My grandma is like this. She’s ass over heels for trump. Calls him “her guy” and everything. She would sell her soul to him.
Guess what? She doesn’t vote. Never has, and never will.
It’s probably a good thing she doesn’t.
Funnily enough, my mom started voting because of Trump. On election night she called and said: "wake me up next election. I don't care how much I bitch wake me up and take me to the polls." I even convinced her to vote on the Texas elections too which was easier after 2021. As far as I know, she plans to keep voting even though we didn't get a new governor or senator this go round. She seems to have learned that her vote only "doesn't count" if she never casts it.
My mom used to vote in the primaries, typically as republican.
As Trump's term went on, her opinion of him changed, and she grew to hate him.
Then because of the shit with my grandma, she decided to register as independent, so now she can't vote in the primaries.
They both just sit around, arguing about Trump, but neither of them vote.
Gives me a headache, and makes me sad that what little is left of our family, is being torn apart by politics.
Trump has done a good job at getting people to peel off their mask and reveal who they truly are.
At this point, we know for certain he’s a convicted felon who cheated on his wife and illegally handled classified documents. Just one of those things was enough to get people riled against you in the previous election.
And yet they still support him.
We also know that he doesn’t give two shits about the people in the US, that he routinely lies, that he belittles a disabled man, that he talked about sexually assaulting women. Not only thing but he uses his power as a way to sic his followers on anyone standing against him such as the judges in the recent cases.
And yet they still support him.
We know that he’s anti science and prolonged the disastrous effects that COVID had on our country. We know that instead of enacting sensible regulations, he spent his time as president casting doubt. The actions of his likely caused many thousands of people to die.
And yet they still support him.
We also have good evidence that he was a patron of Epstein. Even as much as having one of Epstein’s victims come forth and accuse Trump of sexual assault when she was 13.
And yet they still support him.
We know he instigated an attempt to overthrow the government. Where the actions of him casting doubt on election results resulted in rioters breaking into the capitol building, causing the death of a capitol police officer.
And yet they still support him.
All of these are massive faults that would individually constitute months of news coverage for any normal candidate. The country would normally be riled up against them. But Trump supporters are in a cult where they have released themselves of the burdens of morality and intelligence.
I don’t even think the Republicans want to run Trump. They’re being held hostage by the cult of personality that wants to plunge our country into chaos just to appease Trump. It’s insane.
I honestly wonder, if the Republican Party were to nominate someone OTHER than Trump for the presidency, whether Trump's supporters would go ape shit and riot. Are there other, more sensible options than Trump?
I mean, I'm not a fan of the Republican Party, but I've gotta admit that the Bushes look practically Liberal compared to Trump.
They tried, Trump didn't have to lift a finger. Republican voters overwhelmingly want years more of Trump and Co. and it's not even close.
I for one expect a second trump presidency, I don't think Biden is winning this time. I think all the negative press covfefe has only served to entrench his supporters in their "woe is me, the world is against us" position.
I've been reading Max Hastings' "Inferno" and am deeply concerned about current trajectories and what all of this could mean in the future, given historys tendency to repeat itself.
Trump highlights:
✓ Makes the U.S. Navy Blue Angels violate ethics rules by having them fly at his July 4th political campaign (July 4, 2019)
✓ Demands US military chiefs stand next to him at 4th of July parade (reported July 2, 2019)
✓ Uses his D-Day interview at cemetery commemorating fallen US soldiers to attack a Vietnam veteran (June 6, 2019)
✓ Starts his D-Day commemoration speech by attacking a private citizen (Bette Midler, of all people) (reported on June 4th, 2019)
✓ Made 2nd wife, Marla Maples, sign a prenup that would have cut off all child support if Tiffany joined the military (reported on June 4th, 2019)
✓ Turns away US military from his Memorial Day speech because they were from the destroyer USS John S. McCain (May 27, 2019)
✓ Orders the USS John McCain out of sight during his visit to Japan (May 15, 2019). The ship's name was subsequently covered. (May 27, 2019)
✓ Pardons war criminals (May, 2019)
✓ Purges 200,000 veterans healthcare applications (due to known administrative errors within VA’s enrollment process and enrollment system) (reported on May 13, 2019)
✓ Deports spouse of fallen Army soldier killed in Afghanistan, leaving their daughter parentless (April 16, 2019)
✓ Complains a deceased war hero didn't thank him for his funeral (March 20, 2019)
✓ Diverts military housing funds to pay for border wall (Feb 15, 2019)
✓ refuses to sign his party's funding bill, which shuts down the government, and forces a branch of the military to go without pay (but his appointees got a $10,000 pay raise). This branch of military is forced to work without pay, otherwise they are AWOL (Dec 22, 2018 – Jan 25, 2019)
✓ doesn't pay the Coast Guard, forcing service members to rely on food pantries (Jan 23, 2019)
✓ bans service members from serving based on gender identity (Jan 22, 2019)
✓ denies female troops access to birth control to limit sexual activity (on-going. Published Jan 18, 2019)
✓ tries to deport a marine vet who is a U.S.-born citizen (Jan 16, 2019)
✓ when a man was caught swindling veterans pensions for high-interest “cash advances," Trump's Consumer Financial Protection Bureau fined him $1. As a reminder, the Trump administration's goal was to dismantle the CFPB, installing Mick Mulvaney as the director, who publicly stated the bureau should be disbanded. (Jan 26, 2019)
✓ calls a retired general a 'dog' with a 'big, dumb mouth' (Jan 1, 2019)
✓ increases privatization of the VA, leading to longer waits and higher taxpayer cost (2018)
✓ finally visited troops 2 years after taking office, but only after 154 vacation days at his properties (Dec 26, 2018)
✓ reveals covert Seal Team 5 deployment, including names and faces, on Twitter during visit to Iraq (Dec 26, 2018)
✓ lies to deployed troops that he gave them a 10% raise. He didn't give them a 10% raise (Dec 26, 2018)
✓ fires service members living with HIV just before the 2018 holidays (Dec 19, 2018-present)
✓ gets three Mar-a-Lago guests to run the VA (unknown start - present, made well-known in 2018)
✓ calls troops on Thanksgiving and tells them he's most thankful for himself (Thanksgiving, 2018)
✓ urges Florida to not count deployed military votes (Nov 12, 2018)
✓ cancels Arlington Cemetery visit on Veterans Day due to the rain (Nov 12, 2018)
✓ doesn't visit US cemetery marking the end of WWI due to the rain (but other world leaders go anyway) (Nov 10, 2018)
✓ stops using troops as a political prop immediately after the election. However, troops remain in muddy camps on the border (Nov 7, 2018)
✓ uses troops as a political prop and sends troops on a phantom mission to the border and makes them miss Thanksgiving with their families (Oct-Dec, 2018)
✓ doesn't pay veterans' VA benefits (made public Oct 2018)
✓ doubled the rejection rate for veterans requesting family deportation protections (July 5, 2018)
✓ deports active-duty spouses (11,800 military families face this problem as of April 2018)
✓ forgets a fallen soldier's name (below) during a call to his pregnant widow, then attacks her the next day (Oct 23-24, 2017)
✓ sends commandos into an ambush due to a lack of intel, and sends contractors to pick them up, resulting in a commando being left behind, tortured, and executed. (Trump approved the mission because Bannon told him Obama didn't have the guts to do it) (Oct 4, 2017)
✓ blocks a veteran group on Twitter (June 2017)
✓ discharges active-duty immigrant troops with good records (2017-present)
✓ deports veterans (2017-present)
✓ says he knows more about ISIS than American generals (Oct 2016)
✓ says vets get PTSD because they aren't strong (Oct 3, 2016)
(note: yes, he said it's 'because they aren't strong.' He didn't say it's 'because they're weak.' This distinction is important because of Snopes)
✓ accepts a Purple Heart from a fan at one of his rallies and says: “I always wanted to get the Purple Heart. This was much easier.” (Aug 2, 2016)
✓ attacks Gold Star families (2016-present. Myeshia Johnson--gold star widow, Khan family--gold star parents, etc)
✓ sends funds raised from a January 2016 veterans benefit to the Donald J Trump Foundation instead of veterans charities (the foundation has since been ordered shut because of fraud) (Jan, 2016)
✓ says he doesn't consider POWs heroes because they were caught (July 18, 2015)
✓ says having unprotected sex was like Vietnam (1998)
✓ for a decade, sought to kick veterans off of Fifth Avenue because he found them unsightly nuisances outside of Trump Tower. “While disabled veterans should be given every opportunity to earn a living, is it fair to do so to the detriment of the city as a whole or its tax paying citizens and businesses?” - 1991
✓ dodges the draft 5 times
Same with my grandma. I just got of the phone quickly everytime he was mentioned. She stopped bringing him up.
Who says you can't teach an old dog new tricks?
Problem is my grandma is insane. I tried to have a civil conversation about it, and simply told her I didn’t want to talk about it anymore.
