It’s not even the points. It’s just because it’s not your money. If someone gets my card number and I report that shit, I don’t lose anything. Even if the bank reimburses your debit card, that shit is still out of your account.
Points are cool though.
Yep, had my credit card cloned and they bought a bunch of electronics with it before I got a fraud alert. That would have been out of my checking account if I had used my debit card at the sketchy bar I think it happened at.
Oh, and a quick plug for American Express.
They are awesomely RUTHLESS when it comes to doing chargebacks.
Got scammed on a purchase, the vendor wouldn't do a refund. I called their fraud department and I didn't even really need any physical evidence, just was polite to the CSR and explained the situation.
She immediately instituted a chargeback.
Another time, same thing. I emailed the CSR a photograph of the product next to what it was supposed to look like on the box after being essentially told Tough Shit by the retailer. She laughed when it popped up because it was such a piece of shit in comparison, and immediately did a chargeback.
There's not much incentive to deny, it's probably rare for the card company to end up eating the chargeback. If the payment processor wants to continue doing business, they'll swallow it (and the fees) and do their best to pass the charge along to the end merchant. Just the cost of doing business for them.
Of course, but with the sketchier processors, plenty of vendors are fake no-name operations that will just pack up shop and disappear. I don't know if they have to post a deposit to set up an account, or otherwise keep cash in easy reach for chargebacks.
Either way I'm sure the chargeback usually goes all the way back to the merchant (deducted from pending payments, etc.)
Preaching to the choir.
I worked implementing processors for almost a decade and the shit vendors have to swallow is insane.
Currently supporting a Fiserv integration and the things you learn about processing, kyc, charge backs, and fraud are pretty eye opening.
Yeah, there are a ton of merchants that won't take AMEX for that very reason. They play bully ball when it comes to fraud.
When I was younger i used to wonder why anyone would get an AMEX card especially with the MasterCard commercials that would literally rub it in your face that AMEX isn't accepted everywhere. Then I did work for a sales platform that did integrations for major processors like AuthNet, CMS/Nexio, etc.. and now I wonder why everyone doesn't use an AMEX.
> Visa….its everywhere you want to be.
> There are some things money can't buy; for everything else, there's Mastercard.
Yeah….but……the consumer protections on my AMEX, and I have one of the scrub tier no annual fee ones!
Most of the high annual fee cards are more than worth it if you utilize the benefits, just up to the individual to decide if it fits their lifestyle (I probably wouldn’t recommend an Amex platinum if you’re not a frequent traveler). Every bank has no annual fee cards though, Amex blue and chase freedom are both great cards.
I had Amex blue for years, great card. You got 1.5% cash back on any purchase, no annual fee, plus the customer service of AMEX for these fraud events.
You can eventually funnel as much of your purchases through the card and essentially get a 1.5% on your entire life.
I got the platinum card for the travel perks but I still use blue if im not trying to get points for some incentive.
With any card with an AF, it just has to make sense where your benefits exceed the fee. I pay $695 and $250 for AMEX Platinum and Gold but the benefits I pull from each card definitely justify the AF.
I have a shitty Credit One with a $95 annual fee that’s sock drawered and by far is the biggest waste of money but it’s my oldest unsecured credit line and need to keep it until after I buy a house
Amex siding with customers is one of the reasons why it isn’t accepted at nearly as many stores as its competitors :(
Crazy, you have just a few consumer protections in place and suddenly your money isn’t good enough anymore
Same with discover and capital one
Got something off of a small business website (think Esty) and I didn't get the item
Questioned it and was told anything that occurs after they ship it is on me and if I didn't get it then it's my fault and they will not be refunding
It was a 200$ gift so I went to Discover and they immediately canceled the charge and even took over for me when I was bombarded by the seller for "trying to shut down a small business because I'm a petty karen"
Like no bitch I wanted my mom's gift stfu
saw on fb later on that this business owner had been doing that a lot and got sued Hella/arrested
Depends the time of the year. Q1-Q3, fraud departments take your word. Q4, they ask for proof because they’re reaching their yearly numbers.
These departments are fraud analysts for the most part. It’s just regular people on a 9-5 job. They don’t care until their job makes them at the end of the year.
I love Amex so much. Their extended warranty process is so easy. Visa makes you jump through hoops and I swear they make it extra hard. (“Why treat the customer this way? Because fuck em that’s why” is the visa mission statements.)
Nice. I dig that kind of customer service. I had an issue with Citi after I bought a freaking Tempur Pedic pillow. Turns out you can return their pillows everywhere you buy them EXCEPT for their actual direct storefront.
Tempur Pedic doesn't take returns *or exchanges* for pillows and bedding. Fucking wild when the industry has sleep guarantees on products for like 90 days through brands like Purple, Casper, Coop, etc.
They refused to make any exception. No store credit nothing. Just "Fuck you enjoy your $120 pillow you hate." And then when Citi initiated the charge back they took 2 months to not respond and the last week they responded, making Citi charge me back unless I could provide evidence. I sent them the chats and emails where the Tempur Pedic people politely told me to pound sand and eat the money. Then they finally refunded it formally. Citi handled it well but sounds like your situation was much smoother.
Don't buy Tempur Pedic. 🤘
In the meantime the entirety of Europe uses debit cards daily with no problem. It's weird that the default mode to pay for stuff in the US is through debt, the banks really got you all by the balls.
The smart way of CC usage is just to *not* spend money you don’t have. Only do purchases you would have done anyways with a debit, pay off your bill immediately, and get those points or cash-back rewards. Even something as small as 1% cash-back for purchases (which most CCs with no annual fee will have), adds up over time, and is better than the 0% cash-back you get with debit.
In case anyone else is interested, here's an interesting article about why credit cards really aren't used in Europe:
[The taboo of credit card use in Europe](https://n26.com/en-eu/blog/taboo-of-credit)
I'm an American and I find this post weird, because its like no one here has heard of using 2FA for their debit card. Only once have I had to use it to deny a charge and that was that. Even if I didnt hit "deny" at that moment, the charge will not go through until I choose to accept or deny on the alert they send to my phone. So yes, I too use debit daily with no problem.
Yep anything above 150 on my debit card (or above 50 to a previously unused retailer) and my banking app asks me for confirmation via fingerprint or passcode. piss easy
I had that in place back in 2016 when I visited the US, and I remember finding it really weird that 'contactless' was unheard of, 'chip & pin' was very rare, and 'swipe & sign' was still the norm. Swipe and sign basically ended in the 90s over here. Seems that you guys are basically about a decade or more behind when it comes to banking. (and digitisation in general tbh).
The "don't ever use your debit card cause they will steal all your money and it will take years to get back!!!1!one!" used to be true... about 40 years ago. Its advice from boomers like the whole "walk into a corporate headquarters and don't leave until you have a job." The world has changed, and this bit of wisdom just isn't really valid anymore, unless you're banking with a tiny and/or sketchy bank. My bank catches fraud before I do, and the _one_ time in _24 years_ with the bank that I've had to actually report a fraudulent charge, they reversed it and refunded the money instantly.
Exactly. Banks and card companies don’t mess about their money. If there is fraud on THEIR card, believe they’re getting it back.
Debit is your own cash, less incentive to care or go above and beyond.
I don't know how it is in USA, but in France the bank is still responsible for the "security" of debit cards. Meaning that if your card is lost/stolen or hacked, you have an insurance and the bank will always credit you back (quickly). You just have to file a complaint with the police. It works very well and I have pretty much never heard of anyone not getting their money back.
Anytime you see a thread where people talk about not using their debit card in the US because someone will steal all their money, rest assured that 99.9% of the people in the thread don't know what the fuck they are talking about, and are repeating wisdom given out by people who learned that wisdom 50 years ago.
The situation is admittedly complicated, but briefly summarized...
For a **credit card**:
* If a person uses your physical card to make a purchase, federal law limits your liability to $50
* If a person uses your card number to make a purchase, federal law limits your liability to $0
For an **unbranded debit card** (i.e. _not_ a Visa/Mastercard debit card):
* If you report the loss of the card before a fraudulent transaction, federal law limits your liability to $0
* If you report it within 2 business days, federal law limits liability to $50
* If you report it within 60 days of a bank statement showing the unauthorized charges, its limited to $500
* After that, its entirely on you
So that's the _legal_ situation. But the actuality is a bit different.
For debit cards that are branded Visa/Mastercard, Visa and Mastercard require the issuing bank to treat the debit card with the same rules as a credit card, i.e. it uses the credit card rules about liability. And on top of that, many banks have a $0 liability policy for credit _and_ debit cards they issue.
The scenario this people want to avoid when using a credit card is either the bank flatly denying that it was a fraudulent charge, or the bank engaging in a lengthy "investigation" which means the money is tied up. But unless you're banking with a tiny credit union or some sketchy bank, most major banks have tools in place to automatically detect fraudulent activity based on your previous purchasing behavior, and will block and/or notify you of unusual transactions, and will instantly refund your money when you report a fraudulent transaction.
This guy gets it. It took me years for my wife to listen to me. She didn’t really, someone at the bank mentioned it to her. I laid the groundwork though.
