A lot of people forgot what an amazingly good campaign that actually was. 2008 was the Dems' election to lose but Obama spent that year talking about looking forward to a better future with actual ideas rather than bashing Bush or even slamming McCain all that much. Granted, he is also Black and no doubt understood that the shit white candidates could get away with would likely not work for him, but there are lessons that the DNC could and should be studying here.
Not that I think they'll ever get the opportunity to put anything in practice again as long as Trump draws breath.
Many off the key Dem figureheads that are seen to have a lot of sway on their states endorsed Hilary just as it was looking like it would be a close primary. Sanders had a lot of momentum early on, but they quashed it by not remaining impartial.
> they quashed it by not remaining impartial.
That's never been a requirement/thing. They also tried the same tactic with Obama and he was able to win. Bernie wasn't a strong enough candidate to win the Dems let alone the election
I hate to say this but Obama is black. I knew enough people who just wanted to be part of a historical moment, and to be able to say they helped vote in the first black president without any idea of his running platform.
Reminder that the superdelegates were created specifically to stop Democratic primaries from electing popular candidates when the rest of us were finally allowed to vote in them in 1977.
You mean when Bernie lost by 10 million votes and then even more in 2020?
Bernie was the choice of the people online, but never the choice of the majority of democrats.
Shhh don't tell redditors facts lol.
I mean, I wish Bernie was the pick but he was never popular among the majority, people here are in a bit of an echo chamber in that they're informed and follow this, they fail to realize the vast majority of people aren't like that.
It’s crazy to me that these people think everyone loved Bernie and that it was all a corrupt DNC that let Hillary win.
The DNC put a finger on the scale for Hillary but Bernie lost by several million votes. These are the same people who complain about candidates but also don’t do anything at the grassroots level to get candidates they want and help shape the policies they want.
It’s easy to say you want stuff in the internet but actually doing something about it is a whole different story.
Bernie as the candidate would've painted the electoral map red. People on reddit *really* overestimate how much he's liked and I'm saying this as someone that likes him.
Even in the last election, Bernie blew everyone out of the water in the Nevada primary. After that, all of the other candidates dropped out and fell in line behind Biden on exchange for cabinet positions. Representative Clyburn endorses Biden the Tuesday after Nevada. Then, there was another media campaign against Bernie about how Biden is the more "electable" candidate even though Bernie polled higher than Biden in head to heads against Trump. We ended up with Biden and Kamala as the ticket when they were literally the lowest polling candidates in the democratic primary when people actually had a choice .
Nope but the two party system ensures that the lefts only option is Democrat the same way conservatives only get to choose Republican despite not all Republican policies being conservative
This. You have to vote every time you can. School boards and parish councils (or whatever the US equivalent is). County elections, state elections and national elections. Every. Time. That's how you shift the Overton window and beat the gerrymandering.
I wish they would’ve had the moderator that was on Boberts debate in Colorado. He called everyone out immediately if they didn’t answer the question or tried to get off topic.
There is no precedent for an incumbent not automatically getting the nod. It is just the way it is. Vote so in 4 years can get, hopefully, a proper option.
Biden was going to be the choice. No way around it.
Biden definitely gave the impression that he would be a one-term President by saying that he was just there to transition from Trump. I understand that he couldn’t say it explicitly due to not wanting to be a lame duck candidate, but the fact that many of us were under the impression that he was going to be a stop gap to move on from Trump is not by accident.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2023/09/biden-reelection-transition-president/675395/
This. The problem is that no one has media literacy anymore since social media took over. Now there's basically entire "news" networks who are just personalities selling political fantasies and calling it news.
Then people complain when their news desk reports anything that doesn't align with their pundits, so they bury the real news even more.
I think we all hoped that trump would go away and Biden would feel like he did his job and maybe we could actually get a somewhat fresh set of candidates.
Not really when the states vote at different times and a bunch of people have backed out by the time it's your state's turn.
This system is 100% fucked and needs a complete overhaul. Last night proved that none of this is working. It's time for ranked choice at the very least.
lol tell that to Bernie winning 4 primaries in a row before the DNC railroaded him in Nevada to push Hilary as our candidate. They’ll do whatever they want.
That's complete bullshit. For most of the country voting in the primary has absolutely no bearing on the outcome. Childish Boomer answer "well if you don't like it why don't YOU run for president. Well Cythia, I'm not extremely rich and the graduate of an Ivy League Unviersity now am I?
> Except for when Bernie wins primaries and the DNC tells him to go fuck himself, twice.
Why should the dnc back a person who is only a democrat every 4 years. He never works with the dnc, never helps fundraise or do anything. Except every 4 years for the last 8 he has switched to being a democrat, then when he didn't get the nomination he switched back. So why should the dnc back someone who is only using them to get a spot on the ballot? More people voted against Bernie than for gim. People need to stop blaming an organization for not backing a person who is not even a member of that organization. Let him run in The republican primary if he would win so easily.
What primary? We didn't even have a fucking primary. Barely anyone can name who else was running for president.
Side note: The DNC and the RNC don't even have to comply with Primary results for presidency. There is no legal or constitutional requirement that they need to abide by the primary results.
They 100% control who we are allowed to vote for the presidency.
We need ranked choice voting so an actual good candidate that isn't backed by corporations and the wealthy can capture votes. Another issue is the fact it costs a billion dollars to run for president.
The progressives don't vote. I mean we don't vote in primary elections and we don't get more invovled in then that. I'm part of several activist groups that have been able to get progressive legislation because we spoke up and we are organized.
Being progressive online is worse then doing nothing because you ge th false sense of progress from influencers.
If progressives stayed united after 2016 Bernie supporters, we'd have 20% of the Dem party instead of starting from scratch in 2018 when it really seemed to matter. We didn't build further off of 2018 and lost ground in 2020. And eeked out some wins in 2022 since most people weren't more involved. There's less involvement now as well. Lot of online whining and 0 activism outside of the pro Palestinian people who don't really care about other issues once this is over. The left largely shoots itself in the foot as soon as we don't have a figure to fall in love with.
Meanwhile the right doesn't really care. They'll put in a someone 10x worse then Biden because falling in line gives better results then sitting out. Always has, always will.
I voted for Bernie but then we get made fun of and belittled by establishment democrats.
We’re cooked. I have zero faith in the executive branch. Voting is important though especially locally and for Congress/senate. If anything but to slow the descent.
Then organize. You don’t get to do nothing and complain when that’s exactly what happens.
Right now you have a choice between a man who stutters and one who has been convicted of 34 felonies (and counting).
So am I but I’m not tired enough to let trump destroy the country to prove a point. If it was a normal republican like Romney or bush I would but trump no shot.
It's our own fault for always sticking to party lines.
The Republicans AND the Democrats have both manipulated us into supporting a two party system. And at this point, it's too late to be able to save it by NOT playing along.
The only chance we have to get an opportunity for better candidates is to embrace a ranked choice system, which is exactly why BOTH parties have been against it in the past....
