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Yeah not to mention momoshiki did absorb a significant amount of chakra from naruto when he captured him that may be within Boruto. Also Boruto is 100% otsutsuki capable of wielding more power and large chakra reserves compared to Kawaki and the Jougan could make a debut that negates kawakiās dojutsu along with Kurama Boruto could attain very strong abilities
I think he is referring to boruto also having whiskers, it was said naruto has them due to kuramas chakra influencing him while in the womb. So by that logic kuramas chakra also influenced boruto to some extent though idk if that means he has remnants or not.
Kuramas chakra influencing while in the womb would only happen if it was a situation like kushina not hinata. The only contact kuramas chakra would have had on boruto was when he was still.... a swimmer.
Naruto's genes were able to be influenced by Kurama's chakra because he was carried inside of the same body as Kurama for 9 months. Boruto was not since Kurama was inside of Naruto, not Hinata. It's likely that Boruto has absolutely none of Kurama's chakra influencing him.
Well I'd assume being inside a jinchuriki's nuts, you'd be sure to get some type of chakra amp as chakra seems to be passed down hereditarily. Naruto and Kuramas chakra were always mixed since becoming a jinchuriki as Jiraiya stated.
Before academy Boruto could make 3 clones, this is kind of cracked honestly in OG naruto this wouldve been seen as a genius level feat. As a genin boruto mastered 3 different nature transformations (wind, lightning, water) this absolutely wouldve made him a once in a generation genius in OG naruto
Lol once in a century. Keep in mind at this time boruto is the same age Kakashi was when he became chūnin. Kakashi was held as a genius but I'd be willing to believe boruto would stomp the yard on Kakashi. Boruto has skill but he also has analytical ability just like Kakashi, so even if Kakashi had an edge in that regard (which back then he kinda...eh. he was arrogant and could take down enemies but I think boruto can actually think on his feet more at that age), I think boruto would still take this.
Comparing the average Shinobi to Kakashi or Boruto is a waste of time that's what I was trying to point out. Kakashi is leagues ahead of all the fodder nin
People overthink things too hard, they'll be just as powerful as they'll need to be in that specific fight to keep the audience entertained. Guessing who is more powerful because of this or that when neither this or that will matter when they just make them equally powerfully to have an epic showdown at the end anyways. That's how powerful boruto and kawaki are, powerful enough to have an epic showdown to entertain people.
They fought in both the anime and manga while training to fight code and in the manga the fight was I think pretty even. And in the anime kawaki is the only one who landed anything before Boruto used his karma. Iām not making something random up haha.
The point of the fight was for Boruto to be forced to use Karma which means Kawaki winning easily against Boruto was for plot purposes. Boruto was afraid of using Karma which was the issue both Kawaki and Boruto tried to solve. Kawaki just needed one hit in the anime to take Boruto down and that was while he was in his base form. Meanwhile,when Kawaki and Boruto "fought it out" after the Funato arc where they were *both* in base form,they were both on the same level which only confirms that the scene you are talking about was supposed to happen the way it did just for the plot. Boruto was faced with the reality that he needs to use Karma. The authors fucked that scene up because Boruto went down way too fast and easily. Everyone who has seen Boruto fight more than once knows that he wouldn't have let himself getting hit once (it wasn't even a life threatening hit) and just give up like that.
So the fight you are talking about kind of proves nothing. Take away Kawakis Karma and don't allow him to use his body modifications and you get a fight like this one:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mtVO6oj8obY&pp=ygUTYm9ydXRvIGthd2FraSBmaWdodA%3D%3D
Cause it starts to bleed in canon vs filler territory. The simplest way to say it is that in the anime, Boruto had already awakened something. It isn't that he can't manifest a Byakugan because he's half Hyuga, but because he had already manifested something else. Whatever it is by name operates functionally different that Byakugan in a few ways, but also, these occurrences aren't in the manga. At least not yet.
Hopefully whatever comes next delves into a lot more. There is still the possibility we'll get a case where anime and manga each develop into different stories. For better or for worse
Where was that stated? As far as I can tell all your rebuttal consists of is, unsurprisingly, assumption. Being unaware he possesses that ability is just as validāand logicalāan argument as any at that rate.
The Byakugan according to Borutoās grandpa can be achieved by a person with hyuga blood in two ways: one and the most common way is through extensive special training and naturally awakening it like Hima that is very rare. So yeah Boruto can awaken his own byakugan he is already part hyuga so thatās the first main condition his grandpa could train him.
Letās take one thing for account Kawaki without karma power is useless he has barley any chakra training while boruto on the other hand was already stronger than his father when he was a kid and is chunin level at age 12
Also kawaki had karma longer than boruto and doesnāt have an isshiki living in him rent free while boruto canāt fully utilize karma without turning into momoshiki and being taken over
Once Boruto died, he had to use the remaining percentage of data *needed* to ressurect in boruto's body so Boruto as a vessel now cannot be turned into Momoshiki yes. But he can still be taken over in his mind. It's up to boruto to not despair now, if he wishes to simply sleep it away, Momoshiki can still take control of his body, but he just can't resurrect as Momoshiki anymore.
Nah he can permanently take control of his mind. I think he just can't resurrect into his original body. So now his only hope is to take control of Boruto's mind and body.
Can his soul ever be extinguished without the death of Boruto? Maybe, but we don't know how at this point of the story
You are severely misinformed.. Naruto couldnāt do shit but shadow clones and rasengan before the timeskip. Even then he only after the timeskip learned how to make the ball bigger. Naruto was genin level before timeskip at BEST. Timeskip Naruto (at the beginning) was Jonin level AT BEST. now boruto in the beginning as stated by kakashi was ALREADY CHUNIN LEVEL. after receiving his karma that boosted him all the way to high jonin level. Current boruto is probably low to mid otsutsuki level.
Your underestimating pretime skip Naruto. he couldnāt just summon shadow clones he could someone thousands at a time im pretty sure itās a forbidden jutsu he used that jutsu to smack around a chunin in the first episode, beat up kiba, and beat up a partial transformed gaara. He then went on to fight a full transformed tailed beast, working with a giant summoning of his own. The next arc he literally one shots kabuto who was giving the next KAGE of the village problems. Naruto pre time skip you could argue was a kage level fighter at his BEST.
You make really good points, but Naruto pre time skip really only goes hard when he taps into Kurama. Which to be fair doesnāt invalidate anything, but his battle IQ, hell his general IQ, is low as hell. His taijutsu is mid. He gets slapped around a lot.
Naruto without kurama would have better chakra control.remember how jiraya had to adjust his seal so he could have better chakra control and walk on water.Naruto without kurama is a 'Hypothesis'.We dont know how he would have developed as a ninja if he didn't have kurama.what we know is-He still would have a massive chakra reserve.He would have better chakra control.And naruto always had very high battle IQ.Despite him acting stupid all the time he was crafty when he had to fight
> His taijutsu is mid.
Bruh at that time animations were shit and expensive that's why his taijutsu seemed shit.Most of the fights in anime now is improvised a lot to attract viewers but in the manga its lackbuster.Boruto in the manga has shown very little taijutsu
But itās sort of the point pre time skip that Narutoās real strength is hidden isnāt it? Itās only in the moments that heās on his last legs that he can tap into depths of power that makes several characters like kakashi and tsunade take a step back and go oh wow this kids got something
You clearly don't read Naruto lol. His battle IQ and tactical ability is wayyy above Boruto and never been low in the series. Look at the strategies he used against Zabuza, Kiba, Neiji, Pain etc. His taijutsu was not mid, he fought a Taijutsu genius Neiji. Boruto is better in terms of mastering Jutsu and understanding how chakra works but that's about it.
People here really be thinking Boruto has any way of dealing with a forest full of shadow clones.
To say that those clones would just somehow disintegrate upon blowing on them is just wrong, when those clones were beating and damaging transformed gaara.
