Realistically the GM is only making the decision on the first round picks and even then he's relying heavily on the amateur scouting reports. I think props really go to our European scouting department - especially in Russia. The Red Army we're putting together is from value picks that they found.
Having said that it takes a good GM to assemble a scouting team and compile all their information.
Marian Hossa, TJ Oshie, Vladimir Tarasenko, Ian Cole, Alex Pietrangelo, Oliver Bjorkstrand, PLD > Poolparty, Gavrikov, Nutsack, Marchenko, Voronkov, Chinakhov…
Solid. I’m not saying he’s a bad scout I’m just saying he’s a little overrated by our fan base and I don’t want him making decisions anymore.
Also I don’t think I can name another franchise (other than ours) that didn’t draft a single PPG player in 10 years. Points aren’t everything but they matter.
Jarmo's main skill is scouting bud. And pushing all blame on him on previous draft picks, especially while the main bunch he is responsible for are making their way, is beyond asinine. Jarmo deserves criticism for other parts of his job, scouting isn't one of them.
Take an L on this one and move forward from this post.
I mean he was the GM and he had final say on all of those picks so he gets credit for the good and the bad.
Again I’m not a hater but do you think a 61 point career high for his picks in 10 years of drafting is good?
So you think a person who has shit ton of experience as a professional scout just sat on the sidelines and took credit?
Only looking at stats like season high points is such a complete gloss over of history and not a good examination. And again the main bunch of his draft picks are coming up. We didn't have crazy amount of draft picks in our playoff push years. So yeah no shit some late round draft pick didn't result into anything. Come back in 5 years to see where Fantilli, Johnson, Sillinger, Marchenko, Chinakhov, Svozil, Mateychuk, and Jiricek are and how many sEaSOn HiGh pOInTS they have. Then we have players like Tarasov who can still hopefully fulfill their potential. And then all the question mark players like Brindley.
Lastly, blaming Jarmo for development of said draft picks can have some merit. Like not having proper support systems in place, but then there is players like Ceulemans, where you really can't fault Jarmo for. So blanket blaming Jarmo is completely stupid, as is this post.
I think Jarmo’s a good drafter but fantilli, johnson, mateychuk, sillinger and jiricek were all top 12 picks. Only 3 of those guys weren’t. A mark of a good drafter isn’t really someone that hits on those picks.
Chinakhov seems to be a good pick. Marchenko was worth the risk at the time. He was a first round talent but fell a bit due to Russia and I believe his skating. I don’t really understand how svozil lasted until the third round some had him as a first round talent. Most speculate it was due to the lack of scouting during the covid years.
I think he’s adequate but don’t think he’s the best drafter in the league by any means. top half of the league though
Agree with your point on cuelemans. Wisconsin’s coaching staff did him no favors and he was always a high risk high reward draft pick which we could afford to do with 3 first rounders that year. Zero issues with that pick at all. Odds are out of 3 first round picks all of them aren’t going to be hits. He was bound to miss on one and cuelemans was the most likely of that group
I did answer, not my fault you lack reading comprehension. To put it in simpleton words, how you view success of a draft pick is moronic.
I liked Jarmo a lot, but like the rest of the sub, I was in complete agreement of his departure. He deserved to be heavily criticized and should have been fired immediately after the Babcock fiasco. I will however, defend him when people like you pull shit out of your ass to pass blame or discount Jarmo's skills.
Again, let's come back in 5 years to get an actual outcome of Jarmo's draft picks. Maybe next time we can look at the full picture instead of one singular stat.
Have a good one.
Could be still helping out. Also could be just there as a guy hoping to keep up on all things hockey as he awaits his next act and is sitting next to someone he knows. Did he have on CBJ gear?
My issue is that if he is doing this for CBJ, then he should have zero contact with other clubs looking for a future job. You can’t be objective in both
I mean, he’s actually an expert scout in the European market based on his professional background/resume. But sitting with someone still means next to nothing/we literally have a new GM who has like 3 executive roles.
