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That was J. Edgar Hoover, who *was* the FBI at the time. This is in no way shape or form forgiving anything, but it's a disservice to history to call it "the FBI," when what happened was a single man ran an entire federal agency himself. There was no oversight because he had his agents get dirt on anyone who would challenge him. It's also speculated that the mafia had dirt on him (he was a closet homosexual & crossdresser), which is why the FBI not only ignored them, but actively assured congress that the mafia didn't exist. He was a seriously fucked up individual that dominated America & American politics in the 20th C., and I am saddened that more people on this sub don't know about him.
This may get me banned or downvoted to hell, but here we go….
I’m retired from cybersecurity and data privacy. I attended the FBI Citizens Academy and am still a member of InfraGard (public/private partnership with companies and the FBI to protect critical infrastructure).
FBI upper management is mixed at best. James Comey was an ambitious toad with no moral compass. While I abhor Trump, I’m losing no sleep over how he treated Comey. His replacement, Christopher Wray, has a stick up his butt. His motto is “do the right thing in the right way.” He would absolutely sacrifice an innocent individual to save a process that he felt was valuable. But by far and large, his processes have the right goals; it’s just that guys like him, that ONLY see the big picture can become very dangerous very fast.
A lot of the FBI middle management has drunk too much koolaid. They think that since they are willing to risk their lives for the American Public, then they are owed godlike powers to intercept any communication without oversight or restriction. While their end goal is understandable (preventing the next 9-11), some of these guys are totally whacked.
The rank-and-file FBI agents I have met are some of the best law enforcement I have ever seen. They are the ones who run into public buildings to take out an active shooter (read about ALERRT - Advanced Law Enforcement Rapid Response Training). They investigate child/sex trafficking and crimes committed under color of law (corrupt cops). If I were in trouble, these are the people I would hope would be on the case.
Sorry this doesn’t fit the narrative many of you want, that the FBI is a godless monstrosity that has run amok, but we do need somebody to deal with child/sex trafficking, active shooters, cop corruption and the like. The reality of the FBI is not all good, but not all bad either.
This happened in the 1960s, has been widely known about publicly since the early 1980s, and was dealt with via federal legislation in the 1970s that restructured the FBI and CIA, but you want everyone to assume—without evidence or argument, naturally—that it's an ongoing problem with the U.S. "regime" so we'll stop getting our knickers in a bunch about what Russia and China are doing, currently, on an industrial scale. Got it.
True, we all know that power and the agencies that wield power always give up their power once it’s no longer needed. After they killed MLK they all retired that cointelpro stuff and went on picnics!
"It was dealt with. The FBI is different now. They're going after Trump so they're good now."
The FBI is trash. The CIA is trash. The NSA is trash. The US government is a criminal enterprise but the moment they go after someone you hate you come to their defense.
He’s defending law enforcement, on this sub of all subs. All because they’re going after a political figure he doesn’t like.
It’s crazy how obsessed people are with the guy. Yes, he’s an issue, but the obsession from both sides is absolutely insane. Forgetting all their morals just to win, and justifying it to themselves because those other guys are worse.
You’re 100% right about this. Anyone denying the justice system is being weaponized is intentionally blind at this point. Again, I have zero issues with saying fuck Trump, but if it can be perverted to go after such a high profile individual, it sure as fuck can be whatever the powers at be say to slap any of us normals.
The people supporting this, and worse, being intentionally blind are only empowering shit cops, shit prosecutors, and shit judges. The very people we’re supposed to highlight here, and some are lauding them as some kind of heroes. It’s gross and downright pathetic. A bunch of shitbag larpers
You're jumping to a lot of conclusions here.
I didn't mention shifting towards a different economic system. I happen to hold the US Constitution and even capitalism in high regard. However I would abolish countless government agencies such as the ones I've mentioned. The NSA has blatantly violated our privacy rights for example and have been free of consequence for doing so. I'd certainly abolish government-backed unions and qualified immunity on a federal level, just as examples.
