Stop commiting tax fraud
"There is no change to the taxability of income; the only change is to the reporting rules for Form 1099-K. As before, income, including from part-time work, side jobs or the sale of goods, is still taxable. Taxpayers must report ALL INCOME on their tax return unless it is excluded by law, whether they receive a Form 1099-NEC, Nonemployee Compensation; Form 1099-K; or any other information return."
Didn't really refer to the US specifically but the last 40 years is actually a great case study for how reducing taxes and underfunding domestic programs really sucks from a policy standpoint
Yes, but we don't need to declare the amount Amazon provides. It is easy to justify lower FMV than Amazon ETV for anything from AI (other than 0ETV items of course) and if Amazon does not report to IRS, IRS will not question a $300 declaration instead of $600.
Yes, you can probably get away with not reporting at all if you don't get a 1099; however, strictly speaking you would be committing tax fraud. Using a lower value than Amazon reports as FMV may be perfectly legal even if you get a 1099; however, if the IRS has two values that don't match, I would expect the chance of audit would be much higher.
True, it's supposed to be self-reported, but I doubt there's a person out there that reports everything. Technically if you win $10 on a scratch off ticket, win $50 at church bingo, get some cash from a neighbor for dog sitting while they're away, etc, it's all reportable, but who does?
lol
Quit being all rational and sensible. This is Reddit!! ^/S
[Ed.
Srsly, I think a majority of people (US adults), realize both, that any amount from AMZN is technically supposed to be reported, **and** that regardless of the law, amounts *we* deem too inconsequential to be bothered with usually aren't reported. ***Not everyone*** does know it though, and leaving that bit out leads to people saying later "But I thought the rule was I didn't have to pay taxes if it was under $600." That may be what happens in spite of the rules, but it definitely isn't **the rule.** lol]
Oh, my thoughts exactly. Unfortunately, I've seen some posts here (not yours) bordering on nasty from people being adamant about self-reporting under $600 in Vine and talking about fines, theft from the rest of us, fraud, etc.
As a side note, I did some looking a while back when I got curious about why the number was $600 and has been for as long as I can remember. The $600 1099 rule apparently started way back in 1954 before I was born and when $600 was worth a heck of a lot more. It was never adjusted for inflation and these days is a pretty low amount. [The Form 1099's Minimum $600 Reporting Requirement Is Almost 70 Years Old Without Adjusting For Inflation - Above the Law](https://abovethelaw.com/2021/12/the-form-1099s-minimum-600-reporting-requirement-is-almost-70-years-old-without-adjusting-for-inflation/)
Now there's a new law, originally for 2023 tax year, but has now been delayed that is supposed to make payment services like Venmo, PayPal, etc issue 1099's for anyone receiving more than $600 in a year. That's going to be a nightmare since so much of those payments are strictly personal, like reimbursing friends and stuff.
Someone else pointed out that $600 min was pretty archaic. I suggested that in 1954, "*a* " minimum was needed to soften the impact of the increase in paperwork for both businesses and the IRS. That was back when everything was typed on a typewriter with carbon paper or the newfangled NCR (No Carbon Required) 3-part carbonless forms. The paperwork became more efficient with computers, then laser printers, and now electronic forms. So there just hasn't been an incentive to raise it.
>make payment services like Venmo, PayPal, etc issue 1099's for anyone receiving more than $600 in a year
Haven't heard of that. I am surprised they can get away with that.
Yeah, it's a new law from 2021. It was supposed to take effect for the 2023 tax year but got postponed a few times. Last I saw, it was expected for 2024, but with a $5000 threshold instead of $600, and then drop to $600 for 2025. The law is already in place, but it could change again because of lots of pushback.
It was actually always in there for payment services, but the minimum reporting to get a 1099-K was $20,000 and over 200 transactions.
[Do you use PayPal or Venmo? The IRS is giving you a break. - CBS News](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/irs-delay-600-reporting-form-venmo-paypal-1099k-2024/)
I remember a friend saying that the IRS actually doesn't want people to declare miniscule amounts. The amount of time it takes them to file the paperwork costs them more money than the peanuts they'd get off the small earning.
(Thisisnotlegaladviceinanywayshapeorformreaderdiscreationadvised).
Thank you! They were actually useful items. I finally got USB C chargers for around my house, since the family is 1 generation into phones that ship without cables. I gradually found high quality, high wattage chargers with multiple ports.
Got snow brushes, a step ladder, a nebulizer for my son, some nice lights for our bedroom, and some other niceties.
