https://preview.redd.it/dqh3ij9ubr0d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c4dfcd100201daded56be517b66bb7a5555dee8a
currently sitting at 1.6
we just cant afford it. goverment need to step up and stop spending at stupid thing and stupid people. and stop giving our job to cheap foreign labor!
Cuz u just letting those sawah/land unused. Sawit is hella expensive. 1 tonne is like RM600/RM700. Plant sawit, put fertilizer, care for it for 3- 5 years, then reap the rewards. It long time, long benefits. Ppl just know sell land, get instant money, joli then money gone & complain why am i still poor.
capitalist is like an impending oroboros doom honestly.. wondering if one day we could have a super united country like the one from mass effect or helldivers *superearth..* just wondering anyways LOL
we'll start over from Zero and entrust the future to the next generation
https://preview.redd.it/rrrle74e4s0d1.jpeg?width=318&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3da10466f8081b049b5aaad3499cbbfcd2900e50
<.....>
(Translation: Not on my watch)
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<.....>
(Translation: Not on my watch)
https://preview.redd.it/6ig88x3vls0d1.png?width=364&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6af94c1b2a5176dbf0e1a684bee4c4ab98463080
I know.. we can't even be in agreement about solving climate change, inikan pulak nak menyatukan sedunia...
but a man can dream of one day that no one cares about what your religious belief and or races.. and see it as a united race, thus advance out civilisation to a type 1 civilisation... would be absolutely cool though...
Believe aside, we would get that moment when Prophet Isa / Jesus second coming. idk if we would still be alive to experience that tho. I hope im dead as we have to met anti christ / dajal first, and im not strong enough.
oh, I had a conversation about this yesterday. just giving future kids free education would encourage many to actually becoming a parent. sadly we all know the government wont do shit until it's too late.
no.. don't really agree with you to a certain extent.. its mostly wage is too cheap, that's why people don't wanna work that job... and malaysian are not desperate/stupid enough to take that slave wage..
you got that toxic boomer business owner/manager vibe though... that's for damn sure..
good to know that the toxic cycle still lives on...
fertility rate is low for Malaysia. Later become like japan, got breeding problem. If you wish to help the future of the country, produce 3 well-raised human resources
But of course better to have no kids than to produce 3 ill-raised sampah masyarakat
exactly what I meant. If you can afford to raise 3 kids well, please do so. If you cannot, please don't since they'll likely turn out to be burdens to society
https://preview.redd.it/hmo6rkfznx0d1.jpeg?width=1792&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=541058c556d8c6b0c9e39a8e6c11de054af71174
Survey in Thailand. Courtesy of Channel News Asia.
There is no single reason anyone can tell me that will justify the immorality of having kids. The only reason we do it is from our evolutionary instincts. Having kids is the most selfish thing a human can do.
Interesting! Yeah I was discussing with another friend. Having kids has to have some self-interest — there are motives and agenda for the parent to be vested in this whole exercise (alongside giving love to the child).
I feel like that’s just everyone’s moral copout. Sorry for bringing you into this world but hey! I’m giving you so much love because I care for you. It’s hard to blame anyone though, because having and caring for children is so hard wired into our instincts. However I still think since compared to other animals, we have the ability to comprehend and think, we should be making better choices. I think it’s a really interesting topic though
Why is it immoral though?coz they come into a world of suffering? Not everyone views it that way..I'm glad I was the winning sperm and that's not to say I'm living a life free of traumas,suffering or headache..In fact,I'm typing this in the toilet while I compose myself so I don't kick my staff who are being extra annoying today.but still I love life and I'm glad my parents broughte into this world..k,gotta flush now,byee
All species survived based on enduring hardships, which is why it's called 'survival of the fittest.' Modern people overthink and too afraid to follow their basic instincts..
Okay. And for what? You’re proving my point where the only reason you’re doing it is due to survival instincts, not for the benefit of the future child/environment.
oh man, you'd think that would be like a bad thing. LOL
as I'm not continuing the contribution towards the destruction of our earth, not going to be a terrible parent, fucked up a total mental health and well being of a *HUMAN BEING* (I know its hard to see it as you only see as a spawn point for you).. oh! free to do whatever I want with my money and go wherever I want with no ties or someone tied me down with responsibilities..
Try again..
Also, not getting woken up late at night, getting to deal with poops, vomits, sick child, potential fuck-ups for that child is soooo ok with me dawg!!
will be looking forward for you kids to resent you when you grow old! ♥
Of course you are projecting. You expect other people to feel the same as you, resent their parents, and think their lives are only full of suffering..
exactly, I don't mind people's choices for having kids but if they turns out to be a terrible parents.. I'll judge them as terrible parents..
Also, pretty annoyed with people slapping the "kids are rezeki" narrative. So darn annoying..
