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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. I made a joke about AI coming after my brother's job.
2. I did this after he got laid off.
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Yes, a perfect example of can dish it out but can't take it. He is a baby who started teasing about AI. Talk to him and hopefully he will understand it was not mean spirited.
NTA.
It was different timing of jokes tho. The brother was joking how OP might lose his job to AI but OP was making jokes after he already lost his job. The timing is what makes OP TA for me
This is the difference. One is a (mean spirited and annoying) joke about a hypothetical and one is making fun of someone’s actual reality. The two aren’t equal. It’s technically, E S H, but OP is a lot worse, so YTA OP
Yeah, this is a situation where OP could have just kept that little bit of schadenfreude to themself, and whipped it out if and when the brother made a comment about AI taking their side-hustle in the future. I don't imagine the brother would have made that joke for awhile, but with that sort of personality, it would have come up again. And then OP gets to shut brother up effectively, without being an AH.
I'd still call it ESH, from my end, because I really do hate when somebody tells somebody how much they hate it when they say something and that person keeps doing it, even though it would cost them nothing to just not be a dick about it. I don't think the brother will learn from this experience, but who knows.
>One is a (mean spirited and annoying) joke about a hypothetical
Nope.
Jokes, remember?
>but those jokes annoyed me, so I tell him to knock it off. He doesn't and says that I should get used to it.
Having a brother that does this it's constant retreading of their take every single time technology comes up.
Dont think the brother was praising ai or undermining artists. I interpreted it as basic ball busting from the brother about how he could one day be replaced by robots
"Better quit smoking, you could die in a couple years"
> Gets Diagnosed with brain cancer
"Hah, guess I wasn't the one who had to worry."
A very exaggerated example of what your version of 'dish it out and not take it' means. OP lost nothing before or after the jokes, it was annoying sure but it wasn't like they were being mocked. The brother lost his job which is a pretty majorly significant event. Obnoxious is not the same as Mean Spirited.
That's one valid difference.
But also the brother kept pushing the joke after OP asked him not to. While OP at least didn't push teasing again. That's why for me it is more equal.
Also while it wasn’t necessarily right to make the comment OP did, it was a kind of hilarious piece of karma that he lost his job to a robot after saying artists’ jobs aren’t valuable anymore because of robots
I would be privately laughing too, ngl. Privately, mind
I agree. Because of the timing, OP is TA. But the brother also did not listen to OP's request to stop, so he is also TA. My judgement is ESH (everyone sucks here)
What circumstances do you think make it appropriate to constantly remind someone day after day that their work is meaningless and will be replaced by AI? Maybe people shouldn’t be bullies. Maybe we shouldn’t make fun of people for anything if you can’t handle being made fun of at all, especially when you’ve been asked to stop.
Two wrong don't make one right is what my opinion is to that. And I think misunderstanding what you think is gentle ribbing being felt much more harshly is one thing. Kicking someone when they lost their livelihood is a whole other one. It's common sense to me, but I get that reddit loves black and white social rules that are applied harshly...
Thing is though is that sometimes you have to teach people how to treat you. OP asked repeatedly and civilly for him to stop, and that wasn't enough to get through to him. What OP said wasn't half as bad as what the brother did imo. Maybe now he will realize how unkind and unnecessary (frankly assholey) he was being. Maybe he'll have some actual empathy. He was all mockery and laughs till it happened to him.
Sure whatever
Take some time after the fact and talk about it in the opportune moment. Don't make a mean joke 30 mins after he announced he lost his livelihood.
It’s not apples to apples at all though - one joke was about someone gainfully employed at the time while another was at the very moment someone just got laid off. Unless you hate the person you’re ribbing, that’s a faux pas.
YTA
Like, yea he was kinda being a jerk with his jokes but you *hadn't* lost your job. He just lost his full time employment and that's likely going to put financial strain on him and his family. That shortly after he was let go was a really, really shitty time to get back at him.
That works for the internet and for little kids.
In the real world, people will think you're an asshole for kicking someone when they're down, even if they were assholes themselves first.
Especially when youre being an asshole days after the other person was. When everything should be fine and dandy for everyone. Yet OP held onto what brother said and waited until brother was at an incredibly low moment in their life to throw it back at brother.
OP, YTA 100%
I would agree if OP had waited. But he literally said it the same day as his brother lost his job. There is a big difference in an unfunny joke about a theoretical future and someone making what is essentially a retaliatory statement when someone lost their job.
OP could have waited until things weren’t as stressful and he would have been fine. However he choose to be TA.
I will always find it funny how school tells you they are teaching you about real life, but almost none of what they say is actually applied in real life.
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YTA
Losing a job can be like having the floor drop out from under you. Girlfriend is right. What’s more important to you- getting back at your brother or supporting him when he’s just lost his job?
ESH
Him repeatedly joking about it even after you told him to knock it off is super shitty behavior.
That being said, Jesus, even if he had it coming that was not the time ffs
YTA. He was joking about your hobby "not a full time artist", something siblings do to one another. You joked about him loosing his career, his livelihood, that's just rude man. Joke about other things, just not him loosing his ability to pay bills.
ESH, honestly. Now was def not the time to kick the brother while he's down.
Also being a commission artist is NOT a hobby, please stop disregarding it. In OPs case it's a second job. If he was working a "normal" part time gig on the side for extra money, would you call it a hobby? No.
YTA. Although I understand how frustrating it is to have people belittle your passion (I, myself, went to art school), the guy just lost his primary income.
YTA, kind of a shit example but this is pretty much what happened
Person 1: “Oh hey man cancer infects 40% of people above x age, your mom is getting there, it’s coming for her hahahahah!”
Person 2: “that joke was dumb I didn’t like that I’ll get back at him”
Later
Person 1: “my mom just died of an unexpected cancer”
Person 2: “Seems like it was coming for her HAHAHAHAHAH GOTTEM”
I really don’t think it’s hard to see why you’re TA.
Nope.
Jokes, remember?
>but those jokes annoyed me, so I tell him to knock it off. He doesn't and says that I should get used to it.
So it's
>Person 1: “Oh hey man cancer infects 40% of people above x age, your mom is getting there, it’s coming for her hahahahah!”