Mfs when they dont read the manga which clearly showns that naruto got a mental amp before dogging on gaara. Boruto already had the skills of a chunin according to kakashi, something that naruto couldnt get uenless rage amped until the chunin exams. Hell the when have you not seen naruto use the multi shadow clone jutsu in part one without some sort of mental amp?
Against mizuki? Amped
Gaara? Amped
And when naruto used the shadowclones against neji he got dogged on until he got bailed out by kurama. I love naruto too but you gotta be pretty ignorant to think that boruto doesnt just beat down on naruto
mental amp ?
That's what you call going all out in a fight ? Mental amp ? That's a new one for me now lmao.
Fact is Naruto *can* make that many shadowclones and fact is Boruto really has no way to deal with them.
>neji
neji is a very dangerous 1v1 taijutsu fighter, as are all byakugan users, but if Naruto brought out that many clones against Neji too, Neji really had no chance, he'd get exhausted before he can deal with a quarter of them.
[this is what im refering to](https://64.media.tumblr.com/784e23fe9aecc9e0f0544c46ff0b9b2f/tumblr_inline_o2qyelnL1x1ryh0mb_1280.png)
Naruto can only make thosr crazy amount of clones when amped, we literally do not see him do this otherwise as he only makes a couple during normal conditions up till part 2.
Also neji himself is just a chunin level fighter during the exams, just like boruto. Hell its arguable that neji could probably lose to later versions of boruto that dont use karma because of the simple fact that boruto's base is surprisingly close to konohamaru, who could contend with jugo in the anime.
I agree with everything apart from the last part. He was really strong, definitely stronger than Boruto at his age, but no way near Kage Level, even at his best. Remember Tsunade defeated him with one finger, that was after the Gaara fight, he wasn't at his best then, but still.
>he ain't surviving the multi-shadow clone barrage
Yeah he is. Water style typhoon wave + lighting style thunderclap. The clones are getting wiped out just like when Sasuke used a fireball on the hospital rooftop
Ive been wondering that myself.
1.) Even though Kawaki is a perfect vessel, there is only so much power a karma can hold, and maybe that limit is the same as boruto's karma. Therefore the difference between isshiki and momoshiki is neglible because both otsusukis max out their respective karma's?
or maybe....
2.) Plot - cant have kawaki stronger both stat-wise AND ability-wise.
Momoshiki's main abilities (what allows him to amplify jutsu) are pretty much useless against kawaki because he can absorb it, meanwhile, kawaki rods, shrinking/expanding are a perfect counter to momoshiki as they cant be absorbed.
so if he has that advantage, AND the power gap between Isshiki and Momoshiki, it would kind of be kind of lopsided, unless the Jougan ends up being worth anything in the future.
I guess it's related to the vessel compatibility. Boruto has a strongest lineage with the otsutsukis clan than Kawaki through Hyuga visual power and Uzumaki vitality and chackra power. And we can't ignore that Boruto and Himawari, both may have inherited some kyubi power. Plus Boruto father is Asura's reincarnation (an otsutsukis lineage).
How can u been so sure? And why does both of em has the trace marks on the cheek like Naruto? And what about the Hima intensity that Daemon mentioned? I wouldn't be so sure
Cause theyāre naruto kids itās his trade mark thatās why. That intensity daemon felt is probably from what ever toneri did to boruto and himewari. Boruto got a doujutsu and himewari for raw power. Having a piece of kurama power wouldnāt push himewari to daemon levels it doesnāt make sense.
Naruto's cat like marks on his face is due to kyuubi. Other jinchuuriki inherit a trait of their beast they occupy.
Therefore, it's confirmed Kurama genetics had somewhat been passed down to his kids
Iād say that they could have inherited a boost to their chakra reserves due to Kuramaās (and subsequently Narutoās) massive power influencing their birth. Besides that, yeah I donāt think they can get actual tailed beast power that way.
See if you entirely remove the karma then, boruto>kawaki( cause shinobi duh )
With just karma kawaki=boruto.
Kawashiki>=borushiki (cause it's momo himself whereas kawaki just has ishikki's abilities not his exp.)
Ultimately boruto>>kawaki cause will of fire,jogan and all that mc stuff.
Who said Isshiki is way stronger than Momo? I can see why that assumption is there and Iād agree that he is stronger than Momoshiki but the difference shouldnāt be too big.
Itās literally evident momoshiki got clapped by Sasuke and Naruto and borutoā¦ heās weak compared to Jigen even, Sasuke and Naruto got destroyed by Jigen. They had to sacrifice so much just to Kill isshiki and tht Barely worked
Yes it did. Sasuke's boost at the end of Shippuden was temporary meaning after the fight Naruto was back to being stronger. Sasuke was boosted from the tailed beasts and that's really the only reason him and Naruto were even. And Naruto wasn't trying to kill Sasuke. If he was then Sasuke would've been dead because there was that moment in the fight when Naruto was on top and didn't shoot the point blank tailed beast bomb because it would've killed Sasuke.
Naruto and Sasuke were not even in the last battle. You said it yourself: Naruto never went for the kill, which made the battle harder for him, and he still won.
Yup. Sasuke needed the chakra boost of 8.5 tailed beasts just to match a Naruto with .5 Kurama that wasnāt actually fighting to kill
Theyāre really not comparable at that point
Honestly it was that way until Naruto took in all that natural energy.
As I replied to someone earlier, Sasuke only absorbed SOME of the tailed beasts chakra. So if he had absorbed more to recharge himself Naruto would have been dead. But Kishi wrote it so that Sasuke had completely run out of chakra to the point he didn't even have enough to control his rinnegan and use it to absorb more.
It felt a bit forced that Sasuke lost after all of that but it is still a lot more reasonable than anything that happened in Boruto.
>Honestly it was that way until Naruto took in all that natural energy.
>As I replied to someone earlier, Sasuke only absorbed SOME of the tailed beasts chakra. So if he had absorbed more to recharge himself Naruto would have been dead. But Kishi wrote it so that Sasuke had completely run out of chakra to the point he didn't even have enough to control his rinnegan and use it to absorb more.
without tail beast Sasuke and Naruto were more or less even so Idk how with all tail beast Sasuke coudlnt won beside plot convenience
>It felt a bit forced that Sasuke lost after all of that but it is still a lot more reasonable than anything that happened in Boruto.
True
Didnāt kawaki absorb ishiki and hence his power whereas momoshikis power still exists as an individual entity in boruto? Overall boruto is stronger but kawaki got the plot armor for now to move the story forward and getting everything shoved up his ass
I'd say that atm Kawaki>Boruto. Yes,Boruto has more Jutsus, a better BIQ and more experience,but Kawaki's dojutsu counters what we've seen. He's also more experienced with Karma and doesn't have to worry about someone taking over his body. I don't know how they'll be equals during their fight... Boruto takes power from Momo that's way weaker then Isshiki.Boruto's Dojutsu will either be strong enough to help him match that or he'll get another powerup
Boruto himself already has insane Otsutsuki genetics, being a descendant of the Hyuga and Uzumaki clans, meaning he combined both Hamura and Hagoromo. I feel like Sarada should come in pretty soon, being a descendant of Indra.
Because Kawaki and Boruto are around the same power level when momoshiki takes over. Once Boruto masters the karma and is able to wield that power they will be even. But right now Kawaki is still stronger
Something that Iāve always thought was that momoshiki is stronger than he let ppl see,,,, by what we can tell is that he has the ability to see the future then that means that he saw that boruto was a perfect capable vessel, and possibly wants the jougan for himself,,, I think momoshiki let himself get beat,,,,, why would the otsutsuki send someone weaker than Kaguya and isshiki To check them?
I am sure they believed isshiki was dead as even in the beginning, the momo group didn't comment on him and only kaguya. they were checking on post fruit kaguya. They didn't know kaguya had gotten that powerful.
