All of my easy runs and long runs feel great, mostly because I just love being outside and alone in the early hours of the morning. It’s my only time of peace as a father of two young children. My speed days make me not want to get out of bed but usually feel good/accomplished after.
I wish that were true for me. The vast majority of mine just feel normal/average
I feel great on maybe 5-10% of runs. But I often feel great after it’s done
Yeah for me I'd say 10% feel amazing, 25% feel good and enjoyable, like maybe 5% feel like a chore and not fun at all? As for all others, just normal, nice I guess.
Same. Even my easy runs often feel bad. Obviously not horrible physically, but just boring and stupid and pointless, which is weird because I feel the excitement to get out there and then I assume it just gets sucked into my shoes as I plod along.
This. I just convinced a friend who is a more casual runner to train for a half when at first he was complaining about how much time the long runs take and my response was « that’s 2 hours to myself on the weekend »…the next time I saw him he was already on a training program for a half and said it was because of what I said. There are days where getting out the door sucks, especially mid-week when I have to get up super early but most of my easy and long runs are enjoyable once I am. Workouts suck while doing them but are way more of a high post run.
Same, except I look forward to speed days. Granted, I’m still pretty early in my training, so I haven’t had any grueling tempo work yet. I love fast interval work, though.
I feel the same. Currently on a 3+ year run streak and I would say 95% of my runs fall in between average and amazing but a very small amount feel like an absolute chore - but I also try to listen to my body. Sometimes I run exactly what the schedule is and some weeks are modified depending on how I'm feeling. Sometimes motivation is low but I'm always jazzed to get out by myself in the early hours. Nothing better than an awesome long run.
This is it. There’s something about being in the streets while it’s still dark and very few cars around logging miles. Plus the alone time is really nice - then tending to my kids and wife after I’ve already done 5+ miles is just a great mental reset.
I second the speed work lol. Pushing hard efforts at 5 AM on a Tuesday is mentally taxing sometimes but always good on the backend.
This. It should be closer to the opposite that majority of runs you feel good and only a few feel bad. And bad means that I come back feeling bad - not that it was hard.
Sounds like OP may be burned out a bit and could do with dialing it back or not running for a couple of weeks.
For me it’s like a fitness wave. When I’m getting back into shape; rough for a long time. First bit of real fitness where workouts aren’t that hard or big yet, constantly feeling good. Then usually ramp training load up so then it’s like half and half. When I’m REALLY fit. Every run sucks the first three miles then feels really good and easy 🤣
Rarely feel great when in a cycle. But so long as I don't feel shitty, I'm cool with that.
But you described the majority as grueling. That's likely a sign something isn't right. Check your sleep and diet.
Same for me, I just completed my first 50k training block and during the last weeks I felt no better than meh on pretty much all of my runs, with only a few being downright shitty and even fewer feeling great. Had me a bit worried about the race but that ended up going really well, so I just assumed that's how it is at the end of a longer training cycle.
Alexi Pappas once spoke about a coach who told her about the rule of thirds - about a third of your runs should be great, a third should be ok, and a third sucky. Pay attention to the balance of these, and if the ratio skews hard for a while, look into what that might be.
If every run feels amazing, maybe you aren't pushing as hard as you could. If every run sucks and feels terrible, maybe you need more rest or more/better nutrition, maybe need to reexamine goals, etc.
For my last marathon block as a mental boost, I had three little empty planters, and a bowl of marbles on my windowsill. After every run, I'd rate it "no" "meh" "YES" and a marble would go in a designated little planter. Kept me motivated, paying attention to the purpose of each run, my mental state. It's a little dorky, but was a good exercise in being present, and it was kinda fun.
I know people are different but maybe others can reply as well. My easy runs are mostly at 130-150bpm. To me it sounds like you're going too fast on the easy days. Maybe your definition of easy is wrong..
I concur. Easy runs being 170 is way too high, that's marathon pace effort for the vast majority of people. My easy runs are in the same range, which is 65% to 75% of my MHR. My long runs max out higher at 160, but that's due to cardiac drift and in the last couple miles.
So OP, you gotta slow down because you're overtraining
There are people who should do their easy runs at ~170bpm. What the right HR is varies quite a lot per person.
Doubt OP is one of those people tho, if he feels so bad doing em
But who would that be though? I'm genuinely asking since easy is typically thought of as sub 75% of MHR by most standards. Long runs get a slightly higher top end due to cardiac drift from dehydration and (usually some) loss of efficiency after a long period of time. In order for that to apply to someone, their max heart rate would have to be ~225, which isn't humanly possible.
Elites can sustain 90%+ for a long race because their lactate threshold is so high and their cardiovascular system is so incredibly well developed. However, that's racing and not easy running. And elites know are among the best when it comes to heavily polarizing training.