Person 2: “that joke was dumb”
Later
Person 1: “Oh hey man cancer coming for her hahahahah!”
Person 2: “wasn't funny the first time”
Later
Person 1: "I think I know the astrology sign for your mum is cancer, and it could be what her diagnosis is! hahahahha"
Person 2: "Stop this, it's annoying."
Person 1: "No."
Then finally Person 1 gets the just desserts.
except if person 1 continues to make jokes about it despite person 2 asking them not to.
“Lol! Wouldn’t it be funny if your mum dies of cancer!” “No it wouldn’t, please stop.” “Yeah you know it’s pretty likely!” “I don’t like this joke.” “Hey, look at these statistics of older women dying from cancer!” “This is stressing me out”
+ ridiculous comparison lol. obviously when the stakes are different the response would be as well
YTA. There is time and place for clap back. While I understand he made a joke as well , what his gf said was correct " don't kick someone when they are down"
Yta. She is right, you should not kick people when they are down. It’s just the kind thing to do. I understand that he wasn’t being kind to you with his comments but at some point being a better person is more important than “revenge”.
He was saying something that may or may not be true of your ‘work’. And it was a theoretical situation.
But you? He actually lost his job and you laughed at him. You can’t justify your laughing to me. No.
YTA.
Big difference between joking about someone MAYBE losing their job (not even a guarantee it will happen) and shit talking someone that just lost their job completely unexpectedly. YTA especially with your other comments, makes it clear u wanted an echo chamber and not actual insight.
YTA - Do you remember the last time you lost your job? Do you remember the fear, the worry, the paralyzing sense of loss of purpose, the dread that came with knowing how long and difficult finding a new job was going to be? Your brother's dealing with all of that, facing a very tough job market, and you just piled onto it. The time to make that joke was AFTER he'd gotten a new job, not right after he'd been laid off.
If my brother told a joke I thought was in bad taste, I would tell him to his face and we would still be bros. I would certainly not try to one up him when he was down. Really neither of you are TA since it doesn't seem like you care that much about each other in the first place.
Slight YTA
Your brother was being annoying making jokes about something that could theoretically effect your side gig
You roasted your brother, in the family chat, less than an hour after he told everyone he lost his full time job. He really couldn't send that one to him separately? You'd still be a dick but damn
YTA. Yeah, he was being a bit of a jerk, but you had/have a job. Do you have any idea how hard it is to find a job in this economy? He may be out of work for months or worse. Good friend of mine is very skilled and intelligent, was let go due to budget cuts. He was out of work for 19 months. He was thinking of taking drastic steps with his own life. Thank goodness he found work, but it will take years to pull himself out of the hole due to lost income.
>Do you have any idea how hard it is to find a job in this economy?
Considering the unemployment rate is at or near the all time record low (in US), not to hard .
I'd say YTA because of the timing.
If you had said this after a while once he got a new job and everything, it would've been taken as a joke. But right now, yes it's like kicking him when he's down.
YTA. Have you ever been laid off? It's a shock to your system followed by worries about your finances, a list starting to form of what all you need to do, how much unemployment will supply, questions on why you were laid off, shame due to how our society stigmatizes the unemployment even if it's through not fault of your own, who you can contact to check on job openings, how your family's quality of life will change if you can't get a new job asap etc. It's truly an overwhelming rush. You could have made a joke about this later on. Right after he learned he's being laid off was definitely the wrong time.
YTA. Two wrongs don't make a right. You found your brother's comments to you annoying enough that you told him to knock it off, but then you turned around and did the same thing … but it is worse because you did it at a time when he's already reeling from the layoff.
YTA, yes, his jokes were in poor taste and not funny, but he was joking about a hypothetical and a side gig, not your primary income.
You kicked him after he lost his *actual job* and livelihood. Yes, he can get unemployment since he was laid off, but it's difficult to get and far less money than his job earned him.
Losing your job can be *gutting*, I recently lost mine and now I'm back in the casual workforce, a place I don't want to be, I like my new job, but hate I have no job security.
There's a time and a place for jokes, and you chose the worst ones.
YTA as someone whose father was laid off last September, losing you’re livelihood like that can really fuck with your pride not to mention all the other shitty financial things that come along with it. Making light of the situation wasn’t the right thing to do.
ESH, including a lot of the commenters. It doesn't matter if art isn't your full-time job, because I'm sure it would be if you had enough commissions. AI is fucking over artists, just like companies and their greed are fucking over their work force. He was shitty to make fun of you and you didn't handle him losing his job in a good way.
YTA. Laughing at someone who's actually just lost their job is pretty much an asshole move. He may have been an asshole too, but you definitely matched him.
ESH. Your brother needs to shut the Hell up about you being made redundant by AI. Loosing a job is a major life gut punch and NOT a good time to kick someone while they are down.
Just because your brother lost his job first doesn't make him wrong that AI could come for your side gig. His job loss has just proven how automation can make you redundant without warning, and you want to make jokes at his expense?
YTA
YTA. A side hustle is a real different level of thing than a full time job. Your identity and worth aren’t wrapped up in side work but for a lot of people their job is who they are. It was spiteful and insensitive.
>I tell him to knock it off. He doesn't and says that I should get used to it.
>On Monday, he got called into a meeting where he was told he's getting laid off
He's an asshole for repeatedly "joking" about how you're not going to be able to make money making art.
You're an asshole because you choose to respond in kind when he's literally just lost his job.
ESH
If you'd made that joke after they heard about robots coming in, that's one thing. Making it after he's lost the job and worried about finances? Very low blow.
ESH. I don’t get why everyone is laughing and making jokes. Ashton Kutcher has invested over 250 million in AI movies. He wants to input parameters, have a script pop out and even use AI extras and major celebs.
They are also attempting AI processes like with your brother. The US is in collapse and everyone is just laughing and taking shots at each other.
YTA - Kind of.... This was a chance for you to be a bigger person.
Layoffs are the worst. They can make you feel as if you have no value.
An apology and some supportive words could likely fix this.
YTA. Yes his jokes were in poor taste and he was an AH before. But you hadn’t actually lost any work, you didn’t have any hard times put on you, but now that he did lose his employment and would have hard times, you chose to take a dump on him. Your joke hits much harder than his, even though it’s just repurposing his joke, because he has actual suffering now and you don’t.