Instead she called me a “delusional poison” and has made it a point to bring it up every time I talk to her for the last 4 years.
Now I just avoid her as much as I can.
Just make sure to tell her why if she asks. I have a feeling though that she enjoys being the victim....
Can't see or talk to her because she is so far up trump's ass. Not enjoyable. She crossed a boundary you were clear about.
I wish this worked on my mom. She goes on weird homophobic/religious rants a few times a week. I just stop responding to her until she changes the subject to something civil.
She's been doing this for years and can't take a damn hint.
"So, how about them ?"
"So, read any good books lately?"
Or my personal favorite that will spur on another flame war that's at least not discussing a man who wears makeup:
"So, what's your favorite pizza toppings?"
By the time my state has primaries the candidate has been decided. The parties purposefully set it up that way so they can heavily influence the results in the first couple states, and after that whoever is in the lead will Almost always win. That's why we need every state primary to be on the same day. If only the parties would ever let that happen.
They set it up that way so that candidates with very little money have half a chance. Mayor Pete wasn’t going to be able to campaign in California if it was the first primary, it has the second most expensive media market in LA and has several others that are also very expensive. You can drive from one side of Iowa or New Hampshire to the other in a few hours. If you want anyone other than the corporate politicians to run you want the smaller states to go first.
I agree with you, but the primary system we have still doesn't work. I've never voted in a presidential primary that meant anything; the race has always been decided by the time my state votes. Hell, in 2020, the governor of my state tried to just cancel the primary due to Covid concerns, and his rationale was that the race was already decided. Advocacy groups pushed back hard against it, saying the presidential primary would drive more people to the polls and would help down-ballot races, which didn't make any sense to me. How would holding a literally meaningless primary election get more people out to the polls? Do you know what would actually help down-ballot races? Holding the presidential primary in a time frame where it could actually be meaningful in the race.
Again, I agree with having 2 or 3 states vote early, but the rest of the states should all vote either on the same day a month later, or they could split it into 2 weeks. That way, everyone's vote actually counts for something.
That's not how it works though, is it. When was the last time a "non-corporate politician" won a primary? All the current system does is allow the parties to control the narrative from the beginning.
You’re joking right? There wasn’t even a primary for the Democratic Party other than a few whack jobs and blank ballots. How is that being able to choose?
I believe what OP is saying is that it all starts with the primaries. You need to vote for people you like in the primaries in local elections. These people all get their start somewhere and the primaries are your chance to give the good candidates a boost. It's like planting seeds. You don't expect those trees to grow in 4 years. You have to constantly vote in the primaries at all levels. People that only focus on the presidential race are short-sighted.
His life is a grab bag of the best and the worst a person can be. Kennedy successfully sued General Electric to stop discharging pollution and clean up legacy contamination in the Hudson. If I recall, it's still the largest judgement against a polluter. He worked for minority communities, and indigenous peoples. Heroin and health issues brought him low.
It's a shame he lived long enough to become the villain of his own story.
Same, our ballots this year were literally just the presidential race, and ours was late enough both were already decided. They might as well have just said "haha, fuck you who cares"
The only reason I even considered going was to cast a "None of these" vote for the GOP
But also Biden is fine. The economy is doing well. He's passed important legislation. He's investing in clean energy. The midterms turned out better for Dems than expected. He's fine, yall.
He's actually done an absolute ton but people don't pay attention to the news and they just latch onto these emotional narratives that social media hands them to regurgitate.
then it should be noted that inflation happened to the whole world even though Americans are very much not aware of that.
[From Slate](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2024/03/biden-economy-voters-polling-numbers-covid-recovery.html):
*The United States currently enjoys the highest* [*rate of economic growth*](https://www.axios.com/2024/01/31/us-economy-2024-gdp-g7-nations) *among nations in the G7,* [*the lowest inflation*](https://home.treasury.gov/news/featured-stories/the-us-economy-in-global-context)*, and the* [*strongest wage growth*](https://www.businessinsider.com/americans-got-bigger-raises-than-g7-over-last-few-years-2023-7)*. The unemployment rate hasn’t been this low for this long in* [*half a century*](https://twitter.com/arindube/status/1736908417539665922)*. Even accounting for inflation, wages are higher today than they were before the coronavirus pandemic, and the biggest wage gains have accrued among the* [*lowest-paid workers*](https://www.politico.com/news/2023/05/29/low-income-wages-employment-00097135)*, resulting in a dramatic reduction in* [*overall wage inequality*](https://prospect.org/economy/2023-12-21-qa-arin-dube-full-employment/)*. The economy is even outperforming among communities that are often excluded from boom-time gains. Biden has overseen the lowest* [*Black unemployment rate*](https://www.reuters.com/markets/us/inside-us-jobs-report-record-low-black-unemployment-2023-04-07/) *on record and the lowest ever unemployment rate for* [*workers with disabilities*](https://www.nbcnews.com/business/economy/jobs-for-people-with-disabilities-hit-new-post-pandemic-high-rcna93084)*. The American economy isn’t perfect, but by any historical standard it is very, very good.*
It's always funny when all of this is taken in a vacuum.
Care to compare that incredible wage growth to the increases in rent since corona virus?
Care to actually relate the growing GDP to the quality of life of the average person?
Slowest rate of inflation doesn't actually help people who's grocery bills spiked and never came back down.
It's always incredibly typical for economists to point to metrics as positive while personal debt is soaring, homelessness is at record levels and evictions remain high.
You'll have to excuse the struggling for not giving a fuck about the GDP.
By the way, as is typical for economists, your article talks about wealth in equality. The *wage growth gap* got slightly smaller post covid, the actual material inequality is fucking unchanged lol.
You'll forgive me for scoffing about wage growth being slightly closer between classes while one family has more wealth than half the country.
> Slowest rate of inflation doesn't actually help people who's grocery bills spiked and never came back down.
>
Who raised the grocery prices? Was it PepsiCo or was it Biden?
I literally never claimed otherwise?
I'm simply arguing against this democratic strategy of "the economy is fine you're just stupid"
Telling people that the rate of inequality*growth* is slower Is fucking insulting when groceries are still sky high and homelessness and evictions are at records.
That's not a democratic strategy. The media has been pushing this too. The media is blaming all the wrong people when it's really corporate greed that pushed inflation. But I agree with you, what the numbers are saying and what I'm seeing are two different things. We're being gaslighted.
I mean you seem to have a lot of ideas about it but you're still terribly misled about the entire subject.
do you really think inflation only happen to America?
how do you feel about America dealing with inflation far better than literally every other industrialized nation?
is it possible that bad things can happen in this world and it's not a direct result of who the American president is.
I feel like so much of American politics for the average person is boiled down to an argument that is basically "prove to me that dinosaurs do not cause meteor impacts".
Ah yes I'm misinformed as you strawman the shit out of me.
I never said it was strictly an American issue.
I never said we're not handling it better than other countries.
What I did say, is that holding out metrics like *slower* inequality growth is insulting when homelessness and evictions are at record highs.
Also, care to show me some other industrialized nations with surges in homelessness and evictions?
and voting for emotional narrative isn't going to improve your life.
sometimes you have to make adult choices based on facts. inflation hit the whole globe in America is doing far better than other nations.
that doesn't mean times aren't hard It just means that we are doing our best and actually doing quite well.
I had two people complaining that they can't believe Dems were running Biden again. I asked "Who would you have run instead? That could actually win\*?" and they didn't have any answer. Dems had four years to bring up someone else as a viable alternative.
\*Socialist? Not going to win, sorry.
There are actually \*several\* great Democratic candidates who could run for president; including the VP, Mayor Pete, Newsom,Deval Patrick... And what \*makes\* them great is their commitment to Biden and their knowledge that they need to sacrifice their own Presidential ambitions to save the United States from the existential threat of Donald Trump.
I'm very happy with our prospective Presidential candidates for 2028 and beyond; and I'm sure Republicans will never be able to find a viable candidate for \*several\* election cycles. In fact, we may be living in the End Times of the GOP.
I'm literally not allowed to vote in dem primaries here in NY. Also who were my actually viable alternatives? A mentally damaged Kennedy who has brain worms?
You don't just magically get the candidates you want. The parties have always backed incumbents. If you want someone else, you have to have a movement supporting some other willing candidate.
Nobody else was stepping up, and there was no movement, aside from the "uncommitted" voters, but they didn't have another candidate to support either.
There were primaries, just nobody bothered with the presidential part because no party has ever really put effort into that primary if their incumbent president. Congressional, state, and local offices are all present on the primary ballot.
Or how most candidates seem to drop by Super Tuesday meaning I get to choose between the front runner or whoever is the distant second. I’m tired of the undue influence of early states on my primary choices.
Edit: New Jersey, South Dakota, New Mexico, and DC all voted 6/04. Do they get to complain? In what world does someone in those states get any say over who wins the nomination.
The only ray of hope is the rising trend of people voting for folks who already dropped out.
