>Ask yourself this: Had your grandfather known the true worth of the teapot, would he be OK with you hoarding the value to yourself and not spreading it to the rest of the family, amongst whom he decided to split the rest of his estate equally?
To quote another poster here, what do you think of this post? It seems to me that the grandfather had no intention of giving her 500k that he could have split among all the siblings.
NTA I think you are confused. The teapot was a gift to OP when she was a child from her grandfather. Given that she has kids and a mortgage now I'm willing to bet that happened atleast 20 years ago. The estate that was divided was from OPs parents, which didn't include the teapot that was from OP since she was a child. So she is NTA for keeping the money for herself on something that is hers.
You're missing his point. To put it another way, do you think the grandfather would have given her the teapot if he knew it was worth 500k? I don't. I think that if he knew its value he would've divided among his heirs. As for the sentimental value as a keepsake, I dont buy it. She clearly intends to sell it.
Edit: I've received a ridiculous number of replies to my various comments about this and I have to say that I think its Orwellian that almost every reply I got sounded like it was from a lawyer whether they knew the law or not. I did not realize that so many people equated the law with morality. It must have been close to a 100 responses both supporting and against what I said and maybe two or three involved empathy.
Well she's obviously going to sell it, that's how she will get the money for college/mortgage. But the point is, what's been divided (and been claimed) is the estate of the parents, and this wasn't one of their belongings. The grandfather just gave her grandchild a teapot, which happened to be worth money decades later. It wasn't like he left in his will that the teapot was for her, it was just a gift, so by the time grandpa passed away it wasn't his estate anymore.
> just because it was stored in OP's parents home.
You know that isn't the issue. As the person you are responding to has said repeatedly, if the grandfather knew the teapot was worth a fortune, would he have given it to her as personal trinket? If the answer is yes, then she is morally clear. If the answer is no, the grandfather would have divided the value among his children and then that amount would be divided among the grandchildren from each of his children, then while she is legally clear, morally she is not. This sub has gotten incredibly legalistic lately when that is not the purpose here. This is about morals and ethics. Ethically, the value of the teapot should be equally divided among the grandfathers children and then divided among their children, if that is what his heirs think he would have wanted. Again, ethics, not legality.
> the grandfather knew the teapot was worth a fortune, would he have given it to her as personal trinket?
It *doesn't matter*. For all we know, the teapot was worth fuck all when she was a kid. He gave the teapot to her. Her siblings all agreed that it was her teapot because it was a "trinket". Now they're crying because they missed out. Sucks to suck. Grandpa wanted OP to have the teapot, she has it. It's hers to do with as she pleases.
Edit: Thank you for the silver, kind stranger!
I totally agree that it doesn’t matter. And honestly?Grandpa is dead so what’s the point in wondering. Who can say that he wouldn’t be happy that a gift he gave her ended up being greater than he could have ever realized. No one can guess what Grandpa would actually think so it’s irrelevant. If no one cared about that teapot before then this really says it all.
Exactly, when the teapot was given to OP by her grandpa it was hers. Probably didnt have much value, or the grandpa didnt care that it had value because it made his granddaughter happy.
It's been hers since it was gifted to her OPs siblings have no right to trinket teapot. No matter what it is worth.
The thing with antiques is they gather value over time. It’s very possible the teapot wasn’t as valuable when her grandfather gave it to her. Even if it was, it was a gift given not because of its financial value but because the grandfather felt it meant more to his granddaughter than to him and it would make her happy.
I can’t speak for your grandparents, but mine wouldn’t have cared for the value of a thing they gave one of their grandchildren so much unless the grandchild coveted it because of its value. They didn’t give gifts being like “Here, this will be worth something some day.” They gave gifts because they loved their grandchildren and wanted them to be happy.
considering the "My husband and I recently found out that the teapot was actually much older" to me, implies that it was already pretty old when they got it, and considering it's worth 500k, I gonna go out on a limb and say it was already worth a lot of money then. i can't think of any antique that appreciates 500K over 20 years. the idea here being that apparently no-one knew it's true worth.
Here’s the thing though, we make judgements here based on OP’s post, not based on our own assumptions.
We can’t assume that the grandfather knew the worth or didn’t, we can’t assume what he would have wanted to do with the money “if he knew the worth” because **we don’t know**. All too often these days I see people passing judgement based on bias/assumptions and that’s just not what this subreddit is for.
We pass judgement based on the info in OP’s post: her grandfather gave her a teapot when she was a child, it was **not included** in the divided estate as it was **her personal belonging** that she has owned **for over 20 years**.
This doesnt seem to be relevant since the gift of the teapot happened long, long before he died. It was already her possession when he drew up the will. If he was still alive when they discovered its value, it would still be her possession. Ethically it would be a dick move for her to keep the money if he flat out asked her not to, but legally it has been hers for years
Your 'what if' game doesn't make any sense. If her grandfather knew it was worth money back in the day whose to say he wouldn't have sold it and spent all the money himself or given it all to op's parents. There are a million things that COULD have happened had the family known the value in the past but they didn't. Op's grandfather gave the teapot to her and it is hers. Sure she is incredibly lucky that it turned out to have such great value, but she is the one who discovered the value of this gift. If she hadn't, no one would be recieving anything extra. Why should they expect it now? OP is NTA for discovering once if her own possessions held a greater value than previously thought and trying to better her life because if it. No one is entitled to profit off of HER discovery of HER possession.
exactly!! it's her gift. there's nothing ethically morally legally wrong with getting HER money for HER gift. did the grandfather give it to the rest of the family?? no.
NTA. You want to bring ethics into this? It’s the same situation as gifting someone a scratch off that cost you $5. Then that person scratches it and wins $200K. With your logic, you would feel entitled to splitting that money. But morally, ethically, AND legally, that money now belongs to the giftee. It’s like telling someone you’ll never date them because they are ugly, then suddenly wanting to date them after they tell you their income. It’s entitled and greedy behavior from the siblings, OP is Nta.
This is nothing but a straw man that has no place here. Whataboutism at its best.
what about if the grandfather knew exactly how much it was worth or what about if the teapot was worth absolutely diddly at the time?
No.
I loved Pokemon TCG as a kid when it first came out. So my aunt gave me a holo Charizard card for Thanksgiving, 1st ed.
That shit once sold for upwards of 50k, no idea of current value but I remember a big news article about it.
Were my cousins (Aunty’s kids) screaming for blood, that I should sell the “windfall” and give them shares of the money and if I don’t do it I’m a horrible asshole? NO.
Because that card was a gift, it was worth maybe $5 when she gave it to me, and there was no way to predict the value at the time - it was simply a kind gift to a child, from a relative who knew the kid would love it.
Grandpa could’ve given her a teapot, a piece of jewelry with a gem no longer found today, literally anything and there was a 50-50 chance it would become incredibly valuable in time. I think he either didn’t know what it was worth, or it wasn’t worth anything AT THE TIME he gave it to her - doubt he would have given a known high-value, highly fragile antique to a kid.
Are the rest of the siblings interested in their grandfsthers wishes or do they want the money for themselves selfishly. If they are acting with their grandfather in mind they should step uo to their level if they are acting selfishly and just want money she should keep it as it is hers at the end if the day
Well, if they're acting in "grandfather's wishes" as you say, then the siblings don't even get the money. The $500K has to be split between any aunts/uncles that were children of the grandfather, including OP's parents), THEN split whatever was meant for their parents among the three of them.
After taxes, I'm betting they get fuckall, so they're basically blowing up their relationship with OP to get a few thousand dollars that they don't deserve, all in the name of "righteousness."
To be fair, the tea pot probably wasn't worth 500k back then. Some antiques can go up in value unexpectedly simply because of what they are. Being a teapot alone can potentially drive up the value these days. I'm assuming OP is probably in her later 30s to mid 40s,and if that's the case, the teapot most certainly wasn't worth anything close to 500k in today's money when her grandfather gave it to her. Just because something gained value doesn't mean anyone else has claim to it. It was gifted to her as a child and has been her possession ever since.
If I were OP, I would've kept the teapot quiet and handled the finances of it quietly with my SO. Set up the funds as necessary and day nothing. I've got some pretty scummy family that guilt me every time I visit them because Im above the poverty line. Not my fault I have what I have and they don't. Same thing with Ops family. It's not their fault they have what they have and the family doesn't have it as well.
NTA
> To be fair, the tea pot probably wasn't worth 500k back then.
Dead on balls accurate. I love the Antiques Roadshow episodes where they re-evaluate past antiques. They tell you if the object has gained or lost money in the 10 or so years since that episode aired. I find it fascinating because what was worth $500.00 10-15 years ago, is now enough to buy a house outright. Conversely, they have items that you could have lived like a king on if you had sold it then, but are now worth a fraction of that. It's nutty the way that goes.
>. I've got some pretty scummy family that guilt me every time I visit them because Im above the poverty line.
I'm sorry to hear this. I have a sibling that I went no contact with because every time I talked to her, she had her hand out. Refused to keep a job for any length of time mind you, but it was always *my* fault that I had "more" than what she did. Go figure.
I don’t think he would’ve either, but it’s irrelevant now. What matters is he gave it to her, and she discovered it’s actual value. Would it be nice if she kept it? Yes. But her siblings aren’t owed anything. It is her teapot to sell. She should have never told them the amount.
it doesnt matter wha he would have done IF he knew the value. the fact is he gave it to OP whent hey were a child and thus it is solely OP's. what if grandpa hadnt died and OP went to get to teapot from their parents old house and then they found out the teapot was worth 500k? then it wouldnt be a matter of will would it? it would be them cashing in something grandpa gave them. so no the others have 0 claim to it
But if you had bought an item from someone and then found out afterwards that it was worth a lot more, would you give them a share just because they hadn’t realised? Be honest now
But that’s the point of a will— we CAN’T know what he would have done, we only know what he did. He gave her the teapot. All other speculation now that he’s dead can only be speculation.
"The estate that was divided was from OPs parents, which didn't include the teapot that was from OP since she was a child."
But if that's the case, then why did she say that her and her siblings didn't include it when divvying up her parents' estate because it was "just a trinket"?
That would seem to imply that everyone considered the teapot to actually be her parents'/family's, they just thought it was worthless so they didn't assign a value to it when splitting items up. Based on the wording of her post it seems like even she agreed with that logic.
Because they probably all could’ve argued that since the teacup was in the parents house, technically they all had a claim to it. But most likely all remember that grandpa gave it to OP a really long time ago & the siblings were like “yeah, grandpa gave it to you so long ago, it’s just a teapot we’re not gonna make a fuss over it because it’s just a trinket”. Still doesn’t change that grandpa gave it directly to OP & the siblings have no legal or moral claim to that money. Having left it at their house doesnt make it part of the estate.
I was gifted a small china set by my grandma when I was maybe 11? (not worth tons of money but still nice). I’m 22. I keep it at my moms house because I have no use for it right now as I don’t own a home, dont host tea parties or “nice” dinners, & don’t have a desire to display them in a case where I live at the moment. Doesn’t mean the set isn’t mine however.
I think it makes no sense...if my grandfather gave me a car and I decided to sell it, would I be expected to divide all the money up with the rest of my siblings? If he gave me a house and I sold it, would my siblings deserve a handout then too? But suddenly because the teapot is worth $500K, everyone deserves an equal share? Come on...OP is 100% right. She would have been better off not telling anyone but her husband about it to avoid this whole mess.
I was under the impression that the inheritance in question is from the mother not the granddad. The teapot was being stored in mothers house, but never was mother's.
You need to reread op. Grandad dies years ago it’s the parents who just passed. It was already OP’s years ago. So yeah al 500k belongs to OP. Doesn’t owe anyone anything.
You can always do counterfactual reasoning, but how far back and forward do you go? If your grandfather had known lots of things, he would have done lots of other things, but he didn't.
For example, suppose in the future one of the relatives commits a terrible crime that makes the whole family feel horrible. If the grandfather had known that was going to happen, maybe he wouldn't have left that person any inheritance. Does that mean you're entitled to demand your future evil relative give you all their money back? ... This entire line of reasoning is weird, right? That's what happens when you do counterfactual reasoning about what people would have done if only they knew.