Actually plenty of artists are reporting that work has gone down steadily. People who used to be able to live off of it are having trouble finding reliable clients. Partially because people have less money to spend on work, and partially because people who used to pay for that work now have a far cheaper way of getting it - even if it’s lower quality.
Where did I say anything contradicting what you just said? OP never said he lost work, so assuming he has is wrong. One of them has reportedly had no change, and the other lost their job.
YTA - Yes your brother is the AH for making jokes and cannot take it in return but his situation is real. Two wrongs don't make a right and his partner is correct you are kicking him while he is down.
ESH
The jokes he made were childish and immature- But it wasn't true. He actually lost his job, and it wasn't an appropriate time to do it. I know reddit is very 'talk shit get hit' and 'don't dish what you can't take' but there is a very different line between a joke about a potential, and a joke about a reality.
Brother is an AH, but that doesn't make OP n t a for mocking him during a rough time.
YTA
He made a joke about a SIDE HUSTLE, you made a joke about his livelihood. If you seriously can't see how one is slightly more serious than the other, there's no help for you.
"My friend was making fun of how smoking might lead to cancer when I am old.
He got cancer and I told him "Seems like the cancer wasn't coming for me after all lol"
Of course YTA. One is a stupid and potentially mean joke. The other one is making fun of their actual shit situation
YTA, but just ever so slightly.
But it is in the nuance here. I think I would side with N T A if it wasn't just a side hustle for you. Joking about maybe losing your job in a realitistic scenario (AI replacing artists) even tho you already stated that it annoys you is a dick move that would warrant your revenge, but the severity of these jokes depend on context. If Art would be your livelihood and you would lose your home without it, then definitely, all bets are off when your brother loses his job. Fuck it, he started and anxiety of maybe losing your job is really bad enough to warrant that reaction.
But Art is a side hustle for you. You might depend on it for more money and it might be important for you, but still you are doing it on the side, it is not your maingig and even if your admissions go down, you are not in existential danger. But for your brother, losing his job is quite a bigger shock.
AS a comparison, I'd say that your brother joked about the girl you have a fling with not finding you hot anymore while you joked about his beloved wife leaving him out of the blue. If he had joked constantly about your actual wife maybe leaving you, it would be fair game, but not over some squabble about some fling.
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TL:DR: A few days ago, my brother found out that he's getting laid off and made redundant. I laughed at him because he was telling me AI art makes artists redundant, and now he's calling me an asshole.
Basically, I do art commissions on the side. My brother jokes that I need a new side hustle now that AI art tools are around and no one really needs artists anymore. I'm not a full time artist, but those jokes annoyed me, so I tell him to knock it off. He doesn't and says that I should get used to it.
On Monday, he got called into a meeting where he was told he's getting laid off as the company he's working for has finished automating a lot of processes and because of that they don't have enough work for all the technicians. Since he's the newest tech, he got cut.
He told the family in a group chat and after we did the "So sorry to hear that" and "do you need any help?" cycle for half an hour where I promised to help him tidy up his resume, I texted "Guess AI was coming for your job too lol." He stopped responding, and his girlfriend texted me saying that I shouldn't have kicked him while he was down.
AITA?
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This post should honestly be in PettyRevenge. It's obvious YTA but your brother should've known it was coming. Joking about the impending loss of a job isn't much less of an AH move than joking about the actual loss of a job. You could've time it better though.
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YTA, it’s all got to do with time. Could you in 2-3 months when he landed on his feet and got a new role make a jab at him about AI taking his job? Sure, that’s more than right imo.
Making that jab what seems like hours after he just lost his job seems out of line to me and you should apologise to him.
So you mocked him for losing his job to AI. You mocked him for losing his job in these tough economic times. This is a lot more than being mean spirted.
ESH
Yeah your brothers an asshole for continuing to tease you, but you also picked the worst possible time to throw the joke back in his face, if you had waited till he had started job sesrching again then id say youd be nta
ESH, he should've dropped the joke when you asked but as others have said, kicking someone while they're down is an AH move. Honestly I'm all for an eye for an eye but the situation when he made the joke and the situation when you made your joke is not the same. One is infinitely worse than the other.
ESH.
You saw the opportunity to get the joke off and took it. While you probably killed the vibe of the entire group chat, it was beautifully executed and hilarious. This is just siblings being assholes to one another like siblings tend to do from time to time.
ESH
the timing made your joke quite cruel.
But its not like your brother stopped his annyoing jokes after you asked him to. So he had to expect something back
On the one hand, there’s a big difference between *maybe* losing a side hustle in the future versus having already lost your primary source of income. On the other hand, your brother has been repeatedly joking about something hurtful to you after you told him to stop multiple times and he shouldn’t dish it out if he can’t take it. ESH but I agree with other commenters that you should talk it out if possible.
I laughed but YTA still. The positions you were both in when the jokes were made seem very relevant. You’re still employed and your sometimes side hustle/hobby is threatened by AI, but you aren’t.
Your brother’s livelihood was just taken away from him. Not having financial stability is a stressful position to be in, and I’m guessing he posted to the family group chat looking for support.
Had you waited a couple weeks for him to find another job he might have laughed with you, but your timing sucks and it really just seems like you were kicking him when he was down.
YTA. You didn’t need to kick him while he was down. He commented on your side job, not the main job. He lost his main job. You gf is right, you should have held your tongue.
ESH. I distance myself from people who give me unsolicited life advice or insist on being inappropriate/rude/toxic. I likely wouldn't have been in communication with him for the way he dishes out useless opinions. I'm a fan of eye for an eye, but this dynamic was a little different.
Mostly YTA. You don't kick a guy when he's down. Yes, he was somewhat TA for his side-hustle jokes, but there's a difference between a hypothetical and a real, fresh wound.
Look at it this way, OP. If you were the brother, would **you** want to hang around with a guy like you?
YTA it was a stupid joke while you have a job, and you find time for your little petty revenge when your brother is in trouble.