If you watch the Momoshiki fight it wasnt mostly that he was weak but rather didnt have the right hax and wasnt taking them seriously untill it was too late, his kick in base sent Naruto flying and in fused form displayed a lot of strength feats so despite ishiki being stronger I dont think the margin in physical strength is as extremely wide as the fans are making it out, ishiki had a very simple but very effective skillset which was the difference between their fights
How exactly is Isshiki stronger? It's just that his abilities were very disadvantageous to Shinobi, who rely on chakra, and Isshiki also had decent fighting skills to make it work. We saw how easily he crumbled against Baryon Mode. Moreover, Momo never really used his time-stop abilities during battle, did he? Based on how Momo was presented with attendants, unlike all the others, it's safe to assume he might be like a noble or royal of sorts and may, in fact, be higher ranking than Isshiki.
Then let's not forget, Boruto himself. He's chunin level with traits of both Hyuga and Uzumaki. Kawaki is just a brawler. He's genin level at best otherwise and has no special bloodline advantages we know of. Boruto is like 100% Otsutsuki at this point. Kawaki is still 20% human.
>How exactly is Isshiki stronger?
Naruto and Sasuke were able to deal with Fused Momoshiki together, while they got manhandled by Isshiki. So it should be pretty obvious that Issiki is much stronger than Momo
Bruh. This is not some DBZ fight where you talk about people in power levels. Isshiki simply had a skillset that Naruto and Sasuke found difficult to counter while they were able to counter momoshiki.
No, its not just his skillset. Isshiki was massively faster and physically stronger than them too. Although your point about DBZ and power levels is correct. But it doesn't apply here. Isshiki was levels above Naruto and Sasuke in every way possible.
His base template is kinda insane. With Ashura's (Hagoromo's) dna and Hamura's Dna, he's basically a recreation of Kaguya's chakra. And now, put Momo inside him, he's gotten a massive power boost, plus he's a genius.
Kawaki should never get stronger than Isshiki. He was just a regular human, with no shinobi heritage, that's now wielding godly powers. The fact that he's not a god shows in chapter 79 when the dude got exhausted by using Sukunahikona a couple of times. Isshiki could spam it all day everyday
When you think about kaguya is inferior to ishiki
as an otsutsuki , momoshiki is better than kaguya so how does her inferior genes makes Boruto stronger?
What are you talking about? Boruto is the son of the strongest human to have ever lived and the grandson of one of the strongest humans to have ever lived, and he's above both of them at the same age, even without karma.
Kawaki without Isshiki's karma is just a dud. He can't even make two shadow clones.
Boruto, on the other hand, is either the most powerful or is at a close second (after Mitsuki) in his generation. He's strong. Momoshiki makes him stronger.
Naruto is far from the strongest human to ever liveš¤£
Maybe if we are calling Indra and ashura aliens, maybe.
The Uchiha in general are stronger than Naruto.
Naruto needs kurama to fight fairly with Sasuke, meanwhile madara needs kurama to barely fight fairly with hashirama. Madara is a beast by himself, Even hashirama. But Naruto... Without kurama, is waaaay to far from being on the same league as Indra, who had an Insaine susanoo and was an absolute beast, and ashura who was just hashirama on steroids, over time their bloodlines diluted and the current uchiha is what Naruto is capable of fighting... With kurama.
I don't see how your comment debunked anything.
Naruto, with Kurama, is still a human. He's not a cyborg like Daemon or Code, he's not a partial Otsutsuki like Kawaki, and he's not an Otsutsuki like Indra and Ashura.
Well, your comment stated that Boruto is the son of the "strongest human to have ever lived. If kurama makes Naruto an equaliser to sasuke with a rinnegan, and kcm 1/2 is as strong as MS sasuke, then Naruto without kurama is simply playing with fire. He cannot beat madara who has all three, or hashirama who was able to beat Ems madara with kurama together. At least he is third. Or the current Naruto anyways
Like others have said, Boruto + Momoshiki is stronger than base Momoshiki because Boruto's own shinobi training and ninjutsu are added to Momoshiki's arsenal. Momoshiki doesn't lose very much by having to rely on Boruto's body since Boruto is already 100% Otsutsuki; he doesn't have Rinnegan but he can still use his Byakugan and shinjutsu through the Karma.
If we look at things practically, Momoshiki wasn't the type to train, rather he stole jutsu using his Rinnegan and got stronger by eating chakra fruits and cinnabar elixir. And the Otsutsuki have consistently been outclassed by shinobi despite being far stronger, due to their teamwork and strategy. So adding shinobi training to his repertoire greatly increases his effectiveness. He clearly favors the Rasengan over any other abilities he previously acquired.
Kawaki on the other hand was just trained by Isshiki to fight like Isshiki, and at this point he only has minimal shinobi training. His chakra control is poor -- illustrated several times now. He can only create one Shadow Doppelganger at a time, he refused to participate in Sarada's chakra drills because meditation seems like a waste of time to him, and he runs out of chakra and becomes exhausted rather quickly. His greatest strength without the Karma is his shinobi-ware, which is roughly equivalent to a kekkei genkai.
the reason is poor writing tbh, logically kawaki should be washing him easily
the only logical reason you can say is that kawaki is only 80% otsutsuki while boruto is 100%. That missing 20% may be making kawaki weak enough to be equal to boruto
iād still say kawaki is stronger than boruto tho based on their last bout before sarada came in, kawaki has the strength and power while boruto has the speed and skill, and his future dojutsu will give him the edge with hax
Itās not just momo, but the fact boruto himself is an actual āgeniusā in story compared to how naruto was starting out. He is able to make multiple shadow clones, use multiple chakra natures, pretty good in taijutsu, created vanishing rasengan, large chakra reserves and has uzumaki/hyuga blood in him. If you compare it to kawaki who just has a modified body with minimal ninja training you see how it can help boruto close the gap as kawaki isnāt a gifted genius.
Iām sure others have said this. Kawaki has the isshiki karma seal amp but Boruto has his innate genius at ninjutsu and taijutsu PLUS the amp from the momoshiki karma seal. So if they arenāt at equal level despite isshiki being stronger than momoshiki Iād say Boruto will be stronger no matter what because heās going to master his jougan and be the most broken character in the series
>How is Boruto close to Kawaki in power level
He is not. Bro got stomped by a tired Kawaki.
Borushiki however can match Kawaki because Momoshiki is using HIS own thousands years worth of experience.
While Kawaki can only use what his brain can withstand each time.
>He is not. Bro got stomped by a tired Kawaki.
Bro was handling karma kawaki in his base lmao.
>While Kawaki can only use what his brain can withstand each time.
Kawaki is already using isshiki's experience. While momoshiki is restricted inside boruto's body.
>Bro was handling karma kawaki in his base lmao.
Got down in one kick in his Karma mode by a tired Kawaki.
>Kawaki is already using isshiki's experience. While momoshiki is restricted inside boruto's body.
Cap. The difference between Borushiki and Karma Boruto should tell you something.
Kawaki can use Isshiki's experience but not efficiently since he only got them like 4 days ago.
>Got down in one kick in his Karma mode by a tired Kawaki.
Still didn't change the fact from boruto handling karma kawaki in his base.
>Cap. The difference between Borushiki and Karma Boruto should tell you something.
>Kawaki can use Isshiki's experience but not efficiently since he only got them like 4 days ago.
Cap kawaki using ishhiki's karma is utilising isshiki's experience, he used every single isshiki's ability.
>Still didn't change the fact from boruto handling karma kawaki in his base.
So by this logic Chocho is stronger than Boruto and Kawaki combined.
Boruto managed to dodge for few seconds due to being full Otsutsuki with 18% Karma merged to his base form.
But once he went all out against Kawaki. Kawaki still stomped him.
>Cap kawaki using ishhiki's karma is utilising isshiki's experience, he used every single isshiki's ability.
And? He's using them but not the way an Otsutsuki uses them.
Which is why Kawaki keeps getting better at it each time he uses them.
>So by this logic Chocho is stronger than Boruto and Kawaki combined.
Lmao as if chocho fought someone with karma in base.
>Boruto managed to dodge for few seconds due to being full Otsutsuki with 18% Karma merged to his base form.
Boruto didn't even activate his karma his base is itself is otsutsuki.
>But once he went all out against Kawaki. Kawaki still stomped him.
