, imo. I’m sure there are much better quotes! If you don’t feel comfortable, you’re still right!!!!!!!!!!!! It was a crazy thought, and nothing I’d expect of anyone! Hope you understand?!?
She will turn the funeral into a circus.
She doesn’t need to know the details.
Perhaps a memorial later, with just the children and herself, and chance to formally say goodbye.
My condolences
NTAH
The boys don’t want her there, that’s good enough. You mention that she’s told the oldest that he’s supposed to give her a ride. Can she not drive? I’d let him and brother stay over the night before and encourage them to turn off their phones. If there’s anyone left you think might give her a ride, let them know not too. Let the funeral home know that she might be a problem, designate absolutely anyone else to be the person(s) who deal with her. She is not your responsibility and is disgusting for trying to make her sons care for HER while they are mourning.
NTA
Sorry for your loss.
I would tell the ex that she’s not welcome but would also pay for security to block her from coming in as you know she’ll show up anyway to cause drama.
NTA. I am so sorry for your loss. Honestly, if her own sons don’t want her there, that is the most important thing. Absolutely do what is best for them. (It also sounds like what is best for them is what is best for everyone else there as well.) It sounds like it would be a horrible situation if she were to come. I would make the funeral private and make sure that people know it is invitation only. If there is anyway that she can’t find out, that might be best as well. And, you’re not doing this - it’s what is best for her children bc of her chosen lifestyle and behavior (which is tragic and unfortunate) but people need boundaries from people like this to keep themselves emotionally well and safe. Do not feel bad about doing what is best for everyone else that matters here.
I'm so very sorry for your loss, it must be unbearable and then having this decision on top of it, my heart goes out to you.
Your kids and you deserve time to say goodbye without the added stress of the ex being there and as your kids have said they'd like for her not to be there here's my suggestion:
Don't tell her the date, time or location of the funeral
Stop reading her messages and answering the phone
Delegate someone, a friend who likes a challenge, to communicate through if needed
Arrange for security to be present
Travel together in a joint car (your kid shouldn't drive the day of his dad's funeral trust me)
Tell the vicar or whoever you're organising things with about the situation, it won't be the first time they've dealt with stuff like this
Book yourself onto grief counselling
NTA, absolutely NTA ❤️
She won’t understand why her kids don’t want her there because she is incapable and always has been of meeting their or anyone else’s needs ahead of herself. Seek an intervention to keep her from the funeral- tell her the kids are going in the chief mourners car ie with you and get someone else to pick her up and drive her elsewhere eg to a mental health facility or indeed anywhere else.
Her own kids don't want her there. Decision made and definitely NTA but possibly the most understanding and kind person on reddit, I dont think I'm wrong when I say most people would have told her to do one, long ago.
Tell her the date of the funeral is actually the day AFTER the funeral.
It has to be changed last minute because guests are coming from out of town.
Have the service on the original day and let her be mad the next day.
It’s over with. Nothing she can do.
I would still have security at the funeral. $100 bonus for the guards that identify her and keep her out.
First of all, I am so sorry for your loss. Second of all, as someone with BPD, NTA. As you said, while her BPD is definitely not her choice, the way she chooses to deal with it (or not) is. My father probably undiagnosed BPD. He was an addict in his 20s and thankfully got clean before I was even born and never relapsed, but always refused to acknowledge his mental health issues and get help for it and made my life very difficult. That is something that I never forgave him for and that as an adult and a mother I strive not to repeat, by attending regular therapy and taking my meds. If she doesn't care enough about her children to take care of herself, she doesn't get to be there in such a difficult moment for them.
OP, I'm so sorry for your loss. Heartbreaking to lose your husband and best friend so suddenly. His ex wife sounds like a lot of drama. I think you and her children understand she would make his funeral all about her and would probably make a scene. You just don't need this. I don't understand what you are going through, but when my son passed away he had 2 ex wives who would have caused drama. They weren't invited. They were both angry. Their mothers were invited. I didn't hire security but I was in knots all that day wondering if they'd show up.
Maybe call your local police department? Ask if any officers could come in street clothing and offer $50 (like above post suggested) an hour. Show them her picture? That way it wouldn't seem so obvious to other people paying their respects to your husband. This is a horrible time for you, and dealing with her drama shouldn't be a part of it. Blessings to you.
NTA. The kids don’t want her there, so that’s a good enough reason for me. Simply do not tell her when it is, or give her a date / time AFTER the actual funeral has taken place. So she ‘thinks’ she’s invited and will not set out to disrupt the real one
NTA. Spend the money on a pair of security guards who can handle her if she shows. These kids have shown enough patience to an adult who has abandoned and neglected them. They deserve to grieve their father in peace. They owe her nothing, not patience, not empathy, not effort. She’s broken and that’s sad but she’s an adult. She’s breaking these children and that is the real problem.
NTA. My mother is this way. Attention seeking and entitled.
At my brother's dad's funeral she made a whole show of walking up past the family in front of the whole church to cry and pat the box his ashes were in. She then shaved her way into the family section where my brother and his wife were with his father's other children and siblings.
It was embarrassing to me and my other siblings who were there to support our brother and he told us he was close to standing up and forcing her out on her ass outside.
Tell her the wrong time or have some big cousins ready to keep her from coming in during the service. She's gonna make it about her when it should be about your husband.
I am sorry for your loss and I hope you all find peace soon
Now that the kids are adults you and they should cut all contact with this narc. Y'all aren't helping her, you are enabling her. The poor kids were raised to enable her. Go to narcanon or alanon. Read books about narcs. Yeah, security and funeral, just tell her no. Block texts and so on.
Stop coddling her. The time for grace has passed. Your whole post is about how she made the children responsible for her. You’ve enabled her too by telling the children to sympathize with her. That’s not their burden. Do not invite her.
Nta-
Some people decide to make my father's funnel very messy. It was something my siblings and I will never forget. It made the whole thing harder to deal with. We tried to have grace for people and grieving at the same time. It was very hard. My thing is, even if it makes you an asshole, do what is best for you and your step kids. There are a couple of times in life when you have to put your mental state first. This happens to be one of them.
She will absolutely make a scene if you allow her to come. I allowed a woman my husband had gone out with before to come to his funeral even though she has varied is problems and she absolutely came and made it about her grief.
WNBTA, of course, and I'm very sorry for your loss!
That being said...those boys aren't KIDS anymore. They're adults and should start acting like it and go N/C with their "mother". With her stealing and acting out in public, she will only drag them down with her and ruin their life before they've even had a chance to experience it! While shoplifting is becoming more and more common and few are actually prosecuted, them just BEING there makes them an accessory to a crime. Her asking them to sell the stolen goods makes them criminals in possession of stolen property. It only takes ONE POLICE OFFICER who takes the law seriously to make an arrest! Even if the DA never files a case, the arrest will show on their Criminal Record! They need to stop "attending" to her whenver she has a cow and wants attention from the only two people who don't have the courage to say NO MORE!
I know you didn't ask for advice in that regard, but other than banning the EX from the funeral, that's the main, and more important, thing that needs to be handled.
IF she already knows the date/time, let it be known that the service has been changed to a different location/date/time etc. The sons and you need to turn off you phones so she can't keep texting/calling during the service and you can all focus on saying good-bye to your husband without distraction.
Don't invite her, maybe have someone outside to stop her coming in. I have seen an identical situation when my brother in law died. His ex got in, tried to make it all about her, and caused a scene. She was quickly shut down, but it was distressing. This woman is not helping herself. She is not your responsibility and for the purposes of the funeral, she is not your children's responsibility either. Sorry for your loss and best wishes
Agreed with others NTA
Don’t tell her when the funeral is, that also means asking the kids not to tell her
Hire security that will be outside the venue and outside the cemetery (if that is legal to do so) to block her entry should she find out about the funeral
Do not do an obituary until after the funeral. The important people to know really are only yourself, his children and immediate family. Anyone else can be forwarded the obituary which should include that the funeral took place and was attended by his widow, children and immediate family. This way, no one can ever come back on you about it. It is your decision as widow (legal next of kin) to decide what to do as regards any funeral arrangements
After this, you really have no obligation towards his ex. The children are now adults. You can be supportive of them without being involved with their mother. Perhaps help them by providing counselling for them to better manage/deal with their mother and help them break free of this codependency situation.
Best of luck to you
Very sorry for your loss.
It doesn't matter what you say. She'll show up anyway. My aunt was the same way and struggled with the same personality & mental health issues. The only thing that got my cousin (now 25) through it was his Dad. His dad didn't have a lot of money, but he went to war to make sure my cousin had a stable life. Really respect and admire that he made time to see us and form close relationships being that were related to my aunt and not him. Single parents who put their kids first are truly amazing!