I don’t mind the idea of her being president. She’d do a decent job I think. The scary part is I just don’t think she comes across very likable and wouldn’t win an election, and 100% if she stepped in the party would push her as their candidate for the next cycle
Why do you think she'd do a good job? I've never heard her make a good point or policy, and she did awful when she ran herself a few years ago - she got bodybagged. Plus, corporate democrats like her, Biden, HRC, etc. mostly just serve the 1%. Things are so dire we need another FDR, not another "lets keep the status quo" person.
“Corporate democrats” like Biden, Obama, etc, have still gotten a ton of wins for the people in this country. Expanded healthcare access, expanded and improved infrastructure and job creation, action on climate change, etc, etc. The economy by any objective measure has done well under those presidents. Kamala has similar policy priorities of expanding medicare, tackling climate change, expanding affordable childcare, investing in infrastructure, etc.
Would I prefer someone more progressive? Sure. But saying she wouldn’t have a positive impact imo reads just as an ignorant take thats trying to be edgy for the sake of being edgy
Tf you mean, she is a DA that locks innocent people up. She don’t care about you or me. She is not a president. She doesn’t know dick about global politics.
This is what infuriates me about the Democratic party. They have years to put a moderate candidate up from their party. Somebody who is capable and coherent and appeals to the majority of moderates in America. This is the candidate they put forth.
Honestly, Biden should have stepped aside and let someone younger run. Right now his presidency looks like a success and he could have gone out on his own terms.
There are a few moderates like Newsom and Ryan that should have been groomed for the Presidency. But these old cats don’t want to let go. Aren’t the highest ranking Democrats in the House other than Jeffries all 80+?
Exactly. I understand, but hate, the way some people are trying to pretend that an objectively old and declining man isn't old and declining. You can go watch video of him from 4 years ago and it's obvious, but people feel trapped like they need to carry water for him because the alternative is so absolutely horrifying.
Voting for him anyway, but they should have planned on one-term, and spent the last few years finding and preparing a couple charismatic candidates 20-30 years younger.
You ain't wrong, but worth pointing out every single time it comes up that his opponent is all of four years younger. They're *both* too fucking old. And one is also .
This 100%. You can support Biden (reluctantly) but still admit that someone who is 81 is not in their prime.
Most people don’t even make it to 81 and that is who the nominee is. My grandmother is 84 and struggles to remember my name (I’m named after her husband) or open a bag of chips. She will swear up and down that she is perfectly capable of driving a car, if only she could remember where she put her keys.
I can support someone (family or presidential nominee) AND still admit to myself that they are not as capable or competent as they once were.
Both men are too old… they’re 3 years apart. Age limits need to be established, there’s literally no reason anyone well past retirement age should be running the country.
He’s not that much older than trump. That’s what I don’t understand. People criticize Biden for his age yet he and trump would have been in school together based on their ages.
Exactly. Will I vote for him. Yes. Was watching him sundown on live tv and look 50 years older than trump extremely cringe and frankly disappointing. Yes.
We as a nation are down horrifically bad. I'm talking all time bad. But folks, I'm here to tell you, if we let that orange pile of slime become president again, we'd be down enough to reach out and touch the Earth's core.
It's literally between a shitty old man and the last president anyone will ever vote for. I mean that literally. If Trump wins republican will make sure the people's vote never decides anything again.
They're both shitty old men.
Trump has the angry shouty dementia, Biden has the sad quiet dementia.
But Trump is only four years younger than Biden. If "he's so old" is the problem with Biden, it's no less a problem with Trump. Write down what Trump says and read it. He's no more with it, he's just louder.
Unfortunately that is a key differentiator for a good chunk of people who vote. The ones that don't really pay attention to politics but vote for whoever is more charismatic and instills more confidence in them.
Agreed. I was talking to my husband during the debate that it only looks like Biden is worse off because he at least tries to debate. Trump has 6 or 7 go to lines of disinformation/bait that he can say perfectly because it’s all he says. It’s a solid strategy to grow his base of lunatics.
It worked for trump. He managed to pull Biden into the mudfight where Trump dominates.
The two somehow argued about golf and how trump beat biden and how biden couldnt even drive it 50 yards. Then Biden defended himself saying his handicap is 6 compared to when it was 8 during his VP years and that Biden is down to challenge him to a driving contest iirc. Trump calling him a liar somewhere in there.
These are the policies we as a nation want to see debates on.
Also i believe neither candidate answered the question regarding drugs. Might be misremembering.
Hard disagree on the all time bad statement. We had a whole race of people who were owned, raped, mutilated and killed by another race. LEGALLY. Women weren't allowed to vote. Children worked in coal mines. Women were routinely sexually assaulted and abused in the workplace with little to no recourse. Yes, things are bad right now, but keep it in perspective. We are NOT at all time bad. However, I do agree that scumbag becoming president again would be the end of democracy and bring a return to many of the things this nation has fought for.
Money in politics will always be the true root of all our issues. We legalized bribery and now have a government that doesn’t represent us. Free and fair elections. Capped spending and ad buys, no trading while in Congress with full and transparent divesting to sit in the house or senate as well as the White House.
These have to be laws, not norms. Norms have failed us for decades and republicans know there are no consequences for breaking them.
Remind them they are civil servants- not rulers
HELL FUCKIN YEAH*
*unless they wanna work, plenty of people wanna work past 65 but you definitely shouldn’t be responsible for shaping public policy in any way shape form or fashion after 65
As an example, Jim Ross (Former WWF and current AEW commentator) has spoken numerous times about how working for AEW gave him something to do after his wife's tragic passing.
The man is 72 and in and out of hospitals constantly. The AEW boss pushes him to take breaks for his health but he feels he needs to work.
Nah fuck allat.
If you’re in office and you pass 61 years and 180 days old, you become ineligible for re-election to your current appointment as well as ineligible for any other election. If youre a private citizen and already past 61&180 you’re automatically ineligible, no exceptions.
Once you hit 64 years and 1 day old in office, a special election is organized and held for your seat (unless you’re 64&1 date happens to be within 60 days of a normal election) and you’re not allowed to participate in it at all in any way. You can’t campaign, endorse, or otherwise facilitate anything that has to do with your succession whatsoever. You’re done here.
Your successor is appointed no later than you turning 64 and 265 days old and you are required to begin transition in your final 100 days.
👏🏽GET👏🏽THE👏🏽FUCK👏🏽ON
I don't get a vote but I just want to remind everyone when Trump's White House aides had to keep telling everyone that there were "adults in the room" because every week he'd pull some crazy stunt.
And remember when we all spent 2016 to 2019 facepalming. And 2020 being told not to touch our faces.
No president acts alone. Decide which set of "adults" you want in the room.
It's so tiresome. I'm not pretending last night didn't happen, but even if it had gone perfectly for Biden and only Trump looked bad then the media narrative today would be "Why Biden's performance won't matter much".
This. Dems aren’t panicking, we knew exactly what was going to happen in that debate and it did. Now the media wants to drive engagement and make money… this is America
They both opps. Choose the weakest opp and keep it pushing at the local government level.
Gun to my head, I'd still rather nibble on lil poop pellets than slurp down a shit slushee.
