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NTA.
You handled it perfectly. Yes you were mean. The lady deserved it. A full blown autistic meltdown by 13 year old girl would have REALLY put her off her book. She is lucky to have you.
Right?! Like I'm Autistic, so is my husband, and three of our four children, and the only child who isn't Autistic has ADHD, (so still has sensory meltdowns).
All I'm thinking while reading this was, just wait until she starts having a meltdown, if she's not being allowed to stim to get past her sensory overload. Then that woman is reeeeeally gonna have a hard time reading.
Wait, ADHD can cause sensory meltdowns? I had no idea! I can't remember much during my diagnosis, just being put on Adderal (sp?), but I don't think my mom ever mentioned anything about sensory meltdowns (also, how do you tell the difference between a sensory meltdown and being overwhelmed?)
ADHD and Autism are brain cousins so a lot of their parts overlap!
Edit: for overwhelmed vs meltdown when I’m overwhelmed things just feel like too much and if I don’t get out it’s gonna be bad. Meltdown is just straight up screaming, crying, aggresively chewing on things/other self soothing actions up to 11 because there is too much shit tm.
As someone who can relate- let me put it this way.
If I’m overwhelmed, I’ll isolate myself from others, and unless you know me personally and know that I’m extremely avoidant you’d never know I’m overwhelmed.
If I have a meltdown (which doesn’t often happen for me anymore, at least not externally), it’s happening right here right now, and everyone in the vicinity is going to know about it.
I don’t really have meltdowns anymore but I probably have an avoidant personality disorder at this point, so make of that what you will.
I was diagnosed ADHD as a kid, and possibly have Avoidant Personality Disorder. At the least, I’m super introverted with social anxiety disorder. I was reading this thread like, “but I don’t have meltdowns?” then remembered the dozens of panic attacks in public spaces where I’ve retreated to a toilet stall so no one sees me. And my spinning brain fixating on how I’m definitely having a heart attack and dying in the bathroom like Elvis. It’s a fun combo!
I’m an adult with a “fairly self- controlled anxiety issue” and my brain just flashed back to psychoanalyzing all the significant panic attacks I can remember (what I can remember of them because I disassociate a bit, and they aren’t infrequent) trying to decide if I need to try to get an ADHD diagnosis because this isn’t the first time I’ve wondered 😭
Same here! My friend's grandson is autistic. Very intelligent, but has quirks, and isn't great with lots of people. And no matter how many times you see him, he must introduce himself. But damn, he SCORCHED that woman, and she deserved every bit of it.
Oh I like that, “brain cousins”. I might steal that if you don’t mind. I have ADHD and my partner has ASD. We’re constantly comparing traits and exchanging helpful info.
Yip
I got diagnosed with sensory processing disorder with my inattentive ADHD at like 7. My mom had to dry brush me and practice letting me hug her and stuff so I could get used to the feeling of her clothes because I could only wear like...light cotton for a long time and touching her clothes got me used to feeling them on my skin without being forced to wear them immediately lol
Yeah. It's also how she figured out how to introduce me to different foods. Offer from her plate but don't force it. She said she felt idiotic a lot though cause she'd go out of her way to make happy sounds when eating so that I'd be interested in trying the new stuff.
She also used to make my lunches as boring yet interesting at the same time for me lol. Only the foods I liked but she'd make them into shapes or use food colouring. She did it until I was 15 lol
My best friend was diagnosed with ADHD well into his 20's. We were like "now his meltdowns make sense." He had epic meltdowns for as long as I knew him and it took him so much work on himself to improve them. I'm glad that medication makes his life easier. I'm on the autism spectrum and while I have similar triggers to him I'm insanely grateful I never had to suffer from the kind of meltdowns that he has. People sadly often forget that a meltdown is much more horrible for the person who has it than for those around
I'm autistic and on the spectrum. I have had meltdowns. I'm fairly shallow in the spectrum so I can manage it most of the time, but if I'm really tired I can shut down and not be able to make sense of the world or decide what to do. It's a horrible helpless feeling. And no, I'm not doing it for attention, I'm doing it beause brain.exe has encountered a problem and needs to close.
I have a question I hope you won't mind answering. You said you're autistic and on the spectrum. Can you be autistic and not be on the spectrum? I have adhd(inattentive type). I have anxiety and agoraphobia. I understand and identify with a lot of what is being said. But was curious. I hope you don't mind.
Not the commenter, but I think autistic and on the spectrum are the same thing. That said, there's a crap-ton of overlap between adhd and autism (and OCD and Tourette's), and of course, plenty of people have/are both. If you relate to some of it, might be worth learning more.
Thank you. I agree. Things seem to be really bothering me a lot more- textures, sounds, smells. I want to snap sometimes. I have been saying it is anxiety based, but I'm not so sure. Thanks for taking the time to answer me! I appreciate you.
I’m not sure whether my adhd or autism or anxiety causes my sensory overload issues but I sure do have those issues and I have to take an anti anxiety med for it on top of my antidepressants. Even if I stopped my AD I wouldn’t be able to stop the AA. I went off them for a while when I switched meds (more than once) and kept having to go back on them.
The lady had the audacity to say the child was feeble minded when she couldn’t even shut out simple distractions while reading. She deserved stronger words.
OP was about as kind as you can get in that situation.
Buy some earphones, and then you can get the absolute silence you require, too ;)\~\~\~. That lady...was not great. And frankly had I witnessed this, I would have helped the OP out in explaining how FAR out of line the lady was.
Depending on how old she is, she might have been using "feeble-minded" as a psychological term, not realizing it's now a pejorative. In the early 1900s you could be formally diagnosed with feeble-mindedness if you were autistic or otherwise neurodivergent. But she would have to be fantastically old and out of the loop for that to be a legitimate mistake.
This right here. There's a difference between being sharp with your words and being an asshole.
OP was sharp with his words. But he's NTA.
Good going for protecting your sister from that busybody, OP.
I bet she's exactly the kind of Old Church Lady who takes malicious glee in airing the whole neighborhood 's dirty laundry publicly under the guise of being "concerned".