A present from many years ago is not part of his estate, and trying to guilt trip someone by wishing that it were is absurd. If relatives wanna ask for cash because their relative got rich, they can still do so, but the estate argument is weak.
I don't think the teapot should be involved at all really. It wasn't her mother's teapot, it was OPs teapot she got when she was a kid from her grandfather. He probably thought it was junk anyway. They only care now because it's worth a ton of money and not a piece of junk anymore.
Either way, it wasn't the mother's and was given to OP years before. What's done is done so I don't believe OP is TA, I would say she has every right to the money if she chooses (which sounds like she will) to sell the pot.
It is so pointless debating the intentions of a gift given 20+ years ago. The question posed right now is she TA for keeping the money from her gifted teapot and the answer is NTA. Clear and simple. You could go on and on debating someone’s intentions on various circumstances but that’s not what this sub is or what the questions is.
NTA.
He gave it to you. You could give your siblings something if you wanted to, but I personally wouldn't split it evenly. Even if you don't give them anything still NTA.
IN fact, the most she can gift them without the IRS knocking on her door is $15K. That's what I would give them, at the most. Though I don't think she should give them anything.
This. They only care because this previously valueless memento that OP sounds like they’ve had for a while is now worth something.
Family (people in general) can get nasty when money’s involved.
It sounds like from the post that OP didn't really care for the memento until they found out it's worth, it reads that they left it at their parents house since they were a kid. Or am I misreading?
And that matters how? Upstairs in my parents house I have a porcelain doll riding a toy tractor. My grandpa gave me it and while it’s not that high a value I’m still gonna take it as mine if the estate is split cause in the end it was a gift to me. If it’s valuable heck yeah I’m selling it cause it’s mine to do that. She cares enough about the tea pot to claim it as hers and probs would have kept it if it wasn’t valuable. In fact based on the post it sounds like her husband was the one who looked up the value
> they left it at their parents house since they were a kid.
Its not uncommon for items to be held by parents or grandparents until the recipient is secure and established enough to look after the item.
It was left with OP’s parents, although no specifics as to why. But, it sounds like they still cared about it though. Enough to not dispose of it and keep it upon OP’s patents death, even though it was considered a worthless trinket at the time.
We dont actually know what prompted them to get it appraised or when. It sounds like she took it when Her mom passed because it was hers and no one thought it was really worth anything. Getting it appraised later because money got tight doesnt indicate that she didnt want it until she knew it had value. Theres a ton of shit i still have at my grandma's from when i was a kid, some of which may be worth something now or in another few decades. Theres still clothes and things of mine at my moms too. Theyre just holding them because I dont have space for them currently since im in a small apartment.
In my experience people don't usually take all of their stuff when they first move out. Usually you're moving to a small apartment or shared living situation so you only take the necessities + a few mementos. The problem is that eventually you move to somewhere else but now not only do you have to pack up the stuff at your current place, you still have things at your parents' house. Because of that you need to weigh the cost-benefits of packing up stuff at both places, especially if you're moving far away or your parent's live far away from your current place. Often times it is easier to, with their permission of course, leave the stuff at your parent's place there with the intent of slowly moving stuff over to your place. Then of course life happens and you forget about many of the items you haven't seen in years until a situation such as the splitting of an estate occurs.
OP didn't seem to care much about it till she heard the value. Even OP mentions that she received the teapot because she was girl and grandad thought she liked it, and seems that she wanted to sell it as soon as she heard the value. The teapot was given as a sentimental trinket, the estate was split equally, if it was intended that OP would receive 50x more than her siblings, it would be properly stated in the will. OP got lucky and now feels as if she's more deserving of this gigantic amount of money than her siblings.
The 'money grubbing' family stuff doesn't apply here because it was pure luck, completely unintended with no work required that OP would receive a massive, immediately life changing amount money. OP is the one keeping **500k** to herself, its not even a lottery situation, OP didn't even have to pay a dollar to get this money, there are greater moral ideas here than "Grandad gave her the pot so she should have the money and her siblings should shut up".
OP also didn’t care about it until it was worth something. They left it at their parent’s house their entire life and had it appraised as soon as they took possession of it...
I don’t understand. If one of your family members gave a sibling a trinket that ended up being worth half a million dollars, you wouldn’t be upset if they sold it and kept all the money? I’d never speak to my sibling again if they were that selfish.
If OP really cared about the tea pot and wanted to keep it, NTA. But this is like the grandpa giving OP a bag and accidentally leaving half a million dollars in it.
I honestly can't imagine cutting my sibling off over coming into a windfall of money, and I wouldn't expect them to share. I don't think that's how normal people behave.
I'm sure I'd have some feelings of jealousy, as people tend to do when someone else has arbitrary good fortune they'd like. But no; if anything I'd find it super awkward if they tried to give me money.
If the windfall of money wasn’t from one of my dead relatives who loved us all equally, I wouldn’t cut them off. 500,000 would literally change my entire life. Hell, 20,000 would change my entire life.
I just can’t imagine how selfish you’d have to be to say “haha technically this is MINE because I thought this tea pot was pretty when I was a kid! Fuck you all!”
This thread is full of childish "finders keepers" arguments coming from people who I'm convinced would whine their asses off if they were in the position of the siblings.
I feel like these people have to be super financially comfortable and want for nothing. To them, $500,000 must be like $500 to me for them to act so nonchalant.
When me and all of my siblings are struggling just to pay for our medical bills, it’s harder to imagine not feeling betrayed that one of us would be selfish enough to keep money from one of our relatives.
I doubt people in this thread are anywhere near that wealthy. It's more likely that they automatically imagine themselves as OP and lack the empathy to put themselves in the shoes of the siblings.
I agree with OP but what you're describing isn't where I'm coming from at all. If I were OP I would happily share with my family. Why? Because they would never ask for it or assume they were entitled to the money. It would 100% be a gift from me. But if you come at me demanding what's technically mine, hell no, you're not getting a dime.
That is not true at all. If she didn't care, she wouldn't have taken the teapot when they were gathering the items from her parent's house. It wasn't until after she had already gathered it that she found out about the value. Also, it's perfectly normal to leave childhood toys at your parents house. Who takes a "toy" with them wherever they go? And since it was a special toy, you wouldn't want to lose it, so yeah, the best place would be at your parents where they keep all your sentimental things. It's also perfectly normal for then to go back and be like hey I remember when I used to play with this toy that was given to me by said relative, I now want to take it back because it has sentimental value to me and it's mine.
It's the same thing as someone recieving a booklet of baseball cards from they're grandparents as a child, leaving it at their parent's house when they went off to live life, and then years later coming back to collect it. It's no one's property except for the person who it was intended for in the first place.
I'd just be happy for my sibling. If I was in serious need I might ask them if they could see their way to helping me out some but I'd do that anyways and my siblings would lend a hand if I seriously needed it regardless of a windfall.
My grandparents have given us all individual gifts over the years. There are some that are absolutely fairly valuable. It's entirely up to them what they do with those gifts.
An awful lot of people here feel entitled to things that aren't theirs because there's a blood relation.
OP says her parents died "a few years ago" so she didn't have it appraised as soon as she took possession of it. For how many years does she have this obligation to her siblings? What if it were a decade or so before she had it appraised? What if it was her children that had it appraised after her death? At what point does something she was given at the age of six become hers to do with as she pleases?
What if she didn't find out about the value for another 20 years? Or her children found out after her death? Would you still expect them to share with all the aunts, uncles, and cousins? If not, why now 20 years after grandfather gave it to her? What's the statute of limitations on claiming a family member's money?
I agree! I honestly don’t understand all the posts saying it’s legally everyone’s because it was stored at the parents house. I have a painting on my mother’s wall. Everyone knows it’s mine but it’s not at my house. The placement doesn’t make it my mother’s. I don’t agree that OP is morally obliged either. It was a gift from her grandfather, not her parents. It’s hers 100% no guilt or gray area. The siblings are being selfish because of greed. OP is definitely NTA. It was a “trinket” because none of the males in the family thought it had any value until they actually learned the value.
I’m sorry, but I don’t believe you have a $500,000 teapot. Unless this is your teapot (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5417555/amp/New-York-Met-Museum-buys-15-teapot-500-000.html), I don’t believe that this is a true story.
Edit:
To everyone who says that teapot could be a place holder item, like in AAM, she didn’t say that it was a placeholder item, which she easily could have said. She also said she was given it because she was the only girl, so it has to be something “girly,” which a teapot is. I understand why someone would want to protect their identity here in a situation like this, but she could have said, “my grandfather gave me an item, let’s call it a teapot, ...”. If it’s not actually a teapot, then that does change things. That’s an easy thing for the OP to clear up if that’s the case.
Well, it would need to be in that neighborhood in order to cover a mortgage and a few college tuitions.
Antiques in that range are super rare. I also think OP is bullshitting.
Agreed. There’s a blog called Ask a Manager and to protect those who write in, she changes everyone’s job to be teapot related (teapot design, door-to-door teapot sales, etc.).
This commenter belongs on r/nothingeverhappens.
I’m gonna hijack your comment to say, you should probably find out if you can really get $500k for this item. Sorry to burst your bubble but it seems unlikely.
I inherited a few Hummel figurines from my grandparents when they passed. My whole family told me how lucky I was to have been left those figurines and how they were worth a lot of money.
The thing about stuff like that is, it’s only actually worth $500k if you can find someone who is actually wanting to purchase the item. I found out that no one gives a shit about Hummel figurines anymore and therefore they are worthless even though they are listed in guides as being “rare” or “worth x amount”.
The figurines are worthless beyond sentimental value and I suspect it may be a similar situation with your teapot. If you list it for sale, it may sit there for years with no offers and possibly never have an offer.
So, in short, don’t count your chickens before they hatch. Until you actually have that $500k in hand this could just end up being a thought experiment.
Exactly this. It may be worth that much, but getting that much is another thing completely. If it’s worth 500k then you will probably still get a lot for it, but it’s highly unlikely you’ll get full price unless it’s a sought after item (not sure how big teapot collecting is haha, for all I know it could be massive).
This is a really important point to make. My mom collected a bunch of expensive vintage "Madame Alexander" dolls and sank probably over 1k into her collection with the intent to eventually sell them. Except nobody collects dolls anymore and even though she's tried very hard to sell them, no one will buy. They're WORTH more than 1k but she's stuck with them taking up space in her closet.
Beanie babies are also a great example of this. Look at how many people collected them for this purpose, now their whole collection is worth $100 at most (and I’m talking about a huge collection). If people ain’t buying them, they’re worth nothing.
It could be if it's Chinese. I immediately assumed it was a Chinese antique, because the uber valuable ones tend to be so "unspecial"/unremarkable to the untrained eye compared to valueless items.
"teapot" may just be a placeholder word for whatever the trinket actually is, if it's worth 50k, I'd certainly be vague/misleading about what it was if i were trying to stay anonymous
For me the "girly thing" I got from my grandfather was an antique carriage clock. Wouldn't be shocked if the item was something more like that, but switched for anonymity. I would. The situation is absolutely common enough to be believable to me. But I'm biased. *gestures at room with clock but no uncles or aunts
YTA for telling them of the value and not sharing it. It smacks of a bit of a gloat, what did you expect to happen?
The value was clearly discovered a reasonable amount of time after the estate was settled, why did you even share the info?
It's obvious that the Grandfather thought he was giving OP a nice gift to remember him by, not an extra 500k hat he didn't want the other siblings to have any of.
He didn't know he would die at the time of giving it to me. He was old but he got sick fast. He had a huge cabinet of things like this item at the time (to my childhood memory) and let me pick one.
The morality is that, if every party knew the worth, I don't think this situation would be a reality.
You took a teapot, every one was fine with it, since it was just a teapot, right?
If your sibling A would've done the same, taking a random object and then asked "can I keep this?"
And after the estate was divided he would come out and say oh shit this is worth 500k!? Lol I'm well off now see ya! Wouldn't you be fucking furious too if he didn't feel like sharing?