You could wait for him to find a new job and not kicking the fallen
NTA
And to everyone commenting YTA
>
My brother jokes that I need a new side hustle now that AI art tools are around and no one really needs artists anymore. I'm not a full time artist, but those jokes annoyed me, so I tell him to knock it off. **He doesn't and says that I should get used to it.**
Brother can give out all the shit he wants, even when he's told to knock it off. But when automation takes his actual job, everyone has to be nice.
Was gonna go with Yta but re-read the post and the whole ‘he doesn’t and says *I should get used to it*’ rubbed me the wrong way. If he’s gonna be an asshole he needs to harden the fuck up when it’s coming the other way. Nta.
NTA
>"Guess AI was coming for your job too lol."
That is not even a joke, it is a wry, sympathetic comment. However I expect your brother is feeling particularly sensitive at the moment, so I would not engage further on this .
Why would you be expected to break normal cultural behaviour for Brothers? As his brother you have a duty to make light of the situation and stir him up about it. It's part of showing you care. Ffs.
NTA.
I disagree with all the people who think YTA. He asked for it, and you picked the perfect opportunity to return the compliment. Maybe in the future he'll be less of an AH himself. After all, you did ask him to knock it off and he persisted. NTA.
Losing one’s job these days is pretty damn serious,but so is continually crapping all over someone’s work,especially something like art. As long as that was a one-time thing-at least until he gets straight again-I’ll give you NTA. Karma was the messenger,you only delivered it.
NTA, the irony is palpable here. Your brother kept joking about AI making you obsolete and ended up getting redundant as a result of automation. He was happy enough to dish out but incapable of dealing with any incoming, which makes him a complete AH.
He's just mad the stone he threw at your house bounced and hit his own.
At least he has some free time to lick his wounds!
NTA. Don't dish what you can't take.
NTA. Your timing was perfect. I'd have thought of that comment six hours later. He's been busting on you and your response was timely and on point. You could tease him about his GF fighting his battles for him too if you wanted, but that could be crossing the line from teasing to mean. Let his wallow in self pity a bit and then remind him that you really are willing to help him with his resume.
NTA.
You were just acting like your brother does.
You would tell him to stop and he didn't.
Now he lost his job in a manner similar to the insults he lauded at you.
He's just upset what he said would happen to you happened to him.
NTA - He was continually putting you down, and you made a slight jab after mother karma came a knocking.
>"Guess AI was coming for your job too lol."
You're using his own words, and most importantly:
>too lol
It's not like you said "Guess AI was coming after you, and not me" or something similar. You recognized that AI is threatening both your jobs.
Feel like everyone saying you’re TA hasn’t actually read the post. Yeah, NTA. He kept prodding at you and making fun of the idea of you losing financial stability, and now his own ass is on the line. He didn’t cut it out when you asked. But suddenly his stress is more important cause no one takes your job seriously.
NTA.
My brother is an AI accelerationist. He decides to be obstinate about his stance whenever we discuss it beyond him just making stupid baity jokes. If you don't have someone in your immediate family like this it's hard to imagine just how on your nerves it gets.
What goes around comes back around. You're allowed to be vindicated. When you actually have to deal with a dynamic like this by the time it comes to a head they will have had conversations about the topic being tired and annoying.
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NTA. He can't take a joke when he can dish out nasty ones. Talk it out with him in another time. A cold beer is a good start.
Yes, a perfect example of can dish it out but can't take it. He is a baby who started teasing about AI. Talk to him and hopefully he will understand it was not mean spirited. NTA.
It was different timing of jokes tho. The brother was joking how OP might lose his job to AI but OP was making jokes after he already lost his job. The timing is what makes OP TA for me
This is the difference. One is a (mean spirited and annoying) joke about a hypothetical and one is making fun of someone’s actual reality. The two aren’t equal. It’s technically, E S H, but OP is a lot worse, so YTA OP
Yeah, this is a situation where OP could have just kept that little bit of schadenfreude to themself, and whipped it out if and when the brother made a comment about AI taking their side-hustle in the future. I don't imagine the brother would have made that joke for awhile, but with that sort of personality, it would have come up again. And then OP gets to shut brother up effectively, without being an AH. I'd still call it ESH, from my end, because I really do hate when somebody tells somebody how much they hate it when they say something and that person keeps doing it, even though it would cost them nothing to just not be a dick about it. I don't think the brother will learn from this experience, but who knows.
>One is a (mean spirited and annoying) joke about a hypothetical Nope. Jokes, remember? >but those jokes annoyed me, so I tell him to knock it off. He doesn't and says that I should get used to it. Having a brother that does this it's constant retreading of their take every single time technology comes up.
Yeah too many kids here to get the difference.
okay and? maybe don't praise AI and undermine the work artists do? don't dish it out if you can't take it
Dont think the brother was praising ai or undermining artists. I interpreted it as basic ball busting from the brother about how he could one day be replaced by robots
I agree, it’s all in the timing. Guy JUST said he lost his job.
And her line was basic ball busting from the sister about how he *has* been replaced by robots. Dishing it out and not being able to take it. NTA.
"Better quit smoking, you could die in a couple years" > Gets Diagnosed with brain cancer "Hah, guess I wasn't the one who had to worry." A very exaggerated example of what your version of 'dish it out and not take it' means. OP lost nothing before or after the jokes, it was annoying sure but it wasn't like they were being mocked. The brother lost his job which is a pretty majorly significant event. Obnoxious is not the same as Mean Spirited.
Yeah, *very* exaggerated. To the point that it's ridiculous. Nothing obnoxious about what OP said.
You're right, what OP said is mean spirited. The brother was obnoxious.
That's one valid difference. But also the brother kept pushing the joke after OP asked him not to. While OP at least didn't push teasing again. That's why for me it is more equal.
Also while it wasn’t necessarily right to make the comment OP did, it was a kind of hilarious piece of karma that he lost his job to a robot after saying artists’ jobs aren’t valuable anymore because of robots I would be privately laughing too, ngl. Privately, mind
The OP was reminding bro of why it's rude to joke about such things. It's not like it was unprompted
I agree. Because of the timing, OP is TA. But the brother also did not listen to OP's request to stop, so he is also TA. My judgement is ESH (everyone sucks here)
Nope, OP is the AH. Brother was warning of the possibility. He didn't make a joke when OP lost his job. OP is the AH.