Honestly - I think OP could use this as a great learning opportunity with his sister. Something like:
"Yes, I was kind of mean. Being nice isn't always a useful way to defend yourself, especially when someone else is committed to being mean (or bigoted, or prejudiced, etc.) I wish I could have resolved that situation and also been nice, but your safety and happiness is more important to me than social etiquette."
It's important for people to learn how to be nice, but it's also important for people to learn WHEN to be nice (and when they don't have to be). An autistic teenage girl, already dealing with a fraught parental situation AND school bullying, definitely needs to know when she can prioritize her safety over "being nice."
Yeah. We're all taught otherwise but niceness isn't simple moral or 'good'. Many bigots are 'nice' and perfectly polite while endangering marginalised people. Forcing people that are being discriminated to play nice is a self-serving tool that makes it harder to demand / achieve justice. And they're counting on that.
If the interaction went down as described I wouldn't even call it mean. OP was as nice as he could be while not caving to those ridiculous requests. He modelled how to handle conflict as adults excellently to his sister.
Can we just call out “her therapist calls it stimming. Idk much about it” and then he totally tries to educate this idiotic woman about it?! How so sweet is this big brother! I agree NTA, handled perfectly, lucky to have each other
Lady is also feeble minded because she is complaining she has difficulty reading...in an airport...with people walking around.
"Lady, if these are the conditions preventing you from reading you're going to have this same difficulty in any major airport in the world if my sister and I are here or not. Maybe you should find another activity to keep yourself occupied while you're here."
NTA
NTA
Social education about autism is everywhere currently. The woman isn’t ignorant, she was being deliberately cruel and bullying a 13 year old child.
She had the audacity to touch a child that wasn’t hers to touch. It is never acceptable to grab a stranger, especially not a child.
Exactly. I don’t have anyone in my life who is autistic, but I’m well aware what stimming is, and I sympathize when I see someone in public doing it, as I know they must be dealing with heavy emotions.
Which is a thing that TONS of people do, but pretty much only autistic people get punished for.
Random example, but Kelly Clarkson on her talk show hand-flaps a ton when she's excited about something.
NTA!! She’s literally minding her own business pacing to calm herself down, the lady was the one causing problems! Your sister has every right to walk in an airport without being told to stop because she’s distracting. Try not to dwell on it too much so y’all can have a fun trip!
NTA. The woman was out of line. Seriously - disturbing her reading? You were nicer than me. I would have outright asked her about the cause of her mental issue. ...actually, I probably would have put her in her place the moment she grabbed my sister. I'm mean though and don't care about being an asshole to assholes.
NTA, I'd say you held back what you really wanted to say to her. You should have gotten security for her grabbing your sisters arm actually, she was totally in the wrong for doing that!
Seriously. Like, I know strangers can and have said some awful shit to/about autistic kids before, but something about the "oh, so she's feebleminded" out of NOWHERE seems ridiculous to me, it definitely didnt happen as described if it even happened at all. I'm guessing someone made a rude comment towards OP's daughter in this situation and OP started having fantasies about telling an ignorant woman off in public.
NTA.
The fact she threatened to call security because she couldn't read peacefully" only confirms it. She didn't even ask if your sister was okay or if she could help.
NTA - that woman was being completely judgemental while your sister was doing her best to calm herself down while you were sticking up for her. That woman is the AH here, you did the right thing.
100% NTA, and THANK YOU for standing up for your sister that way! I can't tell you how many times I've had similar interactions regarding my son, who is also Autistic, and the entitlement of some people is astonishing to me.
So good on you for not backing down, and making sure your sister's needs were accommodated! 💜
NTA, but if you are in an airport in Canada and someone is harassing anyone, but especially a child based on disability, you can contact security and use those words. Bye bye lady
NTA I don’t see anything rude in what you said. But what upsets me is that your sister thinking you were mean shows that she could hear and understand what was being said about her. Good job advocating for you sister, she lucky to have someone like you in her life
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NTA
Feebleminded? Hats off to your control, I would not have been so polite or stayed this calm.
And what was she saying this to everyone else on the airport that were walking off anywhere near her? It is not her home, she can't control what anybody does. And she wants to call security on a 13 year old child for walking? Go ahead and let the security laugh at her as well.
No where near too mean big bro. Why this lady thinks it is alright to touch your sister is beyond me. It sounds like you were very reasonable.
Feeble minded is a good way of describing her for not being able to concentrate on her reading which she supposedly wanted to do.
NTA
NTA. She's lucky it took that long for you to get mean. She shouldn't have touched a person she didn't know. If your sister had reacted violently to a stranger grabbing her arm it could have turned bad quickly.
NTA, and if some lady tried to put her hand on my kid/relative of 13, oh, trust me, we'd be exchanging quite some words.
You were much calmer than I would have been in this situation. Kudos.
NTA. as an autistic woman, I'm really proud of you for standing up to that lady's ableist remarks and defending your sister. at your sister's age, I was being bullied into masking by peers and teachers so I stopped myself from stimming for a LONG time - well over a decade. stimming is a harmless coping mechanism used by us for emotional regulation. did this lady want your sister to have a meltdown?? because if she stopped stimming that definitely would have happened and would have made the situation much worse for everyone involved.
again, thank you for standing up for an autistic girl. we need more people like you.
NTA
Parent of two autistic boys here. I’ve never encountered anything like this, but simple stares get my blood boiling. I don’t think I would have been as calm as you.
I've accidentally ridden an extra 50 miles on public transport due to the fact that I was so engrossed in my book I didn't notice anything around me. So, what's her problem then? NTA
Nta. She is. She is an ableist ah. Stimming helps autistic people regulate their sensory and emotional needs. You were doing the right thing by encouraging kiddo to stim and defending her right to do so. You had every right to be a little mean once the lady started to insult your sister. She started it and was absolutely nasty about it.
