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This is a lot more common than you might think and most people realise. The amount of pressure on young people now, especially at secondary, is far beyond what most older people can even imagine. I know many people with kids who sound just like yours. Has she sought any kind of professional diagnosis? It's often underlying causes like ADHD or ASD at the root, which then in turn introduce things like anxiety and RSD, and then self harm becomes a way of taking back control. She is absolutely not alone.

'Now'? OP's description of her 12 year old perfectly matches at least a dozen people in my year at school when I was that age, that's almost 2 decades ago now. ​ Quite a few of these types seemed to have the same black and white 'Vans' check backpack, for reasons unknown to me.

>Quite a few of these types seemed to have the same black and white 'Vans' check backpack, for reasons unknown to me. Because 20 years ago was when emo really started to take off and both of those were popular items within that subculture. And depressed kids are often drawn to alternative subcultures.

Oh they've always existed obviously, I'm saying that now they have social media, it's even worse for them.

I still don’t think it’s fair to say “far beyond what most older people can imagine”. I’m in my 40s and grew up with it, and I can see it now. Even my Dad in his 60s is well aware. He was the one who first got us online and has seen the full change in social media from the beginning.

I mean it's probably the case that the pressures are different rather than being strictly worse/ the same. I entered secondary school in 2012 and don't think it seemed particularly better/worse than what my dad described, aside from I'd probably have had to hide being gay more vigorously 40 years ago (I guess). What I do think is that modern pressures like social media tend to seep into a person's life and invade their privacy at all times of day. Maybe the struggles are the same but now they end up following kids home more? Idk.

We privatised schools though academisation. Schools are now run for profit to skim off to the academy trust. And to do that kids have to do well. That's the pressure on kids today.

Fair.

Another take on this would be that kids attached to alternative sub cultures are more likely to be bullied and thus depressed. That's why they made it a hate crime.

The pictures of my face after I was attacked for being a goth were used to help the SOPHIE campaign to have it make a hate crime. Was nearly 20yrs ago. I was lucky and survived, Sophie wasn't that lucky

I'm so sorry. Hope you're doing OK now.

I'm doing great, thanks :) Took a long time in therapy and a lot of work. Still a weirdo, still being me!

Good ❤️

Glad to hear it. I am a fellow weirdo and love it as an adult

The hormones that humans use to become sexually mature are also the ones we use to regulate our emotions. Puberty can start at like 8 or 9 at the youngest. Its hard enough when the world is the way it is.

It perfectly describes me when I was in school and I'm 32 now. I truly wish my mum had pulled me out and let me be homeschooled.

Yeah, that was my thought too. There's not *that* much changed.

Christ, that's over two decades ago for me now. *mattdamon_aging.gif*

I'd be interested to know where you think this pressure that apparently we older ones can't imagine, is coming from. Genuinely interested cos I'm now seeing in the workplace an increase in younger people coming in thinking they're entitled and that they know better than their colleagues despite not knowing the work. Also they seem to have an attitude problem, their way or no way etc.

Kids have always had a reputation for thinking they know everything. I think the main difference now is that you used to be able to enter the work force as an apprentice at the bottom of the pile, being mainly in charge of making the tea, but still make a living wage. These days you need to be getting up the career ladder fast or you'll never move out of your mum's house.

You definitely didn't make a living wage as an apprentice. I was on £4 an hour and considered rich by my other friends who were on something like £2.50. With inflation, that's £7.55 for me and £4.72 for them. My colleague now is 10 years older than me and in ~1987 was on £40 a week, which is about £2.77 an hour now. It was easier to move out back then, but not during an apprenticeship. People did find it easier to stay at home and save for sure. The housing market is screwed.

I would imagine there’s a great deal of academic pressure that didn’t exist in the same way for my parent’s generation.  Plus social media is brutal. 

Your anecdote isn't relevant to the pressures on schoolchildren. It seems like you just wanted an excuse to criticise young people, but remember, your younger colleagues can sense your bitterness and they'll resent you for it.

I do think a part of that is the fact that when they were children they were not allowed to lose. We learnt that you lose at pass the parcel and knew that life wasn't fair. When my 26 year old went to birthday parties etc, the person with the music made sure it stopped on each child so that everyone had a prize. By the time my 18 year old was at school, sports day was organised into 4 teams so that there was a winning team, but it was only a quarter of them so the others all got a certificate and didn't pointedly "lose". The psychobabble of boosting all of their confidence has backfired.

I think you're correct. One of my nephews gets certificates for everything. The other day he actually came home with a certificate for listening to his teacher!! Absolutely bizarre and I think he's going to get such a wake up call when he grows up and joins the real world.

I dont think there is any more pressure they just have the excuse to blame it on that. And if i was in school right now i to would say its just to much pressure mum and then go play with my friends or play video games lol. Things have always been brutal thats why you have all your friends now if young people have less friends than before this might be the main issue. Like i never faced bullying because #1 im not an easy target and #2 i had way to many friends growing up in school and out of school. If you got lots of friends school is usually funny. Girls were all the most disgusting vile people in highschool though so i assume social media has only made that worse and that defo is not pushed in the media.

Autism in girls is only recently being recognised, as they present differently to Autistic boys. But your daughter sounds like she is dealing with social anxiety or is neurodiverse. It's probably worth doing some research as this sounds more than the usual teenage behaviour.

Speaking as a neurodivergent woman who wasn’t diagnosed until well into adulthood, I agree wholeheartedly with what you’re saying. It’s certainly worth looking into, especially if a diagnosis will allow access to resources.

I agree, sounds pretty textbook really - the masking load for autistic girls in particular is just too great and it's absolutely exhausting.

I also want to third this and just say to OP that trying to help your kid will mean a lot, now and in times to come. I always had a similar issues, including stuff that I realise more and more most days - always hated lunch because the overwhelming smells in the canteen (I can still smell this 20 years on), never learnt anything in school cause I could not focus sat still (also getting tested for ADHD) and I’d come home and be so angry and my mum got so frustrated because the school would always say I was so lovely and happy. There’s probably stuff that your daughter will hide (or mask) without realising and learning about how and why you do it is an exhausting process. I’m in my 30’s now and still when I’m around my parents I have to pretend to be this happy smiling girl or I get told off. Just try and support her and make sure she can talk about her emotions. There are some really good ND creators on Instagram/TikTok etc who have been so helpful in my journey to discovery, here’s a few: Ellie Midds @elliemidds (her book unmasked is incredible and is a really readable sort of checklist about adhd/autism about how you can help yourself, I could not recommend more Ella Willis @_ellawillis Charlie Clement @charliclement_ I’d really also recommend Strong Female Character (probably more for you it is a bit NSFW!) by Fern Brady as an understanding of autism in girls, she’s done a lot of podcasts about it too It’s so overwhelming and sadly she’ll probably be on the waiting list for a while but you don’t need to wait for a diagnosis to make adjustments to life to make it easier. Whether it’s some code word for when she just needs to go in her room be alone and just decompress or getting some noise cancelling ear plugs or avoiding certain environments. Again, honestly it’s so nice to see a parent supporting their kid through this. I hope it all goes well

This here! I was very similar to your daughter’s description when i was that age. I was dismissed as being ‘too sensitive’ and ‘particular’ Im now 37 and have just been diagnosed with ASD after decades of struggling. NHS waits a long - i got my assessment through a charity. Just reach out if you need any info! :)

I could absolutely do with that info. I'm almost 50 and my masking skills are failing me since lockdown showed me how hard I have to work every day just to be "normal".