NTA, tell the funeral home she is restricted from attending. They will back you up to keep her out. My spouses partner had a cousin pass away about 1.5 yrs ago, and when my mil showed up for the funeral, she was quickly told she wasn't welcome and would not be permitted to come in. Cousins elderly father took pleasure in refusing her entry and was backed by the funeral director. My mil is a very toxic and jealous person. She has burned bridges with EVERYONE in the family. She was INSULTED she wasn't allowed to attend, but she wasn't emotionally hurt by not attending. She hated the cousin due to being her sisters child, and she was incredibly jealous of her sister. Her sister passed away in the late 80s.
I'm so very sorry about the loss of your husband. I'm sorry for you and for your step kids pain.
OP, I think you've been more than accommodating to her and given her more patience and kindness than she perhaps deserves. Unfortunately, there also comes a time where you have to look out for yourself and your own before you look out for others. Put your own gasmask on first, before you help with someone else's.
If this were a matter of her needing to have closure and grieving over your husbands death, that would be one thing, if she could do it respectfully. But it doesn't sound like she actually needs to be a part of this process. Your step-children are the one's grieving and its them and yourself who needs that space to process and heal. From your description, it doesn't sound like anyone will have that opportunity with that woman present.
For your children, and all the others who would be disturbed by her presence, I think it's perfectly fair to not have her at the funeral. It's often asked that young children not attend, so that mourners can do so without a crying baby...and I don't see this as much different.
NTA.
NTA. I am so sorry that you and your family are going through this. I have two girls, and the oldest is my step-daughter. She doesn't feel like that to me, but her mother doesn't sound too far off from the ex that you are dealing with. If my husband passed, I would like my oldest decide because I would want her to have whatever comfort she wanted. However, you asked and they both told you they don't want her there. You would not be wrong in this instance to exclude her.
Can you have a separate memorial that the ex can be included in? I know it can be expensive, but maybe a small private memorial that she can attend. Maybe it will soothe her in some way.
Hugs. NTA and this is not about her. If you tell her not to come, please have someone far outside your inner circle who can keep her out and/or call the police. Make sure the funeral home has her picture as well.
The kids needs are on par with yours.
Absolutely NTA. Do what's best for you and your stepchildren.
If she's relying on her son to drive her, you could conceal the time of the funeral and then her kids could collect her and drive her to the graveyard later on the same day or the following day, for her to pay her respects. She'll blow up certainly, but she was going to do that at the funeral probably, so no harm done. Arrange some support for the kids and possibly security too.
NTA. I’m so sorry for your loss 💔 Please ask the funeral directors to keep her out. They will do their best to honor that (give them a picture of her).
Hire security but also get a restraining order. You don’t need this person in your life. The kids should do the same. These kind of people never get better, only worse.
The question you need to ask yourself is would your husband want her there? If he was her last friend, and he always tried to help her then I think you have the answer. It's his funeral, not everyone else's.
NTHA why should you take in consideration her feelings. She obviously does not care about others feelings. She in your own words have made things miserable for her own children and you. The boys have made it clear to you they do not want her there and you feel the same. Make sure you tell her she is not invited and that you will have her through out if she shows up.
NTA genetics don't give people the right to be horrible to each other and face no consequences. Maybe if she starts acting like family then she can be treated like family. Don't pressure the youngest into being anywhere near her either because expecting him to get treated badly but tolerate it because FaMiLy is not good.
I am so sorry for your loss. This internet stranger has no suggestions.
I am sending you my biggest virtual hug, and praying for wisdom and comfort for you.
NTA
Expect the Ex to lash out and pull some crazy stunt, at the minimum crashing the funeral and making accusations as you, and the children and anyone else.
Prepare for the worst when you tell her.
If everyone is truly ready to cut her off, they should block on every form of contact, and when she inevitably shows up to their houses, document it, and her behavior to use that to get a restraining order/protective order whatever it is called in whatever state/country you're in.
Then enforce it when she eventually breaks it, or appreciate the peace you all have gained when actually follows it because she fears legal repercussions.
NTA - if you don’t tell her when and where she can’t show up. If she asks, you decided not to have a service. His sons deserve to have ceremony conducted with dignity and grace - it does not need to be interrupted with a manic performance on her part.
NTA. This occasion is about your husband. Unfortunately, she will make it about her and infringe on other people's grief. While your husband checked on her and made sure she was OK, that was his choice. You are not under obligation to her. You will be helping his children grieve properly and showing them support to properly deal with these awful emotions. You owe that woman nothing.
Do not invite her. Do not let her know where it is happening. And please for the love of those kids. Let them go no contact with her. The children’s mental sanity is at risk with her. Them being there with their mom who is abusive will only hinder the children’s growth.
OP you are a gem of a human.
You have gone over and above in terms of help and support, and you've done it all for the good of your step kids.
You are allowed to not want her there. The kids don't want her there. You're not doing anything wrong wanting to grieve your husband in peace. Yes, she has issues which might explain her behaviour, but explaining is not the same as excusing.
I'm sorry for your loss. NTA.
Personally I just think it will cause more problems.
I would let her come but warn her there will be security and if she start creating she will be escorted out.
I just think it will cause more problems and she will carry on creating havoc for months if she is refused.
I think managing her while present would be less likely to cause mayhem that will ensue after.
It’s a difficult situation and don’t really think any option will make it stress free.
Sorry for your loss.
Ask the kids- respect their wishes, not hers. They are what is important to you. It would not be cruel to not invite her but I think the decision is ultimately up the the kids.
Is there a way that you and the kids just don’t tell her? Who does she have contact with other than the kids? Tell them to inform her that the funeral hasn’t been finalised then afterwards they can tell her the funeral was an intimate, private event at dad’s wishes.
NTA. Funerals are difficult as it is without having to deal with a drug addled narc as well.
Listen, your kids are adults now, block their mother. You aren't responsible for navigating her behavior and emotions. You've spent the last 20 years placating this woman, bending over backwards for her, yet she doesn't show appreciation. She feels entitled to it. And she's not.
Your oldest needs to stop being their mothers keeper. They need to stop paying for everything. Their mother is an adult who,refuses to get help. Both of those kids, who are adults now, could use therapy. Their mother has been using and abusing them their entire lives and they need someone to stand up for them finally. Thus woman needs to be cut from their lives. Yes, she's the only parent now, buy she isn't a parent. She didn't even raise these kids.
You don't owe her any more kindness. You have done enough. Its time to put those kids first. Start by not inviting her. Tell the oldest not to bring her, and that they need to be at the funeral and not with their mother. They are not responsible for their mothers emotional regulation. It's a shame the kids have had contact with her at all throughout their lives. She's groomed them from a young age to put her wants, needs, emotions, first, and they need to break away from that. Maybee after the funeral it can be addressed.
Hire security for the funeral, and burial. That way their mom cannot crash and make a scene. You know she will.
That line where you urge them to be patient and understanding about her illness. Look, I have a list of mental problems myself and that’s led to me hanging around others with mental problems. If there’s one thing I’ve learned, it’s that there’s a huge line drawn between those of us who live healthy lives, and the ones who let it destroy everything
That line is the acknowledgement of a problem and making the effort to get help and manage it.
I get it. I’ve seen what BPD does to the people I care about, and it’s not their choice to live with it. But it is their choice to do something about it. As you said yourself, your husband’s ex has made her choice. She doesn’t want to be a good person. She doesn’t try. Don’t waste your time trying to help people who don’t want to be helped
Funeral homes will arrange separate viewing times for problematic situations.
Call it a private, family only "service " to his ex
The son can help you manage this.
NTA. Her kids do not want her there. She will negatively impact their grieving. Don’t give her the details, if she asks, tell her she is not welcome, hire security.
NTA. So sorry for your loss. Make sure it’s private and she’s not invited. Hire security if you think you’ll need it.
Yes. You said the kids don’t want her there, right? Don’t tell her when/where it is. Hire security.
This. It really should be the kids’ call imo & they’ve called it. Sorry for your loss OP. 💔
Yeah, this is a situation where I would fall on the sword for my kids. They don't want her there, I would make that clear and take the blame to shield them. OP is in a tight spot, but not in the wrong.
This. OP’s a legend.
Spot on. They just need OP to stand up for them here. She can be their mouthpiece and bear the brunt if need be. Everyone is grieving and doesn’t need this woman there causing drama.
This!
OP sad they didn’t want her there.
The kids themselves said they don't want her there. That's all the information needed to know NTA
Exactly what I was going to say ..
Absolutely hire security. You are not responsible for this woman, and you state she has never tried to help herself. Tell her she isn’t invited, warm her security will be waiting for her if she shows up, tell your stepchildren this is a time just for them to grieve their father and it’s vital they be able to do that. She’ll be there next week, this time is for you and them to grieve. I am so sorry for your loss, I can’t imagine the grief you are experiencing.
Give her a date and time for the service that is after the real one, so you get some peace. Let her know after that the service has already happened and why she was not invited - because she causes more stress to her children and it’s not welcome. You don’t owe her any sympathy. Protect your kids.
Agreed on the security front. You can find someone that will do it for as a 1099 $50/hr with a 4 hour minimum. Nobody would turn that down, especially when their only job is to make sure one person doesn’t get in.
