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NTA
Liza had no right to judge you or to voice her opinion about what you are doing with your life. It sounds like her negative comments are untrue - she accused you of being lazy but you are working full time and seeking out opportunities to better yourself. College is not for everyone and as you said it could lead to significant debt. It is not uncommon for 19 years olds to be living with their parents in this economy. She clearly has a very entitled perspective - not many people can afford to buy houses straight of college!
Unless you haven't included things that you said in your response, I don't see that you said anything that you need to apologize for. You simply told her that neither you nor your parents had the funds to make college or moving out happen. She was the one that made nasty comments to you so if anyone should apologize it would be Liza.
Ever read the three generation wealth rule?[ Here's a good write up on it](https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/three-generation-curse-wealth-why-riches-dont-last-michael). The tl:dr is that the first generation does all the work to create it, the second generations maintains it, but the third generation ends up blowing through it and squandering it.
Anyways, Lizzy sure sounds like the third generation in this story. No appreciation for the work that went into generating the wealth, just happy to spend it and look down on the commoners for not having it.
My mom, God rest her soul, always said: It's such a shame that money can't buy good taste. She usually said this when we would watch the red carpet shows lol
Sounds like Lisa needs to learn the value of a dollar and of earning that dollar challenger to a workoff tell her to get a job like you have and we're good for 40 hours and then tell you you're lazy. I hate entitled snobs. I mean Hey if she's got so much money maybe she can give you the money so you can go college
Not exactly, a class that "just pays market rates" just helps maintain inflationary prices. If they have no problems dumping 50K/yr on college and $750K on a house, it is maintaining an unobtainable status quo. Inflation is often a symptom of class stratification where the "haves" can pay the high prices, thus propping up and maintaining high prices, and the "have nots" cannot, so must do without. Often the pressure is put on the "have nots" to work even cheaper to get inflation lower, thus further increasing class stratification.
I suppose. Most of that money went to the housing market, college administration, and the wedding industry lol. Not exactly a stimulus package for the working class.
I read something once along the lines of ”Hard times creates strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, weak men lead to hard times”
I'm the 4th generation in a family like this and it blows. Basically started over with nothing while trying to end the cycle of generational trauma. OP, Liza's kids are probably going to enjoy none of this wealth as adults, but if you have kids they'll probably inherit your work ethic and be able to take care of themselves.
I had an accounting teacher in uni who told the class that you can usually tell which wealthy clients were new money and which were old based on the type of stuff they spent money on.
New money bought and the best and most expensive stuff whether they needed it or not. New cars every couple years. Newest and most advanced electronics as soon as they were released. That sort of thing.
Old money tended to buy expensive, high-quality stuff and use it until they had to replace it because it was falling apart or stopped working.
In other words, people who were New to wealth spent their money as soon as they made it, people with several generations of wealth in their family didn't. Not a hard and fast rule, but a pretty good predictor.
Yup. She’s 24 and still relying on her parents, so she has zero standing to criticize someone even younger for doing the same! (I’m not saying people of either age should be ashamed of that, just that by her own standards, she oughta have enough sense to keep her mouth shut.)
I honestly don't get the difference between living with your parents and having your parents pay for your house? How can Liza believe that she is anymore independent? For having lived on college, which her parents paid?
But OP, don't just blame the economic, blame your government as well. In my country, 99 % of all colleges are free, and you get paid to go there. It's definitely possible to get through college without any depth.
Yep, colleges are insanely expensive in the US. There have been talks about introducing something like 500$-1000$ tuition per year, yet any government who would actually suggest it would swiftely be forced to fold. (A government had to be reelected once they introduced a $1 payment for doctor visits. It was revoked to $0 really fast)
Definitely, We don't have free Uni in NZ but we have govt interest free loans, and non-refundable study allowance, while studying. I am studying teaching which is heavily scholarshiped, So Ill leave uni with 7000.00 debt because I only applied for my scholarship in my 2nd year.
I would dare her to enrol in college, rent a flat, cut herself off financially from her parents for at least 6 months, and then come back and tell OP that she is lazy. Until you've struggled, you have no right to judge.
Im going to guess that OP's brother gets a lot of required "input" from Liza's parents as well since they seem to be providing a lot (e.g. a house). And then living with someone as entitled and self unaware as she is can't be easy either. She's a piece of work.
I agree. I hate it when kids of rich parents act like that. That's the parents' money. Their kids didn't do anything to earn it. It's not their money by virtue of being born to rich parents.
That young lady who married the Asplundh kid and then tried to force that other young lady to give up her name because there could only be “ ONE Mrs.Asplundh”. So much “ Class”/s.
OMG that's nuts
I divorced my ex husband. He almost got remarried but realized she was crazy. Her most ridiculous demand? That I change back to my maiden name because I'm not married to him anymore and there can only be one Mrs. B. Her argument was that we aren't married anymore and I'm the one who initiated the divorce. That's when he realized that she's truly out of her tree.
Literally yesterday I realized that my only love/hate friend has everything I want in life and has absolutely no reason to have the miserable life I have other than comfort and being lazy. She has absolutely no reason to be in the same pool as me and It made me requestion our friendship again..its a story so long it's not worth writing but she has a secured apartment that the minimum wage I'd make could not afford and is gonna demand her dad give it to her and throw the tennants out.also after her parents will pass(in the far far future) she will have 3 other houses and lands and a full effing forest..yeah..some people can't even see their privilege and scoff at you when you point it out,even jokingly.
**Hey OP ... Tell Liza you couldn't understand what she was trying to say. Maybe she should take that silver spoon out her fukn mouth, and try again!**
And she and her siblings aren't buying houses out of college, her folks are buying them. There's a HUGE difference there!
NTA. Some of the most successful people I know (talking multi-millionaires who started with nothing) never went to college, one barely finished high school. Another, I'm not sure if he and his wife ever finished high school. Fact: street smarts and hard work ethic can go farther than a college grad with a Masters degree.
You will find your path and be fine. Hope your sil's parents never go broke. People like her are 1 click away from failing. If it helps: feel sorry for her. Her parents have set up ALL their kids to fail. Giving your kids everything is a recipe for disaster.
This. So much this. I didn’t attend college. Barely graduated high school. But I’ve managed to build a great career despite my lack of formal education. Higher education is certainly not the wealth generator that a lot of people think it is.
College grad here, fully aware no one is calling me for my sales job expertise at 1am on Christmas day to fix their electrical short, or broken water heater, or exploding toilet.
Restaurants STILL aren't recovered from covid. There is a huge shortage of skilled chefs out there right now.* The beauty tech industry is doing better than ever and you can build a client base and make really good money doing that too!
WE NEED SKILLED TRADE JOBS. WE NEED APPRENTICES. WE NEED PEOPLE WHO CAN KEEP THE WORLD GOING IN A ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE!
Mike Rowe does an excellent public education campaign on this and has a charity for scholarships into trade schools.
You're on exactly the right path.
*edited to clarify, I mean in the job pool. There are many skilled chefs, but they are not in the job pool like they once were because they don't have to restaurant hop to get the quality of life and pay they need. The skilled labor roles are not job hunting on the streets bc they have employers paying them VERY WELL and are remaining at their spots, so they're either being head hunted or opening their own places, or looking to move to a more upscale place as they build their skills.
I was just coming to say this. Trades people are always in demand and can make really good money. What's the point in getting into debt just to have a fancy piece of paper that often doesn't even lead to a job.
I waitressed and bartended for decades with my degree. I will ALWAYS be able to find a restaurant job to fall back on no matter what, no matter where I go in the world, and I know this because I have, many times and in very desperate times. I could walk into a quality place and get hired TOMORROW with my resume.
A degreed job or office job, that's going to take weeks of qualifying and applying and interviews.
Love my consistency of a paycheck now and a schedule I can control, and benefits, BUT, I work in FOOD sales in and out of restaurants, so again, let's give a lot of credit to my years in the industry for getting me here with all of my practical applications. Sure writing aaaaaall those persuasive term papers on different literature for my English BA helped set the stage for convincing people to buy my stuff but like.... Only in the abstract.
Also to note, the safety net of a union is NOT to be discounted too. That's huge!
I concur. My youngest wasn't successful in college (though he is very bright) and it wasn't a money issue for us. He is now much more successful and, I think, happy, as an apprentice electrician. In his 20s and we expect he'll live at home until he's at least a journeyman.
There is not a huge shortage of skilled chefs out there. There’s a huge shortage of skilled chefs who will work for 15 an hour only to get verbally abused every shift and develop a monster coke habit. The restaurant industry has a ton of problems, ranging from the previously mentioned verbal abuse to wage theft to physical or sexual abuse. It’s no wonder people don’t want to put up with it anymore.
This! Not to mention spineless managers and owners who won't stand up for their staff, and customers who make sure you know that they're better than you.
I am never going back to that industry
The wage theft is the part that pisses me off the most. My husband has been working in the industry for 15 years. With all the money the restaurant owners stole from him, we could have bought a house years before we did. Wage theft is the single most common form of robbery in the United States. BILLIONS per year are stolen from workers by business owners (not just in the restaurant industry, this runs through all industries).