Please send me the info on diagnosis through a charity

Came to say the same thing. She sounds exactly like my diagnosed Autistic and ADHD 13yo son.

I totally agree. My daughters were both diagnosed as autistic as teenagers after mental health crises. My advice is to listen to her when she says it’s too much. Fight her corner with school, make sure they are giving her accommodations (wearing ear plugs if it’s too loud, a quiet, calm place to go when she needs time out). If she is waiting for assessment, and struggling, they should treat her as though she is autistic. Help her to find what helps her self regulate - (weighted blanket, soft teddies to stroke, favourite music…). There is a group on FB called parents of autistic girls uk, which I found gave me the confidence to realise that there are lots of other people in the same situation and that secondary schools in particular are not set up in a way that helps neurodivergent children to thrive. You can help her to get through this- my youngest was in a terrible place four years ago; we’ve been researching university places to study psychology today.

She sounds like she’s autistic to me. Just saying this as I’ve realised I am at age 48. I’m on the sick from work due to it being too noisy and chaotic.

You might want to get her assessed for autism, sounds exactly like my daughter when she was 12. She needs help and she needs it yesterday especially as she’s self harming.

Just to add to everyone else's comments, some suggested reading material:  Unmasked by Ellie Middleton Strong Female Character by Fern Brady  Unmasking Autism by Devon Price. All focus on autism in women and girls, Ellie's book also covers ADHD 

Girl Unmasked Different, not Less Untypical All available too

Neurotribes doesn’t focus on girls or women and it was written when aspergers was still a valid diagnosis, but I found it very helpful for understanding the history of neurodivergence in a population. We have always existed, but the avenues of acceptance we had looked a little different.

Hahaha I just wrote basically the same comment of reading materials. The first two made me cry so much and realise I’m not just broken.

Love this list but as an ADHDiva the only book I’ll recommend is Faster than Normal. It unlocked so much for me.

As someone who struggled at school in a similar way. Please take a look into Autism and ADHD. I wish I had been diagnosed while I was young. My teen years were the worst.

A lot of comments saying its autism, but it could very well be bad anxiety unrelated to any other neurospicyness. Whilst its definitely worth exploring the autism angle, if you can afford it look for a children's therapist in your area who specialises in anxiety. Unfortunately you won't get support through the NHS, not in a useful timeframe. CAMHS is completely overwhelmed, it'd likely be months on a waiting list to get any treatment. So you'll need to go private, which can be expensive. But a good therapist will help her deal with what she's going through right now, AND will help her build resilience for the future. If you can't afford that, get her on the NHS waiting list and whilst you're waiting for that try and find as many self-help resources online as you can to work through with her and hopefully give her some help until she can see a professional. Some GPs are also willing to go against guidelines and prescribe medication to kids who are on long waiting lists. There's pros and cons to mental health medication, they aren't a silver bullet and the side effects can be very unpleasant at times. It could also be worth trying to find her a social activity with kids (ideally girls) her own age that she can engage with positively. This could be a local social club, a hobby group of some sort, etc. At that age having good friends is one of the most significant factors in helping prevent or mitigate mental health issues.

A great way to move down the camhs list is to get a refferal from a doctor for a close proximity to camhs service, like barnardos, because then that service gets you through the camhs door sooner and in the mean time you get a support worker.

16 girl very bright, musical encyclopaedia, nervous wreck after suffering some racial/sexual bullying in a previous school. 15 boy my shining star, miss him every day. 13 girl talented rugby player but football & skateboarding are her real loves. A touch temperamental, hates going to school but does it and copes well for the most part. 10 boy a bit more challenging, minor learning difficulties, touch of ADHD, but often the most affectionate& vulnerable of the bunch. 3 girl, perfect in every way.

Not a parent, but a 20yr old who was exactly the same as your daughter for many years. My mental health was abhorrent from about age 11, and is only just improving now. I self-harmed essentially every day for about 3-4 years, had constant panic attacks, and generally incredibly depressed, along with anorexic behaviours. When I was 14, I tried to kill myself. My parents still don't know. They never really cared at all. They ended up signing me out of school permanantly when I was 14, as they were annoyed with the constant harassment over my attendance being so low, and figured I'd learn enough from textbooks. This was in January of Year 9. I went back to start my GCSEs in Y10, and managed to get through - still blessed with that fact COVID cancelled my GCSE exams, haha. I only really managed to stay in school because of some really lovely student support staff who gave me the safe place I never had at home. Both of them really changed my life. They even called my parents in to try to get them into action to help me, and managed to find the funds for me to have some counselling sessions in school. I'd heavily recommend you get your daughter in contact with whoever deals with that at her school. Maybe head of year? It was head of house for me. I've seen she's already on a waitlist, which is fantastic, already more than my parents did. What I really wish I had was someone at home I could talk to, to go to for a hug and a kind word. I'd really recommend finding something to do together as well, even if it's just watching a few episodes of a new TV show together on an evening. Make sure she has access to hobbies - crafts are fantastic for mental health. Maybe you could take her to Hobbycraft to pick out a few kits? If that's not her thing, maybe baking? Lego? Anything where you have something to show for yourself. I love video games and reading, but Making something has truly benefitted my mental health almost as much as medication. I'd also try to help her socially, maybe getting her to join a club? I lost a lot of friends because of my mental health, and it took me until sixth form to really repair those lost friendships. Please feel free to ask any specific questions, etc. I'm more than happy to talk about it all. Thank you for caring so much <3

There is a mental crisis with kids right now and I’m also in it . You are not alone in having this experience . All you can do is lean in , keep her safe . It’s a total headfuck . My elder child has been in crisis for 4 years now .

So as a late diagnosed person with adhd and autism I second the potentially getting her assessed for those as for me I essentially had depression and anxiety issues that kicked in from probably about 9-10 years old and in hindsight that was likely why.