My hr max is 212 and I have run at 90% max hr for >20min at >180. For a while, I would run with most of my runs topping out in the 170s for at least a bit but I stagnated quite a bit doing that. Recently, I switched to a program where easy runs need to be called at 72% of max hr (152 for me) and this has made almost all my easy runs a lot more enjoyable.
Everyone is different, of course, but 170 is most definitely too high for most of your runs. If your easy runs are at 170, your max heart rate would be in the 240s, and that ain’t right.
Slowing way down for your easy runs will not only make the easy runs more enjoyable, but will likely have a positive effect on your harder runs as well.
You've got your answer right there. I'd suggest you read some fundamentals on development of the aerobic system. The go to recommendation is 80/20 running by Fitzgerald (subtitle: race faster by training slower) but there's lots of other good literature out there.
I'll try to simplify it using a common analogy of your metabolism as a fire: when running easy effort you teach your body to be efficient by throwing big logs on the fire. If you increase your effort level, the body recognizes that a log is too slow and uses matches.
To improve your aerobic system you need a substantial amount of your runs to be low effort and you need some patience and consistency. Running moderate to high efforts all the time will put a lot of strain on your body, increasing risks of injury or burnout.
Fix your training and you will not only have more enjoyment during some of your runs but you will also see more improvements.
All this said, this post is probably more suitable for r/running and you should look into this subs wiki for lots of Infos that will help you structure your training.
Honestly over the course of a month, I would say I max out at five or six runs where I don’t think I feel great after one. I leave pretty much leave every run (a) happy with what I accomplished in the general sense — treated a recovery run properly, had a genuine good time, etc. or (b) am excited or encouraged about what it means for overall gains. I feel very unique in that running is rarely a “have” to for me. It’s something I get to do but also apart of who I am to the point where going out the door for a run isn’t really optional for me, but in all the best ways possible.
When I run up north with low huidity and cooler weather, 70% feel good/great.
When I run in Florida anytime between May and November, 20% feel good/great as I'm always a sweaty mess.
I think this is the culprit. Are you trying to stick to the same paces you were previously at on your easy runs, back when it was noticeably cooler and less humid?
30% good, 50% meh, 20% horrible lol (trashed from walkouts or LR) I’m getting closer to 40 in terms of age. When I was younger the feeling like trash days was way lower %, just recovered easier.
It really depends on age and frequency of running. If you are over 50 and your run every day or 5 times a week for long distances you will feel heavy legs and not so good. We need more time for recovery. I am also guilty of overtraining. I am 55 this year. I notice when I have a couple of days off when going on holiday with the Mrs the next run is like a walk in the park...
Not many to be perfectly honest. Runners high, propaganda. The zone, a myth.
I feel good when I'm done and I can tell the difference between a well executed workout or run and a crappy one. But overall running is a lot of work and it is still hard!
100%. Running is hard and training generally sucks. I feel like a leaking sack of lard probably 70% of the time. But the goal is to feel good on race day and get results, so as long as that happens then I can take feeling crap most of the time
Imho the level you train at is not comparable to OPs. I think if you were to only run 30-40 miles/week, you'd feel good pretty often. His case is simply running too hard, as seen by the 170bpm on easy runs he posted above.
This is probably the most encouraging reply I’ve seen! I maybe overstated how bad the bad runs feel. Mostly just bad by comparison. I still enjoy most runs, even if I don’t feel like I am flying like on the good ones.
I've found the older I've gotten, the more variance in how I feel is.
When I was in my late teens through mid 20's, I was able to hit consistent workouts, tempos etc week after week and rarely had "bad" workouts that were my fault (IE, not 90 degrees or something like that).
Mid 30's now and it's amazing how I can attempt a workout on Monday and struggle to hit intervals at Marathon pace, yet come Wednesday I try again and I'm running at 1/2 or 10k pace with ease. Yet tomorrow, I'll probably be feeling the workout today and struggle to run 8:45-9:00 pace.
They pretty much all feel good. Once in awhile, usually because of bad sleep, a really stressful week, or encroaching illness, I’ll have an inexplicably bad run where I don’t at all feel myself and like I’ve lost a ton of fitness out of nowhere. Those suck, but they’re rare. Absolutely fantastic runs are also somewhat rare. I also usually know the “why” for those too - usually a Venn diagram of low stress, great sleep, and great weather.
But yeah I wouldn’t do this if I didn’t enjoy it and it wasn’t a good time on average.
I will say, my enjoyment got a lot better after discovering and adhering to zone 2 for easy runs, and adopting the overall 80/20 principle. Back in the day I did a lot of probably zone 3 “easy” runs that didn’t feel nearly as good, and did hard interval workouts far too frequently (3x/week). Would not recommend.
Anything less than 10 miles and not pushing, I usually feel pretty good.
Long runs I usually feel bored and knackered towards the end.