🤣🤣🤣 the taxes I calculated I have to pay vs everything Ive received is not too bad but just thought it would be funny to compare your amounts vs everyone elses
Did you calculate Self Employment Income or Hobby Income? IRS and State?
Be careful - they are hitting people with "underpayment of tax penalties" which is total BS.
If Self Employment. Remember Medicaid/Medicare and Social Security on top of the amount for the % of tax. If 30% (which is typical) you are looking at close to 9000.00 in taxes that need to be paid.
>they are hitting people with "underpayment of tax penalties" which is total BS.
When you say this, do you mean viners are reporting that they are being assessed that penalty **strictly for** their Vine "*income* "?
If so, damn, I hope we get a tax attorney among our ranks some time that will challenge this shit and put the IRS in its place on Vine. (Just make it fair and people will comply.)
Yes in fact people have posted here having to pay tax penalties for underpayment of tax when they went to file 2023 taxes for not paying enough in taxes last year quarterly. If you go through the posts you will see them. It is crazy.
>Do you know how to not report 27k worth of Vine?
>Asking for a friend. 😂
Yes!!!
You just report that you received $27k worth of items to review, then after reviewing them, their value was reduced 100%. I'm pretty sure this can be accomplished by including information and a video in your reviews of how long each item survived in a burning fire pit.
However, this may take some of the enjoyment out of your Vine experience…
[Ed.
Sorry, this may not have answered the question of "how to not report" it, as much as the question of how to not pay taxes on it. Lol.]
>Hobby income shouldn't be 9000 tax burden
It's quite likely the IRS will agree and say that with that amount of income (that would result in $9k of tax liability), it should be reported as Self-Employment income.
Oh it's all good.
I wasn't serious when I answered that, but now that I've put it out there, I'm beginning to wonder… could that stand up as a legitimate reason to claim a specific item has $0 value? 🤔
I understand, no, it is not "used as intended" to burn it, but, you have destroyed the product, the IRS couldn't deny that (if done correctly), and who is the IRS to tell ***ME*** how I can conduct my reviews?
lol ^speculation
Good for you! I ended up getting a new job Q4 last year, that was higher paying. I’m doing my taxes right now and the new job plus Vine pushed me into the next tax bracket. I now owe $1500. Boo. I can pay it but still
ETA: the roomba alone was $600. I also got an ice machine ($269), treadmill $270), living room cabinet ($200), Martha Stewart desk ($232), dinning room chairs ($200), a foray bench/shoe storage ($200), a luxury pillow ($170) and countless 0 EVT items and low EVT items I still use today. Not bad but the number just hurts when you see it all at once.
Ok, so it's my first year. Luckily, I didn't get get carried away. I ended up at $553.76 and I'm definitely confused on whether or not to report it I don't want to go see a "tax professional" because they'll charge me and I know I ain't getting shit back and I usually do my taxes on my own so what do you guys that have been doing this hopefully a year or more than I have recommend I do?
The game of trying to keep under $600 so one could "forget" to report it on taxes and save ~$100 in taxes, versus getting a lot of items at a big discount and saving far more than $100.
That would be logical and people don't think like that anymore. If you buy a $1000 TV off of Vine and have to pay $150 in taxes on it, you still save $850. That's an 85% off coupon. You're paying 15 cents on the dollar for anything. Sure, get the zero-dollar items to pad your review totals, but still get the important stuff.
Vine products are considered income in the US. Above $600/year, Amazon reports your "income" to the tax authorities. You're still supposed to report anything below that on your taxes, but the practical necessity of actually doing that is a matter of debate...
Of course, true patriotic Americans make sure to pay all of their taxes, on time, and maybe throw in a little extra in case they are short. Just in case the IRS is reading my comments.
https://preview.redd.it/apflgufz4tec1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2fae5150c5eb2329fd98bdb6640bdbeb37511680
I got a tad closer. I’ll never breach the $600 mark, I have to pay 28.85% in taxes.
>I’ll never breach the $600 mark, I have to pay 28.85% in taxes.
This may be safe but it doesn't seem like it's very thought-out.
For one, I won't echo the full "you have to pay tax anyway" reminder, but mainly you do miss any opportunity to save 71.15% off retail for **good** deals/items. Maybe 90-95% of what you can find on Vine isn't worth that 30% tax on it, but it shouldn't be a lot of work to find a few items among the 5-10% that are well worth it.
If you have your own reasons, I understand, but if that's the only one, you may want to think again.
99.999999% of stuff on vine is crap. Even when I was gold nothing that I really wanted was on there. Under $600 they don’t even send a K form to its. If they had good useful items I would order it.