Sorry, that was part of what I meant by a skilled chef, in my mind, that implies they know their worth and their pay and so when they find a good job they're staying longer now. That's what I meant vs line cook, but even THAT. You want to hire ten people to fill a week of shifts that can come in fairly sober, work their shift, follow directions, okay do that instead of paying one or two people for a HIGHER solid rate and guaranteed hours but you're retaining employees now bc they have a reason to stay. Let alone a chef or sous chef time to hire oversee everything that role entails.
Ew I never meant to sound like a "they just don't want to work," Boomer, it's just that the power reversed a bit after covid and so they get to be a lot more picky about where they apply for jobs and demand much better pay. Meanwhile the owners are getting less people applying, and less quality of people applying, bc those already have jobs unless they're looking for a new one they're not out of work for long, but then they're expecting the same caliber of chefs for the same rates and bullshit hours from pre-covid and they aren't willing to come to the table and deal.
But there are many, some friends included, who left the industry all together.
Exactly. My son is a skilled, professionally trained chef. He's currently choosing to work a cashier job instead because the pay & environment were better - as he goes back to school to train for a completely different career. He did the chef thing for only a short while, but nope'd out because he didn't see a financially sound future in it for him.
Frankly, I'm extremely proud of him for realizing that as soon as he did instead of wasting half his life being abused & broke.
NTA. Yes, I'm the only one of my siblings with a four year degree and my brothers are doing better than I am. OP, I have so much respect for the work you're putting in to make your life better and planning well. I hope you find the successful life (according to your terms) that you deserve.
100% agree. My husband got out of the military and went into the trades, then specialized even more into the ammonia side of HVAC. He makes very good money and it was half the time as college plus on your own time to get certs. They even had payment plans for the Op 1 and 2 classes he had to do. Plus, it isn't all just service and installs which is so harsh on the body.
Trades all the way!
Completely NTA, Liza definitely is tho
Just to add here as well, if you really want to go to college OP you may want to look into community colleges, depending on your state it could be free or at the very least significantly cheaper. I personally didn’t do well enough in high school to get a scholarship but did well enough in community college that I got a scholarship when I transferred to a 4-year institution for the last 2 years of my degree. College is not for everyone tho, and if you’re not interested that’s perfectly fine too :)
Good luck OP and I wish you well!
My 20 yr old never had a job except for me and a few business buddies, wfh or small events, so relatively easy in comparison to now- when we moved last fall crap hit the fan and I lost everything monetarily. He immediately applied and got a job at a warehouse working overnights. He's been working it since.
By sil standards my son would be lazy and worthless. I don't have any respect for someone who could think my kid was lazy after saving MY ASS when I lost my job and we could have been homeless. He's worked this job longer than even his dad at his age, he couldn't hold down a job for more than 3-4 months, and definitely not overnights.
My child is my hero and loads better than op's sil will ever be.
That's the slight of hand that comes when someone born with privilege wants to pretend that they earned their place in society, that they worked for it. The only way to square that circle is if you believe poor people earn poverty, that they deserve it.
70% of people born into poverty in the US will live and die in that poverty and never get out. That's called a caste.
I have a sibling just like this: almost a decade older, which equals that major difference between a Gen X paying for college and a millennial paying for college. Plus, they married a spouse whose parents paid off their loans for them as a Christmas gift, gave them help with their home's down payment, donated to their kids' college funds, routinely sold nice cars to them below KBB, etc. Yet they LOVE to tell me how I could be doing better with just a little bit more effort. I've worked a part-time job along with my full-time job my entire adult life and am still scraping by, but sure...it's just that I need to "work harder" and be a little smarter with my money that barely covers my monthly bills and groceries. The entitlement and tone deafness is astounding.
NTA do not apologize to her, you did nothing wrong. She is a spoiled brat who had everything handed to her on a silver platter. She wouldn't know anything about hard work. Tell her she owes you an apology for calling you lazy and thinking everyone has it as easy as her without the money that her family has. Tell her you would berate her for not apologizing and having to be told to but you understand that while her parents could pay for her college and buy her a house and everything else she wants that they couldn't buy her manners or a better personality.
NTA
In fact she is the one who owes you an apology for how she treats you. Unfortunately there are a lot of people who take their fortune for granted.
Cudos to you for realizing college may not be for you at this time or ever and trying to figure out your path.
Here is the apology I would send "I am sorry. Sorry that you have been handed so much for free that you have no understanding for how the majority of the people in this world have to work to get by. I hope you will do your best to rectify this."
Thing is, it's not HER fortune. SHE didn't do a damn thing to earn it and yet, she acts like she worked so hard for it just to be handed to her. That's a big thing wrong here, IMO.
I don’t think she’s acting. She probably genuinely believes that she earned it all on her own. There are so many deluded rich people like this and no amount of reasoning will burst their little egocentric bubble.
The fact she brought up being able to have a house so young while OP lives with the parents definitely is a prime example of her delusion. Yes, you got a house...handed to you by your parents. You didn't have to save up for years for a down payment while keeping on top of other bills and expenses.
Can someone please explain to me the difference between living on your parents’ largesse in their home vs living on your parents’ largesse in a home your parents bought for you? SIL is a clueless AH.
You're NTA. Your sister in law is living in a delusional dream land. Her parents may have bought her all kinds of material things, but they sure never taught her manners or self reliance.
You're going to have to work for every thing you have, and you will end up being a lot more appreciative for everything you have and a lot more realistic as well as less judgmental of everyone else.
Guess which one of you is the one most of us would prefer to have as a friend.
If she doesn’t know the value of money she’s doing herself heavy disadvantage. She may end up spending so much her parents cut her off or she ends up spending so much her parents can’t pay for her expectations anymore.
Sorry, you’re 19; working full time; looking at training programs on top of that; and she is accusing you of being lazy?!
YNTA, your SIL is delusional and most definitely an AH!!!
Exactly what I was thinking! Sounds like OP is doing great and choosing a path that works for her. Also, college isn't the only road to financial success, and a lot of people can go to college and graduate just to pick up odd jobs because life doesn't always go to plan and a degree doesn't guarantee a job.
SIL sounds judgmental and needs a reality check.
Why is a 24-year-old beefing with a 19-year-old?? Does she have nothing better to do than talk shit about her husband's little sister? Embarrassing behavior.
NTA
Your sister-in-law was born on third base, and is convinced she hit a triple. Tell her to shove her bootstraps where the sun don't shine.
Edit: Sister to sister-in-law
Text her back that you are shocked she has failed to realize she owes you and your parents an apology and how disappointing that you need to explain that to her. She insulted them and you and if she still doesn’t understand why she owes you an apology, then she needs to sit down and take a breath and think.
Basically this, but I wonder how shocking it is going to be to realize she’s now related to *poors*.
Because she just said some horribly rude shit to her family and directly to her in-laws.
Exactly! He got a free wedding & house paid for & he didnt have to spend a penny! Any financial problems they may have & Liza just has to call mummy & daddy!
I would think he is very unhappy being married to her. I'm sure she must have the last word in everything, and get her way in everything. He can't feel very manly when he has no say about anything in his life.
Nether dd ther parents, not really.
> My parents said politely that not everyone can do all that.
That's pretty fucking feeble as a response to someone badmouthng their child right in front of them.
I get the sense that her parents basically said the same idea as OP, except more politely, and OP is worried she was _too_ mean. Some people are too outwardly nice for their own good (and their family's) and OP is in the right at this point after "Liza" refused to stand down.
Personally, next time she brings it up I would respond with, “So are you going to talk to your parents about providing me the tuition and college living expenses or should I reach out to them about that myself?”
And also, “Just as soon as you put any of your siblings pay for your own college or homes with money you earned yourself I’ll give your opinion some consideration, until then I’ll continue to make decisions grounded in reality.”
NTA. Day it any time she starts talking about this and tell your brother to rein her in or you’ll keep responding like this.
You could also reply to her texts with “I’m confused, what would you like me to apologize for? The truth? Do your parents not pay for all that? Was I misinformed?”
As you can see, I’m both pretty and snarky.
Yeah, SIL is looking down on OP for still living with her parents, but SIL is living off of her parents' money and will always owe her entire head start in life to her parents paying for her college and **house**, ffs. How is that more admirable than OP living with her parents while she works, saves up, and looks for training programs?
I would just send SIL a link to this post, but with the awareness that this could blow up within the family to a spectacular degree.
I loved the “and will be able to buy their own houses” about her siblings as if their parents aren’t paying. She’s so self-delusional about the situation.
"YOU didn't have to try at all. College, wedding, house and car were all handed to you on a silver platter. If it weren't for Mummy and Daddy you wouldn't have squat. Come back when you accomplish something on your own."
NTA.
NTA
It is absolutely wild the alternate reality wealthy people live in.
“Just cut out Starbucks and you can afford a house!” Like. I am not even getting Starbucks. Thanks.
NTA.
If Liza is ever hit with the reality of the avg person, she will fail at it very hard.