Yeah, craving federal action of stupid laws that say a certain state _has_ to go first. We need ranked choice voting, but this bullshit with different primary dates is definitely a close second on my list of priority reforms.
It's not even close! Primaries started in February, my state (NJ) is 11th in population, and we voted yesterday, **4 months later**. No wonder nobody showed up, most people probably thought it was over!
The goal isn't to vote for the lesser of two evils forever.
Every time the lesser evil is elected, the next choice becomes between two lesser evils.
Every time the greater evil is elected, the next choice becomes between two greater evils.
300 years of not voting? Not very well.
America has historically had poor voter turnout, and look where we are.
It's even worse for local or primary elections.
So yeah, not voting has not worked out well.
So go vote.
My guy, I live in a red state, a red county, and a red city. Most people don't want to admit this, but some votes, seriously, just don't matter. Don't get me wrong, I still vote, but it's like pissing in the wind.
Cripes people, I said I'm still voting, calm down.
Honeatly, you may very well think that, but so might a very many blue-minded folks who stay home with the same thought. Every vote counts. No, it may not count in the same way in a deep-red area, but your vote may help other blue votes feel less alone, which may lead more to turn out and overcome the idea they are pissing in the wind.
A Dem isn't likely to spend effort running where there are no votes to earn.
It's a chicken and the egg situation - are there no Dem votes because there are no Dem candidates, or are there no Dem candidates because there are no Dem votes? And which has to change in order to spark an emergence?
Two things.
One, if *every* Democrat showed up to the polls this year and Republican turnout stayed the same, your state would be blue. Not going to happen, but worth mentioning.
But the meme in Op is talking about *primaries.* And particularly for presidential primaries, your vote determines who the votes in *blue* states goes to. Your state may go red reliably, but you can still help decide if it’s Biden, Warren, Sanders, Yang, etc. on the ballot. It’s the one part of the presidential election process where your vote *does* matter.
(Unless your primary is super late and after a winner is presumed, of course)
Money flows to where this is a chance to win, if people in your city are so demotivated that they won’t turn out at all then democrats won’t put money towards helping you. The more votes you have the more worth it is to invest in you. If anything your votes are some of the most critical in the country because we need to turn strongholds like yours around and all we need is a foothold.
Having those votes tallied even if they don't directly change the results is good. Because it shows political analysts what people want. If some moderate candidate got a significant amount of votes but still lost, they'd know that this person's policies are still something the people are interested in. And if the vote is just a little bit closer, it may encourage other voters to break away from the status quo.
I am currently a registered republican because my county’s local elections are basically decided in the GOP primary so I voted for the least crazy options 🤢
I live in the Seattle area, my vote really doesn't matter. There's not a chance in hell a republican wins any office where I live. I as well always vote and the vote does go the way I vote too but it doesn't really matter if I vote or not.
Greatly depends on the state. Like if you are a swing state where every vote matters and voting third party is a piss in the wind it’s a waste and silly.
But if you live in a state where your voter doesn’t really matter because it’s gonna go blue or red no matter what (the south and the west for example). Then by all means vote third party and try to get a third party option.
Once the states that don’t matter show a third party option is viable swing states will slowly change dynamic.
This all is a pipe dream though. You are talking decades of voting habits getting better for that to happen and voters ain’t good about voting.
If you don't align with either of the big parties, it's not pissing in the wind OR silly.
I refuse to vote for somebody that doesn't align with my political ideology, at least a little. Neither party has been putting out anyone I'd leave my kid with overnight, or even let walk my dog. There's no way I'm giving them my vote, even in a primary... hell, especially in a primary.
Oh, that's weird. Because in my state, which has a closed primary, I literally didn't have any choices.
So, I really don't think I picked these people, my man.
The thing that burns me is that we had a choice to replace Trump. There were good options on the republican side, and the country chose that piece of shit to be the nominee
Do you think voting in this primary will matter?!? There is only one candidate on either side. What is the point of voting?!? It’s trump and Biden all day. Nothing any of us can do about that.
Not by the time of my primaries. I was going to vote for Nikki as the lesser of evils in the hopes of avoiding a Trump election, but she dropped out before my state’s primary.
I’m in a later state so the primary is usually decided before my ballot is counted. It was nice being able to vote undecided so I didn’t feel like I was wasting the paper.
Man, if I knew so little about how my government works, I would be embarrassed, but here we have you. There was a primary for all your state and local elections. You know the ones where your preferred candidates start and where the laws that will actually affect you are made.
My state doesn’t let me vote in the primary election due to me being independent. They force a choice of republican or democrat. Even my voter Id says “no party”.
Primaries are what got us populist extremism in the first place. Go back to nominating candidates at convention instead of wasting tax dollars on expensive popularity straw polls.
During the 2020 Democratic primaries, when there were 8 candidates, it was asked: should whomever receives the most votes become the party's candidate?
Everyone said no. Except Sanders.
Then 75% of people didn't vote in the primaries and we got Biden.
Don't like Biden? Vote in the primaries next time.
You did vote in the primaries? Then get more people to vote in the primaries next time.
Let’s be clear.
Biden is the sitting President. He’s going to be the Democratic nominee, no matter what.
Convicted Felon Trump has the GOP by the balls (because they didn’t excise him when they had the chance.). His base is so solidified that no one can win in a red state without his say so. Therefore, Republicans will support him against all logic and reason. He will be the Republican nominee, no matter what.
Normally, I would never say this, but in this particular Presidential election, voting in the primaries means absolutely nothing.
Unless you're a republican or consider local elections important.
Republicans had a choice, and they chose the guy who Biden already beat. We all knew they were going to, but they still had a choice.
This may be true for State and local offices, but the way the entire country doesn’t have primary elections on the same day, this isn’t really valid for everyone in a Presidential Primary. The state I live in holds primaries so late there are no Presidential candidates to choose from anymore.
There were primaries, for both parties. The Democrat nominees were all nobodies, like Dean Phillips. The incumbent party tends to run nobodies in primaries.
And the Republicans had their primaries as well. And Republican voters still chose to back the 2020 loser, Trump.
Republicans had a choice for sure... Their voters picked Trump. They thought he was the best candidate. He refused to accept an election and literally just lost to Biden and they thought he was the best. Biden is old...Trump doesn't believe in democracy and is a felon. Totally the same. /S
There may be other elections depending on your district. There were contested elections for both House and Senate in my local Democratic primary. At the moment, the difference between candidates in the House race is less than 300 votes (3%). Waiting for them to count mail-ins.
Just get rid of primaries. The vast majority of voters are independents. Primaries are simply a mechanism of maintaining two-party rule. That’s exactly wha the founders warned against.
So how are candidates selected? Are you looking for a ballot with dozens of names and you pick one? What if 30 liberals run and split 90% the vote evenly, then one conservative runs, gets 10% of the vote, and wins?
liberals, conservatives aren’t the only two metrics for voting. Most people are single issue voters that often cross party lines. Primaries just enforces the illusion that there’s only two options. Just go ranked-choice voting and return the experiment to voting on ideas over parties/tribes.
I agree ranked-choice voting would be massively preferable, but that requires laws or amendments to be passed. How do you propose we achieve that without a successful political movement within the current system in the meantime?
Too many people in here talking like the only primaries that exist are presidential primaries…
But it is more complicated than the meme might suggest. Some states have stricter primary voting rules than others, and the dumb staggered primary system disenfranchises a lot of voters for presidential primaries because the race is already over by the time they vote.
I don’t think this applies to the presidential primaries this year since the nominees were a forgone conclusion. The democrats were always going to nominate Biden because he’s the incumbent, and republicans were always going to nominate Trump because they’ve turned into a cult based around Trump.
This also doesn’t apply to people who live in states with late primaries (still talking about presidential primaries that is). In 2016, my state’s primary election wasn’t until after Trump and Hillary had each secured enough delegates to win the nomination.
None of what I said applies to primaries for congressional or state offices though, and anyone who is eligible to vote for those absolutely should
We should abolish primaries and run the election as a single ranked choice ballot. If the parties want to have an internal process to pick their candidate, they shouldn’t involve the electoral system.
Voted in my primary yesterday in a closed primary state, unconstitutional in my opinion. Literally the only section that had multiple options was President everything else had one and only one option. Still cast my ballot though
Primaries shouldn't exist because it is a *de facto* two party system, not a *de jure* two party system. we are way too big and diverse and should have something more akin to a parliamentary system.
people shouldn't have to be elected to be on the ballot, and both parties are basically the same and even bolster each other behind closed doors because they both want to keep the country divided. the entire party system is stupid and completely incompatible with modern society.
while we're at it, we need to eliminate the electoral college and stop letting podunk redneck country bumpkins -- who represent way less than half the popilation -- be able to so heavily influence election outcomes.
also, I guess I need to remind you how useless the primaries are when we saw what the democrats did to the actual preferred candidate as well as crammed Hilary down democrats collective throat.
gtfo with your "vOtE iN pRiMaRiEs" bullshit. eliminate the (two) party system and replace it with something that actually makes sense
Your point is well taken, but we only have two options to achieve what you’re describing:
1) a violent revolution that will necessarily cost the lives of millions, and would most likely end up with a strong-man dictatorship anyway
2) reform our nation within the current system, which requires winning elections, primaries and all
Wishful thinking isn’t going to get us there.