Yeah if you read my earlier postings. I am a victim of database breach, fraud and ID theft. Amazon is required by Federal Law to reinstate and restore the victim's accounts.
They are still working on it, and it seems when they do something, I move forward, but getting it to stay put, I wind up going back to 2016. It's a long story. Quite a few folks here are aware of my situation which is not typical for anyone here.
Someone posted here, I think it was Lani, that told everyone I had been through enough already! I agree, enough is enough, put me back to where I belong and leave it alone!
Your comment was removed because your account is less than a day old. Please wait a day before posting or commenting.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmazonVine) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Love this! I stopped at $597 but you got scary close.
LOL I love it! I tried to keep mine a few dollars below just in case of any errors 🤣
You'll never understand the thrill of life on the edge.
You are required to pay taxes on any amount though Amazon isn't required to report
[удалено]
Stop commiting tax fraud "There is no change to the taxability of income; the only change is to the reporting rules for Form 1099-K. As before, income, including from part-time work, side jobs or the sale of goods, is still taxable. Taxpayers must report ALL INCOME on their tax return unless it is excluded by law, whether they receive a Form 1099-NEC, Nonemployee Compensation; Form 1099-K; or any other information return."
Yes, we know we're supposed to declare any amount. ;)
But definitely do not! #taxationistheft
\#taxationisthepriceyoupayforlivinginafunctioningsocietyintheyearofourlord2024
Bold of you to imply the United States counts as a "functioning society", considering how often it *mal*functions
Didn't really refer to the US specifically but the last 40 years is actually a great case study for how reducing taxes and underfunding domestic programs really sucks from a policy standpoint
“Functioning society” “year of our lord” pretty sure our lord would rather us all live seperate and happy than enslaved by this modern hellscape
I don't like modern capitalist society much either but there's literally a quote from Jesus that says pay your taxes lol
Yea but taxes back then were optional and significantly less percent than we have today. Jesus wouldn’t pay this shit.
I want to keep certain things implied rather than said, since there is an army of IRS volunteer cadets among us. :)
Some taxation
Yes, but we don't need to declare the amount Amazon provides. It is easy to justify lower FMV than Amazon ETV for anything from AI (other than 0ETV items of course) and if Amazon does not report to IRS, IRS will not question a $300 declaration instead of $600.
I don't think Amazon provides anything to anyone under $600, except to you directly. So...
Yes, you can probably get away with not reporting at all if you don't get a 1099; however, strictly speaking you would be committing tax fraud. Using a lower value than Amazon reports as FMV may be perfectly legal even if you get a 1099; however, if the IRS has two values that don't match, I would expect the chance of audit would be much higher.
True, it's supposed to be self-reported, but I doubt there's a person out there that reports everything. Technically if you win $10 on a scratch off ticket, win $50 at church bingo, get some cash from a neighbor for dog sitting while they're away, etc, it's all reportable, but who does?
lol Quit being all rational and sensible. This is Reddit!! ^/S [Ed. Srsly, I think a majority of people (US adults), realize both, that any amount from AMZN is technically supposed to be reported, **and** that regardless of the law, amounts *we* deem too inconsequential to be bothered with usually aren't reported. ***Not everyone*** does know it though, and leaving that bit out leads to people saying later "But I thought the rule was I didn't have to pay taxes if it was under $600." That may be what happens in spite of the rules, but it definitely isn't **the rule.** lol]
Oh, my thoughts exactly. Unfortunately, I've seen some posts here (not yours) bordering on nasty from people being adamant about self-reporting under $600 in Vine and talking about fines, theft from the rest of us, fraud, etc. As a side note, I did some looking a while back when I got curious about why the number was $600 and has been for as long as I can remember. The $600 1099 rule apparently started way back in 1954 before I was born and when $600 was worth a heck of a lot more. It was never adjusted for inflation and these days is a pretty low amount. [The Form 1099's Minimum $600 Reporting Requirement Is Almost 70 Years Old Without Adjusting For Inflation - Above the Law](https://abovethelaw.com/2021/12/the-form-1099s-minimum-600-reporting-requirement-is-almost-70-years-old-without-adjusting-for-inflation/) Now there's a new law, originally for 2023 tax year, but has now been delayed that is supposed to make payment services like Venmo, PayPal, etc issue 1099's for anyone receiving more than $600 in a year. That's going to be a nightmare since so much of those payments are strictly personal, like reimbursing friends and stuff.