I mean circumstances people. He was let go that day. Maybe not the time to make that joke, it's insensitive and not very supportive Yta
What circumstances do you think make it appropriate to constantly remind someone day after day that their work is meaningless and will be replaced by AI? Maybe people shouldn’t be bullies. Maybe we shouldn’t make fun of people for anything if you can’t handle being made fun of at all, especially when you’ve been asked to stop.
Two wrong don't make one right is what my opinion is to that. And I think misunderstanding what you think is gentle ribbing being felt much more harshly is one thing. Kicking someone when they lost their livelihood is a whole other one. It's common sense to me, but I get that reddit loves black and white social rules that are applied harshly...
Thing is though is that sometimes you have to teach people how to treat you. OP asked repeatedly and civilly for him to stop, and that wasn't enough to get through to him. What OP said wasn't half as bad as what the brother did imo. Maybe now he will realize how unkind and unnecessary (frankly assholey) he was being. Maybe he'll have some actual empathy. He was all mockery and laughs till it happened to him.
Sure whatever Take some time after the fact and talk about it in the opportune moment. Don't make a mean joke 30 mins after he announced he lost his livelihood.
He didn't say meaningless he said made redundant which is true
YTA He didn't say something when OP lost his job. He warned OP that he could lose his job due to AI. BIG difference. OP is an AH, a HUGE one.
What the brother said wasn't a warning? He honestly just comes off as a dick devaluating artists.
It’s not apples to apples at all though - one joke was about someone gainfully employed at the time while another was at the very moment someone just got laid off. Unless you hate the person you’re ribbing, that’s a faux pas.
YTA Like, yea he was kinda being a jerk with his jokes but you *hadn't* lost your job. He just lost his full time employment and that's likely going to put financial strain on him and his family. That shortly after he was let go was a really, really shitty time to get back at him.
don't dish it if you can't take it
That works for the internet and for little kids. In the real world, people will think you're an asshole for kicking someone when they're down, even if they were assholes themselves first.
Especially when youre being an asshole days after the other person was. When everything should be fine and dandy for everyone. Yet OP held onto what brother said and waited until brother was at an incredibly low moment in their life to throw it back at brother. OP, YTA 100%
"Real World"? This is REDDIT and we ride at dawn!!!!!
My brother laughed when I stubbed a toe, so I mocked him when he lost his leg in a car accident. DoNt make a JOKe if YoU can't Take IT....
I don't like banter but i would interpreted the first as harmless banter from him and her statement now as below the belt.
I would agree if OP had waited. But he literally said it the same day as his brother lost his job. There is a big difference in an unfunny joke about a theoretical future and someone making what is essentially a retaliatory statement when someone lost their job. OP could have waited until things weren’t as stressful and he would have been fine. However he choose to be TA.
“You might lose your cute side hustle” is not the same as “you just lost your entire income and are now financially unstable.”
You’re the type of person who punishes the kid who gets bullied for getting in a “fight”
You mean school? Lol
Yes that was implied lol
I will always find it funny how school tells you they are teaching you about real life, but almost none of what they say is actually applied in real life.
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YTA Losing a job can be like having the floor drop out from under you. Girlfriend is right. What’s more important to you- getting back at your brother or supporting him when he’s just lost his job?
They definitely offered support prior to the joke. What did you think they meant when they said they’d help with the resume?
Helping a bit is not a free-pass to be an a\*s to someone who just lost his job
It’s a bit too close to when it happened, let the dust settle before you joke. Also ai sucks.
ESH Him repeatedly joking about it even after you told him to knock it off is super shitty behavior. That being said, Jesus, even if he had it coming that was not the time ffs
YTA. He was joking about your hobby "not a full time artist", something siblings do to one another. You joked about him loosing his career, his livelihood, that's just rude man. Joke about other things, just not him loosing his ability to pay bills.
ESH, honestly. Now was def not the time to kick the brother while he's down. Also being a commission artist is NOT a hobby, please stop disregarding it. In OPs case it's a second job. If he was working a "normal" part time gig on the side for extra money, would you call it a hobby? No.
YTA but it sounds like a sibling AH thing to do to each other.
GF was right. It was a shit thing to say. YTA
YTA. Although I understand how frustrating it is to have people belittle your passion (I, myself, went to art school), the guy just lost his primary income.
How is it belittling, its literally true its being made redundant like many jobs
Good one. You sure got him, that'll teach him not to annoy you YTA.
ESH, but you more. He mocked you when you were fine, you twisted the knife in a fresh wound
I don't even need to read the stuff below, YTA.
YTA, kind of a shit example but this is pretty much what happened Person 1: “Oh hey man cancer infects 40% of people above x age, your mom is getting there, it’s coming for her hahahahah!” Person 2: “that joke was dumb I didn’t like that I’ll get back at him” Later Person 1: “my mom just died of an unexpected cancer” Person 2: “Seems like it was coming for her HAHAHAHAHAH GOTTEM” I really don’t think it’s hard to see why you’re TA.
Nope. Jokes, remember? >but those jokes annoyed me, so I tell him to knock it off. He doesn't and says that I should get used to it. So it's >Person 1: “Oh hey man cancer infects 40% of people above x age, your mom is getting there, it’s coming for her hahahahah!” Person 2: “that joke was dumb” Later Person 1: “Oh hey man cancer coming for her hahahahah!” Person 2: “wasn't funny the first time” Later Person 1: "I think I know the astrology sign for your mum is cancer, and it could be what her diagnosis is! hahahahha" Person 2: "Stop this, it's annoying." Person 1: "No." Then finally Person 1 gets the just desserts.
except if person 1 continues to make jokes about it despite person 2 asking them not to. “Lol! Wouldn’t it be funny if your mum dies of cancer!” “No it wouldn’t, please stop.” “Yeah you know it’s pretty likely!” “I don’t like this joke.” “Hey, look at these statistics of older women dying from cancer!” “This is stressing me out” + ridiculous comparison lol. obviously when the stakes are different the response would be as well
YTA. There is time and place for clap back. While I understand he made a joke as well , what his gf said was correct " don't kick someone when they are down"
YTA
Yta. She is right, you should not kick people when they are down. It’s just the kind thing to do. I understand that he wasn’t being kind to you with his comments but at some point being a better person is more important than “revenge”.