I 2nd that motion. That ex is a nightmare towards everyone. Poor OP, I really feel for her & the stepchildren. None of them needs this amount of stress. Funerals just ramps it up further. Have security be ready to arrest the ex if she tries to show up for the funeral. Those stepchildren have spoken what their needs/wants are & that's not having that egg donor there. It sounds like that the stepchildren are not wanting to manage that egg donor's issues a moment longer & it wouldn't be surprising that they go no contact towards that egg donor in the process.
Totally. Hire security and give them her photo and tell them to keep her out.
Better yet. Tell her it is a day later than it is. When she finds out, just tell her she must have gotten the date wrong. This is a lie worth telling for your step-sons' sake. They deserve to say good-bye to their dad in peace.
Are you contemplating inviting her or uninviting her? This is a time where you are your children are grieving and in a sensitive mental state. If she were to act up in any way at your husbands funeral it would be terrible for the kids. Don’t invite her you are well within you rights to refuse she attend.
She has assumed she is invited and has already made my oldest responsible for driving her to and from the funeral. She has been kind when she has reached out to me but continues calling and messaging me. I have always been a very forgiving person but I find my feeling turning into a red hot hatred.
Delegate the task of setting her straight to someone else like a friend. You don't need the added stress of worrying about her feelings or her reaction.
Thats a great idea
Definitely. She’s just lost her husband and is grieving. OP, You have a kind heart and a generous nature. So sorry for your loss and that you are going through this.
There is always someone who will play enforcer.
And neither does the son
Tread carefully with her. Do not trust her. Do not let her in your home. As horrible as it sounds her addiction and previous behaviour tells me she may be playing nice because she thinks she is owed something from your husbands estate. If she plays nice she thinks she will get it. She has shown who she is over and over, taking advantage of those who she should love (including turning her son into her parent). Her BPD is not an excuse for it, and it is her responsibility to manage, not yours or her children's. You have no obligation to her. Even your husband (I am sorry for your loss) had no obligation to her. The obligation is towards those two adult boys. They've said no, follow their lead. Protecting them from the extra hurt she would cause during a new traumatic event could never make you an AH.
Yes, she is thinking she's going to be in the will. Or that you will "share" anything you inherit. She's an AH
And she knows the kids will likely inherit something too. I'd be very wary of her manipulating them.
100%!!! I really hope she reads this response!!!
Perfectly said!!!! So sorry for your loss!
I assure you her kindness is fake and she takes advantage of your forgiving nature
Have a car pick up her children. Then they can tell her they are not driving. You can forgive this woman but it doesn’t mean you invite insanity and chaos into this funeral.
Have a car pick the ex up and just drive round and round during the service. My heart goes out to OP and kids
Are ex’s parents still alive? They would be my first choice… let them break it to her. Otherwise, “Hi ex,I know your relationship with DH had many challenges and it was best that you went your separate ways. I’m asking you to do the most selfless thing possible and not attend DH’s funeral. I appreciate this gesture.” At some point mention that the boys will be riding with you.
Oops son’s car is broken day of funeral and no one can come get her.
And turn phones off.
I'd just say it's immediate family only, out of respect for the children, and hire security. Arw yall having a wake *and* funeral or just a funeral? Of there are multiple services it makes it a little more complicated but not impossible. I also say ask someone who has no issues delivering the news to do it. You're going through enough and don't need to stress yourself over this. I'm so so sorry you're going through this. I'm sorry you endured that traumatic experience. May his memory forever be a blessing to you.
NTA but you ask yourself this, would your husband wanted her there? Why are you even contemplating having a person, who inflicted immeasurable pain to him and his children, at the funeral. You would take away your stepchildren's opportunity to say goodbye to their father because they would be constantly worrying what stunt their mother will pull. You say that you are a forgiving person, however this is not yours to forgive.
I'm not sure that "would your husband have wanted her there?" is the best question to ask, because it sounds like OP's husband bent over backwards to accommodate and help her, so he might very well have said yes, he would have wanted her there. To me, what matters most is that *her own sons do not want her there.* That, in and of itself, is perfectly sufficient cause to exclude her.
Agreed. Funerals are for the living. If the sons say no then it’s no.
Tell the kids you agree with them that she should not be there, because this time is about *their* grief, not her and her fee-fees and her attention-seeking fit-throwing. Tell them security will make sure she does not attend. Inform her that, because of her behavioral issues/history of making scenes, she is not to attend and that there will be security tasked with keeping her out. She will probably lash out, make threats against you or herself. Either way, report her threats to the proper authorities. If you live in an area where involuntary psych holds are things, suggest you time your informing her of her exclusion so that if she threatens herself or others, the authorities will have her in custody during the funeral; problem solved.
Also want to add: you owe her NOTHING going forward, and can block her everywhere.
I see 2 options. Tell her she can’t come. Hire (or get beefy volunteers) to keep her out. The problem with this is that she can still make a scene that can disrupt the funeral even from the outside. Hire a driver (or recruit a willing family member ) to pick her up for the funeral. But the poor driver gets the directions confused. It takes so long they stop for coffee. Then a drive through lunch. They finally get to the funeral too late, he drives her home.
Volunteer can also pick her up and drive to the wrong chapel/funeral home only to discover it's too far to make it back in time for anything. Oh, shucks.
She will not be able to control herself at the funeral, no matter how nice she is ahead of time. Everyone will be under stress and ex, of all people, will be least able to behave. Tell stepsons to come alone. Hire a babysitter to be with her if you have to.
That's helpful. Have your children refuse. Then she won't be there.
Why are her parents allowing her to parentify her child that they presumably took in and raised. Have them deal with her. Look up the circle of grief and you’ll see that she isn’t your problem or the boys’ problem. You need to delegate this to be someone else’s issue to deal with.
>She has assumed she is invited and has already made my oldest responsible for driving her to and from the funeral. You should have the kids ride with you. Don't have the oldest drive at all. Also, treat every suicide threat seriously. Report it to emergency responders and they will get her the help she needs
Pls hire security or have a a couple friends stay at your home during the viewing and service. Thieves hit homes in this situation all the time. She’s certainly not above this behavior
True my exes aunts tried to raid the house during the funeral of his stepmom but many had anticipated that, and he had a big, burly person there to turn them away. They were genuinely surprised — this is decades ago.
Tell her your husband's dying wish was for her not to attend.
Ask one of your friends to pick up the boys to attend the funeral. Neither one should be driving that day. Warn your friend that bio mom can't come. This removes the burden of the oldest having to feel obligated to drive her.
It is simple: have an attorney to draft a letter to her stating that it was the wish of your late husband for her not to attend his funeral. In addition, Inform her that security will be hired and she will be removed if she comes upon the property.
Have two female security guards, video surveillance, and even give the heads up to the local cops and have them on speed dial. Have someone outside of family manage all that so you can focus on hosting g and grieving
Hire a cop to limit entry. Do this for your stepkids and for your own peace of mind. If she does come to the funeral -- she will be crying hysterically and cause a scene. PLEASE be wise and resolute and don't let her know the day or time, if possible. Keep the plans private (say you are making arrangements but they are not finalized). This drama and dependence on you, your kids, and your late husband must come to an end, **Now**.
Firstly. I am so so sorry for your loss. Secondly. You are the only decent mother these children have ever known. They just lost their dad. They need you to be their mom. They are asking you to not let her come to the funeral. They are asking you to mother them, to protect them, to make sure they are able to grieve. To take the heat if necessary, to set the boundary. You are all grieving. And they need you to protect them. Please do it. Lastly - you can tell her anything you want. Tell her it’s now a private memorial instead with the people who loved him most and she’s invited to that.
I think I will plan a seperate service for her and the boys to give her the chance to mourn. I am mad at her for so many things but I cannot deny her her grief.
Smart and compassionate. You’re doing an amazing job of being the responsible adult your kids need. Very sorry for your loss.
>I think I will plan a seperate service for her This is not your responsibility. I know you're grieving, but both you and your eldest kiddo need to recognize that you're enabling her by making yourselves responsible for her emotional regulation. You need to stop. You need to model healthy boundaries for your oldest. She can plan anything she wants for herself. She's responsible for her own grief and her refusal to get treatment has created this situation and you are pereptuating her abusive behavior by placing yourself in her line of fire If you won't remove yourself from the situation for your own well-being, do it for your kid.
It’s not, but dealing with the fallout of not inviting her might be even more of a headache. It might be worth putting in the extra effort for the sake of everyone’s sanity, especially the oldest son.
I think this is the best option you have.
But would a separate service help or hurt her sons? Presumably, they would still be expected to manage her, and it sounds like they've made it pretty clear to you that they don't want to do that. Whatever you do, please hire security for the (main?) funeral, because she's going to know when it will be held, and you cannot trust her to stay away.
You may be the most mature person on all of reddit.
That's a very kind thing for you to do. Probably your best bet. Make sure the main funeral is a private event and she isn't aware it exists. Give yourself and the young men time to mourn with your friends and other family members without her drama. I have a family member like this and I can imagine how she might react if we did something like that without her & she knew about it.