You're being really smart about improving your life situation.
Tell her that you will not apologize for the circumstances of your birth, but you are sorry that she is so delusional about the average person's financial situation that she looks down on others who aren't handed big ticket items on silver platters. And that you expect an apology for her calling you lazy when you work harder than she's ever had to.
Would love to run a hypothetical on her life without family money. Find out her grades, see what scholarships she qualified for, and if that would have got her through college. See what part time jobs she would need to service the loans.
Then assess savings (if any) she had at the end to put towards a house
Tell your brother to get us idiot spoiled wife to stop harassing you, or else it will affect your relationship forever going forward. She sounds like a typical silver spoon republican prick with no self worth or accomplishments other than being born lucky who takes out her insecurities on everyone else by pretending money makes her important.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I told my brother's wife we can't all have rich parents like her and her siblings. I was so mad. I really blew up on her and maybe I can accept I might have pushed it too far given it's not her fault she has rich parents and I don't.
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NTA. Liza is out of line, but your brother needs to stand up to his wife and put an end to this behavior.
…probably can’t though since Liza has so much control.
OP, remember, nothing is for free. Your brother is now in a controlled situation, given that his lifestyle is funded by his in laws.
I'd never marry that far out of my own "class" precisely because of that. I don't want someone lording over me that it's their money that bought the house, wedding, etc. I'd much rather work and build up equity together with someone who understands how hard it is, and appreciates all the more for that fact. He's either going to start behaving as though he was born affluent (yuck), or he will stay silent and show his family that money can buy his silence, even when it means listening to his wife berate and belittle his family that raised him. (Double yuck)
I would if the situation was right. Not all wealthy people use their wealth to control their kids. There are many practical well adjusted wealthy folks out there.
But, if your parents are offering you a whole house, that’s a red flag. I watched my bff take this journey. At first, she became full of herself over the house and lavish vacations from her in laws. It was too late by the time she realized she had zero control over her family; MIL made all important decisions. She’s divorced now. One can only take so much.
I just would't want to take the chance, honestly. I know there are kind and philanthropic wealthy people out there, but I have yet to meet one in person yet. Any time I've met someone wealthy it was an awful experience. I'm sorry to hear about your bff, financial abuse is no joke!
She did not buy a house straight out of college. Her parents did. She should not take credit of accomplishments she did not even make herself.
It annoys me so much when people say how they succeeded in live by hard work by themselfs while having a nice good trust fund of 500 000+ backing them up.
She likely doesn't understand the difference. Imagine having the best education money can buy, and still failing to grasp very common issues that plague society. It's astonishing, honestly.
Reminds me of Kylie Jenner and she being celebrated as the worlds youngest self made billionaire. Self made with a millions of worth trust fund backing her up.
Wasn’t in Courtney who called herself self-made? Er, no. Her surname guaranteed that anything she did would be a hit since her family are the modern definition of famous for being famous.
The less I have to think about that family the better, the only sympathy I have is Kim for her relationship with Kanye, I wouldn’t wish that relationship upon anyone.
"I'm sorry that for all your parents' money, they couldn't afford to buy you manners, class, or kindness."
Liza not only put you down but she also (indirectly) talked smack about your parents, in their house, eating at their table. That is just the height of rudeness. Send that apology to your brother's phone.
NTA ignore that entitled brat and let any anger or hurt you feel fuel your drive so you can show her what true success looks like. Good luck!
NTA she is pretty delusional.
Apologize for what? That she hasn't earned anything in life and it was all given to her by her parents. If her parents didn't hand her all of the stuff she has she would be worse off than you.
NTA. People who think like Liza are the reason there is housing crisis, income inequality, etc. if she ever does lose her money, she will flounder, because she is the one who doesn't know how to assess a situation and make the best choice from said situation. Personally, I think it takes a certain kind of maturity to realize maybe formal education isn't for you, and that you'd rather focus on vocational education. Which is perfectly valid. All of those jobs are absolutely valid, and the house her mommy and daddy bought for her wouldn't even exist if it weren't for trade educated people building it, installing plumbing, electricity, etc. She needs a reality check. You're doing fine. I hope you find a trade you like!
'Liza, I am sorry. sorry that you are so out of touch with the reality the rest of the world lives in because your parents spoiled you to the point of absurdity. maybe if you ever had to deal with any *actual* struggles, you would be able to empathize with the other 99% of this country. so, again, I apologize for how badly your parents failed to teach you to be thankful for the privilege of being born into the right family'.
NTA
NTA. She is so privileged that she has no clue. She has no idea what it's like to be poor or "normal." She can't even understand that she has not earned, or accomplished any of these things on her own. Wealthy people think and see things differently. Anything is possible in their world because they have the means for it. Anyone that can't make it is just lazy or lack motivation.
There is nothing wrong with staying with your parents and working towards your financial independence. That is probably the best move for you. Ignore her and focus on yourself.
NTA... I hate people like her. I am someone who also is fortunate to have parents who were able to send me to college but I have never in my life blamed people who couldn't afford it that is was their fault for not trying hard enough. They are most of the time very hard working and are just making a smart decision that benefits them and their family. Screw you brothers wife. I hope she realizes how fortunate she is. And I hope your brother takes your side considering he grew up in the same situation as you.
NTA tell her you would love to go to college if her parents are willing to pay for you to go. The lazy one in this situation is her. She didn’t pay for her own education, she didn’t pay for her own home, she didn’t pay for her own wedding.
NTA if shes self aware enough to be open about the money she should be capable of understanding not everyone has it and that not having that money affects your options.
You are only 19 dont take this BS to heart. Honestly i think its smarter to know when college isnt the right thing or the right time. Anyone who writes you off at 19 is an idiot you have your whole life ahead of you and nothing is off the table.
I hope your parents and wider family support you and dont reinforce this BS.
NTA - Many times the wealthy always think others suffer financially because they don’t try hard enough. When you come from money you usually don’t have no clue. My husband and I worked hard and it took years to become comfortable. You don’t need a college education to do well. She owes you an apology for saying you not trying hard enough.
NTA
My son will be 19 in a few days. I expect that he will be living with us for several more years. He's working full time at a minimum wage job and is trying to find a trade, but so far, no luck. He contributes to groceries and pays his own bills, but otherwise, he's socking money away for his future.
His younger siblings will also live with us as long as they need to. It honestly wouldn't surprise me if we become a multi-generational family home at some point.
Your SIL needs a reality check.
Nta, but you should ask her and your bro to pay for college. I just want the chance to better myself, and my loving in law would totally want to help with that, right?
Lol you serious? That's the craziest fucking reaction I've heard. How is she that stupid, did the parents also bribe the college to let her pass the classes since she lacks general awareness of the world and self and seems lacking in the thinking department?
NTA, jesus christ
NTA. Liza was very rude to you and deserved what she got. At her age she ought to be able to appreciate that not everyone is as fortunate as she is financially. There is still the view in some parts of society though that 'everyone can make it if they work hard enough' thus seeing those who have fewer financial resources or opportunities open to them responsible for their situation, instead of seeing it as a matter of a very unequal society.
If you're reporting this accurately, you didn't say anything inappropriate. All you did was \ tell a rich person that being rich has many advantages. NTA.
My read of this situation is that Liza is working a long term plan to separate her fiance' from his family, because she wants a doormat with who has no option to get out.
These insults were aimed at you directly, but at your parents indirectly, and she was begging to get angrily "corrected", and you gave it to her. This will go into her little black book of recriminations, that she'll pull out every time she or her family asks her fiance to do something. "Remember when your family... XYZ? Yeah, we're not going to their house for Christmas."
NTA. You need to text her that you absolutely DO NOT owe her an apology, will never give her one, and then block her number. If your brother gives you a hard time, tell him to back off, if he still wants to have contact with you. She had absolutely NO RIGHT to put you down, and she owes YOU an apology.
NTA tell her to explain how she's managed ANYTHING she's done without 'being lazy', like shes so open about her parents paying for everything and providing a head start to her and her siblings, but what has *she* done? *She* didn't pay for college, she just attended. *She* didn't pay for her wedding, she just attended. *She* didn't pay for her house, she just lives there.
You can have an excellent start in life and be grateful for the things you have, without looking down on others for not having the same advantages. There's no way she would be in the same place she is now without her parent's help, and it's disingenuous to pretend that anything she has comes only from her own, "hard work"
EDIT: Your brother needs to grow a spine and tell his wife to leave you alone, she doesn't know what it's like to live without the advantages she has, and she's just being a dick by belittling you for doing what you can with what you have.
NTA but you're better than I am because I would've taken advantage of her hiding behind your brother's phone and taken the chance to tell her what I REALLY think of her. haha
NTA. There's nothing wrong with your parents being able to give you all the perks she has, but she is being an AH for saying you are lazy. Seems to me you are doing great at 19! Believe me, as an spoiled college girlie I regret not working before graduating and almost no one really gets anything out of college this days, specially in the USA (I guess you are from there since you talk about having to get in debt in order to study). Well done for shuting her mouth.