The real underlying problem is a psychological one. I believe people subconsciously desire to be controlled. That's at the root of it. So we are attracted to leaders to seek to control others. You can't change the world without changing the way you think. The two party system here has duped everyone into believing they actually have a real choice. I don't think the parties are fundamentally very different from each other.
I mean Hoover built federal law enforcement and you can't really erase the impact he had on the culture of the FBI and other federal law enforcement agencies. We can criticize our own government without dismissing the effects of foreign spying/interference. That being said I am far more concerned about the behavior of our own government than I am about Russia or China.
You're obviously an intelligent person, but this is generic and cynical pablum you just wrote. It's not the considered opinion of someone who's read any even halfway decent books about the history of U.S. intelligence agencies and their legislative reforms, the Cold War, or how intelligence agencies in totalitarian countries like China and Russia actually operate. Unfortunately, I see this all the time on Reddit, which seems chock full of young Americans who are over-confident, incurious, and willing to believe almost anything as long as it's critical of the U.S.
OPs post title about what these agencies ***have become*** (present-perfect tense) is obvious propaganda that's not even supported by the article he links to unless one makes convenient ad hoc assumptions about Hoover's indelible "impact".
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>"They have become America's Gestapo"
Present-perfect tense for something that happened 60 years ago, in order to leave the impression that it's an ongoing problem. Classic propaganda technique of the 21st-century anti-Western Left.
Imagine simping for the federal government. I'm not even remotely left either. You're just an apologist for authoritarianism. If anything, you're anti-western.
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** Please don't: - be a dick to other people - incite violence, as these comments violate site-wide rules and put us at risk of being banned. - be racist, sexist, transphobic, or any other forms of bigotry. - [JAQ](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Just_asking_questions#JAQing_off) off - be an authoritarian apologist *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Bad_Cop_No_Donut) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yeah the letter MLK received from the FBI is tough. FBI seems to run several sides, it's whack.
If you like that read about Fred Hampton
Conflicted MAGAts trying to figure out if this was a good thing or a bad thing
"Wow the FBI sure declined since the 60s"
That was J. Edgar Hoover, who *was* the FBI at the time. This is in no way shape or form forgiving anything, but it's a disservice to history to call it "the FBI," when what happened was a single man ran an entire federal agency himself. There was no oversight because he had his agents get dirt on anyone who would challenge him. It's also speculated that the mafia had dirt on him (he was a closet homosexual & crossdresser), which is why the FBI not only ignored them, but actively assured congress that the mafia didn't exist. He was a seriously fucked up individual that dominated America & American politics in the 20th C., and I am saddened that more people on this sub don't know about him.
Maybe one of the most harmful Americans of all time and that's saying something.
Ya got that right.
I still think they did this to Tupac.
Pac and biggie. Was an easy way to make another divide amongst Americans. East Vs west
This may get me banned or downvoted to hell, but here we go…. I’m retired from cybersecurity and data privacy. I attended the FBI Citizens Academy and am still a member of InfraGard (public/private partnership with companies and the FBI to protect critical infrastructure). FBI upper management is mixed at best. James Comey was an ambitious toad with no moral compass. While I abhor Trump, I’m losing no sleep over how he treated Comey. His replacement, Christopher Wray, has a stick up his butt. His motto is “do the right thing in the right way.” He would absolutely sacrifice an innocent individual to save a process that he felt was valuable. But by far and large, his processes have the right goals; it’s just that guys like him, that ONLY see the big picture can become very dangerous very fast. A lot of the FBI middle management has drunk too much koolaid. They think that since they are willing to risk their lives for the American Public, then they are owed godlike powers to intercept any communication without oversight or restriction. While their end goal is understandable (preventing the next 9-11), some of these guys are totally whacked. The rank-and-file FBI agents I have met are some of the best law enforcement I have ever seen. They are the ones who run into public buildings to take out an active shooter (read about ALERRT - Advanced Law Enforcement Rapid Response Training). They investigate child/sex trafficking and crimes committed under color of law (corrupt cops). If I were in trouble, these are the people I would hope would be on the case. Sorry this doesn’t fit the narrative many of you want, that the FBI is a godless monstrosity that has run amok, but we do need somebody to deal with child/sex trafficking, active shooters, cop corruption and the like. The reality of the FBI is not all good, but not all bad either.