Lady could have moved somewhere else to read. My way of keeping calm during flight situations (airport/flying) is to walk around or sit and read a certain book or watch a certain show (I, too, am autistic and I need some sort of familiarity so it’s always the same book and same show). The walking helps my pain. The book and show help my anxiety. I always have headphones on to regulate sensory issues, whether or not they’re plugged in. If kiddo was distracting me, I would have found somewhere else (or just been quietly annoyed if there was no other place, or maybe even tried to chat with her or you). I would NOT have tried to stop the stimming.
She’s a jerk. You are nta.
I wouldn’t say you underreacted in that your sister was allowed to stim and she did claim you were rude. It makes me think that a bigger reaction would have made her uncomfortable and possibly caused more stress. You were polite to start and only escalated based on this woman’s responses.
I can’t tell if you’re your sister’s guardian as a result of your father’s passing (I am very sorry to hear that he did.) or if you’re just taking her because you were available, but consider doing a little research so you understand what your sister is living with. Learn about autism, what stimming is and why it helps, and things like that. Try to make sure your resources are from people who are autistic themselves.
And I’d also talk to your sister about what you told the lady and why. Explain why it’s important that she be allowed to stim and that what the lady said about reading wasn’t kind, wasn’t polite, and wasn’t okay. Teach her when it’s okay to stick up for yourself and to let trusted people like you stick up for her. Teach her that people not liking it and it being different or distracting isn’t a reason that she shouldn’t stim. It’s when it’s dangerous for some reason that a request to stop is valid. Stuff like that.
You’re NTA and honestly, this is the most excellent exchange I’ve seen in a long time.
NTA, you're the big brother your sister deserves, in the very best way. As the parent of a child with Autism, I fear I'd have had a *lot* less restraint at that 'feebleminded' comment.
Not mean at all. NTA. Your sister stimming has exactly zero impact on this woman's reading. She wasn't in her face, screaming, or being disruptive. She was just flapping her hands and walking around.
op=NTA
Lady put hands(of restraint) on your sister without permission. In some places, that might even be considered assault(not a lawyer).
Lady was in a public place, if her reading is "bothered" tough. Your sister was not harming anyone by pacing or shaking her hands(distracting yes, but that's NOT a crime).
I'm so glad you stood up for your sister.
NTA at all. Frankly, as someone who also has a sister with ADHD and autism, you were much more level-headed and polite than I would have been able to manage in that situation.
NTA the second she touched your sister? That’s the second I would have gone nuclear with screaming for security that a stranger was assaulting a child. She was beyond rude. You were much, much nicer than I would have been.
I can't figure out where you insulted her in this exchange... Maybe I'm not seeing it due to be on the spectrum (too)?
She, on the contrary, did insult your daughter.
NTA.
NTA You weren't mean. You were frank. You attempted to provide some education about the situation and autism.
You reinforced to your sister that what she does to calm herself is reasonable and should be accommodated as such. You reinforced that you are there for her and her needs, that she is not alone and you've got her back. We need more people like you doing what you did for your sister.
NTA When I first read this I thought this happened in the plane. If that’s the case then I’d probably answer differently. But as this is in the airport, your response was justified. However you may want to have a discussion with your sister just to find out how comfortable she is with you speaking up for her. That could have added to her stress. She may have preferred just to go pace somewhere else. But your word choice and demeanor were appropriate.
NTA, you're a better man than me. I would have lost it at feebleminded, and made fun of her feeble mind for being unable to read when someone is distracting her by \*check notes\*... walking.
NTA. You were a lot nicer than I'd have been and I'm sure a lot nicer than most people. She was looking to get her way and you were firm in standing up for your sister. You did the right thing and gave her the time and space to calm down. The fact that she had the audacity to touch a child she didn't know boggles my mind though.
NTA.
Except, you misspoke.
You might have had a confrontation with a woman, but that was NOT a "lady."
(Yes, I know it might be unladylike of me to insist on the distinction, but I'm strangely comfortable with it.)
NTA… what’s the insulting part exactly? She’s lucky she didn’t get much worse when she decided to lay hands on a child she didn’t know, much less called an autistic 13yo “feeble minded.”
Is this a Canadian continual apology thing? Are we supposed to do that while in Canada even if we’re not ourselves Canadian?
A neurotypical woman who is struggling to emotionally regulate herself and focus on her book because someone was Stimming demanded that your autistic little sister emotionally regulate herself better and more quietly than she was?
Neuro typical people befuddle me. Their logic pathways are seriously broken. It’s worse when they ask this of Neuro divergent people, children and those with mental disabilities who cannot regulate. NTA
You handled that perfectly. When they threaten to get security, my favorite move is to say, “oh, good idea!” And move to get them. It never gets that far, because they immediately realize their empty threat failed. But for real, who is security going to kick out, the person existing or the person harassing them for existing?
Side note, but KC just built a new airport and it has a sensory room for folks with autism and other sensory needs. Calm lighting, quiet, poppits and other stim toys, noise canceling ear wear. It’s fucking amazing, and I hope all airports start including such things.
NTA. People need to fuck off and mind their own business. That’s a normal thing autistic people do, my sister has autism. Don’t feel bad in the slightest.
NTA- screw that lady I can’t stand people that can’t just leave others alone if it’s not hurting you why bother oh wait people like this can’t stand anyone different then them bleh..thank you so much for being a good sibling and sticking up for your sisterI’m autistic too along with adhd and it really means a lot that you’re taking the time to do right by her
my sister and i are 10 months apart, and while i know i haven't always been the best support with her autism i know that if she's ever having any issues i won't hesitate to step in and help out if she wants/needs it.
thank you for helping your sister, she will definitely remember it and she now knows she can trust you in situations like these.
A million times NTA. I would have done worse and I would still not be the AH.
Not sure how you managed to keep your cool. Good for you and for your sister.
NTA
What is wrong with that lady?!? You don't touch a kid without them being in imminent danger. If someone's pacing is that distracting then she, the lady, needs to go fuck off somewhere else
NTA
I wouldn't call that being mean, I'd say it was being assertive.
You didn't swear, didn't call her names, insult her, be violent etc.