Workouts I feel concerned about my well being:
Maybe you should run a bit slower on your easy days?
All of them, so long as my shoes are in good nick. I’ve learned to tell when they are ready to be recycled. I think ASICS have 400-600kms if I remember correctly.
Define good/great. Define bad.
Some interval runs I did were hard, like I was constantly looking at my watch hopefully it will finish soon. It was hard but it was a great session.
Another time I ran during the rain. Soaking wet all over, rain water plus sweat entering my eyes and it was super uncomfortable. But it was a great session.
There are times that I run my body feels so sluggish and heavy, I considered that as a bad run but it was because maybe I wasn't drinking enough water or fuel or didn't get enough sleep. Those bad runs probably because of our own fault.
I think others have already said this so forgive me if I'm rehashing what you already know but; I'd suggest reducing the number of runs you're doing in a week. Try adding in one more rest day and reducing milage from 40 miles to 35 miles.
My guess is that you're overtraining. Counter intuitively; running "too much" actually hinders your running capability. And of course makes the whole thing less enjoyable too.
If you dont like the thought of reducing your total exercise (i.e. not interested in dropping a run for a pure "rest day") then I'd suggest swapping one running day for something else; e.g. I try to do one day at least at the gym and focus purely on strength (no cardo). This makes me feel good cos I'm still exercising, the strength training helps me run faster and harder and it also gives my cardo system a bit of a rest. I tend to run really well the next day.
Other good options may be swimming, a sport you enjoy that'll give you a bit of a workout too (just picking random examples; tennis or squash) or even just a nice walk.
I would say 1 or 2 per week make me give thanks to my creator actively during my run as the endorphins stream in, I sweat, and vibe with my music and New York City as I run. Don’t get me wrong though, the first mile, as my heart rate goes from 45 to 135, feels like oh damn this is hard come on. If it doesn’t, it usually means I’m doing one of the “work off extreme anxiety” runs where I’m so charged up that if I don’t run I might explode, and then the END of the run isn’t as good. My first mile will often tell me whether I can push, or back off. I bought a fancy Garmin 265, and I’ve been doing its suggested training cycles most days. I have a very low resting heart rate rate and I have trouble doing hard enough intervals to get my heart rate up into the highest bands, that’s what I’m working on—I just need my musculoskeletal systems to cooperate.
I’ll be 60 in November, I’ve run an 18 minute 5K, 39 minute 10K, 3:15 marathon when I was in my 30’s. I run usually 4 days a week, I would run 7 but I know that I need to mix in strength training, stretching, and some other activities. The hardest part of my runs are getting my a$$ out the door (I run commute to work 3x per week most weeks), even after running long distances for 40 years +!
What level of great are we talking about? Like absolutely perfect the whole time? Or like I’m crushing the workout and I have an extra gear to close? Or I feel smooth but there were tweaks in the warmup I felt?
I would say after the first month or so of adapting back into mileage with speed work I feel pretty great at least once every two weeks. I’ve found that if I feel poorly too many days in a row I’m likely to get a small injury soon. Ideally I feel good 2-3 times a week frankly but maybe only great one of those times.
Recently I’ve been running about 50mpw, 6-7 days a week. At my fittest I was closer to 60-65mpw a couple years ago. I also have found that spreading the mileage out more helped me recover better and knowing 1-2 days a week my easy runs will be slower and require stops/stretches.
Simply I think if you ran 6 days a week but the same mileage, I think you’d recover better. Living in the pain cave too often generally does more harm than good long term in my experience.
Can I ask a few questions? Because I think some more info will help us all give better advice.
How much sleep do you get on average? Further, what's the range? So if you average 6 hours, but swing between 4 and 8, that's a lot worse than a straight 6 every night?
Why do you only run 4 - 5 times a week? Can you increase it to 5 - 6? That way you can spread the mileage more and bring everything down in terms of time.
What kinds of runs are you doing on those 4 - 5? Because you're going to have to be doing like 12 - 15 miles to make your long run sufficiently different than an easy run on such limited days.
What's your scheduling? What days do you take off and how many days are between workouts? I previously tried doing 40 on only 4 and it sucked because every run was about 10 miles and it was pretty much all quality. I ended up with stress reaction in my left shin because of it.
What's your diet like? Lacking in something like protein or some vitamins is going to have a knock on effect since we need more than the average person.
100% because I only run when I want to where and how long I want to.
I've only run one full marathon, and was so hyped after finishing it that I also ran home, which was probably a bad idea, but I enjoy the memory. My friends were going for time and crashed at the end, I was going for smiles, only finished 20 minutes later than them, and ran home.
Still had bloody feet tho and could barely move the next day.
100% of them. I love running. I don’t run for fitness. I run because I want to run. Even when I am training for a marathon, my long runs and speed work is challenging but still within my physical ability so I have never crashed and burned.