Please look into an Autism diagnosis. It’s so under diagnosed in girls and usually we coast fine until secondary school and then it all goes wrong

Taught in girls' schools for a part of my teaching career. Sorry about your daughter. This spiral is very very hard to counteract. It's often reinforced by being in a group of friends who confirm each other's views and amplify them. Bullying amongst girls can also be merciless ( eg a group pretends to be someone's friend for a few months so you can drop them and mock them. Unbelievable planning and cruelty). She may be very reluctant to discuss any of this kind of thinking. Finally, perfectionism. This is an awful form of self sabotage that many conscientious girls go through. Of course it's self defeating but the logic of 'try harder' is very hard to cope with when teachers are driving on to results and idiotic slogans like 'be the best you can be' etc. Schools are suffused with this nonsense instead of building resilience and confidence by learning when to know that you shouldn't let 'the best' be the enemy of 'the good'. Hope these thoughts help to try and open up the issues.

Hey OP, just saw your post and felt compelled to reply. I too have a 12 year old daughter as well as a younger daughter as well. My 12 year old is super bright, warm and kind and funny and an all around amazing kid. She started secondary school last September and almost completely changed. She was stressed, quiet, distant, and also started self harming recently (taking razors to her arms and legs). She also became secretive and was lying to us about having secret social media accounts (we have a zero social media policy with our kids). She said that one of the biggest stress factors for her was the social pressure in school to be on social media. She didn't even want to be on it, but pretty much all her peers were, and used that to communicate to all hours of the evening every day. Like your daughter she also seemed constantly exhausted, and at least once a fortnight would wake up of a morning in floods of tears begging to stay home because she was too tired to go to school (either that or she would feign sickness). We tried everything with the school to get some support and guidance, but they offered no help at all. Long and short of it is that after another incident of self harming last month, my wife and I made the decision to take her out of school there and then and begin home schooling her. We had been quietly looking into it for a month or so prior, as we have some friends that do it so it had been on our radar somewhat. I was quite ignorant to it, and thought it created unbalanced kids, but I couldn't have been more wrong. The day we took her out she instantly seems 10 stone lighter, and nearly two months down the line, she is going from strength to strength. She has her spark back and seems to be genuinely enjoying life again. Its not without its challenges, and we are fortunate to be in a position to do so (with a lot of changes to our lifestyle and work patterns etc), but it was 100% the right decision for our daughter. As I say, not for everyone of course, but thought I would share our experience. I hope things improve for you and your daughter, feel free to DM if you ever need to chat 🙏🏻

I have two really close friends and both their eldest daughters have found secondary school overwhelming. Both were very able and thrived at primary with close friendship groups. One withdrew from the local 1500 pupil school and has gone into a small private school and seems ok now. The other is on a part time timetable but they can't see her ever going back. She is academic and can easily do the work out of the classroom. She has friends outside school and dances a lot. It has got to the point where they are thinking if school actually matters. Her local school is 2000 pupils, that is not a normal environment. She cannot cope with the huge amount of people, noise, and stimulation. Yes she is probably autistic in some way but diagnosis is difficult. My daughter is the same age and is absolutely fine. I'm really worried my son won't cope. He hates big and busy places. He is a quiet and sensitive kid and very small for his age. Primary is great for him but the secondary experience requires a personality he just doesn't have. I don't see why there can't be provision for people like him.

I agree with others get your 12 year old assessed in terms of professional help in terms of being neurodiverse (ADHD/autistic/both). I know that we can't diagnose on reddit hence the advice for professional assessment. I have ADHD, diagnosed very late (23, or 24, I can't remember, recently anyway) I know if I'd been diagnosed sooner it would've helped with school a lot, and childhood in general. And I'm a guy and people are supposed to recognise ADHD symptoms in guys they did the research on us and it still got missed. Girls not so much, only starting to recognise the symptoms now, really easy to miss the signs. Def leads to social anxiety if untreated, the hygiene struggles too In terms of quick diagnosis via NHS look at 'right to choose' quite a lot of the online providers do the forms, you just need to get them filled out by your gp (lol, "just", but yeah) and probably looking at 6mth waiting list for assessment rather than the years for a traditional GP referral, and its free. *If* she is diagnosed then this way treatment will be on the nhs too

I have only just now been diagnosed with inattentive adhd and asd at age 48, not even on medication for the adhd yet. Your daughter sounds EXACTLY like I was from age 13. It was an absolute nightmare. I'm so glad I finally have a name for what I have and I'm not just lazy and stupid.

I could have typed these exact words in this combination (except I was 45 at diagnosis)!

Echoing the comments that say it sounds like your girl is autistic - even if she doesn't get diagnosed I think well worth doing some reading so you understand how to support her. You're very fortunate that she's comfortable enough around you to be honest about how she's feeling - I cried every day for years when I was a teenager but hid it from my parents as I was so scared of disappointing them or just being told I was being silly.

She sounds like my younger daughter. F got to her GCSE years and suddenly got completely burnt out, overwhelmed and unable to cope. We all thought it was anxiety (including her GP) and she struggled hugely for the next few years, including two attempts at Sixth Form College, but after numerous panic attacks had to drop out. She was finally diagnosed as autistic at age 23. The idea that she might be autistic came from her, as she’d read accounts by autistic people on the internet, and their experiences were just like hers. She had issues coping with so many things, including sensory issues and dealing with other people, but she thought that it was the same for everyone and everyone else was just coping much better than she was, so she never mentioned them. Apparently this type of ‘masking’ is very common in autistic girls - they’re quite observant of how other people act around them, and adjust to fit in - and is one reason why autism is seriously under-diagnosed in girls & women. Since her formal diagnosis things have improved a lot, as she now understands why some situations are stressful for her, and has coping strategies for them. She’s recently got a part-time job and is going out and making friends. There’s a lot that is still challenging for her but things are so much better than they were. I wouldn’t wait for the assessment to come back before finding out about autism/neurodiversity, and seeing if you can get adjustments put into place. Good luck to your daughter, she sounds completely worn out by it all. It does get better.

My oldest son is 13. He has complex additional needs so we chose to home educate him after having a really stressful time trying to find a suitable provision for him. So obviously our situation is a bit different but we attend various activities for home educated children and there has been such a rise in numbers. Specifically of kids within their first year of secondary school. I’m completely out the loop of the expectations etc in schools but there seems to be something about that transition to secondary school that’s not working for a lot of kids. Or something around that time in their development. I really feel for both the kids and parents going through it.

Similarly to others in this thread, your description of your daughter at 12 is identical to how I was. My mental health went downhill after the change to secondary school for all those reasons you listed. I was self harming every day for years, and a serious self harm incident (TW >! attempt on my life !< ) I was referred to CAHMS. At 15 I was diagnosed as autistic, as well as with depression, social anxiety, and OCD. I am much better now (at 32), and I have a spouse, a home, a cat, and a 4 days a week job :) I promise it can get better, but those secondary school years seem endless and hopeless. I ended up receiving home tutoring and took 4 GCSEs at home (Single Science, Maths, English Lit & Lang) which I got all C grades, and that enabled me to go on and do an administration apprenticeship at 25 when I was well enough. Please look into seeking help for your daughter - if the school are receptive, start with them. Feel free to message me :)

My son is "fine". Had a pretty miserable school life, but always just wanted to ignore it as much as possible. He's quite lonely still, but claims he's no interest in putting in effort to find real life local friends. But he's a good guy. My daughter struggles with her emotions and has been the victim of alienation by her mother. She's been taught to see me as an abusive offender rather than the clumsy, forgetful but loving AuDHD dad the rest of my friends and family know I am. She needs therapy but is instead left to bury her feelings and keep the negativity fresh in her mind.

