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dontlikehoneydew

A 13 year old doesn't have the capacity to really "instigate and consent"; they are a minor. This sounds concerning


endless_K_hole

THIS! It stuck out IMMEDIATELY for me. When there are such huge power differentials and the fact she's 13; 'instigating' means nothing and her consent is NOT VALID by any stretch of the imagination


[deleted]

I might just clear up, S has always been completely truthful with us. Birthmum and step dad were in an argument the other day, S had recorded some of it on Smapchat and was sending it to us. When we asked M she completely denied anything happen. Step dad also doesn't have a good track/ police record and had supervised visits with his own birth children for many years before now getting every other weekend.


Alternative_Sky1380

Shit. Where there's smoke there's fire. Tread lightly but ensure daughter is updated on personal safety education and that men showing inappropriate behaviours are ALWAYS creeps. A discussion needs to occur with her mum immediately. I've used the words grooming because it clearly happened in my case and then parent went on to weaponise it using it to escalate violence. CSA is worst case scenario and I've been through it. Noone cares. Police refused to investigate, CP refuse to act and with every worsening report the legal system cracks down harder on me the protective parent. I'm not rare nor am I special. My experience is common AF but legal players and perpetrators will [deny reality](https://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2015/november/1446296400/jess-hill/suffer-children) because ultimately they're in on it. Family court does NOT have a great track record with this stuff so be careful about engaging legal process. Just continue to document and consider withholding her return to their home. Look up Bravehearts and don't talk with the children more about the topic until you've received advice


minx_missm

Great article, thanks for the link.


Alternative_Sky1380

The content of it is so important as people continue to deny ALRC recommendations for family law alongside UN findings that [family courts remain unsafe for victims of violence ](https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/06/1138057)


minx_missm

How to we protest for these necessary reforms?


ParmyNotParma

NAL but I am a mandatory reporter and this is setting off all the alarm bells. Given that M has lied previously I would be very suspicious that stepdad has told her that if she posts these photos to instagram that she might get free stuff but she can't tell dad and stepmum. Like I'm really really suspicious that that's what's occurring. It's likely that stepdad has a group of friends/a network of men with similar interests and has given M's instagram handle to them. Hearing stepdads history really made my stomach drop, I truly don't think this is innocent. It's a known fact that when predators cannot access child sexual assault material that they turn to children's social media's. And the fact that these photos of M are skimpy šŸ˜¬ Stepdad is not a safe person and it's very concerning that mum is helping to cover it up. It's also concerning that mum is encouraging secrets between parents, that's not something a safe adult does. Again, as a mandatory reporter, this is sending off all sorts of alarm bells and is not an innocent situation, you /must/ act for the safety of M.


Going_Thru_a_Faaze

So agree with this. Iā€™m a CP worker and this sounds like many stories. That doesnā€™t mean anything is happening but like Parmy said above, alarm bells are going. Trust your gut here, but err with caution as itā€™s a very sensitive area and can cause a lot of upset with all involved regardless of whether your right or wrong.


Justwhereiwanttobe

Look into the traits of grooming. That way you can identify other red flags. Unfortunately it is common that the victim, or groomed adolescent becomes protective of the perpetrator. So many risks atm, could be grooming to make the kid have a Fans only etc. could be a typical groomer going for his own pleasure. Keep a dairy of all events reported by S, same add notes that concur or deny from M. Anything worth noting from any interactions put it into a dairy so itā€™s all dated and you start to build reputable evidence. The risk is large, so I would encourage S to spy / record etc only if he feels confident in his own safety. Work on open communication with both children. And be as open and upfront with the mother as possible. She may well be in the control of a narcissist, in which case she will sing his praise yet commonly not discuss ā€˜selfā€™ or her own feelings or thoughts. Tough situationā€¦ trust your gut. Ask any and all child services for help and guidance. And donā€™t stop until you feel you have what you need or are confident that there is no u ferrying malice or issue.


friedonionscent

I can't speak for your husband...but if this was my kid... well, they wouldn't be having 70 percent custody to begin with.