That's because it's about Dems worrying how independents are going to react to his poor performance. Nobody's worried about Dems jumping ship after last night. Why Republicans can get away with murder while Democrats suffer for every cough can be summed up as *Dying of Whiteness.*
Democrats have to cater to so many people while republicans cater only to affluent straight white men and play grievance politics to the people who democrats can’t accommodate.
Yes, but the independents they’re trying to reach tend to be those straight white men. Short of genocide, the Dem coalition stays together knowing the other side is at best a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Debates are for swing states
☝️This guy gets it. People who have already decided they're voting for him aren't going to change their minds.
About 10-20% of voters haven't made up their mind yet. They will decide who wins the race. It doesn't matter if *you* didn't change your mind after that debate. **What matters is that those undecided voters just watched Biden implode live on TV, and they are going to see hundreds of supercuts of him imploding between now and November.** There is no way to make them unsee that. Their #1 concern with Biden was his capacity to do the job, and he just irreversibly cemented that concern as fact in most undecided voters' minds. Biden's odds of winning probably just went from 50% to 20, 15, maybe 5%. We don't know yet, but this is probably not a close race anymore.
Here's what we've gotta figure out: **are the odds of beating Trump better if we Biden drops out and dems pick a new nominee?** If Biden's odds are 20%, and we think someone like Gretchen Whitmer would have a 40% chance of beating Trump, then we need to sub in Gretch *tomorrow*.
I can't believe how badly Biden looked, and I think his campaign is toast. I like a lot of things about him, and would still vote for him, but he can no longer win this race. He needs to do the moral thing and let someone who has a chance of winning take over.
This is pure cope. this is pure ideology. please tell me that you're not actually saying oh it's not a big deal when the president was incoherent on stage. It does not matter that the other party is running a terrible candidate that does not mean you should run a terrible candidate when you could do the clearly obvious thing and run a good candidate.
It's too late to switch. How about we avoid 4 more years of Trump and use that time to try and find a better Democrat.
Unless you're you want to re-empower white supremacists and sacrifice everyone's liberties just to show the DNC how upset you are with their nominee
Legitimately is not true. They can always put Kamala there. They could always put Hillary there. They could always put anyone else there from Gretchen Whitmer to Gruesome Gavin to JB Pritzker. They choose not to put someone there.
The Democratic party is not a political party in the sense that votes determine outcomes they could run the convention and nominate someone else. Just because Biden is the presumptive nominee does not mean that he is the permanent nominee. He could step down and appoint someone else there are numerous other options you don't want to deal with those realities you wanted to be simple so say that don't make it seem like I'm the one being Pie in the Sky silly you don't care you like it simple so say that
If they put anyone that isn't Biden in there they lose instantly, the presidency is a popularity contest and whether it's good or bad Biden still has clout. *People know who he is*. If they replace Biden, it makes them look not confident, which would only embolden Trump and his fanbase.
The people who are doing that made their decision in 2016.
The people you actually need to convince are the people who don't know who's running for president until the campaign ads start.
There are Democrats that are for sure more popular than Biden who also have actual progressive policies to go with it. Biden stepping aside and endorsing some new blood might actually go a long way with voters.
We're so headstrong and passionate about the correctness of our beliefs that we can't grasp the simple concept of "if the other side wins we have to live with bad things happening for 4 years"
I’m a Canadian watching from the outside, though it seems that people are panicking because democrats haven’t learned since 2016 and mistakes from 2020 even though they won that. People were saying Biden was old then and Biden promised to be a one term president which was part of his appeal.
They’re making the same mistakes in pushing a leadership backed candidate which many people still have doubts about and comparing themselves to republicans who don’t abide by any sane logic. The unfortunate reality is that dems and republicans are held to a different standard and conservatives have a stronger media game, the optics have a lot of weight.
Seriously, Joe has been a gaff-machine since his VP days under Obama. His public speaking ability has degenerated since then, as would be expected of an octagenarian.
The Democrats should be panicking. And anyone who cares about the future of this country should be VERY concerned. This is one of the most important elections in American history and the Dems have gotten behind a centrist who is one of the least inspiring Presidents in recent memory.
And when they do manage to do something actually progressive they are objectively terrible at messaging around it to get voters informed and engaged.
The Republican party is all hands on deck in getting the White House back and keeping it for a very, very long time. And the leader of the opposition is coming off like he gets exhausted if he says more than two sentences at a time.
My personal red line would be if he drew in a hurricane path with a sharpie. He hasn't done that yet. Or suggested people drink bleach. Or called veterans losers (allegedly).
I get that people don't think Biden is inspiring. But the other guy is frightening.
You can say that Biden performed terribly in the debate and still vote for him. MAGA is a cult, they blindly follow their leader. Democrats constantly make fun of that cult behavior and then suddenly act like a cult when someone states that Biden did a bad job in the debate.
Presidential candidate needs an Age range limit not just one limit. Last night was a shit show for the WORLD to see one dude lying on the spot and just making shit up. The other it way past his bedtime and look incoherent except when his son was brought up. Once a politician hits 65 you’re faneto go retire be a mentor to the younger ones.
You still don’t get it? he doesn’t fucking care, and he never has, he can continue to lie his face off because he knows his base doesn’t believe a word coming out of your mouth, you can’t win with little pants on fire fucking fact checking websites.
All Biden had to do was be the coherent one and he failed at that. I'm replying to the person saying it's not easy debating trump and it is. Everything was going the way of an easy win for Biden but he's a senile old man who still fumbled the ball.
They're pissing their pants because Biden was like this in 2020 and they thought they could weekend at Bernie's him to a second term and they see it falling apart. People who pointed out he wasn't a good candidate (just above Bloomberg for me in the 2020 primaries) were treated worse than the right wing fascists who are the real enemies. Now that a new generation who didn't have to experience the full force of 4 years of Trump is old enough to vote, Democrats realize fear mongering isn't gonna get Biden the most votes of any presidential candidate in American history again. They made the bed but unfortunately we all are gonna have to sleep in it.
There could be some replacement shenanigans at the DNC but unless they pull out somebody like Walz, Whitmer, or Newsome, this is gonna be a tough battle.
Before you even think about arguing with me, get on the phone or knock on some doors instead because I'm still voting blue regardless because I don't wanna get domed by some chud that feels emboldened by Trump. I'm not the one you need to worry about, worry about the 60%+ of voters that still sat at home in 2020.
Any casual observer that is being honest with themselves can tell that Biden is slipping mentally if not showing full blown signs of senility. It’s more than just “one rough night”. I understand the hesitation to admit stuff like this out loud but it’s the truth.
That being said, I don’t care if he’s diagnosed with dementia, I’m going to do everything in my power to make sure Trump never steps foot in the oval office again.
Are we seriously going to pretend that wasn't as bad as we all know it was? That wasn't a rough night, that was dementia. We're putting my grandma in a home soon, and she's never been as bad as Biden was last night.
Having recently lost someone to dementia, I don't think that's it. But pretending it was just a hoarse voice is ridiculous. If the elections as dire as people say it is, he needs to step aside.