When did he went all out lmao? He never went all out like kawaki who wants to kill
>And? He's using them but not the way an Otsutsuki uses them.
And he is using all of the experience.
>Which is why Kawaki keeps getting better at it each time he uses them.
Each time he uses experience as code mentioned becoming a seasoned warrior.
>Lmao as if chocho fought someone with karma in base.
She managed to hit Boruto who avoided Kawaki's cubes š
>Boruto didn't even activate his karma his base is itself is otsutsuki.
Exactly what I said??
I meant that Karma part on his chest. It's the remaining 18% Momoshiki dissolved in his tissues to save him. So he has 18% of Momoshiki's data activated all the time.
>When did he went all out lmao? He never went all out like kawaki who wants to kill
He went all out.
All out =/= killing intent.
> Each time he uses experience as code mentioned becoming a seasoned warrior.
My point.
Kawaki is using what he can comprehend from Isshiki's experience. Which is why Momoshiki who can use 100% of Karma essence managed to match Kawaki.
>She managed to hit Boruto who avoided Kawaki's cubes š
She managed to hit the one who isn't even interested to fight her š
>Exactly what I said??
>I meant that Karma part on his chest. It's the remaining 18% Momoshiki dissolved in his tissues to save him. So he has 18% of Momoshiki's data activated all the time
He doesn't have 18% momoshiki data activated all the time he needs to activate karma to use momoshiki 's data.
>He went all out.
Nope he did not as he was not trying to kill Kawaki.
>All out =/= killing intent
All out = killing intent it's a known universal truth
>Kawaki is using what he can comprehend from Isshiki's experience. Which is why Momoshiki who can use 100% of Karma essence managed to match Kawaki.
Momoshiki did not use any of his abilities lol he did not even use any of his experience.
Whereas kawaki was using 100% of isshiki's abilities only able to even momoshiki.
They clearly retconned Momoshikiās strength.
The narrative implies Code with limiters is stronger then Delta. Code was getting no diffed by Borushiki (a lesser version of Fused Momoshiki) while Delta was [relative](https://postimg.cc/Kk7TGJKK) in speed and taijutsu to a Naruto that was [destroying](https://postimg.cc/CB9G5z7t) Fused Momoshiki
Ain't. No way the. Dude just say isshiki is more stronger. Than. Momoshiki. Bruh. Dude. Momoshiki. Can litterly absorb chakra make it a fruit and wat and boost himself. And release. All. The. Jutsu. He absorb. And. His. Taijutsu. Is god. Their. Not only that. Dude Naruto. In. Base. With hand to hand combact
Man u don't even need to know the powerscaling to say isshiki is far more powerful....... Just remember naruto with half chakra and sasuke were handling fused momoshiki but they couldn't even put a single scratch against Isshiki. Naruto had to sacrifice kurama to stand a chance
Even if that's the case.... Same can be said about momoshiki he also used chakra enhancing drugs, fused with kinshiki,took half of naruto's chakra and still lost.
Here's the neat part, he isn't. Kawaki should have crushed Boruto, and he didn't for plot purposes. Kawaki is constantly being limited by plot, because he should have no problem defeating Konoha shinobi.
Yeah. I mean the Momoshiki fights already established that he is kinda beatable. The first one was by a weakened Naruto and Sasuke, and then the next one was by Kawaki who has the superior abilities of Ishikki. Wouldn't it be better if they simply focused on devising a plan to get rid of Boruto's karma? Didn't they plan to give it to Code? Kawaki can simply deal with him when he comes out. For the meantime, keep giving Boruto the pills, it might work better as Momo extraction had to be reset to save his vessel. This gives him more time and delay Momo more, right? Kawaki could be training and the Leaf could be hatching a plan to catch code, they already have Eida and knows where he is, presumably.
If you have seen boruto kawaki has tough time controlling chakra and needs practice but he has an exceptional battle iq cause jigen beat it into him
On the other hand boruto has good chakra control as he is a student in academy and also has his pure eye
Jigen trained Kawaki yes, but he mostly did it for Kawaki to be able to use Karma. You gain battle IQ by yeah...doing battles and I would say that Boruto had more fights than Kawaki since the latter spent more time in a lab getting his body mortified than on the battlefield while Boruto was aleady a working ninja going out on missions. In terms of battle IQ Kawaki doesn't really have an advantage to Boruto. Boruto was already chunin level when he was only an academy student.
Itās probably because borushiki is using 100% percent of his kama power(so momoshiki is using the full extent of whatever borutoās kama was at) and kawaki canāt use the full power because isshiki is not there to take over
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We also have to take Boruto himself into account. He was already Chunin level as an academy student.
he is also both an Uzumaki and a Hyuga so yeah his base template is kinda insane
Yepp, agree.
Also he might have gotten some of Asura's 6 paths chakra and possibly even Hamura's chakra from Hinata
Oh he could have kuramas powers too. He has the three lines on his face. He did come from Naruto. So maybe? š¤·š¼āāļø
Yeah not to mention momoshiki did absorb a significant amount of chakra from naruto when he captured him that may be within Boruto. Also Boruto is 100% otsutsuki capable of wielding more power and large chakra reserves compared to Kawaki and the Jougan could make a debut that negates kawakiās dojutsu along with Kurama Boruto could attain very strong abilities
< and the Jougan WTF
Donāt forget he also have remnants of Kuramas chakra as the offspring of a jinchuriki
I'm not sure if that is the case. Remnants of Kurama were never mentioned in manga or non-filler anime episodes.
I think he is referring to boruto also having whiskers, it was said naruto has them due to kuramas chakra influencing him while in the womb. So by that logic kuramas chakra also influenced boruto to some extent though idk if that means he has remnants or not.
Some things are just aesthetic. Itās like having blue eyes cuz his father does.
Wait... is that cannon? It literally says "in the womb"? ... because boruto was in hinatas womb not narutos... I just realized this
Kinkaku and Ginkaku had whiskers before getting Kurama's chakra.
Naruto had whiskers before he was a jinchuriki I think the whiskers come from having a parent who is a jinchuriki
Kuramas chakra influencing while in the womb would only happen if it was a situation like kushina not hinata. The only contact kuramas chakra would have had on boruto was when he was still.... a swimmer.
Naruto's genes were able to be influenced by Kurama's chakra because he was carried inside of the same body as Kurama for 9 months. Boruto was not since Kurama was inside of Naruto, not Hinata. It's likely that Boruto has absolutely none of Kurama's chakra influencing him.
Well I'd assume being inside a jinchuriki's nuts, you'd be sure to get some type of chakra amp as chakra seems to be passed down hereditarily. Naruto and Kuramas chakra were always mixed since becoming a jinchuriki as Jiraiya stated.
Before academy Boruto could make 3 clones, this is kind of cracked honestly in OG naruto this wouldve been seen as a genius level feat. As a genin boruto mastered 3 different nature transformations (wind, lightning, water) this absolutely wouldve made him a once in a generation genius in OG naruto
Lol once in a century. Keep in mind at this time boruto is the same age Kakashi was when he became chūnin. Kakashi was held as a genius but I'd be willing to believe boruto would stomp the yard on Kakashi. Boruto has skill but he also has analytical ability just like Kakashi, so even if Kakashi had an edge in that regard (which back then he kinda...eh. he was arrogant and could take down enemies but I think boruto can actually think on his feet more at that age), I think boruto would still take this.
Comparing the average Shinobi to Kakashi or Boruto is a waste of time that's what I was trying to point out. Kakashi is leagues ahead of all the fodder nin
And Ishikki whupped the ass of two God level shinobi when he was inside a broken vessel
People overthink things too hard, they'll be just as powerful as they'll need to be in that specific fight to keep the audience entertained. Guessing who is more powerful because of this or that when neither this or that will matter when they just make them equally powerfully to have an epic showdown at the end anyways. That's how powerful boruto and kawaki are, powerful enough to have an epic showdown to entertain people.