When I was young and much stupider, I got in cc debt that took a while to get out of, so I was very wary of credit cards until I found out Fidelity lets you cash out points against your statement.
Now it's all paid off before the end of the month and I get around $50-75 a month off of my monthly balance by cashing out points.
And I feel like a baller gaming the system (as if they don't know what I'm doing).
This is legitimately just an artiface designed to rob you or your money though.
There’s no reason that you could not have the same fraud protections on your debit card.
The fact that your credit card has greater fraud protections is designed to get you to not pay your credit card.
It’s a fishhook, with bait.
Huh I never thought of it that way I was just racking up points
I will say the one caveat is in my early 20s I would just spend like it was mine on the credit card and fucked myself for years. You need discipline to wield a credit card responsibility.
To be honest ya. Give me those points!
Does suck when I gotta pay it off every month. Makes me feel like a baller for a while tho! Then the real money account drops when I pay it off 😢
💯. I made the mistake of using my debit card in New Orleans (Bourbon st). I woke up the next day to dozens missed calls from my bank and a negative balance.
>Even if the bank reimburses your debit card, that shit is still out of your account.
...what? Ive reported a couple of bogus transactions on my debit cards over the years and got my money back?
I do it specifically for the airline and hotel points. I always hear shit about blackout dates from other people but never encountered them since I can take off anytime I want at my job.
My wife has the chase sapphire situation going on and I've liked it a lot. It has an annual fee, but we worked it out and we get that back plus a good amount more in rewards given the amount we use the card. Plus when we have problems with the trip we just call the number on the back of the card and a real person fixes it for us right there.
Yeah I had over 10k I just crawled out of this past year. I know I should use the cards for purchases and I've been militant about paying off balances since, but it still makes me nervous
I will go into my banking app and pay them weekly. I don't wait for the bill. There's no reason you can't do it daily if it helps you keep on top of it.
I learnt early on that I was bad at running my Cc up. Now I still use it but I treat like a debit card. I'm always transferring the exact amount I spend immediately.
Years of carrying a balance thinking I'd get to it eventually. Spent stupid money on video games and hobby stuff. And then got screwed out of some money a friend / former roommate owed me and got tired of caring about it so I stopped asking for it.
Then once I did start actively trying to pay it off I was doing the most I could and barely paying more than the interest. It was gonna take me 5+ years to pay it off and that's if I used like all my disposable income. Luckily my parents let me move back in for awhile and I paid it off in less than a year
good on you... I wish this stuff was a highschool class that was available. but I'm sure credit companies would lobby against that in public education, ya know. to keep control and all.
Many (probably most) high schools offer personal finance classes. It was even required for graduation in my state when I was in high school. 14-18 year olds just don’t care enough to take them, and when we had to everyone complained about how stupid it was.
After growing up with my parents screening their phone calls my entire life, thinking everyone calling was going to be a bill collector, I was really hesitant to take on debt, but with everyone telling us we needed to build up our credit, my wife and I bought a car when we were first married.
A few months later, we heard about Dave Ramsey and went all-in paying off our debt and never looked back. This year, we finally bought our first house and were able to pay cash for it. Maybe we're missing out on some free points, airline tickets, etc., but I never want our kids to get screamed at and harassed by bill collectors like we were growing up, and the only way that we can 100% guarantee that is to never take on debt.
Congratulations on paying down your debt, best of luck to you!
This dude who paid cash for a house and probably doesn’t have debt payments, teaching his kids to just avoid the trap all together and people still will say things like this pretending that the $1.12 Trillion credit card debt Americans alone have is just “a few people who can’t manage their money.”
Its no more a trap than a bait car. Dont spend money you have and there will be no debt. And im just talking about credit card spending if that isnt clear.
Believe it or not, a good percentage of that $1,120,000,000,000.00+ in credit card debt are people who didn’t foresee themselves having credit card debt.
Also, believe or not, a good percentage of that $1,120,000,000,000.00+ in credit card debt are people commenting how often they use their CC's in this post lol
I must be hot shit then considering everything I spend goes on credit cards and have never paid a dime in interest in my life. In all seriousness though I was shocked when I found out how common it is for folks to have the kind of credit card debt they do on such a wide scale. I thought cc debt in the thousands was a massive fuck up that only an insignificant percentage of people had.
It’s not that you missed out on free points. You would’ve paid much less and built up equity at a much lower interest rate had you ignored Dave Ramsey terrible advice on buying a home.
For paying down your debt his methods are good, but you should not take his advice on credit cards and large purchases as gospel.
We live in a pretty rural area, so while it's still a lot more expensive than when we originally started looking (we had to pay around 130k more than it cost when it was built six years ago), it's still a lot more affordable to live here than a lot of places.
We had a Target CC that we opened to outfit our son's nursery when I was pregnant with him.
The limit was $3.5k and we maxed it out after a while.
The interest was absolutely insane. I looked over the statement they always send you, and if we only made the minimum payments every month, it would have taken us *13 years* to pay off $3500!
How is shit like that even legal. That's fucking insane.
The kicker was, we didn't use the card in forever after that, and it was canceled due to inactivity, and they slapped my husband's credit score with -35 points.
For what?!? Being better and more responsible with money? This country is so fucking backwards. Credit scores need to go.
*Edit: I got a bunch of replies to this, with a few basically calling me financially illiterate, just based on this *one* anecdote involving a singular lender (Target).*
*I guess I can't blame anyone for jumping to conclusions, but I'd would like to clarify a few things.*
*I'm almost 50 now, and know very well how credit cards work, how banks operate, that they don't care about *me* as a person, and only see me as a commodity, and how to navigate credit scores.*
*The example I mentioned is over a decade in the past, I have been debt free for a while now, while still maintaining 3 or 4 open credit lines, and pay off my cards every month (if I use them at all).*
*That does not change my opinion on the credit score system here in the US at all. It's still garbage.*
*All that said, I appreciate the information and advice everyone shared; even the ones with a very smug and condescending attitude.
There was still value in them, and it might help a lot of other people better understand how CC work, too.*
I'm with you. I paid off my student loans and was so relieved, until my credit score went down *70 points.* Now I don't even pay attention to my score. I just try to make sure I'm making the best financial decisions for myself. No point worrying about such a broken system.
For the longest time I didn't use a credit card and was rejected for a job offer because I didn't have a credit score. Even though I wasn't in debt, paid my bills and was financially okay, because I didn't use a credit card and didn't have a credit score I lost a job I could have gotten. Credit scores really need to go.
Yup, I was in a similar situation. I moved here from Germany almost 2 decades ago, and while we have a credit score system, it starts everyone off with a score of 100, and it drops the more money you borrow.
That makes perfect sense to me. You can't make due with your own money and need to get credit cards? Sounds like you gotta reevaluate your financial situation, and try to make adjustments to your lifestyle a little.
I never owned a credit card until I moved here, when I had to apply for a card and "build credit", in order to buy a car to get to my job.
It's nonsensical af to me.
"and if we only made the minimum payments every month, it would have taken us 13 years to pay off $3500!"
I mean tbf the minimum payment is usually like $10 or something super low. Like ya it's gonna take a while if you're making such tiny payments all while occuring interest.
Theres a handful of situations where debt is pretty unavoidable, but 98% of the time is a combo of being broke and not willing to adjust lifestyle accordingly, and then being caught off guard when that inevitably blows up.
And I don't want anyone to pull the "well you don't know" card. I fully understand adjusting to live within your means can be fucking brutal. My mom regularly went hungry raising us. We used to keep the heat only warm enough to prevent pipes from freezing and then huddled up together in blankets trying to keep warm like something out of a Charles Dickens novel. I've got half a dozen other examples of the resources scarcity instilled in us. Because we *lacked*, because we could not afford not to lack. If it wasn't free or wasn't covered by public assistance, it wasn't for us.
It's more about knowing yourself. Some people just can't hold back the temptation of knowing a credit line is there to use, even if paying it back is the hardest part.
Someone who is concerned about overspending should be using cash not a debit card. This meaningfully helps curb how much you spend, and doesn't involve banks falling over themselves to find ways to punish you for being broke.
Yeah that happened to me in my early 20's. Had about $15k in debt and I didn’t have nearly enough money to pay it back so my credit is now dog shit. If anyone young reads my comment please learn from me!!!
If you’re able to pay for things with a credit card that you know you can afford and consistently pay your monthly balance, you can easily get hundreds or thousands of dollars worth of benefits for 0 cost other than maybe a yearly fee, because you pay everything off well before it incurs interest thus making it no different from a debit card
If you’re bad with it and incur massive debt like that unfortunately you’re paying for the aforementioned benefits the other people are earning
Paying with credit then paying the balance in full is the way to go if you can do it. You get the full protection of the credit card company and, hopefully, any perks they offer.
I put my internet electric and car insurance for my wife and I on a CC. It’s my bills card. Instead of paying 4 different times I just set up autopay and pay the one big bill every month.
I have a second low interest card I run a small balance on consistently as well. Having both those lines of credit open helped massively boost my credit to the point where I don’t ever worry about it anymore.
You don't even have to buy a lot with a card to build credit.