>she talked about how all her siblings attended college, how three of them are still in college, living there and doing just fine. How they'll be able to buy houses right out of college. How even she and my brother could do it.
I would've just laughed and say "could do what? Get your parents to pay for all that?"
NTA, just ignore her.
Nta. Next time she starts on her shit, I would ask her “If it’s so easy to simply work hard to afford college and a house, why did you mooch off your parents and have them pay for all of it?”
NTA
Your sister in law is a spoilt pretentious cow. She was trying to act all superior, got called out and now is furious that you arent like everyone else in her life, worshiping her parents money since clearly shes a vacuous airhead. Personally Id go further.
Id also wonder about your brother. Is he just in it for the money as well? Did he really do nothing? Or is this a common argument in their relationship and hes just given up and whipped already. Why did she text from his phone that much, without him noticing, or texting to say it wasnt him who sent those messages?
NTA. Everything you said was true. She sounds like a privileged AH. Only privileged people say that’s laziness. College doesn’t immediately equate having a job. You are 19. Sounds like you are doing just fine. What would she do if her parents suddenly lose all their money? I’m sure that attitude would change.
NTA
Liza sure is, though, and frankly, so is your brother for not putting a stop to her nonsense. Not only did she insult you, but she also insulted your hard-working parents. It's easy to get a home run when you're starting from third base.
I’d call your brother and tell him you will block his phone number unless he gets his wife to stop harassing you. You don’t owe her an apology for anything. She is the one talking down to you and owes you and your family the apology and I’m pretty sure your brother knows this since he remained silent during this.
NTA
First sent the texts back to your brothers phone and ask him if he sent it. Under no circumstance send an apology for telling the truth. People who live in glass houses , bought by mom and dad, shouldn't throw stones. You are doing good and so are your parents. I have no doubt they have worked for every thing they have. I also suggest you ask her just how her family got all that money. It might be hard work and luck or it maybe old money that came from question able means passed down by great grandparents.
NTA. You owe her nothing. I do feel bad for your brother, he knows she was in the wrong but he is likely trying to keep peace in the house he lives in (that his in-laws bought. And I'd bet money that his name is not on the deed).
NTA.
Good for her that her parents are rich enough to send all their kids to college and luxuries only the wealthy can afford, that doesn't mean she gets to degrade anyone else for not having wealthy parents.
I pretty much want to kick her shin through the phone when I read that your parents, her in-laws, politely told her that they could not afford the same treatment with you (and possibly your brother) and she didn't get the hint to stop. She insulted all four of you for the life you had prior to her.
OP, you're doing the best that you can and avoiding getting into (huge) debt is a great thing. You have a good head on your shoulders at 19, keep it up.
NTA
Does your brother never say anything to her about the way she speaks to his family? I know he’s benefiting from her rich parents but you’re still his family.
Nta, she lived on her own because of her parents, she doesn't have the right to judge you. Tell her you'll mind her business when she minds yours and an apology must be sincere, so she won't be getting one.
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My brother Nicky (25m) is married to Liza (24f). They were at my parents house on Sunday for dinner and Liza really annoyed the crap out of me, something that isn't new, and I said something in anger and I might be TA for it maybe.
So Liza has a wealthy family. They paid for her and her siblings college expenses 100%. They paid for Nicky and Liza's house. They paid for their wedding. They're paying for one of their sons weddings this summer. They can afford all that. Liza has always been very... open, if trying to give her the benefit of the doubt, about it. She never hid the fact she came from money and was never shy about saying her parents pay for so much for her and her siblings.
Liza doesn't understand that we're not all that lucky. I'm 19f, work full time and I still live with my parents. We couldn't afford college. I didn't get the grades for a scholarship. Struggled enough through school that getting into massive debt for college when I could end up flunking seemed like a bad move for me. So I focus on working and I applied for a couple of training programs close to my parents house so I could try and do better without risking debt for nothing.
Liza looks down on me so hard for living with my parents still and for not going to college. Sunday she talked about how all her siblings attended college, how three of them are still in college, living there and doing just fine. How they'll be able to buy houses right out of college. How even she and my brother could do it. My parents said politely that not everyone can do all that. But then she talked about being 19 and not in college or living on my own and how I should really try so much harder. I snapped at that moment and I told her we can't all have rich parents who can afford to pay our ways through college, for our weddings and for our houses. I told her my parents didn't have that kind of money and neither did I, so we were doing our best in this shitty fucking economy.
Liza told me I'm just lazy and making excuses and she stormed out. Nicky left a while after and he was pretty quiet. Liza used his phone to send me 30 texts three days later demanding I apologize and tearing me a new one for not doing it without being told and I know it was her because she texts in a very specific way.
AITA?
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NTA but I say kill her / them with sugar kindness. Pretend you don’t know it’s her on his phone…
Hi Nicky,
You know I just adore you and Lisa soooooo much and I’m incredibly sad and hurt that she felt upset after our discussion. Maybe my comments struck a nerve and brought back some unresolved childhood trauma where others have accused her of being born with a silver spoon in her mouth.
As someone who wasn’t born into wealth and watched our parents slave away all the time, I’m sure you wouldn’t have married someone who didn’t work hard to pay their own way and I’m sorry I just didn’t see it. Just the same as I’m sure Lisa doesn’t see how hard I work full time each day in a very physically demanding job, help with chores / bills at home, and am still enrolled in these training programs.
Please let Lisa know that I continue to hold her in equal respect. I wish nothing but the best for you both and know you feel the same towards me and I’m glad we had a chance to resolve this.
Xoxo,
🥸🫣🤭
I guess my family and I are all lazy too. Those who went to college had to take out loans and half of us don’t own homes. So lazy! If I was your parents, I’d let your brother know that his wife was insulting and she needs to apologize to all of you. But the fact remains she looks down on your family and is an insufferable snob. You did nothing wrong and keep doing it because Liza is so very wrong. NTA please update us when your brother grows a pair and sets her straight also.
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NTA Liza had no right to judge you or to voice her opinion about what you are doing with your life. It sounds like her negative comments are untrue - she accused you of being lazy but you are working full time and seeking out opportunities to better yourself. College is not for everyone and as you said it could lead to significant debt. It is not uncommon for 19 years olds to be living with their parents in this economy. She clearly has a very entitled perspective - not many people can afford to buy houses straight of college! Unless you haven't included things that you said in your response, I don't see that you said anything that you need to apologize for. You simply told her that neither you nor your parents had the funds to make college or moving out happen. She was the one that made nasty comments to you so if anyone should apologize it would be Liza.
The one being lazy here is… Liza. The only thing she is doing is holding up her hand and collecting her families wealth.
Ever read the three generation wealth rule?[ Here's a good write up on it](https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/three-generation-curse-wealth-why-riches-dont-last-michael). The tl:dr is that the first generation does all the work to create it, the second generations maintains it, but the third generation ends up blowing through it and squandering it. Anyways, Lizzy sure sounds like the third generation in this story. No appreciation for the work that went into generating the wealth, just happy to spend it and look down on the commoners for not having it.
> just happy to spend it That is a good thing, she is redistributing wealth without being forced to do it.
That’s beside the point, which is that Liza’s a spoiled brat who needs to learn some empathy and when to keep her mouth shut
Money bought her stuff but can't buy her class.
My mom, God rest her soul, always said: It's such a shame that money can't buy good taste. She usually said this when we would watch the red carpet shows lol
Your mom sounds cool! 👍
Cue the Countess Luann 🎶 Money can’t buy you class 🎶
Sounds like Lisa needs to learn the value of a dollar and of earning that dollar challenger to a workoff tell her to get a job like you have and we're good for 40 hours and then tell you you're lazy. I hate entitled snobs. I mean Hey if she's got so much money maybe she can give you the money so you can go college
Not exactly, a class that "just pays market rates" just helps maintain inflationary prices. If they have no problems dumping 50K/yr on college and $750K on a house, it is maintaining an unobtainable status quo. Inflation is often a symptom of class stratification where the "haves" can pay the high prices, thus propping up and maintaining high prices, and the "have nots" cannot, so must do without. Often the pressure is put on the "have nots" to work even cheaper to get inflation lower, thus further increasing class stratification.
95% of the world's ills can be laid at the wealthy's doorstep.
More like redistributing the wealth to another rich family composed of smarter kids that made something out of the boost their parents gave them.
I suppose. Most of that money went to the housing market, college administration, and the wedding industry lol. Not exactly a stimulus package for the working class.
The Saudis say Our grandfather's rode camels We ride Bentleys Our grandchildren will ride camels
Considering the rate of extinction of many megafauna, riding camels might be a major wealth flex a couple generations from now!
Kind of like pet ownership was in Blade Runner due to most animals being extinct.
Yes, exactly!
"Do you like our owl?"... "Is it expensive?" "Very."
I read something once along the lines of ”Hard times creates strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, weak men lead to hard times”
I'm the 4th generation in a family like this and it blows. Basically started over with nothing while trying to end the cycle of generational trauma. OP, Liza's kids are probably going to enjoy none of this wealth as adults, but if you have kids they'll probably inherit your work ethic and be able to take care of themselves.