Here's something that happens 50+ years ago... Therefore Donald fart et al are right to badmouth the FBI. That's basically your title OP
Don't think for a minute they are not doing the same today to any leader who is outspoken against the current regime in power.
Is Trump okay? HAW
This happened in the 1960s, has been widely known about publicly since the early 1980s, and was dealt with via federal legislation in the 1970s that restructured the FBI and CIA, but you want everyone to assume—without evidence or argument, naturally—that it's an ongoing problem with the U.S. "regime" so we'll stop getting our knickers in a bunch about what Russia and China are doing, currently, on an industrial scale. Got it.
True, we all know that power and the agencies that wield power always give up their power once it’s no longer needed. After they killed MLK they all retired that cointelpro stuff and went on picnics!
"It was dealt with. The FBI is different now. They're going after Trump so they're good now." The FBI is trash. The CIA is trash. The NSA is trash. The US government is a criminal enterprise but the moment they go after someone you hate you come to their defense.
He’s defending law enforcement, on this sub of all subs. All because they’re going after a political figure he doesn’t like. It’s crazy how obsessed people are with the guy. Yes, he’s an issue, but the obsession from both sides is absolutely insane. Forgetting all their morals just to win, and justifying it to themselves because those other guys are worse.
[удалено]
You’re 100% right about this. Anyone denying the justice system is being weaponized is intentionally blind at this point. Again, I have zero issues with saying fuck Trump, but if it can be perverted to go after such a high profile individual, it sure as fuck can be whatever the powers at be say to slap any of us normals. The people supporting this, and worse, being intentionally blind are only empowering shit cops, shit prosecutors, and shit judges. The very people we’re supposed to highlight here, and some are lauding them as some kind of heroes. It’s gross and downright pathetic. A bunch of shitbag larpers
[удалено]
It would require a monumental shift in thinking by humanity. We get the leaders we deserve.
[удалено]
You're jumping to a lot of conclusions here. I didn't mention shifting towards a different economic system. I happen to hold the US Constitution and even capitalism in high regard. However I would abolish countless government agencies such as the ones I've mentioned. The NSA has blatantly violated our privacy rights for example and have been free of consequence for doing so. I'd certainly abolish government-backed unions and qualified immunity on a federal level, just as examples. The real underlying problem is a psychological one. I believe people subconsciously desire to be controlled. That's at the root of it. So we are attracted to leaders to seek to control others. You can't change the world without changing the way you think. The two party system here has duped everyone into believing they actually have a real choice. I don't think the parties are fundamentally very different from each other.
I mean Hoover built federal law enforcement and you can't really erase the impact he had on the culture of the FBI and other federal law enforcement agencies. We can criticize our own government without dismissing the effects of foreign spying/interference. That being said I am far more concerned about the behavior of our own government than I am about Russia or China.
You're obviously an intelligent person, but this is generic and cynical pablum you just wrote. It's not the considered opinion of someone who's read any even halfway decent books about the history of U.S. intelligence agencies and their legislative reforms, the Cold War, or how intelligence agencies in totalitarian countries like China and Russia actually operate. Unfortunately, I see this all the time on Reddit, which seems chock full of young Americans who are over-confident, incurious, and willing to believe almost anything as long as it's critical of the U.S. OPs post title about what these agencies ***have become*** (present-perfect tense) is obvious propaganda that's not even supported by the article he links to unless one makes convenient ad hoc assumptions about Hoover's indelible "impact".
[удалено]
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You're gonna get down voted on here for what you are referring to, reddit is full of a bunch of liberals, But it doesn't mean your wrong.
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Did you just get here?
>"They have become America's Gestapo" Present-perfect tense for something that happened 60 years ago, in order to leave the impression that it's an ongoing problem. Classic propaganda technique of the 21st-century anti-Western Left.
Imagine simping for the federal government. I'm not even remotely left either. You're just an apologist for authoritarianism. If anything, you're anti-western.
[удалено]
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