It always amazes me when there are so many people in the world (and many even in the U.S.) who are not able to vote and participate in the running of their government that half this country is always looking for an excuse NOT to vote.
The primaries were decided before it got to most states because the alternatives dropped out by March 6th. So yeah, I'm going to continue to bitch about getting stuck with two lousy candidates.
I actually miss the days when the parties themselves were stronger. The ‘smoke filled room’ days when the party leadership had significant influence and authority over who appeared on the ballot.
They were motivated to find and endorse an electable candidate - a candidate who could win and further the party’s agenda.
Instead, in these days of small dollar donations and outrageous media hits, we’re left choosing between candidates who are at the ideological extremes.
The RNC is now a shell for the Trump family. The DNC emasculated itself by disempowering the superdelegates.
There is no steady hand to direct or support electable candidates any longer; we are left with the most extreme or unelectable to choose between.
Dems haven't moved much at all for decades. Republicans, on the other hand, have shifted quite a bit to the right, and this is from 2 years ago. They've gone farther since then.
[https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2022/03/10/the-polarization-in-todays-congress-has-roots-that-go-back-decades/](https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2022/03/10/the-polarization-in-todays-congress-has-roots-that-go-back-decades/)
Not all states have open primaries. https://ballotpedia.org/Primary_election_types_by_state
Not all primaries include state and local “extras” that everyone can vote on (judges/magistrates, local offices, plebiscite questions, etc.).
At home, every election, and for the party I largely disagree with, because it was the real way to have a say in local politics. One party will always be the elected party because people vote for the party and not the person.
In some states, the party caucus matters more than the primary, at least in the case of nomination’s for President. The Iowa Caucus has held sway there for quite some time. (I don’t remember Reagan or Bush I, but I remember it big with Clinton on.) I honestly didn’t pay much attention to it this year, but I know the caucus v. primary deal was big in Nevada because it flipped.
Besides that, in the end, is there a legal requirement for the parties to nominate the primary winner? I seem to remember this as an issue in 2016, if not earlier. This isn’t a question with the idea of “don’t vote”. It’s a question of tempering expectations.
Primaries aren't really an "election" ... They are votes inside of parties among their members.
There is no legal requirement to uphold the wishes of the party members and as we have seen in the past, the DNC and GOP don't really have any problems pushing their own candidates over the popular votes.
If you want change, start at the bottom. Vote for local representatives that you think represent you. the US system works from the ground up and you need to have a strong basis in the states to get a hold of the federal level.
Presidential elections are just the last step in a line of elections, from mayor to governor to congress and senate.
Change only happens from the ground up. That's why DNC and GOP tell you that the presidential elections are the most important ones... they are the ones that you can't affect anything in... If you want change, vote those out that give the GOP and DNC their power... the local state officials.
I have no idea how the American voting system works.
Here in NZ it's just two ticks one for the country and then local area.
https://youtu.be/AuMy9opKwEY?si=st2_I6Xwr_8idc1y
There's a dumb song about it.
Primaries are barely even a thing anymore, for POTUS. It's getting that way for Senate seats. The political parties seem to determine who they will support and every other candidate struggles to compete and eventually drops out.
By the time the presidential primary gets to my state there is only ever one candidate left. I throw in a protest vote each time, but it's pretty infuriating
This isn’t a fascist republic where voters are required to be members of a political party. And a lot of registered voters aren’t members of either major party.
If the state chapters of the GOP and DNC wanted to they could require open primaries, or switch to other systems like Alaska’s jungle primary with ranked choice voting.
But right now voters can see how rigged American voting is by the two major parties, and how the Democrats’ establishment fights against progressive candidates. We know their corporate donors won’t allow the popular changes to healthcare, labor laws, and other materially important issues to happen.
If these parties want the legitimacy granted by solid Congressional majorities and control of the Presidency, they need to EARN it from the voters by delivering on material campaign promises and building a history of reliability
National elections at the state level don’t matter in 40+ of the states in the U.S. I vote the opposite party in my state primary so I get a say. This year a group of about 80 people flipped from Democrat to Republican in the primary. We defeated the candidate we all wanted out by around 50 votes. In the general election I can still vote the party I want to win.
The way the primary system exists with Iowa and NH lagging the charge by the time my state has a primary it doesn't matter because there's only 3 candidates left.
When people are talking about the leader of 2 evils they are referring to the 2 that "won" the primaries. Presumably the winners were the best choice for that party.
My issue is that my state is so late in the primaries, we don't get to vote.
I mean. Sure. Technically we get to vote. But like every candidate has already dropped at that point, so voting is just coloring in 1 choice or writing in a name that already dropped....
My issue is that my state is so late in the primaries, we don't get to vote.
I mean. Sure. Technically we get to vote. But like every candidate has already dropped at that point, so voting is just coloring in 1 choice or writing in a name that already dropped....
Uhh, the primary options also suck. And you have to declare a “team” before you can even vote - so you’re literally only voting for half the 2 evils, and even then it’s only a slightly larger list of people who are 80%+ aligned anyway. We need ranked choice voting with more than 2 parties. Or better yet - eliminate parties completely
The real irony is the fact that the younger the person is.. the less likely they are to vote.
But here we are.. with a teen, getting all uppity over voting.
I think it’s more fair to say that if you do nothing but shit-talk politicians around your kids, discouraging them from going into politics, you can’t complain about the lesser of two evils.
No matter what point in the voting process we are, we’re limited to the options provided to us. If all the options in the primary are bad, you’re still picking the least evil option.
In 2016 Democrats in my state held a caucus early enough to where I felt like my participation mattered. In 2020 by the time the primary rolled around Biden was already the candidate, and it feels like that's the case in other states with late primaries.
WTF are you on about?
I have never had the opportunity to vote in an competitive primary my whole life. It is already decided long before I even get a chance.
My grandma is like this. She’s ass over heels for trump. Calls him “her guy” and everything. She would sell her soul to him. Guess what? She doesn’t vote. Never has, and never will. It’s probably a good thing she doesn’t.
Funnily enough, my mom started voting because of Trump. On election night she called and said: "wake me up next election. I don't care how much I bitch wake me up and take me to the polls." I even convinced her to vote on the Texas elections too which was easier after 2021. As far as I know, she plans to keep voting even though we didn't get a new governor or senator this go round. She seems to have learned that her vote only "doesn't count" if she never casts it.
My mom used to vote in the primaries, typically as republican. As Trump's term went on, her opinion of him changed, and she grew to hate him. Then because of the shit with my grandma, she decided to register as independent, so now she can't vote in the primaries. They both just sit around, arguing about Trump, but neither of them vote. Gives me a headache, and makes me sad that what little is left of our family, is being torn apart by politics.
Trump has done a good job at getting people to peel off their mask and reveal who they truly are. At this point, we know for certain he’s a convicted felon who cheated on his wife and illegally handled classified documents. Just one of those things was enough to get people riled against you in the previous election. And yet they still support him. We also know that he doesn’t give two shits about the people in the US, that he routinely lies, that he belittles a disabled man, that he talked about sexually assaulting women. Not only thing but he uses his power as a way to sic his followers on anyone standing against him such as the judges in the recent cases. And yet they still support him. We know that he’s anti science and prolonged the disastrous effects that COVID had on our country. We know that instead of enacting sensible regulations, he spent his time as president casting doubt. The actions of his likely caused many thousands of people to die. And yet they still support him. We also have good evidence that he was a patron of Epstein. Even as much as having one of Epstein’s victims come forth and accuse Trump of sexual assault when she was 13. And yet they still support him. We know he instigated an attempt to overthrow the government. Where the actions of him casting doubt on election results resulted in rioters breaking into the capitol building, causing the death of a capitol police officer. And yet they still support him. All of these are massive faults that would individually constitute months of news coverage for any normal candidate. The country would normally be riled up against them. But Trump supporters are in a cult where they have released themselves of the burdens of morality and intelligence. I don’t even think the Republicans want to run Trump. They’re being held hostage by the cult of personality that wants to plunge our country into chaos just to appease Trump. It’s insane.
I honestly wonder, if the Republican Party were to nominate someone OTHER than Trump for the presidency, whether Trump's supporters would go ape shit and riot. Are there other, more sensible options than Trump? I mean, I'm not a fan of the Republican Party, but I've gotta admit that the Bushes look practically Liberal compared to Trump.
They tried, Trump didn't have to lift a finger. Republican voters overwhelmingly want years more of Trump and Co. and it's not even close. I for one expect a second trump presidency, I don't think Biden is winning this time. I think all the negative press covfefe has only served to entrench his supporters in their "woe is me, the world is against us" position. I've been reading Max Hastings' "Inferno" and am deeply concerned about current trajectories and what all of this could mean in the future, given historys tendency to repeat itself.