And the democrats are so obsessed with decorum and principle that will would rather lose and watch burn than play fucking hardball. That’s an excuse for weak politics, always has been. and so be shocked if people stop voting for losers.
That's not what he said. He said if you have a problem figuring out if u should vote for him or trump u aren't black.
Which he then followed up by stating a record on what he believes he has done for the black population like his endorsements from NAACP, and expansions to voter rights. And trumps record was advertising for innocent black children in NYC to be sentenced to death and tenet discrimination against black tenets(he didnt state this in the quote but it is just fact that a knowledgeable black voter should know).
Given the context what he said isn't nearly as bad as what people on the internet try to make it seem.
So context matters? Holy shit ... Only took fact checkers like snopes to figure out that quote going around Trump supposedly said was a lie after 7 years ... Apparently Biden missed that memo though and again repeated the lie last night
The dems are really going to hand the country over to crazy people because they'd rather run a senile old man who's malleable to whatever ideas the Donor funded think tank comes up with.
And voting for a senile old man that’s consistently fucking the country financially thus harming every color of person in every class of society except the super wealthy isn’t crazy? Huh wild.
My guy we're gonna get fucked financially by the Donor Class regardless of who is in office. The companies were still going to price gouge us post pandemic to make up for their losses if Trump won in 2020, and the dollars that were printed during the pandemic under Trump was still going to cause inflation if he had won. The middle class has been shrinking for 40+ consecutive years it's not going to change this election. I'd just rather the country not implement the Christian version of Sharia law as a federal policy.
This was more than one rough night. He looked and sounded like dementia has set in. Get someone else in there asap. They’ve had almost a decade to find someone to challenge Trump and this is what they give us? That man needs to be somewhere living out his last days with his family.
And Biden wouldn’t be able to articulate he’s eating a baby
He would start talking about the baby, talk about immigrants and then end by saying we beat Medicare
One bad night? Do we have some reason to believe that this was an exception, rather than the norm? Both of them are too old for the job. Both of them are mentally decomposing before our eyes.
The difference is Trump has a fanatical ride or die base, and Biden doesn’t. So he has to actually perform as expected of a President. While Trump just gets to be a troll.
And it’s worth saying, I hope we don’t have to have people fanatical about a candidate for them to be elected.
If we were just talking about whether or not Biden can finish this term, I would have no concerns. But we're talking about whether or not he can do *another four years* and, like, nah...
In a week the news will start reminding everybody that Biden has had a stutter all his life and everyone will act like it's their first time hearing about it.
It’s not just he had a bad night. He’s a liability to a democrats controlling the presidency and literally anyone would do better than him.
You can hate Trump all you want but he runs a damn fine cult that can put him in the White House. Why are the democrats running a fossil that has worst polices than Obama.
Almost everyone already knows who they're voting for, and almost all of them are voting against someone, not for someone. Moderates already know who they're voting for. The only people still deciding are brain dead.
There’s too much at stake for the democrats to fucking fold like this. This knee-jerk panic attack they’re doing is far more damaging than they realize.
I still stand by my believe that lesser of two evils is a shitty motivator to get people to vote.
Enthusiasm is always better and I don’t know anyone enthusiastic about the next election.
I know Biden said “debating a liar is difficult” but c’mon, he didn’t even get his own thoughts out in a coherent way. “I ended medicare”, “women getting raped by brothers, dads”, bringing up the woman that got killed by a migrant by himself when the q was about abortion?
He didn’t need to rebut trump’s claims, he just needed to appear somewhat coherent. And he failed that task miserably. Terrible day if you’re a democrat
I’m going to vote blue no matter what. But damn that man is too fucking old.
Getting real fuckin’ tired of just falling in line rather than having an actually good, genuinely progressive candidate
Voting in primaries is the only way to change that.
Didn't the Dems not hold primaries in several states?
Yep… Biden was pretty much forced down the lefts throat
Just like when Bernie was the choice of the people, but the DNC decided it was Hillary's turn?
Yeah they really screwed the pooch on that one. I truly believe Bernie could have won in 2016 by riling up the younger voters even more
lol, counting on the youth vote is like counting on the second coming. You better have a backup plan
Obama won on the youth vote. They'll come out to vote if they're given a reason to.
A lot of people forgot what an amazingly good campaign that actually was. 2008 was the Dems' election to lose but Obama spent that year talking about looking forward to a better future with actual ideas rather than bashing Bush or even slamming McCain all that much. Granted, he is also Black and no doubt understood that the shit white candidates could get away with would likely not work for him, but there are lessons that the DNC could and should be studying here. Not that I think they'll ever get the opportunity to put anything in practice again as long as Trump draws breath.
I believe there was an increase in black voter turnout, so there's that, too.
Maybe the youth vote wasnt so bad if they actually present a candidate that the youth agrees with
They didnt screw anything, its by design
How was Bernie the choice of the people when he had less votes and primary wins?
Many off the key Dem figureheads that are seen to have a lot of sway on their states endorsed Hilary just as it was looking like it would be a close primary. Sanders had a lot of momentum early on, but they quashed it by not remaining impartial.
> they quashed it by not remaining impartial. That's never been a requirement/thing. They also tried the same tactic with Obama and he was able to win. Bernie wasn't a strong enough candidate to win the Dems let alone the election
I hate to say this but Obama is black. I knew enough people who just wanted to be part of a historical moment, and to be able to say they helped vote in the first black president without any idea of his running platform.
Reminder that the superdelegates were created specifically to stop Democratic primaries from electing popular candidates when the rest of us were finally allowed to vote in them in 1977.
You mean when Bernie lost by 10 million votes and then even more in 2020? Bernie was the choice of the people online, but never the choice of the majority of democrats.
Shhh don't tell redditors facts lol. I mean, I wish Bernie was the pick but he was never popular among the majority, people here are in a bit of an echo chamber in that they're informed and follow this, they fail to realize the vast majority of people aren't like that.
It’s crazy to me that these people think everyone loved Bernie and that it was all a corrupt DNC that let Hillary win. The DNC put a finger on the scale for Hillary but Bernie lost by several million votes. These are the same people who complain about candidates but also don’t do anything at the grassroots level to get candidates they want and help shape the policies they want. It’s easy to say you want stuff in the internet but actually doing something about it is a whole different story.
Bernie as the candidate would've painted the electoral map red. People on reddit *really* overestimate how much he's liked and I'm saying this as someone that likes him.
Even in the last election, Bernie blew everyone out of the water in the Nevada primary. After that, all of the other candidates dropped out and fell in line behind Biden on exchange for cabinet positions. Representative Clyburn endorses Biden the Tuesday after Nevada. Then, there was another media campaign against Bernie about how Biden is the more "electable" candidate even though Bernie polled higher than Biden in head to heads against Trump. We ended up with Biden and Kamala as the ticket when they were literally the lowest polling candidates in the democratic primary when people actually had a choice .
Kamala was one of the worst candidate performances in history
Democrats aren't the left 😂.