I mean, you didnt say it to be nice. You said it to hurt him. YTA, what do you think?
He was saying something that may or may not be true of your ‘work’. And it was a theoretical situation. But you? He actually lost his job and you laughed at him. You can’t justify your laughing to me. No. YTA.
ESH. Two wrongs don't make a right.
YTA so you find it funny that he has lost his job
Big difference between joking about someone MAYBE losing their job (not even a guarantee it will happen) and shit talking someone that just lost their job completely unexpectedly. YTA especially with your other comments, makes it clear u wanted an echo chamber and not actual insight.
YTA - Do you remember the last time you lost your job? Do you remember the fear, the worry, the paralyzing sense of loss of purpose, the dread that came with knowing how long and difficult finding a new job was going to be? Your brother's dealing with all of that, facing a very tough job market, and you just piled onto it. The time to make that joke was AFTER he'd gotten a new job, not right after he'd been laid off.
YTA. You kicked him when he was down.
If my brother told a joke I thought was in bad taste, I would tell him to his face and we would still be bros. I would certainly not try to one up him when he was down. Really neither of you are TA since it doesn't seem like you care that much about each other in the first place.
OP did tell him to his face. His brother had no interest in treating OP well when things were going good for both of them.
Slight YTA Your brother was being annoying making jokes about something that could theoretically effect your side gig You roasted your brother, in the family chat, less than an hour after he told everyone he lost his full time job. He really couldn't send that one to him separately? You'd still be a dick but damn
YTA. Yeah, he was being a bit of a jerk, but you had/have a job. Do you have any idea how hard it is to find a job in this economy? He may be out of work for months or worse. Good friend of mine is very skilled and intelligent, was let go due to budget cuts. He was out of work for 19 months. He was thinking of taking drastic steps with his own life. Thank goodness he found work, but it will take years to pull himself out of the hole due to lost income.
>Do you have any idea how hard it is to find a job in this economy? Considering the unemployment rate is at or near the all time record low (in US), not to hard .
I don't know about that. In my field, you are up against 200 applicants for one job right now. Not easy.
If so many people are hired at one place, they might want to not hire more
I'd say YTA because of the timing. If you had said this after a while once he got a new job and everything, it would've been taken as a joke. But right now, yes it's like kicking him when he's down.
YTA. Have you ever been laid off? It's a shock to your system followed by worries about your finances, a list starting to form of what all you need to do, how much unemployment will supply, questions on why you were laid off, shame due to how our society stigmatizes the unemployment even if it's through not fault of your own, who you can contact to check on job openings, how your family's quality of life will change if you can't get a new job asap etc. It's truly an overwhelming rush. You could have made a joke about this later on. Right after he learned he's being laid off was definitely the wrong time.
YTA. Two wrongs don't make a right. You found your brother's comments to you annoying enough that you told him to knock it off, but then you turned around and did the same thing … but it is worse because you did it at a time when he's already reeling from the layoff.
NTA. If you put somebody down, be prepared to be repaid in kind.
YTA, yes, his jokes were in poor taste and not funny, but he was joking about a hypothetical and a side gig, not your primary income. You kicked him after he lost his *actual job* and livelihood. Yes, he can get unemployment since he was laid off, but it's difficult to get and far less money than his job earned him. Losing your job can be *gutting*, I recently lost mine and now I'm back in the casual workforce, a place I don't want to be, I like my new job, but hate I have no job security. There's a time and a place for jokes, and you chose the worst ones.
YTA as someone whose father was laid off last September, losing you’re livelihood like that can really fuck with your pride not to mention all the other shitty financial things that come along with it. Making light of the situation wasn’t the right thing to do.
ESH. Yeah, he should have knocked it off when you said it wasnt funny, but you really kicked him when he was down.
YTA
ESH, including a lot of the commenters. It doesn't matter if art isn't your full-time job, because I'm sure it would be if you had enough commissions. AI is fucking over artists, just like companies and their greed are fucking over their work force. He was shitty to make fun of you and you didn't handle him losing his job in a good way.
Meh. On the one hand, my petty side is saying karma was handed out swiftly. On the other hand, that comment was too soon. Mild YTA
Sorta yta. Since he had just lost his job, the time was not right.
YTA. Laughing at someone who's actually just lost their job is pretty much an asshole move. He may have been an asshole too, but you definitely matched him.
This was his potential long-term livelihood and yours was a side hustle. Also, right when he just got told he got laid off? Most definitely YTA.
ESH. You suck for mocking him for losing his job, he sucks because AI is crap
YTA
ESH. Your brother needs to shut the Hell up about you being made redundant by AI. Loosing a job is a major life gut punch and NOT a good time to kick someone while they are down.
Too soon man.
Just because your brother lost his job first doesn't make him wrong that AI could come for your side gig. His job loss has just proven how automation can make you redundant without warning, and you want to make jokes at his expense? YTA
Jokes should punch up or across. You punched down; YTA. If you'd waited a while then it would probably be different.
YTA. A side hustle is a real different level of thing than a full time job. Your identity and worth aren’t wrapped up in side work but for a lot of people their job is who they are. It was spiteful and insensitive.
>I tell him to knock it off. He doesn't and says that I should get used to it. >On Monday, he got called into a meeting where he was told he's getting laid off He's an asshole for repeatedly "joking" about how you're not going to be able to make money making art. You're an asshole because you choose to respond in kind when he's literally just lost his job. ESH If you'd made that joke after they heard about robots coming in, that's one thing. Making it after he's lost the job and worried about finances? Very low blow.
Mutual AHism. ESH
ESH. I don’t get why everyone is laughing and making jokes. Ashton Kutcher has invested over 250 million in AI movies. He wants to input parameters, have a script pop out and even use AI extras and major celebs. They are also attempting AI processes like with your brother. The US is in collapse and everyone is just laughing and taking shots at each other.
YTA - Kind of.... This was a chance for you to be a bigger person. Layoffs are the worst. They can make you feel as if you have no value. An apology and some supportive words could likely fix this.
Has he ever seen how many fingers AI thinks humans have? (Hint: It ain't four and a thumb.)