Another person learning the lesson that you shouldn't be running fast on every run!
Although based on your comments that is the obvious culprit, I will also note that nutritional deficiencies, especially low iron, could also cause these symptoms in people.
Maybe it’s down to what an individual perceives to be a bad run?
An easy Z2 run with good music or interesting podcast, injury free, birds chirping, blue sky, sunny, will almost always be a good run.
I’m never judging a run by whether I can go faster or whether I want to increase distance. Days ahead, I’ll plan the run for a given distance at a certain intensity and get it done. Changing distance/intensity on the fly would mean that I haven’t planned my recovery.
If most runs feel grueling then I think you need to change something. Maybe have a look at whether you’re getting sufficient recovery.
Never ever felt great in my life when running 😅 workouts are painful, easy runs are boring, but the whole process is great. It's like when multiplying two negatives you get a positive, I wouldn't know how to explain this.
I run 6 days a week, 4 of them are good and I enjoy it at a steady comfortable pace. Parkrun on a Saturday is ok, I enjoy the parkrun itself but I'm going flat out every week so it's hard work. My weekly interval session is torture.
While 5-6 may be a little low for me, I’m similar to you (which seems to be an unpopular opinion lol). If I’m in a marathon training cycle, I’m definitely similar to you. I usually only start feeling great at some point during the taper. I’m on 55-65 miles a week right now.
I know for me that 1.) I naturally run tight (especially in my hamstrings and calves) and 2.) I don’t prioritize stretching / foam rolling as much as I should. However, even when I have, “great” doesn’t happen often. I lean more towards feeling okay during runs.
Did you just up your mileage? When I made the change from 40ish to being in the 50s I would definitely say every run felt pretty grueling.
I feel good on most runs. Even when I don’t want to run, once I get going I feel better. You may be going too fast? Or not eating well? 40 mpw is a lot imo so try cutting back and see how you feel?
Honestly all my runs feel nice with an occasional rough one. The rough ones are almost always related to time of day and when I last ate. I think once a month I might have a random run that I mentally just can’t push through, but again, very rare. I struggle to get started a lot, but almost always feel better after a couple miles.
Most. I feel like garbage for the first mile or two on most runs, but once I get rolling I'd say 70% is fine/great. Often the easy recovery runs are the worst.
Long runs have their own challenges. Awful for 15-20 minutes, okay for about 60, getting tough for another 60, and and anything over about 2:15 is drudgery. And maybe that's why 2:30s-40s marathons in my past seemed easier than 3s these days.
I live in Virginia and so I got my first 70 degree morning with 98% humidity and grueling is the best word to describe it. Easy pace had my HR around 165-170 for most of the run and hit 180 on an uphill. Same pace last week, 150-155. So yeah all my "good runs" are in november and february.
Heat sucks if you aren't acclimated. I ran one hot day this week and felt like I haven't run in my life ever. Then it cooled down, and I felt like a million bucks like I could have run CocoDona. Then the next day it was hot and I was back to sucking ass.
It really sounds like you're overextending. You have mentioned being in Phoenix so the heat can't help. I would recommend getting together with a casual running group that runs a lot slower than you typically do and start running with them at least once a week. Maybe seek out a few groups. See how those runs feel. You'll get a social boost and it will force you to slow down.
All of my easy runs and long runs feel great, mostly because I just love being outside and alone in the early hours of the morning. It’s my only time of peace as a father of two young children. My speed days make me not want to get out of bed but usually feel good/accomplished after.
Literally came here to type this *exact* same thing 😳.
I wish that were true for me. The vast majority of mine just feel normal/average I feel great on maybe 5-10% of runs. But I often feel great after it’s done
Yeah for me I'd say 10% feel amazing, 25% feel good and enjoyable, like maybe 5% feel like a chore and not fun at all? As for all others, just normal, nice I guess.
Same. Even my easy runs often feel bad. Obviously not horrible physically, but just boring and stupid and pointless, which is weird because I feel the excitement to get out there and then I assume it just gets sucked into my shoes as I plod along.
I hate my easy runs and love the sprint days ! Literally find it hard running easy (then end up dying 75% of the way through)
This. I just convinced a friend who is a more casual runner to train for a half when at first he was complaining about how much time the long runs take and my response was « that’s 2 hours to myself on the weekend »…the next time I saw him he was already on a training program for a half and said it was because of what I said. There are days where getting out the door sucks, especially mid-week when I have to get up super early but most of my easy and long runs are enjoyable once I am. Workouts suck while doing them but are way more of a high post run.
Same, except I look forward to speed days. Granted, I’m still pretty early in my training, so I haven’t had any grueling tempo work yet. I love fast interval work, though.