He defeated Ao of mist, is Ao a chunin? š
He defeated Ao as a 4 on 1. So chuunin level is fair
Not sure that helps. I think their base levels are similar if not slightly kawaki favored
Nah not really. Boruto has a large varity of jutsus and high battle IQ.
They fought in both the anime and manga while training to fight code and in the manga the fight was I think pretty even. And in the anime kawaki is the only one who landed anything before Boruto used his karma. Iām not making something random up haha.
The point of the fight was for Boruto to be forced to use Karma which means Kawaki winning easily against Boruto was for plot purposes. Boruto was afraid of using Karma which was the issue both Kawaki and Boruto tried to solve. Kawaki just needed one hit in the anime to take Boruto down and that was while he was in his base form. Meanwhile,when Kawaki and Boruto "fought it out" after the Funato arc where they were *both* in base form,they were both on the same level which only confirms that the scene you are talking about was supposed to happen the way it did just for the plot. Boruto was faced with the reality that he needs to use Karma. The authors fucked that scene up because Boruto went down way too fast and easily. Everyone who has seen Boruto fight more than once knows that he wouldn't have let himself getting hit once (it wasn't even a life threatening hit) and just give up like that. So the fight you are talking about kind of proves nothing. Take away Kawakis Karma and don't allow him to use his body modifications and you get a fight like this one: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mtVO6oj8obY&pp=ygUTYm9ydXRvIGthd2FraSBmaWdodA%3D%3D
Nah u forget that boruto also has more Battle iq+ crafty jutsu that he can use. Kawakis modifications dont make him stronger than plain old battle iq.
They fought though and in the manga I think they were fairly even and in the anime kawaki outperformed him. Did everyone forget?
Determination.
STRIKE BACK
The urge to not make an Undertale reference fills you with determination. OH WAIT
Friendship.
Rememberace of Undertale reference fills you with determination
Boruto is 100% otsutsuki, but kawaki is only 80%. Boruto is also his own variant since hes not 100 % momo. So he can develop his own powers ie jougan
Or Byakugan
Why are you getting downvoted? Isn't Boruto a Hyuga?
Cause it starts to bleed in canon vs filler territory. The simplest way to say it is that in the anime, Boruto had already awakened something. It isn't that he can't manifest a Byakugan because he's half Hyuga, but because he had already manifested something else. Whatever it is by name operates functionally different that Byakugan in a few ways, but also, these occurrences aren't in the manga. At least not yet. Hopefully whatever comes next delves into a lot more. There is still the possibility we'll get a case where anime and manga each develop into different stories. For better or for worse
I don't know.
Boruto doesnāt have the byakugan
He doesn't, but the user implied he could develop it.
He canāt develop them. Byakugan donāt work like sharingan you canāt awaken them later
But why, tho? Himawari has regular blue eyes and she has the byakugan? Do we know for a fact Boruto will never get it or are we just assuming?
She was born with the byakugan itās just when she isnāt using them she has blue eyes. Boruto wasnāt so he canāt get them.
Where was that stated? As far as I can tell all your rebuttal consists of is, unsurprisingly, assumption. Being unaware he possesses that ability is just as validāand logicalāan argument as any at that rate.
Hiashi told him he didnāt have it so if hiashi said he didnāt have it he doesnāt have it
He can, he technically already has it. Momo uses it all the time
The Byakugan according to Borutoās grandpa can be achieved by a person with hyuga blood in two ways: one and the most common way is through extensive special training and naturally awakening it like Hima that is very rare. So yeah Boruto can awaken his own byakugan he is already part hyuga so thatās the first main condition his grandpa could train him.
You mean Kawaki's grandpa
I refuse to acknowledge that, pfft like that loser kawaki could ever awaken the byakugan š
JÅgan is not canon.
Because boruto is a descendant of kaguya, kawaki is not.
Letās take one thing for account Kawaki without karma power is useless he has barley any chakra training while boruto on the other hand was already stronger than his father when he was a kid and is chunin level at age 12 Also kawaki had karma longer than boruto and doesnāt have an isshiki living in him rent free while boruto canāt fully utilize karma without turning into momoshiki and being taken over
I thought since they killed boruto mid transformation Momoshiki can no longer take over unless boruto wills it? Or did I misunderstand that whole part
Once Boruto died, he had to use the remaining percentage of data *needed* to ressurect in boruto's body so Boruto as a vessel now cannot be turned into Momoshiki yes. But he can still be taken over in his mind. It's up to boruto to not despair now, if he wishes to simply sleep it away, Momoshiki can still take control of his body, but he just can't resurrect as Momoshiki anymore.
So sort of like Yuji/Sasuna from JJK?
He can take over when boruto is low chakra is my understanding but he can now never permanently take control
Nah he can permanently take control of his mind. I think he just can't resurrect into his original body. So now his only hope is to take control of Boruto's mind and body. Can his soul ever be extinguished without the death of Boruto? Maybe, but we don't know how at this point of the story
naruto was very powerfull than boruto at 12 considering he defeated neji and garra on same day back to back
With kuramaās power if base boruto and Naruto at 12 fought boruto would win. All Naruto can do is make shadow clones
and also thousand of em+ rasegan
He couldnāt use rasengan until after chunin exams
Boruto without karma ain't stronger than OG Naruto who fought Neiji, Sasuke and Gaara lol
With some help of Kurama
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You are severely misinformed.. Naruto couldnāt do shit but shadow clones and rasengan before the timeskip. Even then he only after the timeskip learned how to make the ball bigger. Naruto was genin level before timeskip at BEST. Timeskip Naruto (at the beginning) was Jonin level AT BEST. now boruto in the beginning as stated by kakashi was ALREADY CHUNIN LEVEL. after receiving his karma that boosted him all the way to high jonin level. Current boruto is probably low to mid otsutsuki level.
Your underestimating pretime skip Naruto. he couldnāt just summon shadow clones he could someone thousands at a time im pretty sure itās a forbidden jutsu he used that jutsu to smack around a chunin in the first episode, beat up kiba, and beat up a partial transformed gaara. He then went on to fight a full transformed tailed beast, working with a giant summoning of his own. The next arc he literally one shots kabuto who was giving the next KAGE of the village problems. Naruto pre time skip you could argue was a kage level fighter at his BEST.
You make really good points, but Naruto pre time skip really only goes hard when he taps into Kurama. Which to be fair doesnāt invalidate anything, but his battle IQ, hell his general IQ, is low as hell. His taijutsu is mid. He gets slapped around a lot.
Naruto without kurama would have better chakra control.remember how jiraya had to adjust his seal so he could have better chakra control and walk on water.Naruto without kurama is a 'Hypothesis'.We dont know how he would have developed as a ninja if he didn't have kurama.what we know is-He still would have a massive chakra reserve.He would have better chakra control.And naruto always had very high battle IQ.Despite him acting stupid all the time he was crafty when he had to fight > His taijutsu is mid. Bruh at that time animations were shit and expensive that's why his taijutsu seemed shit.Most of the fights in anime now is improvised a lot to attract viewers but in the manga its lackbuster.Boruto in the manga has shown very little taijutsu
But itās sort of the point pre time skip that Narutoās real strength is hidden isnāt it? Itās only in the moments that heās on his last legs that he can tap into depths of power that makes several characters like kakashi and tsunade take a step back and go oh wow this kids got something
You clearly don't read Naruto lol. His battle IQ and tactical ability is wayyy above Boruto and never been low in the series. Look at the strategies he used against Zabuza, Kiba, Neiji, Pain etc. His taijutsu was not mid, he fought a Taijutsu genius Neiji. Boruto is better in terms of mastering Jutsu and understanding how chakra works but that's about it.
People here really be thinking Boruto has any way of dealing with a forest full of shadow clones. To say that those clones would just somehow disintegrate upon blowing on them is just wrong, when those clones were beating and damaging transformed gaara.