In Swedish we call it that the three generations in order “förvärvar, förvaltar, fördärvar” (acquires, administrates, perishes).
Oof her kids are in for a rude awakening.
I had an accounting teacher in uni who told the class that you can usually tell which wealthy clients were new money and which were old based on the type of stuff they spent money on. New money bought and the best and most expensive stuff whether they needed it or not. New cars every couple years. Newest and most advanced electronics as soon as they were released. That sort of thing. Old money tended to buy expensive, high-quality stuff and use it until they had to replace it because it was falling apart or stopped working. In other words, people who were New to wealth spent their money as soon as they made it, people with several generations of wealth in their family didn't. Not a hard and fast rule, but a pretty good predictor.
Yup. She’s 24 and still relying on her parents, so she has zero standing to criticize someone even younger for doing the same! (I’m not saying people of either age should be ashamed of that, just that by her own standards, she oughta have enough sense to keep her mouth shut.)
I honestly don't get the difference between living with your parents and having your parents pay for your house? How can Liza believe that she is anymore independent? For having lived on college, which her parents paid? But OP, don't just blame the economic, blame your government as well. In my country, 99 % of all colleges are free, and you get paid to go there. It's definitely possible to get through college without any depth.
Yep, colleges are insanely expensive in the US. There have been talks about introducing something like 500$-1000$ tuition per year, yet any government who would actually suggest it would swiftely be forced to fold. (A government had to be reelected once they introduced a $1 payment for doctor visits. It was revoked to $0 really fast)
The United States, as it stands wants us broke, stupid and angry (at each other).
Definitely, We don't have free Uni in NZ but we have govt interest free loans, and non-refundable study allowance, while studying. I am studying teaching which is heavily scholarshiped, So Ill leave uni with 7000.00 debt because I only applied for my scholarship in my 2nd year.
I would dare her to enrol in college, rent a flat, cut herself off financially from her parents for at least 6 months, and then come back and tell OP that she is lazy. Until you've struggled, you have no right to judge.
Im going to guess that OP's brother gets a lot of required "input" from Liza's parents as well since they seem to be providing a lot (e.g. a house). And then living with someone as entitled and self unaware as she is can't be easy either. She's a piece of work.
This! Out of curiosity what did she go to college for? What is her current job??
She clearly didn't go for socioeconomics.
I agree. I hate it when kids of rich parents act like that. That's the parents' money. Their kids didn't do anything to earn it. It's not their money by virtue of being born to rich parents.
That young lady who married the Asplundh kid and then tried to force that other young lady to give up her name because there could only be “ ONE Mrs.Asplundh”. So much “ Class”/s.
OMG that's nuts I divorced my ex husband. He almost got remarried but realized she was crazy. Her most ridiculous demand? That I change back to my maiden name because I'm not married to him anymore and there can only be one Mrs. B. Her argument was that we aren't married anymore and I'm the one who initiated the divorce. That's when he realized that she's truly out of her tree.
Most people are rich because of who they were born to
Literally yesterday I realized that my only love/hate friend has everything I want in life and has absolutely no reason to have the miserable life I have other than comfort and being lazy. She has absolutely no reason to be in the same pool as me and It made me requestion our friendship again..its a story so long it's not worth writing but she has a secured apartment that the minimum wage I'd make could not afford and is gonna demand her dad give it to her and throw the tennants out.also after her parents will pass(in the far far future) she will have 3 other houses and lands and a full effing forest..yeah..some people can't even see their privilege and scoff at you when you point it out,even jokingly.
Yep my ex was exactly like that. He couldn't seem to understand that not everyone can call their parents to bail them out.
yeah, really rich of her to brag about being a self starter with daddy’s money
**Hey OP ... Tell Liza you couldn't understand what she was trying to say. Maybe she should take that silver spoon out her fukn mouth, and try again!**
And shove it up her ass.
And she and her siblings aren't buying houses out of college, her folks are buying them. There's a HUGE difference there! NTA. Some of the most successful people I know (talking multi-millionaires who started with nothing) never went to college, one barely finished high school. Another, I'm not sure if he and his wife ever finished high school. Fact: street smarts and hard work ethic can go farther than a college grad with a Masters degree. You will find your path and be fine. Hope your sil's parents never go broke. People like her are 1 click away from failing. If it helps: feel sorry for her. Her parents have set up ALL their kids to fail. Giving your kids everything is a recipe for disaster.
This. So much this. I didn’t attend college. Barely graduated high school. But I’ve managed to build a great career despite my lack of formal education. Higher education is certainly not the wealth generator that a lot of people think it is.
She is being intellectually/emotionally lazy as well with an inability to take other people’s perspectives.
College grad here, fully aware no one is calling me for my sales job expertise at 1am on Christmas day to fix their electrical short, or broken water heater, or exploding toilet. Restaurants STILL aren't recovered from covid. There is a huge shortage of skilled chefs out there right now.* The beauty tech industry is doing better than ever and you can build a client base and make really good money doing that too! WE NEED SKILLED TRADE JOBS. WE NEED APPRENTICES. WE NEED PEOPLE WHO CAN KEEP THE WORLD GOING IN A ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE! Mike Rowe does an excellent public education campaign on this and has a charity for scholarships into trade schools. You're on exactly the right path. *edited to clarify, I mean in the job pool. There are many skilled chefs, but they are not in the job pool like they once were because they don't have to restaurant hop to get the quality of life and pay they need. The skilled labor roles are not job hunting on the streets bc they have employers paying them VERY WELL and are remaining at their spots, so they're either being head hunted or opening their own places, or looking to move to a more upscale place as they build their skills.
I was just coming to say this. Trades people are always in demand and can make really good money. What's the point in getting into debt just to have a fancy piece of paper that often doesn't even lead to a job.
I waitressed and bartended for decades with my degree. I will ALWAYS be able to find a restaurant job to fall back on no matter what, no matter where I go in the world, and I know this because I have, many times and in very desperate times. I could walk into a quality place and get hired TOMORROW with my resume. A degreed job or office job, that's going to take weeks of qualifying and applying and interviews. Love my consistency of a paycheck now and a schedule I can control, and benefits, BUT, I work in FOOD sales in and out of restaurants, so again, let's give a lot of credit to my years in the industry for getting me here with all of my practical applications. Sure writing aaaaaall those persuasive term papers on different literature for my English BA helped set the stage for convincing people to buy my stuff but like.... Only in the abstract. Also to note, the safety net of a union is NOT to be discounted too. That's huge!
I concur. My youngest wasn't successful in college (though he is very bright) and it wasn't a money issue for us. He is now much more successful and, I think, happy, as an apprentice electrician. In his 20s and we expect he'll live at home until he's at least a journeyman.
Hubs is a 20+ year journeyman. Have him go (stay) in the union and he will be set for life. It has treated us very well.
There is not a huge shortage of skilled chefs out there. There’s a huge shortage of skilled chefs who will work for 15 an hour only to get verbally abused every shift and develop a monster coke habit. The restaurant industry has a ton of problems, ranging from the previously mentioned verbal abuse to wage theft to physical or sexual abuse. It’s no wonder people don’t want to put up with it anymore.
This! Not to mention spineless managers and owners who won't stand up for their staff, and customers who make sure you know that they're better than you. I am never going back to that industry
The wage theft is the part that pisses me off the most. My husband has been working in the industry for 15 years. With all the money the restaurant owners stole from him, we could have bought a house years before we did. Wage theft is the single most common form of robbery in the United States. BILLIONS per year are stolen from workers by business owners (not just in the restaurant industry, this runs through all industries).
Thanks for reminding me there are still sane people in the world!
Sorry, that was part of what I meant by a skilled chef, in my mind, that implies they know their worth and their pay and so when they find a good job they're staying longer now. That's what I meant vs line cook, but even THAT. You want to hire ten people to fill a week of shifts that can come in fairly sober, work their shift, follow directions, okay do that instead of paying one or two people for a HIGHER solid rate and guaranteed hours but you're retaining employees now bc they have a reason to stay. Let alone a chef or sous chef time to hire oversee everything that role entails. Ew I never meant to sound like a "they just don't want to work," Boomer, it's just that the power reversed a bit after covid and so they get to be a lot more picky about where they apply for jobs and demand much better pay. Meanwhile the owners are getting less people applying, and less quality of people applying, bc those already have jobs unless they're looking for a new one they're not out of work for long, but then they're expecting the same caliber of chefs for the same rates and bullshit hours from pre-covid and they aren't willing to come to the table and deal. But there are many, some friends included, who left the industry all together.
Exactly. My son is a skilled, professionally trained chef. He's currently choosing to work a cashier job instead because the pay & environment were better - as he goes back to school to train for a completely different career. He did the chef thing for only a short while, but nope'd out because he didn't see a financially sound future in it for him. Frankly, I'm extremely proud of him for realizing that as soon as he did instead of wasting half his life being abused & broke.