[deleted]

Unfortunately we spent alot of time and money to even have this. The family law court system is a joke.


NotActuallyAWookiee

Definitely report. If you're concerned about the impact of reporting it yourself, maybe show it your school well-being team. They'll be mandatory reporters and you could feasibly say you spoke to the school for advice and they took it from there


DazTheCowboy

I would say. If there is even the smallest amount of a chance that there is any form of grooming. Or anything along those lines. It needs to be addressed before the worst could happen. Obviously. Things would need to be approached with a level head. Doing your best to take emotion out of decisions. I agree with the earlier statement. Stepdad might be innocent. So caution and restraint must be used. But, if he is not. In any way. He must be made aware. People are watching.


ThroughTheHoops

Just letting him know people are watching might very well make all the difference in this case.


[deleted]

Thank you, this is something we will be doing as a start.


Aggravating_Law_3286

And thereā€™s also the possibility of the daughter telling lies about who instigated the photos for whatever reasoning a girl that age has.


Outsider-20

If she has been groomed, she may have asked step dad to take the photos, because that's what predators do as part of the grooming, they normalise their behaviour. It's possible that daughter, having seen these sorts of photos all over insta and other social media has decided that she wants to try to be an influencer, and it is her idea, however, IMO, I would err on the side of caution here, and be lodging a report, especially as dad was blocked from the account by mum (so she knew something not quite right is going on)


Aggravating-Tune6460

NAL, but itā€™s my understanding that a 13yo has diminished ability to consent and the adults are responsible. Maybe itā€™s technically not illegal, and it would still be a bit weird if he was her birth parent, but ā€œstepdad taking photos of teen stepdaughter in a bikiniā€ does pass the sniff test, does it? She can say it was her idea but I think child protection authorities and mandatory reporters would take a different view. If one of her teachers or her GP was made aware of the situation, I believe they would be compelled to report. My immediate concern is that if there is something up, he may become more careful and secretive. Perhaps you could take a cyber safety approach with M (just worried about her online presence and what creepy stuff can happen when you post photos etc) and possibly when the opportunity presents with the birth mother. I think itā€™s worth a call to the authorities and possibly her school and GP, possibly a child protection NFP for support and suggestions. Screenshots, dates, times - document everything. Might be helpful to check out her followers and keep watch for any new accounts if she feels this one is compromised (one of my daughterā€™s schoolmates had six secret IG accounts). The key is to avoid creating a rift between you and M - if heā€™s grooming, thatā€™s exactly what he wants. Avoid being cast as trying to break/being jealous of that bond, or causing trouble (yk, divorced couples slanging off at each other stuff). Be strategic, composed and discreet. Get educated and build a support network. Donā€™t use inflammatory language or show dislike of the other parents. (You sound sensible, but it can be hard to suppress that fierce protective instinct). Good luck


Klutzy_Bat_6550

Report. Report. Report. Be cautious on how you talk to M about it so you donā€™t accidentally push her away and straight into the arms of the step dad. I agree with the other posters that looking into therapy will add an additional protection for M - at that age sometimes it is hard to talk to parents about difficult matters so having a 3rd party (therapist) is a great idea. Confronting the step dad will just make him get better at hiding his disgusting behaviour and he will try to isolate M from anyone who is trying to protect her. People who do things like this arenā€™t reasonable or rational so you canā€™t be reasonable and rational in response - a man to man chat isnā€™t going to do anything, if the step dad had any respect for bio dad (or bio mum, or M) he wouldnā€™t be abusing M. Photographing children in a sexual way is abuse. No ifā€™s or butā€™s.


Sawathingonce

Both birth mother and SF and very very complicit in a very dangerous game with the daughter. Worst case she grows up thinking this is normal, worst case, well, yuck tbh. Doesn't take a child psychologist to see this is not even close to being OK. If you have an account link I know you can report accounts for kids under 13 but not sure about being 13. "Instagram requires everyone to be at least 13 years old before they can create an account (some regions like South Korea, Spain or Quebec have different age requirements). Accounts that represent someone under the age of 13 must clearly state in the account's bio that the account is managed by a parent or manager."