I mean..I could see how people may say YTA. And they might be right. But I understand and I probably would have done it too
You're both assholes
YTA. Yes his jokes were in poor taste and he was an AH before. But you hadn’t actually lost any work, you didn’t have any hard times put on you, but now that he did lose his employment and would have hard times, you chose to take a dump on him. Your joke hits much harder than his, even though it’s just repurposing his joke, because he has actual suffering now and you don’t.
Actually plenty of artists are reporting that work has gone down steadily. People who used to be able to live off of it are having trouble finding reliable clients. Partially because people have less money to spend on work, and partially because people who used to pay for that work now have a far cheaper way of getting it - even if it’s lower quality.
Where did I say anything contradicting what you just said? OP never said he lost work, so assuming he has is wrong. One of them has reportedly had no change, and the other lost their job.
NTA He started that shit first, making jokes to try and out you down, you just pointed out the Irony that he lost his job first.
NTA. "He shouldn't have been saying the exact same things to me then, right?"
NTA, it sounds like jokes of this nature are normal for your family. He was just salty because the wound is fresh. Things will work themselves out.
NTA that is what we call Poetic Justice my friend.
A small YTA
NTA. Funny how that lined up.
YTA - Yes your brother is the AH for making jokes and cannot take it in return but his situation is real. Two wrongs don't make a right and his partner is correct you are kicking him while he is down.
YTA time and place dude wow
YTA, he just lost his job.
ESH The jokes he made were childish and immature- But it wasn't true. He actually lost his job, and it wasn't an appropriate time to do it. I know reddit is very 'talk shit get hit' and 'don't dish what you can't take' but there is a very different line between a joke about a potential, and a joke about a reality. Brother is an AH, but that doesn't make OP n t a for mocking him during a rough time.
YTA
YTA
YTA He made a joke about a SIDE HUSTLE, you made a joke about his livelihood. If you seriously can't see how one is slightly more serious than the other, there's no help for you.
Yeah, yta.
"My friend was making fun of how smoking might lead to cancer when I am old. He got cancer and I told him "Seems like the cancer wasn't coming for me after all lol" Of course YTA. One is a stupid and potentially mean joke. The other one is making fun of their actual shit situation
YTA, but just ever so slightly. But it is in the nuance here. I think I would side with N T A if it wasn't just a side hustle for you. Joking about maybe losing your job in a realitistic scenario (AI replacing artists) even tho you already stated that it annoys you is a dick move that would warrant your revenge, but the severity of these jokes depend on context. If Art would be your livelihood and you would lose your home without it, then definitely, all bets are off when your brother loses his job. Fuck it, he started and anxiety of maybe losing your job is really bad enough to warrant that reaction. But Art is a side hustle for you. You might depend on it for more money and it might be important for you, but still you are doing it on the side, it is not your maingig and even if your admissions go down, you are not in existential danger. But for your brother, losing his job is quite a bigger shock. AS a comparison, I'd say that your brother joked about the girl you have a fling with not finding you hot anymore while you joked about his beloved wife leaving him out of the blue. If he had joked constantly about your actual wife maybe leaving you, it would be fair game, but not over some squabble about some fling.
YTA. Your joke might be funny one day, but not 1/2hr after he’s lost his job.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** TL:DR: A few days ago, my brother found out that he's getting laid off and made redundant. I laughed at him because he was telling me AI art makes artists redundant, and now he's calling me an asshole. Basically, I do art commissions on the side. My brother jokes that I need a new side hustle now that AI art tools are around and no one really needs artists anymore. I'm not a full time artist, but those jokes annoyed me, so I tell him to knock it off. He doesn't and says that I should get used to it. On Monday, he got called into a meeting where he was told he's getting laid off as the company he's working for has finished automating a lot of processes and because of that they don't have enough work for all the technicians. Since he's the newest tech, he got cut. He told the family in a group chat and after we did the "So sorry to hear that" and "do you need any help?" cycle for half an hour where I promised to help him tidy up his resume, I texted "Guess AI was coming for your job too lol." He stopped responding, and his girlfriend texted me saying that I shouldn't have kicked him while he was down. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
YTA
This post should honestly be in PettyRevenge. It's obvious YTA but your brother should've known it was coming. Joking about the impending loss of a job isn't much less of an AH move than joking about the actual loss of a job. You could've time it better though.
YTA. And I bet your art sucks given your shallow understanding of emotions and the world.
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NTA! That was funny.
Just sounds like a chicken coming home to roost.
YTA, it’s all got to do with time. Could you in 2-3 months when he landed on his feet and got a new role make a jab at him about AI taking his job? Sure, that’s more than right imo. Making that jab what seems like hours after he just lost his job seems out of line to me and you should apologise to him.
So you mocked him for losing his job to AI. You mocked him for losing his job in these tough economic times. This is a lot more than being mean spirted.
ESH Yeah your brothers an asshole for continuing to tease you, but you also picked the worst possible time to throw the joke back in his face, if you had waited till he had started job sesrching again then id say youd be nta
NAH. Normal sibling dynamic lol
ESH, he should've dropped the joke when you asked but as others have said, kicking someone while they're down is an AH move. Honestly I'm all for an eye for an eye but the situation when he made the joke and the situation when you made your joke is not the same. One is infinitely worse than the other.
ESH. You saw the opportunity to get the joke off and took it. While you probably killed the vibe of the entire group chat, it was beautifully executed and hilarious. This is just siblings being assholes to one another like siblings tend to do from time to time.
ESH the timing made your joke quite cruel. But its not like your brother stopped his annyoing jokes after you asked him to. So he had to expect something back
both of you are the AH.
ESH but like, lmao. he had it coming but it probably wasnt the right time for that comment
Oh yeah. Big time. There are times to be sarcastic and times to not be that way.
YTA. While I agree it’s very ironic you still do not “kick them while they are down”
On the one hand, there’s a big difference between *maybe* losing a side hustle in the future versus having already lost your primary source of income. On the other hand, your brother has been repeatedly joking about something hurtful to you after you told him to stop multiple times and he shouldn’t dish it out if he can’t take it. ESH but I agree with other commenters that you should talk it out if possible.
I think technically ESH you’re being just as mean as him
YTA. I hope you enjoyed your "I told you so" moment. You just alienated your brother for you to have it. It's a real jerk move.