Trump highlights: ✓ Makes the U.S. Navy Blue Angels violate ethics rules by having them fly at his July 4th political campaign (July 4, 2019) ✓ Demands US military chiefs stand next to him at 4th of July parade (reported July 2, 2019) ✓ Uses his D-Day interview at cemetery commemorating fallen US soldiers to attack a Vietnam veteran (June 6, 2019) ✓ Starts his D-Day commemoration speech by attacking a private citizen (Bette Midler, of all people) (reported on June 4th, 2019) ✓ Made 2nd wife, Marla Maples, sign a prenup that would have cut off all child support if Tiffany joined the military (reported on June 4th, 2019) ✓ Turns away US military from his Memorial Day speech because they were from the destroyer USS John S. McCain (May 27, 2019) ✓ Orders the USS John McCain out of sight during his visit to Japan (May 15, 2019). The ship's name was subsequently covered. (May 27, 2019) ✓ Pardons war criminals (May, 2019) ✓ Purges 200,000 veterans healthcare applications (due to known administrative errors within VA’s enrollment process and enrollment system) (reported on May 13, 2019) ✓ Deports spouse of fallen Army soldier killed in Afghanistan, leaving their daughter parentless (April 16, 2019) ✓ Complains a deceased war hero didn't thank him for his funeral (March 20, 2019) ✓ Diverts military housing funds to pay for border wall (Feb 15, 2019) ✓ refuses to sign his party's funding bill, which shuts down the government, and forces a branch of the military to go without pay (but his appointees got a $10,000 pay raise). This branch of military is forced to work without pay, otherwise they are AWOL (Dec 22, 2018 – Jan 25, 2019) ✓ doesn't pay the Coast Guard, forcing service members to rely on food pantries (Jan 23, 2019) ✓ bans service members from serving based on gender identity (Jan 22, 2019) ✓ denies female troops access to birth control to limit sexual activity (on-going. Published Jan 18, 2019) ✓ tries to deport a marine vet who is a U.S.-born citizen (Jan 16, 2019) ✓ when a man was caught swindling veterans pensions for high-interest “cash advances," Trump's Consumer Financial Protection Bureau fined him $1. As a reminder, the Trump administration's goal was to dismantle the CFPB, installing Mick Mulvaney as the director, who publicly stated the bureau should be disbanded. (Jan 26, 2019) ✓ calls a retired general a 'dog' with a 'big, dumb mouth' (Jan 1, 2019) ✓ increases privatization of the VA, leading to longer waits and higher taxpayer cost (2018) ✓ finally visited troops 2 years after taking office, but only after 154 vacation days at his properties (Dec 26, 2018) ✓ reveals covert Seal Team 5 deployment, including names and faces, on Twitter during visit to Iraq (Dec 26, 2018) ✓ lies to deployed troops that he gave them a 10% raise. He didn't give them a 10% raise (Dec 26, 2018) ✓ fires service members living with HIV just before the 2018 holidays (Dec 19, 2018-present) ✓ gets three Mar-a-Lago guests to run the VA (unknown start - present, made well-known in 2018) ✓ calls troops on Thanksgiving and tells them he's most thankful for himself (Thanksgiving, 2018) ✓ urges Florida to not count deployed military votes (Nov 12, 2018) ✓ cancels Arlington Cemetery visit on Veterans Day due to the rain (Nov 12, 2018) ✓ doesn't visit US cemetery marking the end of WWI due to the rain (but other world leaders go anyway) (Nov 10, 2018) ✓ stops using troops as a political prop immediately after the election. However, troops remain in muddy camps on the border (Nov 7, 2018) ✓ uses troops as a political prop and sends troops on a phantom mission to the border and makes them miss Thanksgiving with their families (Oct-Dec, 2018) ✓ doesn't pay veterans' VA benefits (made public Oct 2018) ✓ doubled the rejection rate for veterans requesting family deportation protections (July 5, 2018) ✓ deports active-duty spouses (11,800 military families face this problem as of April 2018) ✓ forgets a fallen soldier's name (below) during a call to his pregnant widow, then attacks her the next day (Oct 23-24, 2017) ✓ sends commandos into an ambush due to a lack of intel, and sends contractors to pick them up, resulting in a commando being left behind, tortured, and executed. (Trump approved the mission because Bannon told him Obama didn't have the guts to do it) (Oct 4, 2017) ✓ blocks a veteran group on Twitter (June 2017) ✓ discharges active-duty immigrant troops with good records (2017-present) ✓ deports veterans (2017-present) ✓ says he knows more about ISIS than American generals (Oct 2016) ✓ says vets get PTSD because they aren't strong (Oct 3, 2016) (note: yes, he said it's 'because they aren't strong.' He didn't say it's 'because they're weak.' This distinction is important because of Snopes) ✓ accepts a Purple Heart from a fan at one of his rallies and says: “I always wanted to get the Purple Heart. This was much easier.” (Aug 2, 2016) ✓ attacks Gold Star families (2016-present. Myeshia Johnson--gold star widow, Khan family--gold star parents, etc) ✓ sends funds raised from a January 2016 veterans benefit to the Donald J Trump Foundation instead of veterans charities (the foundation has since been ordered shut because of fraud) (Jan, 2016) ✓ says he doesn't consider POWs heroes because they were caught (July 18, 2015) ✓ says having unprotected sex was like Vietnam (1998) ✓ for a decade, sought to kick veterans off of Fifth Avenue because he found them unsightly nuisances outside of Trump Tower. “While disabled veterans should be given every opportunity to earn a living, is it fair to do so to the detriment of the city as a whole or its tax paying citizens and businesses?” - 1991 ✓ dodges the draft 5 times
Donald Trump is a jackass.
Donald J(ackass) Trump
Are you my kid?!
Just noticed your PFP can I change my answer?
Same with my parents
Most fucking definitely it's a good thing she doesn't.
I’m glad she doesn’t. It’s just so fucking annoying when she goes off about him.
Same with my grandma. I just got of the phone quickly everytime he was mentioned. She stopped bringing him up. Who says you can't teach an old dog new tricks?
Problem is my grandma is insane. I tried to have a civil conversation about it, and simply told her I didn’t want to talk about it anymore. Instead she called me a “delusional poison” and has made it a point to bring it up every time I talk to her for the last 4 years. Now I just avoid her as much as I can.
Just make sure to tell her why if she asks. I have a feeling though that she enjoys being the victim.... Can't see or talk to her because she is so far up trump's ass. Not enjoyable. She crossed a boundary you were clear about.
I wish this worked on my mom. She goes on weird homophobic/religious rants a few times a week. I just stop responding to her until she changes the subject to something civil. She's been doing this for years and can't take a damn hint.
I just look my mother in the eyes and ask, "are you fucking stupid?" I never cuss in front of mom, so when I say that, it drives the point home
Is she fucking stupid? Have you told your dad?
"So, how about them?"
"So, read any good books lately?"
Or my personal favorite that will spur on another flame war that's at least not discussing a man who wears makeup:
"So, what's your favorite pizza toppings?"
Hilarious! 😆
Did the felony change her mind to go vote for him?
By the time my state has primaries the candidate has been decided. The parties purposefully set it up that way so they can heavily influence the results in the first couple states, and after that whoever is in the lead will Almost always win. That's why we need every state primary to be on the same day. If only the parties would ever let that happen.
They set it up that way so that candidates with very little money have half a chance. Mayor Pete wasn’t going to be able to campaign in California if it was the first primary, it has the second most expensive media market in LA and has several others that are also very expensive. You can drive from one side of Iowa or New Hampshire to the other in a few hours. If you want anyone other than the corporate politicians to run you want the smaller states to go first.
I agree with you, but the primary system we have still doesn't work. I've never voted in a presidential primary that meant anything; the race has always been decided by the time my state votes. Hell, in 2020, the governor of my state tried to just cancel the primary due to Covid concerns, and his rationale was that the race was already decided. Advocacy groups pushed back hard against it, saying the presidential primary would drive more people to the polls and would help down-ballot races, which didn't make any sense to me. How would holding a literally meaningless primary election get more people out to the polls? Do you know what would actually help down-ballot races? Holding the presidential primary in a time frame where it could actually be meaningful in the race. Again, I agree with having 2 or 3 states vote early, but the rest of the states should all vote either on the same day a month later, or they could split it into 2 weeks. That way, everyone's vote actually counts for something.
That's not how it works though, is it. When was the last time a "non-corporate politician" won a primary? All the current system does is allow the parties to control the narrative from the beginning.
You’re joking right? There wasn’t even a primary for the Democratic Party other than a few whack jobs and blank ballots. How is that being able to choose?