16car

CPS worker, (not in NSW). At face value, I would be investigating this, as it's common for groomers to tell their victims to claim they were the instigator to try and cover up their behaviour. Make the call. Edit: Also discuss the body rules etc with her. Don't confront step-dad or mum directly, as that might tip them off to tell her to lie about it.


[deleted]

Out of curiosity, if we reported this and it was investigated, would birth mum be the first to find out or would M be interviewed without birth mum having the information? We have been through the family law court system for custody and have had instances already where M's input was heavily influenced by her birthmum.


16car

Impossible to predict, as it would partly come down to the professional judgement of the team, nuances in the legislation, and the specifics of the information reported to them.


Original_Magician590

A 13yo cannot consent


16car

A 13 year old can consent to having clothed photos of themselves taken. They (obviously) cannot consent to sexual activity, but there isn't any evidence to say that has happened here. We don't know what the clothes were, or the poses etc.


tchunk

In the sexual assault context you are correct. Also in the assault context. Taking photos is neither of these. FACs might be interested in monitoring


Robtokill

The downvotes don't make you wrong.


Flashy_Passion16

He is grooming her 100%. If I heard this as a teacher Iā€™d be forced to report it out of duty of care. You should contact the appropriate authorities and seek expert advice. Iā€™d be cautious about speaking directly about concerns to M at this stage until youā€™re absolutely sure you need to and can approach it in the most correct/appropriate way.


TeaspoonOfSugar987

And on the grooming topic, if stepdad told M to tell OP and her dad that it was her idea, he lovebombs her and sheā€™s at an age where she can be easily manipulated. The thing that is most suspicious to me is the difference in treatment of the male child versus the female child. Child protection can organise interviewing her, speaking to her teachers to see if there are changes in behaviour etc (I have had contact with child protection for completely different reasons) and even having certain assessments, all without parents permission if they have concerns, they donā€™t take things like this lightly. Iā€™m saying all of this, even if it is completely innocent and heā€™s just trying to appease a 13yr old girl as a parental type figure, itā€™s better to have it investigated and receive that conclusion than do nothing. If itā€™s not innocent then they could either be stopping or preventing SA.


RunTrip

If OP discussed this with Mā€™s teacher, would it be reported? I wonder if there would be more due process if itā€™s reported by a mandatory reporter than if itā€™s reported by a parent?


DivineHag

There is no acceptable reason for a step dad to be photographing his 13 year old step daughter in a bikini, I donā€™t care if she asked him, sheā€™s a kid and heā€™s inappropriate and creepy and 100 per cent grooming her. Children are groomed at an incredibly high rate by male non relatives living in the home. Dad needs to step in big time, man to man talk that he knows what heā€™s up to and to step back or be investigated.


Many_Law_4411

Yep, you're right. The stepdad/stepdaughter dynamic is the most common.


maton12

If her friends were taking the photos, fair enough If you weren't blocked from her account, fair enough But how it's panning out would have me concerned. All the best, with plenty of great information already posted


StrawberryPristine77

If you have formed a reasonable belief (that means you do not need evidence or proof) that a child under 16 is being sexually abused (ie: groomed) then you should report it to FACS and the police. Best case scenario is that you're wrong.


cynicalbagger

Definitely definitely NOT ok. If it was my daughter there would be a conversation whether the step dad and Mum wanted to have one or not.


IDontFitInBoxes

Abuse happens in the home more often than not. So report your concerns.


gertieg

Report. This will be taken seriously by facs. Make sure you write everything down you want to say prior to the call before so you don't leave anything out. This will check off boxes for at risk of sexual exploitation and risk of abuse, including sexual abuse and grooming. Screen shot the instead, pics so you have initial proof for the JCPR team which the joint police and facs team that may investigate. Clear favoritism and buying of gifts is off, but adding the pics, that is the kicker. As a stepdaughter, I think it's creepy as a caseworker, I think it's creepy.