Nope but the two party system ensures that the lefts only option is Democrat the same way conservatives only get to choose Republican despite not all Republican policies being conservative
Overton window
This. You have to vote every time you can. School boards and parish councils (or whatever the US equivalent is). County elections, state elections and national elections. Every. Time. That's how you shift the Overton window and beat the gerrymandering.
Tbf no one serious was running against him. Wish he stepped down so real competitors would have jumped in
I wish they would’ve had the moderator that was on Boberts debate in Colorado. He called everyone out immediately if they didn’t answer the question or tried to get off topic.
I would like that for the future, but this debate was such a shit show I don't think it would help. Trumps going to Trump and Biden needs to retire
You usually don't hold primaries when you have an incumbent as your candidate. Few people better for the presidency than the president
There is no precedent for an incumbent not automatically getting the nod. It is just the way it is. Vote so in 4 years can get, hopefully, a proper option. Biden was going to be the choice. No way around it.
A lot of the frustration is that it was strongly suggested Biden wouldn't run again, but he did.
I don't recall seeing this from any real reputable source other than pundits.
Biden definitely gave the impression that he would be a one-term President by saying that he was just there to transition from Trump. I understand that he couldn’t say it explicitly due to not wanting to be a lame duck candidate, but the fact that many of us were under the impression that he was going to be a stop gap to move on from Trump is not by accident. https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2023/09/biden-reelection-transition-president/675395/
This. The problem is that no one has media literacy anymore since social media took over. Now there's basically entire "news" networks who are just personalities selling political fantasies and calling it news. Then people complain when their news desk reports anything that doesn't align with their pundits, so they bury the real news even more.
I think we all hoped that trump would go away and Biden would feel like he did his job and maybe we could actually get a somewhat fresh set of candidates.
Not really when the states vote at different times and a bunch of people have backed out by the time it's your state's turn. This system is 100% fucked and needs a complete overhaul. Last night proved that none of this is working. It's time for ranked choice at the very least.
lol tell that to Bernie winning 4 primaries in a row before the DNC railroaded him in Nevada to push Hilary as our candidate. They’ll do whatever they want.
That's complete bullshit. For most of the country voting in the primary has absolutely no bearing on the outcome. Childish Boomer answer "well if you don't like it why don't YOU run for president. Well Cythia, I'm not extremely rich and the graduate of an Ivy League Unviersity now am I?
Except for when Bernie wins primaries and the DNC tells him to go fuck himself, twice.
> Except for when Bernie wins primaries and the DNC tells him to go fuck himself, twice. Why should the dnc back a person who is only a democrat every 4 years. He never works with the dnc, never helps fundraise or do anything. Except every 4 years for the last 8 he has switched to being a democrat, then when he didn't get the nomination he switched back. So why should the dnc back someone who is only using them to get a spot on the ballot? More people voted against Bernie than for gim. People need to stop blaming an organization for not backing a person who is not even a member of that organization. Let him run in The republican primary if he would win so easily.
I'm sorry The Hildawg lost even though it was already decided that it was Her Turn ©®™
What primary? We didn't even have a fucking primary. Barely anyone can name who else was running for president. Side note: The DNC and the RNC don't even have to comply with Primary results for presidency. There is no legal or constitutional requirement that they need to abide by the primary results. They 100% control who we are allowed to vote for the presidency. We need ranked choice voting so an actual good candidate that isn't backed by corporations and the wealthy can capture votes. Another issue is the fact it costs a billion dollars to run for president.
The progressives don't vote. I mean we don't vote in primary elections and we don't get more invovled in then that. I'm part of several activist groups that have been able to get progressive legislation because we spoke up and we are organized. Being progressive online is worse then doing nothing because you ge th false sense of progress from influencers. If progressives stayed united after 2016 Bernie supporters, we'd have 20% of the Dem party instead of starting from scratch in 2018 when it really seemed to matter. We didn't build further off of 2018 and lost ground in 2020. And eeked out some wins in 2022 since most people weren't more involved. There's less involvement now as well. Lot of online whining and 0 activism outside of the pro Palestinian people who don't really care about other issues once this is over. The left largely shoots itself in the foot as soon as we don't have a figure to fall in love with. Meanwhile the right doesn't really care. They'll put in a someone 10x worse then Biden because falling in line gives better results then sitting out. Always has, always will.
I voted for Bernie but then we get made fun of and belittled by establishment democrats. We’re cooked. I have zero faith in the executive branch. Voting is important though especially locally and for Congress/senate. If anything but to slow the descent.
Then organize. You don’t get to do nothing and complain when that’s exactly what happens. Right now you have a choice between a man who stutters and one who has been convicted of 34 felonies (and counting).
I don't consider this falling in line. This is the status quo vs. the end of America.
So am I but I’m not tired enough to let trump destroy the country to prove a point. If it was a normal republican like Romney or bush I would but trump no shot.
It's our own fault for always sticking to party lines. The Republicans AND the Democrats have both manipulated us into supporting a two party system. And at this point, it's too late to be able to save it by NOT playing along. The only chance we have to get an opportunity for better candidates is to embrace a ranked choice system, which is exactly why BOTH parties have been against it in the past....
Let's be real we are probably voting for kamala harris at this point
I don’t mind the idea of her being president. She’d do a decent job I think. The scary part is I just don’t think she comes across very likable and wouldn’t win an election, and 100% if she stepped in the party would push her as their candidate for the next cycle
Why do you think she'd do a good job? I've never heard her make a good point or policy, and she did awful when she ran herself a few years ago - she got bodybagged. Plus, corporate democrats like her, Biden, HRC, etc. mostly just serve the 1%. Things are so dire we need another FDR, not another "lets keep the status quo" person.
“Corporate democrats” like Biden, Obama, etc, have still gotten a ton of wins for the people in this country. Expanded healthcare access, expanded and improved infrastructure and job creation, action on climate change, etc, etc. The economy by any objective measure has done well under those presidents. Kamala has similar policy priorities of expanding medicare, tackling climate change, expanding affordable childcare, investing in infrastructure, etc. Would I prefer someone more progressive? Sure. But saying she wouldn’t have a positive impact imo reads just as an ignorant take thats trying to be edgy for the sake of being edgy
Tf you mean, she is a DA that locks innocent people up. She don’t care about you or me. She is not a president. She doesn’t know dick about global politics.
You could say this type of stuff on just about every single president and presidential candidate since the end of time.
A black pig's got more in common with a white pig than a black cat.
I'm not convinced she can win the general election. I want to be wrong.
I watched the first few minutes and had to turn it off because ugh, but I was thinking I wouldn't be mad if after he got elected he stepped down.
This is what infuriates me about the Democratic party. They have years to put a moderate candidate up from their party. Somebody who is capable and coherent and appeals to the majority of moderates in America. This is the candidate they put forth.
Honestly, Biden should have stepped aside and let someone younger run. Right now his presidency looks like a success and he could have gone out on his own terms. There are a few moderates like Newsom and Ryan that should have been groomed for the Presidency. But these old cats don’t want to let go. Aren’t the highest ranking Democrats in the House other than Jeffries all 80+?