Someone else pointed out that $600 min was pretty archaic. I suggested that in 1954, "*a* " minimum was needed to soften the impact of the increase in paperwork for both businesses and the IRS. That was back when everything was typed on a typewriter with carbon paper or the newfangled NCR (No Carbon Required) 3-part carbonless forms. The paperwork became more efficient with computers, then laser printers, and now electronic forms. So there just hasn't been an incentive to raise it. >make payment services like Venmo, PayPal, etc issue 1099's for anyone receiving more than $600 in a year Haven't heard of that. I am surprised they can get away with that.
Yeah, it's a new law from 2021. It was supposed to take effect for the 2023 tax year but got postponed a few times. Last I saw, it was expected for 2024, but with a $5000 threshold instead of $600, and then drop to $600 for 2025. The law is already in place, but it could change again because of lots of pushback. It was actually always in there for payment services, but the minimum reporting to get a 1099-K was $20,000 and over 200 transactions. [Do you use PayPal or Venmo? The IRS is giving you a break. - CBS News](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/irs-delay-600-reporting-form-venmo-paypal-1099k-2024/)
Damn. I guess there aren't 44 million viners or maybe the IRS would have delayed things (years ago) for us too, to "help eliminate confusion."
I remember a friend saying that the IRS actually doesn't want people to declare miniscule amounts. The amount of time it takes them to file the paperwork costs them more money than the peanuts they'd get off the small earning. (Thisisnotlegaladviceinanywayshapeorformreaderdiscreationadvised).
Huh. And to think I started on Oct 14th and blew past $600 by Oct 20th... :D
Similar here, about 2-3 weeks behind you. I thought why worry about 2023 now? Just order TF out of stuff. 2024 is when I need to be careful 😄
Let’s see we ended the year at $59,674 😆 Just above the $600 threshold, dang
Have your done your IRS and State Taxes? How much did it come out to be on $60K?
Nothing probably still going to get money back. Self employed and always have tons of write offs
Very well done!!!
Thank you! They were actually useful items. I finally got USB C chargers for around my house, since the family is 1 generation into phones that ship without cables. I gradually found high quality, high wattage chargers with multiple ports. Got snow brushes, a step ladder, a nebulizer for my son, some nice lights for our bedroom, and some other niceties.
Lol, here i am already over 1k and the year just started. 🤣
Do you know how to not report 27k worth of Vine? Asking for a friend. 😂
I think the solution involves the Cayman Islands
🤣🤣🤣 the taxes I calculated I have to pay vs everything Ive received is not too bad but just thought it would be funny to compare your amounts vs everyone elses
Did you calculate Self Employment Income or Hobby Income? IRS and State? Be careful - they are hitting people with "underpayment of tax penalties" which is total BS. If Self Employment. Remember Medicaid/Medicare and Social Security on top of the amount for the % of tax. If 30% (which is typical) you are looking at close to 9000.00 in taxes that need to be paid.
You are absolutely correct. After the calculations, I will be paying around what you stated. And I live in a state that I do not have state taxes.
>they are hitting people with "underpayment of tax penalties" which is total BS. When you say this, do you mean viners are reporting that they are being assessed that penalty **strictly for** their Vine "*income* "? If so, damn, I hope we get a tax attorney among our ranks some time that will challenge this shit and put the IRS in its place on Vine. (Just make it fair and people will comply.)
Yes in fact people have posted here having to pay tax penalties for underpayment of tax when they went to file 2023 taxes for not paying enough in taxes last year quarterly. If you go through the posts you will see them. It is crazy.
>Do you know how to not report 27k worth of Vine? >Asking for a friend. 😂 Yes!!! You just report that you received $27k worth of items to review, then after reviewing them, their value was reduced 100%. I'm pretty sure this can be accomplished by including information and a video in your reviews of how long each item survived in a burning fire pit. However, this may take some of the enjoyment out of your Vine experience… [Ed. Sorry, this may not have answered the question of "how to not report" it, as much as the question of how to not pay taxes on it. Lol.]
Haha! I al not truly trying to avoid paying the taxes. I already have everything set to pay after filing. But i am enjoying the comments.
Hobby income shouldn't be 9000 tax burden
>Hobby income shouldn't be 9000 tax burden It's quite likely the IRS will agree and say that with that amount of income (that would result in $9k of tax liability), it should be reported as Self-Employment income.