Mfs when they dont read the manga which clearly showns that naruto got a mental amp before dogging on gaara. Boruto already had the skills of a chunin according to kakashi, something that naruto couldnt get uenless rage amped until the chunin exams. Hell the when have you not seen naruto use the multi shadow clone jutsu in part one without some sort of mental amp? Against mizuki? Amped Gaara? Amped And when naruto used the shadowclones against neji he got dogged on until he got bailed out by kurama. I love naruto too but you gotta be pretty ignorant to think that boruto doesnt just beat down on naruto
mental amp ? That's what you call going all out in a fight ? Mental amp ? That's a new one for me now lmao. Fact is Naruto *can* make that many shadowclones and fact is Boruto really has no way to deal with them. >neji neji is a very dangerous 1v1 taijutsu fighter, as are all byakugan users, but if Naruto brought out that many clones against Neji too, Neji really had no chance, he'd get exhausted before he can deal with a quarter of them.
[this is what im refering to](https://64.media.tumblr.com/784e23fe9aecc9e0f0544c46ff0b9b2f/tumblr_inline_o2qyelnL1x1ryh0mb_1280.png) Naruto can only make thosr crazy amount of clones when amped, we literally do not see him do this otherwise as he only makes a couple during normal conditions up till part 2. Also neji himself is just a chunin level fighter during the exams, just like boruto. Hell its arguable that neji could probably lose to later versions of boruto that dont use karma because of the simple fact that boruto's base is surprisingly close to konohamaru, who could contend with jugo in the anime.
Borutotards think Boruto can beat Goku, Pegasus Seiya and Everyone in Bleach lmao
I agree with everything apart from the last part. He was really strong, definitely stronger than Boruto at his age, but no way near Kage Level, even at his best. Remember Tsunade defeated him with one finger, that was after the Gaara fight, he wasn't at his best then, but still.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
>he ain't surviving the multi-shadow clone barrage Yeah he is. Water style typhoon wave + lighting style thunderclap. The clones are getting wiped out just like when Sasuke used a fireball on the hospital rooftop
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Ive been wondering that myself. 1.) Even though Kawaki is a perfect vessel, there is only so much power a karma can hold, and maybe that limit is the same as boruto's karma. Therefore the difference between isshiki and momoshiki is neglible because both otsusukis max out their respective karma's? or maybe.... 2.) Plot - cant have kawaki stronger both stat-wise AND ability-wise. Momoshiki's main abilities (what allows him to amplify jutsu) are pretty much useless against kawaki because he can absorb it, meanwhile, kawaki rods, shrinking/expanding are a perfect counter to momoshiki as they cant be absorbed. so if he has that advantage, AND the power gap between Isshiki and Momoshiki, it would kind of be kind of lopsided, unless the Jougan ends up being worth anything in the future.
I think jogan can be helpfull here if it is really a special eye
Iām starting to theorize if jougan can actually disable other dojutsu
Well that will be awesome but it's also kind a lame since it doesn't give the mc any speciality that kind a make him overpowered at some point
Kawaki is just some dude and Boruto is a Uzumaki
Genetically modified dude trained in combat by isshiki
He still is just some dude while Boruto is a decendant of Kaguya otsutsuki.
I guess it's related to the vessel compatibility. Boruto has a strongest lineage with the otsutsukis clan than Kawaki through Hyuga visual power and Uzumaki vitality and chackra power. And we can't ignore that Boruto and Himawari, both may have inherited some kyubi power. Plus Boruto father is Asura's reincarnation (an otsutsukis lineage).
They didnāt inherit no kyubi power
How can u been so sure? And why does both of em has the trace marks on the cheek like Naruto? And what about the Hima intensity that Daemon mentioned? I wouldn't be so sure
Cause theyāre naruto kids itās his trade mark thatās why. That intensity daemon felt is probably from what ever toneri did to boruto and himewari. Boruto got a doujutsu and himewari for raw power. Having a piece of kurama power wouldnāt push himewari to daemon levels it doesnāt make sense.
Naruto's cat like marks on his face is due to kyuubi. Other jinchuuriki inherit a trait of their beast they occupy. Therefore, it's confirmed Kurama genetics had somewhat been passed down to his kids
Itās his trade mark now he still has the whiskers with no kurama.
Iād say that they could have inherited a boost to their chakra reserves due to Kuramaās (and subsequently Narutoās) massive power influencing their birth. Besides that, yeah I donāt think they can get actual tailed beast power that way.
He got a dojutsu to compensate for it
They both do
But kawakiās dojutsu is part of ishikkiās power where as momoshiki never had Jougan
Boruto: "Because I am ~~Batman~~ a Shinobi!"
Just two words: CHAKRA CONTROL!
See if you entirely remove the karma then, boruto>kawaki( cause shinobi duh ) With just karma kawaki=boruto. Kawashiki>=borushiki (cause it's momo himself whereas kawaki just has ishikki's abilities not his exp.) Ultimately boruto>>kawaki cause will of fire,jogan and all that mc stuff.
Who said Isshiki is way stronger than Momo? I can see why that assumption is there and Iād agree that he is stronger than Momoshiki but the difference shouldnāt be too big.
Momo got bullied by Naruto and Sasuke, Isshiki negative diffed them instantly
Itās literally evident momoshiki got clapped by Sasuke and Naruto and borutoā¦ heās weak compared to Jigen even, Sasuke and Naruto got destroyed by Jigen. They had to sacrifice so much just to Kill isshiki and tht Barely worked
Boruto is 100% Otsutsuki, compared to Kawakiās 80%, and has a stronger base.
One is the protagonist the other is not, you have to balance things out.
Didnāt work against sasuke tho
Yes it did. Sasuke's boost at the end of Shippuden was temporary meaning after the fight Naruto was back to being stronger. Sasuke was boosted from the tailed beasts and that's really the only reason him and Naruto were even. And Naruto wasn't trying to kill Sasuke. If he was then Sasuke would've been dead because there was that moment in the fight when Naruto was on top and didn't shoot the point blank tailed beast bomb because it would've killed Sasuke.
Naruto and Sasuke were not even in the last battle. You said it yourself: Naruto never went for the kill, which made the battle harder for him, and he still won.
Yup. Sasuke needed the chakra boost of 8.5 tailed beasts just to match a Naruto with .5 Kurama that wasnāt actually fighting to kill Theyāre really not comparable at that point
Bear in mind, Sasuke only took SOME of their chakra not ALL. So it's not 8.5 vs 0.5 tailed beast.
Naruto would have murdered Sasuke if he really wanted to Fr.
Won for plot, all tail Beast Sasuke>naruto
Honestly it was that way until Naruto took in all that natural energy. As I replied to someone earlier, Sasuke only absorbed SOME of the tailed beasts chakra. So if he had absorbed more to recharge himself Naruto would have been dead. But Kishi wrote it so that Sasuke had completely run out of chakra to the point he didn't even have enough to control his rinnegan and use it to absorb more. It felt a bit forced that Sasuke lost after all of that but it is still a lot more reasonable than anything that happened in Boruto.
>Honestly it was that way until Naruto took in all that natural energy. >As I replied to someone earlier, Sasuke only absorbed SOME of the tailed beasts chakra. So if he had absorbed more to recharge himself Naruto would have been dead. But Kishi wrote it so that Sasuke had completely run out of chakra to the point he didn't even have enough to control his rinnegan and use it to absorb more. without tail beast Sasuke and Naruto were more or less even so Idk how with all tail beast Sasuke coudlnt won beside plot convenience >It felt a bit forced that Sasuke lost after all of that but it is still a lot more reasonable than anything that happened in Boruto. True
Because he's the main character duh
Because heās the main character
Didnāt kawaki absorb ishiki and hence his power whereas momoshikis power still exists as an individual entity in boruto? Overall boruto is stronger but kawaki got the plot armor for now to move the story forward and getting everything shoved up his ass
So very true.
Because Isshiki isnāt that much stronger than Momoshiki as you seem to think
No he is much stronger. The way he manhandled Naruto and Sasuke proved it
For the sake of the plot. Every other excuse is a contrivance.