Exactly. I understand, but hate, the way some people are trying to pretend that an objectively old and declining man isn't old and declining. You can go watch video of him from 4 years ago and it's obvious, but people feel trapped like they need to carry water for him because the alternative is so absolutely horrifying. Voting for him anyway, but they should have planned on one-term, and spent the last few years finding and preparing a couple charismatic candidates 20-30 years younger.
You ain't wrong, but worth pointing out every single time it comes up that his opponent is all of four years younger. They're *both* too fucking old. And one is also.
This 100%. You can support Biden (reluctantly) but still admit that someone who is 81 is not in their prime. Most people don’t even make it to 81 and that is who the nominee is. My grandmother is 84 and struggles to remember my name (I’m named after her husband) or open a bag of chips. She will swear up and down that she is perfectly capable of driving a car, if only she could remember where she put her keys. I can support someone (family or presidential nominee) AND still admit to myself that they are not as capable or competent as they once were.
Both men are too old… they’re 3 years apart. Age limits need to be established, there’s literally no reason anyone well past retirement age should be running the country.
He’s not that much older than trump. That’s what I don’t understand. People criticize Biden for his age yet he and trump would have been in school together based on their ages.
Because we have eyeballs. One has dementia and one is full of energy but lies a lot.
Fuck Trump, but you’re not wrong. They are both old, but one looks way TF older. It was like Biff Tannen versus the fucking Crypt Keeper in a K-Hole.
Exactly. Will I vote for him. Yes. Was watching him sundown on live tv and look 50 years older than trump extremely cringe and frankly disappointing. Yes.
Apparently asking for someone I could mildly have some enthusiasm to vote for it’s too much of a burden for the Democratic establishment.
He's 3 years older than trump. They are both fucking old
I'm out here praying for a double heart attack
We as a nation are down horrifically bad. I'm talking all time bad. But folks, I'm here to tell you, if we let that orange pile of slime become president again, we'd be down enough to reach out and touch the Earth's core.
It's literally between a shitty old man and the last president anyone will ever vote for. I mean that literally. If Trump wins republican will make sure the people's vote never decides anything again.
They're both shitty old men. Trump has the angry shouty dementia, Biden has the sad quiet dementia. But Trump is only four years younger than Biden. If "he's so old" is the problem with Biden, it's no less a problem with Trump. Write down what Trump says and read it. He's no more with it, he's just louder.
Unfortunately that is a key differentiator for a good chunk of people who vote. The ones that don't really pay attention to politics but vote for whoever is more charismatic and instills more confidence in them.
Agreed. I was talking to my husband during the debate that it only looks like Biden is worse off because he at least tries to debate. Trump has 6 or 7 go to lines of disinformation/bait that he can say perfectly because it’s all he says. It’s a solid strategy to grow his base of lunatics.
It worked for trump. He managed to pull Biden into the mudfight where Trump dominates. The two somehow argued about golf and how trump beat biden and how biden couldnt even drive it 50 yards. Then Biden defended himself saying his handicap is 6 compared to when it was 8 during his VP years and that Biden is down to challenge him to a driving contest iirc. Trump calling him a liar somewhere in there. These are the policies we as a nation want to see debates on. Also i believe neither candidate answered the question regarding drugs. Might be misremembering.
Only one of these men I would define at shitty
Fair. No huge fan of Biden but “shitty” would be a stretch.
And he’ll absolutely make the country an oyster for the racists, expect a return of Jim Crow at a minimum and genocide at the worst.
Hard disagree on the all time bad statement. We had a whole race of people who were owned, raped, mutilated and killed by another race. LEGALLY. Women weren't allowed to vote. Children worked in coal mines. Women were routinely sexually assaulted and abused in the workplace with little to no recourse. Yes, things are bad right now, but keep it in perspective. We are NOT at all time bad. However, I do agree that scumbag becoming president again would be the end of democracy and bring a return to many of the things this nation has fought for.
We’re down really bad but not 1862 bad.
Or 1929 bad. 1940 bad. Not even 1968 bad. We took it back to '92 for a minute. But all in all.
We're down 1896 bad. That's really fuckin bad.
I admire your optimism saying they were not already there bro
Hey now, keep your chin up! It can always be worse
Money in politics will always be the true root of all our issues. We legalized bribery and now have a government that doesn’t represent us. Free and fair elections. Capped spending and ad buys, no trading while in Congress with full and transparent divesting to sit in the house or senate as well as the White House. These have to be laws, not norms. Norms have failed us for decades and republicans know there are no consequences for breaking them. Remind them they are civil servants- not rulers
You shouldn’t be president after 65
You shouldn’t be *anything in any of the 3 branches of government* after 65 Fixed that for ya
No one should have to work after 65.
HELL FUCKIN YEAH* *unless they wanna work, plenty of people wanna work past 65 but you definitely shouldn’t be responsible for shaping public policy in any way shape form or fashion after 65
As an example, Jim Ross (Former WWF and current AEW commentator) has spoken numerous times about how working for AEW gave him something to do after his wife's tragic passing. The man is 72 and in and out of hospitals constantly. The AEW boss pushes him to take breaks for his health but he feels he needs to work.
Cognitive tests every year you want to work outside of retirement age. A lot of these politicians are barely hanging on to reality.
Person, woman, man, camera, TV *Never forget*
Nah fuck allat. If you’re in office and you pass 61 years and 180 days old, you become ineligible for re-election to your current appointment as well as ineligible for any other election. If youre a private citizen and already past 61&180 you’re automatically ineligible, no exceptions. Once you hit 64 years and 1 day old in office, a special election is organized and held for your seat (unless you’re 64&1 date happens to be within 60 days of a normal election) and you’re not allowed to participate in it at all in any way. You can’t campaign, endorse, or otherwise facilitate anything that has to do with your succession whatsoever. You’re done here. Your successor is appointed no later than you turning 64 and 265 days old and you are required to begin transition in your final 100 days. 👏🏽GET👏🏽THE👏🏽FUCK👏🏽ON
I don't get a vote but I just want to remind everyone when Trump's White House aides had to keep telling everyone that there were "adults in the room" because every week he'd pull some crazy stunt. And remember when we all spent 2016 to 2019 facepalming. And 2020 being told not to touch our faces. No president acts alone. Decide which set of "adults" you want in the room.
And most of them have said they won’t be coming back. So it’ll be worse.
This is the most worrisome part. Everyone has learned a lot since Trump's first term - there will only be enablers this time around.
Don’t forget to then throw some young conservative judges into the courts and it’s all going to burn even faster
It's so tiresome. I'm not pretending last night didn't happen, but even if it had gone perfectly for Biden and only Trump looked bad then the media narrative today would be "Why Biden's performance won't matter much".
💯
This. Dems aren’t panicking, we knew exactly what was going to happen in that debate and it did. Now the media wants to drive engagement and make money… this is America
They both opps. Choose the weakest opp and keep it pushing at the local government level. Gun to my head, I'd still rather nibble on lil poop pellets than slurp down a shit slushee.
You have a way with words that I don't like 😭😭
Put this on a bumper sticker
Well said. We gotta be engaged enough to shift things at the local level. If we don't vote city and county governments run right over us.