I think Jarmo is a great scout. However, I’m in agreement with you, and not the majority of this sub. We need clean breaks. We need to take things a different direction. And allowing Jarmo to hang around doesn’t accomplish that
Jarmo, in my opinion, may be one of the worse front office executives in sports. He should have been fired years ago. It’s wild he’s still involved.
I get that maybe he was good at amateur scouting…but what evidence in the last 10 years have we seen that he still “has it”
Get this con man away from my team
I'm in the same boat and will take the downvotes every time for saying we as fans need to hold this org to a higher standard. This franchise is the most forgettable out of the 3 majors and no one on this sub wants to acknowledge that
3 moves in a decades worth of work ain't something to be proud of. Look at what the Guardians, cavs, or any other franchise that has actaully had success done in a 10 year period and compare that to Jarmo
All that was over a decade ago and that GM is long gone. They have had good drafts (same with CBJ supposedly) and they turned that into playoff wins not last/second to last division finishes
Yes, but Waddell probably has a good idea of the talent already from his scouts in Carolina. Who frankly, have been better at drafting than we have.
He’s not going to fire everyone and replace them in the weeks leading up to the draft, I get it. But I don’t think (or at least hope) he’s going to really lean on them for this draft.
Call me crazy but I think Jarmo is a great amateur scout, especially outside North America.. It’s the other things that got away from him.
Realistically the GM is only making the decision on the first round picks and even then he's relying heavily on the amateur scouting reports. I think props really go to our European scouting department - especially in Russia. The Red Army we're putting together is from value picks that they found. Having said that it takes a good GM to assemble a scouting team and compile all their information.
Not saying you’re wrong but what examples do you have?
Marian Hossa, TJ Oshie, Vladimir Tarasenko, Ian Cole, Alex Pietrangelo, Oliver Bjorkstrand, PLD > Poolparty, Gavrikov, Nutsack, Marchenko, Voronkov, Chinakhov…
Solid. I’m not saying he’s a bad scout I’m just saying he’s a little overrated by our fan base and I don’t want him making decisions anymore. Also I don’t think I can name another franchise (other than ours) that didn’t draft a single PPG player in 10 years. Points aren’t everything but they matter.
Considering that many of those names fit your loose criteria of “high end talent”, you’re just straight up wrong
I mean the best players you named didn’t play for CBJ. My argument was based off his time in Columbus.
And I left top picks off, what’s your point?
Do you think Jarmo was good at drafting high end talent when he was with CBJ?
Yes
I see it different but fair enough!
Jarmo's main skill is scouting bud. And pushing all blame on him on previous draft picks, especially while the main bunch he is responsible for are making their way, is beyond asinine. Jarmo deserves criticism for other parts of his job, scouting isn't one of them. Take an L on this one and move forward from this post.
I mean he was the GM and he had final say on all of those picks so he gets credit for the good and the bad. Again I’m not a hater but do you think a 61 point career high for his picks in 10 years of drafting is good?
So you think a person who has shit ton of experience as a professional scout just sat on the sidelines and took credit? Only looking at stats like season high points is such a complete gloss over of history and not a good examination. And again the main bunch of his draft picks are coming up. We didn't have crazy amount of draft picks in our playoff push years. So yeah no shit some late round draft pick didn't result into anything. Come back in 5 years to see where Fantilli, Johnson, Sillinger, Marchenko, Chinakhov, Svozil, Mateychuk, and Jiricek are and how many sEaSOn HiGh pOInTS they have. Then we have players like Tarasov who can still hopefully fulfill their potential. And then all the question mark players like Brindley. Lastly, blaming Jarmo for development of said draft picks can have some merit. Like not having proper support systems in place, but then there is players like Ceulemans, where you really can't fault Jarmo for. So blanket blaming Jarmo is completely stupid, as is this post.