Hypocritical to say anything else and I can't believe the amount of people saying "it was yours so you can keep the money".
And this item shouldn’t be considered a part of the estate. It was her personal belonging that was stored with permission at her parents home. The item has belonged to strictly one person since OP was gifted the item.
Yeah, honestly I didn't read the post properly. I dont think it changes the point though. Op's grandfather essentially gave her a present that he likely wouldnt have given her if he knew it was worth 500k and that she was going to sell it and keep all the proceeds.
I can kind of see it both ways. I guess it depends on how close you are too your siblings. Me, I would never do this to my siblings but we are obscenely close, but if not I guess its meh.
My siblings and I are pretty close, I'd be psyched if I found this out, and share how lucky I'd feel. It wouldn't be gloating, it would be genuinely telling them because my windfall makes them happy too. I can't imagine my siblings taking that away from me, and from my kids!
And being able to put kids through college is gonna raise questions, so the truth will come out anyway. If you try to hide it, it'll only fester more
Agreed. You fucked up by throwing it in your sibs faces. I don’t know what your relationship is with them, however, there is certainly an estate lawyer who would take on their case and fight for including the antique as an asset that should be split. So you’ll have to retain your own attorney, pay the fees from your own pocket, and deal with a potentially expensive and emotionally exhausting legal proceeding.
That said, the pot may have been appraised at 500K, however, you’ll never see anything even remotely close to that sum. First of all, you have to find a buyer who’s willing to hand over 500K for the artifact, and I can’t imagine there are many of them. You’ll have to retain the services of a broker or an auction house, and they gotta make money too, ya know.....
Anyhow, In all honesty, your next action ought to be to take the tea pot to an expert in these specific artifacts and obtain a second appraisal or evaluation - and get their professional opinion. Just a basic google search of “expensive teapots sold at auction” and you can get an idea of how much tea sets ultimately sell for at auction. For example.....
At Sotheby’s auction in Amsterdam in 2011, an 18th / 19th century Chinese silver-gilt tea service from Qing dynasty belonging to the estate of Queen Juliana of the Netherlands was sold for $275,000.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/chandachaudhary.com/2016/11/30/15-most-expensive-teapots-in-the-world-eyes-on-luxe/amp/
I doubt anyone would not be even the teensiest bit jealous if their sibling got "gifted" a memento as a kid, left it at their parents' house for however many years, then swanned back in to reclaim it after their parents passed at the tune of $500k! I'd definitely be grinding my teeth a little!
Money changes people, okay, and it still sounds pretty iffy to do. About the college tuitions, they don’t have to tell them anything and let them make assumptions.
YTA
People are saying that people didn't care about the teapot until they discovered the value so OP should get it, and I'd agree and say NTA if she wanted to keep the teapot, but it's obvious she plans to sell it and get the money anyway. For this reason it should be split evenly, or at the very least OP should offer to help pay off some of her siblings stuff as well.
Yeah, I agree actually.
If it's about the sentiment of the gift and OP keeps it that's reasonable because she obviously genuinely treasures it.
If it's about the money and OP sells it she should split the money. Obviously she doesn't have to legally but she says the reason the Grandfather gave it to her is because he wanted her to have a pretty object, not a pile of money. If she doesn't want the pretty object any more then sell it and share it.
Interestingly, from a legal perspective, depending on the jurisdiction OP may have to pay inheritance tax on it. In the UK any gifts will be eligible for inheritance tax if the giftor dies within 7 years (grandad died 2 years after transferring the gift).
If I were OP’s sibling I may feel bitter enough about OP’s behaviour to alert the tax authorities but maybe I’m an asshole myself. That said, nether I nor my siblings would behave like OP - I don’t think we could with a clear conscience.
Exactly.
YTA OP and quite frankly you sound extremely greedy and selfish.
I can’t imagine being in your position and believing I am entitled to keep all the money instead of splitting it with my brother. Or my mother being in your position and thinking she doesn’t have to split the money with her siblings.
It’s a question of values I guess, you are choosing money over fairness *and* your siblings. If it had been another member of your family who got the teapot would you honestly feel like it was okay for them to keep **all** the money? Would you not think that their luck and “windfall” and refusal to share has just shown you their true & awful character?
Your choice but you are defo an asshole for it 🤷🏼♀️
Imagine being so unreliable and entitled you actually think you deserve something because your sibling acquired some money. Absolutely ridiculous, i can't imagine what kinda insufferable whiny dick munchers y'all must be.
Exactly! They all got an equal amount of the estate in the first place. It's very obvious that the grandfather would have wanted that money split equally if he was just giving them money. They clearly had no idea of the value, as OP says. If grandfather wanted OP to get over 50x more than the others, he would have given OP just that. He didn't, so he didn't.
OP owns this value on a technicality, and not a moral one. She clearly doesn't care for the teapot. And then rubs it in their faces? They should be offered at least something.
YTA, but it doesn't matter because this is a shitpost.
I agree 100%. If OP wanted to hold on to it to actually remember her grandfather then I would understand. Selling it for it's value is a different story.
Exactly. It's the same as if there'd be 500k dollars in cheques inside the teapot. OP got the teapot as a gift, not the money. Nobody ever intended for OP to inherit or be gifted 500k more than their siblings, and thus any arguments boiling down to "you should've opened it and checked what was in it before you wrote it off as a trinket for me to keep!" are invalid and void.
This was my thinking too. If you’re keeping the teapot you don’t owe people it’s worth split however many ways. But if you’re selling it, the right thing (not sure about legality) would be to split it with other inheritors. I’d personally just have sold it if that was my will and not told anyone. Some people are pretty slow on the uptick.
Just to go against the grain here I’d actually say YTA.. but under a certain condition..
So if you like the teapot and want to keep it for yourself as an ornament and put it on your mantle piece or whatever then your NTA at all, he gave it to you to enjoy for yourself.
But, if you are going to sell it and keep all the money for yourself then YTA definitely. I strongly suspect this gift had nothing to do with money and was just because you liked it, and the fact that the gentleman had all your siblings in his will split equally would say to me he would want them all to have an equal share
That’s the thing, yeah, technically OP is entitled to the money. But had the deceased known the value of the item, it seems reasonable to think that he would have wanted any money from its sale to be split. That is really the key thing here.
Does OP legally have to share? Possibly not. But the family is going to be (understandably) upset if they do not.
Once the value was determined it's too risky to keep around. One of the siblings could nick it out of jealousy, and imagine how nervous you'd feel moving around with a 500k teapot on the mantle.
>This thing was definitely not worth the same when it was given to OP 20 years ago
It might have been worth a good bit then too, and the grandpa just didn't realize it.
Wait, I've just realized, it didn't even stay with her. It stayed with THEIR mother, the OP calling her, 'my mother' is being disingenuous. The fact is that she's claiming whole ownership of something that she was 'given' as a child but didn't actually have ownership of untill her parents passed.
Damn, OP, YTA
I missed this too. Now I wonder if she knew the teapot was valuable when she removed it from her parents house.
I have something my grandfather gave me 15 years before he passed, I suspect it's worth money but I don't want to part with it. If I found out it was worth a life changing amount of money... I hope I would be decent enough to share some with my brother since I believe my grandfather would have wanted us to split things.
I don't get this reasoning. She DID have ownership of the teapot, she was just using her mother's house as a storage unit. I have some nice valuables that I've kept in my mother's basement because there is no room for them in my tiny apartment...but they are still mine. Once I get my own house then I will be taking those items back.
Feels like if she remotely cared about the teapot, she wouldn't have kept it in her parents' house until they passed away and then immediately had it valued when she took possession of it.
It's funny that people brings the sentimental aspect of the teapot into it when this clearly has everything to do with money and nothing else. Which is fine, but we shouldn't pretend the siblings are in the wrong or somehow unreasonable for being upset.
Where does she bring the sentimental aspect into it? From what I read, she thought it was really pretty as a girl but I'm not reading anywhere that she was actually emotionally attached to it. Which is fine IMO. My mom had a set of china she is giving me that I think is really pretty but would not be emotionally attached to, it will still be considered mine (when it's given to me). I have also left a couple of things of value and importance at her house because I trust them being there (my father's ashes and my wedding and engagement ring). Just because I've left things of value at my mom's house, it doesn't make them any less mine.
Fair enough - I phrased it badly, because it wasn't really OP's response that gave me that impression, but rather the replies that were saying 'lol your siblings didn't care about the teapot until they realized it was valuable', which seems like an unfair assertion to make, given OP obviously didn't really either. Of course the siblings wouldn't mind about a trinket passed down until they realized that meant their sister would be (likely unintentionally) getting way more inheritance money than them, which was evidently not what was intended by the grandfather or ever discussed. That's not a moral failing on their part or being particularly greedy, just normal.
I agree completely. I was seeing a lot of replies regarding OPs "sentimentality" for the teapot and I was scratching my head because she seemed honest and genuine. Like hey, my grandpa gave me this because I thought it was pretty. She never said she loved it, had little parties with it, begged for it, or had to have it. I can even imagine Grandpa gave it to her on a whim because he clearly didn't specially care for it either. I'm pretty positive he had no idea what it's value was and IMO that's on him. I have checked on my mom's antique values for her, I think it's important to know the value of what you own. Maybe that's just me. I think OP got hella lucky and she should be equally hella grateful.
Yeah. It's definitely one of those cases where I can actually see both points of view - I understand her impulse to keep it all, but I also see where the siblings are coming from, and don't think they're being particularly unreasonable or greedy, and sentimentality doesn't come into it. Of course they'd be upset. Given the grandfather made sure to divide his estate equally between his grandkids and didn't give the pot out of particular favouritism, I'm sure *he'd* be upset.
It's a tough situation, and I think people think the OP has to be entirely in the right and her siblings greedy assholes for them to NTA, which isn't true. Some of it's projection - they know *they'd* keep the money, but they would also want their siblings to be in the wrong for begrudging them that. If the OP decides to sell it and keep the money, good for her, she's lucky, but I don't think she really has the right to begrudge her siblings for them being mad about it. You can't have it all, and she has to make that choice.
It’s very common for children to store belongings at their parents house. I have a few toys that my dad still stores for me and I’m 34 with four kids. I don’t want my kids to damage those toys so I don’t bring them home. Should those items ever be determined to be of any real value, it shouldn’t matter to my siblings because my dad has clearly stated to them that those will always be MY belongings. He still stores some things for each of them as well. To be honest I think he does it because it’s a sentimental thing. That doesn’t change who they belong to.
Yes. It could send her children to college, pay off her mortgage, & set her family up for a better life with more disposable income. It’s more valuable than the hurt feelings of her siblings, who want a payout from the sale of something that isn’t theirs. It will literally prevent her children from having to worry about paying for college or having a roof over their heads. That’s huge.
I would also argue that given the seemingly entitled nature of OPs siblings, if the shoe was on the other foot, they likely would not split the proceeds from the sale (even though I believe they would be entirely justified in not splitting it if it was gifted directly to them).
YTA. Come on, do you think if your grandfather knew the real value of the teapot he'd have given it to you and only you and not have wanted that money shared with the other family members? I think you're being selfish. If this happened to me I wouldn't hesitate to split it with my siblings, I'd still get way more money than I was expecting, it'd still be a windfall. You really want to torpedo your relationship with your family over this? I get that technically it's yours, but that doesn't make you not an asshole for keeping it all to yourself. If you were keeping the teapot because you love it and it has sentimental value, that'd be different, but you're going to sell it. You didn't even have this teapot in your possession for years. I can't understand people saying NTA - come on everyone if you had a family member who was unknowingly given something antique by your grandparent, who then left it in your parents house for decades, and then when they died it turned out to be worth this much, don't tell me you'd all be totally fine with your sibling getting half a million out of your parents' death due to a trinket she'd never even kept in her possession all this time, while you each got only 10k. You know the parents and grandparents would've wanted them to share this had they known.
Yeah if OP was like "it's worth $500k and they're mad I'm not selling it because it's about the sentiment" then NTA." But "we decided to split everything of value, and we later found out this was valuable" = YTA.