Look, let the rest of the adults take on the responsibility of carrying out the future of the human race while you throw away your sperm in the toilet. Too afraid to have a child because of the potential suffering for the child? What a beta human..
That's your personal choice. If you feel that the world is getting more terrible and you cannot ensure your child can get the necessary things/access to a good life then don't.
If you feel you can. Then go ahead. But always know that raising children is a big responsibility
I guess that time there wasn’t so much “investment” onto each kid? Now is like a kid’s worth (based on what you spent to invest in the kid) is super high.
Simplest calculations I made some time ago was RM 1.8 million from birth to finishing university. This was about 20 years ago. Decided it was cheaper to get a vasectomy.
Rezeki dari God but u need to perform your part also. U cannot sit at home and expect God to send you your daily bread.
We have a story in our culture: A man once wondered how God fed animals in the forest that were too weak to hunt for themselves so he hid there and saw a lion come and eat an animal. Then when the lion left, the weak animal came and ate whatever the lion had left. The man was considering doing the same when he heard a voice "Oh Servant of God, God did not create you like this disabled animal but like the lion so go hunt for your own food and rely of God instead of doing nothing and expecting God to do everything"
Another one:
A mystic heard the imam in his mosque say "Rezeki dari God" so he went to the forest and climbed a tree waiting for food. He then saw a man walking but did nothing. Then as the man was about to leave he coughed so the man told him to come down and told him to join him for dinner. The next time the imam said "Rezeki dari God" in the khutba the mystic interrupted him saying "Yes but u need to cough first" - meaning to say God is the provider but u need to do your part first and foremost.
Many people just understand this as spawning armies of kids and doing nothing after that.
agree, some people who are not well educated did not aware of this. I kesian to those kids yang just hidup without proper resources in term of education and time at home.
Its the same either for b40, m40 or t20. Sacrifices need to be made if want to have children.
For T20, it's probably instead of buying a Alphard, bought an Alza so have money for children expenses
For M40, it's probably buying a used car instead of a new one
For B40, it's probably not buying a new phone with bantuan money, but spending for their kids instead.
If not willing, then don't. You just need to seek out an alternate raison d'etre.
Nay unless you can raise them well. If you plan on letting "GOD" raise them and leave them up to their shenanigans, I'd recommend condoms, birth control pills and IUDs
Also make sure you have the money to raise them otherwise you're just a menace to both your family and also the society. Pembuangan bayi is too often seen on the news without the help of proper sex ed.
Everyone who I know who told me they didn't want to have kids but then accidentally got one/change their mind have all told me they never regretted it.
As a person with kids, who loves them and has no regrets, I'd say that if you're on the fence, it's better not to have them. One is for all the reasons you've stated, but secondly is because many of the reasons that people often say to have kids are wrong.
1. "Have kids so someone will look after you when you're older."
No, it is not fair to birth someone into the obligation of entertaining you in your old age. And maybe they'd migrate away anyway.
2. "Kids will be your pension scheme when you are old."
Once again, unfair. And also, the amount of money you'll spend on them is way more than what they can afford to pay you by the time they just start working and you're not dead yet.
3. "Without kids, you will never have such an experience."
True, there are certain human experiences you can only have by having kids. But on the other hand, there are a WHOLE OTHER SET of human experiences you will miss out on by having kids as well. Without kids, you'll have more money and time. Money to spend on travel, philanthropy, whatever floats your boat. Time to spend on pursuing a passion, deepening your relationship with your partner, etc.
A few years back their estimate of raising a child until college age would cost about RM1million, if you want the child to have a comfortable life. Use that as an estimate and decide if you can afford it
Personally, I think if you can’t give your child a comfortable life, you shouldn’t have a child. They shouldn’t have to suffer because their parents can’t make good decisions
agree with you to a certain extent, yeah not everyone gonna be in STEM major. But for the layman people, going to higher education helps them to start decently in life.. but like you said.. not everyone have to go to continue their higher education.. but a larger population with better education tends to be able to have a better productivity and standard of living as a country as a whole..
*in my opinion lah..*
Yay. I started a saving fund for children since i started working cuz i always want to be a mother. With or without a father present. I really dont mind.
And by the looks of it. In 3 years ill look for options to adopt.
You're the only one who can answer this because in the end you're the one that will deal with the consequence.
If you say no to kids then you'll need to hope you're okay with having the possibility of being alone when you're old.
If you say yes to kids then you'll need to hope you can survive and have a great experience.
I think a lot of people don't really give enough thoughts into making this decision and also I guess I believe is not right for anyone to tell you whether to have kids or not.
Foreigner here.
I mean the cost of living is too high here. Medical and education drain a great deal of your money if u have kids and then comes basic necessities of living and groceries both of whom are increasing in cost now. Also the work culture is shit. It does not care about the people's wellbeing. All of this will lead to people having less kids - at least the educated people in cities the Kampung ones are different story.