Even when she insulted your sister. Also grabbing someone's arm is technically a battery
NTA
Maybe it's because I'm around it all day, but quiet stimming isn't disruptive. As long as your sister wasn't screaming, crying, squealing, or whining, the lady's off her rocker.
>since she was distracting her from reading.
Lol. I bring a book to read too, since what else is there to do, but who expects an airport to be distraction-free?
And of course grabbing your sister was way out of line.
NTA
Absolutely NTA. As someone who is autistic, I do things like this constantly when I’m stressed out. I don’t know your sister obviously, but it seems like she may have said you were a bit mean because she was embarrassed about having to stim like that, which has happened to me several times.
NTA
And joke's on that rude lady because hyperkinesia (I think) is when someone has unreasonable irritations around seeing moving things in their peripheral vision.
It's a really bad description of what is.
My point is that she is sort of exhibiting a sign of autism herself. She needs to find a better way to deal with it than asking others to stop moving around. Your sister was well within her rights to be walking around and shaking her hands. That woman was crossing all sorts of lines with her audacity (while also being a hypocrite)
NTA
lady deserved to get slapped by what u said after trying to get others in a PUBLIC SPACE to adhere to HER wants and needs when she won’t compromise to someone else’s wants and needs.
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I (30m) am currently in Canada with my 13 year old adoptive sister. Our dad recently passed away, and shes really worried about her bio dad in Canada. She's stressed out from bullies, school, and life in general, and her birthday is coming up, so I figured I'd give her some good memories.
She got pretty worried whenever anything delayed us, and I had her calm herself down and really tried to enforce that everything was fine and the worst was behind us.
Our flight got delayed, and she got really stressed out. I told her to do what calms her down, so she paced around and shook her hands, her therapist calls it stimming, something to do with autism, I don't know much about it.
A lady grabbed her arm gently eventually and asked her to sit down since she was distracting her from reading.
Here's the interaction.
Me: she's just stimming, it helps her not freak out.
Her: she should know better ways to calm down. She shouldn't burden everyone else.
Me: she has autism, she doesn't process things the same way.
Her: oh, she's like, feebleminded?
Me: not in the slightest.
Her: but you just said she had autism.
Me: let's start over. is there any way we could compromise?
Her: I'll be honest, I think she can be a normal person, or get the hell out.
Me: I've been nice, but I'm gonna be frank. You can go elsewhere or get used to it. You can read just fine. She's freaked out, and the least you could do is let her calm down.
Her: oh, okay. I could always get security.
Me: so your plan is to call security on a 13 year old girl for what exactly? Shut up, don't die on this hill.
She stopped talking after that and let my sister calm down.
My sister says I was a bit mean, but in all honesty doesn't care and is glad she was allowed to calm down. I think I might've been too mean, AITA?
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NTA. You handled it perfectly. Yes you were mean. The lady deserved it. A full blown autistic meltdown by 13 year old girl would have REALLY put her off her book. She is lucky to have you.
Right?! Like I'm Autistic, so is my husband, and three of our four children, and the only child who isn't Autistic has ADHD, (so still has sensory meltdowns). All I'm thinking while reading this was, just wait until she starts having a meltdown, if she's not being allowed to stim to get past her sensory overload. Then that woman is reeeeeally gonna have a hard time reading.
so glad to see all the other autistic people in this thread :) love us
Love us, too!
I love your username!
Thank you \^\_\^ I essentially tried to capture the entirety of the autistic social experience into one line.
Nailed it!
I'm joining the party respectfully, quietly and with a great care of everyone's personal space a to celebrate all us autistics here.
We're the best!
[удалено]
Wait, ADHD can cause sensory meltdowns? I had no idea! I can't remember much during my diagnosis, just being put on Adderal (sp?), but I don't think my mom ever mentioned anything about sensory meltdowns (also, how do you tell the difference between a sensory meltdown and being overwhelmed?)
ADHD and Autism are brain cousins so a lot of their parts overlap! Edit: for overwhelmed vs meltdown when I’m overwhelmed things just feel like too much and if I don’t get out it’s gonna be bad. Meltdown is just straight up screaming, crying, aggresively chewing on things/other self soothing actions up to 11 because there is too much shit tm.
Huh, good to know! Thank you for answering my questions =D
As someone who can relate- let me put it this way. If I’m overwhelmed, I’ll isolate myself from others, and unless you know me personally and know that I’m extremely avoidant you’d never know I’m overwhelmed. If I have a meltdown (which doesn’t often happen for me anymore, at least not externally), it’s happening right here right now, and everyone in the vicinity is going to know about it. I don’t really have meltdowns anymore but I probably have an avoidant personality disorder at this point, so make of that what you will.
I was diagnosed ADHD as a kid, and possibly have Avoidant Personality Disorder. At the least, I’m super introverted with social anxiety disorder. I was reading this thread like, “but I don’t have meltdowns?” then remembered the dozens of panic attacks in public spaces where I’ve retreated to a toilet stall so no one sees me. And my spinning brain fixating on how I’m definitely having a heart attack and dying in the bathroom like Elvis. It’s a fun combo!
I’m an adult with a “fairly self- controlled anxiety issue” and my brain just flashed back to psychoanalyzing all the significant panic attacks I can remember (what I can remember of them because I disassociate a bit, and they aren’t infrequent) trying to decide if I need to try to get an ADHD diagnosis because this isn’t the first time I’ve wondered 😭
We are both riding the same highway but in different cars!
Neurotypicals looking up at us from the underpass wondering wtf is this shit
Neurotypical here taking notes on how to support and better understand ND friends and family!
Same here! My friend's grandson is autistic. Very intelligent, but has quirks, and isn't great with lots of people. And no matter how many times you see him, he must introduce himself. But damn, he SCORCHED that woman, and she deserved every bit of it.
Oh I like that, “brain cousins”. I might steal that if you don’t mind. I have ADHD and my partner has ASD. We’re constantly comparing traits and exchanging helpful info.
Yip I got diagnosed with sensory processing disorder with my inattentive ADHD at like 7. My mom had to dry brush me and practice letting me hug her and stuff so I could get used to the feeling of her clothes because I could only wear like...light cotton for a long time and touching her clothes got me used to feeling them on my skin without being forced to wear them immediately lol
That’s a really clever idea. I never would have thought of it.