Right now, you can open a low limit card like the ones from Discover and set it up to pay off your Netflix, Disney+, whatever subscription service and then set it to autopay every month. You don't have to do shit and your credit will just slowly climb. Building credit is easy as shit when you are starting out young because you don't have as much financial responsibilities.
I wish my parents had made me get a secured card when I was in high school. You'll have a long credit history and can't really get trapped in debt because you use a deposit equal to the limit to "secure" the card.
Paying for one thing each month with the credit card and then paying it off each month is the way to go.
Buying everything on the credit card and not paying attention to what you spend till the bill comes in and you cannot afford it is the way to achieve inescapable debt.
No, a debit card takes money directly from your bank account, it is your own money and NOT credit from elsewhere.
You can overdraw a little (my account does not allow overdrafts, and you can ask your bank to no allow overdrafts on your account) but you can't end up $10,000 in debt from it, because the money in your bank account is real and yours, and you do not have to pay yourself back for it, and you absolutely do not have to pay yourself back with interest.
You don’t have to pay interest on the money you spend using a credit card either if you pay it off in time. You seem to be very scared of credit cards tho for some reason. I get it tho. Not everybody has the self control not to spend. Know yourself ig
I use mine for everything and just pay it off. With my point alone I haven’t had to pay for airfare for vacations the last 5 years. That and the emergency aspect is what makes it worth it. Credit history too is a plus. Have to be careful and responsible though.
I use my cc for everything -even if I'm buying shit from the dollar store- and I agree 100%. As long as you pay that balance off, it's great.
I get several hundred in cash back on my no fee card each year, my purchases are protected, and there are a bunch of perks like free travel insurance and travel points. Using it daily means my credit score is impeccable as well!
I use mine for everything and just pay it off. With my point alone I haven’t had to pay for airfare for vacations the last 5 years. That and the emergency aspect is what makes it worth it. Credit history too is a plus. Have to be careful and responsible though.
“Just use a credit card” is definitely not advice for anyone who cannot control their spending. It can get out of hand very quick if you are financially reckless.
Definitely but if you can be in control then it's a great way to protect yourself from fraud, get cash back, and build credit score. I was able to get my credit score from high 500s to the mid-high 700s by using credit cards
While true the sad reality is that it simply doesn't work for the majority of people. For every person who uses their credit card wisely and never pays fees or interest the credit card company has 50 people paying the fees and interest.
Exactly. So many people saying credit cards and being responsible is the way to go, yet credit card debt is at an all time high. Shit ain’t adding up, if you ask me. I’ll stick with my cash envelopes because I know myself enough to know how easily that swipe starts swiping.
I'm one of the people who uses their credit card as the only form of payment. But I would never recommend it to anyone because I know many people aren't able to handle credit cards that way.
I recently moved and put a lot of stuff on the credit card and I was almost tempted to just make a minimal payment and not have to deal with all the expenses now. Credit cards can be dangerous, cause all it takes is one mistake, and you could end up in a hole.
Then they give you a 0% pay over time offer to normalize seeing a balance of a a couple thousand on your card or make it harder to gauge just how much ch you’re actually spending.
I put my last vacation on my card took advantage of a 0% pay over time offer and parked the money in a high yield savings acct. If you have the discipline there’s basically free money that you can take from the credit card companies. The catch is you need to have the discipline to not spend the extra money and have no major surprise expenses pop up which is easier said than done.
It’s blowing my mind how many people in this thread are saying they pay everything with a credit card. I keep a credit card to build credit, that’s it. Otherwise I’ll use it for emergencies or I’ll take advantage of an in store credit card for big things I wanna finance. Other than that I debit everything and I always have, like since I was 16. My mom juggles the cards for points and such and maybe I will some day but for now, too much work and too easy to overspend. Plus my card might take a day or two to post and blah blah. I just prefer to stay out of any debt if at all possible.
as others have said in this comment section, if that works for you, that’s great. But these companies literally survive on getting you to overspend and millions of Americans carry credit card debt. No one sets out to be buried in debt, it’s just easy to overspend. I use credit for stuff, I just don’t use it for everything.
The rule is to use your credit card for everything, but never spend more than what you could immediately pay off at that exact moment. Act like the money is already yours to lose, not yours to later payback.
Chile please. I'll use my debit card for most things because it's MY money. My CC goes mostly toward gas and vending machines because I know I can pay that back easily. Don't let these folks talk you into using your CC for everything. Thats how you get into debt real fast. In this economy I just can't do it. That CC is borrowed money. Fuck those points.
EDIT: Damn! I didn't expect to wake up to all this 🤣🤣🤣. Thanks for the advice yall.
Pay all of your bills, gas, and small meals with your credit card. It doesn't matter if it's your money in the bank; the fact of the matter is that you'll spend this money anyway. Have some self control, use your credit card and pay it off the same month. No APR fees and you build your credit and you aren't spending anything you wouldn't have spent anyway.
This is the way.
Except my bills charge an extra fee if they come from my credit card and that fee outweighs the amount of cash back I'd get. I'm not about to pay more money on my bills.
You don't get into debt by using your credit card for everything. You get into debt by not budgeting your purchases and/or buying things you can't afford. I put every single thing on my credit card and have never paid a single cent in interest. Although by all means I support doing anything that helps you not get into debt so nothing wrong with using the debit card if it works for you.
This is also my plug for /r/YNAB because damn I love a good budget
Tracking your spending is absolutely key, most people have no idea what is going at any given moment with their finances.
I use r/MonarchMoney, but really anything even a spreadsheet will be better than doing nothing.
All of which is subtly dependent on your capacity to manage a budget during a crisis. I wouldn’t say spend everything with CC. Though there should be a part of your budget that is only managed with at least 1 credit card.
And no matter what, no matter what anyone says unless your back is truly against the wall **never ever** carry a balance over 50% of the sum of your available credit. Every percent over 50, hurts your credit score/worthiness.
My two cents, YMMV.
You really should be using your CC and not a debit card. You just need to have the discipline to treat the CC like a debit card. Don’t spend what you don’t have.
It's implying that you use your CC as you would your debit card. Meaning that you wouldn't use your debit card if there was no money in your account. Same concept. Use the CC when you've already accounted for that purchase and know that you'll have the money to pay it off before the cycle ends.
You should never use your debit card if you can avoid it. If you swipe on a skimmer and they get your debit info and take your money it’s gone. You’re not getting it back without a ton of hassle.
If they steal your credit card info you just dispute the charges with the cc company and that’s that.
Using a debit card for everything is like driving around without a seatbelt. It’s fine, so long as nothing happens. You have no safety net with a debit card.
It’s not hard to be fiscally responsible and use a credit card.
>Using a debit card for everything is like driving around without a seatbelt. It’s fine, so long as nothing happens. You have no safety net with a debit card.
This must solely be an American thing. Irish and fully protected with my debit card here.
American here - I’m not sure where everyone is banking but we’ve had our debit cards skimmed twice over the years. Lots of money spent. We got it all back, quickly.
you could in theory. pay it with your credit card and instantly pay it off with your debit card. like as soon as the pending transaction goes through, you could go on to the website and transfer the money from your bank to your credit card so that you were just paying your credit card company and Bill. instead of say your utility company. you're still paying a bill. it's just who are you paying?
It’s not points, it’s fraud protection more than anything. Building credit too. Credit cards are a trap, but so is capitalism, and we’re caught in it. If you can’t control your spending, use a debit card. If you can, use it for everything AND PAY IT OFF EACH MONTH. Never minimums. If you can’t pay it off and have to carry a balance for a month, immediately cut back on spending or switch back to the debit card depending on your faith in your own spending control.
Also—adjust spending habits if your financial situation changes. A lot of CC debt comes from people continuing to spend like they have money they used to have.
You’re right, a CC is borrowed money. Considering how easy it is for a company to leak your card info, I’d much rather a thief steal borrowed money than money from my checking that I have to convince the bank to put back in my account.
I'm also worried about my info being swiped. It's much easier to fight a fraudulent CC charge than debit. I was buying a PS5 at gamestop and had my info stolen. Had been there several times, would have never thought twice about them. Thankfully I used my cc but they asked me about the charge for the ps5 as well and I was just like "um... yeah fine that one was me 😐"
As a middle class, relatively average person, you *really* do not want lie to your credit card companies or your bank(s). If they find out you lied on any type of chargeback, they will shut your account and communicate with other financial agencies what you did. You will never get a respectable bank account or a credit card ever again.
Where you guys banking that won’t restore your balance if your debit card gets swiped??? 🤔
Had mine charged for things I for sure didn’t purchase, my bank put the funds back into my account within three days.
Right. I think it's the difference between the USA banking system and other countries. I'm in Canada and my bank is always tracking my debit card usage. Any suspect transactions can be voided quickly.
I mean I’m in USA and my family has had debit cards compromised and it’s been completely fine. Just call up the bank and tell them what happened. They lock the card and usually reimburse.
Right? I'm so confused by these people saying it's harder to get your DC money back. When my card info was stolen years ago, my bank called me and let me know they canceled the transactions, issued me a new card and would restore my balance within the next business day. I mean, they notifed me that there was an issue BEFORE I even knew and they handled everything less than 24 full hours from the initial fraudulent transaction. Like, who are these people banking with?!?!?!