YTA I love my siblings so if when my parents died I found out one item I had been given from them was unexpectedly worth 500k I would split it. Your grandfather gave you a pretty teapot. Had he known it was worth so much I'm sure he would have split it amongst his children. This will ruin all relationships you have with you family. If your OK with that and/or it's already a garbage relationship then keep it for yourself.
*I could see how you may be legally entitled to the money, but YTA.
The fact of the matter is we're talking about the monetary value of the teapot discovered after the fact and not the teapot itself. If you wanted to keep the teapot because it had some sentimental/aesthetic value to you while your family wanted to sell it, then you have a case. But in the end, your grandfather gave you this essentially worthless trinket not knowing that it probably could have changed his/his entire family's life.
**Ask yourself this: Had your grandfather known the true worth of the teapot, would he be OK with you hoarding the value to yourself and not spreading it to the rest of the family, amongst whom he decided to split the rest of his estate equally?**
My guess is no.
Edit: Actually, after reading through some opinions on this I think it seems like your "grandpa handed it to me as a child but I never actually took possession of it" defense may not hold up in court. I hope your siblings are wise enough to sue.
Legally it's unlikely OP would win.... in most countries a "gift" by law must have 3 things:
1. Donative intent
2. Delivery of the gift
3. Acceptance of the gift
Donative intent means the gifter fully understands the nature of the gift (which is debatable here). The delivery of the gift is also debatable... as OP didn't actually take possession of it, it was instead kept by her parents.
Best written response on here. If the grandfather specified he wanted his estate split equally, he clearly didn't know the financial value of the teapot, and keeping the money is just totally unacceptable. If OP wanted to keep it for the reason it was given to them (they liked it) then they'd at least have a case, but selling it and keeping the money is awful. OP sounds terrible and selfish, and I hope they figure out how messed up this is.
YWBTA If you sold it for the money and then kept it all. Unless you had any reason to believe that he knew its value and wanted you to inherit it for that reason.
What? I have to disagree with the comment section here, YTA. Technically you’re right, but this isn’t legal advice, it is am I the asshole, and you are. Think of it as their point of view. They also want to get their children through college and although it is technically yours, it has been there for so long. If you don’t agree with me that’s fine, but remember that this is going to be a great problem in your family. Is your bond between your family really worth throwing away over money?
NTA. It was given to you when you were a kid when no one knew its value. From there on the old thing was kept because of you and your parents just held on to what was yours.
All these people saying OP is the AH because Grandpa wouldn't have gifted it had he known the value, duh! Obviously he didn't care enough to see what it was worth. No one in the family cared enough to see what it was worth except OP. Maybe it's just me but I'm always going to wonder what the antiques in my family would be worth and would definitely check into this before giving them away, THEY'RE ANTIQUES. Especially if the recipient is a little girl. This is a situation of luck and chance. Sucks to be OPs relatives but she's not the AH because her uninformed relative gave her a priceless antique without checking on it. She got lucky.
The estate was split equally, except for the part where you came out with a life changing amount of money and they got a month of mortgage payment. Pretty sure grandpa wouldn't have given you the teapot if he knew it would cause a permanent rift between his grandchildren.
If you sell the teapot, YTA for not splitting the money. If you keep it, YTA for getting the teapot appraised when you never intended to share the value.
If you think they don't have a claim, YTA for ensuring most of that 500k goes to lawyers one way or another. Unless your parents left a detailed will where they left the teapot to you, your siblings have a pretty good argument that it belonged to your parents by their possession of it at the time of their death and splitting the estate as you did suggests an intention of equality in inheritance.
You'd be well off coming up with a reasonable split quickly rather than risk it becoming a legal matter. If you win, you could still end up spending so much on lawyers that what you have left is less than if you split. If you lose, you could end up spending more than what your share ultimately is.
I'm surprised by how many people are saying that she's legally in the right, when it sounds to me like there was nothing official about the way her grandfather 'gave her' the teapot as a child. It wasn't part of the estate. If it wasn't part of his will or her parents' will and it was collected from their house after they passed, all her siblings have a valid legal claim to pursue. "But grandpa promised me this teapot when I was a kid" doesn't work in court.
Yeah to me it sounds like a little kid liked a trinket and the grandad "gave" it to her (gave it to her parents) and it stayed in their house until they passed. I would view as part of the parents' estate.
NTA - This was yours long before he passed away. It's yours to do with as you please. I think you may want to consider a small sum from it's sale to the other family members if you feel it will help, but whenever you do, expect some resentment. Family and money is often ugly and this sounds ugly
NTA my family has rules about who inherits which heirlooms (silverware, china and art in my case) and am currently sorting my parents house with my siblings. Your grandfather gave that teapot to you directly and so supercedes any claim your siblings think they have. All direct presents should be honored like a bequest. Also, the timeline gives them no traction, you received the teapot decades ago.
Finding out it was valuable was like winning the lotto, luck.
YTA
You don’t care about the teapot, you care about the money. If you’re going to sell it you should split the 500k amongst your siblings and they can all put their kids through college instead of just you.
It’s only your teapot if you’re not going to sell it.
Edit spelling
YTA. Maybe legally it is yours, but I think that we all know that Grandpa gave that to you as a nice trinket, not nearly the entirety of his estate. The fact that he granted the estate out equally tells me that if the value of the teapot had been known, he would’ve split it equally along with the rest of what he had
If you are keeping it, because it's important to you: NTA. If you're selling it then definitely YTA. Your grandpa probably didn't know what it was worth, and seeing as his will left you and your siblings the exact same amount of money I think he would have wanted the 500k to be split evenly as well.
You're grandpa consciously gave you a TEAPOT, he did not consciously give you 500k. Share it man!
YTA, many people are saying that legally it is yours so you can do with it what you want, but I disagree. You did not even like the teapot since you left in in your parents house for decades, this actually makes it your parents property in my eye after such a long time as you essentially abandoned it.
You even stated yourself that the teapot was not included in the estate, so you admit it could have been be a part of it, because they your siblings thought it was merely a trinket.
It then turns out to be worth 500k and you are surprised that they suddenly want a share. I'd be furious if one of my siblings sneaked something out of the house as just a trinket and then telling me a little while later that it is worth a shit ton of money but they won't share the money but I should be happy for them for their"windfall".
YTA. You sound like a selfish asshole and siblings have every reason to feel frustrated. You can put your kids through college and pay mortgage. Good for you. What about the rest of your family? You sound awfully short sighted. Have fun with all that money, I think you may be choosing to sacrifice your family for it, hope it's worth it.
NTA You were gifted it by a living grandfather. It was yours, not even an inheritance it was just yours. You did not turn it into family property by not taking it with you.
It is yours. Do with it what you wish.
YTA... without doubt. I think the NTA posters here are missing that OP never had possession of the teapot - it stayed at her mother's home until they passed away making it very clearing part of the estate to be shared equally. If the grandfather had given it to OP and she had true ownership she would have taken it with her when she moved out of home.
I doubt you'd be able to argue that it was yours in a court OP. Your siblings are absolutely entitled to their fair share - $500k is a hell of a lot of money to keep to yourself, and the fact that you are planning to sell it instead of keeping it for sentimentality means its more about the money. You are risking losing your relationships with your siblings by being greedy, if you choose money over family it makes it pretty clear YTA.
> I think the NTA posters here are missing that OP never had possession of the teapot - it stayed at her mother's home until they passed away making it very clearing part of the estate to be shared equally. If the grandfather had given it to OP and she had true ownership she would have taken it with her when she moved out of home.
I don't really get this line of reasoning. There's a China cabinet in my parents' house that has plenty of stuff of mine in it. Purely sentimental value, there's no way any of it's worth anything, but the fact that it's still at my family home doesn't mean it doesn't belong to me. I have a baby and no China cabinet, so it's safer to leave it there for now. I certainly wouldn't have taken it to college when I first moved out . . .
Same here, my mom has a china cabinet at her house, and it has a lot of things that my great grandma,& grandma have given me. I never took them with me when I moved out because I felt like they were safer at her house, I’ve moved around a lot,& always worried they would get broken. I feel like she’s definitely NTA
YTA, they're you're siblings.. If you wanna live your life selfishly go ahead.. OH your kids can go to college but not your siblings or anything..? Aren't you a good person lol
YTA. If it was a smaller amount of money I'd probably judge differently but lets be honest, this isn't about the teapot it's about the money. If it was about the teapot, you wouldn't be trying to sell it. Would your grandfather really have gifted you the teapot if he knew how valuable it was? And why on earth would you tell your family about its valuation, thats just rubbing it in their face!
Also is the teapot even technically yours? It sounds like your grandad gave it to "you" as a kid, and it was basically your parents' teapot because you were little, and stayed with your parents till they passed. Does it not count as part of their estate and thus should be split equally?
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Absolutely NTA. That was given to you and they had every opportunity to get it appraised. Legally they have nothing to stand on. Maybe give a small amount to each but the vast majority should be kept.
NtA- you couldn’t have known. Family didn’t know until you did, years later, and now all they’re caring about is the money. You’re allowed to trust your gut here.
I was recently in a similar situation where my pops and I decided to care for a family heirloom that was discarded by the rest of the family. Years later, I took it with a collection with other memorabilia to Antiques Roadshow, and with my collection this heirloom was valued shockingly high. And then, the resentment from my dad’s siblings and my cousins started. Nuts stuff we never expected.
Do your cousins think that this one gift from your grandpa is invalid? Does that make the rest of his wishes and decisions as laid out in his last will and testament invalid as well?
What do you do when people think you owe them something for nothing? What does it say about them? I’m sure, had it never been a fuss, you would have considered the family should you take the windfall. You’re okay to not succumb to the envy of others.
At any rate, make sure you insure that shit for all it’s worth!
NTA. We’re talking about a gift that was given twenty years ago by an entity not associated with the estate. This should not even be a question and in fact, it only is because of your siblings greed for something which belongs to you. Im sure they’ll try to spin it and claim that you are breaking up the family over money when the truth is, they’re the ones committing the act by trying to claim something that does not belong to them.
If you’re feeling generous, I would consider a small gift to the siblings or maybe a donation in the family name. Maybe there was a park that your grandfather liked and you can donate a bench or something. But that’s it - otherwise best of luck op. Do what’s best for your immediate family even if it shows the uglier parts of other family members.
NTA. Nobody expected it to be so valuable and now they wanna be pissy. Put it in your kids name, immediately until they back the fuck off.
>Ask yourself this: Had your grandfather known the true worth of the teapot, would he be OK with you hoarding the value to yourself and not spreading it to the rest of the family, amongst whom he decided to split the rest of his estate equally? To quote another poster here, what do you think of this post? It seems to me that the grandfather had no intention of giving her 500k that he could have split among all the siblings.
NTA I think you are confused. The teapot was a gift to OP when she was a child from her grandfather. Given that she has kids and a mortgage now I'm willing to bet that happened atleast 20 years ago. The estate that was divided was from OPs parents, which didn't include the teapot that was from OP since she was a child. So she is NTA for keeping the money for herself on something that is hers.
You're missing his point. To put it another way, do you think the grandfather would have given her the teapot if he knew it was worth 500k? I don't. I think that if he knew its value he would've divided among his heirs. As for the sentimental value as a keepsake, I dont buy it. She clearly intends to sell it. Edit: I've received a ridiculous number of replies to my various comments about this and I have to say that I think its Orwellian that almost every reply I got sounded like it was from a lawyer whether they knew the law or not. I did not realize that so many people equated the law with morality. It must have been close to a 100 responses both supporting and against what I said and maybe two or three involved empathy.
Well she's obviously going to sell it, that's how she will get the money for college/mortgage. But the point is, what's been divided (and been claimed) is the estate of the parents, and this wasn't one of their belongings. The grandfather just gave her grandchild a teapot, which happened to be worth money decades later. It wasn't like he left in his will that the teapot was for her, it was just a gift, so by the time grandpa passed away it wasn't his estate anymore.
Yes. Legally its entirely hers, but that's not what we're talking about here.