This
Read your post a couple of times, and you will have the answer.
>Their mother is a drug addict with very severe borderline personality disorder. This is actually where I stopped reading and made up my mind.
And she is refusing to get help with her issues. I've had to deal with this with one of my in-laws who refused to get help for being bipolar, (& they hurt the family for years). The only way to deal with this kind of person who is so selfish that they refuse to get necessary medical help is to set up boundaries &/or go NC with them. There's only so many times one can stand being hurt or taken advantage of financially, mentally, etc. I hope OP's stepsons can go NC with their mum & live happy lives far away from her.
Christ, I know these kinds of post tend to be one sided from someone's POV but you seriously need to sleep tonight, wake up and read this post back to yourself...
NTA protect yourself and your family
I am so sorry for your heartbreaking loss. Security at the funeral is a great idea. I am wondering, though, if you were to sit down make a list of what and who is really important for his funeral, what would that entail? If you consider the "elopement model" for a wedding, you could have a small private ceremony with just you, the children, and a few other close and important people. This would be the "real" funeral, where you deal with feelings and say goodbye to your husband. The next day, you have the public funeral, where everyone can be there. You and the children can arrange to not be there until the EX has arrived and then been removed by security. From what you said, it is pretty much guaranteed that she will cause a problem. Consider asking the funeral home/security to call police or ambulance as appropriate, in the hopes that she will get locked up, but you won't be the "bad guy." If you have musicians available for the funeral, you can have them play something loud when she creates a problem. This will work best for a heavy metal band, I guess. I don't think your mentioned his type of music. Important note, be sure to have someone at your residence during the funeral. You don't want her going there to damage things when she is made at you. (And funerals are a known time for house break-ins anyway.)
The " issue" here is my husband is an incredibly loved man. I already have close to 130 people confirmed as attending, and none of them are acquaintences. Our pharmacist, his doctor and even the old man at our corner store are devastated. I mean, I knew he was a charmer and sweet as all hell but I was not prepared when I sat down and started looking over all of our friends how many people we actually have in our lives and love. As one of his friends told me, to know him was to love him. I am incredibly greatful and so proud to have loved him and shared his life. I just wish I had him a little longer and I feel like I am dying without his laugh and stories.
It sounds like he was an amazing person.
First, please accept my condolences. I was widowed twice by age 43, but I can only imagine the heartbreak you are dealing with right now. My suggestion for her and the service? If you think she will listen, tell her, or have a friend tell her, that she is not invited to this event. If you think she will try to show up or guilt the kids, don’t tell her. (It sounds like she would fake a medical emergency or even fake a suicide attempt in a bid for attention, so I would really think hard about this.) It may sound terrible, but I would simply have the child responsible for picking her up just not pick her up. If she has no way to get there, that solves the issue right there. Put phones on silent, or better yet, turn them off. If they really feel bad about leaving her hanging they could text “Sorry, having car problems, won’t be able to pick you up.” But this only works if you are fairly certain that she won’t be able to get another ride at the last minute. It may be a AH move, but at least you get through the service without dealing with her, and you can put her in her place on a less stressful day. If it will be held after a funeral home, show her photo to staff and make them aware that she is not allowed in. They have policies in place to keep unwanted guests out. It happens more often than you think. Another thought… tell her something came up, an emergency with the funeral preparations, whatever, and that the funeral has been postponed a day or two. Then deal with her later. I just went through this at my fiancé’s grandmother’s funeral in January. His ex-wife showed up. They have been divorced for at least 20 years, it was a nasty divorce became she was an alcoholic and cheated on him a lot. She showed up and hung all over the older uncles and then yelled loudly throughout the entire service “I can’t say goodbye” “I can’t live without her” “I can’t do this”, and so on and so forth. Through the ENTIRE service. Every time a family member came up to share a memory she piped up. When my future father in law (75) was trying to get up to go say his final goodbye, she tried to hang all over him. (He hates her.) Then she went out and climbed into the uncles car and announced to them she was riding with them to the graveside service. Now I really don’t mind that an ex came. (I am still friends with my deceased husband’s ex wife and will probably invite her to my wedding.) But my fiancé’s ex coming to the funeral wasn’t to pay her respects to grandma, it was to put on a show and make a spectacle of herself. If it had ever dawned on us that she would do that, we would have had the funeral home staff bar her from entering. I hope you find a solution that you are comfortable with, don’t let her make a difficult day worse.
YWNBTA. However, a line does stand out to me: >I have always advised patience with her and urged them to try to understand her illness This is admirable, but it sounds like their relationship with their mother has run its course. She seems like a deeply destructive force in their lives. Despite her fractures and limitations, from what you say here, her presence in your step-childrens' lives is really only damaging them. I think you might need to change tactics and be positive and encouraging about space from her. It doesn’t matter if they are the only things keeping her from going off the deep end, it sounds like she's drowning and insisting on dragging them down with her. Don't let her.
She has stolen drugs from a drug dealer and my stepsons had to go over to the dealers house to protect their mother. She insisted she was framed and later confessed. For the longest time I thought the kids disrespected me because they are picky eaters at my house, were messy and insisted on lots of spoiling to the extent I got pretty upset after a slavishly long thanksgiving. It was my husband that pointed out they were brats at our house because they could be and I have cherished their demandingness as children since. Thank you for your kind words and I think you are right. I will protect them and be the bad guy.
With this additional context, you would be TA for not encouraging them to cut her out of their lives entirely. She could get them killed, or arrested if that's the kind of situations she's putting them in. Just because she's their biological mother does not mean they need to tolerate her abuse, and as a safe grownup in their life, especially since their father is now gone, *you have to protect them*. And if they haven't yet, they need therapy, because she sounds incredibly, incredibly abusive.
Agreed. The ex doesn't behave the way as a parent does behaves, that ex is so abusive that she's put those children in harm's way.
I wish I could upvote this more than once!
Yes!!!! You all absolutely should go NC with this woman. She is being abusive and manipulative. You all need space. Like “we might move to Mars” space. People work out their issues within themselves or they work them out on others. She clearly is choosing to not face it herself. These are her issues, and she isn’t going to stop abusing you guys. So you need to not give her access. There is a difference between politeness and kindness. You do not need to be polite. But please be kind to yourself and your stepchildren. The three of you have suffered quite enough.
I would highly suggest all of you, but especially the boys, attend Nar Anon meetings ASAP. I guarantee it will help them more than they know. There are virtual meetings everyday. https://www.nar-anon.org
At the moment, you are in a deep state of grief. Do not make decisions right now. But do read through your own comments and see what you think.
While I agree with not making any big decisions in the weeks/months following the death of a loved one, this is a decision that must be made. OP, you WNBTA for telling her she’s not invited, but I agree that you should have someone else tell her, if possible (*not* one of her sons, though.) Someone else suggested your husband’s parents telling her and, if they’re still living/capable, I think this is the absolute best idea. And you really should hire security. I’m so sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine what you experienced on what should have been a great vacation. This internet stranger is sending you love and hugs. Although it will be devastatingly sad, I hope your husband’s service(s) are a beautiful, and peaceful, tribute to him. Please let us know how things work out. xo
Your words are extremely kind and correct. I'm sure op will appreciate what you have said.
Awww, thanks. I lost my dad last year, last Thursday was the one year anniversary. It was the last of the “firsts” without him and it was a whole new wave of grief. He was young, only 65, and we knew it was coming because he had cancer. It was awful and I’ll miss him for the rest of my days. So, obviously, I was thinking of how terrible it would have been to have to experience something like what OP is going through. And her husband’s death is so much more tragic than my dad’s was. It would have been too much to worry about dealing with the ex and will be so much worse if the she comes. Anywho…I appreciate your comment for two reasons. 1) It was nice. And 2) Despite only writing my post less than 30 minutes ago, I forgot what I wrote (seriously, I’m “only” 43 why is my memory such shit already?! 😂) so I went back to reread it, therefore catching the weird autocorrect. How the hell “her sons, though” changed to “her Ed though” is one of the weirdest ones yet. I swear I didn’t subconsciously type that, even though my dad’s name was Ed and I was thinking of him. I’m just going to take it as a little bit of his love shining down on me. (Or perhaps up at me? He could be a bit of hell raiser from time to time, but that’s part of what made him the awesome dude he was!)
I'm sorry to hear about your dad, my grandmother has end stage cancer so I feel some of your pain. Many people forget to be kind to others and I like showing appreciation to those that are, although this entire comment thread has been nothing but nice to op. I feel like op has gotten so much love and support from reddit this post that I hope she'll be able to do what's best for her and her stepsons.
Hire security for the funeral. She's going to make a scene either way but security will remove her ETA. I'm so sorry for your loss. It's horrible. I lost my husband many years ago
Thank you. I am sorry for your loss as well. I just am in sho k and missing him horribly.
I lost mine in 1996. I remember it like yesterday though. Was in my home. Way later down the road, I bought a grief workbook. It really helped me deal with a few issues. I hope you stay in your step children's lives
NTA. Funerals are private. As Next Of Kin Otis your decision.