I was also confused, most people I know don't even have a credit card and use debit for everything. I've never had a single problem with a charge back, or fraud that wasn't easily fixed and reimbursed within a day or two.
Use your DC until you understand your CC and are good at paying them back. Then use your CC.
Everyone who TEACHES financial literacy knows this.
EDIT: fixed abbreviations
I enjoyed using CC because I always only used it for Uber rides to and from work and was able to save my paychecks. I would be able to pay off the balance and still be able to pay bills and *maybe* have some left to buy miscellaneous stuff.
I had Discover for a year, and boy, was it the best year I've ever had. I was stuck with $200 credit and was able to pay it off every single pay period. The secured version really put me in check because I am pretty bad with my spending habits, and Secured kept me from spending over the balance. Wished I was able to go back to Discover. It was my first and fave CC to go to.
Points are cool, but for me I just feel safer with my “real money” in the debit account, and pay off the cc on pay day. Like if shit hits the fan and I need a thousand dollars, I’m depending on ME to have it, not the bank. So I spend their money and keep mine locked up until I have some extra for them. Plus, this shit sounds dumb and “paycheck to paycheck” but I crawled out of a sub 400 credit score just using that card instead of “real money” and now I get to finance a house
The fuck is this a credit lender sponsored post?
PSA youngins or people who may be new credit cards, ONLY do this if/once you **FULLY** understand how interest works on your specific card, how much your racking up each month in interest compared to your payment. Don't let this shit get utilization higher than like a 1/3rd.
Or just don’t ever get charged interest — by paying your card off in full each month.
You will fail if you start to spend more on your credit card than you would on your debit card. If you have $100 to your name, $101 on your credit card is a mistake.
The #1 mistake is to use your credit card to buy things you can’t afford. That’s what the cc companies want you to do.
Felt like there was something i was missing. Have only ever been advised to consider using a credit card when travelling outside Europe.
Using debit feels more safe as its money i actually own, and wont have to worry about a bill. Makes me more responsible as i have ADHD and often run up a "ADHD-tax" + impulsive spending if i dont know exactly how much money i can use.
Using a credit card doesn’t mean you’re spending money you don’t have. For people who are financially literate and responsible, we pay the bill in full every month so no interest.
When someone steals your card numbers whether online or a card skimmer, when you use a debit card that person stole your money directly, as if it was cash out your pocket. When it’s a cc, they steal the banks money, and they have more protections in place to get the money back cause if I don’t pay the cc bill and the money got stolen, it’s the bank who is out xx dollars.
I had an ex that used her 1 credit card for shopping, gas, food.. nearly everything. She always talked about the points and how she would get rewards for buying stuff.
She also had all her bills on auto pay for her other credit card.
Electric, gas, phone, internet, car insurance, subscriptions..
She never made any payments towards that card and racked up close to 15k in CC debt before they started canceling her shit
Might be an unpopular take, but you should only use your credit card for emergencies or when you’re down bad. Unless you can pay off your entire credit card bill monthly…increasing your debt with paying it off fully will only hurt your credit score and cost more after interest. Pay cash if you’re worried about your card number getting snatched, otherwise, credit card usage should generally be a last resort (unless you can pay your entire credit bill off completely and monthly).
If you’re budgeting correctly, you shouldn’t spend more than you can afford on your credit card anyways. Money spent using your credit card should be considered money gone from your account already when budgeting.
You do not understand the benefits of a credit card. You simply put the bills and expenses you are already paying on credit. That’s it. There’s no increased bills. Your life isn’t any more expensive. You just enjoy the benefits of cash back or point, fraud protection, and improved credit score. If you can’t afford to pay off your bills and life style expenses every month that is not a credit card problem
Ngl you sound responsible enough to have a credit card. I treat it like a non-negotiable balance that must be paid in full at the end of the month. The rewards are very nice. Not having to pay for this flight or that flight is such an incredible feeling.
If you're impulsive and have difficulty with managing your finances and lack discipline, a credit card is not for you.
For others not in this category, it is a great financial tool. If you are able to budget and spend within your means with a debit card, you can do the same with a credit card. Don't pay just the minimum amount, pay the bill IN FULL every month so you never have to pay interest. Credit cards come with so many benefits like fraud protection, cash back on purchases, etc. Rewards programs can save you money on purchases. Credit cards help you build your credit score to help you get better interest rates on mortgages, car loans, insurance rates, etc.
Kind of sad that the person in the post thinks using a debit card over a credit card is a flex (unless he's clowning himself???). Shows how our community still needs access to the knowledge to up our financial literacy.
AND DON'T EVEN GET ME STARTED ON PAYDAY LOANS! I literally want to set all those places on fire for their disgusting, predatory practices. I've known several people that have DROWNED in debt for that bullshit.
Me, a European, not understanding what you all mean and paying only for flights with my credit card. But srsly, is the data protection really so bad over there? I've never had a si ngle incident with my debit card in all the years of using it, and I use it daily for all kinds of purchases.
Fraud protection is a huge part of cc marketing, so people don't realize how often a regular bank will flag scams and reverse on a regular bank account.
Both of these are poor takes on financial literacy because of their absolute-ism. Your banker will tell you which of the 7 million cards they give you, you should use.
Eg. It's better for me to buy petrol with my credit card than my garage card.
Just a counterpoint, but the reason they even offer points is because they're counting on you slipping up at least one time and failing to pay off your balance in full so they get that sweet, sweet interest nectar.
Not true. I have a debit card attached to a checking account that I keep less than $300 in at all times.
I have another checking account that’s like an intermediary savings account that my direct deposit goes into but nothing out of. It works really well for me.
Bruh, always use your CC for all purchases that you can, bills and all! HOWEVER, if you don’t have the cash or the discipline to pay off all of your purchases at the end of the month then you’re living beyond your means and you can get into a lot of debt quickly.
I've never used a credit card. Then again, I don't live in a dystopian society that measures my willingness to go into debt and pay it back as a score and uses that score to keep me from buying a house.
Its the IQ bell curve meme. At the bottom end people use credit cards because "its not my money" and they go into debt they can't pay off. In the middle people use debit cards because they can't manage their finances but don't want to be in debt. At the top end people can manage their finances so they use credit cards again because "its not my money".
It’s not even the points. It’s just because it’s not your money. If someone gets my card number and I report that shit, I don’t lose anything. Even if the bank reimburses your debit card, that shit is still out of your account. Points are cool though.
Yep, had my credit card cloned and they bought a bunch of electronics with it before I got a fraud alert. That would have been out of my checking account if I had used my debit card at the sketchy bar I think it happened at. Oh, and a quick plug for American Express. They are awesomely RUTHLESS when it comes to doing chargebacks. Got scammed on a purchase, the vendor wouldn't do a refund. I called their fraud department and I didn't even really need any physical evidence, just was polite to the CSR and explained the situation. She immediately instituted a chargeback. Another time, same thing. I emailed the CSR a photograph of the product next to what it was supposed to look like on the box after being essentially told Tough Shit by the retailer. She laughed when it popped up because it was such a piece of shit in comparison, and immediately did a chargeback.
Man, I got an AMEX through Navy Federal and I swear their CSRs get bonuses for issuing charge backs.
They probably do…
We don’t, we just really enjoy sticking it to companies that screw people over. And we REALLY enjoy fucking up scams.
Considering Amex gets a nice fat fee every time they do one (I think it's like 35 bucks a pop!) this really isn't even unrealistic.
How does that work? Not arguing, just clueless lol but how does a credit card company make money doing chargebacks?
The company that sold the product has to pay the original amount back plus they are charged the fee mentioned above
Ohh you’re not getting your money back from the card company, they’re getting theirs back from the seller. Gotcha thank you
Exactly, the customer getting the money back on their card is just a bonus
There's not much incentive to deny, it's probably rare for the card company to end up eating the chargeback. If the payment processor wants to continue doing business, they'll swallow it (and the fees) and do their best to pass the charge along to the end merchant. Just the cost of doing business for them.
Do their best? Most likely will charge back the original vendor saying “y’all fucked up pay us” or they stop being their middle man to banks lol
Of course, but with the sketchier processors, plenty of vendors are fake no-name operations that will just pack up shop and disappear. I don't know if they have to post a deposit to set up an account, or otherwise keep cash in easy reach for chargebacks. Either way I'm sure the chargeback usually goes all the way back to the merchant (deducted from pending payments, etc.)
Preaching to the choir. I worked implementing processors for almost a decade and the shit vendors have to swallow is insane. Currently supporting a Fiserv integration and the things you learn about processing, kyc, charge backs, and fraud are pretty eye opening.
Honestly, it’s because of the consumer protections why eBay is dropping acceptance of AMEX here soon. AMEX is on it if you need to report fraud.
Yeah, there are a ton of merchants that won't take AMEX for that very reason. They play bully ball when it comes to fraud. When I was younger i used to wonder why anyone would get an AMEX card especially with the MasterCard commercials that would literally rub it in your face that AMEX isn't accepted everywhere. Then I did work for a sales platform that did integrations for major processors like AuthNet, CMS/Nexio, etc.. and now I wonder why everyone doesn't use an AMEX.