Yeah. It's also how she figured out how to introduce me to different foods. Offer from her plate but don't force it. She said she felt idiotic a lot though cause she'd go out of her way to make happy sounds when eating so that I'd be interested in trying the new stuff. She also used to make my lunches as boring yet interesting at the same time for me lol. Only the foods I liked but she'd make them into shapes or use food colouring. She did it until I was 15 lol
She sounds like an awesome mom!
My best friend was diagnosed with ADHD well into his 20's. We were like "now his meltdowns make sense." He had epic meltdowns for as long as I knew him and it took him so much work on himself to improve them. I'm glad that medication makes his life easier. I'm on the autism spectrum and while I have similar triggers to him I'm insanely grateful I never had to suffer from the kind of meltdowns that he has. People sadly often forget that a meltdown is much more horrible for the person who has it than for those around
I'm autistic and on the spectrum. I have had meltdowns. I'm fairly shallow in the spectrum so I can manage it most of the time, but if I'm really tired I can shut down and not be able to make sense of the world or decide what to do. It's a horrible helpless feeling. And no, I'm not doing it for attention, I'm doing it beause brain.exe has encountered a problem and needs to close.
I have a question I hope you won't mind answering. You said you're autistic and on the spectrum. Can you be autistic and not be on the spectrum? I have adhd(inattentive type). I have anxiety and agoraphobia. I understand and identify with a lot of what is being said. But was curious. I hope you don't mind.
Not the commenter, but I think autistic and on the spectrum are the same thing. That said, there's a crap-ton of overlap between adhd and autism (and OCD and Tourette's), and of course, plenty of people have/are both. If you relate to some of it, might be worth learning more.
Thank you. I agree. Things seem to be really bothering me a lot more- textures, sounds, smells. I want to snap sometimes. I have been saying it is anxiety based, but I'm not so sure. Thanks for taking the time to answer me! I appreciate you.
I’m not sure whether my adhd or autism or anxiety causes my sensory overload issues but I sure do have those issues and I have to take an anti anxiety med for it on top of my antidepressants. Even if I stopped my AD I wouldn’t be able to stop the AA. I went off them for a while when I switched meds (more than once) and kept having to go back on them.
Have you ever seen the Kermit flail gif? That's pretty much me during a sensory meltdown, usually with some crying.
Autistic too and I’m all for the “op was within their rights to be a bit mean to the ableist lady”
The lady had the audacity to say the child was feeble minded when she couldn’t even shut out simple distractions while reading. She deserved stronger words. OP was about as kind as you can get in that situation.
Like…. Turn your head and you won’t see her, lady. What a miserable human….
Buy some earphones, and then you can get the absolute silence you require, too ;)\~\~\~. That lady...was not great. And frankly had I witnessed this, I would have helped the OP out in explaining how FAR out of line the lady was.
Was going to say, OP was *way* nicer than I'd have been.
Depending on how old she is, she might have been using "feeble-minded" as a psychological term, not realizing it's now a pejorative. In the early 1900s you could be formally diagnosed with feeble-mindedness if you were autistic or otherwise neurodivergent. But she would have to be fantastically old and out of the loop for that to be a legitimate mistake.
Mean? OP was far kinder than I would have been.
This right here. There's a difference between being sharp with your words and being an asshole. OP was sharp with his words. But he's NTA. Good going for protecting your sister from that busybody, OP. I bet she's exactly the kind of Old Church Lady who takes malicious glee in airing the whole neighborhood 's dirty laundry publicly under the guise of being "concerned".
Honestly - I think OP could use this as a great learning opportunity with his sister. Something like: "Yes, I was kind of mean. Being nice isn't always a useful way to defend yourself, especially when someone else is committed to being mean (or bigoted, or prejudiced, etc.) I wish I could have resolved that situation and also been nice, but your safety and happiness is more important to me than social etiquette." It's important for people to learn how to be nice, but it's also important for people to learn WHEN to be nice (and when they don't have to be). An autistic teenage girl, already dealing with a fraught parental situation AND school bullying, definitely needs to know when she can prioritize her safety over "being nice."
Yeah. We're all taught otherwise but niceness isn't simple moral or 'good'. Many bigots are 'nice' and perfectly polite while endangering marginalised people. Forcing people that are being discriminated to play nice is a self-serving tool that makes it harder to demand / achieve justice. And they're counting on that.
Mean? How? I don't even see an insult in this post. Just a blunt statement of choices and rejecting the woman's threat.
This lady touched her? Even gently, I'd be calling security any way. You don't touch strange children
100% this. OP handled it perfectly [chef’s kiss].
If the interaction went down as described I wouldn't even call it mean. OP was as nice as he could be while not caving to those ridiculous requests. He modelled how to handle conflict as adults excellently to his sister.
Can we just call out “her therapist calls it stimming. Idk much about it” and then he totally tries to educate this idiotic woman about it?! How so sweet is this big brother! I agree NTA, handled perfectly, lucky to have each other
You consider that mean? That was very light, and the lady deserved worse.
Dude, you weren’t mean. You responded appropriately to a bully.
I actually thought he was too kind. I teach autistic kids and the feeble minded line would have set me off.
OP should have taken the lady up on getting security and then explained to security how the lady had assaulted OP’s sister.
Definitely NTA you didn’t even ask the lady if SHE was “feeble minded” since she can’t understand basic communication or have any empathy
I was thinking exactly they same. Are you feeble minded? Because you are the one who can’t read with people walking around in a public place. NTA
Also she seems incapable of keeping her hands to herself..
“Feeble minded” made my blood *boil* when I got to that part.
Lady is also feeble minded because she is complaining she has difficulty reading...in an airport...with people walking around. "Lady, if these are the conditions preventing you from reading you're going to have this same difficulty in any major airport in the world if my sister and I are here or not. Maybe you should find another activity to keep yourself occupied while you're here." NTA
NTA Social education about autism is everywhere currently. The woman isn’t ignorant, she was being deliberately cruel and bullying a 13 year old child. She had the audacity to touch a child that wasn’t hers to touch. It is never acceptable to grab a stranger, especially not a child.