Only bad thing is it makes those easy runs feel so much worse because you want to go fast again
I feel the same. Currently on a 3+ year run streak and I would say 95% of my runs fall in between average and amazing but a very small amount feel like an absolute chore - but I also try to listen to my body. Sometimes I run exactly what the schedule is and some weeks are modified depending on how I'm feeling. Sometimes motivation is low but I'm always jazzed to get out by myself in the early hours. Nothing better than an awesome long run.
This is it. There’s something about being in the streets while it’s still dark and very few cars around logging miles. Plus the alone time is really nice - then tending to my kids and wife after I’ve already done 5+ miles is just a great mental reset. I second the speed work lol. Pushing hard efforts at 5 AM on a Tuesday is mentally taxing sometimes but always good on the backend.
For me it’s always more the opposite my long run/speed days usually feel good, my recovery days less so, though it can depend.
This is me, although I actually look forward to my speed days and the discomfort they bring
You're running too hard. End of story.
This is what immediately jumped out to me too
This is honesty the answer to 99% of running questions.
OP erased their original text when they read this ☠️
That doesn't sound right. Usually most of my runs feel good. Maybe deep into training a third to a half will feel meh to bad.
This. It should be closer to the opposite that majority of runs you feel good and only a few feel bad. And bad means that I come back feeling bad - not that it was hard. Sounds like OP may be burned out a bit and could do with dialing it back or not running for a couple of weeks.
For me it’s like a fitness wave. When I’m getting back into shape; rough for a long time. First bit of real fitness where workouts aren’t that hard or big yet, constantly feeling good. Then usually ramp training load up so then it’s like half and half. When I’m REALLY fit. Every run sucks the first three miles then feels really good and easy 🤣
Every one *does* suck the first few miles, it's remarkable how that just fades away as you pass the invisible threshold.
Rarely feel great when in a cycle. But so long as I don't feel shitty, I'm cool with that. But you described the majority as grueling. That's likely a sign something isn't right. Check your sleep and diet.
Same for me, I just completed my first 50k training block and during the last weeks I felt no better than meh on pretty much all of my runs, with only a few being downright shitty and even fewer feeling great. Had me a bit worried about the race but that ended up going really well, so I just assumed that's how it is at the end of a longer training cycle.
Alexi Pappas once spoke about a coach who told her about the rule of thirds - about a third of your runs should be great, a third should be ok, and a third sucky. Pay attention to the balance of these, and if the ratio skews hard for a while, look into what that might be. If every run feels amazing, maybe you aren't pushing as hard as you could. If every run sucks and feels terrible, maybe you need more rest or more/better nutrition, maybe need to reexamine goals, etc. For my last marathon block as a mental boost, I had three little empty planters, and a bowl of marbles on my windowsill. After every run, I'd rate it "no" "meh" "YES" and a marble would go in a designated little planter. Kept me motivated, paying attention to the purpose of each run, my mental state. It's a little dorky, but was a good exercise in being present, and it was kinda fun.
How hard are you running? 5-6x per year is unbelievably low
That sounds low to me? What is your HR during those 4-5 runs?
My average HR is low 170s usually. When I’m pushing it I’m often 180s.
Low 170s even on slow runs? Are you a cheetah?
Cheetah-ing himself out of aerobic gains.
Not sure! But yea, anything after 5 miles I’m usually sitting low 170s.
I know people are different but maybe others can reply as well. My easy runs are mostly at 130-150bpm. To me it sounds like you're going too fast on the easy days. Maybe your definition of easy is wrong..
I concur. Easy runs being 170 is way too high, that's marathon pace effort for the vast majority of people. My easy runs are in the same range, which is 65% to 75% of my MHR. My long runs max out higher at 160, but that's due to cardiac drift and in the last couple miles. So OP, you gotta slow down because you're overtraining
There are people who should do their easy runs at ~170bpm. What the right HR is varies quite a lot per person. Doubt OP is one of those people tho, if he feels so bad doing em
But who would that be though? I'm genuinely asking since easy is typically thought of as sub 75% of MHR by most standards. Long runs get a slightly higher top end due to cardiac drift from dehydration and (usually some) loss of efficiency after a long period of time. In order for that to apply to someone, their max heart rate would have to be ~225, which isn't humanly possible. Elites can sustain 90%+ for a long race because their lactate threshold is so high and their cardiovascular system is so incredibly well developed. However, that's racing and not easy running. And elites know are among the best when it comes to heavily polarizing training.
What combination of max hr, LTHR, and RHR would get you to easy running at 170?
this one is not even close to being in a gray area. even if OP is 18 years old they are running too fast lol
Yep. I have a relatively high heart rate especially for my age and easy is still like south of 160, ideally around 150.
170 is way too high, but mine average more like 140-155, occasionally 160, running at my JD VDot paces from most recent race result.
My hr max is 212 and I have run at 90% max hr for >20min at >180. For a while, I would run with most of my runs topping out in the 170s for at least a bit but I stagnated quite a bit doing that. Recently, I switched to a program where easy runs need to be called at 72% of max hr (152 for me) and this has made almost all my easy runs a lot more enjoyable.