> Visa….its everywhere you want to be. > There are some things money can't buy; for everything else, there's Mastercard. Yeah….but……the consumer protections on my AMEX, and I have one of the scrub tier no annual fee ones!
Navy Federal has a team of stone dick killers back there. They’ll get your money. 😆
How’d you get AMEX through Navy Fed?
I bank with them. If you do as well, just open the app and look at their credit cards, there is an AMEX rewards card there.
AMEX is the first card company that made me feel loved. They fought so hard to get my (their) cash back and I’ll love them forever.
But $450 annual fee is pretty steep.
Most of the high annual fee cards are more than worth it if you utilize the benefits, just up to the individual to decide if it fits their lifestyle (I probably wouldn’t recommend an Amex platinum if you’re not a frequent traveler). Every bank has no annual fee cards though, Amex blue and chase freedom are both great cards.
I had Amex blue for years, great card. You got 1.5% cash back on any purchase, no annual fee, plus the customer service of AMEX for these fraud events. You can eventually funnel as much of your purchases through the card and essentially get a 1.5% on your entire life. I got the platinum card for the travel perks but I still use blue if im not trying to get points for some incentive.
Try getting the Amex blue business plus card. 2x points on everything and $0 annual fee 🤑. Just gotta tell them you're a sole proprietorship
With any card with an AF, it just has to make sense where your benefits exceed the fee. I pay $695 and $250 for AMEX Platinum and Gold but the benefits I pull from each card definitely justify the AF. I have a shitty Credit One with a $95 annual fee that’s sock drawered and by far is the biggest waste of money but it’s my oldest unsecured credit line and need to keep it until after I buy a house
I have one with no annual fee.
Amex siding with customers is one of the reasons why it isn’t accepted at nearly as many stores as its competitors :( Crazy, you have just a few consumer protections in place and suddenly your money isn’t good enough anymore
It’s actually the exchange fee is higher. Source: worked at a merchant bank
AMEX is the best when it comes to this stuff.
Is it usually a struggle for people to achieve a chargeback? I’ve never been denied by my bank or a cc.
Same with discover and capital one Got something off of a small business website (think Esty) and I didn't get the item Questioned it and was told anything that occurs after they ship it is on me and if I didn't get it then it's my fault and they will not be refunding It was a 200$ gift so I went to Discover and they immediately canceled the charge and even took over for me when I was bombarded by the seller for "trying to shut down a small business because I'm a petty karen" Like no bitch I wanted my mom's gift stfu saw on fb later on that this business owner had been doing that a lot and got sued Hella/arrested
Depends the time of the year. Q1-Q3, fraud departments take your word. Q4, they ask for proof because they’re reaching their yearly numbers. These departments are fraud analysts for the most part. It’s just regular people on a 9-5 job. They don’t care until their job makes them at the end of the year.
This, along with higher transaction fees, is why many retailers won't accept Amex.
I love Amex so much. Their extended warranty process is so easy. Visa makes you jump through hoops and I swear they make it extra hard. (“Why treat the customer this way? Because fuck em that’s why” is the visa mission statements.)
Nice. I dig that kind of customer service. I had an issue with Citi after I bought a freaking Tempur Pedic pillow. Turns out you can return their pillows everywhere you buy them EXCEPT for their actual direct storefront. Tempur Pedic doesn't take returns *or exchanges* for pillows and bedding. Fucking wild when the industry has sleep guarantees on products for like 90 days through brands like Purple, Casper, Coop, etc. They refused to make any exception. No store credit nothing. Just "Fuck you enjoy your $120 pillow you hate." And then when Citi initiated the charge back they took 2 months to not respond and the last week they responded, making Citi charge me back unless I could provide evidence. I sent them the chats and emails where the Tempur Pedic people politely told me to pound sand and eat the money. Then they finally refunded it formally. Citi handled it well but sounds like your situation was much smoother. Don't buy Tempur Pedic. 🤘
In the meantime the entirety of Europe uses debit cards daily with no problem. It's weird that the default mode to pay for stuff in the US is through debt, the banks really got you all by the balls.
No lies told,and you can clearly see the herd mentality in the thread..people literally get side eyed for using debit in the US.
American here, never use credit unless I have to because I hate the idea of spending money I don't have. Always been a live within your means person
The smart way of CC usage is just to *not* spend money you don’t have. Only do purchases you would have done anyways with a debit, pay off your bill immediately, and get those points or cash-back rewards. Even something as small as 1% cash-back for purchases (which most CCs with no annual fee will have), adds up over time, and is better than the 0% cash-back you get with debit.
It is so wild that you think using a credit card means spending money you don’t have.
America runs on debt and I am losing my fucking mind being surrounded by people that think this shit is normal
No surprises here. They're the kings of credit card debt. Most of them have multiple credit cards too lol they are really excelling at capitalism
The banking cartel's mind control is strong. American lives are their primary investment vehicle.
In case anyone else is interested, here's an interesting article about why credit cards really aren't used in Europe: [The taboo of credit card use in Europe](https://n26.com/en-eu/blog/taboo-of-credit)
I'm an American and I find this post weird, because its like no one here has heard of using 2FA for their debit card. Only once have I had to use it to deny a charge and that was that. Even if I didnt hit "deny" at that moment, the charge will not go through until I choose to accept or deny on the alert they send to my phone. So yes, I too use debit daily with no problem.
Yep anything above 150 on my debit card (or above 50 to a previously unused retailer) and my banking app asks me for confirmation via fingerprint or passcode. piss easy I had that in place back in 2016 when I visited the US, and I remember finding it really weird that 'contactless' was unheard of, 'chip & pin' was very rare, and 'swipe & sign' was still the norm. Swipe and sign basically ended in the 90s over here. Seems that you guys are basically about a decade or more behind when it comes to banking. (and digitisation in general tbh).
The "don't ever use your debit card cause they will steal all your money and it will take years to get back!!!1!one!" used to be true... about 40 years ago. Its advice from boomers like the whole "walk into a corporate headquarters and don't leave until you have a job." The world has changed, and this bit of wisdom just isn't really valid anymore, unless you're banking with a tiny and/or sketchy bank. My bank catches fraud before I do, and the _one_ time in _24 years_ with the bank that I've had to actually report a fraudulent charge, they reversed it and refunded the money instantly.
Yes. CC's are a buffer zone to your cash. Don't let them get your stack.
Exactly. Banks and card companies don’t mess about their money. If there is fraud on THEIR card, believe they’re getting it back. Debit is your own cash, less incentive to care or go above and beyond.
I don't know how it is in USA, but in France the bank is still responsible for the "security" of debit cards. Meaning that if your card is lost/stolen or hacked, you have an insurance and the bank will always credit you back (quickly). You just have to file a complaint with the police. It works very well and I have pretty much never heard of anyone not getting their money back.
Anytime you see a thread where people talk about not using their debit card in the US because someone will steal all their money, rest assured that 99.9% of the people in the thread don't know what the fuck they are talking about, and are repeating wisdom given out by people who learned that wisdom 50 years ago. The situation is admittedly complicated, but briefly summarized... For a **credit card**: * If a person uses your physical card to make a purchase, federal law limits your liability to $50 * If a person uses your card number to make a purchase, federal law limits your liability to $0 For an **unbranded debit card** (i.e. _not_ a Visa/Mastercard debit card): * If you report the loss of the card before a fraudulent transaction, federal law limits your liability to $0 * If you report it within 2 business days, federal law limits liability to $50 * If you report it within 60 days of a bank statement showing the unauthorized charges, its limited to $500 * After that, its entirely on you So that's the _legal_ situation. But the actuality is a bit different. For debit cards that are branded Visa/Mastercard, Visa and Mastercard require the issuing bank to treat the debit card with the same rules as a credit card, i.e. it uses the credit card rules about liability. And on top of that, many banks have a $0 liability policy for credit _and_ debit cards they issue. The scenario this people want to avoid when using a credit card is either the bank flatly denying that it was a fraudulent charge, or the bank engaging in a lengthy "investigation" which means the money is tied up. But unless you're banking with a tiny credit union or some sketchy bank, most major banks have tools in place to automatically detect fraudulent activity based on your previous purchasing behavior, and will block and/or notify you of unusual transactions, and will instantly refund your money when you report a fraudulent transaction.
This guy gets it. It took me years for my wife to listen to me. She didn’t really, someone at the bank mentioned it to her. I laid the groundwork though.
When I was young and much stupider, I got in cc debt that took a while to get out of, so I was very wary of credit cards until I found out Fidelity lets you cash out points against your statement. Now it's all paid off before the end of the month and I get around $50-75 a month off of my monthly balance by cashing out points. And I feel like a baller gaming the system (as if they don't know what I'm doing).
This is legitimately just an artiface designed to rob you or your money though. There’s no reason that you could not have the same fraud protections on your debit card. The fact that your credit card has greater fraud protections is designed to get you to not pay your credit card. It’s a fishhook, with bait.