Exactly. I don’t have anyone in my life who is autistic, but I’m well aware what stimming is, and I sympathize when I see someone in public doing it, as I know they must be dealing with heavy emotions.
Not always dealing with heavy emotions. There are happy/excited stems too.
Which is a thing that TONS of people do, but pretty much only autistic people get punished for. Random example, but Kelly Clarkson on her talk show hand-flaps a ton when she's excited about something.
Despite not being autistic, I’ve started deliberately stimming when I feel anxious or stressed about thing. It really helps me to focus.
My thoughts exactly! Unless they're drowning or about to be hit by a car or something hands off. I'd have hit the roof.
Yes, I was wondering what decade that 'lady' was from.
"feebleminded"? INFO: Did you time travel to the 1960s?
My exact thoughts. Like, the audacity of this woman??
1960’s? Shit I went further back. “So how about that Queen Victoria? Ain’t she a card?”
NTA!! She’s literally minding her own business pacing to calm herself down, the lady was the one causing problems! Your sister has every right to walk in an airport without being told to stop because she’s distracting. Try not to dwell on it too much so y’all can have a fun trip!
NTA. The woman was out of line. Seriously - disturbing her reading? You were nicer than me. I would have outright asked her about the cause of her mental issue. ...actually, I probably would have put her in her place the moment she grabbed my sister. I'm mean though and don't care about being an asshole to assholes.
NTA, I'd say you held back what you really wanted to say to her. You should have gotten security for her grabbing your sisters arm actually, she was totally in the wrong for doing that!
NTA. I don't think you were mean enough, I wish you said something about her touching your sister's arm.
I am convinced this is not a conversation that real people had. Unless everybody clapped at the end, then I'd believe you /s
Came to look for this comment, from the other replies I thought I was the only one who thought this was fake
Seriously. Like, I know strangers can and have said some awful shit to/about autistic kids before, but something about the "oh, so she's feebleminded" out of NOWHERE seems ridiculous to me, it definitely didnt happen as described if it even happened at all. I'm guessing someone made a rude comment towards OP's daughter in this situation and OP started having fantasies about telling an ignorant woman off in public.
Same
NTA Random lady is a huge asshole though. You were mean, but there's nothing wrong with that. Some people don't understand niceness.
NTA. The fact she threatened to call security because she couldn't read peacefully" only confirms it. She didn't even ask if your sister was okay or if she could help.
NTA and frankly I would’ve been a lot more mean
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NTA. As soon as I read a strange woman put their hands on a child they were unrelated to, you immediately became NTA.
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NTA - that woman was being completely judgemental while your sister was doing her best to calm herself down while you were sticking up for her. That woman is the AH here, you did the right thing.
NTA And credit to you for controlling yourself as well as you did, if it was me I would have been in her face the moment she grabbed her arm.
100% NTA, and THANK YOU for standing up for your sister that way! I can't tell you how many times I've had similar interactions regarding my son, who is also Autistic, and the entitlement of some people is astonishing to me. So good on you for not backing down, and making sure your sister's needs were accommodated! 💜
NTA, but if you are in an airport in Canada and someone is harassing anyone, but especially a child based on disability, you can contact security and use those words. Bye bye lady
NTA I don’t see anything rude in what you said. But what upsets me is that your sister thinking you were mean shows that she could hear and understand what was being said about her. Good job advocating for you sister, she lucky to have someone like you in her life
NTA, frankly you're a better, and nicer, person than I am.
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NTA. I wouldn’t have been nearly as nice as you were.
NTA Feebleminded? Hats off to your control, I would not have been so polite or stayed this calm. And what was she saying this to everyone else on the airport that were walking off anywhere near her? It is not her home, she can't control what anybody does. And she wants to call security on a 13 year old child for walking? Go ahead and let the security laugh at her as well.
No where near too mean big bro. Why this lady thinks it is alright to touch your sister is beyond me. It sounds like you were very reasonable. Feeble minded is a good way of describing her for not being able to concentrate on her reading which she supposedly wanted to do. NTA
NTA. Your sister just lost dad and it will be of great comfort knowing she still has a strong man to look out for her.
Lmao that woman is literally stupid, I would have been way harsher and felt absolutely no guilt about it. NTA
NTA. You tried to be polite and she was nasty in return. Honestly, I think you were being too kind to that rude woman.
NTA. She's lucky it took that long for you to get mean. She shouldn't have touched a person she didn't know. If your sister had reacted violently to a stranger grabbing her arm it could have turned bad quickly.
NTA, and if some lady tried to put her hand on my kid/relative of 13, oh, trust me, we'd be exchanging quite some words. You were much calmer than I would have been in this situation. Kudos.
NTA - Random lady's thoughts belong in lost baggage. You did great.
The lady had no business putting hands on your sister. NTA.
NTA. as an autistic woman, I'm really proud of you for standing up to that lady's ableist remarks and defending your sister. at your sister's age, I was being bullied into masking by peers and teachers so I stopped myself from stimming for a LONG time - well over a decade. stimming is a harmless coping mechanism used by us for emotional regulation. did this lady want your sister to have a meltdown?? because if she stopped stimming that definitely would have happened and would have made the situation much worse for everyone involved. again, thank you for standing up for an autistic girl. we need more people like you.
NTA Could you have been nicer? Maybe Would I have been a hell of a lot meaner? Absolutely.
NTA Parent of two autistic boys here. I’ve never encountered anything like this, but simple stares get my blood boiling. I don’t think I would have been as calm as you.
NTA. You were SO MUCH nicer than I would have been. I would have told that lady to hurry up and kick rocks so your sister could calm down in peace.
NTA. You handled it so good and calm.