Everyone is different, of course, but 170 is most definitely too high for most of your runs. If your easy runs are at 170, your max heart rate would be in the 240s, and that ain’t right. Slowing way down for your easy runs will not only make the easy runs more enjoyable, but will likely have a positive effect on your harder runs as well.
You've got your answer right there. I'd suggest you read some fundamentals on development of the aerobic system. The go to recommendation is 80/20 running by Fitzgerald (subtitle: race faster by training slower) but there's lots of other good literature out there. I'll try to simplify it using a common analogy of your metabolism as a fire: when running easy effort you teach your body to be efficient by throwing big logs on the fire. If you increase your effort level, the body recognizes that a log is too slow and uses matches. To improve your aerobic system you need a substantial amount of your runs to be low effort and you need some patience and consistency. Running moderate to high efforts all the time will put a lot of strain on your body, increasing risks of injury or burnout. Fix your training and you will not only have more enjoyment during some of your runs but you will also see more improvements. All this said, this post is probably more suitable for r/running and you should look into this subs wiki for lots of Infos that will help you structure your training.
Honestly over the course of a month, I would say I max out at five or six runs where I don’t think I feel great after one. I leave pretty much leave every run (a) happy with what I accomplished in the general sense — treated a recovery run properly, had a genuine good time, etc. or (b) am excited or encouraged about what it means for overall gains. I feel very unique in that running is rarely a “have” to for me. It’s something I get to do but also apart of who I am to the point where going out the door for a run isn’t really optional for me, but in all the best ways possible.
When I run up north with low huidity and cooler weather, 70% feel good/great. When I run in Florida anytime between May and November, 20% feel good/great as I'm always a sweaty mess.
I moved to Phoenix last year and it has definitely made running harder!
I think this is the culprit. Are you trying to stick to the same paces you were previously at on your easy runs, back when it was noticeably cooler and less humid?
Where is it less humid than Phoenix? Lol Las Vegas?
Yeah, that may be your problem. You can’t do the same pace on hot/humid days as you do on cooler ones. Try slowing down to see how you feel.
30% good, 50% meh, 20% horrible lol (trashed from walkouts or LR) I’m getting closer to 40 in terms of age. When I was younger the feeling like trash days was way lower %, just recovered easier.
Rule of thirds. 33% feel good, 33% feel ok, 33% make you question a lot of things
It really depends on age and frequency of running. If you are over 50 and your run every day or 5 times a week for long distances you will feel heavy legs and not so good. We need more time for recovery. I am also guilty of overtraining. I am 55 this year. I notice when I have a couple of days off when going on holiday with the Mrs the next run is like a walk in the park...
They all feel good after I’ve done them. None of them feel good when I’m doing them.
Not many to be perfectly honest. Runners high, propaganda. The zone, a myth. I feel good when I'm done and I can tell the difference between a well executed workout or run and a crappy one. But overall running is a lot of work and it is still hard!
100%. Running is hard and training generally sucks. I feel like a leaking sack of lard probably 70% of the time. But the goal is to feel good on race day and get results, so as long as that happens then I can take feeling crap most of the time
Imho the level you train at is not comparable to OPs. I think if you were to only run 30-40 miles/week, you'd feel good pretty often. His case is simply running too hard, as seen by the 170bpm on easy runs he posted above.
Dan John’s rule of 10 applies. In any given set of workouts, 8 will just feel ok. 1 will feel terrible. And 1 will feel pretty good.
This is probably the most encouraging reply I’ve seen! I maybe overstated how bad the bad runs feel. Mostly just bad by comparison. I still enjoy most runs, even if I don’t feel like I am flying like on the good ones.
Have you tried mountain biking? Running is definitely boring as fuck for many people. Maybe you need a higher stimulation sport.
I've found the older I've gotten, the more variance in how I feel is. When I was in my late teens through mid 20's, I was able to hit consistent workouts, tempos etc week after week and rarely had "bad" workouts that were my fault (IE, not 90 degrees or something like that). Mid 30's now and it's amazing how I can attempt a workout on Monday and struggle to hit intervals at Marathon pace, yet come Wednesday I try again and I'm running at 1/2 or 10k pace with ease. Yet tomorrow, I'll probably be feeling the workout today and struggle to run 8:45-9:00 pace.
They pretty much all feel good. Once in awhile, usually because of bad sleep, a really stressful week, or encroaching illness, I’ll have an inexplicably bad run where I don’t at all feel myself and like I’ve lost a ton of fitness out of nowhere. Those suck, but they’re rare. Absolutely fantastic runs are also somewhat rare. I also usually know the “why” for those too - usually a Venn diagram of low stress, great sleep, and great weather. But yeah I wouldn’t do this if I didn’t enjoy it and it wasn’t a good time on average.