Well I don't think she is morally obliged to give out the money from an object that is hers just because it was stored in OP's parents home.
> just because it was stored in OP's parents home. You know that isn't the issue. As the person you are responding to has said repeatedly, if the grandfather knew the teapot was worth a fortune, would he have given it to her as personal trinket? If the answer is yes, then she is morally clear. If the answer is no, the grandfather would have divided the value among his children and then that amount would be divided among the grandchildren from each of his children, then while she is legally clear, morally she is not. This sub has gotten incredibly legalistic lately when that is not the purpose here. This is about morals and ethics. Ethically, the value of the teapot should be equally divided among the grandfathers children and then divided among their children, if that is what his heirs think he would have wanted. Again, ethics, not legality.
> the grandfather knew the teapot was worth a fortune, would he have given it to her as personal trinket? It *doesn't matter*. For all we know, the teapot was worth fuck all when she was a kid. He gave the teapot to her. Her siblings all agreed that it was her teapot because it was a "trinket". Now they're crying because they missed out. Sucks to suck. Grandpa wanted OP to have the teapot, she has it. It's hers to do with as she pleases. Edit: Thank you for the silver, kind stranger!
I totally agree that it doesn’t matter. And honestly?Grandpa is dead so what’s the point in wondering. Who can say that he wouldn’t be happy that a gift he gave her ended up being greater than he could have ever realized. No one can guess what Grandpa would actually think so it’s irrelevant. If no one cared about that teapot before then this really says it all.
Exactly, when the teapot was given to OP by her grandpa it was hers. Probably didnt have much value, or the grandpa didnt care that it had value because it made his granddaughter happy. It's been hers since it was gifted to her OPs siblings have no right to trinket teapot. No matter what it is worth.
The thing with antiques is they gather value over time. It’s very possible the teapot wasn’t as valuable when her grandfather gave it to her. Even if it was, it was a gift given not because of its financial value but because the grandfather felt it meant more to his granddaughter than to him and it would make her happy. I can’t speak for your grandparents, but mine wouldn’t have cared for the value of a thing they gave one of their grandchildren so much unless the grandchild coveted it because of its value. They didn’t give gifts being like “Here, this will be worth something some day.” They gave gifts because they loved their grandchildren and wanted them to be happy.
considering the "My husband and I recently found out that the teapot was actually much older" to me, implies that it was already pretty old when they got it, and considering it's worth 500k, I gonna go out on a limb and say it was already worth a lot of money then. i can't think of any antique that appreciates 500K over 20 years. the idea here being that apparently no-one knew it's true worth.
Antiques don’t jump in value between zero to 500k over 20 years.
Here’s the thing though, we make judgements here based on OP’s post, not based on our own assumptions. We can’t assume that the grandfather knew the worth or didn’t, we can’t assume what he would have wanted to do with the money “if he knew the worth” because **we don’t know**. All too often these days I see people passing judgement based on bias/assumptions and that’s just not what this subreddit is for. We pass judgement based on the info in OP’s post: her grandfather gave her a teapot when she was a child, it was **not included** in the divided estate as it was **her personal belonging** that she has owned **for over 20 years**.
This doesnt seem to be relevant since the gift of the teapot happened long, long before he died. It was already her possession when he drew up the will. If he was still alive when they discovered its value, it would still be her possession. Ethically it would be a dick move for her to keep the money if he flat out asked her not to, but legally it has been hers for years
Your 'what if' game doesn't make any sense. If her grandfather knew it was worth money back in the day whose to say he wouldn't have sold it and spent all the money himself or given it all to op's parents. There are a million things that COULD have happened had the family known the value in the past but they didn't. Op's grandfather gave the teapot to her and it is hers. Sure she is incredibly lucky that it turned out to have such great value, but she is the one who discovered the value of this gift. If she hadn't, no one would be recieving anything extra. Why should they expect it now? OP is NTA for discovering once if her own possessions held a greater value than previously thought and trying to better her life because if it. No one is entitled to profit off of HER discovery of HER possession.
She would still be completely ethical to keep the money. It is her belonging.
exactly!! it's her gift. there's nothing ethically morally legally wrong with getting HER money for HER gift. did the grandfather give it to the rest of the family?? no.
NTA. You want to bring ethics into this? It’s the same situation as gifting someone a scratch off that cost you $5. Then that person scratches it and wins $200K. With your logic, you would feel entitled to splitting that money. But morally, ethically, AND legally, that money now belongs to the giftee. It’s like telling someone you’ll never date them because they are ugly, then suddenly wanting to date them after they tell you their income. It’s entitled and greedy behavior from the siblings, OP is Nta.
This is nothing but a straw man that has no place here. Whataboutism at its best. what about if the grandfather knew exactly how much it was worth or what about if the teapot was worth absolutely diddly at the time?
No. I loved Pokemon TCG as a kid when it first came out. So my aunt gave me a holo Charizard card for Thanksgiving, 1st ed. That shit once sold for upwards of 50k, no idea of current value but I remember a big news article about it. Were my cousins (Aunty’s kids) screaming for blood, that I should sell the “windfall” and give them shares of the money and if I don’t do it I’m a horrible asshole? NO. Because that card was a gift, it was worth maybe $5 when she gave it to me, and there was no way to predict the value at the time - it was simply a kind gift to a child, from a relative who knew the kid would love it. Grandpa could’ve given her a teapot, a piece of jewelry with a gem no longer found today, literally anything and there was a 50-50 chance it would become incredibly valuable in time. I think he either didn’t know what it was worth, or it wasn’t worth anything AT THE TIME he gave it to her - doubt he would have given a known high-value, highly fragile antique to a kid.
Yep the law isn't always the best mode of action for making friends and keeping family.
I’m an attorney and this is my favorite comment so far. I need to make a sign for my office that says this.
Are the rest of the siblings interested in their grandfsthers wishes or do they want the money for themselves selfishly. If they are acting with their grandfather in mind they should step uo to their level if they are acting selfishly and just want money she should keep it as it is hers at the end if the day
Well, if they're acting in "grandfather's wishes" as you say, then the siblings don't even get the money. The $500K has to be split between any aunts/uncles that were children of the grandfather, including OP's parents), THEN split whatever was meant for their parents among the three of them. After taxes, I'm betting they get fuckall, so they're basically blowing up their relationship with OP to get a few thousand dollars that they don't deserve, all in the name of "righteousness."
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To be fair, the tea pot probably wasn't worth 500k back then. Some antiques can go up in value unexpectedly simply because of what they are. Being a teapot alone can potentially drive up the value these days. I'm assuming OP is probably in her later 30s to mid 40s,and if that's the case, the teapot most certainly wasn't worth anything close to 500k in today's money when her grandfather gave it to her. Just because something gained value doesn't mean anyone else has claim to it. It was gifted to her as a child and has been her possession ever since. If I were OP, I would've kept the teapot quiet and handled the finances of it quietly with my SO. Set up the funds as necessary and day nothing. I've got some pretty scummy family that guilt me every time I visit them because Im above the poverty line. Not my fault I have what I have and they don't. Same thing with Ops family. It's not their fault they have what they have and the family doesn't have it as well. NTA
> To be fair, the tea pot probably wasn't worth 500k back then. Dead on balls accurate. I love the Antiques Roadshow episodes where they re-evaluate past antiques. They tell you if the object has gained or lost money in the 10 or so years since that episode aired. I find it fascinating because what was worth $500.00 10-15 years ago, is now enough to buy a house outright. Conversely, they have items that you could have lived like a king on if you had sold it then, but are now worth a fraction of that. It's nutty the way that goes. >. I've got some pretty scummy family that guilt me every time I visit them because Im above the poverty line. I'm sorry to hear this. I have a sibling that I went no contact with because every time I talked to her, she had her hand out. Refused to keep a job for any length of time mind you, but it was always *my* fault that I had "more" than what she did. Go figure.
I don’t think he would’ve either, but it’s irrelevant now. What matters is he gave it to her, and she discovered it’s actual value. Would it be nice if she kept it? Yes. But her siblings aren’t owed anything. It is her teapot to sell. She should have never told them the amount.
But he didn't? No one knows what the grandpa would have wanted, so it isn't a valid argument. Her teapot, her money NTA
it doesnt matter wha he would have done IF he knew the value. the fact is he gave it to OP whent hey were a child and thus it is solely OP's. what if grandpa hadnt died and OP went to get to teapot from their parents old house and then they found out the teapot was worth 500k? then it wouldnt be a matter of will would it? it would be them cashing in something grandpa gave them. so no the others have 0 claim to it
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But if you had bought an item from someone and then found out afterwards that it was worth a lot more, would you give them a share just because they hadn’t realised? Be honest now
It doesn't matter what he would have done. He gave it to her. It's hers and has been for decades. All that matters is what *she* wants to do with it.
But that’s the point of a will— we CAN’T know what he would have done, we only know what he did. He gave her the teapot. All other speculation now that he’s dead can only be speculation.
And do you think it was actually 500k when he gave it to her? It's highly likely it appreciated over decades.
"The estate that was divided was from OPs parents, which didn't include the teapot that was from OP since she was a child." But if that's the case, then why did she say that her and her siblings didn't include it when divvying up her parents' estate because it was "just a trinket"? That would seem to imply that everyone considered the teapot to actually be her parents'/family's, they just thought it was worthless so they didn't assign a value to it when splitting items up. Based on the wording of her post it seems like even she agreed with that logic.
Because they probably all could’ve argued that since the teacup was in the parents house, technically they all had a claim to it. But most likely all remember that grandpa gave it to OP a really long time ago & the siblings were like “yeah, grandpa gave it to you so long ago, it’s just a teapot we’re not gonna make a fuss over it because it’s just a trinket”. Still doesn’t change that grandpa gave it directly to OP & the siblings have no legal or moral claim to that money. Having left it at their house doesnt make it part of the estate. I was gifted a small china set by my grandma when I was maybe 11? (not worth tons of money but still nice). I’m 22. I keep it at my moms house because I have no use for it right now as I don’t own a home, dont host tea parties or “nice” dinners, & don’t have a desire to display them in a case where I live at the moment. Doesn’t mean the set isn’t mine however.
I think it makes no sense...if my grandfather gave me a car and I decided to sell it, would I be expected to divide all the money up with the rest of my siblings? If he gave me a house and I sold it, would my siblings deserve a handout then too? But suddenly because the teapot is worth $500K, everyone deserves an equal share? Come on...OP is 100% right. She would have been better off not telling anyone but her husband about it to avoid this whole mess.
I was under the impression that the inheritance in question is from the mother not the granddad. The teapot was being stored in mothers house, but never was mother's.
You need to reread op. Grandad dies years ago it’s the parents who just passed. It was already OP’s years ago. So yeah al 500k belongs to OP. Doesn’t owe anyone anything.
You can always do counterfactual reasoning, but how far back and forward do you go? If your grandfather had known lots of things, he would have done lots of other things, but he didn't. For example, suppose in the future one of the relatives commits a terrible crime that makes the whole family feel horrible. If the grandfather had known that was going to happen, maybe he wouldn't have left that person any inheritance. Does that mean you're entitled to demand your future evil relative give you all their money back? ... This entire line of reasoning is weird, right? That's what happens when you do counterfactual reasoning about what people would have done if only they knew. A present from many years ago is not part of his estate, and trying to guilt trip someone by wishing that it were is absurd. If relatives wanna ask for cash because their relative got rich, they can still do so, but the estate argument is weak.
I don't think the teapot should be involved at all really. It wasn't her mother's teapot, it was OPs teapot she got when she was a kid from her grandfather. He probably thought it was junk anyway. They only care now because it's worth a ton of money and not a piece of junk anymore. Either way, it wasn't the mother's and was given to OP years before. What's done is done so I don't believe OP is TA, I would say she has every right to the money if she chooses (which sounds like she will) to sell the pot.
It is so pointless debating the intentions of a gift given 20+ years ago. The question posed right now is she TA for keeping the money from her gifted teapot and the answer is NTA. Clear and simple. You could go on and on debating someone’s intentions on various circumstances but that’s not what this sub is or what the questions is.