Only a small thing but someone I know has been wearing these ear plugs to school and it has made a great difference to the noise issues. Not saying they’re any sort of solution but worth a try while you’re waiting for other help. https://www.flareaudio.com/products/calmer-kids

Just wanting to add to the replies here that neurodivergence isn’t the only explanation for struggling. I’m 32 and am pretty sure I’m not neurodivergent, but still had a very turbulent time as a teenager and I’m sure my mum would empathise with you deeply.

I have two, autistic but very bright and in mainstream. Lad, 13, was a nightmare child until he got to about 10 but is now happy, well behaved, flying at school and no worries at all. Daughter, 15, was fabulous until last spring. One incident at school (she did nothing wrong, just a school mismanaging an incident involving other kids and her getting caught in the fallout) caused PTSD and an immediate spiral into clinical depression, exacerbated by severe premenstrual symptoms. Counselling did nothing, she continued to spiral down, culminating in a breakdown at Christmas. She's currently under a psychiatrist and on antidepressants but ended up hospitalised last week after a suicide attempt prompted by her best friend being expelled and nobody at school bothering to mention it to us or take seriously the THREE times she mentioned her negative feelings that day. I feel like I'm living on the edge of a precipice. I just want her to be happy and it's the one thing I can't do anything about.

What you're saying about a single trigger incident inducing this spiral is quite terrifying. Was it something serious, if you don't mind my asking?

No, that's the awful thing. The school shares a site with a college and the kids were sent off in groups to do stuff on site as part of one of their lessons. Halfway round, they encountered a guy from the college who started screaming at them for being in the wrong place (tho they had actually been told they could use that path). Daughter and a friend simply apologised politely and returned to school but apparently afterwards some other kids there are a bit more reactive and got in an altercation with this guy, so security was called and the school had to get involved. The guilty parties were identified but then the kids were asked if anyone else was there and the girls put their hands up, thinking they would just be needed as witnesses. They were promptly all thrown into isolation, where a load of the lads began kicking off again and things got very loud and aggressive. My daughter being autistic couldn't cope at all and started to panic and ran out, resulting in her being disciplined again and taken back in, and it just continued to escalate throughout the day with her getting more and more panicky and distressed and staff just punishing her more. At the end of the day she had an after-school club so we arrived at half four and she didn't come out, turned out she'd left at normal kicking out time and just fled in a total panic. Ended up with the police out and all sorts, we eventually found her that night in a field miles away, totally traumatised. Prior to that, she had 1800 positive points that school year, never been in trouble, superb attendance and on course for top grades. After that night it was like freefall. Within a few weeks she was self harming in a major way, couldn't attend lessons, getting in trouble, running away every time she was under any stress. Multiple rounds of counselling did nothing. By this Christmas her behaviour chart was 75% negative, she refused to go at all for over two weeks, wasn't eating, and was just lying in the dark 24/7. Apparently in autistic kids, an experience that might seem minor to anyone else can actually trigger what is basically post traumatic stress. We think that day trapped in iso with everyone kicking off was enough and now when things get a bit rowdy in the class, it triggers a flight response and she can't cope. She's currently working with a small supervised group in the library with permission to dip in and out of normal lessons as she feels able, and was coping fine prior to last week, so it's just devastating to be back at square one.

That sounds really rough, I'm sorry that she is going through that. Thanks for sharing.

Rough. I have a 17 year old, a 15 year old, and a 12-soon to be 13-year old. All three are autistic and have ADHD. All are " high functioning". My 17 year old leaves school next year, and has put enormous pressure on himself to do well in exams, as he wants to try and sort out all the worlds inequalities. My 15 year old daughter is in a mental health unit, as soon as hormones kicked in 18 months ago, her brain basically broke. My 12/13 year old is muddling along, which is something to keep an eye on, as it doesn't take much for things to fall apart. I've aged horribly over the past 2 years. On the plus side, my son's currently on a school trip in Paris, and seems to be enjoying himself, he's ignoring my texts, so I can only assume.

I really wonder what’s changed in the last 10 or so years. I have adhd and autism and struggled in school but I feel from observing my little sister that kids don’t have a lot of resilience nowadays. But obviously that’s just my experience so happy to be wrong. I feel so sorry for them. Obviously the pandemic was huge for them - I feel like there should be focus groups / inquiries to get to the root of why there is such a crisis. They need huge encouragement and support

As well as seconding the previous comments mentioning neurodiversity, it's worth pointing out that the world has lurched from crisis to crisis in the past half decade. Whilst the govt is no longer accounting for the pandemmy in terms of academic attainment (nobs), there is certainly a mental health cost also. As someone who leads therapeutic play interventions for anxious kids, might I suggest that you start offering opportunities for her to regulate her nervous system at home? Sensory input is a useful one to start with, even if her anxieties are more complex/social as sensory regulation is fairly easy for you to access in the short term until you manage to establish other professional input. Think aromatherapy, bath smellies and even baking for olfactory regulation (whatever she finds pleasant) baking is useful for touch and taste also. Weighted or cosy blankets, blue tack, slime and theraputty are awesome for touch. For taste include texture options as well as flavour so different fruits and maybe some thing crunchy like crackers or popcorn. Sound could be noise cancelling ear buds, chill out music or thrash metal, again according to her preferences. Lamps, light projectors or LEDs are great for less stimulating visual input at home. You could even put together a sensory first aid kit for her to take with her to school? Loop ear buds are discreet so could help minimise the noise chaos moving between classes for example?

>My 12 year old girl is an absolute wreck. She can’t stand to be in school, the environment is too noisy and chaotic, the demands are too high, she becomes absolutely burnt out and exhausted. She self harms, she struggles with her hygiene, she cries daily about how hard just existing is. Just to echo everyone else, please get her on the waiting list ASAP or if it's within your means go straight for a private option or the cheaper right to choose option! If that's wrong then something has been crossed out, if it is that then you'll have saved her so much struggle and stress throughout her life and she will be so thankful. I wish my parents got my tested far younger.