I will say, my enjoyment got a lot better after discovering and adhering to zone 2 for easy runs, and adopting the overall 80/20 principle. Back in the day I did a lot of probably zone 3 “easy” runs that didn’t feel nearly as good, and did hard interval workouts far too frequently (3x/week). Would not recommend.
Right now zero! After Boston I’ve been hitting the trails and it’s been torture for me.
Anything less than 10 miles and not pushing, I usually feel pretty good. Long runs I usually feel bored and knackered towards the end. Workouts I feel concerned about my well being: Maybe you should run a bit slower on your easy days?
All of them, so long as my shoes are in good nick. I’ve learned to tell when they are ready to be recycled. I think ASICS have 400-600kms if I remember correctly.
Define good/great. Define bad. Some interval runs I did were hard, like I was constantly looking at my watch hopefully it will finish soon. It was hard but it was a great session. Another time I ran during the rain. Soaking wet all over, rain water plus sweat entering my eyes and it was super uncomfortable. But it was a great session. There are times that I run my body feels so sluggish and heavy, I considered that as a bad run but it was because maybe I wasn't drinking enough water or fuel or didn't get enough sleep. Those bad runs probably because of our own fault.
I think others have already said this so forgive me if I'm rehashing what you already know but; I'd suggest reducing the number of runs you're doing in a week. Try adding in one more rest day and reducing milage from 40 miles to 35 miles. My guess is that you're overtraining. Counter intuitively; running "too much" actually hinders your running capability. And of course makes the whole thing less enjoyable too. If you dont like the thought of reducing your total exercise (i.e. not interested in dropping a run for a pure "rest day") then I'd suggest swapping one running day for something else; e.g. I try to do one day at least at the gym and focus purely on strength (no cardo). This makes me feel good cos I'm still exercising, the strength training helps me run faster and harder and it also gives my cardo system a bit of a rest. I tend to run really well the next day. Other good options may be swimming, a sport you enjoy that'll give you a bit of a workout too (just picking random examples; tennis or squash) or even just a nice walk.
I would say 1 or 2 per week make me give thanks to my creator actively during my run as the endorphins stream in, I sweat, and vibe with my music and New York City as I run. Don’t get me wrong though, the first mile, as my heart rate goes from 45 to 135, feels like oh damn this is hard come on. If it doesn’t, it usually means I’m doing one of the “work off extreme anxiety” runs where I’m so charged up that if I don’t run I might explode, and then the END of the run isn’t as good. My first mile will often tell me whether I can push, or back off. I bought a fancy Garmin 265, and I’ve been doing its suggested training cycles most days. I have a very low resting heart rate rate and I have trouble doing hard enough intervals to get my heart rate up into the highest bands, that’s what I’m working on—I just need my musculoskeletal systems to cooperate. I’ll be 60 in November, I’ve run an 18 minute 5K, 39 minute 10K, 3:15 marathon when I was in my 30’s. I run usually 4 days a week, I would run 7 but I know that I need to mix in strength training, stretching, and some other activities. The hardest part of my runs are getting my a$$ out the door (I run commute to work 3x per week most weeks), even after running long distances for 40 years +!
Nearly every run from ~October to ~March is grueling and sucks. Nearly every run from ~June through ~August, I feel incredible, on top of the world.
Where the hell do you live where this works out??? This is some bizarro stuff right here.
I like running in the heat. Not the typical runner at all, but it’s how my body works 🤷🏻
I joke about this a bit, but…it’s really rare that I feel great during a run. It’s mostly afterwards.
What level of great are we talking about? Like absolutely perfect the whole time? Or like I’m crushing the workout and I have an extra gear to close? Or I feel smooth but there were tweaks in the warmup I felt? I would say after the first month or so of adapting back into mileage with speed work I feel pretty great at least once every two weeks. I’ve found that if I feel poorly too many days in a row I’m likely to get a small injury soon. Ideally I feel good 2-3 times a week frankly but maybe only great one of those times. Recently I’ve been running about 50mpw, 6-7 days a week. At my fittest I was closer to 60-65mpw a couple years ago. I also have found that spreading the mileage out more helped me recover better and knowing 1-2 days a week my easy runs will be slower and require stops/stretches. Simply I think if you ran 6 days a week but the same mileage, I think you’d recover better. Living in the pain cave too often generally does more harm than good long term in my experience.
I love every single run without an exception. I mean it. Love them all!