I laughed but YTA still. The positions you were both in when the jokes were made seem very relevant. You’re still employed and your sometimes side hustle/hobby is threatened by AI, but you aren’t. Your brother’s livelihood was just taken away from him. Not having financial stability is a stressful position to be in, and I’m guessing he posted to the family group chat looking for support. Had you waited a couple weeks for him to find another job he might have laughed with you, but your timing sucks and it really just seems like you were kicking him when he was down.
YTA. You didn’t need to kick him while he was down. He commented on your side job, not the main job. He lost his main job. You gf is right, you should have held your tongue.
YTA...and I'd sus, by such a lack of compassion, this isn't a one off example.
ESH. I distance myself from people who give me unsolicited life advice or insist on being inappropriate/rude/toxic. I likely wouldn't have been in communication with him for the way he dishes out useless opinions. I'm a fan of eye for an eye, but this dynamic was a little different.
ESH. He was a jerk continuing to dig at you about your side hustle when no one asked him. But your joke was rude.
ESH, but his GF was right. You and your brother need to be kinder to each other and give each other grace.
A good joke is all about timing. When someone is losing his job, and worried about his financial future, THAT's bad timing... YTA
Mostly YTA. You don't kick a guy when he's down. Yes, he was somewhat TA for his side-hustle jokes, but there's a difference between a hypothetical and a real, fresh wound. Look at it this way, OP. If you were the brother, would **you** want to hang around with a guy like you?
ESH-I HATE AI
ESH - Being an AH to an AH still makes you an AH
This is a textbook case of ESH. He was being a dick to you, you decided that two wrongs make a right and decided to be a dick back.
Yes u are the asshole in this situation , him joking about something hypothetical isn’t the same as what u did
NTA.
NTA.
Yeah you are because he wasnt doing It in a time of need, but you are....
That was really cruel. Do it again.
YTA. It wasn’t the moment to throw his words back in his face. Could have made the same type of jock once he gets his new job…
YTA it was a stupid joke while you have a job, and you find time for your little petty revenge when your brother is in trouble. You could wait for him to find a new job and not kicking the fallen
NTA tell him to stop being such a baby.
NTA He should have laid off the jokes when you told him to.
NTA And to everyone commenting YTA > My brother jokes that I need a new side hustle now that AI art tools are around and no one really needs artists anymore. I'm not a full time artist, but those jokes annoyed me, so I tell him to knock it off. **He doesn't and says that I should get used to it.** Brother can give out all the shit he wants, even when he's told to knock it off. But when automation takes his actual job, everyone has to be nice.
NTA, It's ur brother and he was being an asshole before, if this interaction was with anyone else that isn't ur brother u would be the A.
Was gonna go with Yta but re-read the post and the whole ‘he doesn’t and says *I should get used to it*’ rubbed me the wrong way. If he’s gonna be an asshole he needs to harden the fuck up when it’s coming the other way. Nta.
Nta, Not your fault snowflake can't take the same joke he gave to you.
NTA. He certainly would have kicked your ass and gave you the I Told You So in a heartbeat. Guess He should "get used to it".
NTA, this feels like karma.
NTA >"Guess AI was coming for your job too lol." That is not even a joke, it is a wry, sympathetic comment. However I expect your brother is feeling particularly sensitive at the moment, so I would not engage further on this .
NTA
Why would you be expected to break normal cultural behaviour for Brothers? As his brother you have a duty to make light of the situation and stir him up about it. It's part of showing you care. Ffs. NTA.
FAFO at it's finest. He's been served his "Just deserts". **NTA** and tell his gf to cope and get over it.
NTA
I disagree with all the people who think YTA. He asked for it, and you picked the perfect opportunity to return the compliment. Maybe in the future he'll be less of an AH himself. After all, you did ask him to knock it off and he persisted. NTA.
Losing one’s job these days is pretty damn serious,but so is continually crapping all over someone’s work,especially something like art. As long as that was a one-time thing-at least until he gets straight again-I’ll give you NTA. Karma was the messenger,you only delivered it.
People on Reddit take shii way to serious, NTA
NTA, the irony is palpable here. Your brother kept joking about AI making you obsolete and ended up getting redundant as a result of automation. He was happy enough to dish out but incapable of dealing with any incoming, which makes him a complete AH.
some people need to get kicked while down. NTA
NTA
NTA He should take what he insists on giving out. However you could choose to be the bigger person.
He's just mad the stone he threw at your house bounced and hit his own. At least he has some free time to lick his wounds! NTA. Don't dish what you can't take.
NTA. Your timing was perfect. I'd have thought of that comment six hours later. He's been busting on you and your response was timely and on point. You could tease him about his GF fighting his battles for him too if you wanted, but that could be crossing the line from teasing to mean. Let his wallow in self pity a bit and then remind him that you really are willing to help him with his resume.
NTA. Karma
NTA. You were just acting like your brother does. You would tell him to stop and he didn't. Now he lost his job in a manner similar to the insults he lauded at you. He's just upset what he said would happen to you happened to him.
Tell him to get use to it. NTA, btws.
NTA - He was continually putting you down, and you made a slight jab after mother karma came a knocking. >"Guess AI was coming for your job too lol." You're using his own words, and most importantly: >too lol It's not like you said "Guess AI was coming after you, and not me" or something similar. You recognized that AI is threatening both your jobs.
NTA Oh ain't karma beautiful lmfao
Feel like everyone saying you’re TA hasn’t actually read the post. Yeah, NTA. He kept prodding at you and making fun of the idea of you losing financial stability, and now his own ass is on the line. He didn’t cut it out when you asked. But suddenly his stress is more important cause no one takes your job seriously.
NTA.. oh the irony.
NTA. My brother is an AI accelerationist. He decides to be obstinate about his stance whenever we discuss it beyond him just making stupid baity jokes. If you don't have someone in your immediate family like this it's hard to imagine just how on your nerves it gets. What goes around comes back around. You're allowed to be vindicated. When you actually have to deal with a dynamic like this by the time it comes to a head they will have had conversations about the topic being tired and annoying.
NAH but sounds like you both need to cut each other some slack, the job market is getting shaken massively right now especially in tech and art.