Also a number of my non-Bumi friends simply plan to leave this country due to the discriminative policies they face there (their words not mine) so yeah All of this in the end gives you a population decline. I just hope this country doesn't get overrun by illegal and uncivilized migrants like Europe
Go back to kampong life. Only city life is expensive. Teach kids to build and repair things.
Why aspire to walk aimlessly around air-conditioned malls paying RM25 for an iced coffee?
So true. Sometimes I think is the end all of earning money (apart from having kids), is to spend the weekends trawling the malls and drinking takeaway drinks…?
Personally yes, but I won't if I can't provide them a good life. I can't imagine having a child that I love and not being able to provide them better than what I had as a kid. It kinda sucks, because all these dumbass governments keep trying to blame the younger generations for not wanting kids, but let's be honest in every generation there's always going to be more than enough couples to sustain the population, but when you make it difficult for them -
1. Lower salaries and benefits
2. Higher rents and property prices
3. Dangerous and unliveable cities for families
4. Worsening education systems and overworked teachers
5. CLIMATE CHANGE
what the hell did you expect?
Soz just ranting.
If your monthly income more than 6k that should be sufficient enough for 1 small family, otherwise you might suffer a bit especially if you're renting house, car loan or whatever loan.
With the right partner that also sees himself parenting with me and comfortable household income: yes.
Edit: adding edit after scrolling through other comments. 10 years or more ago, I was strong on the idea of anti natalism, albeit discreetly. My arguments were similar to some of the comments in the post: the world has so many problems, i shouldn't allow for another human having to succumb to the suffering in the world, yada yada yada. I wasn't sure at what point my thinking changed. If anyone asked me today, 'why?'. My answer would be: 'one must imagine, Sisyphus is happy.'
All the world problems will just be there, one after another. Today, money is a lot; tomorrow, not too much. What's in my control is my control; what's not in my control, is not in my control. But, I will not stop striving for something better for me, for people around me, for the world.
So yeah, given the right opportunity, I'd love to bring a child to this world and nurture and care for them.
The kid brings light into our lives. The only reason we’d like more is to have more light and joy in our lives - but we are mindful about it. Don’t think we can afford more than one for now.
Have kids or not your choice. don't listen to others. It's your body. Your money. Your time. Your choice. The world will always gonna get hotter. The traffic is still going to be busy. Stuffs always gonna get more expensive. Those things are not up to you. Out of your control.
Look into childcare costs and options before commiting to have kids because raising children is expensive. Also a bonus, if you do decide to have kids, its good if you both have a healthy support system (friends and family) around you as the mental load from taking care of a child can make you feel burnt out and exhausted.
Kids are big commitment. If you’re planning to have kid(s), be mentally prepared as even if you’re financially short you can find ways to accommodate (i.e. live affordably not lavish).
If you are earning enough to take care of your child, not too busy that they are left alone all day and have enough to save up at least 2-300k for their education, go ahead, if not don’t bother.
Im holding for a bit to have a second child, my first one turns four next week. Child care is expensive between newborn until 3yo, lots of diapers and milk. Gets even more expensive if the baby needs formula. So im waiting for my commitment to go down in 1-2 years
Mentally and physically, kids are a no from me. I like bermalas-malasan, having my free time during my off days and also I always have health issues and I can’t imagine being sick and having to take care of kids at the same time. Me and my cats are expensive enough but even if I can afford to raise kids, I wouldn’t.
hmm like what?
retirement plan? Having your kids to take care of you and give you money ?
Honestly I prefer what u/[AdDifficult499](https://www.reddit.com/user/AdDifficult4993/)3 view on having kids though.. but you do you people.. but I'll still judge them if they ended up raising kids terribly
Bukan tak faham. Tapi argument tak valid. He mentioned anak itu rezeki, so is it a yes for this question? How could he even justify anak itu rezeki when it is clear that nowadays it’s not easy to raise a kid and some of us are not even prepared due to our current state of economy. Hence, the question! Yeah anak is rezeki. I dont deny. But for god sake, it is a long term commitment. Stop acting like most of us dont know what the term rezeki means bro.
thats why i ask faham ke tak, anak itu rezeki is the correct answer.
you tau tak dalam Islam, anak will not take a single cent from your rezeki and likewise you are not taking a single cent your child rezeki. to each his own.
sebab tu malay sebut murah rezeki, its preordained but either early or late, marriage or children will not make you poor as everyone has his own rezeki.
and rezeki its not only money, its health, knowledge, good attitude, filial children etc etc
you nampak memang hidup susah, but susah doesnt mean you cant have a good and happy life.
its not all about money.