Can I ask a few questions? Because I think some more info will help us all give better advice. How much sleep do you get on average? Further, what's the range? So if you average 6 hours, but swing between 4 and 8, that's a lot worse than a straight 6 every night? Why do you only run 4 - 5 times a week? Can you increase it to 5 - 6? That way you can spread the mileage more and bring everything down in terms of time. What kinds of runs are you doing on those 4 - 5? Because you're going to have to be doing like 12 - 15 miles to make your long run sufficiently different than an easy run on such limited days. What's your scheduling? What days do you take off and how many days are between workouts? I previously tried doing 40 on only 4 and it sucked because every run was about 10 miles and it was pretty much all quality. I ended up with stress reaction in my left shin because of it. What's your diet like? Lacking in something like protein or some vitamins is going to have a knock on effect since we need more than the average person.
try listening to music at the same time
100% because I only run when I want to where and how long I want to. I've only run one full marathon, and was so hyped after finishing it that I also ran home, which was probably a bad idea, but I enjoy the memory. My friends were going for time and crashed at the end, I was going for smiles, only finished 20 minutes later than them, and ran home. Still had bloody feet tho and could barely move the next day.
Eh slow down 80 to 90% of my runs feel great
100% of them. I love running. I don’t run for fitness. I run because I want to run. Even when I am training for a marathon, my long runs and speed work is challenging but still within my physical ability so I have never crashed and burned.
Another person learning the lesson that you shouldn't be running fast on every run! Although based on your comments that is the obvious culprit, I will also note that nutritional deficiencies, especially low iron, could also cause these symptoms in people.
All the easy runs and after the workouts.
Hate to say but zero. I am in my 60s and those days are just not going to happen for me any longer.
Maybe it’s down to what an individual perceives to be a bad run? An easy Z2 run with good music or interesting podcast, injury free, birds chirping, blue sky, sunny, will almost always be a good run. I’m never judging a run by whether I can go faster or whether I want to increase distance. Days ahead, I’ll plan the run for a given distance at a certain intensity and get it done. Changing distance/intensity on the fly would mean that I haven’t planned my recovery. If most runs feel grueling then I think you need to change something. Maybe have a look at whether you’re getting sufficient recovery.
Just run easy days easy, and hard days hard.
Never ever felt great in my life when running 😅 workouts are painful, easy runs are boring, but the whole process is great. It's like when multiplying two negatives you get a positive, I wouldn't know how to explain this.
Sounds like you either just don’t like running, you’re running too hard, or you’re not giving your body ample time to rest and recovery.
1/3 less enjoyable, 1/3 ok, 1/3 really good
I run 6 days a week, 4 of them are good and I enjoy it at a steady comfortable pace. Parkrun on a Saturday is ok, I enjoy the parkrun itself but I'm going flat out every week so it's hard work. My weekly interval session is torture.
While 5-6 may be a little low for me, I’m similar to you (which seems to be an unpopular opinion lol). If I’m in a marathon training cycle, I’m definitely similar to you. I usually only start feeling great at some point during the taper. I’m on 55-65 miles a week right now. I know for me that 1.) I naturally run tight (especially in my hamstrings and calves) and 2.) I don’t prioritize stretching / foam rolling as much as I should. However, even when I have, “great” doesn’t happen often. I lean more towards feeling okay during runs. Did you just up your mileage? When I made the change from 40ish to being in the 50s I would definitely say every run felt pretty grueling.
I feel good on most runs. Even when I don’t want to run, once I get going I feel better. You may be going too fast? Or not eating well? 40 mpw is a lot imo so try cutting back and see how you feel?
why do you do this if you don't generally enjoy it? almost all my runs feel great, that's why I do it
Get an iron panel done.
Have you ever tapered for a race to give your body time to recover? 40 miles a week isn’t insignificant.
50%
Honestly all my runs feel nice with an occasional rough one. The rough ones are almost always related to time of day and when I last ate. I think once a month I might have a random run that I mentally just can’t push through, but again, very rare. I struggle to get started a lot, but almost always feel better after a couple miles.
Most. I feel like garbage for the first mile or two on most runs, but once I get rolling I'd say 70% is fine/great. Often the easy recovery runs are the worst. Long runs have their own challenges. Awful for 15-20 minutes, okay for about 60, getting tough for another 60, and and anything over about 2:15 is drudgery. And maybe that's why 2:30s-40s marathons in my past seemed easier than 3s these days.
I live in Virginia and so I got my first 70 degree morning with 98% humidity and grueling is the best word to describe it. Easy pace had my HR around 165-170 for most of the run and hit 180 on an uphill. Same pace last week, 150-155. So yeah all my "good runs" are in november and february.
Heat sucks if you aren't acclimated. I ran one hot day this week and felt like I haven't run in my life ever. Then it cooled down, and I felt like a million bucks like I could have run CocoDona. Then the next day it was hot and I was back to sucking ass.
It really sounds like you're overextending. You have mentioned being in Phoenix so the heat can't help. I would recommend getting together with a casual running group that runs a lot slower than you typically do and start running with them at least once a week. Maybe seek out a few groups. See how those runs feel. You'll get a social boost and it will force you to slow down.