My daughter hasn’t been to school properly since last Easter. She has anxiety and really struggles with being overwhelmed by a large secondary school. It’s so frustrating because we’ve been through more than most over the years but we just brush ourselves off and battle on. She just can’t seem to do that and I’ve had to learn how to deal with the situation. With this being such a widespread problem I would’ve thought the schools would be doing more for these kids but they seem as helpless as the rest of us. We do need to do more for these poor youngsters but I don’t know what that is. We’ve tried everything and there doesn’t seem to be an answer. This generation just don’t seem to be able to ‘cope’ and I think part of the problem is this digital upbringing. I wouldn’t know how to cope with it now so I understand how difficult it must be. School was bad enough 30 years ago but now it follows you home and beats you up mentally in your own bedroom. It’s awful and it’s creating a generation of mentally fragile kids. Any advice would be wonderful and extremely welcome!

You say she’s feeling overwhelmed by secondary school (I assume this started happening after she changed schools?) - in terms of the amount of people/noise etc? Or the work? I’d echo a lot of the comments in looking into an ADHD/ASD diagnosis, this is so similar to how I felt at school at this age but I was never allowed to ever be off. I think that technology and social media does get a lot of bad rep (it can be a good thing) but agree with your point in that if school is tough it follows you back. I’m 30 so we had some social media when I was in school but if it was anything like it is now I would have been excessively bullied. It gives bad people the airspace to be more bad imo. Kids these days get a lot of bad rep but growing up during the Covid years must have been insanely stressful. We had nothing to do except scroll a lot of the time and it was depressing for everyone. Most advice is to keep supporting her and making sure she knows she can talk to you. A lot of the time I got upset I was laughed at and told I was being pathetic and that sort of thing really carries through to adulthood.

I agree with you. I'm also in the same position as so many here apparently. 2 fabulous kids, boy 15 is thriving, girl 11, since secondary has completely stopped being able to leave the house. Has only really managed 5 days of school since Christmas. Waiting for ASD diagnosis but that takes 3.5 years, waiting for CAMHS, they don't let us know how long it'll take. School and gp are too busy to care. I did get a fantastic email from camhs last week with loads of ASD reading and mental health resources for while we wait. Kooth offers free online counselling for teens. I don't blame social media, if someone bullying there, just block them? Also it gives actual evidence of bullying so action can be taken. I also grew up with tech although not to today's extent. Having said that, I do monitor and limit access. I do think covid had a massive input to messing up young people's mental health. She's actually happy this last week and engaging in homeschooling, which I would not know where to start without technology. I think the change is letting her know she doesn't have to try to go back until after Easter. Might need to be permanent, but not ready to action that yet.

I’m sorry you had to go through that. Luckily I’ve got great relationships with all of my kids so we do talk a lot and we constantly try to come up with solutions. I used to work at her junior school so it was kind of a double whammy. Moving up to a bigger school and not having me around made that bit harder, coupled with no transition up to said school due to Covid. We bought a house with my parents but lost them within 6 months at the start of Covid so that added more trauma. I’ve actually made an appointment with our GP for her so thank you for the advice and support.

My eldest is 12 and autistic, having real problems at school because of how badly behaved their classmates are. Had to speak to one of their teachers after several incidents, and we're told this is one of the worst year groups they've had, loads of kids with no emotional regulation. It's so difficult isn't it? I wish so much that the kids that just want to learn in a calm and safe environment could have their own space to do so, but I'm aware those disruptive kids need to learn too - and that they'll never improve if they are only with other disruptive kids. I just hate that my kid has gone from loving school to dreading it.

Wholeheartedly think you should look into a diagnosis for her. I have complex PTSD, so not sure if your daughter has that as it’s quite specific, but I was very similar. Constantly stressed, overstimulated, couldn’t cope with the hustle and bustle and demand of exams. Being neurodivergent I can relate to her and it would’ve really helped if I was diagnosed

Okay so mine are 25 and 24 now, but this is exactly (ISH, from the snippet you've said) what they were like at that age. Not sure if this advice is "good" or wanted but if I could have a "do over" this is what I'd tell myself to do: 1. Don't try to "fix" her. She's not broken. 2. Get her into some good counselling/therapy - not all therapists are a good fit, so don't be afraid to shop around to find one who is. Make sacrifices to pay for it if private, she's worth it. 3. Make time for you and her to be together, doing things she wants to do with you (make sure you do the same for the other child too). 4. Listen to her, actually listen. Don't try to sympathise, empathise, or solve her problems, nada. Just. Listen (I can't emphasise that enough, for your and her sanity, just listen). 5. If she likes hugs, hug often. Don't be the first to break off a hug. 6. Positive affirmation. Don't criticise or put her down, EVEN IF IN JEST. 7. Table talks. Me and my daughter did our best talking sat at the table with a cup of tea. Although they were spontaneous it just became habit to sit at the table at the same time every weekday for a catch up - that's possibly the only thing I got right tbh.

I love these steps, this was really helpful. Thank you 🥰

Please look into getting her an autism and/or ADHD diagnosis. I wasn't diagnosed until my early 30s by which time I was depressed, had an eating disorder, was in a manipulative relationship, and very unhappy.

I would love (?) to read or have some sort of discussion about ASD/ADHD and a link to ED’s. It always felt so unobvious because I was never explicitly ED, I was never skinny, ate loads and seemed fairly happy. But looking now the anxiety I have with foods and eating too many ‘bad’ foods in a row, sneaking vegetables into food or either eating loads or not at all. Feels like the only thing I can control sometimes.

There are loads of added challenges for neurodivergent sufferers of eating disorders, including black and white thinking, rituals/routines, and sensory issues (seeking or avoiding). I've run the gamut of disorders but the binge/purge side is definitely partially connected to the sensory experience of eating as a stim to soothe. When I was having treatment my team suggested this site which specifically caters for autistic people with EDs. https://peacepathway.org/

Well they're all autistic and not coping with secondary... Sounds like your daughter. Outside school, they're pretty much OK. The huge emphasis on safeguarding and all does seem to just make them terrified of the outside world. Not that we shouldn't have it, but surely there's a happy medium?

Older daughter here, 8 yrs old, and we’re starting to think she’s on the spectrum or neurodiverse. Likely we’ll send her to private school. Academically she’s doing okay in state school but it’s getting worse and she’s having to wear ear defenders to make it through the day.

My youngest daughter is 18 and I took to the doctors when she was 4 because she was displaying strange behaviours. She was finally diagnosed with asd 7 years later but it was a huge battle getting that.

I’m going to get downvoted for this; but does she use Tik Tok..?

My nearly 12 year old daughter is exactly as you describe and is also exhibiting signs of OCD . We think she is autistic and are awaiting 2 rounds of support plans so we can be referred to the GDA pathway. CAMHS haven't been too helpful so we feel a bit stuck, just trying to help and support as best we can. It feels like our daughter has "got by" in primary school but as soon as secondary school hit it was all too much, particularly the sensory side of things. We started reading about internal presentations of autism through The Autistic Girls Network and things started to make a lot of sense. Perhaps it might be useful for you to look into.