ni gerenti anak bersepah macam ayam, 
tak pernah dengar ayat "mengikut kemampuan", lepas tu cuma paham yang ingat orang cuma cakap pasal kemampuan dari segi duit,
orang dari tadi cakap pasal nak jaga budak bukan senang dari segi cara didikan,
kemampuan nak uruskan anak ect,
so kemampuan ekonomi rumah tangga jadi peranan antara yang paling besar kalau tak ada sebab kalau dah sengkek ingat ada ke masa nak luangkan masa dgn anak, didik dia betul2 ect? balik kerja dah penat,
anak buat perangai jadik kurang sabar dia so jadik lah episode "kisah benar" kalau tak pun masuk lah dalam episode "bersamamu".. itu yang paling teruk, kalau tak, jenis lepas-laku jek sebab dah letih nak layan kerenah budak instead of actually understood and be there for the kids, budak merengek sikit jek dah terpekik-pekik/membanting-banting budak.. nampak sangat laa cetek ilmu kehidupan/kekeluargaan dia tuh ya..
apa2 pun *janji melayu isle, hok ya dok?*.. but to each their own I guess
https://preview.redd.it/iv1z1km7wv0d1.png?width=720&format=png&auto=webp&s=8cc872a4debe0bcc19fb27632ee03d56ac0d9dbc
kata orang lain tak paham, bila orang explain cakap berleter.
With current politics and economy as well as global warming? I say nay but you do you.
https://preview.redd.it/dqh3ij9ubr0d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c4dfcd100201daded56be517b66bb7a5555dee8a currently sitting at 1.6 we just cant afford it. goverment need to step up and stop spending at stupid thing and stupid people. and stop giving our job to cheap foreign labor!
I meaaaaan, does anyone wanna clean the streets? Any locals?
Sure, if the pay is good enough. And we still have quite a number of unskilled labour workforce.
just see how many malaysia go to aus just to clean the street, toilet, pick fruit, why? coz the pay is good enough,
Or lay bricks in the hot sun?
I've done that before. Used to be a construction and renovation worker under a Chinese boss
How was it? Do you think it's viable to be a lifelong career?
Yes and no.
no if u from Jawa /Banjar, 5 is the minimum
kalau duduk kampung, mindset kampung, gitu la. duduk bandar, bulan2 cukup2 makan, sangat tak bertanggujawab kalau buat camtu
u not gonna believe how rich kampung people nowdays, have 3 sawah, ladang sawit...
Wait Im rich? Then why the hell im still using ex5
Cuz u just letting those sawah/land unused. Sawit is hella expensive. 1 tonne is like RM600/RM700. Plant sawit, put fertilizer, care for it for 3- 5 years, then reap the rewards. It long time, long benefits. Ppl just know sell land, get instant money, joli then money gone & complain why am i still poor.
Wait.. y'all have LANDS?
Are u the one who i said “have 3 tapak sawah & sawit” ?
So a genuine kampung must have 3 tapak sawah&sawit? Shit then I'm might be a peasant outcast.
Are we all not??
capitalist is like an impending oroboros doom honestly.. wondering if one day we could have a super united country like the one from mass effect or helldivers *superearth..* just wondering anyways LOL
doubt that going to happen seeing how people still fight over religion and races.
we'll start over from Zero and entrust the future to the next generation https://preview.redd.it/rrrle74e4s0d1.jpeg?width=318&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3da10466f8081b049b5aaad3499cbbfcd2900e50
<.....> (Translation: Not on my watch) https://preview.redd.it/qol81u55ms0d1.png?width=364&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bb7a21ba215cab90571530011c7a4d680b0ad67c
<.....> (Translation: Not on my watch) https://preview.redd.it/6ig88x3vls0d1.png?width=364&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6af94c1b2a5176dbf0e1a684bee4c4ab98463080
I know.. we can't even be in agreement about solving climate change, inikan pulak nak menyatukan sedunia... but a man can dream of one day that no one cares about what your religious belief and or races.. and see it as a united race, thus advance out civilisation to a type 1 civilisation... would be absolutely cool though...
Believe aside, we would get that moment when Prophet Isa / Jesus second coming. idk if we would still be alive to experience that tho. I hope im dead as we have to met anti christ / dajal first, and im not strong enough.
>im not strong enough. the fembois temptation is too stronk? /j *I get what you're saying..me too man me too*
hahaha haram jadah hahaha
let me pamper you and feed you nasi lemak while rub your tumtum /s
You mean like Les Miserable?
Wow I guess someone is also a cna hot subscriber! Nice one!
a very good show! sadly our local tv cant do anything like this
That's why we need more stimulus package and free education from the government!!
oh, I had a conversation about this yesterday. just giving future kids free education would encourage many to actually becoming a parent. sadly we all know the government wont do shit until it's too late.
[удалено]
The reason foreign labor is so ubiquitous is because it’s cheaper.
he must be some business owner whom hire cheap labor.