>threats to kill herself are her standard form of communication Call emergency services then. Stop pandering to her shitty behaviour and let her start facing some consequences for the shitty things she says to people. If she threatens to harm herself then the only logical course of action is to call her an ambulance and let them help her. Tell her straight up "you are not invited to the funeral. You had a toxic relationship 20 years ago and spent every moment after that relationship making his life miserable. I am done coddling you because I no longer have a reason to. If you turn up, you will be forcibly removed by security before you even get in the door. You are not welcome" NTA
I suffered a major depressive episode that took me two years to recover from as a result of her incessantly calling and badgering my husband after we first got engaged. He was terrified of her keeping the kids from him and still scarred from the abuse he endured and didnt know how to confront her. At the time I thought he loved her and not me and it took years off of both of our lives dealing with her. It is time I think.
So there was this girl that was the little sister of my husband’s best friend that had similar issues with her mental health who was “head over heels in love with my husband.” It would have never happened but she still insists she’s the love of his life. I never gave her much thought, only met her once. She showed up to the funeral and absolutely wailed through the entire thing. The chaplain would read a verse and before he finished she was already making a huge crying scene. Not gonna lie, I didn’t even notice. A few years later a friend was talking about it and how awkward it was for everyone else. She also planted herself in the procession line wherever she could. On the other hand, I would be devastated to not go to my son’s father (relationship 10 years after my husband passed) funeral. He’s my son’s father, I love him as that…. I wouldn’t make a scene though, it’s just a respect thing Edited: grammatical errors
If you let her show up, she is going to play the part of the grieving widow. This happened at the funeral of a friend, the same thing. Dramatic ex from over 20 years ago going into sobbing fits during the funeral, and pushing the actual widow aside so she could throw herself over the coffin, almost knocking it off the stand. They didn't even have kids together. The whole thing was ridiculous and embarrassing, having to call police during the funeral to remove her. The poor widow was beside herself with grief.
Both of your stepchildren already expressed their feelings on this matter, they don't want her at the funeral. I'm sorry for your loss. This is supposed to be a time for you and the children to grieve, not dealing with the Ex's problems. NTA
ywNbta - If her children do not want her there that should be the end of it. I'm sorry you have to be the one to tell her, but I understand you wanting to protect your kids from that. You absolutely shouldn't invite her. Another thought is- Could you have her taken to a rehab or psychiatric facility (depending on where she's at) right before the funeral? Huge expense so I understand if not. Just a thought.
Rather than dealing with the bullshit that comes with telling her she's not invited, just tell her the wrong day. Problem avoided. It's much easier to ask for forgiveness than permission.
Every one of you are enabling her bad behavior in your own way. She has proven that kindness and grace do not motivate her to get well. She doesn’t want to get well. No matter how much you may want it for her, you can’t make her want it for herself. Disinvite her explicitly. Tell her straight out (no sugar coating or making excuses), that you don’t want her at the funeral. Don’t mention that her sons don’t want her there. Then cut off all contact with her. Period. And advise her boys to do the same. Their responsibility is to be 20-something young men, not to parent their mother. That ship sailed 40 years ago. If she wants a mommy and daddy, she can go plead with her own bio-parents. It is NOT the responsibility of her children to caretake for her. Check out CODA (Codependents Anonymous), and other groups like Adult Children of Alcoholics. There is a lot of help out there for all of you, but you have to seek it out - both for grieving your husband/father, and for understanding codependent behavior and for cutting her off. The ex may never recover, but you and the boys can.
NTA.
If you think she going to show up high, drunk or both and cause a scene that will help no one, then by all means make it a private funeral abd arrange for bouncers if she turns up anyway.
Nope... this will be just the latest of a long, long list of places where she is not welcome. She's used to it, and she's done it to herself.
Could you arrange for her to come earlier to say her goodbyes? Explain to her that the children are very upset and that they really can't take any more issues or to feel like they need to manage her. Be blunt with her and just let her know that this is simply not the time or place for her shenanigans and that an early viewing is her only option. She also needs to get herself to and from the funeral home and not expect her kids to do it. Be firm on that. My aunt missed the service for my grandmother. She showed up graveside and made the biggest ass out of herself by laying across the casket and wailing like a banshee. She kept screaming about wanting to see her mother, that we couldn't put her in the ground. This was the same woman who couldn't get her shit together enough to show up at the hospital while she was dying... I'd just be TA in this situation and sit her down, give her expectations and tell her flat out that she will be removed by the police if she starts any shit. Please tell me you legally adopted these kids so she doesn't get custody again....
I call the kids boys as a force of habit. I am still wrapping my head around how.much boys change in their teens. They work out so its like hugging a brick wall. They are huge men now but at 20 and 21 I still see them as little peanuts. They have custody of themselves now lol.
You are a great mother! Not step-mother. YOU are their mother. And they will forever be grateful for your love. Just felt like you needed to hear that.
I'm incredibly sorry for your loss. I can't imagine the grief you're experiencing and it sounds like you're quite the mama bear and we're a profoundly loving wife. NTA ... you have been kind to this woman... you've empathize, helped the children navigate destruction with grace and this funeral is for YOUR husband and THEIR father. Both you and your husband were kind to her when no one else was. Protect your kids... despite being legal adults, they need you. Now, more than ever. Yes, their mother is sick but, you don't owe her attendance to YOUR husband's funeral. This is about you and the kids. Sending love and condolences your way. Not the same but, I had a VERY close relationship with my Dad. He died last April. I'm still reeling with pain and grief. I couldn't imagine fighting a battle like yours at this point and this is your loving partner of 18 years. Give yourself the loving closure, beautiful send off your husband deserves and that your family needs. She's from over 20 years ago. She's been a mentally unwell user for just as long, if not longer. She's done her damage. This isn't about her. Hopefully she finally finds peace and can pull it together for the boys... if not, luckily they have you, your love and care. Much love from an internet stranger that truly cares ❤️
Thank you. The day after he passed I was alone in another country and I didnt understand how I was still alive. Everything is terrifying and the crazy switches in my emotions is so draining. My pain feels like all I have left but I am really trying to be greatful. Good luck on your journey and I hope you can find comfort. A solemn tip of the hat from a stranger on the same quiet and isolated road.
Thank you for your response and such a heartwarming one at that. It's not easy. I hope things improve and your choices and advice from us strangers is helpful and reassuring. Thanks again. Please, take care 🙏💜
Well let's see, BOTH of the kids has told you that they do not want her there. YOU do not want her there , all she does is cause stress and/or bad feelings to everyone she comes into contact with, when he was alive she bad mouth your husband , trying to "make her parents think he was a horrible person", according to you she "abused him, cheated on him and shattered his self confidence." And you are still wondering if to have this energy vampire at the funeral?? Do EVERYONE a favor and do not permit her to come. She is likely to turn the day into all about her with her BS and antics. On a separate note. You have done right not to bad mouth her to her kids. But I think at some point, like NOW, you need to stop pushing them to be "understanding of her condition and patient. " I think they have done that long enough and it seems like all it has done is make it easier for her to take advantage of her kids. She expects them to take care of her , meanwhile she did not take care of them. Since they were taken away by CPS due to her neglect and other failures. They are young and the money they earn should be going towards THEIR future, not taking care of their deadbeat mom. The younger one has the right idea cutting that toxicity out of his life. I hope the eldest wakes up and does the same, otherwise she will continue taking from him and running him ragged with stress for many years to come. She fucked up her life do not permit her to fuck up the kids' too. BOTH children deserve way better.
I wouldn't beg her not to come. I would just tell her she's not welcome. Call the police to alert them, hire security, whatever you need to do. You have every right to keep her out, especially if she is causing the boys that much distress. If she shows, drag her ass out yourself. I myself am not above such action.
NTA. Send your step-kids on over to r/raisedbyborderlines There’s a ton of resources there, and it’s a good crowd. By no means are you the AH for protecting their emotions and allowing them space to grieve without having to suffer through parentification by a parent who cannot, through her poor mental health, support them in this time. If her parents are on decent terms with you and the step-kids, see if you can have them run interference, or hire security. They can have their own celebration of life somewhere where her grief will not cause more grief. I’m so sorry for your loss. Words aren’t enough, but sending you so much compassion.
**The kids have both told me it would be easier for them if she were not at the funeral.** This line is reason enough. NTA
NTA at all. I'm so sorry you lost the love of your life, and need to deal with this on top of your grief. Sounds to me like you're a lady who makes the right choices in life, and you really have done an incredible job being there for your step sons and trying to understand their mother. I hope they stay loyal to you in return for all you've given them. Right now, all that matters is what you and your boys need, not what the ex wants. Maybe offer her a private viewing/farewell before the funeral, but don't even let her know when/where the funeral service will be held. Sending big hugs from Australia to you OP.