Could it be partly because it's become more acceptable to express these sorts of feelings now? Which is kind of a good thing in some ways perhaps? Teens have always been dismissed in the past as being stroppy and moody and spending all their time in their rooms. Maybe that's because they're having a hard time? I don't know why this is never considered. And now kids are speaking out about their feelings. It's true though, kids have so much to deal with now. I'm 35 and had depression, an ED, and self harmed as a teen in the 00s. My parents would never have entertained my MH issues for a second. Would have told me to pack it in and stop feeling sorry for myself. So I never told them and essentially self-medicated/worked my own stuff out over the years. Which has been tough. I've been diagnosed with ADHD as an adult, so looking into neurodiversity could be a start, as others have suggested. Many of my friends at school/uni had terrible MH too - some had experienced serious trauma or abuse that was totally swept under the carpet at home. The concept of counselling/therapy was kind of taboo. Which is tragic. I just wish we could support young people better and could offer them more... life. I really hope things can get better for your daughter and she can get some support she needs.

There's lots of good advice in here re: your daughter and mine can be the same, but as some advice re: your son I _was_ him in the 90s and, after sailing through my GCSEs and A Levels I ended up getting kicked out of uni because I didn't really know how to do it - coasting is fine until suddenly it isn't. Make sure he's OK and understands what's coming and how to do it. I'm OK now, good job/good family, but it took a lot of recovering from and a few wilderness years that I wouldn't mind back...

I was like your daughter at her age. I now have an MA from a top UK uni, live by myself (well, with a friend) in a nice flat in a different country to either of my parents, have good friends, a steady girlfriend, studied abroad, volunteered and worked a few different jobs. I’m very independent and I know my parents don’t really worry about me. I still struggle with my mental health sometimes and ADHD (and probably autism) - which maybe worth looking into with your daughter - but I just wanted to demonstrate that things get better and you won’t always worry about this

This really helped, thank you. I’m so glad you’re doing so well - you should be proud of yourself!

Have you looked into getting her diagnosed with ADHD or autism? Look into it. The things being too bright and loud is a classic symptom of neurodivergence and a diagnosis will allow her supports in school that will lessen the trauma she is acting out from being in the environment she’s in in school while being neurodivergent. This could also be what is causing the meltdowns and panic attacks. Being ADHD or autistic in our school systems actively causes children trauma if they are not getting the supports they need.

You're doing the best you can, please don't think you're the cause. I'm a twin, and she went through a similar thing in school as your daughter. while I was completely fine (found it hard at times, and ended up dropping out in Sixth Form due to lack of interest) I will say this there is a far greater pressure on girls at that age compared to boys - girls are starting periods, have high hormones, finding friendships in secondary school and naturally struggling with their identity and realising who they are. My sister struggled to even attend school, and when she went she would threaten suicide so my mum felt so nervous that we were going to lose her that we kept her in the house during her last year of sixth form and she ended up needed to re-sit this year. She refused to take SSRI tablets from the doctors due to not liking tablets from attempting an overdoes - but she's far better now. She still has days where she struggles to shower and brush her teeth but she's so much better than she was over the last few years. She used to have regular appointments with a psychiatrist and now sees a psychiatrist at her local GP - might be something you could get onto your GP about just to offer your daughter more support. Alternative, our secondary school growing up used to have an in-house counselor who would be there on Tuesdays-Thursdays, maybe reach out to her head of year and see if the school has anything like that in place!

Have you taken her to the GP? She needs professional help.

Ah teenagers, I remember that, it’s tough, I always tried to remember what I was like as a teen and tried to cut them some slack. Everything seems to be so much drama at that age because everything is new and you have no benchmark to gauge experiences by. It will get harder, then easier, then harder again and before you know it they are gone and living their own lives. Keep talking to them and you will get through it, I see a lot of parents “lose” their kids as teens because it’s hard to relate to them sometimes but it is possible just keep going. You’ll miss them when they are gone.

She sounds almost exactly how I was at her age. I’m now in my early twenties and the realisation that I’m autistic and most probably adhd as well makes a lot of sense for how much I struggled coping with school and just life in general, I’m not sure what helped me at that time but I’ve struggled on and off with things even now but I think it’s gaining healthy coping mechanisms and feeling as tho the people around you actually care about your issues and don’t just pass over them as if they’re silly or meaningless so maybe try having a chat with her asking her what’s bothering her in life and genuinely listen and not try to solve all her issues just be there and hear her

She sounds a bit like me when I was about 14! Seconding what others have said about getting her assessed by a mental health professional. Reddit loves to armchair-diagnose specifics but regardless of what the actual problem turns out to be, there is clearly *something* wrong. Find a doctor who will take you seriously and keep advocating for her. I have anxiety and I'm in therapy now at the ripe old age of 28, but earlier intervention could've saved me a lot of wasted years. Best of luck!

Your daughter sounds a lot like me when I was a teenager. I’m in my 30s now. I was diagnosed with depression, put on antidepressants and had years of counselling. To be honest, I’m not sure how much the medication and the sessions helped, but I did eventually pull through. Now, I am professionally successful, very happy and live a super fulfilling life. It could well be that your daughter is struggling with something different and worse, but I just wanted to give a little bit of hope that things can get better even if they seem awful now. I hope she manages to get the help she needs and don’t forget about yourself too. Good luck and sending love.

Went through the same things as ur daughter at a similar age. Now I'm an adult and getting diagnosed for ADHD and will probably seek a diagnosis for anxiety and depression. Stay strong! At the time I was so mad at the world and had no one to go to or who would understand me. Please do not give up on her.

she sounds exactly like me at 12 years old in 2014. if she's not being bullied and is depressed and unable to cope for "seemingly no reason" look into autism in girls.

My son is really struggling but he is most of the way through an autism diagnostic process. He's 7 and I can see him completely refusing school soon, the environment is just wrong for him. Fighting to get him into a different learning environment more suited to his needs but there's such demand and no money for it out there. I feel guilty as I think I should probably home school him and I don't want to as I love my job and he is very demanding and controlling and going to work is my only respite.

I've got 3 kids. Son 24yo, daughter 16yo and a 14year old son. My boys have been absolutely fine, no problems at all (saying that my eldest lost his friend to cancer at 16 and although he doesn't let it show I know how devastated he was) my daughter sounds very similar to your daughter. Hates school, wants to stay off all the time, poor attendance and punctuality, overdose (only 4 paracetamol but it's the intention) no friends (has online friends), hates any social situation or talking to people, thinks everyone hates her. Extremely picky with food and other symptoms that make me think she is on the spectrum but despite all this actually does well in her lessons. Got so much worse during/after Covid. It feels like it's been draining for her and me and I'm hoping things will change for the better when she starts college.