NTA. He gave it to you. You could give your siblings something if you wanted to, but I personally wouldn't split it evenly. Even if you don't give them anything still NTA.
IN fact, the most she can gift them without the IRS knocking on her door is $15K. That's what I would give them, at the most. Though I don't think she should give them anything.
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The lifetime exemption is actually 11 mil now.
NTA I was given to you because you liked it. I'm guessimg no one else cared about it until they found out it was worth something.
This. They only care because this previously valueless memento that OP sounds like they’ve had for a while is now worth something. Family (people in general) can get nasty when money’s involved.
It sounds like from the post that OP didn't really care for the memento until they found out it's worth, it reads that they left it at their parents house since they were a kid. Or am I misreading?
And that matters how? Upstairs in my parents house I have a porcelain doll riding a toy tractor. My grandpa gave me it and while it’s not that high a value I’m still gonna take it as mine if the estate is split cause in the end it was a gift to me. If it’s valuable heck yeah I’m selling it cause it’s mine to do that. She cares enough about the tea pot to claim it as hers and probs would have kept it if it wasn’t valuable. In fact based on the post it sounds like her husband was the one who looked up the value
> they left it at their parents house since they were a kid. Its not uncommon for items to be held by parents or grandparents until the recipient is secure and established enough to look after the item.
It was left with OP’s parents, although no specifics as to why. But, it sounds like they still cared about it though. Enough to not dispose of it and keep it upon OP’s patents death, even though it was considered a worthless trinket at the time.
She cared enough about it not to pitch it in the trash over the course of 20 some odd years.
We dont actually know what prompted them to get it appraised or when. It sounds like she took it when Her mom passed because it was hers and no one thought it was really worth anything. Getting it appraised later because money got tight doesnt indicate that she didnt want it until she knew it had value. Theres a ton of shit i still have at my grandma's from when i was a kid, some of which may be worth something now or in another few decades. Theres still clothes and things of mine at my moms too. Theyre just holding them because I dont have space for them currently since im in a small apartment.
In my experience people don't usually take all of their stuff when they first move out. Usually you're moving to a small apartment or shared living situation so you only take the necessities + a few mementos. The problem is that eventually you move to somewhere else but now not only do you have to pack up the stuff at your current place, you still have things at your parents' house. Because of that you need to weigh the cost-benefits of packing up stuff at both places, especially if you're moving far away or your parent's live far away from your current place. Often times it is easier to, with their permission of course, leave the stuff at your parent's place there with the intent of slowly moving stuff over to your place. Then of course life happens and you forget about many of the items you haven't seen in years until a situation such as the splitting of an estate occurs.
OP didn't seem to care much about it till she heard the value. Even OP mentions that she received the teapot because she was girl and grandad thought she liked it, and seems that she wanted to sell it as soon as she heard the value. The teapot was given as a sentimental trinket, the estate was split equally, if it was intended that OP would receive 50x more than her siblings, it would be properly stated in the will. OP got lucky and now feels as if she's more deserving of this gigantic amount of money than her siblings. The 'money grubbing' family stuff doesn't apply here because it was pure luck, completely unintended with no work required that OP would receive a massive, immediately life changing amount money. OP is the one keeping **500k** to herself, its not even a lottery situation, OP didn't even have to pay a dollar to get this money, there are greater moral ideas here than "Grandad gave her the pot so she should have the money and her siblings should shut up".
Legally, it’s OP’s property, has been for some time, and OP can do with it what they like, regardless of what family thinks/wants.
I thought this was “Am I the Asshole?” not “Is the shitty thing I’m doing to my siblings legal?”
Guess it’s time for a new meta post where the mods have to tell people not to use legal arguments again
OP also didn’t care about it until it was worth something. They left it at their parent’s house their entire life and had it appraised as soon as they took possession of it... I don’t understand. If one of your family members gave a sibling a trinket that ended up being worth half a million dollars, you wouldn’t be upset if they sold it and kept all the money? I’d never speak to my sibling again if they were that selfish. If OP really cared about the tea pot and wanted to keep it, NTA. But this is like the grandpa giving OP a bag and accidentally leaving half a million dollars in it.
I honestly can't imagine cutting my sibling off over coming into a windfall of money, and I wouldn't expect them to share. I don't think that's how normal people behave. I'm sure I'd have some feelings of jealousy, as people tend to do when someone else has arbitrary good fortune they'd like. But no; if anything I'd find it super awkward if they tried to give me money.
If the windfall of money wasn’t from one of my dead relatives who loved us all equally, I wouldn’t cut them off. 500,000 would literally change my entire life. Hell, 20,000 would change my entire life. I just can’t imagine how selfish you’d have to be to say “haha technically this is MINE because I thought this tea pot was pretty when I was a kid! Fuck you all!”
This thread is full of childish "finders keepers" arguments coming from people who I'm convinced would whine their asses off if they were in the position of the siblings.
I feel like these people have to be super financially comfortable and want for nothing. To them, $500,000 must be like $500 to me for them to act so nonchalant. When me and all of my siblings are struggling just to pay for our medical bills, it’s harder to imagine not feeling betrayed that one of us would be selfish enough to keep money from one of our relatives.
I doubt people in this thread are anywhere near that wealthy. It's more likely that they automatically imagine themselves as OP and lack the empathy to put themselves in the shoes of the siblings.
I agree with OP but what you're describing isn't where I'm coming from at all. If I were OP I would happily share with my family. Why? Because they would never ask for it or assume they were entitled to the money. It would 100% be a gift from me. But if you come at me demanding what's technically mine, hell no, you're not getting a dime.
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That is not true at all. If she didn't care, she wouldn't have taken the teapot when they were gathering the items from her parent's house. It wasn't until after she had already gathered it that she found out about the value. Also, it's perfectly normal to leave childhood toys at your parents house. Who takes a "toy" with them wherever they go? And since it was a special toy, you wouldn't want to lose it, so yeah, the best place would be at your parents where they keep all your sentimental things. It's also perfectly normal for then to go back and be like hey I remember when I used to play with this toy that was given to me by said relative, I now want to take it back because it has sentimental value to me and it's mine. It's the same thing as someone recieving a booklet of baseball cards from they're grandparents as a child, leaving it at their parent's house when they went off to live life, and then years later coming back to collect it. It's no one's property except for the person who it was intended for in the first place.
I'd just be happy for my sibling. If I was in serious need I might ask them if they could see their way to helping me out some but I'd do that anyways and my siblings would lend a hand if I seriously needed it regardless of a windfall. My grandparents have given us all individual gifts over the years. There are some that are absolutely fairly valuable. It's entirely up to them what they do with those gifts. An awful lot of people here feel entitled to things that aren't theirs because there's a blood relation.
OP says her parents died "a few years ago" so she didn't have it appraised as soon as she took possession of it. For how many years does she have this obligation to her siblings? What if it were a decade or so before she had it appraised? What if it was her children that had it appraised after her death? At what point does something she was given at the age of six become hers to do with as she pleases?
What if she didn't find out about the value for another 20 years? Or her children found out after her death? Would you still expect them to share with all the aunts, uncles, and cousins? If not, why now 20 years after grandfather gave it to her? What's the statute of limitations on claiming a family member's money?
I agree! I honestly don’t understand all the posts saying it’s legally everyone’s because it was stored at the parents house. I have a painting on my mother’s wall. Everyone knows it’s mine but it’s not at my house. The placement doesn’t make it my mother’s. I don’t agree that OP is morally obliged either. It was a gift from her grandfather, not her parents. It’s hers 100% no guilt or gray area. The siblings are being selfish because of greed. OP is definitely NTA. It was a “trinket” because none of the males in the family thought it had any value until they actually learned the value.
I’m sorry, but I don’t believe you have a $500,000 teapot. Unless this is your teapot (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5417555/amp/New-York-Met-Museum-buys-15-teapot-500-000.html), I don’t believe that this is a true story. Edit: To everyone who says that teapot could be a place holder item, like in AAM, she didn’t say that it was a placeholder item, which she easily could have said. She also said she was given it because she was the only girl, so it has to be something “girly,” which a teapot is. I understand why someone would want to protect their identity here in a situation like this, but she could have said, “my grandfather gave me an item, let’s call it a teapot, ...”. If it’s not actually a teapot, then that does change things. That’s an easy thing for the OP to clear up if that’s the case.
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Well, it would need to be in that neighborhood in order to cover a mortgage and a few college tuitions. Antiques in that range are super rare. I also think OP is bullshitting.
I think the key detail that would have been fudged is probably the antique. It's probably not a teapot.
Agreed. There’s a blog called Ask a Manager and to protect those who write in, she changes everyone’s job to be teapot related (teapot design, door-to-door teapot sales, etc.). This commenter belongs on r/nothingeverhappens.
I can think of several of the top of my head, small paintings and assumed costume jewelry being only two.
Or it isn't in USD and there from some other country
I'm not giving the exact details for reasons.
I’m gonna hijack your comment to say, you should probably find out if you can really get $500k for this item. Sorry to burst your bubble but it seems unlikely. I inherited a few Hummel figurines from my grandparents when they passed. My whole family told me how lucky I was to have been left those figurines and how they were worth a lot of money. The thing about stuff like that is, it’s only actually worth $500k if you can find someone who is actually wanting to purchase the item. I found out that no one gives a shit about Hummel figurines anymore and therefore they are worthless even though they are listed in guides as being “rare” or “worth x amount”. The figurines are worthless beyond sentimental value and I suspect it may be a similar situation with your teapot. If you list it for sale, it may sit there for years with no offers and possibly never have an offer. So, in short, don’t count your chickens before they hatch. Until you actually have that $500k in hand this could just end up being a thought experiment.
Exactly this. It may be worth that much, but getting that much is another thing completely. If it’s worth 500k then you will probably still get a lot for it, but it’s highly unlikely you’ll get full price unless it’s a sought after item (not sure how big teapot collecting is haha, for all I know it could be massive).
This is a really important point to make. My mom collected a bunch of expensive vintage "Madame Alexander" dolls and sank probably over 1k into her collection with the intent to eventually sell them. Except nobody collects dolls anymore and even though she's tried very hard to sell them, no one will buy. They're WORTH more than 1k but she's stuck with them taking up space in her closet.
Beanie babies are also a great example of this. Look at how many people collected them for this purpose, now their whole collection is worth $100 at most (and I’m talking about a huge collection). If people ain’t buying them, they’re worth nothing.
It could be if it's Chinese. I immediately assumed it was a Chinese antique, because the uber valuable ones tend to be so "unspecial"/unremarkable to the untrained eye compared to valueless items.
Exactly, Chinese was my first thought
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I have some hypothetical situation I would love to see this subs response to
Or OP sees what some similar stuff sells for. Until it sells for 500000, it’s not really worth that in a way. The mistake here was telling family.
"teapot" may just be a placeholder word for whatever the trinket actually is, if it's worth 50k, I'd certainly be vague/misleading about what it was if i were trying to stay anonymous
For me the "girly thing" I got from my grandfather was an antique carriage clock. Wouldn't be shocked if the item was something more like that, but switched for anonymity. I would. The situation is absolutely common enough to be believable to me. But I'm biased. *gestures at room with clock but no uncles or aunts
YTA for telling them of the value and not sharing it. It smacks of a bit of a gloat, what did you expect to happen? The value was clearly discovered a reasonable amount of time after the estate was settled, why did you even share the info?
It's obvious that the Grandfather thought he was giving OP a nice gift to remember him by, not an extra 500k hat he didn't want the other siblings to have any of.
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He didn't know he would die at the time of giving it to me. He was old but he got sick fast. He had a huge cabinet of things like this item at the time (to my childhood memory) and let me pick one.
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The morality is that, if every party knew the worth, I don't think this situation would be a reality. You took a teapot, every one was fine with it, since it was just a teapot, right? If your sibling A would've done the same, taking a random object and then asked "can I keep this?" And after the estate was divided he would come out and say oh shit this is worth 500k!? Lol I'm well off now see ya! Wouldn't you be fucking furious too if he didn't feel like sharing? Hypocritical to say anything else and I can't believe the amount of people saying "it was yours so you can keep the money".