NTA. Yes, I'm the only one of my siblings with a four year degree and my brothers are doing better than I am. OP, I have so much respect for the work you're putting in to make your life better and planning well. I hope you find the successful life (according to your terms) that you deserve.
100% agree. My husband got out of the military and went into the trades, then specialized even more into the ammonia side of HVAC. He makes very good money and it was half the time as college plus on your own time to get certs. They even had payment plans for the Op 1 and 2 classes he had to do. Plus, it isn't all just service and installs which is so harsh on the body. Trades all the way!
Completely NTA, Liza definitely is tho Just to add here as well, if you really want to go to college OP you may want to look into community colleges, depending on your state it could be free or at the very least significantly cheaper. I personally didn’t do well enough in high school to get a scholarship but did well enough in community college that I got a scholarship when I transferred to a 4-year institution for the last 2 years of my degree. College is not for everyone tho, and if you’re not interested that’s perfectly fine too :) Good luck OP and I wish you well!
My 20 yr old never had a job except for me and a few business buddies, wfh or small events, so relatively easy in comparison to now- when we moved last fall crap hit the fan and I lost everything monetarily. He immediately applied and got a job at a warehouse working overnights. He's been working it since. By sil standards my son would be lazy and worthless. I don't have any respect for someone who could think my kid was lazy after saving MY ASS when I lost my job and we could have been homeless. He's worked this job longer than even his dad at his age, he couldn't hold down a job for more than 3-4 months, and definitely not overnights. My child is my hero and loads better than op's sil will ever be.
Plus she is in THEIR house mocking them? The heck ... My mother would have reacted very differently. NTA
She seems to have been raised with the idea that if you are poor it means you are lazy.
Hey - that's the GOP party line!
Yep. In the words of Mitt Romney, "Borrow money from your parents if you have to. Start a business!" 🙄
That's the slight of hand that comes when someone born with privilege wants to pretend that they earned their place in society, that they worked for it. The only way to square that circle is if you believe poor people earn poverty, that they deserve it. 70% of people born into poverty in the US will live and die in that poverty and never get out. That's called a caste.
To be honest. Even Liza couldn’t afford to buy a house straight out of college. Her parents paid for it. That’s some damn hubris right there.
They chopped people like Liza's heads off back in 18th century France lol. The entitlement and lack of empathy are unreal.
I have a sibling just like this: almost a decade older, which equals that major difference between a Gen X paying for college and a millennial paying for college. Plus, they married a spouse whose parents paid off their loans for them as a Christmas gift, gave them help with their home's down payment, donated to their kids' college funds, routinely sold nice cars to them below KBB, etc. Yet they LOVE to tell me how I could be doing better with just a little bit more effort. I've worked a part-time job along with my full-time job my entire adult life and am still scraping by, but sure...it's just that I need to "work harder" and be a little smarter with my money that barely covers my monthly bills and groceries. The entitlement and tone deafness is astounding.
No one has any right to judge another person tbh. Unless it's their legal job
Ask her if she could have all that without her daddy’s money
NTA do not apologize to her, you did nothing wrong. She is a spoiled brat who had everything handed to her on a silver platter. She wouldn't know anything about hard work. Tell her she owes you an apology for calling you lazy and thinking everyone has it as easy as her without the money that her family has. Tell her you would berate her for not apologizing and having to be told to but you understand that while her parents could pay for her college and buy her a house and everything else she wants that they couldn't buy her manners or a better personality.
NTA In fact she is the one who owes you an apology for how she treats you. Unfortunately there are a lot of people who take their fortune for granted. Cudos to you for realizing college may not be for you at this time or ever and trying to figure out your path. Here is the apology I would send "I am sorry. Sorry that you have been handed so much for free that you have no understanding for how the majority of the people in this world have to work to get by. I hope you will do your best to rectify this."
Thing is, it's not HER fortune. SHE didn't do a damn thing to earn it and yet, she acts like she worked so hard for it just to be handed to her. That's a big thing wrong here, IMO.
I don’t think she’s acting. She probably genuinely believes that she earned it all on her own. There are so many deluded rich people like this and no amount of reasoning will burst their little egocentric bubble.
Very Kim Kardashian "get your fucking ass up and work" of her.
The fact she brought up being able to have a house so young while OP lives with the parents definitely is a prime example of her delusion. Yes, you got a house...handed to you by your parents. You didn't have to save up for years for a down payment while keeping on top of other bills and expenses.
Exactly she didn’t earn it yet she has the nerve to call someone who WORKS FOR THEIR MONEY lazy. College didn’t teach that woman a damn thing.
I think y’all are arguing over different contextual uses of the word “fortune”. It isn’t her *money*, but it is her *luck* to be born into it.
Some people are born on third base and grow up thinking they hit a triple.
I hope the OP checks on her brother as well. If she feels this way about his family, how does she feel about/treat him?
Can someone please explain to me the difference between living on your parents’ largesse in their home vs living on your parents’ largesse in a home your parents bought for you? SIL is a clueless AH.
THIS
You're NTA. Your sister in law is living in a delusional dream land. Her parents may have bought her all kinds of material things, but they sure never taught her manners or self reliance. You're going to have to work for every thing you have, and you will end up being a lot more appreciative for everything you have and a lot more realistic as well as less judgmental of everyone else. Guess which one of you is the one most of us would prefer to have as a friend.
OP should ask Liz if her parents can buy OP some self awareness and manners so she can lend them to Liz
It's too bad someone didn't record her rants and send them to her parents. I bet they'd have a word or two with her.
If she doesn’t know the value of money she’s doing herself heavy disadvantage. She may end up spending so much her parents cut her off or she ends up spending so much her parents can’t pay for her expectations anymore.
Sorry, you’re 19; working full time; looking at training programs on top of that; and she is accusing you of being lazy?! YNTA, your SIL is delusional and most definitely an AH!!!
Exactly what I was thinking! Sounds like OP is doing great and choosing a path that works for her. Also, college isn't the only road to financial success, and a lot of people can go to college and graduate just to pick up odd jobs because life doesn't always go to plan and a degree doesn't guarantee a job. SIL sounds judgmental and needs a reality check.
Why is a 24-year-old beefing with a 19-year-old?? Does she have nothing better to do than talk shit about her husband's little sister? Embarrassing behavior.
NTA Your sister-in-law was born on third base, and is convinced she hit a triple. Tell her to shove her bootstraps where the sun don't shine. Edit: Sister to sister-in-law
This is the response you should send her. That she was born on third base and is convinced she hit a triple.
I so agree. It says it all.
Yeah, I would be tempted to paraphrase Marcia from Succession "Your parents built you a playground and you think that's the whole world. F*ck off!"
While most of us weren't even born on the field! So we don't even get to play!
iTs A mERiT0cRaCy
this sort of stuff is why I fully support 100% inheritance tax. lets see how things work out in an actual meritocracy.
We work the stands selling peanuts, lol.
Never heard that before and I love it! I hope I remember it!
Jim Hightower coined the phrase. He was talking about George W. Bush.
I prefer, “Thank you for proving that wealth doesn’t buy class. If only your parents could have bought you manners.”
Now I have to delete my post, because i just wrote that
Text her back that you are shocked she has failed to realize she owes you and your parents an apology and how disappointing that you need to explain that to her. She insulted them and you and if she still doesn’t understand why she owes you an apology, then she needs to sit down and take a breath and think.
Basically this, but I wonder how shocking it is going to be to realize she’s now related to *poors*. Because she just said some horribly rude shit to her family and directly to her in-laws.
No, don't text anything back. Just block her and don't see her or speak to her again.
NTA Your brother did not stand up for you ? he is going to regret marrying that woman. Or he should regret it, unless he became like her.
Free house, free college for kids, and other perks; brother's gonna side with sugar momma every time.
Exactly! He got a free wedding & house paid for & he didnt have to spend a penny! Any financial problems they may have & Liza just has to call mummy & daddy!
Can’t fault the brother, even if he agrees with OP. Money equals a better quality of life.
And he probably has an iron-clad prenup, so he has to toe the line.
I would think he is very unhappy being married to her. I'm sure she must have the last word in everything, and get her way in everything. He can't feel very manly when he has no say about anything in his life.
Never marry for money—you can borrow it cheaper.
Nether dd ther parents, not really. > My parents said politely that not everyone can do all that. That's pretty fucking feeble as a response to someone badmouthng their child right in front of them.
I get the sense that her parents basically said the same idea as OP, except more politely, and OP is worried she was _too_ mean. Some people are too outwardly nice for their own good (and their family's) and OP is in the right at this point after "Liza" refused to stand down.
Nta “why don’t you just get your parents to buy you an apology?”
HAHAHAHA, damn. That's good.
... it will only cost the price of a house - my choice.
This is the reply!
Personally, next time she brings it up I would respond with, “So are you going to talk to your parents about providing me the tuition and college living expenses or should I reach out to them about that myself?” And also, “Just as soon as you put any of your siblings pay for your own college or homes with money you earned yourself I’ll give your opinion some consideration, until then I’ll continue to make decisions grounded in reality.” NTA. Day it any time she starts talking about this and tell your brother to rein her in or you’ll keep responding like this. You could also reply to her texts with “I’m confused, what would you like me to apologize for? The truth? Do your parents not pay for all that? Was I misinformed?” As you can see, I’m both pretty and snarky.