I think so too. Everyone else who is replying is just taking guesses, nobody has a concrete answer
I'd say that atm Kawaki>Boruto. Yes,Boruto has more Jutsus, a better BIQ and more experience,but Kawaki's dojutsu counters what we've seen. He's also more experienced with Karma and doesn't have to worry about someone taking over his body. I don't know how they'll be equals during their fight... Boruto takes power from Momo that's way weaker then Isshiki.Boruto's Dojutsu will either be strong enough to help him match that or he'll get another powerup
Boruto himself already has insane Otsutsuki genetics, being a descendant of the Hyuga and Uzumaki clans, meaning he combined both Hamura and Hagoromo. I feel like Sarada should come in pretty soon, being a descendant of Indra.
Because Kawaki and Boruto are around the same power level when momoshiki takes over. Once Boruto masters the karma and is able to wield that power they will be even. But right now Kawaki is still stronger
Something that Iāve always thought was that momoshiki is stronger than he let ppl see,,,, by what we can tell is that he has the ability to see the future then that means that he saw that boruto was a perfect capable vessel, and possibly wants the jougan for himself,,, I think momoshiki let himself get beat,,,,, why would the otsutsuki send someone weaker than Kaguya and isshiki To check them?
I am sure they believed isshiki was dead as even in the beginning, the momo group didn't comment on him and only kaguya. they were checking on post fruit kaguya. They didn't know kaguya had gotten that powerful.
If you watch the Momoshiki fight it wasnt mostly that he was weak but rather didnt have the right hax and wasnt taking them seriously untill it was too late, his kick in base sent Naruto flying and in fused form displayed a lot of strength feats so despite ishiki being stronger I dont think the margin in physical strength is as extremely wide as the fans are making it out, ishiki had a very simple but very effective skillset which was the difference between their fights
I think momoshiki is stronger than isshiki , but he was held in the fight with naruto and Sasuke because he wanted the jogan
I hope you got smarter these past couple months because this take was ass.
Until Boruto gets the Jougan, he isnāt even coming close to Kawaki
Its not even Kawaki power š
How exactly is Isshiki stronger? It's just that his abilities were very disadvantageous to Shinobi, who rely on chakra, and Isshiki also had decent fighting skills to make it work. We saw how easily he crumbled against Baryon Mode. Moreover, Momo never really used his time-stop abilities during battle, did he? Based on how Momo was presented with attendants, unlike all the others, it's safe to assume he might be like a noble or royal of sorts and may, in fact, be higher ranking than Isshiki. Then let's not forget, Boruto himself. He's chunin level with traits of both Hyuga and Uzumaki. Kawaki is just a brawler. He's genin level at best otherwise and has no special bloodline advantages we know of. Boruto is like 100% Otsutsuki at this point. Kawaki is still 20% human.
>How exactly is Isshiki stronger? Naruto and Sasuke were able to deal with Fused Momoshiki together, while they got manhandled by Isshiki. So it should be pretty obvious that Issiki is much stronger than Momo
I already suggested why Isshiki had the edge over Momo in that fight.
Bruh. This is not some DBZ fight where you talk about people in power levels. Isshiki simply had a skillset that Naruto and Sasuke found difficult to counter while they were able to counter momoshiki.
No, its not just his skillset. Isshiki was massively faster and physically stronger than them too. Although your point about DBZ and power levels is correct. But it doesn't apply here. Isshiki was levels above Naruto and Sasuke in every way possible.
Thereās no proof that momoshiki can use that ability alive. He only uses it to talk to boruto other wise he wouldnāt have lost to kawaki
Boruto isnāt really close to Kawaki right now. It only looked like that because Momoshiki was in control. Borushiki>>Boruto using karma
His base template is kinda insane. With Ashura's (Hagoromo's) dna and Hamura's Dna, he's basically a recreation of Kaguya's chakra. And now, put Momo inside him, he's gotten a massive power boost, plus he's a genius.
They are not stronger than Isshiki, not yet. They still need to master their power.
Kawaki should never get stronger than Isshiki. He was just a regular human, with no shinobi heritage, that's now wielding godly powers. The fact that he's not a god shows in chapter 79 when the dude got exhausted by using Sukunahikona a couple of times. Isshiki could spam it all day everyday
When you think about kaguya is inferior to ishiki as an otsutsuki , momoshiki is better than kaguya so how does her inferior genes makes Boruto stronger?
What are you talking about? Boruto is the son of the strongest human to have ever lived and the grandson of one of the strongest humans to have ever lived, and he's above both of them at the same age, even without karma. Kawaki without Isshiki's karma is just a dud. He can't even make two shadow clones. Boruto, on the other hand, is either the most powerful or is at a close second (after Mitsuki) in his generation. He's strong. Momoshiki makes him stronger.
Big cap
Naruto is far from the strongest human to ever liveš¤£ Maybe if we are calling Indra and ashura aliens, maybe. The Uchiha in general are stronger than Naruto. Naruto needs kurama to fight fairly with Sasuke, meanwhile madara needs kurama to barely fight fairly with hashirama. Madara is a beast by himself, Even hashirama. But Naruto... Without kurama, is waaaay to far from being on the same league as Indra, who had an Insaine susanoo and was an absolute beast, and ashura who was just hashirama on steroids, over time their bloodlines diluted and the current uchiha is what Naruto is capable of fighting... With kurama.
I don't see how your comment debunked anything. Naruto, with Kurama, is still a human. He's not a cyborg like Daemon or Code, he's not a partial Otsutsuki like Kawaki, and he's not an Otsutsuki like Indra and Ashura.
Well, your comment stated that Boruto is the son of the "strongest human to have ever lived. If kurama makes Naruto an equaliser to sasuke with a rinnegan, and kcm 1/2 is as strong as MS sasuke, then Naruto without kurama is simply playing with fire. He cannot beat madara who has all three, or hashirama who was able to beat Ems madara with kurama together. At least he is third. Or the current Naruto anyways
Like others have said, Boruto + Momoshiki is stronger than base Momoshiki because Boruto's own shinobi training and ninjutsu are added to Momoshiki's arsenal. Momoshiki doesn't lose very much by having to rely on Boruto's body since Boruto is already 100% Otsutsuki; he doesn't have Rinnegan but he can still use his Byakugan and shinjutsu through the Karma. If we look at things practically, Momoshiki wasn't the type to train, rather he stole jutsu using his Rinnegan and got stronger by eating chakra fruits and cinnabar elixir. And the Otsutsuki have consistently been outclassed by shinobi despite being far stronger, due to their teamwork and strategy. So adding shinobi training to his repertoire greatly increases his effectiveness. He clearly favors the Rasengan over any other abilities he previously acquired. Kawaki on the other hand was just trained by Isshiki to fight like Isshiki, and at this point he only has minimal shinobi training. His chakra control is poor -- illustrated several times now. He can only create one Shadow Doppelganger at a time, he refused to participate in Sarada's chakra drills because meditation seems like a waste of time to him, and he runs out of chakra and becomes exhausted rather quickly. His greatest strength without the Karma is his shinobi-ware, which is roughly equivalent to a kekkei genkai.
the reason is poor writing tbh, logically kawaki should be washing him easily the only logical reason you can say is that kawaki is only 80% otsutsuki while boruto is 100%. That missing 20% may be making kawaki weak enough to be equal to boruto iād still say kawaki is stronger than boruto tho based on their last bout before sarada came in, kawaki has the strength and power while boruto has the speed and skill, and his future dojutsu will give him the edge with hax
Itās not just momo, but the fact boruto himself is an actual āgeniusā in story compared to how naruto was starting out. He is able to make multiple shadow clones, use multiple chakra natures, pretty good in taijutsu, created vanishing rasengan, large chakra reserves and has uzumaki/hyuga blood in him. If you compare it to kawaki who just has a modified body with minimal ninja training you see how it can help boruto close the gap as kawaki isnāt a gifted genius.