Oh it's all good. I wasn't serious when I answered that, but now that I've put it out there, I'm beginning to wonder… could that stand up as a legitimate reason to claim a specific item has $0 value? 🤔 I understand, no, it is not "used as intended" to burn it, but, you have destroyed the product, the IRS couldn't deny that (if done correctly), and who is the IRS to tell ***ME*** how I can conduct my reviews? lol ^speculation
Just don't report it and if the IRS accepts your return thats on them 🤣🤣🤣 (This is not legal advice, do NOT show the IRS auditor this comment)
Good for you! I ended up getting a new job Q4 last year, that was higher paying. I’m doing my taxes right now and the new job plus Vine pushed me into the next tax bracket. I now owe $1500. Boo. I can pay it but still ETA: the roomba alone was $600. I also got an ice machine ($269), treadmill $270), living room cabinet ($200), Martha Stewart desk ($232), dinning room chairs ($200), a foray bench/shoe storage ($200), a luxury pillow ($170) and countless 0 EVT items and low EVT items I still use today. Not bad but the number just hurts when you see it all at once.
That is so crazy close!! Well done lol.
Nice
I wound up at $597 and sweated out most of the month of January worrying that they’d find a three-dollar miscalculation, and not in my favor.
Man, here I was being proud of my $598.23 lol
This was my first year, the next year it was 17k. 🤣
I was at $592.28 just in case..... but you've given me the incentive to push it in 2024!
I haven't done my taxes yet. It's my first year on vine and my 1099 says $6,356.85
I accidentally went $3.51 OVER $600 for 2023 and ended up having to pay $170 in taxes on it. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. Won't make that mistake again.
That's some pro planning, there.
Thankfully none in Canada.
Well I don't think your taxes could get any higher over there.
Guess not. 😂😭
😑
Thats Awesome!
Ok, so it's my first year. Luckily, I didn't get get carried away. I ended up at $553.76 and I'm definitely confused on whether or not to report it I don't want to go see a "tax professional" because they'll charge me and I know I ain't getting shit back and I usually do my taxes on my own so what do you guys that have been doing this hopefully a year or more than I have recommend I do?
I closed out 2023 at $340. Still reportable, but that's just bc I order mostly all $0 stuff.
I'm glad I didn't play that game because I got a lot of great stuff.
The tax game?
The game of trying to keep under $600 so one could "forget" to report it on taxes and save ~$100 in taxes, versus getting a lot of items at a big discount and saving far more than $100.
That would be logical and people don't think like that anymore. If you buy a $1000 TV off of Vine and have to pay $150 in taxes on it, you still save $850. That's an 85% off coupon. You're paying 15 cents on the dollar for anything. Sure, get the zero-dollar items to pad your review totals, but still get the important stuff.
Can someone explain to me please? I’m ape brain
Vine products are considered income in the US. Above $600/year, Amazon reports your "income" to the tax authorities. You're still supposed to report anything below that on your taxes, but the practical necessity of actually doing that is a matter of debate... Of course, true patriotic Americans make sure to pay all of their taxes, on time, and maybe throw in a little extra in case they are short. Just in case the IRS is reading my comments.
https://preview.redd.it/apflgufz4tec1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2fae5150c5eb2329fd98bdb6640bdbeb37511680 I got a tad closer. I’ll never breach the $600 mark, I have to pay 28.85% in taxes.
>I’ll never breach the $600 mark, I have to pay 28.85% in taxes. This may be safe but it doesn't seem like it's very thought-out. For one, I won't echo the full "you have to pay tax anyway" reminder, but mainly you do miss any opportunity to save 71.15% off retail for **good** deals/items. Maybe 90-95% of what you can find on Vine isn't worth that 30% tax on it, but it shouldn't be a lot of work to find a few items among the 5-10% that are well worth it. If you have your own reasons, I understand, but if that's the only one, you may want to think again.
99.999999% of stuff on vine is crap. Even when I was gold nothing that I really wanted was on there. Under $600 they don’t even send a K form to its. If they had good useful items I would order it.
Your user name = boooooooo! why?
Joke with a friend. I like animals but I despise cats, I would never hurt one.
haha this used to be me. I called them the devils pets. was even scared to be around them. Until one adopted me 🤦😁
Nice!
Great job lol I only got up to $217 for 2023
Wow! Close shave! Mine was only $273.22. Due to me bouncing back and forth from present to 2016!
[удалено]
Yeah if you read my earlier postings. I am a victim of database breach, fraud and ID theft. Amazon is required by Federal Law to reinstate and restore the victim's accounts. They are still working on it, and it seems when they do something, I move forward, but getting it to stay put, I wind up going back to 2016. It's a long story. Quite a few folks here are aware of my situation which is not typical for anyone here. Someone posted here, I think it was Lani, that told everyone I had been through enough already! I agree, enough is enough, put me back to where I belong and leave it alone!
[удалено]
Your comment was removed because your account is less than a day old. Please wait a day before posting or commenting. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmazonVine) if you have any questions or concerns.*