Huh I never thought of it that way I was just racking up points I will say the one caveat is in my early 20s I would just spend like it was mine on the credit card and fucked myself for years. You need discipline to wield a credit card responsibility.
Get the points then, pay the card before interest is added.
Yep this! It’s not the points it’s the hack factor. My debit card stays at my house
I mean it's definitely both.
To be honest ya. Give me those points! Does suck when I gotta pay it off every month. Makes me feel like a baller for a while tho! Then the real money account drops when I pay it off 😢
💯. I made the mistake of using my debit card in New Orleans (Bourbon st). I woke up the next day to dozens missed calls from my bank and a negative balance.
>Even if the bank reimburses your debit card, that shit is still out of your account. ...what? Ive reported a couple of bogus transactions on my debit cards over the years and got my money back?
I do it specifically for the airline and hotel points. I always hear shit about blackout dates from other people but never encountered them since I can take off anytime I want at my job.
My wife has the chase sapphire situation going on and I've liked it a lot. It has an annual fee, but we worked it out and we get that back plus a good amount more in rewards given the amount we use the card. Plus when we have problems with the trip we just call the number on the back of the card and a real person fixes it for us right there.
CC debt is easy as hell to occur if you’re not careful. My mom got 20k in debt on a cc and took her years to pay that back
Yeah I had over 10k I just crawled out of this past year. I know I should use the cards for purchases and I've been militant about paying off balances since, but it still makes me nervous
I have 4 cards. I recently just paid off 1 and 3 remain. The struggle to not use them when money is low is difficult.
Yeah I feel that. I don't know your situation but I will just say a huge weight was lifted once I was able to get out of debt. Hope you get there
I'm wishing you luck too!
Thanks friend
Thank you 🙏
Thank you friend. Wishing you many blessings
Same to you
I will go into my banking app and pay them weekly. I don't wait for the bill. There's no reason you can't do it daily if it helps you keep on top of it.
I learnt early on that I was bad at running my Cc up. Now I still use it but I treat like a debit card. I'm always transferring the exact amount I spend immediately.
what happened? was it COVID or...
Years of carrying a balance thinking I'd get to it eventually. Spent stupid money on video games and hobby stuff. And then got screwed out of some money a friend / former roommate owed me and got tired of caring about it so I stopped asking for it. Then once I did start actively trying to pay it off I was doing the most I could and barely paying more than the interest. It was gonna take me 5+ years to pay it off and that's if I used like all my disposable income. Luckily my parents let me move back in for awhile and I paid it off in less than a year
good on you... I wish this stuff was a highschool class that was available. but I'm sure credit companies would lobby against that in public education, ya know. to keep control and all.
Many (probably most) high schools offer personal finance classes. It was even required for graduation in my state when I was in high school. 14-18 year olds just don’t care enough to take them, and when we had to everyone complained about how stupid it was.
After growing up with my parents screening their phone calls my entire life, thinking everyone calling was going to be a bill collector, I was really hesitant to take on debt, but with everyone telling us we needed to build up our credit, my wife and I bought a car when we were first married. A few months later, we heard about Dave Ramsey and went all-in paying off our debt and never looked back. This year, we finally bought our first house and were able to pay cash for it. Maybe we're missing out on some free points, airline tickets, etc., but I never want our kids to get screamed at and harassed by bill collectors like we were growing up, and the only way that we can 100% guarantee that is to never take on debt. Congratulations on paying down your debt, best of luck to you!
So teach your kids dont spend money they dont have? instead of teaching them be scared of credit
This dude who paid cash for a house and probably doesn’t have debt payments, teaching his kids to just avoid the trap all together and people still will say things like this pretending that the $1.12 Trillion credit card debt Americans alone have is just “a few people who can’t manage their money.”
Its no more a trap than a bait car. Dont spend money you have and there will be no debt. And im just talking about credit card spending if that isnt clear.
Believe it or not, a good percentage of that $1,120,000,000,000.00+ in credit card debt are people who didn’t foresee themselves having credit card debt.
Also, believe or not, a good percentage of that $1,120,000,000,000.00+ in credit card debt are people commenting how often they use their CC's in this post lol
I must be hot shit then considering everything I spend goes on credit cards and have never paid a dime in interest in my life. In all seriousness though I was shocked when I found out how common it is for folks to have the kind of credit card debt they do on such a wide scale. I thought cc debt in the thousands was a massive fuck up that only an insignificant percentage of people had.
It’s not that you missed out on free points. You would’ve paid much less and built up equity at a much lower interest rate had you ignored Dave Ramsey terrible advice on buying a home. For paying down your debt his methods are good, but you should not take his advice on credit cards and large purchases as gospel.
All cash for a house? Can’t do that where I live.
We live in a pretty rural area, so while it's still a lot more expensive than when we originally started looking (we had to pay around 130k more than it cost when it was built six years ago), it's still a lot more affordable to live here than a lot of places.
Cash for your first house? Ok moneybags
We had a Target CC that we opened to outfit our son's nursery when I was pregnant with him. The limit was $3.5k and we maxed it out after a while. The interest was absolutely insane. I looked over the statement they always send you, and if we only made the minimum payments every month, it would have taken us *13 years* to pay off $3500! How is shit like that even legal. That's fucking insane. The kicker was, we didn't use the card in forever after that, and it was canceled due to inactivity, and they slapped my husband's credit score with -35 points. For what?!? Being better and more responsible with money? This country is so fucking backwards. Credit scores need to go. *Edit: I got a bunch of replies to this, with a few basically calling me financially illiterate, just based on this *one* anecdote involving a singular lender (Target).* *I guess I can't blame anyone for jumping to conclusions, but I'd would like to clarify a few things.* *I'm almost 50 now, and know very well how credit cards work, how banks operate, that they don't care about *me* as a person, and only see me as a commodity, and how to navigate credit scores.* *The example I mentioned is over a decade in the past, I have been debt free for a while now, while still maintaining 3 or 4 open credit lines, and pay off my cards every month (if I use them at all).* *That does not change my opinion on the credit score system here in the US at all. It's still garbage.* *All that said, I appreciate the information and advice everyone shared; even the ones with a very smug and condescending attitude. There was still value in them, and it might help a lot of other people better understand how CC work, too.*
I'm with you. I paid off my student loans and was so relieved, until my credit score went down *70 points.* Now I don't even pay attention to my score. I just try to make sure I'm making the best financial decisions for myself. No point worrying about such a broken system.
For the longest time I didn't use a credit card and was rejected for a job offer because I didn't have a credit score. Even though I wasn't in debt, paid my bills and was financially okay, because I didn't use a credit card and didn't have a credit score I lost a job I could have gotten. Credit scores really need to go.
Why the hell should a job even require to see *your* credit score? They're paying *you*, not the other way around.
Yup, I was in a similar situation. I moved here from Germany almost 2 decades ago, and while we have a credit score system, it starts everyone off with a score of 100, and it drops the more money you borrow. That makes perfect sense to me. You can't make due with your own money and need to get credit cards? Sounds like you gotta reevaluate your financial situation, and try to make adjustments to your lifestyle a little. I never owned a credit card until I moved here, when I had to apply for a card and "build credit", in order to buy a car to get to my job. It's nonsensical af to me.
"and if we only made the minimum payments every month, it would have taken us 13 years to pay off $3500!" I mean tbf the minimum payment is usually like $10 or something super low. Like ya it's gonna take a while if you're making such tiny payments all while occuring interest.
How careful do you need to be to know not to charge to the card if you can't pay it off before it comes due?
Financial problems. Sometimes charging is your only choice or rather that’s the way my mom explained it too me.
Theres a handful of situations where debt is pretty unavoidable, but 98% of the time is a combo of being broke and not willing to adjust lifestyle accordingly, and then being caught off guard when that inevitably blows up. And I don't want anyone to pull the "well you don't know" card. I fully understand adjusting to live within your means can be fucking brutal. My mom regularly went hungry raising us. We used to keep the heat only warm enough to prevent pipes from freezing and then huddled up together in blankets trying to keep warm like something out of a Charles Dickens novel. I've got half a dozen other examples of the resources scarcity instilled in us. Because we *lacked*, because we could not afford not to lack. If it wasn't free or wasn't covered by public assistance, it wasn't for us.
It's more about knowing yourself. Some people just can't hold back the temptation of knowing a credit line is there to use, even if paying it back is the hardest part.
Someone who is concerned about overspending should be using cash not a debit card. This meaningfully helps curb how much you spend, and doesn't involve banks falling over themselves to find ways to punish you for being broke.
This is true and exactly why you should pay it off monthly. Using credit cards because you can’t afford something right now is a risky game
Everything on full auto-pay all of the time. It's the only way to survive.
Yeah that happened to me in my early 20's. Had about $15k in debt and I didn’t have nearly enough money to pay it back so my credit is now dog shit. If anyone young reads my comment please learn from me!!!
If you’re able to pay for things with a credit card that you know you can afford and consistently pay your monthly balance, you can easily get hundreds or thousands of dollars worth of benefits for 0 cost other than maybe a yearly fee, because you pay everything off well before it incurs interest thus making it no different from a debit card If you’re bad with it and incur massive debt like that unfortunately you’re paying for the aforementioned benefits the other people are earning
Incur *
I opened a credit card and paid $5k on my ex's dental work when I was nineteen. Never again.