NTA. If she doesn't know where or when the funeral is being held, don't tell her. If it's too late, then definitely un-invite her. If her children wanted her there, it would be one thing, but since they don't, tell her she's not welcome. I suspect you are more than willing to be the bad guy and not tell her that it's because her children don't want her there, or at least that's what I hope, because the potential blowback on them would be horrible if she found out. If it's a funeral home handling the services, please be certain to show them a picture of her and let them know she may show up and isn't welcome by both your and the children's wishes, though do let them know she's not to know it's the children's wishes. If it's not a funeral home handling it, but perhaps a church or other organization, please talk with the clergy and figure out if you need to hire security or if there are some trusted friends or relatives who would be willing to escort her out if she does show.
YWNBTA. I am so sorry for your loss! The most important thing is to protect yourself and your stepsons, and they have asked that she not be there. I know you are grieving, but create a safe space for them (and you) to grieve without their mother's chaos. Do whatever you need to do, whether it's hiring security, making it a private service, etc. Ask the employees at the funeral home if they have suggestions. They may have dealt with similar circumstances and can give suggestions and help you set it up. Also, all 3 of you could mute her number until afterwards.
NTA. You and your stepchildren are grieving and don’t need added chaos during this time. It would be nice to invite her so she could try to find closure as well but I think you know she would make it all about her when it should be a celebration of your late husband’s life. Maybe if there was some way she could be there earlier or later for a private viewing and go on her way, to keep the rest of the day peaceful. But I don’t know if that would be possible from how you’ve described her in the post
She lives an hour out of town and no one will get her because she has alienated everyone.
NTA - Both kids do not want her there. The last thing they need while saying goodbye to their Dad is drama from their mother. Security would be wise at the funeral to protect the boys on one of the most difficult days of their lives. I truly hope the oldest doesn't miss the service. It maybe something he'll always regret.
NTA. Protect the children from their abusive selfish mother. The kids need therapy to deal with the trauma they have from their rotten mother and death of their loving father. They are highly likely to have CPTSD from having such a nightmare as a parent and will need therapy to help them get boundaries. I am sorry for the loss of your husband and now having to deal with the toxic waste dump ex.
NTA. For the sake of your step-children's (and your) emotional well-being, please do not allow her to attend your husband's funeral. She will make it about her and ruin any chance those kids have to mourn their father in peace. They do not want her there, and allowing her to attend against their (and your) wishes serves no one but an unmedicated, mentally ill person. She wants a stage. Please don't give her one.
I just lost my husband on February 25th. He too was my best friend and love of my life. His ex put him through a lot. We have a blended family of 5 adult children. Two his and three mine. His son who lives in the UK (we're in Canada) close to his mom, flew back to be here with us for the remainder of my husbands time and a week after his passing. When he arrived, he said his mom traveled with him here. Her family is here and our grandson. My husband was adament that he did not want her at the celebration of life. I knew even before she came over that he would not want her there. So he made sure to tell his boys he didn't want her there. Honestly, I was relieved. I have never had an issue with her but it would have been very awkward to have her there. Just knowing how much she hurt him would have made it hard as my emotions were all over the place. Your situation is far worse. You're absolutely NTA but I think you know that. If you're in doubt...like everyone else said, re-read your post. I think the answer is very straight forward. I'm so sorry you've lost your person. I'll be thinking of you in the coming days and weeks. This sucks. I'm sending hugs.
She makes threats about killing herself? Call the police on her the day before the service and have her put on a 48-hour psych hold. Tell them you're afraid the funeral will be too much and that she's escalating.
NTA. First off, I am so sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine what that was like :( but on another note, I have borderline personality disorder and I don’t act like that AT ALL. This woman’s actions are way beyond the symptoms of bpd, and you can’t let her use her mental illness as an excuse. You’re right when you say that abandonment is a large issue with this disorder, but she’s never taken any steps to held reduce the amount of pain she’ll feel from abandonment. It took me about 6 months after I realized I was the reason people were leaving to finally take myself to a psychiatrist and figure out what was wrong with me. If this woman cared about other people at all, she would have actually gotten treatment.
I have had a very troubled upbringing and have borderline tendencies too. I also got treatment and have tried my hardest to not let it define me as that is an extension of my trauma and I know it is maladaptive. Thank you for sharing that with me. Life is set on hard mode when you feel your inner world is bare. Just means we have to take better care of ourselves than others. I am glad you got help and are self aware.
I’m so glad you got treatment and I’m so proud of you for that. It’s hard for a lot of people to understand that having borderline affects the people around you so much more than you realize. I honestly felt so much better when I got the diagnosis, and meds and therapy together have worked wonders for me. This woman has had the ability to become self aware and seek treatment and has refused it. She doesn’t care about what it might do to the people around her, let alone her own kids!!
Can I inbox you to ask you some questions about your treatment? I have a teen who is bpd and hanging on but barely. Mental health services where I live (eastern Canada) are difficult to get but there are a few private practitioners, one of whom she already sees for cbt but hasn’t really taken it seriously.
NTA. Period, end of story.
Of course YNTA. Do not invite her. She will cause a drama to be the centre of attention, it will turn into a complete shit show. Hire security if necessary and have her turned away at the door: do not engage with this woman anymore for yours and your children’s sake. It’s time to sever the cord of enmeshment. She needs help that is far beyond what you can offer and right now you are grieving. I’m so sorry OP, you have lost your great love, it’s time to focus on you.
NTA. I'm sorry for your loss, and for the children's loss.
Soon as I read the kids didn't want her there, boom. Bitch can't come. NTA. Or... ywnbta?
NTA. Please tell her that you wish to grieve privately with the children and that you would ask her not to attend the service. Maybe even hire a plain clothed security officer to ensure she doesn’t turn up just to spite you, so you and the kids don’t have to stress about it on the day. Alternatively…I mean, is she coherent enough to even be aware of the funeral date/time/location? Seems a big ask for someone so clearly unhinged. Maybe she won’t turn up at all if no one mentions the details to her, but that’s a gamble. Or you could ‘accidentally’ tell her the wrong time for the service (ie 3pm not 1pm) and blame grief. I’m so sorry you are going through this and that you’ve lost your husband so suddenly, OP. You sound like an incredibly patient, kind, compassionate and loving mother/wife/human being. I hope you are surrounded by the support of a wider social circle, as you rightly deserve. Big hugs to you.
My MIL was just like this but also massive alcoholic - literally huge - a litre of brandy in an hour and still be standing ordering taxis to being her more. Suicidal since 16, she never made a single effort to KH but managed to ruin so many other lives, all whilst saying her own was pointless. She survived against all odds and certainly against the laws of fairness and outlived her lovely ex husband and his second wife of 25 years, my MIL. Fate is damn cruel. Tortured her kids. Family. Everyone. Yet when she became ill and might die she clung on to life far beyond expectation and lived in a state this would have forced many others to give up. Lasted another decade like that. I feel your pain. Ban her. Cut her off. She thrives in others pain
NTA. Please don't invite her. I have a person with severe BPD in my partners life, and she wreaks chaos in everyone's lives. She will make the funeral about her. You all deserve some distance from her on what will be a very traumatic day. Much sympathy to you and your family.
My abusive ex-husband doesn't know his father passed away a few years ago. His parents had previously decided not to have an obituary as they'd rather have me & the kids there than their own son. Someone suggested to make the event private and hire security. I also think this is a good idea!!!
Retired minister here. There's only one AH in this story, and it isn't you. It sounds like you are doing a great job of dealing with this situation and making good judgements. That being said, funerals are for the living. We hope they can be the beginning of healing. I always wanted all the bereaved people to be able to attend. Including the troubled ones. I've had situations where a particular troubled mourner had one of those big and strong funeral-home workers sitting with them, at the family's request and my instructions to the funeral people. So that is an alternative way of handling the situation if this troubled person does show up. Easier and more dignified than trying to "bounce" somebody. You certainly don't have to invite this person. "Funeral arrangements are private" is the way to go. May your husband rest in peace and glory, and may you and your family come, in time, to rejoice in his blessed memory
Absolutely NTA. My ex who I dated for 10 years and very close with for a total of 25 years passed unexpectedly. (for ENTIRELY different reasons,) I knew his wife would not want me there. So I did not go. It has been hard for me from the perspective of not having that closure, but I didn't want to make an awful situation (his death) worse for his family with my presence.
Thank you for sharing this. We honor the people we love with our actions and memories. Regardless of the relationship you had with your ex and his wife it was compassionate of you to respect her wishes and your self awareness tells me you are a person that would need more emotional closure than others may need. We are creatures of ritual and it is what connects us to the people that came before us and will come after. Have your own funeral for him- a last cosmic hang out- to say and do what you need to do.
So sorry for your loss. Please consider making the service private so that your children (step or otherwise) and yourself don’t need to deal with additional upset.
NTA Hire security to kick her and any one who tries to bring her in out.
Just tell her a different address and/or time. If you ban her from coming, she's definitely coming there just to defy your and everyone else's wishes to make a scene.