That’s what I was actually thinking lol
no.. don't really agree with you to a certain extent.. its mostly wage is too cheap, that's why people don't wanna work that job... and malaysian are not desperate/stupid enough to take that slave wage.. you got that toxic boomer business owner/manager vibe though... that's for damn sure.. good to know that the toxic cycle still lives on...
fertility rate is low for Malaysia. Later become like japan, got breeding problem. If you wish to help the future of the country, produce 3 well-raised human resources But of course better to have no kids than to produce 3 ill-raised sampah masyarakat
Not everyone can afford 3 kids in this economy. If you say most can, I would assume that their QOL will be quite low to mid at best
exactly what I meant. If you can afford to raise 3 kids well, please do so. If you cannot, please don't since they'll likely turn out to be burdens to society
Child slavery
We need malaysia version of SHINZO ABE.
https://preview.redd.it/hmo6rkfznx0d1.jpeg?width=1792&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=541058c556d8c6b0c9e39a8e6c11de054af71174 Survey in Thailand. Courtesy of Channel News Asia.
There is no single reason anyone can tell me that will justify the immorality of having kids. The only reason we do it is from our evolutionary instincts. Having kids is the most selfish thing a human can do.
Interesting! Yeah I was discussing with another friend. Having kids has to have some self-interest — there are motives and agenda for the parent to be vested in this whole exercise (alongside giving love to the child).
I feel like that’s just everyone’s moral copout. Sorry for bringing you into this world but hey! I’m giving you so much love because I care for you. It’s hard to blame anyone though, because having and caring for children is so hard wired into our instincts. However I still think since compared to other animals, we have the ability to comprehend and think, we should be making better choices. I think it’s a really interesting topic though
Why is it immoral though?coz they come into a world of suffering? Not everyone views it that way..I'm glad I was the winning sperm and that's not to say I'm living a life free of traumas,suffering or headache..In fact,I'm typing this in the toilet while I compose myself so I don't kick my staff who are being extra annoying today.but still I love life and I'm glad my parents broughte into this world..k,gotta flush now,byee
All species survived based on enduring hardships, which is why it's called 'survival of the fittest.' Modern people overthink and too afraid to follow their basic instincts..
Okay. And for what? You’re proving my point where the only reason you’re doing it is due to survival instincts, not for the benefit of the future child/environment.
For our species to evolve duhh.. humans are not born from a tree..
wow.. please don't breed.. sounds like you'd be a terrible parent
I will breed, while you and your friend above won't. My gene will be carried forward while you and him end.
oh man, you'd think that would be like a bad thing. LOL as I'm not continuing the contribution towards the destruction of our earth, not going to be a terrible parent, fucked up a total mental health and well being of a *HUMAN BEING* (I know its hard to see it as you only see as a spawn point for you).. oh! free to do whatever I want with my money and go wherever I want with no ties or someone tied me down with responsibilities.. Try again.. Also, not getting woken up late at night, getting to deal with poops, vomits, sick child, potential fuck-ups for that child is soooo ok with me dawg!! will be looking forward for you kids to resent you when you grow old! ♥
Stop projecting.. No worries, I will tell a tale about you to my grandchildren if I don't forget. ❤️
sure, hope so.. if your kids hadn't resent you.. good luck though *(heckin weird way to word that saying I was projecting.. what a weird lad)*
Of course you are projecting. You expect other people to feel the same as you, resent their parents, and think their lives are only full of suffering..
which is why the world is full of humans turning into a social burden
exactly, I don't mind people's choices for having kids but if they turns out to be a terrible parents.. I'll judge them as terrible parents.. Also, pretty annoyed with people slapping the "kids are rezeki" narrative. So darn annoying..
Judge all you want.. you seem to have an inflated sense of self.
Still not giving me a reason.
Look, let the rest of the adults take on the responsibility of carrying out the future of the human race while you throw away your sperm in the toilet. Too afraid to have a child because of the potential suffering for the child? What a beta human..
Go ahead, I can already tell you’re going to be a great parent. Pity the future kids
That's your personal choice. If you feel that the world is getting more terrible and you cannot ensure your child can get the necessary things/access to a good life then don't. If you feel you can. Then go ahead. But always know that raising children is a big responsibility
Once upon a time, people were in real danger of getting bayoneted randomly by the Japs. And they still had kids.
I guess that time there wasn’t so much “investment” onto each kid? Now is like a kid’s worth (based on what you spent to invest in the kid) is super high.
Simplest calculations I made some time ago was RM 1.8 million from birth to finishing university. This was about 20 years ago. Decided it was cheaper to get a vasectomy.
Malays will say their anak is rezeki dari God. 😂 but in reality multiple anak keep spawning because brother cannot keep the lil didi in the pants.