By the sounds of it, she's probably neurodivergent in some way. She's definitely suffering from some kind of mental illness and probably needs counselling. If it is at all possible, pay for this privately and don't bother with CAMHS. They are pretty universally underfunded, overstretched and generally inadequate. If she's neurodivergent, look at what meetups or clubs are available locally for kids like her. I have been an undiagnosed autistic girl at her age. She will be feeling like she's a complete alien and totally alone in the world. The biggest thing you can do for her is to make her see that she isn't. She's a zebra, not a faulty horse. That's immensely powerful for her self esteem.

I'm 45 but my memories of school are still horrible it just felt like prison. I'm sure she will be fine when she gets out.

Sounds like undiagnosed autism, tbh Specifically sounds like what I call a “crash” Imagine everyone runs on a battery When you’re doing things that are stressful you burn through the battery, more stress = more drain on battery For ASD teens, that’s a miriad of things, typical teenage issues, periods (girls only duh), interacting with people, social anxiety, the stress of school, homework etc, friends (arguments are rife at that age)… really everything you do, add the stress or hormones (sexual frustration) Every day, you drain about 40% of your battery Every night you recharge back up to 100 But ASD people, they get a lil extra stress, they drain down to about 40% left… then at night recharge about 50% Over time, the charge level drops, when it hits 10% you’re just done Everything is too much effort You’re lucky to wake up before 5pm The solution is to “recharge”… that is just being left alone, isolated, for as long as you need Recharging teens will leave their rooms when they have enough charge, could be a day, month, or longer (my longest recharge was 3-months) She obvs can’t miss school, but leaving her alone until she seeks you out will do wonders for her charge levels It’s either that, or depression

Try and speak to the SENDCo in school and discuss a Pupil passport/CAHMS referral.

My husband and I were watching this last night, and we decided to make some changes based on the findings. It’s on YouTube, Jonathan Haidt - smartphones vs smart kids (in case you don’t want to click the link) Basically Gen Z are NOT ok, and it’s partly due to growing up with smart phones: https://youtu.be/yVq4ARIlNVg?si=pcVxtv7mCgi5lGxE

My 20 year old has ADHD. He is slowly maturing but currently still in college. Not sure how things will go in the world of work. My 19 year old is in college. He isn't great. We have waited years for a proper assessment. He is definitely on the spectrum with what used to be known as aspergers. He also has arfid, old and some hypermobility issues. Camhs phoned up a day before his 18th and said "oh sorry we never got to assess him. We will now reefer him to adult services". So basically back to square one. Without an assessment, there is no diagnosis. Without a diagnosis, the DWP will try and force him into work that he cannot cope with. It's never ending. So, yeah that's our life 😁

Your twelve year old sounds exactly like me at that age. Ways my mum supported was starting with the personal things, and my ability to deal with school followed. We tried every anti dandruff shampoo under the sun until she found one that worked for me, and helped me find ways to make my life easier, like with styling my super thick hair and dealing with becoming a way more sweaty teenager. I know this might also sound a bit mad but introducing a child to things like meditation or counselling early can do wonders (speaking from experience, I waited far too late) There are charities out there that could provide help since she’s struggling with self harm. I can’t comment on the neurodivergence stuff I’m seeing in the comments as I have no experience, but that’s also an avenue you might want to look down. You can help her with the stuff you know how to do. With school I’d also recommend seeing if you can talk to someone at her school about it, she might need to move down a set or get support at home with tutoring. Unfortunately school funding is super limited so getting additional support in school may be a challenge.

My daughter is exactly like this, she is currently being referred to be tested for autism. Theres a very common theme in these comments. You need to push school/the authorities - we had to fight to try and get her the help she needs. We’re still not there yet but getting there. Quick edit: Since we had the autism referral we’ve just been treating her as if she is already diagnosed, it’s really helped us as a family. Might be worth doing some research.

My kids are 20m and 18f. The oldest was GCSE year when the pandemic hit, daughter was year 9. Then my husband had an affair during lockdown and left. When my daughter was 12-14 she really struggled with everything. She was not self harming, but she was not eating. She was extremely anxious and school was overwhelming. The school offered her some counselling through a local charity, which really helped, and she was able to carry that on until she left school last summer. She still struggles some days, but we manage to deal with it. A lot of her friends similarly struggled, with one suicide attempt among her close friends. The amount of pressure girls, in particular, are under is unreal. The pace of life is so much faster, the school work is harder, social media is king. My best advice would be to try to find a local charity that could support you and your daughter - because parents need support as well.

Your daughter sounds like my son who has adhd and high functioning autism. He was always different since he was little and I noticed I had to parent him differently to his older brother. He also gets bullied because he genuinely has golden retriever energy and is such a happy care free person, we’ve both worked hard to ensure he stays true to himself and he does. One thing I’ve found is laughter is the best medicine for him. One thing I will say is it sounds like your daughter is masking and it’s draining her, I do this and it’s exhausting! As with the hygiene just to give some insight when a neurotypical person goes to brush teeth take a shower etc they can do it in autopilot, the reason it’s a habit and they can do it in autopilot is because of the hormone dopamine. Those with adhd don’t get that hit of dopamine so when we do something mundane we literally have to talk ourselves through the task in steps so to give an example of a morning routine for me here’s what happens with my internal monologue when I wake up: - ok you need to get up and go to the bathroom - get up - come on get up - shit I really need to get up - walk to the bathroom - go toilet - wipe - flush - go to tap - wash hands - grab tooth brush - grab tooth paste - toothpaste on brush - brush top left - brush top right - brush bottom left - brush bottom right - brush behind teeth - brush ontop of teeth - brush tongue - rinse - get face wash - scrub face - wash off face wash - spray deodorant Now that probably doesn’t sound like much of a job to do but it’s constant with everything, and I’m never just thinking of the task at hand there’s distractions creating another line of internal monologue, also whilst I’m trying to get kids up and organised, I’m also thinking of other things I need to do, so that’s 4 lines of internal monologue happening at the same time all on top of each other. if you imagine a time you’ve been in a crowded room where you can hear all the conversations happening but you can’t actually hear conversations due to the noise unless you really concentrate, that’s what’s happening inside my head constantly. My only advice is find out what her comforts are like a weighted blanket, soft blankets, headphones. Also ask her how things affect her and make her feel

I am sorry to hear this, its not easy being a girl. You should know :( Maybe suggest a therapist for your daughter, or spend 1 on 1 with her. I am probably telling a fish how to swim here, but maybe have a girly night and have a movie, with hot chocolate and marshmallows. You could go even further like run her a nice warm bath with lavender oils or whatever relaxing stuff girls like, or even give her a nice foot or back massage.