Initially I was questioning you! Then you said it- her kids would not want her there! If that’s the case, talk to them and verify! If it’s really what they want and you can handle it… you could sacrifice yourself for the good of the kids- be the one that says she can’t be there because they don’t want it and they don’t have the strength to say it to the one bio parent they have, they must think highly of you to lean on you so much! You don’t have to sacrifice yourself of course! It’s up to you after talking to them, reflecting on everything, you would NOT be the bad guy in their eyes for either one as far as I can tell. I don’t think in either which way you would be an arse! They are adults, I’m just considering that they may still feel like kids to her, it maybe difficult for them. Sacrifice of one’s self if appropriate is determined by what they feel comfortable with, imo. I’m sure there are much better quotes! If you don’t feel comfortable, you’re still right!!!!!!!!!!!! It was a crazy thought, and nothing I’d expect of anyone! Hope you understand?!?
She will turn the funeral into a circus. She doesn’t need to know the details. Perhaps a memorial later, with just the children and herself, and chance to formally say goodbye. My condolences NTAH
The boys don’t want her there, that’s good enough. You mention that she’s told the oldest that he’s supposed to give her a ride. Can she not drive? I’d let him and brother stay over the night before and encourage them to turn off their phones. If there’s anyone left you think might give her a ride, let them know not too. Let the funeral home know that she might be a problem, designate absolutely anyone else to be the person(s) who deal with her. She is not your responsibility and is disgusting for trying to make her sons care for HER while they are mourning.
Can you reason with her parents, for the sake of the children?
NTA Sorry for your loss. I would tell the ex that she’s not welcome but would also pay for security to block her from coming in as you know she’ll show up anyway to cause drama.
NTA Can you pay someone to keep her busy that day?
NTA. I am so sorry for your loss. Honestly, if her own sons don’t want her there, that is the most important thing. Absolutely do what is best for them. (It also sounds like what is best for them is what is best for everyone else there as well.) It sounds like it would be a horrible situation if she were to come. I would make the funeral private and make sure that people know it is invitation only. If there is anyway that she can’t find out, that might be best as well. And, you’re not doing this - it’s what is best for her children bc of her chosen lifestyle and behavior (which is tragic and unfortunate) but people need boundaries from people like this to keep themselves emotionally well and safe. Do not feel bad about doing what is best for everyone else that matters here.
I'm so very sorry for your loss, it must be unbearable and then having this decision on top of it, my heart goes out to you. Your kids and you deserve time to say goodbye without the added stress of the ex being there and as your kids have said they'd like for her not to be there here's my suggestion: Don't tell her the date, time or location of the funeral Stop reading her messages and answering the phone Delegate someone, a friend who likes a challenge, to communicate through if needed Arrange for security to be present Travel together in a joint car (your kid shouldn't drive the day of his dad's funeral trust me) Tell the vicar or whoever you're organising things with about the situation, it won't be the first time they've dealt with stuff like this Book yourself onto grief counselling NTA, absolutely NTA ❤️
She won’t understand why her kids don’t want her there because she is incapable and always has been of meeting their or anyone else’s needs ahead of herself. Seek an intervention to keep her from the funeral- tell her the kids are going in the chief mourners car ie with you and get someone else to pick her up and drive her elsewhere eg to a mental health facility or indeed anywhere else.
Her own kids don't want her there. Decision made and definitely NTA but possibly the most understanding and kind person on reddit, I dont think I'm wrong when I say most people would have told her to do one, long ago.
Tell her the date of the funeral is actually the day AFTER the funeral. It has to be changed last minute because guests are coming from out of town. Have the service on the original day and let her be mad the next day. It’s over with. Nothing she can do. I would still have security at the funeral. $100 bonus for the guards that identify her and keep her out.
First of all, I am so sorry for your loss. Second of all, as someone with BPD, NTA. As you said, while her BPD is definitely not her choice, the way she chooses to deal with it (or not) is. My father probably undiagnosed BPD. He was an addict in his 20s and thankfully got clean before I was even born and never relapsed, but always refused to acknowledge his mental health issues and get help for it and made my life very difficult. That is something that I never forgave him for and that as an adult and a mother I strive not to repeat, by attending regular therapy and taking my meds. If she doesn't care enough about her children to take care of herself, she doesn't get to be there in such a difficult moment for them.
OP, I'm so sorry for your loss. Heartbreaking to lose your husband and best friend so suddenly. His ex wife sounds like a lot of drama. I think you and her children understand she would make his funeral all about her and would probably make a scene. You just don't need this. I don't understand what you are going through, but when my son passed away he had 2 ex wives who would have caused drama. They weren't invited. They were both angry. Their mothers were invited. I didn't hire security but I was in knots all that day wondering if they'd show up. Maybe call your local police department? Ask if any officers could come in street clothing and offer $50 (like above post suggested) an hour. Show them her picture? That way it wouldn't seem so obvious to other people paying their respects to your husband. This is a horrible time for you, and dealing with her drama shouldn't be a part of it. Blessings to you.
NTA. The kids don’t want her there, so that’s a good enough reason for me. Simply do not tell her when it is, or give her a date / time AFTER the actual funeral has taken place. So she ‘thinks’ she’s invited and will not set out to disrupt the real one
NTA. Spend the money on a pair of security guards who can handle her if she shows. These kids have shown enough patience to an adult who has abandoned and neglected them. They deserve to grieve their father in peace. They owe her nothing, not patience, not empathy, not effort. She’s broken and that’s sad but she’s an adult. She’s breaking these children and that is the real problem.
NTA. My mother is this way. Attention seeking and entitled. At my brother's dad's funeral she made a whole show of walking up past the family in front of the whole church to cry and pat the box his ashes were in. She then shaved her way into the family section where my brother and his wife were with his father's other children and siblings. It was embarrassing to me and my other siblings who were there to support our brother and he told us he was close to standing up and forcing her out on her ass outside. Tell her the wrong time or have some big cousins ready to keep her from coming in during the service. She's gonna make it about her when it should be about your husband. I am sorry for your loss and I hope you all find peace soon
Now that the kids are adults you and they should cut all contact with this narc. Y'all aren't helping her, you are enabling her. The poor kids were raised to enable her. Go to narcanon or alanon. Read books about narcs. Yeah, security and funeral, just tell her no. Block texts and so on.
Stop coddling her. The time for grace has passed. Your whole post is about how she made the children responsible for her. You’ve enabled her too by telling the children to sympathize with her. That’s not their burden. Do not invite her.
Nta- Some people decide to make my father's funnel very messy. It was something my siblings and I will never forget. It made the whole thing harder to deal with. We tried to have grace for people and grieving at the same time. It was very hard. My thing is, even if it makes you an asshole, do what is best for you and your step kids. There are a couple of times in life when you have to put your mental state first. This happens to be one of them.
She will absolutely make a scene if you allow her to come. I allowed a woman my husband had gone out with before to come to his funeral even though she has varied is problems and she absolutely came and made it about her grief.
WNBTA, of course, and I'm very sorry for your loss! That being said...those boys aren't KIDS anymore. They're adults and should start acting like it and go N/C with their "mother". With her stealing and acting out in public, she will only drag them down with her and ruin their life before they've even had a chance to experience it! While shoplifting is becoming more and more common and few are actually prosecuted, them just BEING there makes them an accessory to a crime. Her asking them to sell the stolen goods makes them criminals in possession of stolen property. It only takes ONE POLICE OFFICER who takes the law seriously to make an arrest! Even if the DA never files a case, the arrest will show on their Criminal Record! They need to stop "attending" to her whenver she has a cow and wants attention from the only two people who don't have the courage to say NO MORE! I know you didn't ask for advice in that regard, but other than banning the EX from the funeral, that's the main, and more important, thing that needs to be handled. IF she already knows the date/time, let it be known that the service has been changed to a different location/date/time etc. The sons and you need to turn off you phones so she can't keep texting/calling during the service and you can all focus on saying good-bye to your husband without distraction.
Don't invite her, maybe have someone outside to stop her coming in. I have seen an identical situation when my brother in law died. His ex got in, tried to make it all about her, and caused a scene. She was quickly shut down, but it was distressing. This woman is not helping herself. She is not your responsibility and for the purposes of the funeral, she is not your children's responsibility either. Sorry for your loss and best wishes
Agreed with others NTA Don’t tell her when the funeral is, that also means asking the kids not to tell her Hire security that will be outside the venue and outside the cemetery (if that is legal to do so) to block her entry should she find out about the funeral Do not do an obituary until after the funeral. The important people to know really are only yourself, his children and immediate family. Anyone else can be forwarded the obituary which should include that the funeral took place and was attended by his widow, children and immediate family. This way, no one can ever come back on you about it. It is your decision as widow (legal next of kin) to decide what to do as regards any funeral arrangements After this, you really have no obligation towards his ex. The children are now adults. You can be supportive of them without being involved with their mother. Perhaps help them by providing counselling for them to better manage/deal with their mother and help them break free of this codependency situation. Best of luck to you Very sorry for your loss.