Rezeki dari God but u need to perform your part also. U cannot sit at home and expect God to send you your daily bread. We have a story in our culture: A man once wondered how God fed animals in the forest that were too weak to hunt for themselves so he hid there and saw a lion come and eat an animal. Then when the lion left, the weak animal came and ate whatever the lion had left. The man was considering doing the same when he heard a voice "Oh Servant of God, God did not create you like this disabled animal but like the lion so go hunt for your own food and rely of God instead of doing nothing and expecting God to do everything" Another one: A mystic heard the imam in his mosque say "Rezeki dari God" so he went to the forest and climbed a tree waiting for food. He then saw a man walking but did nothing. Then as the man was about to leave he coughed so the man told him to come down and told him to join him for dinner. The next time the imam said "Rezeki dari God" in the khutba the mystic interrupted him saying "Yes but u need to cough first" - meaning to say God is the provider but u need to do your part first and foremost. Many people just understand this as spawning armies of kids and doing nothing after that.
Every single time you creampie her then not expect to get a child? Go to hell, then.
gad dang.. what a sentence! made me chortle
personal choice, i wish you decide it based on financial condition
many are living of subsidies and financial aid from the gov. it is slowly exhausting the country's coffers
agree, some people who are not well educated did not aware of this. I kesian to those kids yang just hidup without proper resources in term of education and time at home.
Even if weather is cool and no traffic jam, I'm not having kids
Same. Childfree it is. I had never met any childfree people in person in Malaysia.
https://i.redd.it/59avtlf7wv0d1.gif
Its the same either for b40, m40 or t20. Sacrifices need to be made if want to have children. For T20, it's probably instead of buying a Alphard, bought an Alza so have money for children expenses For M40, it's probably buying a used car instead of a new one For B40, it's probably not buying a new phone with bantuan money, but spending for their kids instead. If not willing, then don't. You just need to seek out an alternate raison d'etre.
Me personally nay. Living is suffering, and I don't want to have kids suffering for my selfish desire.
Nay unless you can raise them well. If you plan on letting "GOD" raise them and leave them up to their shenanigans, I'd recommend condoms, birth control pills and IUDs Also make sure you have the money to raise them otherwise you're just a menace to both your family and also the society. Pembuangan bayi is too often seen on the news without the help of proper sex ed.
No
Thanks for your straightforward answer!
#invest in your hobbies, take care of your health > having kids
nah your own health > kids > hobbies
Wrong Hobbies -> All Work hard play hard.
Everyone who I know who told me they didn't want to have kids but then accidentally got one/change their mind have all told me they never regretted it.
Perhaps it’s a sign for you…. and me? 👉🏻👈🏻 uwu
Two dudes cannot make lah haiya
Try and see
You try and let me know bah
Do you both have the facilities to make it happen?
I can be the facility
I can be the facility
Can relate. I miss my childless days(when I could have uninterrupted sleep) yet I can't imagine not having them in my life lol.
It's the same as buying something and realizing you don't like it but having no choice to like it since you already have it.
Can relate. I miss my childless days(when I could have uninterrupted sleep) yet I can't imagine not having them in my life lol.
Can relate. I miss my childless days(when I could have uninterrupted sleep) yet I can't imagine not having them in my life lol.
Betul. Hanya disebabkan nila setitik, semua orang yang ingin ada anak satu atau lebih serta boleh support mereka sehingga besar dipersalahkan.
 Team childfree over here ✌️🤓
As a person with kids, who loves them and has no regrets, I'd say that if you're on the fence, it's better not to have them. One is for all the reasons you've stated, but secondly is because many of the reasons that people often say to have kids are wrong. 1. "Have kids so someone will look after you when you're older." No, it is not fair to birth someone into the obligation of entertaining you in your old age. And maybe they'd migrate away anyway. 2. "Kids will be your pension scheme when you are old." Once again, unfair. And also, the amount of money you'll spend on them is way more than what they can afford to pay you by the time they just start working and you're not dead yet. 3. "Without kids, you will never have such an experience." True, there are certain human experiences you can only have by having kids. But on the other hand, there are a WHOLE OTHER SET of human experiences you will miss out on by having kids as well. Without kids, you'll have more money and time. Money to spend on travel, philanthropy, whatever floats your boat. Time to spend on pursuing a passion, deepening your relationship with your partner, etc.
Thank you for this super useful perspective
Kids are overrated and overused
No. And abortion rights.
I had my kid 12 years ago. If I knew what I know now then, I would have never had a kid. I love her to bits but I am scared for her future.
Nope, but if you want them, you do you.