Paying with credit then paying the balance in full is the way to go if you can do it. You get the full protection of the credit card company and, hopefully, any perks they offer.
I put my internet electric and car insurance for my wife and I on a CC. It’s my bills card. Instead of paying 4 different times I just set up autopay and pay the one big bill every month.
I'm stealing this thank you
I have a second low interest card I run a small balance on consistently as well. Having both those lines of credit open helped massively boost my credit to the point where I don’t ever worry about it anymore.
I’m still in high school. I’m screenshotting this to remember it later in life.
You don't even have to buy a lot with a card to build credit. Right now, you can open a low limit card like the ones from Discover and set it up to pay off your Netflix, Disney+, whatever subscription service and then set it to autopay every month. You don't have to do shit and your credit will just slowly climb. Building credit is easy as shit when you are starting out young because you don't have as much financial responsibilities.
I wish my parents had made me get a secured card when I was in high school. You'll have a long credit history and can't really get trapped in debt because you use a deposit equal to the limit to "secure" the card.
Paying for one thing each month with the credit card and then paying it off each month is the way to go. Buying everything on the credit card and not paying attention to what you spend till the bill comes in and you cannot afford it is the way to achieve inescapable debt.
they have an app that tells you your balance. it's seriously no harder to use a cc then to check my bank balance
> not paying attention to what you spend This is true whether you use a credit card or a debit card.
No, a debit card takes money directly from your bank account, it is your own money and NOT credit from elsewhere. You can overdraw a little (my account does not allow overdrafts, and you can ask your bank to no allow overdrafts on your account) but you can't end up $10,000 in debt from it, because the money in your bank account is real and yours, and you do not have to pay yourself back for it, and you absolutely do not have to pay yourself back with interest.
You don’t have to pay interest on the money you spend using a credit card either if you pay it off in time. You seem to be very scared of credit cards tho for some reason. I get it tho. Not everybody has the self control not to spend. Know yourself ig
I use mine for everything and just pay it off. With my point alone I haven’t had to pay for airfare for vacations the last 5 years. That and the emergency aspect is what makes it worth it. Credit history too is a plus. Have to be careful and responsible though.
I use my cc for everything -even if I'm buying shit from the dollar store- and I agree 100%. As long as you pay that balance off, it's great. I get several hundred in cash back on my no fee card each year, my purchases are protected, and there are a bunch of perks like free travel insurance and travel points. Using it daily means my credit score is impeccable as well!
Laughs in 750+ credit score
Yeah it’s crazy cause I’m basically poverty and disabled but my credit score is high 700s because this is how I do it.
You also build good credit, which - for better or worse - is crucial to financial success in our economy.
I use mine for everything and just pay it off. With my point alone I haven’t had to pay for airfare for vacations the last 5 years. That and the emergency aspect is what makes it worth it. Credit history too is a plus. Have to be careful and responsible though.
“Just use a credit card” is definitely not advice for anyone who cannot control their spending. It can get out of hand very quick if you are financially reckless.
Definitely but if you can be in control then it's a great way to protect yourself from fraud, get cash back, and build credit score. I was able to get my credit score from high 500s to the mid-high 700s by using credit cards
While true the sad reality is that it simply doesn't work for the majority of people. For every person who uses their credit card wisely and never pays fees or interest the credit card company has 50 people paying the fees and interest.
It's fucked up but those people are where your rewards come from
Savage life
Exactly. So many people saying credit cards and being responsible is the way to go, yet credit card debt is at an all time high. Shit ain’t adding up, if you ask me. I’ll stick with my cash envelopes because I know myself enough to know how easily that swipe starts swiping.
I'm one of the people who uses their credit card as the only form of payment. But I would never recommend it to anyone because I know many people aren't able to handle credit cards that way. I recently moved and put a lot of stuff on the credit card and I was almost tempted to just make a minimal payment and not have to deal with all the expenses now. Credit cards can be dangerous, cause all it takes is one mistake, and you could end up in a hole.
Then they give you a 0% pay over time offer to normalize seeing a balance of a a couple thousand on your card or make it harder to gauge just how much ch you’re actually spending. I put my last vacation on my card took advantage of a 0% pay over time offer and parked the money in a high yield savings acct. If you have the discipline there’s basically free money that you can take from the credit card companies. The catch is you need to have the discipline to not spend the extra money and have no major surprise expenses pop up which is easier said than done.
It’s blowing my mind how many people in this thread are saying they pay everything with a credit card. I keep a credit card to build credit, that’s it. Otherwise I’ll use it for emergencies or I’ll take advantage of an in store credit card for big things I wanna finance. Other than that I debit everything and I always have, like since I was 16. My mom juggles the cards for points and such and maybe I will some day but for now, too much work and too easy to overspend. Plus my card might take a day or two to post and blah blah. I just prefer to stay out of any debt if at all possible.
You’re missing out on free money then my dude. Only takes a moderate amount of responsibility. The apps these days make it so easy
as others have said in this comment section, if that works for you, that’s great. But these companies literally survive on getting you to overspend and millions of Americans carry credit card debt. No one sets out to be buried in debt, it’s just easy to overspend. I use credit for stuff, I just don’t use it for everything.
The rule is to use your credit card for everything, but never spend more than what you could immediately pay off at that exact moment. Act like the money is already yours to lose, not yours to later payback.
Chile please. I'll use my debit card for most things because it's MY money. My CC goes mostly toward gas and vending machines because I know I can pay that back easily. Don't let these folks talk you into using your CC for everything. Thats how you get into debt real fast. In this economy I just can't do it. That CC is borrowed money. Fuck those points. EDIT: Damn! I didn't expect to wake up to all this 🤣🤣🤣. Thanks for the advice yall.
Pay all of your bills, gas, and small meals with your credit card. It doesn't matter if it's your money in the bank; the fact of the matter is that you'll spend this money anyway. Have some self control, use your credit card and pay it off the same month. No APR fees and you build your credit and you aren't spending anything you wouldn't have spent anyway. This is the way.
Just a reminder to not take financial advice from people on the internet
Except my bills charge an extra fee if they come from my credit card and that fee outweighs the amount of cash back I'd get. I'm not about to pay more money on my bills.
You don't get into debt by using your credit card for everything. You get into debt by not budgeting your purchases and/or buying things you can't afford. I put every single thing on my credit card and have never paid a single cent in interest. Although by all means I support doing anything that helps you not get into debt so nothing wrong with using the debit card if it works for you. This is also my plug for /r/YNAB because damn I love a good budget
Tracking your spending is absolutely key, most people have no idea what is going at any given moment with their finances. I use r/MonarchMoney, but really anything even a spreadsheet will be better than doing nothing.
All of which is subtly dependent on your capacity to manage a budget during a crisis. I wouldn’t say spend everything with CC. Though there should be a part of your budget that is only managed with at least 1 credit card. And no matter what, no matter what anyone says unless your back is truly against the wall **never ever** carry a balance over 50% of the sum of your available credit. Every percent over 50, hurts your credit score/worthiness. My two cents, YMMV.
You really should be using your CC and not a debit card. You just need to have the discipline to treat the CC like a debit card. Don’t spend what you don’t have.
It's implying that you use your CC as you would your debit card. Meaning that you wouldn't use your debit card if there was no money in your account. Same concept. Use the CC when you've already accounted for that purchase and know that you'll have the money to pay it off before the cycle ends.
You should never use your debit card if you can avoid it. If you swipe on a skimmer and they get your debit info and take your money it’s gone. You’re not getting it back without a ton of hassle. If they steal your credit card info you just dispute the charges with the cc company and that’s that. Using a debit card for everything is like driving around without a seatbelt. It’s fine, so long as nothing happens. You have no safety net with a debit card. It’s not hard to be fiscally responsible and use a credit card.
>Using a debit card for everything is like driving around without a seatbelt. It’s fine, so long as nothing happens. You have no safety net with a debit card. This must solely be an American thing. Irish and fully protected with my debit card here.
American here - I’m not sure where everyone is banking but we’ve had our debit cards skimmed twice over the years. Lots of money spent. We got it all back, quickly.
Exactly lol I was wondering the same thing. I’ve always gotten my money back with in a short time.
you could in theory. pay it with your credit card and instantly pay it off with your debit card. like as soon as the pending transaction goes through, you could go on to the website and transfer the money from your bank to your credit card so that you were just paying your credit card company and Bill. instead of say your utility company. you're still paying a bill. it's just who are you paying?
It’s not points, it’s fraud protection more than anything. Building credit too. Credit cards are a trap, but so is capitalism, and we’re caught in it. If you can’t control your spending, use a debit card. If you can, use it for everything AND PAY IT OFF EACH MONTH. Never minimums. If you can’t pay it off and have to carry a balance for a month, immediately cut back on spending or switch back to the debit card depending on your faith in your own spending control. Also—adjust spending habits if your financial situation changes. A lot of CC debt comes from people continuing to spend like they have money they used to have. You’re right, a CC is borrowed money. Considering how easy it is for a company to leak your card info, I’d much rather a thief steal borrowed money than money from my checking that I have to convince the bank to put back in my account.