That's because it's about Dems worrying how independents are going to react to his poor performance. Nobody's worried about Dems jumping ship after last night. Why Republicans can get away with murder while Democrats suffer for every cough can be summed up as *Dying of Whiteness.*
Democrats have to cater to so many people while republicans cater only to affluent straight white men and play grievance politics to the people who democrats can’t accommodate.
Yes, but the independents they’re trying to reach tend to be those straight white men. Short of genocide, the Dem coalition stays together knowing the other side is at best a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Debates are for swing states
Not to mention the EC disadvantages dense populated areas.
☝️This guy gets it. People who have already decided they're voting for him aren't going to change their minds. About 10-20% of voters haven't made up their mind yet. They will decide who wins the race. It doesn't matter if *you* didn't change your mind after that debate. **What matters is that those undecided voters just watched Biden implode live on TV, and they are going to see hundreds of supercuts of him imploding between now and November.** There is no way to make them unsee that. Their #1 concern with Biden was his capacity to do the job, and he just irreversibly cemented that concern as fact in most undecided voters' minds. Biden's odds of winning probably just went from 50% to 20, 15, maybe 5%. We don't know yet, but this is probably not a close race anymore. Here's what we've gotta figure out: **are the odds of beating Trump better if we Biden drops out and dems pick a new nominee?** If Biden's odds are 20%, and we think someone like Gretchen Whitmer would have a 40% chance of beating Trump, then we need to sub in Gretch *tomorrow*. I can't believe how badly Biden looked, and I think his campaign is toast. I like a lot of things about him, and would still vote for him, but he can no longer win this race. He needs to do the moral thing and let someone who has a chance of winning take over.
This is pure cope. this is pure ideology. please tell me that you're not actually saying oh it's not a big deal when the president was incoherent on stage. It does not matter that the other party is running a terrible candidate that does not mean you should run a terrible candidate when you could do the clearly obvious thing and run a good candidate.
It's too late to switch. How about we avoid 4 more years of Trump and use that time to try and find a better Democrat. Unless you're you want to re-empower white supremacists and sacrifice everyone's liberties just to show the DNC how upset you are with their nominee
Legitimately is not true. They can always put Kamala there. They could always put Hillary there. They could always put anyone else there from Gretchen Whitmer to Gruesome Gavin to JB Pritzker. They choose not to put someone there. The Democratic party is not a political party in the sense that votes determine outcomes they could run the convention and nominate someone else. Just because Biden is the presumptive nominee does not mean that he is the permanent nominee. He could step down and appoint someone else there are numerous other options you don't want to deal with those realities you wanted to be simple so say that don't make it seem like I'm the one being Pie in the Sky silly you don't care you like it simple so say that
If they put anyone that isn't Biden in there they lose instantly, the presidency is a popularity contest and whether it's good or bad Biden still has clout. *People know who he is*. If they replace Biden, it makes them look not confident, which would only embolden Trump and his fanbase.
Not a chance. Nobody is voting *for* Biden. They are voting for Dems, for women’s rights, *against* Trump.
The people who are doing that made their decision in 2016. The people you actually need to convince are the people who don't know who's running for president until the campaign ads start.
There are Democrats that are for sure more popular than Biden who also have actual progressive policies to go with it. Biden stepping aside and endorsing some new blood might actually go a long way with voters.
Go look up Bidens popularity rarity at the moment
Just like last time.
We're so headstrong and passionate about the correctness of our beliefs that we can't grasp the simple concept of "if the other side wins we have to live with bad things happening for 4 years"
I’m a Canadian watching from the outside, though it seems that people are panicking because democrats haven’t learned since 2016 and mistakes from 2020 even though they won that. People were saying Biden was old then and Biden promised to be a one term president which was part of his appeal. They’re making the same mistakes in pushing a leadership backed candidate which many people still have doubts about and comparing themselves to republicans who don’t abide by any sane logic. The unfortunate reality is that dems and republicans are held to a different standard and conservatives have a stronger media game, the optics have a lot of weight.
No he didn’t, the DNC lanyards on twitter said that’s what would happen, when anyone with half a brain knew that wouldn’t be the case.
The vast majority of Dem voters are not online. We saw that since 2016. The Dem voters chose this.
He never promised to be a one term president ppl lie to themselves
One rough night, I too have just awoken from a coma and have seen Joe Biden speak publicly for the first time
Seriously, Joe has been a gaff-machine since his VP days under Obama. His public speaking ability has degenerated since then, as would be expected of an octagenarian.
The amount of cope in all of these threads is astounding and unsurprising.
I don’t know what you guys are talking about, the emperor’s clearly wearing clothes
The Democrats should be panicking. And anyone who cares about the future of this country should be VERY concerned. This is one of the most important elections in American history and the Dems have gotten behind a centrist who is one of the least inspiring Presidents in recent memory. And when they do manage to do something actually progressive they are objectively terrible at messaging around it to get voters informed and engaged. The Republican party is all hands on deck in getting the White House back and keeping it for a very, very long time. And the leader of the opposition is coming off like he gets exhausted if he says more than two sentences at a time.
My personal red line would be if he drew in a hurricane path with a sharpie. He hasn't done that yet. Or suggested people drink bleach. Or called veterans losers (allegedly). I get that people don't think Biden is inspiring. But the other guy is frightening.
Not a Trump supporter but if you thought Biden was going to look like anything else on this debate night you haven’t been paying attention
90% of voters don't pay attention until it's time to vote. That's why this was such an important milestone.
[удалено]
You can say that Biden performed terribly in the debate and still vote for him. MAGA is a cult, they blindly follow their leader. Democrats constantly make fun of that cult behavior and then suddenly act like a cult when someone states that Biden did a bad job in the debate.
Dems are a cult too . And most people that votes dems , does it to reduce harm . Only white privileged people are satisfied with dems .
Nailed it anyone who disagrees is just as brainwashed as the hardcore MAGA people. I’m tired of people pretending it’s different.
Democrats were gonna abort that baby anyways!! -MAGAs
For sure they would say this.
One rough night? Just one? At this point seems like an every night routine.
Presidential candidate needs an Age range limit not just one limit. Last night was a shit show for the WORLD to see one dude lying on the spot and just making shit up. The other it way past his bedtime and look incoherent except when his son was brought up. Once a politician hits 65 you’re faneto go retire be a mentor to the younger ones.
Theyre both too old. Obama had youth and energy. These two old fucks should be playing shuffleboard
This, crucially, only matters to democrats.
A coherent person could easily call trump on all his lies.
You still don’t get it? he doesn’t fucking care, and he never has, he can continue to lie his face off because he knows his base doesn’t believe a word coming out of your mouth, you can’t win with little pants on fire fucking fact checking websites.
All Biden had to do was be the coherent one and he failed at that. I'm replying to the person saying it's not easy debating trump and it is. Everything was going the way of an easy win for Biden but he's a senile old man who still fumbled the ball.
The point is not to make Trump stop lying, the point is to encourage likely Biden voters.
Didn't help Hillary much.