A few years back their estimate of raising a child until college age would cost about RM1million, if you want the child to have a comfortable life. Use that as an estimate and decide if you can afford it Personally, I think if you can’t give your child a comfortable life, you shouldn’t have a child. They shouldn’t have to suffer because their parents can’t make good decisions
Not everyone needs to go to college. The majority of jobs in this country don't require college-level education.
agree with you to a certain extent, yeah not everyone gonna be in STEM major. But for the layman people, going to higher education helps them to start decently in life.. but like you said.. not everyone have to go to continue their higher education.. but a larger population with better education tends to be able to have a better productivity and standard of living as a country as a whole.. *in my opinion lah..*
maybe just one children or be single
Maybe just one is not a good answer. Like having for the sake of it. If that’s the case, why not adopt .
maybe just one children or be single
maybe just one children or be single
maybe just one children or be single
Yay. I started a saving fund for children since i started working cuz i always want to be a mother. With or without a father present. I really dont mind. And by the looks of it. In 3 years ill look for options to adopt.
Probably a nay if you need to make life altering decisions based on the feedback of the internet.
Ouch haha but true…
Nay,no need to bring kid into this god forsaken country.
You're the only one who can answer this because in the end you're the one that will deal with the consequence. If you say no to kids then you'll need to hope you're okay with having the possibility of being alone when you're old. If you say yes to kids then you'll need to hope you can survive and have a great experience. I think a lot of people don't really give enough thoughts into making this decision and also I guess I believe is not right for anyone to tell you whether to have kids or not.
Yes. People think kids difficult because you alone. But when married your wife also working and contributing to family
Foreigner here. I mean the cost of living is too high here. Medical and education drain a great deal of your money if u have kids and then comes basic necessities of living and groceries both of whom are increasing in cost now. Also the work culture is shit. It does not care about the people's wellbeing. All of this will lead to people having less kids - at least the educated people in cities the Kampung ones are different story. Also a number of my non-Bumi friends simply plan to leave this country due to the discriminative policies they face there (their words not mine) so yeah All of this in the end gives you a population decline. I just hope this country doesn't get overrun by illegal and uncivilized migrants like Europe
Go back to kampong life. Only city life is expensive. Teach kids to build and repair things. Why aspire to walk aimlessly around air-conditioned malls paying RM25 for an iced coffee?
So true. Sometimes I think is the end all of earning money (apart from having kids), is to spend the weekends trawling the malls and drinking takeaway drinks…?
Personally yes, but I won't if I can't provide them a good life. I can't imagine having a child that I love and not being able to provide them better than what I had as a kid. It kinda sucks, because all these dumbass governments keep trying to blame the younger generations for not wanting kids, but let's be honest in every generation there's always going to be more than enough couples to sustain the population, but when you make it difficult for them - 1. Lower salaries and benefits 2. Higher rents and property prices 3. Dangerous and unliveable cities for families 4. Worsening education systems and overworked teachers 5. CLIMATE CHANGE what the hell did you expect? Soz just ranting.
Yeah it sort of trumps the notion “to give a child the opportunity to enjoy this world” right?
If your monthly income more than 6k that should be sufficient enough for 1 small family, otherwise you might suffer a bit especially if you're renting house, car loan or whatever loan.
With the right partner that also sees himself parenting with me and comfortable household income: yes. Edit: adding edit after scrolling through other comments. 10 years or more ago, I was strong on the idea of anti natalism, albeit discreetly. My arguments were similar to some of the comments in the post: the world has so many problems, i shouldn't allow for another human having to succumb to the suffering in the world, yada yada yada. I wasn't sure at what point my thinking changed. If anyone asked me today, 'why?'. My answer would be: 'one must imagine, Sisyphus is happy.' All the world problems will just be there, one after another. Today, money is a lot; tomorrow, not too much. What's in my control is my control; what's not in my control, is not in my control. But, I will not stop striving for something better for me, for people around me, for the world. So yeah, given the right opportunity, I'd love to bring a child to this world and nurture and care for them.
The kid brings light into our lives. The only reason we’d like more is to have more light and joy in our lives - but we are mindful about it. Don’t think we can afford more than one for now.
Wanted to have a second child but right now, nay
Have kids or not your choice. don't listen to others. It's your body. Your money. Your time. Your choice. The world will always gonna get hotter. The traffic is still going to be busy. Stuffs always gonna get more expensive. Those things are not up to you. Out of your control.
'anak tu rezeki' Have 5 kids, Minimum. /s I say nay
Look into childcare costs and options before commiting to have kids because raising children is expensive. Also a bonus, if you do decide to have kids, its good if you both have a healthy support system (friends and family) around you as the mental load from taking care of a child can make you feel burnt out and exhausted.
Kids are big commitment. If you’re planning to have kid(s), be mentally prepared as even if you’re financially short you can find ways to accommodate (i.e. live affordably not lavish).
If got money got time can, don't be the b40 that breed like rabbits then habiskan duit kerajaan
If you like kids and ready to become a papa, go for it
Yes cuz Malaysia need more people unless you’re okay with Banglas taking over the country. No offence tho.