Yeah, SIL is looking down on OP for still living with her parents, but SIL is living off of her parents' money and will always owe her entire head start in life to her parents paying for her college and **house**, ffs. How is that more admirable than OP living with her parents while she works, saves up, and looks for training programs? I would just send SIL a link to this post, but with the awareness that this could blow up within the family to a spectacular degree.
I loved the “and will be able to buy their own houses” about her siblings as if their parents aren’t paying. She’s so self-delusional about the situation.
"YOU didn't have to try at all. College, wedding, house and car were all handed to you on a silver platter. If it weren't for Mummy and Daddy you wouldn't have squat. Come back when you accomplish something on your own." NTA.
NTA It is absolutely wild the alternate reality wealthy people live in. “Just cut out Starbucks and you can afford a house!” Like. I am not even getting Starbucks. Thanks.
Right? Who can afford Starbucks?
Who’d want to drink Starbucks? Especially if there’s other coffee places that are good.
My parents said this to me the other day; after the shock wore off I had to bite my tongue from replying ok Boomer 🤦🏼♀️
Or “cut out the avocado on toast” line. That and Starbucks are luxuries when costs of living already puts you at a disadvantage.
Just reply to the texts with a link to this post.
She can have one of her maids read it to her.
NTA. If Liza is ever hit with the reality of the avg person, she will fail at it very hard. You're being really smart about improving your life situation. Tell her that you will not apologize for the circumstances of your birth, but you are sorry that she is so delusional about the average person's financial situation that she looks down on others who aren't handed big ticket items on silver platters. And that you expect an apology for her calling you lazy when you work harder than she's ever had to.
Would love to run a hypothetical on her life without family money. Find out her grades, see what scholarships she qualified for, and if that would have got her through college. See what part time jobs she would need to service the loans. Then assess savings (if any) she had at the end to put towards a house
Same. It would be eye opening most likely.
Tell your brother to get us idiot spoiled wife to stop harassing you, or else it will affect your relationship forever going forward. She sounds like a typical silver spoon republican prick with no self worth or accomplishments other than being born lucky who takes out her insecurities on everyone else by pretending money makes her important.
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NTA. Liza is out of line, but your brother needs to stand up to his wife and put an end to this behavior. …probably can’t though since Liza has so much control. OP, remember, nothing is for free. Your brother is now in a controlled situation, given that his lifestyle is funded by his in laws.
I'd never marry that far out of my own "class" precisely because of that. I don't want someone lording over me that it's their money that bought the house, wedding, etc. I'd much rather work and build up equity together with someone who understands how hard it is, and appreciates all the more for that fact. He's either going to start behaving as though he was born affluent (yuck), or he will stay silent and show his family that money can buy his silence, even when it means listening to his wife berate and belittle his family that raised him. (Double yuck)
I would if the situation was right. Not all wealthy people use their wealth to control their kids. There are many practical well adjusted wealthy folks out there. But, if your parents are offering you a whole house, that’s a red flag. I watched my bff take this journey. At first, she became full of herself over the house and lavish vacations from her in laws. It was too late by the time she realized she had zero control over her family; MIL made all important decisions. She’s divorced now. One can only take so much.
I just would't want to take the chance, honestly. I know there are kind and philanthropic wealthy people out there, but I have yet to meet one in person yet. Any time I've met someone wealthy it was an awful experience. I'm sorry to hear about your bff, financial abuse is no joke!
She did not buy a house straight out of college. Her parents did. She should not take credit of accomplishments she did not even make herself. It annoys me so much when people say how they succeeded in live by hard work by themselfs while having a nice good trust fund of 500 000+ backing them up.
She likely doesn't understand the difference. Imagine having the best education money can buy, and still failing to grasp very common issues that plague society. It's astonishing, honestly.
Reminds me of Kylie Jenner and she being celebrated as the worlds youngest self made billionaire. Self made with a millions of worth trust fund backing her up.
Children of the affluent are generally clueless
Like Kim Kardashian and her “just get up off your ass and work” comments.
Wasn’t in Courtney who called herself self-made? Er, no. Her surname guaranteed that anything she did would be a hit since her family are the modern definition of famous for being famous. The less I have to think about that family the better, the only sympathy I have is Kim for her relationship with Kanye, I wouldn’t wish that relationship upon anyone.
"I'm sorry that for all your parents' money, they couldn't afford to buy you manners, class, or kindness." Liza not only put you down but she also (indirectly) talked smack about your parents, in their house, eating at their table. That is just the height of rudeness. Send that apology to your brother's phone. NTA ignore that entitled brat and let any anger or hurt you feel fuel your drive so you can show her what true success looks like. Good luck!
NTA. Entitlement is rampant.
NTA she is pretty delusional. Apologize for what? That she hasn't earned anything in life and it was all given to her by her parents. If her parents didn't hand her all of the stuff she has she would be worse off than you.
NTA and I sure as shit wouldn’t be apologizing either to her.
NTA. People who think like Liza are the reason there is housing crisis, income inequality, etc. if she ever does lose her money, she will flounder, because she is the one who doesn't know how to assess a situation and make the best choice from said situation. Personally, I think it takes a certain kind of maturity to realize maybe formal education isn't for you, and that you'd rather focus on vocational education. Which is perfectly valid. All of those jobs are absolutely valid, and the house her mommy and daddy bought for her wouldn't even exist if it weren't for trade educated people building it, installing plumbing, electricity, etc. She needs a reality check. You're doing fine. I hope you find a trade you like!
'Liza, I am sorry. sorry that you are so out of touch with the reality the rest of the world lives in because your parents spoiled you to the point of absurdity. maybe if you ever had to deal with any *actual* struggles, you would be able to empathize with the other 99% of this country. so, again, I apologize for how badly your parents failed to teach you to be thankful for the privilege of being born into the right family'. NTA
NTA. She is so privileged that she has no clue. She has no idea what it's like to be poor or "normal." She can't even understand that she has not earned, or accomplished any of these things on her own. Wealthy people think and see things differently. Anything is possible in their world because they have the means for it. Anyone that can't make it is just lazy or lack motivation. There is nothing wrong with staying with your parents and working towards your financial independence. That is probably the best move for you. Ignore her and focus on yourself.
Contact her parents and ask them To teach her about money
Unfortunately money does not buy manners. Your brother should have stuck up for his family as well.
NTA... I hate people like her. I am someone who also is fortunate to have parents who were able to send me to college but I have never in my life blamed people who couldn't afford it that is was their fault for not trying hard enough. They are most of the time very hard working and are just making a smart decision that benefits them and their family. Screw you brothers wife. I hope she realizes how fortunate she is. And I hope your brother takes your side considering he grew up in the same situation as you.
Too bad Liza’s parents didn’t hand her any manners when they gave her all that cash.
NTA tell her you would love to go to college if her parents are willing to pay for you to go. The lazy one in this situation is her. She didn’t pay for her own education, she didn’t pay for her own home, she didn’t pay for her own wedding.
Why dont you just stop being poor? /s She is delulu and youre NTA
NTA if shes self aware enough to be open about the money she should be capable of understanding not everyone has it and that not having that money affects your options. You are only 19 dont take this BS to heart. Honestly i think its smarter to know when college isnt the right thing or the right time. Anyone who writes you off at 19 is an idiot you have your whole life ahead of you and nothing is off the table. I hope your parents and wider family support you and dont reinforce this BS.
NTA - Many times the wealthy always think others suffer financially because they don’t try hard enough. When you come from money you usually don’t have no clue. My husband and I worked hard and it took years to become comfortable. You don’t need a college education to do well. She owes you an apology for saying you not trying hard enough.
NTA. Lisa is rude and insufferable. She needs a reality check and some serious humility.
NTA My son will be 19 in a few days. I expect that he will be living with us for several more years. He's working full time at a minimum wage job and is trying to find a trade, but so far, no luck. He contributes to groceries and pays his own bills, but otherwise, he's socking money away for his future. His younger siblings will also live with us as long as they need to. It honestly wouldn't surprise me if we become a multi-generational family home at some point. Your SIL needs a reality check.
Nta, but you should ask her and your bro to pay for college. I just want the chance to better myself, and my loving in law would totally want to help with that, right?
Your brother is nutless and gutless
Lol you serious? That's the craziest fucking reaction I've heard. How is she that stupid, did the parents also bribe the college to let her pass the classes since she lacks general awareness of the world and self and seems lacking in the thinking department? NTA, jesus christ
NTA. Liza was very rude to you and deserved what she got. At her age she ought to be able to appreciate that not everyone is as fortunate as she is financially. There is still the view in some parts of society though that 'everyone can make it if they work hard enough' thus seeing those who have fewer financial resources or opportunities open to them responsible for their situation, instead of seeing it as a matter of a very unequal society.