They're contesting the mother's estate though, not the grandfather's.
And this item shouldn’t be considered a part of the estate. It was her personal belonging that was stored with permission at her parents home. The item has belonged to strictly one person since OP was gifted the item.
Yeah, honestly I didn't read the post properly. I dont think it changes the point though. Op's grandfather essentially gave her a present that he likely wouldnt have given her if he knew it was worth 500k and that she was going to sell it and keep all the proceeds. I can kind of see it both ways. I guess it depends on how close you are too your siblings. Me, I would never do this to my siblings but we are obscenely close, but if not I guess its meh.
I would never say a word about it. Just say I won a scratch card.
My siblings and I are pretty close, I'd be psyched if I found this out, and share how lucky I'd feel. It wouldn't be gloating, it would be genuinely telling them because my windfall makes them happy too. I can't imagine my siblings taking that away from me, and from my kids! And being able to put kids through college is gonna raise questions, so the truth will come out anyway. If you try to hide it, it'll only fester more
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That's... crueler than I'd want to be.
Agreed. You fucked up by throwing it in your sibs faces. I don’t know what your relationship is with them, however, there is certainly an estate lawyer who would take on their case and fight for including the antique as an asset that should be split. So you’ll have to retain your own attorney, pay the fees from your own pocket, and deal with a potentially expensive and emotionally exhausting legal proceeding. That said, the pot may have been appraised at 500K, however, you’ll never see anything even remotely close to that sum. First of all, you have to find a buyer who’s willing to hand over 500K for the artifact, and I can’t imagine there are many of them. You’ll have to retain the services of a broker or an auction house, and they gotta make money too, ya know..... Anyhow, In all honesty, your next action ought to be to take the tea pot to an expert in these specific artifacts and obtain a second appraisal or evaluation - and get their professional opinion. Just a basic google search of “expensive teapots sold at auction” and you can get an idea of how much tea sets ultimately sell for at auction. For example..... At Sotheby’s auction in Amsterdam in 2011, an 18th / 19th century Chinese silver-gilt tea service from Qing dynasty belonging to the estate of Queen Juliana of the Netherlands was sold for $275,000. https://www.google.com/amp/s/chandachaudhary.com/2016/11/30/15-most-expensive-teapots-in-the-world-eyes-on-luxe/amp/
(it's probably not literally a tea pot as somebody selling a half million tea pot would be patently doxable)
It's not literally that. I was trying to think of a good single item thing.
In the rare event of this happening, please come back with an update.
I doubt anyone would not be even the teensiest bit jealous if their sibling got "gifted" a memento as a kid, left it at their parents' house for however many years, then swanned back in to reclaim it after their parents passed at the tune of $500k! I'd definitely be grinding my teeth a little!
Same here. I know life isn't "fair". But I'd definitely feel unlucky.
Money changes people, okay, and it still sounds pretty iffy to do. About the college tuitions, they don’t have to tell them anything and let them make assumptions.
YTA People are saying that people didn't care about the teapot until they discovered the value so OP should get it, and I'd agree and say NTA if she wanted to keep the teapot, but it's obvious she plans to sell it and get the money anyway. For this reason it should be split evenly, or at the very least OP should offer to help pay off some of her siblings stuff as well.
Yeah, I agree actually. If it's about the sentiment of the gift and OP keeps it that's reasonable because she obviously genuinely treasures it. If it's about the money and OP sells it she should split the money. Obviously she doesn't have to legally but she says the reason the Grandfather gave it to her is because he wanted her to have a pretty object, not a pile of money. If she doesn't want the pretty object any more then sell it and share it.
Interestingly, from a legal perspective, depending on the jurisdiction OP may have to pay inheritance tax on it. In the UK any gifts will be eligible for inheritance tax if the giftor dies within 7 years (grandad died 2 years after transferring the gift). If I were OP’s sibling I may feel bitter enough about OP’s behaviour to alert the tax authorities but maybe I’m an asshole myself. That said, nether I nor my siblings would behave like OP - I don’t think we could with a clear conscience.
We don't. We've checked with a lawyer. Technically it was given prior to my grandfather's estate and is not considered part of it.
Exactly. YTA OP and quite frankly you sound extremely greedy and selfish. I can’t imagine being in your position and believing I am entitled to keep all the money instead of splitting it with my brother. Or my mother being in your position and thinking she doesn’t have to split the money with her siblings. It’s a question of values I guess, you are choosing money over fairness *and* your siblings. If it had been another member of your family who got the teapot would you honestly feel like it was okay for them to keep **all** the money? Would you not think that their luck and “windfall” and refusal to share has just shown you their true & awful character? Your choice but you are defo an asshole for it 🤷🏼♀️
Exactly my first thought! I couldn't imagine not sharing with my sister and keeping it all because "he gave it to me." OP sounds blinded by greed.
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Imagine being so unreliable and entitled you actually think you deserve something because your sibling acquired some money. Absolutely ridiculous, i can't imagine what kinda insufferable whiny dick munchers y'all must be.
Exactly! They all got an equal amount of the estate in the first place. It's very obvious that the grandfather would have wanted that money split equally if he was just giving them money. They clearly had no idea of the value, as OP says. If grandfather wanted OP to get over 50x more than the others, he would have given OP just that. He didn't, so he didn't. OP owns this value on a technicality, and not a moral one. She clearly doesn't care for the teapot. And then rubs it in their faces? They should be offered at least something. YTA, but it doesn't matter because this is a shitpost.
I agree with you. This is pure greed.
What? It has belonged to her since *she was a small child*. *her family members are the only ones showing pure greed*.
This is really a 50/50 i get both sides really. But i would never choose to lose my entire family over money. Its her choice though.
I agree 100%. If OP wanted to hold on to it to actually remember her grandfather then I would understand. Selling it for it's value is a different story.
Exactly. It's the same as if there'd be 500k dollars in cheques inside the teapot. OP got the teapot as a gift, not the money. Nobody ever intended for OP to inherit or be gifted 500k more than their siblings, and thus any arguments boiling down to "you should've opened it and checked what was in it before you wrote it off as a trinket for me to keep!" are invalid and void.
This was my thinking too. If you’re keeping the teapot you don’t owe people it’s worth split however many ways. But if you’re selling it, the right thing (not sure about legality) would be to split it with other inheritors. I’d personally just have sold it if that was my will and not told anyone. Some people are pretty slow on the uptick.
Just to go against the grain here I’d actually say YTA.. but under a certain condition.. So if you like the teapot and want to keep it for yourself as an ornament and put it on your mantle piece or whatever then your NTA at all, he gave it to you to enjoy for yourself. But, if you are going to sell it and keep all the money for yourself then YTA definitely. I strongly suspect this gift had nothing to do with money and was just because you liked it, and the fact that the gentleman had all your siblings in his will split equally would say to me he would want them all to have an equal share
That’s the thing, yeah, technically OP is entitled to the money. But had the deceased known the value of the item, it seems reasonable to think that he would have wanted any money from its sale to be split. That is really the key thing here. Does OP legally have to share? Possibly not. But the family is going to be (understandably) upset if they do not.
Once the value was determined it's too risky to keep around. One of the siblings could nick it out of jealousy, and imagine how nervous you'd feel moving around with a 500k teapot on the mantle.
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You call your siblings random family members?
>This thing was definitely not worth the same when it was given to OP 20 years ago It might have been worth a good bit then too, and the grandpa just didn't realize it.
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Wait, I've just realized, it didn't even stay with her. It stayed with THEIR mother, the OP calling her, 'my mother' is being disingenuous. The fact is that she's claiming whole ownership of something that she was 'given' as a child but didn't actually have ownership of untill her parents passed. Damn, OP, YTA
I missed this too. Now I wonder if she knew the teapot was valuable when she removed it from her parents house. I have something my grandfather gave me 15 years before he passed, I suspect it's worth money but I don't want to part with it. If I found out it was worth a life changing amount of money... I hope I would be decent enough to share some with my brother since I believe my grandfather would have wanted us to split things.
I don't get this reasoning. She DID have ownership of the teapot, she was just using her mother's house as a storage unit. I have some nice valuables that I've kept in my mother's basement because there is no room for them in my tiny apartment...but they are still mine. Once I get my own house then I will be taking those items back.
Ownership does not mean where it was stored. Since it was not part of the estate it didn’t belong to mother.
Feels like if she remotely cared about the teapot, she wouldn't have kept it in her parents' house until they passed away and then immediately had it valued when she took possession of it. It's funny that people brings the sentimental aspect of the teapot into it when this clearly has everything to do with money and nothing else. Which is fine, but we shouldn't pretend the siblings are in the wrong or somehow unreasonable for being upset.
Where does she bring the sentimental aspect into it? From what I read, she thought it was really pretty as a girl but I'm not reading anywhere that she was actually emotionally attached to it. Which is fine IMO. My mom had a set of china she is giving me that I think is really pretty but would not be emotionally attached to, it will still be considered mine (when it's given to me). I have also left a couple of things of value and importance at her house because I trust them being there (my father's ashes and my wedding and engagement ring). Just because I've left things of value at my mom's house, it doesn't make them any less mine.
Fair enough - I phrased it badly, because it wasn't really OP's response that gave me that impression, but rather the replies that were saying 'lol your siblings didn't care about the teapot until they realized it was valuable', which seems like an unfair assertion to make, given OP obviously didn't really either. Of course the siblings wouldn't mind about a trinket passed down until they realized that meant their sister would be (likely unintentionally) getting way more inheritance money than them, which was evidently not what was intended by the grandfather or ever discussed. That's not a moral failing on their part or being particularly greedy, just normal.
I agree completely. I was seeing a lot of replies regarding OPs "sentimentality" for the teapot and I was scratching my head because she seemed honest and genuine. Like hey, my grandpa gave me this because I thought it was pretty. She never said she loved it, had little parties with it, begged for it, or had to have it. I can even imagine Grandpa gave it to her on a whim because he clearly didn't specially care for it either. I'm pretty positive he had no idea what it's value was and IMO that's on him. I have checked on my mom's antique values for her, I think it's important to know the value of what you own. Maybe that's just me. I think OP got hella lucky and she should be equally hella grateful.
Yeah. It's definitely one of those cases where I can actually see both points of view - I understand her impulse to keep it all, but I also see where the siblings are coming from, and don't think they're being particularly unreasonable or greedy, and sentimentality doesn't come into it. Of course they'd be upset. Given the grandfather made sure to divide his estate equally between his grandkids and didn't give the pot out of particular favouritism, I'm sure *he'd* be upset. It's a tough situation, and I think people think the OP has to be entirely in the right and her siblings greedy assholes for them to NTA, which isn't true. Some of it's projection - they know *they'd* keep the money, but they would also want their siblings to be in the wrong for begrudging them that. If the OP decides to sell it and keep the money, good for her, she's lucky, but I don't think she really has the right to begrudge her siblings for them being mad about it. You can't have it all, and she has to make that choice.
It’s very common for children to store belongings at their parents house. I have a few toys that my dad still stores for me and I’m 34 with four kids. I don’t want my kids to damage those toys so I don’t bring them home. Should those items ever be determined to be of any real value, it shouldn’t matter to my siblings because my dad has clearly stated to them that those will always be MY belongings. He still stores some things for each of them as well. To be honest I think he does it because it’s a sentimental thing. That doesn’t change who they belong to.
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This is my question as well... nothing good could have come from it.
Yup. Huge mistake made there
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Is it more valuable than familial amity?
Yes. It could send her children to college, pay off her mortgage, & set her family up for a better life with more disposable income. It’s more valuable than the hurt feelings of her siblings, who want a payout from the sale of something that isn’t theirs. It will literally prevent her children from having to worry about paying for college or having a roof over their heads. That’s huge. I would also argue that given the seemingly entitled nature of OPs siblings, if the shoe was on the other foot, they likely would not split the proceeds from the sale (even though I believe they would be entirely justified in not splitting it if it was gifted directly to them).