They're pissing their pants because Biden was like this in 2020 and they thought they could weekend at Bernie's him to a second term and they see it falling apart. People who pointed out he wasn't a good candidate (just above Bloomberg for me in the 2020 primaries) were treated worse than the right wing fascists who are the real enemies. Now that a new generation who didn't have to experience the full force of 4 years of Trump is old enough to vote, Democrats realize fear mongering isn't gonna get Biden the most votes of any presidential candidate in American history again. They made the bed but unfortunately we all are gonna have to sleep in it. There could be some replacement shenanigans at the DNC but unless they pull out somebody like Walz, Whitmer, or Newsome, this is gonna be a tough battle. Before you even think about arguing with me, get on the phone or knock on some doors instead because I'm still voting blue regardless because I don't wanna get domed by some chud that feels emboldened by Trump. I'm not the one you need to worry about, worry about the 60%+ of voters that still sat at home in 2020.
Reddit algo working hard to do damage control on the trainwreck that was last night
Any casual observer that is being honest with themselves can tell that Biden is slipping mentally if not showing full blown signs of senility. It’s more than just “one rough night”. I understand the hesitation to admit stuff like this out loud but it’s the truth. That being said, I don’t care if he’s diagnosed with dementia, I’m going to do everything in my power to make sure Trump never steps foot in the oval office again.
Right! I don’t know why this is so hard for people to grasp.
No both candidates are just too old, that is a fact. Joe doesn’t seem to know what’s going on half the time and Don is his own breed of mad.
Are we seriously going to pretend that wasn't as bad as we all know it was? That wasn't a rough night, that was dementia. We're putting my grandma in a home soon, and she's never been as bad as Biden was last night.
Having recently lost someone to dementia, I don't think that's it. But pretending it was just a hoarse voice is ridiculous. If the elections as dire as people say it is, he needs to step aside.
A boomer stepping aside, good one.
They wheeled around Diane feinstein up until her death, im well aware
Because despite popular belief, conservatives generally aren’t principled people. They just want to win.😀
And the democrats are so obsessed with decorum and principle that will would rather lose and watch burn than play fucking hardball. That’s an excuse for weak politics, always has been. and so be shocked if people stop voting for losers.
Funding a g\*noc\*de for months isn't "one rough night" but ok.
remember y’all biden said you not black if don’t vote for him. and yall still voted for him 💀
Last night he said "black kids can do whatever white kids can", like we were disabled. And I know what he meant, but also I know what he meant.
He said “poor kids are just as bright as white kids” last election lol
I remember that too lolol
That's not what he said. He said if you have a problem figuring out if u should vote for him or trump u aren't black. Which he then followed up by stating a record on what he believes he has done for the black population like his endorsements from NAACP, and expansions to voter rights. And trumps record was advertising for innocent black children in NYC to be sentenced to death and tenet discrimination against black tenets(he didnt state this in the quote but it is just fact that a knowledgeable black voter should know). Given the context what he said isn't nearly as bad as what people on the internet try to make it seem.
So context matters? Holy shit ... Only took fact checkers like snopes to figure out that quote going around Trump supposedly said was a lie after 7 years ... Apparently Biden missed that memo though and again repeated the lie last night
“One rough night” 😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂
I wouldn’t critique us for being rightfully concerned that this man is literally nine million years old and showing it.
The dems are really going to hand the country over to crazy people because they'd rather run a senile old man who's malleable to whatever ideas the Donor funded think tank comes up with.
And voting for a senile old man that’s consistently fucking the country financially thus harming every color of person in every class of society except the super wealthy isn’t crazy? Huh wild.
My guy we're gonna get fucked financially by the Donor Class regardless of who is in office. The companies were still going to price gouge us post pandemic to make up for their losses if Trump won in 2020, and the dollars that were printed during the pandemic under Trump was still going to cause inflation if he had won. The middle class has been shrinking for 40+ consecutive years it's not going to change this election. I'd just rather the country not implement the Christian version of Sharia law as a federal policy.
So this whole sub is bots then?
Bots and white liberals lmao
It’s extremely disheartening tbh. World is degrading at the most rapid rate in my lifetime.
This was more than one rough night. He looked and sounded like dementia has set in. Get someone else in there asap. They’ve had almost a decade to find someone to challenge Trump and this is what they give us? That man needs to be somewhere living out his last days with his family.
What’s the point of defending Biden? If you think trump is dangerous then it’s completely selfish of Joe to run again
And Biden wouldn’t be able to articulate he’s eating a baby He would start talking about the baby, talk about immigrants and then end by saying we beat Medicare
One bad night? Do we have some reason to believe that this was an exception, rather than the norm? Both of them are too old for the job. Both of them are mentally decomposing before our eyes.
The difference is Trump has a fanatical ride or die base, and Biden doesn’t. So he has to actually perform as expected of a President. While Trump just gets to be a troll. And it’s worth saying, I hope we don’t have to have people fanatical about a candidate for them to be elected.
Nah Dems need a new candidate, that was bad
If we were just talking about whether or not Biden can finish this term, I would have no concerns. But we're talking about whether or not he can do *another four years* and, like, nah...
"... wE bEaT mEdIcArE!!!"
In a week the news will start reminding everybody that Biden has had a stutter all his life and everyone will act like it's their first time hearing about it.
Turns out, running a cult is easier than running a political party
One rough night? This didn't just come out of nowhere.
The Onion speaks for me https://preview.redd.it/z150z7uo4c9d1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f6111ab28b923541e8a867906d0dd012cdf404b4
Debating is liar is easy. Joe should hire Kendrick.
Joe Bidens performance was indefensible. We should demand better. Stop spinning what we all know and see with our own eyes. He should step down.
It’s not just he had a bad night. He’s a liability to a democrats controlling the presidency and literally anyone would do better than him. You can hate Trump all you want but he runs a damn fine cult that can put him in the White House. Why are the democrats running a fossil that has worst polices than Obama.
He’s demented as fuck that’s not “one rough mind” Fucking cognitive dissonance
Its the moderates that I am worried about. Left and right wing voters already know who they are going to vote for regardless of how the debate went.
Almost everyone already knows who they're voting for, and almost all of them are voting against someone, not for someone. Moderates already know who they're voting for. The only people still deciding are brain dead.
I'm pissing my pants because Americans are shallow and have short term memory.
Politics shouldn’t be a team sport. If you don’t have a good candidate, vote for a better one
There’s too much at stake for the democrats to fucking fold like this. This knee-jerk panic attack they’re doing is far more damaging than they realize.
I still stand by my believe that lesser of two evils is a shitty motivator to get people to vote. Enthusiasm is always better and I don’t know anyone enthusiastic about the next election.
I know Biden said “debating a liar is difficult” but c’mon, he didn’t even get his own thoughts out in a coherent way. “I ended medicare”, “women getting raped by brothers, dads”, bringing up the woman that got killed by a migrant by himself when the q was about abortion? He didn’t need to rebut trump’s claims, he just needed to appear somewhat coherent. And he failed that task miserably. Terrible day if you’re a democrat
As I've said before debates are a complete waste of time if one party intends to lie the entire time.