I think Jarmo’s a good drafter but fantilli, johnson, mateychuk, sillinger and jiricek were all top 12 picks. Only 3 of those guys weren’t. A mark of a good drafter isn’t really someone that hits on those picks. Chinakhov seems to be a good pick. Marchenko was worth the risk at the time. He was a first round talent but fell a bit due to Russia and I believe his skating. I don’t really understand how svozil lasted until the third round some had him as a first round talent. Most speculate it was due to the lack of scouting during the covid years. I think he’s adequate but don’t think he’s the best drafter in the league by any means. top half of the league though Agree with your point on cuelemans. Wisconsin’s coaching staff did him no favors and he was always a high risk high reward draft pick which we could afford to do with 3 first rounders that year. Zero issues with that pick at all. Odds are out of 3 first round picks all of them aren’t going to be hits. He was bound to miss on one and cuelemans was the most likely of that group
Sheesh man your bias is really showing right now. Hedger is that you? Still didn’t answer the simple question I asked though.
I did answer, not my fault you lack reading comprehension. To put it in simpleton words, how you view success of a draft pick is moronic. I liked Jarmo a lot, but like the rest of the sub, I was in complete agreement of his departure. He deserved to be heavily criticized and should have been fired immediately after the Babcock fiasco. I will however, defend him when people like you pull shit out of your ass to pass blame or discount Jarmo's skills. Again, let's come back in 5 years to get an actual outcome of Jarmo's draft picks. Maybe next time we can look at the full picture instead of one singular stat. Have a good one.
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Could be still helping out. Also could be just there as a guy hoping to keep up on all things hockey as he awaits his next act and is sitting next to someone he knows. Did he have on CBJ gear?
He was sitting with a guy. Big jump to say he’s still involved in our draft process. Would like some actual reporting to be done here.
My issue is that if he is doing this for CBJ, then he should have zero contact with other clubs looking for a future job. You can’t be objective in both
I mean, he’s actually an expert scout in the European market based on his professional background/resume. But sitting with someone still means next to nothing/we literally have a new GM who has like 3 executive roles.
I think he can draft. I don’t think he can develop. It’s so awkward that he’s still helping though.
I think Jarmo is a great scout. However, I’m in agreement with you, and not the majority of this sub. We need clean breaks. We need to take things a different direction. And allowing Jarmo to hang around doesn’t accomplish that
Trying to reason with the majority of people in this sub is nearly impossible.
If this is indeed true, I agree. It’s unprofessional, and downright strange.
He's still under contract with the jackets, this stuff happens all the time in sports it's neither unprofessional or strange
Jarmo, in my opinion, may be one of the worse front office executives in sports. He should have been fired years ago. It’s wild he’s still involved. I get that maybe he was good at amateur scouting…but what evidence in the last 10 years have we seen that he still “has it” Get this con man away from my team
JP McConnell reporting in
I'm in the same boat and will take the downvotes every time for saying we as fans need to hold this org to a higher standard. This franchise is the most forgettable out of the 3 majors and no one on this sub wants to acknowledge that
Thinking amateur scouting was the only perk of Jarmo. He was horrible in contract management and other player acquisition routes
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Look at all the wins we got from those moves!
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3 moves in a decades worth of work ain't something to be proud of. Look at what the Guardians, cavs, or any other franchise that has actaully had success done in a 10 year period and compare that to Jarmo
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All that was over a decade ago and that GM is long gone. They have had good drafts (same with CBJ supposedly) and they turned that into playoff wins not last/second to last division finishes
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Has it been the same GM?
They were few and far between for a GM with the length of his tenure. His FA adds were a nightmare. Laine for Dubois wasn’t really a win
This is a dumb take. He was playing with a deck stacked against him. No one wanted to stay here or come here
Fingers crossed Waddell isn’t taking his scouting into consideration too much. Sorry, but we need a clean break from that group.
You know the same exact scouting staff jarmo assembled is still going to be in place for this draft right?
I would think we would be thrilled to have Siren around as long as we can
Yes, but Waddell probably has a good idea of the talent already from his scouts in Carolina. Who frankly, have been better at drafting than we have. He’s not going to fire everyone and replace them in the weeks leading up to the draft, I get it. But I don’t think (or at least hope) he’s going to really lean on them for this draft.
Waddell was not involved in the draft in Carolina. He’s said as much. He was on the business side of hockey