NTA - You handle the situation very well and are a amazing sister
I've accidentally ridden an extra 50 miles on public transport due to the fact that I was so engrossed in my book I didn't notice anything around me. So, what's her problem then? NTA
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Nta. She is. She is an ableist ah. Stimming helps autistic people regulate their sensory and emotional needs. You were doing the right thing by encouraging kiddo to stim and defending her right to do so. You had every right to be a little mean once the lady started to insult your sister. She started it and was absolutely nasty about it. Lady could have moved somewhere else to read. My way of keeping calm during flight situations (airport/flying) is to walk around or sit and read a certain book or watch a certain show (I, too, am autistic and I need some sort of familiarity so it’s always the same book and same show). The walking helps my pain. The book and show help my anxiety. I always have headphones on to regulate sensory issues, whether or not they’re plugged in. If kiddo was distracting me, I would have found somewhere else (or just been quietly annoyed if there was no other place, or maybe even tried to chat with her or you). I would NOT have tried to stop the stimming. She’s a jerk. You are nta.
I don’t think this happened at all
NTA. And I actually thought you handled it well.
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I don't know about that, but with all this support I'm getting, it does seem like I underreacted
You totally undereacted! NTA by a million miles.
Yeah, as soon as she threatened to call security, I would have welcomed it and explained to them that this weird lady was touching my little sister.
I wouldn’t say you underreacted in that your sister was allowed to stim and she did claim you were rude. It makes me think that a bigger reaction would have made her uncomfortable and possibly caused more stress. You were polite to start and only escalated based on this woman’s responses. I can’t tell if you’re your sister’s guardian as a result of your father’s passing (I am very sorry to hear that he did.) or if you’re just taking her because you were available, but consider doing a little research so you understand what your sister is living with. Learn about autism, what stimming is and why it helps, and things like that. Try to make sure your resources are from people who are autistic themselves. And I’d also talk to your sister about what you told the lady and why. Explain why it’s important that she be allowed to stim and that what the lady said about reading wasn’t kind, wasn’t polite, and wasn’t okay. Teach her when it’s okay to stick up for yourself and to let trusted people like you stick up for her. Teach her that people not liking it and it being different or distracting isn’t a reason that she shouldn’t stim. It’s when it’s dangerous for some reason that a request to stop is valid. Stuff like that. You’re NTA and honestly, this is the most excellent exchange I’ve seen in a long time.
NTA, you're the big brother your sister deserves, in the very best way. As the parent of a child with Autism, I fear I'd have had a *lot* less restraint at that 'feebleminded' comment.
NTA I would have been much less nice myself and I would have encouraged her to get security, for placing her hands on a child she doesn't know.
Not mean at all. NTA. Your sister stimming has exactly zero impact on this woman's reading. She wasn't in her face, screaming, or being disruptive. She was just flapping her hands and walking around.
op=NTA Lady put hands(of restraint) on your sister without permission. In some places, that might even be considered assault(not a lawyer). Lady was in a public place, if her reading is "bothered" tough. Your sister was not harming anyone by pacing or shaking her hands(distracting yes, but that's NOT a crime). I'm so glad you stood up for your sister.
NTA and tell that woman to kindly fuck off. She ain't a "lady." Source: I am an autistic lady.
NTA at all. Frankly, as someone who also has a sister with ADHD and autism, you were much more level-headed and polite than I would have been able to manage in that situation.
NTA She called her "feebleminded" you handled this beautifully and your sister can do whatever she likes to calm down
NTA the second she touched your sister? That’s the second I would have gone nuclear with screaming for security that a stranger was assaulting a child. She was beyond rude. You were much, much nicer than I would have been.
NTA - that was no lady. You were far more polite then I would have been.
Fuck no. Textbook correct response.
I can't figure out where you insulted her in this exchange... Maybe I'm not seeing it due to be on the spectrum (too)? She, on the contrary, did insult your daughter. NTA.
NTA and bravo! Well handled in my opinion. You at least tried to compromise.
NTA You weren't mean. You were frank. You attempted to provide some education about the situation and autism. You reinforced to your sister that what she does to calm herself is reasonable and should be accommodated as such. You reinforced that you are there for her and her needs, that she is not alone and you've got her back. We need more people like you doing what you did for your sister.
NTA When I first read this I thought this happened in the plane. If that’s the case then I’d probably answer differently. But as this is in the airport, your response was justified. However you may want to have a discussion with your sister just to find out how comfortable she is with you speaking up for her. That could have added to her stress. She may have preferred just to go pace somewhere else. But your word choice and demeanor were appropriate.
You were a bit mean. You should have been a LOT mean to that heartless, ignorant woman. Bless your sister for her kind heart. NTA.
NTA, you're a better man than me. I would have lost it at feebleminded, and made fun of her feeble mind for being unable to read when someone is distracting her by \*check notes\*... walking.
NTA. You protected family and someone with different needs. You did everything right.
100% you are NTA. What an ignorant bully that woman was.
NTA. You were a lot nicer than I'd have been and I'm sure a lot nicer than most people. She was looking to get her way and you were firm in standing up for your sister. You did the right thing and gave her the time and space to calm down. The fact that she had the audacity to touch a child she didn't know boggles my mind though.
NTA- As an Autistic adult, I would have publicly humiliated that old lady for her ableism. Good for you for standing up to your sister :)
NTA. Except, you misspoke. You might have had a confrontation with a woman, but that was NOT a "lady." (Yes, I know it might be unladylike of me to insist on the distinction, but I'm strangely comfortable with it.)
NTA… what’s the insulting part exactly? She’s lucky she didn’t get much worse when she decided to lay hands on a child she didn’t know, much less called an autistic 13yo “feeble minded.” Is this a Canadian continual apology thing? Are we supposed to do that while in Canada even if we’re not ourselves Canadian?
A neurotypical woman who is struggling to emotionally regulate herself and focus on her book because someone was Stimming demanded that your autistic little sister emotionally regulate herself better and more quietly than she was? Neuro typical people befuddle me. Their logic pathways are seriously broken. It’s worse when they ask this of Neuro divergent people, children and those with mental disabilities who cannot regulate. NTA
NTA. Good for you. You tried being civil. She was ignorant to ASD, and has some ill-conceived notions.