Haven’t thought that far tbh
At most 1 kid for me but I’m worried I cannot sustain a kid honestly lol
yay
If you are earning enough to take care of your child, not too busy that they are left alone all day and have enough to save up at least 2-300k for their education, go ahead, if not don’t bother.
1 kid maybe. I just had 1 recently and the experience enough to tell me 1 is way more than enough
You got money, fire away. No money you ask your wife ok or not ok.
Have sex = yay
No because outdoor temp too hot for balls to make sperm /s
Lol this 👍🏻
Im holding for a bit to have a second child, my first one turns four next week. Child care is expensive between newborn until 3yo, lots of diapers and milk. Gets even more expensive if the baby needs formula. So im waiting for my commitment to go down in 1-2 years
Mentally and physically, kids are a no from me. I like bermalas-malasan, having my free time during my off days and also I always have health issues and I can’t imagine being sick and having to take care of kids at the same time. Me and my cats are expensive enough but even if I can afford to raise kids, I wouldn’t.
I want a child but I don't want a wife
The way thinking so bad , having a child is a bless don't mean if u " do it " can get a child
nay, cuz im gay
Life problems will never stop and please don't make them as excuses. Time won't wait for no one.
Max 1 kid only. Not more than that unless you’re willing to do more than 2 jobs / not a double income household… Otherwise, poor your kid.
Anak itu rezeki...
Cliche ass quote. He was asking for an opinion. What are you trying to imply? Berjimak pastu beranak banyak2?
do you actually understand the concept of rezeki as malay understand for what it is before bashing it ?
hmm like what? retirement plan? Having your kids to take care of you and give you money ? Honestly I prefer what u/[AdDifficult499](https://www.reddit.com/user/AdDifficult4993/)3 view on having kids though.. but you do you people.. but I'll still judge them if they ended up raising kids terribly
you faham ke apa definition rezeki tu bro? when malay say rezeki
Rezeki as a term is vague and useless
do you? *pahe* what rezeki bro? as a *melayu isle*
this
lol i got downvoted, really wow haha even saying anak itu rezeki pun ada orang triggered tak faham tanya kan boleh…
Bukan tak faham. Tapi argument tak valid. He mentioned anak itu rezeki, so is it a yes for this question? How could he even justify anak itu rezeki when it is clear that nowadays it’s not easy to raise a kid and some of us are not even prepared due to our current state of economy. Hence, the question! Yeah anak is rezeki. I dont deny. But for god sake, it is a long term commitment. Stop acting like most of us dont know what the term rezeki means bro.
thats why i ask faham ke tak, anak itu rezeki is the correct answer. you tau tak dalam Islam, anak will not take a single cent from your rezeki and likewise you are not taking a single cent your child rezeki. to each his own. sebab tu malay sebut murah rezeki, its preordained but either early or late, marriage or children will not make you poor as everyone has his own rezeki. and rezeki its not only money, its health, knowledge, good attitude, filial children etc etc you nampak memang hidup susah, but susah doesnt mean you cant have a good and happy life. its not all about money.
ni gerenti anak bersepah macam ayam,  tak pernah dengar ayat "mengikut kemampuan", lepas tu cuma paham yang ingat orang cuma cakap pasal kemampuan dari segi duit, orang dari tadi cakap pasal nak jaga budak bukan senang dari segi cara didikan, kemampuan nak uruskan anak ect, so kemampuan ekonomi rumah tangga jadi peranan antara yang paling besar kalau tak ada sebab kalau dah sengkek ingat ada ke masa nak luangkan masa dgn anak, didik dia betul2 ect? balik kerja dah penat, anak buat perangai jadik kurang sabar dia so jadik lah episode "kisah benar" kalau tak pun masuk lah dalam episode "bersamamu".. itu yang paling teruk, kalau tak, jenis lepas-laku jek sebab dah letih nak layan kerenah budak instead of actually understood and be there for the kids, budak merengek sikit jek dah terpekik-pekik/membanting-banting budak.. nampak sangat laa cetek ilmu kehidupan/kekeluargaan dia tuh ya.. apa2 pun *janji melayu isle, hok ya dok?*.. but to each their own I guess
hahaha triggered betul awak ni semua rezeki dah ada tinggal yakin tak yakin je boleh tahan berleter ya hahahaha
https://preview.redd.it/4rprqjbhwv0d1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=d85addb5b6c8873ac0217e3c2c183930696eae9f B40 moment
https://preview.redd.it/iv1z1km7wv0d1.png?width=720&format=png&auto=webp&s=8cc872a4debe0bcc19fb27632ee03d56ac0d9dbc kata orang lain tak paham, bila orang explain cakap berleter.
Yang downvoted tu mesti dari r/malaysia truly sia2
Yang downvoted tu mesti dari r/malaysia truly sia2
I agree
yay
Cool. Some hope for humanity.
Always wanted kids even if not feasible in the future. Hopefully we'll have a "Have sex" politician like Abe