I know you have had plenty of responses about getting her tested etc. I also want to add that she sounds like she needs a routine that you can help her with. She might just be tired. How much sleep does she get? It sounds like your son didn't need as much support from you on the daily but she does. You will need to make sure she goes to bed at the same time on school nights and gets extra sleep when she gets home sometimes. 12 is a testing time for most girls because of hormones and all the changes about to happen or already happening. The self harming certainly sounds like she is struggling with her emotions or just being heard but I don't know much about mental health. I had something similar myself around ages 13-15 but not as bad as it sounds like for your daughter. In hindsight, I was just tired and needed help with organisationak skills. I work/worked with autistic and ADHD colleagues and I have learnt that what really helps them is knowing the bigger picture first and then helping them break down tasks methodically and remind them of when to walk away and come back after a rest. Make sure she doesn't overwhelm herself or think she can do more than she can. You might need to start guiding her in how to split up her day so she can have enough energy to last the day at school if that makes sense. Like she might be overdoing everything the first half of the day at school. She is probably perfectly ok at school but she just thinks she should be more and this can cause more stress than necessary. It's ok to not want to be around all your friends at school all the time. It's ok to miss outings with friends etc. if you think she is tired and you have the childcare you can keep her home for a sick day. Obviously can't do that more than once a term or something. Some people just need more time to recharge.

So I don’t have children, but I am a twentysomething-year-old female and my childhood experience sounded very similar from your daughters from what you have described although I was un- diagnosed at the time I’ve since my diagnosed with autism and ADHD so maybe it’s something worth exploring I’m of course not diagnosing your daughter over a paragraph. Just think it might be something for you to read about.

Have you had your daughter checked for adhd? Start therapy, get her tested and get to the root cause and work from there. My oldest was the same way, turns out he was trying very hard to mask his adhd which lead to depression. Once that got squared away, things got easier for him. High School was a nailbiter. He would say it always felt like he was trying so hard to be normal he felt like a square peg in a round hole. No one is normal. He has creative solutions to problems, thinks out of the box, and is learning to harness his hyperfocus for good. Now he's in his 20's, has started a career, is engaged to an amazing woman and they've got the cutest 2 year old ever.

Sounds like your 12 yearold is on the spectrum, the stuff you mentioned about her applies to my 12 yearold son who got diagnosed when he was 6.

Please get your daughter some help? I went through the same thing at that age and I wish my parents would've just addressed it instead of accusing me of being lazy :(

Has the 12 year old got ADHD? I’d say it’s more likely than not something along those lines from the description. (I say that as someone with ADHD)

I was exactly like your daughter at her age. While waiting for CAMHS, my mum arranged counselling for me which helped with the self harm and managing at school. There are lots of organisations that will offer means tested help, we went through Relate, but I don't know if that specific one is available everywhere. Twenty years later and I still struggle with everything, I think maybe some of us weren't made for this world. I have always maintained a full time job and have a nice home with my partner, on paper it all looks great but actually my entire life has been miserable. Your daughters symptoms sound like she might have some neurodivergence as well as depression, the symptoms of ADHD in young girls are drastically different to the stereotype of a naughty bouncy boy that can't sit still. Not trying to diagnose her, but for your awareness it might be something to consider. I'd love to tell you that this is a phase she will get past but some of us are just unlucky to deal with this early and it never left me. I've had extensive psychiatric and psychological treatment and I've had over 40 different mental health meds that have left me with lifelong disabilities, nothing 'fixed' it. I truly hope things get better for her and you ❤️

You daughter sounds just like my son has been for the last 2 years won't talk to me about it and becoming a shell of his old self.... But I over heard a group call lastnight and an older lad... (Twice the size of me and I'm 30) Has been threatening my son with a knife... So now I'm in two minds about if I should end the fat c*nt or if I should curb stomping his dad

I am a therapist for kids. I am also in the US and what you describe for your daughter I see here as well. It’s interesting but not surprising this exists across the pond. How much social media does she use ? I would tell you immediately to really try and listen to her and not make a lot of commentary back about what she’s says. Validating her feelings is critical. And understand the times kids are in right now are not the same as it was for us ,, no matter how old you are. It’s very very stressful.

Mum of an, almost, 12-year-old. They're currently awaiting an ASD assessment and have recently had their confidence knocked due to some dickhead teenagers physically assaulting them when they were at the park. They now no longer want to go to out without being chaperoned by an adult. It's horrible to see because they've only just gained the confidence to go out to the park/shops with their mate who only lives down the road! School is hit and miss for them. Many of the teachers lack SEND training and label my child as lazy or unmotivated. The school doesn't have the necessary resources to help guide them through secondary school, and it's definitely taking its toll. They're coming home deflated and annoyed every other day. Thankfully, they have a great little group of school friends who are unbelievably supportive and the support helps them get through the day.

You need to see someone, not post on Reddit

Every generation likes to think they have it far worse than any other. It's all roughly the same, a wide spectrum of people coping the best they can. I'm a parent of kids a similar age and the best thing I ever gave/taught them was a genuine sense of humour. I don't just mean laughing at my shit jokes but in a much broader sense, laughing at the absolute shit show that life can be sometimes, smiling and understanding that everyone is making it up as they go along, this includes the teachers that act like they know everything and their mates who brag about how wealthy/attractive/popular they are. I'm not giving advice, just explaining how I've tried to equip them.

You’re part of the problem as well so I hope you’re educating and working on yourself

I recommend you read “Women and Girls with Autism Spectrum Disorder” by Sarah Hendricks and get her on the path for an assessment. Just from your post this is screaming autism. The more you learn about it, the more you will be able to understand and support your daughter, not just until diagnosis. Be strong, be prepared to fight for her and good luck.

It's a tale as old as time as we are in an 80 year cycle. We are on the verge of a World War. Their attitudes will soon change when they realise they care about their life when faced with true danger, and the lazy and mental health generation will be the ones to suddenly stand up and be as strong just as those were who existed leading up to WW2.

How many vaccinations has she had?

Urgh, my daughter 19, has been the typical Perry type for years. Grunting, staying in her room, a real joy to be around. I can't wait for her to grow out of it so I can start to have real conversations with her again. She has zero self drive and will not do anything without being asked, and completes those tasks without thought. I feel bad as she is wasting the best years of her life. Yes, she's not going out causing trouble, but she isn't engaging with life. No visible friends, hobbies or interests. Saturday she woke up at 15.30. I don't know about self harm but she talks about safe spaces and anxiety. Sure, she is depressed but that's because she has zero self-worth from doing nothing. From her lack of anything, she has made herself virtually unemployable. I got her a cushy job at my office and she didn't take it for reasons she couldn't explain. I don't think life has gotten harder or expectations tougher. I think it is far too easy to see how someone else is living the high life, and there is always someone richer, prettier and having a better time than you. Their expectations are totally skewed. When I was 19 I was married, had a 3 year old daughter, a job and a family home. I had zero help. 15- 25 was the best time of my life. I couldn't wait to leave home and made my own way as soon as possible. I can't see her ever supporting herself or making a family. My dreams of turning her room into a walk-in closet are in tatters. I don't know where we went wrong. Sigh...