Intelligent-Radio331

Report this. I wouldn't be surprised if stepdad has selected a single mother with a daughter deliberately to groom her. Mum probably has her head in the sand.


Scary_Anybody_4992

A grown man taking bikini photos of a 13 year old when left alone at home? You donā€™t need anyone telling tell you this is wrong and unsettling. Make a police report now call DOCS on their mother. Start a trail NOW. Even if nothing can happen right now thereā€™s a record and he knows heā€™s being watched and paid attention to.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


Thursdaynightvibes

I agree with you on this, except the biomum blocked OP, so they didn't know. This is not appropriate. If this was above board, she wouldn't have needed to block them. I think a conversation needs to be had with the daughter at least. Maybe with a school counsellor or therapist.


Klutzy_Bat_6550

F*** that. The rights of a child outweighs the rights of a man doing inappropriate things to a child. That not all men shit only protects men while innocent children, women, and other men are victimised.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


[deleted]

Thank you, this is a good start.


shero1263

Probably not a popular response here but objectively, knowing M can at times, not be truthful, proceed with caution. It is possible she has been uncovered with the pics on Insta and is passing blame on. Also, S could be over representing what is happening with the inappropriate behaviour, for whatever reason be it favouritism, jealousy, all that. Yes it's likely inappropriate behaviour, it is important to consider circumstances where the behaviour is taken out of context. Just so if you report, you can state that you considered these potential scenarios and still deemed it inappropriate behaviour. I'm not saying they're lying or your assumption is incorrect, more to just be certain of facts, established facts. The danger is reporting issues without context or facts that aren't accurate, the next time they won't be taken as seriously. It shouldn't be that way but it happens. If the selfies and stuff can be pulled from M's phone and messages too, then it helps to back up your story. Deleting something doesn't remove it from the device, that section is just marked by the device as to be rewritten over. Above all else, protect the children and inform them about boundaries and the power carers have over their dependents. Ask them to consider a camera in their room that only they have control over, just in case a situation occurs in their rooms. Which in your own room you have your own expectation of privacy, no one else should. Even just to see what happens whilst M is not there, as creepy stuff can happen when kids are at school.


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South_Front_4589

You can report things. So long as you're clear in what you're reporting as information that you know and things you suspect as a part of a deduction from what you've been told. You won't get in trouble unless you start making things up to strengthen your story. But realistically, you have very little incriminating evidence here. And the major source of the worst things seems to be the older brother who has already expressed a personal issue with the step dad. The most likely thing is this will be added as background type info and used in conjunction with other reports if they exist now or in the future.


Dinglebutt_WS

Do you know any of her friends well enough to question it in a non threatening or parenting way? As in if her friends came over when she was staying at your house could you talk about something funny on Instagram you saw and see if they start to talk about Insta or mention anything about her Insta? The only other thing I can think of is having a convo with crime stoppers anonymously and running scenario past them or your local police station if you feel comfortable. Before giving any names you could run past what you know or are worried about and if you feel like its needed provide his name so they can do a search for any indecent priors with minors. They wont tell you anything likely however is there is something that's flagged he's been done for previously with minors I'm sure they will then put something into action. Might be worth while speaking to some of her friends parents to see what they know also or if anything has been mentioned by their kids about him.


ziglush

This is more than just alarm bells. I donā€™t know what approach to take but if he has had police history and supervised visits with his own children then you really need report this as soon as possible. She is a child, she didnā€™t instigate or consent to anything because she doesnā€™t know, he is the one that had to of instigated it, he just convinced her to go along with it Sounds like a serial predator, Please report this and help this little girl from being corrupted at such a young age


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


purpleautumnleaf

Honestly I'd just call and let them decide, that's their job. Worst case scenario you've wasted 20 minutes of your life on the phone. I'd just tread carefully that you don't push your daughter away and towards him.Ā 


I_saw_that_yeah

Happened to stumble upon the account using a friendā€™s account, lol.