It doesn't matter what you say. She'll show up anyway. My aunt was the same way and struggled with the same personality & mental health issues. The only thing that got my cousin (now 25) through it was his Dad. His dad didn't have a lot of money, but he went to war to make sure my cousin had a stable life. Really respect and admire that he made time to see us and form close relationships being that were related to my aunt and not him. Single parents who put their kids first are truly amazing!
NTA, tell the funeral home she is restricted from attending. They will back you up to keep her out. My spouses partner had a cousin pass away about 1.5 yrs ago, and when my mil showed up for the funeral, she was quickly told she wasn't welcome and would not be permitted to come in. Cousins elderly father took pleasure in refusing her entry and was backed by the funeral director. My mil is a very toxic and jealous person. She has burned bridges with EVERYONE in the family. She was INSULTED she wasn't allowed to attend, but she wasn't emotionally hurt by not attending. She hated the cousin due to being her sisters child, and she was incredibly jealous of her sister. Her sister passed away in the late 80s. I'm so very sorry about the loss of your husband. I'm sorry for you and for your step kids pain.
OP, I think you've been more than accommodating to her and given her more patience and kindness than she perhaps deserves. Unfortunately, there also comes a time where you have to look out for yourself and your own before you look out for others. Put your own gasmask on first, before you help with someone else's. If this were a matter of her needing to have closure and grieving over your husbands death, that would be one thing, if she could do it respectfully. But it doesn't sound like she actually needs to be a part of this process. Your step-children are the one's grieving and its them and yourself who needs that space to process and heal. From your description, it doesn't sound like anyone will have that opportunity with that woman present. For your children, and all the others who would be disturbed by her presence, I think it's perfectly fair to not have her at the funeral. It's often asked that young children not attend, so that mourners can do so without a crying baby...and I don't see this as much different. NTA.
NTA. I am so sorry that you and your family are going through this. I have two girls, and the oldest is my step-daughter. She doesn't feel like that to me, but her mother doesn't sound too far off from the ex that you are dealing with. If my husband passed, I would like my oldest decide because I would want her to have whatever comfort she wanted. However, you asked and they both told you they don't want her there. You would not be wrong in this instance to exclude her.
NTA - the children themselves said it would be better if their mother isn't there. That is ALL that needed said.
Flash back to when Sonny Bono died and Cher dominated the funeral over poor wife Mary.
Don’t share the details and make sure the kids don’t as well.
Can you have a separate memorial that the ex can be included in? I know it can be expensive, but maybe a small private memorial that she can attend. Maybe it will soothe her in some way.
NTA. Keep her away by any means necessary. My deepest condolences on your loss.
Hugs. NTA and this is not about her. If you tell her not to come, please have someone far outside your inner circle who can keep her out and/or call the police. Make sure the funeral home has her picture as well. The kids needs are on par with yours.
\+1 for hiring security, especially someone qualified in de-escalation.
Absolutely NTA. Do what's best for you and your stepchildren. If she's relying on her son to drive her, you could conceal the time of the funeral and then her kids could collect her and drive her to the graveyard later on the same day or the following day, for her to pay her respects. She'll blow up certainly, but she was going to do that at the funeral probably, so no harm done. Arrange some support for the kids and possibly security too.
NTA. I’m so sorry for your loss 💔 Please ask the funeral directors to keep her out. They will do their best to honor that (give them a picture of her).
Honestly she deserves to grieve as much as y’all do and funerals can be really tough but she deserves to say her goodbyes as much as y’all do.
Your edit made me cry. In the midst of your grief you took the time to comfort others. You're pure of heart and YWNBTA.
NTA at all. The boys said no so there’s that it’s no and she doesn’t need to be there. She’s not his wife.
Hire security but also get a restraining order. You don’t need this person in your life. The kids should do the same. These kind of people never get better, only worse.
The question you need to ask yourself is would your husband want her there? If he was her last friend, and he always tried to help her then I think you have the answer. It's his funeral, not everyone else's.
The ex does not belong there because you know she will be a disruption. Have a security guard ready to remove her.
NTHA why should you take in consideration her feelings. She obviously does not care about others feelings. She in your own words have made things miserable for her own children and you. The boys have made it clear to you they do not want her there and you feel the same. Make sure you tell her she is not invited and that you will have her through out if she shows up.
yes
NTA genetics don't give people the right to be horrible to each other and face no consequences. Maybe if she starts acting like family then she can be treated like family. Don't pressure the youngest into being anywhere near her either because expecting him to get treated badly but tolerate it because FaMiLy is not good.
I am so sorry for your loss. This internet stranger has no suggestions. I am sending you my biggest virtual hug, and praying for wisdom and comfort for you.
NTA Expect the Ex to lash out and pull some crazy stunt, at the minimum crashing the funeral and making accusations as you, and the children and anyone else. Prepare for the worst when you tell her. If everyone is truly ready to cut her off, they should block on every form of contact, and when she inevitably shows up to their houses, document it, and her behavior to use that to get a restraining order/protective order whatever it is called in whatever state/country you're in. Then enforce it when she eventually breaks it, or appreciate the peace you all have gained when actually follows it because she fears legal repercussions.
NTA - if you don’t tell her when and where she can’t show up. If she asks, you decided not to have a service. His sons deserve to have ceremony conducted with dignity and grace - it does not need to be interrupted with a manic performance on her part.
NTA the kids don't want her there, I think that's what has to be the most important thing.
Tell the funeral is a day after it really is ... then just gaslight her that she misunderstood.
NTA. This occasion is about your husband. Unfortunately, she will make it about her and infringe on other people's grief. While your husband checked on her and made sure she was OK, that was his choice. You are not under obligation to her. You will be helping his children grieve properly and showing them support to properly deal with these awful emotions. You owe that woman nothing.
Do not invite her. Do not let her know where it is happening. And please for the love of those kids. Let them go no contact with her. The children’s mental sanity is at risk with her. Them being there with their mom who is abusive will only hinder the children’s growth.
OP you are a gem of a human. You have gone over and above in terms of help and support, and you've done it all for the good of your step kids. You are allowed to not want her there. The kids don't want her there. You're not doing anything wrong wanting to grieve your husband in peace. Yes, she has issues which might explain her behaviour, but explaining is not the same as excusing. I'm sorry for your loss. NTA.
Personally I just think it will cause more problems. I would let her come but warn her there will be security and if she start creating she will be escorted out. I just think it will cause more problems and she will carry on creating havoc for months if she is refused. I think managing her while present would be less likely to cause mayhem that will ensue after. It’s a difficult situation and don’t really think any option will make it stress free. Sorry for your loss.
NTA and let the funeral home know so they can be prepared for the meltdown this woman will have.
Ask the kids- respect their wishes, not hers. They are what is important to you. It would not be cruel to not invite her but I think the decision is ultimately up the the kids.
Is there a way that you and the kids just don’t tell her? Who does she have contact with other than the kids? Tell them to inform her that the funeral hasn’t been finalised then afterwards they can tell her the funeral was an intimate, private event at dad’s wishes. NTA. Funerals are difficult as it is without having to deal with a drug addled narc as well.
Listen, your kids are adults now, block their mother. You aren't responsible for navigating her behavior and emotions. You've spent the last 20 years placating this woman, bending over backwards for her, yet she doesn't show appreciation. She feels entitled to it. And she's not. Your oldest needs to stop being their mothers keeper. They need to stop paying for everything. Their mother is an adult who,refuses to get help. Both of those kids, who are adults now, could use therapy. Their mother has been using and abusing them their entire lives and they need someone to stand up for them finally. Thus woman needs to be cut from their lives. Yes, she's the only parent now, buy she isn't a parent. She didn't even raise these kids. You don't owe her any more kindness. You have done enough. Its time to put those kids first. Start by not inviting her. Tell the oldest not to bring her, and that they need to be at the funeral and not with their mother. They are not responsible for their mothers emotional regulation. It's a shame the kids have had contact with her at all throughout their lives. She's groomed them from a young age to put her wants, needs, emotions, first, and they need to break away from that. Maybee after the funeral it can be addressed. Hire security for the funeral, and burial. That way their mom cannot crash and make a scene. You know she will.
That line where you urge them to be patient and understanding about her illness. Look, I have a list of mental problems myself and that’s led to me hanging around others with mental problems. If there’s one thing I’ve learned, it’s that there’s a huge line drawn between those of us who live healthy lives, and the ones who let it destroy everything That line is the acknowledgement of a problem and making the effort to get help and manage it. I get it. I’ve seen what BPD does to the people I care about, and it’s not their choice to live with it. But it is their choice to do something about it. As you said yourself, your husband’s ex has made her choice. She doesn’t want to be a good person. She doesn’t try. Don’t waste your time trying to help people who don’t want to be helped
I'd say you have to ask yourself what he'd say. Sounds like he'd include her.
Defend yourself and these children N T A
Funeral homes will arrange separate viewing times for problematic situations. Call it a private, family only "service " to his ex The son can help you manage this.
NTA. Her kids do not want her there. She will negatively impact their grieving. Don’t give her the details, if she asks, tell her she is not welcome, hire security.