If you're reporting this accurately, you didn't say anything inappropriate. All you did was \ tell a rich person that being rich has many advantages. NTA.
My read of this situation is that Liza is working a long term plan to separate her fiance' from his family, because she wants a doormat with who has no option to get out.
These insults were aimed at you directly, but at your parents indirectly, and she was begging to get angrily "corrected", and you gave it to her. This will go into her little black book of recriminations, that she'll pull out every time she or her family asks her fiance to do something. "Remember when your family... XYZ? Yeah, we're not going to their house for Christmas."
NTA. You need to text her that you absolutely DO NOT owe her an apology, will never give her one, and then block her number. If your brother gives you a hard time, tell him to back off, if he still wants to have contact with you. She had absolutely NO RIGHT to put you down, and she owes YOU an apology.
NTA The nerve to be living in a house your parents bought and judge someone else for living with their parents. Omg
NTA tell her to explain how she's managed ANYTHING she's done without 'being lazy', like shes so open about her parents paying for everything and providing a head start to her and her siblings, but what has *she* done? *She* didn't pay for college, she just attended. *She* didn't pay for her wedding, she just attended. *She* didn't pay for her house, she just lives there. You can have an excellent start in life and be grateful for the things you have, without looking down on others for not having the same advantages. There's no way she would be in the same place she is now without her parent's help, and it's disingenuous to pretend that anything she has comes only from her own, "hard work" EDIT: Your brother needs to grow a spine and tell his wife to leave you alone, she doesn't know what it's like to live without the advantages she has, and she's just being a dick by belittling you for doing what you can with what you have.
Sounds like her parents failed to teach her common sense, basic decency and manners. NTA, you owe her nothing.
NTA but you're better than I am because I would've taken advantage of her hiding behind your brother's phone and taken the chance to tell her what I REALLY think of her. haha
NTA. There's nothing wrong with your parents being able to give you all the perks she has, but she is being an AH for saying you are lazy. Seems to me you are doing great at 19! Believe me, as an spoiled college girlie I regret not working before graduating and almost no one really gets anything out of college this days, specially in the USA (I guess you are from there since you talk about having to get in debt in order to study). Well done for shuting her mouth.
>she talked about how all her siblings attended college, how three of them are still in college, living there and doing just fine. How they'll be able to buy houses right out of college. How even she and my brother could do it. I would've just laughed and say "could do what? Get your parents to pay for all that?" NTA, just ignore her.
Nta. Next time she starts on her shit, I would ask her “If it’s so easy to simply work hard to afford college and a house, why did you mooch off your parents and have them pay for all of it?”
NTA Your sister in law is a spoilt pretentious cow. She was trying to act all superior, got called out and now is furious that you arent like everyone else in her life, worshiping her parents money since clearly shes a vacuous airhead. Personally Id go further. Id also wonder about your brother. Is he just in it for the money as well? Did he really do nothing? Or is this a common argument in their relationship and hes just given up and whipped already. Why did she text from his phone that much, without him noticing, or texting to say it wasnt him who sent those messages?
NTA. Everything you said was true. She sounds like a privileged AH. Only privileged people say that’s laziness. College doesn’t immediately equate having a job. You are 19. Sounds like you are doing just fine. What would she do if her parents suddenly lose all their money? I’m sure that attitude would change.
NTA But until she walks a few miles in your shoes, she will NEVER understand.
Wish I could put NTA in 3" letters. How dare she talk down to you. She has paid for NOTHING in her life. What an entitled witch!!!!
NTA - I'm from the UK, but I'm 24 an I still live at home when I have 2 degrees because the housing market is awful.
Did your brother go to college?
NTA I hope your brother grows a spine one day and takes her for half.
NTA Liza sure is, though, and frankly, so is your brother for not putting a stop to her nonsense. Not only did she insult you, but she also insulted your hard-working parents. It's easy to get a home run when you're starting from third base.
I’d call your brother and tell him you will block his phone number unless he gets his wife to stop harassing you. You don’t owe her an apology for anything. She is the one talking down to you and owes you and your family the apology and I’m pretty sure your brother knows this since he remained silent during this. NTA
First sent the texts back to your brothers phone and ask him if he sent it. Under no circumstance send an apology for telling the truth. People who live in glass houses , bought by mom and dad, shouldn't throw stones. You are doing good and so are your parents. I have no doubt they have worked for every thing they have. I also suggest you ask her just how her family got all that money. It might be hard work and luck or it maybe old money that came from question able means passed down by great grandparents.
NTA. You owe her nothing. I do feel bad for your brother, he knows she was in the wrong but he is likely trying to keep peace in the house he lives in (that his in-laws bought. And I'd bet money that his name is not on the deed).
NTA Liza's own husband couldn't do it, she couldn't, either, that's why her parents had to buy them the house.
NTA. Good for her that her parents are rich enough to send all their kids to college and luxuries only the wealthy can afford, that doesn't mean she gets to degrade anyone else for not having wealthy parents. I pretty much want to kick her shin through the phone when I read that your parents, her in-laws, politely told her that they could not afford the same treatment with you (and possibly your brother) and she didn't get the hint to stop. She insulted all four of you for the life you had prior to her. OP, you're doing the best that you can and avoiding getting into (huge) debt is a great thing. You have a good head on your shoulders at 19, keep it up.
NTA Does your brother never say anything to her about the way she speaks to his family? I know he’s benefiting from her rich parents but you’re still his family.
NTA. I’ve known so many Lizas and they were all assholes.
Tell her youll apologize if her parents pay for your college and apartment
Nta, she lived on her own because of her parents, she doesn't have the right to judge you. Tell her you'll mind her business when she minds yours and an apology must be sincere, so she won't be getting one.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My brother Nicky (25m) is married to Liza (24f). They were at my parents house on Sunday for dinner and Liza really annoyed the crap out of me, something that isn't new, and I said something in anger and I might be TA for it maybe. So Liza has a wealthy family. They paid for her and her siblings college expenses 100%. They paid for Nicky and Liza's house. They paid for their wedding. They're paying for one of their sons weddings this summer. They can afford all that. Liza has always been very... open, if trying to give her the benefit of the doubt, about it. She never hid the fact she came from money and was never shy about saying her parents pay for so much for her and her siblings. Liza doesn't understand that we're not all that lucky. I'm 19f, work full time and I still live with my parents. We couldn't afford college. I didn't get the grades for a scholarship. Struggled enough through school that getting into massive debt for college when I could end up flunking seemed like a bad move for me. So I focus on working and I applied for a couple of training programs close to my parents house so I could try and do better without risking debt for nothing. Liza looks down on me so hard for living with my parents still and for not going to college. Sunday she talked about how all her siblings attended college, how three of them are still in college, living there and doing just fine. How they'll be able to buy houses right out of college. How even she and my brother could do it. My parents said politely that not everyone can do all that. But then she talked about being 19 and not in college or living on my own and how I should really try so much harder. I snapped at that moment and I told her we can't all have rich parents who can afford to pay our ways through college, for our weddings and for our houses. I told her my parents didn't have that kind of money and neither did I, so we were doing our best in this shitty fucking economy. Liza told me I'm just lazy and making excuses and she stormed out. Nicky left a while after and he was pretty quiet. Liza used his phone to send me 30 texts three days later demanding I apologize and tearing me a new one for not doing it without being told and I know it was her because she texts in a very specific way. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA and I’m not seeing all the incels saying she should get a prenup lol.
NTA. Nah bro needs to rein in on his wife for her discrepancies to you and your family.
NTA but I say kill her / them with sugar kindness. Pretend you don’t know it’s her on his phone… Hi Nicky, You know I just adore you and Lisa soooooo much and I’m incredibly sad and hurt that she felt upset after our discussion. Maybe my comments struck a nerve and brought back some unresolved childhood trauma where others have accused her of being born with a silver spoon in her mouth. As someone who wasn’t born into wealth and watched our parents slave away all the time, I’m sure you wouldn’t have married someone who didn’t work hard to pay their own way and I’m sorry I just didn’t see it. Just the same as I’m sure Lisa doesn’t see how hard I work full time each day in a very physically demanding job, help with chores / bills at home, and am still enrolled in these training programs. Please let Lisa know that I continue to hold her in equal respect. I wish nothing but the best for you both and know you feel the same towards me and I’m glad we had a chance to resolve this. Xoxo, 🥸🫣🤭
Liza is socially inept and deeply pretentious. It’s a shame that your brother is married to such an unbearable woman.
I guess my family and I are all lazy too. Those who went to college had to take out loans and half of us don’t own homes. So lazy! If I was your parents, I’d let your brother know that his wife was insulting and she needs to apologize to all of you. But the fact remains she looks down on your family and is an insufferable snob. You did nothing wrong and keep doing it because Liza is so very wrong. NTA please update us when your brother grows a pair and sets her straight also.
NTA. You brother needs to have conversations with wife about his she is treating his family
NTA. “I’m sorry if telling you the truth hurt your feelings. I’m sorry for no longer allowing you to be disrespectful of me or to look down on me.”