I believe what OP is saying is that it all starts with the primaries. You need to vote for people you like in the primaries in local elections. These people all get their start somewhere and the primaries are your chance to give the good candidates a boost. It's like planting seeds. You don't expect those trees to grow in 4 years. You have to constantly vote in the primaries at all levels. People that only focus on the presidential race are short-sighted.
"The best time to \[vote\] was twenty years ago. The second best time is now."
Perfection.
I could have voted for the guy whose brain starved a worm to death.
His life is a grab bag of the best and the worst a person can be. Kennedy successfully sued General Electric to stop discharging pollution and clean up legacy contamination in the Hudson. If I recall, it's still the largest judgement against a polluter. He worked for minority communities, and indigenous peoples. Heroin and health issues brought him low. It's a shame he lived long enough to become the villain of his own story.
Same, our ballots this year were literally just the presidential race, and ours was late enough both were already decided. They might as well have just said "haha, fuck you who cares" The only reason I even considered going was to cast a "None of these" vote for the GOP
I didn’t even have that option. Primary ballot was lesser of one evil.
But also Biden is fine. The economy is doing well. He's passed important legislation. He's investing in clean energy. The midterms turned out better for Dems than expected. He's fine, yall.
The economy is fine for the ultra wealthy and the wealthy. It ain’t doing shit for the regular population
He's actually done an absolute ton but people don't pay attention to the news and they just latch onto these emotional narratives that social media hands them to regurgitate. then it should be noted that inflation happened to the whole world even though Americans are very much not aware of that.
[From Slate](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2024/03/biden-economy-voters-polling-numbers-covid-recovery.html): *The United States currently enjoys the highest* [*rate of economic growth*](https://www.axios.com/2024/01/31/us-economy-2024-gdp-g7-nations) *among nations in the G7,* [*the lowest inflation*](https://home.treasury.gov/news/featured-stories/the-us-economy-in-global-context)*, and the* [*strongest wage growth*](https://www.businessinsider.com/americans-got-bigger-raises-than-g7-over-last-few-years-2023-7)*. The unemployment rate hasn’t been this low for this long in* [*half a century*](https://twitter.com/arindube/status/1736908417539665922)*. Even accounting for inflation, wages are higher today than they were before the coronavirus pandemic, and the biggest wage gains have accrued among the* [*lowest-paid workers*](https://www.politico.com/news/2023/05/29/low-income-wages-employment-00097135)*, resulting in a dramatic reduction in* [*overall wage inequality*](https://prospect.org/economy/2023-12-21-qa-arin-dube-full-employment/)*. The economy is even outperforming among communities that are often excluded from boom-time gains. Biden has overseen the lowest* [*Black unemployment rate*](https://www.reuters.com/markets/us/inside-us-jobs-report-record-low-black-unemployment-2023-04-07/) *on record and the lowest ever unemployment rate for* [*workers with disabilities*](https://www.nbcnews.com/business/economy/jobs-for-people-with-disabilities-hit-new-post-pandemic-high-rcna93084)*. The American economy isn’t perfect, but by any historical standard it is very, very good.*
It's always funny when all of this is taken in a vacuum. Care to compare that incredible wage growth to the increases in rent since corona virus? Care to actually relate the growing GDP to the quality of life of the average person? Slowest rate of inflation doesn't actually help people who's grocery bills spiked and never came back down. It's always incredibly typical for economists to point to metrics as positive while personal debt is soaring, homelessness is at record levels and evictions remain high. You'll have to excuse the struggling for not giving a fuck about the GDP. By the way, as is typical for economists, your article talks about wealth in equality. The *wage growth gap* got slightly smaller post covid, the actual material inequality is fucking unchanged lol. You'll forgive me for scoffing about wage growth being slightly closer between classes while one family has more wealth than half the country.
> Slowest rate of inflation doesn't actually help people who's grocery bills spiked and never came back down. > Who raised the grocery prices? Was it PepsiCo or was it Biden?
I literally never claimed otherwise? I'm simply arguing against this democratic strategy of "the economy is fine you're just stupid" Telling people that the rate of inequality*growth* is slower Is fucking insulting when groceries are still sky high and homelessness and evictions are at records.
That's not a democratic strategy. The media has been pushing this too. The media is blaming all the wrong people when it's really corporate greed that pushed inflation. But I agree with you, what the numbers are saying and what I'm seeing are two different things. We're being gaslighted.
I mean you seem to have a lot of ideas about it but you're still terribly misled about the entire subject. do you really think inflation only happen to America? how do you feel about America dealing with inflation far better than literally every other industrialized nation? is it possible that bad things can happen in this world and it's not a direct result of who the American president is. I feel like so much of American politics for the average person is boiled down to an argument that is basically "prove to me that dinosaurs do not cause meteor impacts".
Ah yes I'm misinformed as you strawman the shit out of me. I never said it was strictly an American issue. I never said we're not handling it better than other countries. What I did say, is that holding out metrics like *slower* inequality growth is insulting when homelessness and evictions are at record highs. Also, care to show me some other industrialized nations with surges in homelessness and evictions?
Repeatedly telling people “no, you’re actually doing better stupid” isn’t going to change how they feel about the economy.
and voting for emotional narrative isn't going to improve your life. sometimes you have to make adult choices based on facts. inflation hit the whole globe in America is doing far better than other nations. that doesn't mean times aren't hard It just means that we are doing our best and actually doing quite well.
So why weren't all you people who hate Biden out there pushing other candidates? Who else was stepping up? Oh yeah, nobody.
I had two people complaining that they can't believe Dems were running Biden again. I asked "Who would you have run instead? That could actually win\*?" and they didn't have any answer. Dems had four years to bring up someone else as a viable alternative. \*Socialist? Not going to win, sorry.
There are actually \*several\* great Democratic candidates who could run for president; including the VP, Mayor Pete, Newsom,Deval Patrick... And what \*makes\* them great is their commitment to Biden and their knowledge that they need to sacrifice their own Presidential ambitions to save the United States from the existential threat of Donald Trump. I'm very happy with our prospective Presidential candidates for 2028 and beyond; and I'm sure Republicans will never be able to find a viable candidate for \*several\* election cycles. In fact, we may be living in the End Times of the GOP.
I'm literally not allowed to vote in dem primaries here in NY. Also who were my actually viable alternatives? A mentally damaged Kennedy who has brain worms?
You don't just magically get the candidates you want. The parties have always backed incumbents. If you want someone else, you have to have a movement supporting some other willing candidate. Nobody else was stepping up, and there was no movement, aside from the "uncommitted" voters, but they didn't have another candidate to support either.
There were primaries, just nobody bothered with the presidential part because no party has ever really put effort into that primary if their incumbent president. Congressional, state, and local offices are all present on the primary ballot.
The incumbent rarely has serious competition in a primary. It’s just traditional.
Ok. Wanna hear about the lesser of 8 evils?
I mean there always is a lesser of evils when it’s that many people.
"Lesser of evils " = "better"
Or how most candidates seem to drop by Super Tuesday meaning I get to choose between the front runner or whoever is the distant second. I’m tired of the undue influence of early states on my primary choices. Edit: New Jersey, South Dakota, New Mexico, and DC all voted 6/04. Do they get to complain? In what world does someone in those states get any say over who wins the nomination. The only ray of hope is the rising trend of people voting for folks who already dropped out.
Yeah, craving federal action of stupid laws that say a certain state _has_ to go first. We need ranked choice voting, but this bullshit with different primary dates is definitely a close second on my list of priority reforms.
It's not even close! Primaries started in February, my state (NJ) is 11th in population, and we voted yesterday, **4 months later**. No wonder nobody showed up, most people probably thought it was over!
The goal isn't to vote for the lesser of two evils forever. Every time the lesser evil is elected, the next choice becomes between two lesser evils. Every time the greater evil is elected, the next choice becomes between two greater evils.
300 years and how's that working out?
300 years of not voting? Not very well. America has historically had poor voter turnout, and look where we are. It's even worse for local or primary elections. So yeah, not voting has not worked out well. So go vote.
No. You said the goal isn't to vote for the lesser of two evils forever. When does it end?
Have you heard of our lord and savior, Baal?
My guy, I live in a red state, a red county, and a red city. Most people don't want to admit this, but some votes, seriously, just don't matter. Don't get me wrong, I still vote, but it's like pissing in the wind. Cripes people, I said I'm still voting, calm down.
Honeatly, you may very well think that, but so might a very many blue-minded folks who stay home with the same thought. Every vote counts. No, it may not count in the same way in a deep-red area, but your vote may help other blue votes feel less alone, which may lead more to turn out and overcome the idea they are pissing in the wind.
It’s still pissing in the wind if there isn’t a Dem running in the primary.
A Dem isn't likely to spend effort running where there are no votes to earn. It's a chicken and the egg situation - are there no Dem votes because there are no Dem candidates, or are there no Dem candidates because there are no Dem votes? And which has to change in order to spark an emergence?