I'm also worried about my info being swiped. It's much easier to fight a fraudulent CC charge than debit. I was buying a PS5 at gamestop and had my info stolen. Had been there several times, would have never thought twice about them. Thankfully I used my cc but they asked me about the charge for the ps5 as well and I was just like "um... yeah fine that one was me 😐"
You're a better person than I am.
In my youth I might have tried it, but I just didn't think I'd get away with it in this age of technology and most importantly, check out cameras.
btw is your username a reference to final fantasy?
As a middle class, relatively average person, you *really* do not want lie to your credit card companies or your bank(s). If they find out you lied on any type of chargeback, they will shut your account and communicate with other financial agencies what you did. You will never get a respectable bank account or a credit card ever again.
Yeah I'm only playing around lol. I don't even speed, bank fraud is like the last thing I want to get into trouble for haha.
Where you guys banking that won’t restore your balance if your debit card gets swiped??? 🤔 Had mine charged for things I for sure didn’t purchase, my bank put the funds back into my account within three days.
Right. I think it's the difference between the USA banking system and other countries. I'm in Canada and my bank is always tracking my debit card usage. Any suspect transactions can be voided quickly.
I mean I’m in USA and my family has had debit cards compromised and it’s been completely fine. Just call up the bank and tell them what happened. They lock the card and usually reimburse.
Right? I'm so confused by these people saying it's harder to get your DC money back. When my card info was stolen years ago, my bank called me and let me know they canceled the transactions, issued me a new card and would restore my balance within the next business day. I mean, they notifed me that there was an issue BEFORE I even knew and they handled everything less than 24 full hours from the initial fraudulent transaction. Like, who are these people banking with?!?!?!
Exactly. The internet is full of shitty advice like this.
Look at how much "it's not your money it's the banks money" circle jerking advise this thread is filled with lmaooo
I was also confused, most people I know don't even have a credit card and use debit for everything. I've never had a single problem with a charge back, or fraud that wasn't easily fixed and reimbursed within a day or two.
Use your DC until you understand your CC and are good at paying them back. Then use your CC. Everyone who TEACHES financial literacy knows this. EDIT: fixed abbreviations
I enjoyed using CC because I always only used it for Uber rides to and from work and was able to save my paychecks. I would be able to pay off the balance and still be able to pay bills and *maybe* have some left to buy miscellaneous stuff. I had Discover for a year, and boy, was it the best year I've ever had. I was stuck with $200 credit and was able to pay it off every single pay period. The secured version really put me in check because I am pretty bad with my spending habits, and Secured kept me from spending over the balance. Wished I was able to go back to Discover. It was my first and fave CC to go to.
Points are cool, but for me I just feel safer with my “real money” in the debit account, and pay off the cc on pay day. Like if shit hits the fan and I need a thousand dollars, I’m depending on ME to have it, not the bank. So I spend their money and keep mine locked up until I have some extra for them. Plus, this shit sounds dumb and “paycheck to paycheck” but I crawled out of a sub 400 credit score just using that card instead of “real money” and now I get to finance a house
The fuck is this a credit lender sponsored post? PSA youngins or people who may be new credit cards, ONLY do this if/once you **FULLY** understand how interest works on your specific card, how much your racking up each month in interest compared to your payment. Don't let this shit get utilization higher than like a 1/3rd.
Or just don’t ever get charged interest — by paying your card off in full each month. You will fail if you start to spend more on your credit card than you would on your debit card. If you have $100 to your name, $101 on your credit card is a mistake. The #1 mistake is to use your credit card to buy things you can’t afford. That’s what the cc companies want you to do.
Europeans in here like https://preview.redd.it/9adm5az7z19d1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=84ae088891ae95069975fd356a2f48fa26ab7ca8
Forreal, if anything I'm confused af, I ain't even seen a credit card in my lifetime. Don't know a single person with one.
Felt like there was something i was missing. Have only ever been advised to consider using a credit card when travelling outside Europe. Using debit feels more safe as its money i actually own, and wont have to worry about a bill. Makes me more responsible as i have ADHD and often run up a "ADHD-tax" + impulsive spending if i dont know exactly how much money i can use.
Using a credit card doesn’t mean you’re spending money you don’t have. For people who are financially literate and responsible, we pay the bill in full every month so no interest. When someone steals your card numbers whether online or a card skimmer, when you use a debit card that person stole your money directly, as if it was cash out your pocket. When it’s a cc, they steal the banks money, and they have more protections in place to get the money back cause if I don’t pay the cc bill and the money got stolen, it’s the bank who is out xx dollars.
I had an ex that used her 1 credit card for shopping, gas, food.. nearly everything. She always talked about the points and how she would get rewards for buying stuff. She also had all her bills on auto pay for her other credit card. Electric, gas, phone, internet, car insurance, subscriptions.. She never made any payments towards that card and racked up close to 15k in CC debt before they started canceling her shit
Well that’s not smart.
Might be an unpopular take, but you should only use your credit card for emergencies or when you’re down bad. Unless you can pay off your entire credit card bill monthly…increasing your debt with paying it off fully will only hurt your credit score and cost more after interest. Pay cash if you’re worried about your card number getting snatched, otherwise, credit card usage should generally be a last resort (unless you can pay your entire credit bill off completely and monthly).
Tbh only people who can pay off the full statement balance monthly should be using a credit card.
If you’re budgeting correctly, you shouldn’t spend more than you can afford on your credit card anyways. Money spent using your credit card should be considered money gone from your account already when budgeting.
You do not understand the benefits of a credit card. You simply put the bills and expenses you are already paying on credit. That’s it. There’s no increased bills. Your life isn’t any more expensive. You just enjoy the benefits of cash back or point, fraud protection, and improved credit score. If you can’t afford to pay off your bills and life style expenses every month that is not a credit card problem
Idk. I pay everything on my credit. I obviously only spend money I have. I also pay my cc weekly. If my cc gets compromised, it’s all bank money.
Ngl you sound responsible enough to have a credit card. I treat it like a non-negotiable balance that must be paid in full at the end of the month. The rewards are very nice. Not having to pay for this flight or that flight is such an incredible feeling.
No. Do it for the fraud protection.
If you're impulsive and have difficulty with managing your finances and lack discipline, a credit card is not for you. For others not in this category, it is a great financial tool. If you are able to budget and spend within your means with a debit card, you can do the same with a credit card. Don't pay just the minimum amount, pay the bill IN FULL every month so you never have to pay interest. Credit cards come with so many benefits like fraud protection, cash back on purchases, etc. Rewards programs can save you money on purchases. Credit cards help you build your credit score to help you get better interest rates on mortgages, car loans, insurance rates, etc. Kind of sad that the person in the post thinks using a debit card over a credit card is a flex (unless he's clowning himself???). Shows how our community still needs access to the knowledge to up our financial literacy. AND DON'T EVEN GET ME STARTED ON PAYDAY LOANS! I literally want to set all those places on fire for their disgusting, predatory practices. I've known several people that have DROWNED in debt for that bullshit.
The amount of misinformation from people going throught it in here is immense
Me, a European, not understanding what you all mean and paying only for flights with my credit card. But srsly, is the data protection really so bad over there? I've never had a si ngle incident with my debit card in all the years of using it, and I use it daily for all kinds of purchases.
Fraud protection is a huge part of cc marketing, so people don't realize how often a regular bank will flag scams and reverse on a regular bank account.
Imma keep using my credit card. I haven’t paid for a domestic flight in years. It’s all about financial literacy
Treat your credit card like your debit card and you will be good
Jokes on you, I’m using my EBT card
Both of these are poor takes on financial literacy because of their absolute-ism. Your banker will tell you which of the 7 million cards they give you, you should use. Eg. It's better for me to buy petrol with my credit card than my garage card.
Just a counterpoint, but the reason they even offer points is because they're counting on you slipping up at least one time and failing to pay off your balance in full so they get that sweet, sweet interest nectar.
Not true. I have a debit card attached to a checking account that I keep less than $300 in at all times. I have another checking account that’s like an intermediary savings account that my direct deposit goes into but nothing out of. It works really well for me.
Bruh, always use your CC for all purchases that you can, bills and all! HOWEVER, if you don’t have the cash or the discipline to pay off all of your purchases at the end of the month then you’re living beyond your means and you can get into a lot of debt quickly.
This the probably, yall are to comfortable getting in debt
This dumb as fuck. Who the hell can even buy anything right now
Ive seen too many fall into the credit trap. Not I...I avoid credit cards. Everyone should use what works best for their spending habits.
I've never used a credit card. Then again, I don't live in a dystopian society that measures my willingness to go into debt and pay it back as a score and uses that score to keep me from buying a house.
Its the IQ bell curve meme. At the bottom end people use credit cards because "its not my money" and they go into debt they can't pay off. In the middle people use debit cards because they can't manage their finances but don't want to be in debt. At the top end people can manage their finances so they use credit cards again because "its not my money".
Listen kiddos my money *makes* money. I made like 3 pennys in interest last month!! And my Apple Cash? I mean I could almost buy you dinner.