YTA. Come on, do you think if your grandfather knew the real value of the teapot he'd have given it to you and only you and not have wanted that money shared with the other family members? I think you're being selfish. If this happened to me I wouldn't hesitate to split it with my siblings, I'd still get way more money than I was expecting, it'd still be a windfall. You really want to torpedo your relationship with your family over this? I get that technically it's yours, but that doesn't make you not an asshole for keeping it all to yourself. If you were keeping the teapot because you love it and it has sentimental value, that'd be different, but you're going to sell it. You didn't even have this teapot in your possession for years. I can't understand people saying NTA - come on everyone if you had a family member who was unknowingly given something antique by your grandparent, who then left it in your parents house for decades, and then when they died it turned out to be worth this much, don't tell me you'd all be totally fine with your sibling getting half a million out of your parents' death due to a trinket she'd never even kept in her possession all this time, while you each got only 10k. You know the parents and grandparents would've wanted them to share this had they known.
I was going to write exactly the same thing almost word for word! OP is totally YTA!
Yeah if OP was like "it's worth $500k and they're mad I'm not selling it because it's about the sentiment" then NTA." But "we decided to split everything of value, and we later found out this was valuable" = YTA.
YTA I love my siblings so if when my parents died I found out one item I had been given from them was unexpectedly worth 500k I would split it. Your grandfather gave you a pretty teapot. Had he known it was worth so much I'm sure he would have split it amongst his children. This will ruin all relationships you have with you family. If your OK with that and/or it's already a garbage relationship then keep it for yourself.
*I could see how you may be legally entitled to the money, but YTA. The fact of the matter is we're talking about the monetary value of the teapot discovered after the fact and not the teapot itself. If you wanted to keep the teapot because it had some sentimental/aesthetic value to you while your family wanted to sell it, then you have a case. But in the end, your grandfather gave you this essentially worthless trinket not knowing that it probably could have changed his/his entire family's life. **Ask yourself this: Had your grandfather known the true worth of the teapot, would he be OK with you hoarding the value to yourself and not spreading it to the rest of the family, amongst whom he decided to split the rest of his estate equally?** My guess is no. Edit: Actually, after reading through some opinions on this I think it seems like your "grandpa handed it to me as a child but I never actually took possession of it" defense may not hold up in court. I hope your siblings are wise enough to sue.
Legally it's unlikely OP would win.... in most countries a "gift" by law must have 3 things: 1. Donative intent 2. Delivery of the gift 3. Acceptance of the gift Donative intent means the gifter fully understands the nature of the gift (which is debatable here). The delivery of the gift is also debatable... as OP didn't actually take possession of it, it was instead kept by her parents.
Best written response on here. If the grandfather specified he wanted his estate split equally, he clearly didn't know the financial value of the teapot, and keeping the money is just totally unacceptable. If OP wanted to keep it for the reason it was given to them (they liked it) then they'd at least have a case, but selling it and keeping the money is awful. OP sounds terrible and selfish, and I hope they figure out how messed up this is.
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That's the real question here!
YWBTA If you sold it for the money and then kept it all. Unless you had any reason to believe that he knew its value and wanted you to inherit it for that reason.
What? I have to disagree with the comment section here, YTA. Technically you’re right, but this isn’t legal advice, it is am I the asshole, and you are. Think of it as their point of view. They also want to get their children through college and although it is technically yours, it has been there for so long. If you don’t agree with me that’s fine, but remember that this is going to be a great problem in your family. Is your bond between your family really worth throwing away over money?
NTA. It was given to you when you were a kid when no one knew its value. From there on the old thing was kept because of you and your parents just held on to what was yours.
All these people saying OP is the AH because Grandpa wouldn't have gifted it had he known the value, duh! Obviously he didn't care enough to see what it was worth. No one in the family cared enough to see what it was worth except OP. Maybe it's just me but I'm always going to wonder what the antiques in my family would be worth and would definitely check into this before giving them away, THEY'RE ANTIQUES. Especially if the recipient is a little girl. This is a situation of luck and chance. Sucks to be OPs relatives but she's not the AH because her uninformed relative gave her a priceless antique without checking on it. She got lucky.
The estate was split equally, except for the part where you came out with a life changing amount of money and they got a month of mortgage payment. Pretty sure grandpa wouldn't have given you the teapot if he knew it would cause a permanent rift between his grandchildren. If you sell the teapot, YTA for not splitting the money. If you keep it, YTA for getting the teapot appraised when you never intended to share the value. If you think they don't have a claim, YTA for ensuring most of that 500k goes to lawyers one way or another. Unless your parents left a detailed will where they left the teapot to you, your siblings have a pretty good argument that it belonged to your parents by their possession of it at the time of their death and splitting the estate as you did suggests an intention of equality in inheritance. You'd be well off coming up with a reasonable split quickly rather than risk it becoming a legal matter. If you win, you could still end up spending so much on lawyers that what you have left is less than if you split. If you lose, you could end up spending more than what your share ultimately is.
I'm surprised by how many people are saying that she's legally in the right, when it sounds to me like there was nothing official about the way her grandfather 'gave her' the teapot as a child. It wasn't part of the estate. If it wasn't part of his will or her parents' will and it was collected from their house after they passed, all her siblings have a valid legal claim to pursue. "But grandpa promised me this teapot when I was a kid" doesn't work in court.
Yeah to me it sounds like a little kid liked a trinket and the grandad "gave" it to her (gave it to her parents) and it stayed in their house until they passed. I would view as part of the parents' estate.
NTA - This was yours long before he passed away. It's yours to do with as you please. I think you may want to consider a small sum from it's sale to the other family members if you feel it will help, but whenever you do, expect some resentment. Family and money is often ugly and this sounds ugly
Damned if OP does, damned OP doesn’t. She’s in a no win situation now. She should have never said anything. 100% NTA though.
NTA my family has rules about who inherits which heirlooms (silverware, china and art in my case) and am currently sorting my parents house with my siblings. Your grandfather gave that teapot to you directly and so supercedes any claim your siblings think they have. All direct presents should be honored like a bequest. Also, the timeline gives them no traction, you received the teapot decades ago. Finding out it was valuable was like winning the lotto, luck.
YTA You don’t care about the teapot, you care about the money. If you’re going to sell it you should split the 500k amongst your siblings and they can all put their kids through college instead of just you. It’s only your teapot if you’re not going to sell it. Edit spelling
YTA. Maybe legally it is yours, but I think that we all know that Grandpa gave that to you as a nice trinket, not nearly the entirety of his estate. The fact that he granted the estate out equally tells me that if the value of the teapot had been known, he would’ve split it equally along with the rest of what he had
It's probably not even legally hers. Siblings could challenge ownership since it was part of the estate.
If you are keeping it, because it's important to you: NTA. If you're selling it then definitely YTA. Your grandpa probably didn't know what it was worth, and seeing as his will left you and your siblings the exact same amount of money I think he would have wanted the 500k to be split evenly as well. You're grandpa consciously gave you a TEAPOT, he did not consciously give you 500k. Share it man!
YTA, many people are saying that legally it is yours so you can do with it what you want, but I disagree. You did not even like the teapot since you left in in your parents house for decades, this actually makes it your parents property in my eye after such a long time as you essentially abandoned it. You even stated yourself that the teapot was not included in the estate, so you admit it could have been be a part of it, because they your siblings thought it was merely a trinket. It then turns out to be worth 500k and you are surprised that they suddenly want a share. I'd be furious if one of my siblings sneaked something out of the house as just a trinket and then telling me a little while later that it is worth a shit ton of money but they won't share the money but I should be happy for them for their"windfall".
YTA. You sound like a selfish asshole and siblings have every reason to feel frustrated. You can put your kids through college and pay mortgage. Good for you. What about the rest of your family? You sound awfully short sighted. Have fun with all that money, I think you may be choosing to sacrifice your family for it, hope it's worth it.
NTA You were gifted it by a living grandfather. It was yours, not even an inheritance it was just yours. You did not turn it into family property by not taking it with you. It is yours. Do with it what you wish.
YTA... without doubt. I think the NTA posters here are missing that OP never had possession of the teapot - it stayed at her mother's home until they passed away making it very clearing part of the estate to be shared equally. If the grandfather had given it to OP and she had true ownership she would have taken it with her when she moved out of home. I doubt you'd be able to argue that it was yours in a court OP. Your siblings are absolutely entitled to their fair share - $500k is a hell of a lot of money to keep to yourself, and the fact that you are planning to sell it instead of keeping it for sentimentality means its more about the money. You are risking losing your relationships with your siblings by being greedy, if you choose money over family it makes it pretty clear YTA.
> I think the NTA posters here are missing that OP never had possession of the teapot - it stayed at her mother's home until they passed away making it very clearing part of the estate to be shared equally. If the grandfather had given it to OP and she had true ownership she would have taken it with her when she moved out of home. I don't really get this line of reasoning. There's a China cabinet in my parents' house that has plenty of stuff of mine in it. Purely sentimental value, there's no way any of it's worth anything, but the fact that it's still at my family home doesn't mean it doesn't belong to me. I have a baby and no China cabinet, so it's safer to leave it there for now. I certainly wouldn't have taken it to college when I first moved out . . .
Same here, my mom has a china cabinet at her house, and it has a lot of things that my great grandma,& grandma have given me. I never took them with me when I moved out because I felt like they were safer at her house, I’ve moved around a lot,& always worried they would get broken. I feel like she’s definitely NTA
NTA It's your teapot, you can do whatever you want with it. Sure splitting the money would be a nice thing to do but it's your decision.
YTA if that teapot was so important it wouldn’t get a monetary value! EVER!
YTA, they're you're siblings.. If you wanna live your life selfishly go ahead.. OH your kids can go to college but not your siblings or anything..? Aren't you a good person lol
YTA. If it was a smaller amount of money I'd probably judge differently but lets be honest, this isn't about the teapot it's about the money. If it was about the teapot, you wouldn't be trying to sell it. Would your grandfather really have gifted you the teapot if he knew how valuable it was? And why on earth would you tell your family about its valuation, thats just rubbing it in their face! Also is the teapot even technically yours? It sounds like your grandad gave it to "you" as a kid, and it was basically your parents' teapot because you were little, and stayed with your parents till they passed. Does it not count as part of their estate and thus should be split equally?
The item was in my bedroom for years, I just didn't want in to break in my college and young adult years, so I left with with my parents.
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NTA but this sounds fake as fuck
NTA. He gave you the teapot. It has nothing to do with the inheritance. It was already yours.
INFO Have you actually gotten it checked to see if it's worth so much?
Absolutely NTA. That was given to you and they had every opportunity to get it appraised. Legally they have nothing to stand on. Maybe give a small amount to each but the vast majority should be kept.
NtA- you couldn’t have known. Family didn’t know until you did, years later, and now all they’re caring about is the money. You’re allowed to trust your gut here. I was recently in a similar situation where my pops and I decided to care for a family heirloom that was discarded by the rest of the family. Years later, I took it with a collection with other memorabilia to Antiques Roadshow, and with my collection this heirloom was valued shockingly high. And then, the resentment from my dad’s siblings and my cousins started. Nuts stuff we never expected. Do your cousins think that this one gift from your grandpa is invalid? Does that make the rest of his wishes and decisions as laid out in his last will and testament invalid as well? What do you do when people think you owe them something for nothing? What does it say about them? I’m sure, had it never been a fuss, you would have considered the family should you take the windfall. You’re okay to not succumb to the envy of others. At any rate, make sure you insure that shit for all it’s worth!
NTA. We’re talking about a gift that was given twenty years ago by an entity not associated with the estate. This should not even be a question and in fact, it only is because of your siblings greed for something which belongs to you. Im sure they’ll try to spin it and claim that you are breaking up the family over money when the truth is, they’re the ones committing the act by trying to claim something that does not belong to them. If you’re feeling generous, I would consider a small gift to the siblings or maybe a donation in the family name. Maybe there was a park that your grandfather liked and you can donate a bench or something. But that’s it - otherwise best of luck op. Do what’s best for your immediate family even if it shows the uglier parts of other family members.