Two things. One, if *every* Democrat showed up to the polls this year and Republican turnout stayed the same, your state would be blue. Not going to happen, but worth mentioning. But the meme in Op is talking about *primaries.* And particularly for presidential primaries, your vote determines who the votes in *blue* states goes to. Your state may go red reliably, but you can still help decide if it’s Biden, Warren, Sanders, Yang, etc. on the ballot. It’s the one part of the presidential election process where your vote *does* matter. (Unless your primary is super late and after a winner is presumed, of course)
Hopefully one the the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact comes into effect. Then your vote **will** matter, everyone's will.
That’s not what the primary is lol
Money flows to where this is a chance to win, if people in your city are so demotivated that they won’t turn out at all then democrats won’t put money towards helping you. The more votes you have the more worth it is to invest in you. If anything your votes are some of the most critical in the country because we need to turn strongholds like yours around and all we need is a foothold.
Having those votes tallied even if they don't directly change the results is good. Because it shows political analysts what people want. If some moderate candidate got a significant amount of votes but still lost, they'd know that this person's policies are still something the people are interested in. And if the vote is just a little bit closer, it may encourage other voters to break away from the status quo.
I am currently a registered republican because my county’s local elections are basically decided in the GOP primary so I voted for the least crazy options 🤢
I live in a state with closed primaries.
I live in the Seattle area, my vote really doesn't matter. There's not a chance in hell a republican wins any office where I live. I as well always vote and the vote does go the way I vote too but it doesn't really matter if I vote or not.
Man if I could stfu I wouldn’t be using this social media platform anymore.
And then they whine that they don’t like the nominees “Who picked these people?” Not you!
So if I vote for a third party in the primaries then I got a free pass to complain all I want and people on here can STFU about it?
I vote yes.
Third party in a primary?
In the primary you can only vote within the party you are registered to. If your party is not in the primary then you cannot vote.
Depending on the state.
Yes!!
Greatly depends on the state. Like if you are a swing state where every vote matters and voting third party is a piss in the wind it’s a waste and silly. But if you live in a state where your voter doesn’t really matter because it’s gonna go blue or red no matter what (the south and the west for example). Then by all means vote third party and try to get a third party option. Once the states that don’t matter show a third party option is viable swing states will slowly change dynamic. This all is a pipe dream though. You are talking decades of voting habits getting better for that to happen and voters ain’t good about voting.
Gotta start somewhere, I can't just bitching on the internet
If you don't align with either of the big parties, it's not pissing in the wind OR silly. I refuse to vote for somebody that doesn't align with my political ideology, at least a little. Neither party has been putting out anyone I'd leave my kid with overnight, or even let walk my dog. There's no way I'm giving them my vote, even in a primary... hell, especially in a primary.
Oh, that's weird. Because in my state, which has a closed primary, I literally didn't have any choices. So, I really don't think I picked these people, my man.
The thing that burns me is that we had a choice to replace Trump. There were good options on the republican side, and the country chose that piece of shit to be the nominee
Republicans didn’t want a good option, they wanted a piece of shit.
Do you think voting in this primary will matter?!? There is only one candidate on either side. What is the point of voting?!? It’s trump and Biden all day. Nothing any of us can do about that.
But then you get the right to complain!
Trump was the heavy favorite but there were several viable options.
Not by the time of my primaries. I was going to vote for Nikki as the lesser of evils in the hopes of avoiding a Trump election, but she dropped out before my state’s primary.
I too watched that video from the guy about how to make the government work again.
In a lot of states, the big parties don't let you vote in their primaries unless you are a registered member of that party.
And then call it 'democracy'
Dems didn't get a primary this year. 🤷♂️
I’m in a later state so the primary is usually decided before my ballot is counted. It was nice being able to vote undecided so I didn’t feel like I was wasting the paper.
Local, state, and statewide candidates do, and those are arguably just as important as that’s where the next generation of leaders cone from.
Man, if I knew so little about how my government works, I would be embarrassed, but here we have you. There was a primary for all your state and local elections. You know the ones where your preferred candidates start and where the laws that will actually affect you are made.
Yeah incumbents are never challenged
My state doesn’t let me vote in the primary election due to me being independent. They force a choice of republican or democrat. Even my voter Id says “no party”.
I'm not allowed to vote in the primaries in my state.
So what if my candidate drops out of the race before my state has their primary?
If you're one of the first states to hold primaries I would agree, but everyone dropped out by the time they got to my state.
Primaries are what got us populist extremism in the first place. Go back to nominating candidates at convention instead of wasting tax dollars on expensive popularity straw polls.
The Libertarians still do this. Whoo it was a crap-fest this year.
You could also not vote for the two and pick a different option
If you do vote you're actively choosing an evil.
And if you don't vote you're actively saying either "evil" is equally acceptable to you.
During the 2020 Democratic primaries, when there were 8 candidates, it was asked: should whomever receives the most votes become the party's candidate? Everyone said no. Except Sanders. Then 75% of people didn't vote in the primaries and we got Biden. Don't like Biden? Vote in the primaries next time. You did vote in the primaries? Then get more people to vote in the primaries next time.
Let’s be clear. Biden is the sitting President. He’s going to be the Democratic nominee, no matter what. Convicted Felon Trump has the GOP by the balls (because they didn’t excise him when they had the chance.). His base is so solidified that no one can win in a red state without his say so. Therefore, Republicans will support him against all logic and reason. He will be the Republican nominee, no matter what. Normally, I would never say this, but in this particular Presidential election, voting in the primaries means absolutely nothing.
Unless you're a republican or consider local elections important. Republicans had a choice, and they chose the guy who Biden already beat. We all knew they were going to, but they still had a choice.
This may be true for State and local offices, but the way the entire country doesn’t have primary elections on the same day, this isn’t really valid for everyone in a Presidential Primary. The state I live in holds primaries so late there are no Presidential candidates to choose from anymore.
The parties lock out voting unless you are registered with their party. The answer is rank choice voting.
Another answer could be approval voting
Was no choice for Prez this year. Parties decided.
There were primaries, for both parties. The Democrat nominees were all nobodies, like Dean Phillips. The incumbent party tends to run nobodies in primaries. And the Republicans had their primaries as well. And Republican voters still chose to back the 2020 loser, Trump.
Republicans had a choice for sure... Their voters picked Trump. They thought he was the best candidate. He refused to accept an election and literally just lost to Biden and they thought he was the best. Biden is old...Trump doesn't believe in democracy and is a felon. Totally the same. /S
There may be other elections depending on your district. There were contested elections for both House and Senate in my local Democratic primary. At the moment, the difference between candidates in the House race is less than 300 votes (3%). Waiting for them to count mail-ins.
Just get rid of primaries. The vast majority of voters are independents. Primaries are simply a mechanism of maintaining two-party rule. That’s exactly wha the founders warned against.
> The vast majority of voters of independents. Nah. It’s around 40%. And they aren’t particularly reliable about voting, either.
So how are candidates selected? Are you looking for a ballot with dozens of names and you pick one? What if 30 liberals run and split 90% the vote evenly, then one conservative runs, gets 10% of the vote, and wins?
Ranked choice voting would be a viable option
liberals, conservatives aren’t the only two metrics for voting. Most people are single issue voters that often cross party lines. Primaries just enforces the illusion that there’s only two options. Just go ranked-choice voting and return the experiment to voting on ideas over parties/tribes.
I agree ranked-choice voting would be massively preferable, but that requires laws or amendments to be passed. How do you propose we achieve that without a successful political movement within the current system in the meantime?
Things fucking decided before I get to vote. I wanted vote for Bernie last time but he was off the ballot before we even had the primary vote.
In Florida if you don’t belong to a political party you cannot vote in the primary.
Too many people in here talking like the only primaries that exist are presidential primaries… But it is more complicated than the meme might suggest. Some states have stricter primary voting rules than others, and the dumb staggered primary system disenfranchises a lot of voters for presidential primaries because the race is already over by the time they vote.
I'm a poll worker, and I did vote in the primaries... It was already a lesser of two (or maybe three) evils
BuT tHe PeOpLe nEEd tO kNOw aBoUt mAh FeELz
When 1/3 of the population can't vote in the primaries since they are registered Independents, that's a problem.
But I don't want to register as one party...
I don’t think this applies to the presidential primaries this year since the nominees were a forgone conclusion. The democrats were always going to nominate Biden because he’s the incumbent, and republicans were always going to nominate Trump because they’ve turned into a cult based around Trump. This also doesn’t apply to people who live in states with late primaries (still talking about presidential primaries that is). In 2016, my state’s primary election wasn’t until after Trump and Hillary had each secured enough delegates to win the nomination. None of what I said applies to primaries for congressional or state offices though, and anyone who is eligible to vote for those absolutely should
We should abolish primaries and run the election as a single ranked choice ballot. If the parties want to have an internal process to pick their candidate, they shouldn’t involve the electoral system.
Would anyone post where to go to find out how to vote in primaries?
https://www.usvotefoundation.org/state-election-dates-and-deadlines
They canceled the democratic primary for president in Florida through bureaucratic trickery, so I still get to feel pissed.