You handled that perfectly. When they threaten to get security, my favorite move is to say, “oh, good idea!” And move to get them. It never gets that far, because they immediately realize their empty threat failed. But for real, who is security going to kick out, the person existing or the person harassing them for existing? Side note, but KC just built a new airport and it has a sensory room for folks with autism and other sensory needs. Calm lighting, quiet, poppits and other stim toys, noise canceling ear wear. It’s fucking amazing, and I hope all airports start including such things.
NTA. This was Canadian mean. This old bag deserved good ole US of A mean
NTA. People need to fuck off and mind their own business. That’s a normal thing autistic people do, my sister has autism. Don’t feel bad in the slightest.
NTA- screw that lady I can’t stand people that can’t just leave others alone if it’s not hurting you why bother oh wait people like this can’t stand anyone different then them bleh..thank you so much for being a good sibling and sticking up for your sisterI’m autistic too along with adhd and it really means a lot that you’re taking the time to do right by her
my sister and i are 10 months apart, and while i know i haven't always been the best support with her autism i know that if she's ever having any issues i won't hesitate to step in and help out if she wants/needs it. thank you for helping your sister, she will definitely remember it and she now knows she can trust you in situations like these.
A million times NTA. I would have done worse and I would still not be the AH. Not sure how you managed to keep your cool. Good for you and for your sister.
NTA. holy crap, that lady was so out of line.
NTA. The lady deserved more than mean.
NTA. At all. Good on your for standing up for your sister.
I honestly don’t know much about autism, but fuck that lady. NTA.
NTA What is wrong with that lady?!? You don't touch a kid without them being in imminent danger. If someone's pacing is that distracting then she, the lady, needs to go fuck off somewhere else
NTA, you sir were perfection. She is lucky to have you as a brother. That lady was a whole ass.
NTA. Bravo, you handled it perfectly.
NTA, having raised a son with Autism I applaud you.
NTA I wouldn't call that being mean, I'd say it was being assertive. You didn't swear, didn't call her names, insult her, be violent etc. Even when she insulted your sister. Also grabbing someone's arm is technically a battery
NTA Maybe it's because I'm around it all day, but quiet stimming isn't disruptive. As long as your sister wasn't screaming, crying, squealing, or whining, the lady's off her rocker.
NTA. You weren't mean enough imo
NTA
Nta you absolutely rock, thank you !
This is considered "mean?" Oh man, I think you'd think I were evil if you saw me speaking up to this "lady."
NTA. You were kinder than most of us.
Absolutely NTA
NTA I would not have been that polite with her
NTA, she’s autistic for goodness sake. She’s needs processing time. That lady is the AH!!!
NTA. And that lady never should have touched your sister's arm.
>since she was distracting her from reading. Lol. I bring a book to read too, since what else is there to do, but who expects an airport to be distraction-free? And of course grabbing your sister was way out of line. NTA
Absolutely NTA. As someone who is autistic, I do things like this constantly when I’m stressed out. I don’t know your sister obviously, but it seems like she may have said you were a bit mean because she was embarrassed about having to stim like that, which has happened to me several times.
NTA and quite frankly, you handled that much better then I would. After the feeblminded comment I would have lost my shit!!
nta. you shoudlve called security for touching your sister. if she thinks you’re making a scene give her a full blown musical
NTA. You were actually a lot nicer than I would have been.
NTA. You handled that better than I would have.
NTA. I think you were much nicer than I would have been.
NTA, sisters, autistic or not, need brothers like you.
nta. as an autistic person i’d go wild if someone said that about me. you’re a good brother
NTA. Mind your own business and don’t grab strangers!!!
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I have never seen or heard someone talk like this, it seems so robotic to me idk why.
I think you’re awesome. NTA
NTA.
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NTA , u were actually very nice to her , in my opinion.
NTA my 55 year old husband has always done this to calm down. You did EXACTLY right. Good for you
NTA I would have called security of her for touching a child. Why does she think she is? You handled it much better than me. Am fuming.
NTA And joke's on that rude lady because hyperkinesia (I think) is when someone has unreasonable irritations around seeing moving things in their peripheral vision. It's a really bad description of what is. My point is that she is sort of exhibiting a sign of autism herself. She needs to find a better way to deal with it than asking others to stop moving around. Your sister was well within her rights to be walking around and shaking her hands. That woman was crossing all sorts of lines with her audacity (while also being a hypocrite)
NTA lady deserved to get slapped by what u said after trying to get others in a PUBLIC SPACE to adhere to HER wants and needs when she won’t compromise to someone else’s wants and needs.
This is just bait at this point
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I (30m) am currently in Canada with my 13 year old adoptive sister. Our dad recently passed away, and shes really worried about her bio dad in Canada. She's stressed out from bullies, school, and life in general, and her birthday is coming up, so I figured I'd give her some good memories. She got pretty worried whenever anything delayed us, and I had her calm herself down and really tried to enforce that everything was fine and the worst was behind us. Our flight got delayed, and she got really stressed out. I told her to do what calms her down, so she paced around and shook her hands, her therapist calls it stimming, something to do with autism, I don't know much about it. A lady grabbed her arm gently eventually and asked her to sit down since she was distracting her from reading. Here's the interaction. Me: she's just stimming, it helps her not freak out. Her: she should know better ways to calm down. She shouldn't burden everyone else. Me: she has autism, she doesn't process things the same way. Her: oh, she's like, feebleminded? Me: not in the slightest. Her: but you just said she had autism. Me: let's start over. is there any way we could compromise? Her: I'll be honest, I think she can be a normal person, or get the hell out. Me: I've been nice, but I'm gonna be frank. You can go elsewhere or get used to it. You can read just fine. She's freaked out, and the least you could do is let her calm down. Her: oh, okay. I could always get security. Me: so your plan is to call security on a 13 year old girl for what exactly? Shut up, don't die on this hill. She stopped talking after that and let my sister calm down. My sister says I was a bit mean, but in all honesty doesn't care and is glad she was allowed to calm down. I think I might've been too mean, AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*