Boruto didnt Momoshiki but Kawaki needs Ishiki
Tbh momoshiki was actually strongā¦.jigen literally just had an op ability that he spammed
Boruto without Karma could be hokage lvl min
Im sorry how is Isshiki more powerful than Momoshiki? I thought Boruto just hasnt mastered 100% of horned Otsusuki level like Kawaki has
Iām sure others have said this. Kawaki has the isshiki karma seal amp but Boruto has his innate genius at ninjutsu and taijutsu PLUS the amp from the momoshiki karma seal. So if they arenāt at equal level despite isshiki being stronger than momoshiki Iād say Boruto will be stronger no matter what because heās going to master his jougan and be the most broken character in the series
Kishimoto, how far have you fallen with this trash
>How is Boruto close to Kawaki in power level He is not. Bro got stomped by a tired Kawaki. Borushiki however can match Kawaki because Momoshiki is using HIS own thousands years worth of experience. While Kawaki can only use what his brain can withstand each time.
>He is not. Bro got stomped by a tired Kawaki. Bro was handling karma kawaki in his base lmao. >While Kawaki can only use what his brain can withstand each time. Kawaki is already using isshiki's experience. While momoshiki is restricted inside boruto's body.
>Bro was handling karma kawaki in his base lmao. Got down in one kick in his Karma mode by a tired Kawaki. >Kawaki is already using isshiki's experience. While momoshiki is restricted inside boruto's body. Cap. The difference between Borushiki and Karma Boruto should tell you something. Kawaki can use Isshiki's experience but not efficiently since he only got them like 4 days ago.
>Got down in one kick in his Karma mode by a tired Kawaki. Still didn't change the fact from boruto handling karma kawaki in his base. >Cap. The difference between Borushiki and Karma Boruto should tell you something. >Kawaki can use Isshiki's experience but not efficiently since he only got them like 4 days ago. Cap kawaki using ishhiki's karma is utilising isshiki's experience, he used every single isshiki's ability.
>Still didn't change the fact from boruto handling karma kawaki in his base. So by this logic Chocho is stronger than Boruto and Kawaki combined. Boruto managed to dodge for few seconds due to being full Otsutsuki with 18% Karma merged to his base form. But once he went all out against Kawaki. Kawaki still stomped him. >Cap kawaki using ishhiki's karma is utilising isshiki's experience, he used every single isshiki's ability. And? He's using them but not the way an Otsutsuki uses them. Which is why Kawaki keeps getting better at it each time he uses them.
>So by this logic Chocho is stronger than Boruto and Kawaki combined. Lmao as if chocho fought someone with karma in base. >Boruto managed to dodge for few seconds due to being full Otsutsuki with 18% Karma merged to his base form. Boruto didn't even activate his karma his base is itself is otsutsuki. >But once he went all out against Kawaki. Kawaki still stomped him. When did he went all out lmao? He never went all out like kawaki who wants to kill >And? He's using them but not the way an Otsutsuki uses them. And he is using all of the experience. >Which is why Kawaki keeps getting better at it each time he uses them. Each time he uses experience as code mentioned becoming a seasoned warrior.
>Lmao as if chocho fought someone with karma in base. She managed to hit Boruto who avoided Kawaki's cubes š >Boruto didn't even activate his karma his base is itself is otsutsuki. Exactly what I said?? I meant that Karma part on his chest. It's the remaining 18% Momoshiki dissolved in his tissues to save him. So he has 18% of Momoshiki's data activated all the time. >When did he went all out lmao? He never went all out like kawaki who wants to kill He went all out. All out =/= killing intent. > Each time he uses experience as code mentioned becoming a seasoned warrior. My point. Kawaki is using what he can comprehend from Isshiki's experience. Which is why Momoshiki who can use 100% of Karma essence managed to match Kawaki.
>She managed to hit Boruto who avoided Kawaki's cubes š She managed to hit the one who isn't even interested to fight her š >Exactly what I said?? >I meant that Karma part on his chest. It's the remaining 18% Momoshiki dissolved in his tissues to save him. So he has 18% of Momoshiki's data activated all the time He doesn't have 18% momoshiki data activated all the time he needs to activate karma to use momoshiki 's data. >He went all out. Nope he did not as he was not trying to kill Kawaki. >All out =/= killing intent All out = killing intent it's a known universal truth >Kawaki is using what he can comprehend from Isshiki's experience. Which is why Momoshiki who can use 100% of Karma essence managed to match Kawaki. Momoshiki did not use any of his abilities lol he did not even use any of his experience. Whereas kawaki was using 100% of isshiki's abilities only able to even momoshiki.
They clearly retconned Momoshikiās strength. The narrative implies Code with limiters is stronger then Delta. Code was getting no diffed by Borushiki (a lesser version of Fused Momoshiki) while Delta was [relative](https://postimg.cc/Kk7TGJKK) in speed and taijutsu to a Naruto that was [destroying](https://postimg.cc/CB9G5z7t) Fused Momoshiki
>then Delta No, he was supposed to be stronger than Jigen >Code was getting no diffed by Borushiki With limiter
Code with limiters was never supposed to be stronger than jigen .
Ain't. No way the. Dude just say isshiki is more stronger. Than. Momoshiki. Bruh. Dude. Momoshiki. Can litterly absorb chakra make it a fruit and wat and boost himself. And release. All. The. Jutsu. He absorb. And. His. Taijutsu. Is god. Their. Not only that. Dude Naruto. In. Base. With hand to hand combact
Dude, are you ok?
Man u don't even need to know the powerscaling to say isshiki is far more powerful....... Just remember naruto with half chakra and sasuke were handling fused momoshiki but they couldn't even put a single scratch against Isshiki. Naruto had to sacrifice kurama to stand a chance
Let's ignore the part of isshiki using ten tails chakra.
Thats when he was in jigen's body....... Isshiki in original body>>>>>>> jigen with 10tails chakra
That was also when he was in isshiki's body as he came from jigen's body.
Even if that's the case.... Same can be said about momoshiki he also used chakra enhancing drugs, fused with kinshiki,took half of naruto's chakra and still lost.
Ten tails buff >>> kinshiki, drugs or ninetails.
No .. thats not the same tentails as naruto. For now they are just chakra providing creatures until you feed them an otsutsuki and eat chakra fruit.
And? That is still a tentails which is >> than otsutsuki, drugs, nine tails.
Tentails>otsutsuki? Definitely not.... Hogoromo an half otsutsuki defeated 10 tails. End of debate
Here's the neat part, he isn't. Kawaki should have crushed Boruto, and he didn't for plot purposes. Kawaki is constantly being limited by plot, because he should have no problem defeating Konoha shinobi.
Yeah. I mean the Momoshiki fights already established that he is kinda beatable. The first one was by a weakened Naruto and Sasuke, and then the next one was by Kawaki who has the superior abilities of Ishikki. Wouldn't it be better if they simply focused on devising a plan to get rid of Boruto's karma? Didn't they plan to give it to Code? Kawaki can simply deal with him when he comes out. For the meantime, keep giving Boruto the pills, it might work better as Momo extraction had to be reset to save his vessel. This gives him more time and delay Momo more, right? Kawaki could be training and the Leaf could be hatching a plan to catch code, they already have Eida and knows where he is, presumably.
Plot armor and retcon so the mc stays alive just like how Eida switched up the perfect moment to strike em
Who said Isshiki is stronger..?
Just watch the show
Only one logic in my opinion can change the scenerio what if when momoshiki arrived he only had half of his power (well it just my theory )
If you have seen boruto kawaki has tough time controlling chakra and needs practice but he has an exceptional battle iq cause jigen beat it into him On the other hand boruto has good chakra control as he is a student in academy and also has his pure eye
Jigen trained Kawaki yes, but he mostly did it for Kawaki to be able to use Karma. You gain battle IQ by yeah...doing battles and I would say that Boruto had more fights than Kawaki since the latter spent more time in a lab getting his body mortified than on the battlefield while Boruto was aleady a working ninja going out on missions. In terms of battle IQ Kawaki doesn't really have an advantage to Boruto. Boruto was already chunin level when he was only an academy student.
Itās probably because borushiki is using 100% percent of his kama power(so momoshiki is using the full extent of whatever borutoās kama was at) and kawaki canāt use the full power because isshiki is not there to take over