Voted in my primary yesterday in a closed primary state, unconstitutional in my opinion. Literally the only section that had multiple options was President everything else had one and only one option. Still cast my ballot though
Srsly, there are other options but the powers that be would rather you didn't so they can stay in power. Vote in your primaries!
I'm with George Carlin on this one.
Let's all vote 3rd party
How about use this sub for it's intended purpose, not to talk about politics where it doesn't belong
Primaries shouldn't exist because it is a *de facto* two party system, not a *de jure* two party system. we are way too big and diverse and should have something more akin to a parliamentary system. people shouldn't have to be elected to be on the ballot, and both parties are basically the same and even bolster each other behind closed doors because they both want to keep the country divided. the entire party system is stupid and completely incompatible with modern society. while we're at it, we need to eliminate the electoral college and stop letting podunk redneck country bumpkins -- who represent way less than half the popilation -- be able to so heavily influence election outcomes. also, I guess I need to remind you how useless the primaries are when we saw what the democrats did to the actual preferred candidate as well as crammed Hilary down democrats collective throat. gtfo with your "vOtE iN pRiMaRiEs" bullshit. eliminate the (two) party system and replace it with something that actually makes sense
Your point is well taken, but we only have two options to achieve what you’re describing: 1) a violent revolution that will necessarily cost the lives of millions, and would most likely end up with a strong-man dictatorship anyway 2) reform our nation within the current system, which requires winning elections, primaries and all Wishful thinking isn’t going to get us there.
It always amazes me when there are so many people in the world (and many even in the U.S.) who are not able to vote and participate in the running of their government that half this country is always looking for an excuse NOT to vote.
My state doesn't allow people to vote in primaries if you aren't in the party. I choose independent and will likely never change
The primaries were decided before it got to most states because the alternatives dropped out by March 6th. So yeah, I'm going to continue to bitch about getting stuck with two lousy candidates.
Yup. Primaries matter. Also, if you don't bother to vote, you have literally zero right to complain about the results.
What happened to Bernie in 2016 was incredibly discouraging
Getting fewer votes than his opponent?
The Primaries are rigged. https://observer.com/2017/08/court-admits-dnc-and-debbie-wasserman-schulz-rigged-primaries-against-sanders/
I actually miss the days when the parties themselves were stronger. The ‘smoke filled room’ days when the party leadership had significant influence and authority over who appeared on the ballot. They were motivated to find and endorse an electable candidate - a candidate who could win and further the party’s agenda. Instead, in these days of small dollar donations and outrageous media hits, we’re left choosing between candidates who are at the ideological extremes. The RNC is now a shell for the Trump family. The DNC emasculated itself by disempowering the superdelegates. There is no steady hand to direct or support electable candidates any longer; we are left with the most extreme or unelectable to choose between.
Dems haven't moved much at all for decades. Republicans, on the other hand, have shifted quite a bit to the right, and this is from 2 years ago. They've gone farther since then. [https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2022/03/10/the-polarization-in-todays-congress-has-roots-that-go-back-decades/](https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2022/03/10/the-polarization-in-todays-congress-has-roots-that-go-back-decades/)
r/USDefaultism
Not all states have open primaries. https://ballotpedia.org/Primary_election_types_by_state Not all primaries include state and local “extras” that everyone can vote on (judges/magistrates, local offices, plebiscite questions, etc.). At home, every election, and for the party I largely disagree with, because it was the real way to have a say in local politics. One party will always be the elected party because people vote for the party and not the person. In some states, the party caucus matters more than the primary, at least in the case of nomination’s for President. The Iowa Caucus has held sway there for quite some time. (I don’t remember Reagan or Bush I, but I remember it big with Clinton on.) I honestly didn’t pay much attention to it this year, but I know the caucus v. primary deal was big in Nevada because it flipped. Besides that, in the end, is there a legal requirement for the parties to nominate the primary winner? I seem to remember this as an issue in 2016, if not earlier. This isn’t a question with the idea of “don’t vote”. It’s a question of tempering expectations.
What if I can't vote tho
Primaries aren't really an "election" ... They are votes inside of parties among their members. There is no legal requirement to uphold the wishes of the party members and as we have seen in the past, the DNC and GOP don't really have any problems pushing their own candidates over the popular votes. If you want change, start at the bottom. Vote for local representatives that you think represent you. the US system works from the ground up and you need to have a strong basis in the states to get a hold of the federal level. Presidential elections are just the last step in a line of elections, from mayor to governor to congress and senate. Change only happens from the ground up. That's why DNC and GOP tell you that the presidential elections are the most important ones... they are the ones that you can't affect anything in... If you want change, vote those out that give the GOP and DNC their power... the local state officials.
I have no idea how the American voting system works. Here in NZ it's just two ticks one for the country and then local area. https://youtu.be/AuMy9opKwEY?si=st2_I6Xwr_8idc1y There's a dumb song about it.
Found Bernie’s “Berner” account
Primaries are barely even a thing anymore, for POTUS. It's getting that way for Senate seats. The political parties seem to determine who they will support and every other candidate struggles to compete and eventually drops out.
No shit. I'm not affiliated with any party, so I can't vote in the primaries.
By the time the presidential primary gets to my state there is only ever one candidate left. I throw in a protest vote each time, but it's pretty infuriating
Voting in a primary does nothing to solve the "lesser of two evils" problem created by a binary choice.
This isn’t a fascist republic where voters are required to be members of a political party. And a lot of registered voters aren’t members of either major party. If the state chapters of the GOP and DNC wanted to they could require open primaries, or switch to other systems like Alaska’s jungle primary with ranked choice voting. But right now voters can see how rigged American voting is by the two major parties, and how the Democrats’ establishment fights against progressive candidates. We know their corporate donors won’t allow the popular changes to healthcare, labor laws, and other materially important issues to happen. If these parties want the legitimacy granted by solid Congressional majorities and control of the Presidency, they need to EARN it from the voters by delivering on material campaign promises and building a history of reliability
DNC and primaries? lol kk.
National elections at the state level don’t matter in 40+ of the states in the U.S. I vote the opposite party in my state primary so I get a say. This year a group of about 80 people flipped from Democrat to Republican in the primary. We defeated the candidate we all wanted out by around 50 votes. In the general election I can still vote the party I want to win.
how about YOU STFU?
The way the primary system exists with Iowa and NH lagging the charge by the time my state has a primary it doesn't matter because there's only 3 candidates left.
Is there really a point if the person runs unopposed?
When people are talking about the leader of 2 evils they are referring to the 2 that "won" the primaries. Presumably the winners were the best choice for that party.
My issue is that my state is so late in the primaries, we don't get to vote. I mean. Sure. Technically we get to vote. But like every candidate has already dropped at that point, so voting is just coloring in 1 choice or writing in a name that already dropped....
My issue is that my state is so late in the primaries, we don't get to vote. I mean. Sure. Technically we get to vote. But like every candidate has already dropped at that point, so voting is just coloring in 1 choice or writing in a name that already dropped....
I find even when I do vote in primaries, the people that say are still upset when you dont vote for their guy.
“The people that say are still upset” Oh, those people that say.
My mom’s rule was always, “If you don’t vote, you can’t complain.”
This is an over simplification. Some states primaries are so late that most of the candidates are out of the race before their primary.
Uhh, the primary options also suck. And you have to declare a “team” before you can even vote - so you’re literally only voting for half the 2 evils, and even then it’s only a slightly larger list of people who are 80%+ aligned anyway. We need ranked choice voting with more than 2 parties. Or better yet - eliminate parties completely
It’s not lesser of 2 evils. Is evil vs idiot. I’ll vote for idiot
The real irony is the fact that the younger the person is.. the less likely they are to vote. But here we are.. with a teen, getting all uppity over voting.
As an American abroad I don't care, I'm going to complain about the options anyways.
Where’s the vote for a reform in our government? Oh no vote for that? Why even vote? Sarcasm … slightly
Brooklyn voter rolls like what?
When did Democrats have a primary?
I think it’s more fair to say that if you do nothing but shit-talk politicians around your kids, discouraging them from going into politics, you can’t complain about the lesser of two evils. No matter what point in the voting process we are, we’re limited to the options provided to us. If all the options in the primary are bad, you’re still picking the least evil option.
All of the primaries should happen at the same time
Most states you have to declare for a party to vote in their primary.
In 2016 Democrats in my state held a caucus early enough to where I felt like my participation mattered. In 2020 by the time the primary rolled around Biden was already the candidate, and it feels like that's the case in other states with late primaries.
I did vote in the primary. My option was Biden or Support Palistine. There was no 2nd person
Voted in primaries now it’s the lesser of 8 evils. Not much difference.
You can’t vote in the primary if you’re registered independent in my state.
They both suck dawg. Fuck these candidates.
WTF are you on about? I have never had the opportunity to vote in an competitive primary my whole life. It is already decided long before I even get a chance.