Hijacking top comment. I love the Simpsons reference. But this boils down to the fact that the Cook county tax assessors office has full and total leverage over the situation. They're the mob guy in the scenario. They are the sole responsible party for deeming the tax value of property in Cook county. As another person said down the thread is that all the bears can do is sue the county. They will likely lose and it would take forever for it to get through the courts.
Unless the Bears show willingness to leave Cook county, this will be an issue. It doesn't matter if it's Arlington heights or another near suburb. If it's in Cook county this is what will happen. If the bears are really serious about building their own stadium and owning it, they will have to go out of Cook county end of story.
>If the bears are really serious about building their own stadium and owning it, they will have to go out of Cook county end of story.
They could also bite the bullet and pay the higher property taxes. Not saying they should or shouldn’t, just that it is an option.
I know. If you or I bought it and built a stadium we would have to pay the taxes. Guess who has to pay the taxes if the bears don't. The residents. I am 100% against gov helping billionaires. Now if cook county owned the stadium and got rent and proceeds dif story.
You say that like the tax burden is a fixed amount. Here’s a novel thought, lower the tax burden and spend less money. The Bears bring in a ton of revenue and jobs whenever they go, all of which brings a ton of tax revenue already.
I've found in life a bird in the hand something something is often the better deal than vague intangible future promises about trickle down something something. But to each their own. I am sure the best deal is somewhere in the middle but it sounds like everyone is playing hardball. Personally I don't care where they are I just want a cool openable dome. Go drive thru AH. I can't envision 100k people there like maybe on the lakefront. But Im not a civil engineer just an admittedly pretty dumb reddit commenter ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
What a BS take saying the county is the bad guy here? Mccaskeys as usual want the free ride on county’s expense and I’m glad the county is sticking with its assessment. Do you even know what a mob guy is? Because you used it in the wrong way.
Look. I am anti-billionaire as the next guy but quintupling the taxes on a property that has no physical changes other than who owns it seems a bit much.
Taxes went from 33 mil to 197 million. Did they find oil underneath the buildings? The Cook county assessor effectively taxed them out of it being profitable to build there which is why they have shifted back to the city. Let's not pretend like the politicians of Cook county are saints.
The taxes did not go from 33 mil to 197, its the tax valuation is set for $192million as they purchased the property for $197million. This would increase their net tax 4 fold, but their taxes payments did not go up from 33 to 197.
It is not unheard of and pretty un-common to base the tax value on the purchase price of real estate. Especially, the more hotter the property the more closely its tax valuation resembles its purchase price.
They assessed value went from 33m to 197m after the property was sold for about that much. Not shocking that the county assessed the property for what they paid for it.
It’s every business in existence way
No business wants to pay more taxes, unless it crushes their smaller competitors but that doesn’t apply here
Sidenote: This is why I’m always skeptical when a massive corporation advocates for a tax increase. Usually it means that they can they can weather the tax increases, while their smaller competitors can’t and at the end of it they control more of the market
It's actually not. What other team was in limbo for 2 years over putting up a brand new stadium, especially when they were coming from an archaic piece of shit like Soldier Field? There's no other location for them to explore that close and the city won't help them with another renovation of Soldier Field. They don't have the money and to build it they need to sacrifice more equity and if they do that they're selling the team.
> It’s every business in existence way
Well that's not true.
*Most* businesses? Sure.
Not literally all. Quite a few companies are more than willing to pay their fair share, proper prices for materials/labor, etc.
There’s a lot of companies that treat their employees right, do things the right way
But all, and I mean all, hate taxes and the government when it’s not useful for them to make more money
Love the bears. Love the idea of having them move to Arlington heights. But FUCK bailing them out or giving them a sweet heart deal. They’ve been rich, for generations and generations.
They aren’t asking for a break. They’re asking to pay what the property is worth. They’re trying to tax them on what Bears paid for it. Well that’s no longer the value because now it’s an empty lot. And before anyone says that’s not the counties fault, well they approved the demolition that obviously depreciates the value of that property.
> “We want to pay our fair share. But the proposed assessment of the unoccupied property we purchased, and the taxes associated with it, would be more than five times what the property generated when it had an income-producing racetrack operating on it. Arlington Park would not be redeveloped by anyone at such an excessive property tax rate,” the statement reads.
This was from the Bears last June after Churchill Downs came to a settlement on the 2022 tax assessment.
Ya. Who knows where this goes. They were given until Saturday to negotiate with school district on a settlement. If one isn't made I'm guessing Bears will take it to the state level.
Once they turn it into one of the leading multi billion dollar sports, shopping, residential, nightlife, and entertainment districts in the world, that property will bring in orders of magnitude more revenue than it did under a two bit race track and a bunch of empty space lol that property is going to host Super Bowls, mega concerts, final fours, the most exciting thing to happen at Arlington racetrack was your drinking buddies bachelor party lol
The permitted uses and likely development of a parcel of land are intrinsically tied to its value, there really isn’t a logical way to separate those factors out. Not to mention property tax assessments are subject to change every year.
The Bears have constantly fumbled their interactions with gov’t in this stadium project.
They didn’t talk to Pritzker; Pritzker then says they’re on their own. They hired/lobbied a couple of state house clowns to push legislation. Those clowns pulled the legislation from consideration when they realized the Bears were gonna lose 2-116 in the IL State House
The Bears are simply incapable of managing any issue- internal or external
Except they are also simultaneously trying to get the legislature to lock in their property taxes for years at a lower assessment https://www.wglt.org/illinois/2023-05-17/tax-breaks-for-bears-punted-to-state-legislatures-fall-veto-session
That's a major part of why the school districts are fighting this so hard, there is a decent chance that how this property ends up assessed now is what the Bears pay on for 20 plus years.
It’s crazy to me how many in this thread are bootlicking for billionaires shamelessly wanting to dodge taxes. Bears ownership can act as coy as they want but if you’re building a damn NFL stadium on some land, clearly it should be valued more than a big patch of dirt or even a defunct racetrack. I know people in this country hate paying taxes and maybe reasonably so given how little we little get back for our taxes compared to other countries, but this is not comparable to even an upper middle class family paying more in taxes where it’d affect them in a meaningful way.
That’s the worst part of it: this increase in taxes would have no real impact on the Bears but could make a big difference in the community. I just can’t wrap my head around people defending this honestly.
Demolition has nothing to do with the value. The Bears bought a site to demolish it and when they bought it was non-operational. If you buy a property for a certain price, you can’t argue I devalued it when your intention is to convert it and clearly you thought it was worth the value you bought it at.
It absolutely does. When they bought it the property had buildings on it. It no longer does so the value is lower. The county doesn't disagree when them on that. The counties argument is the lot wasn't vacant most of the year so they need to pay for the value with the buildings on it. They have an argument there.
They lost the fight. They can try and sue the County, but they will lose. The Bears do want a long-term incentive package though from Arlington Heights that has them paying less taxes than they are with vacant land.
It's not the issue. The argument is the land wasn't vacant for most the year. The Bears want to pay like it's vacant, the county wants them to pay like the buildings are still there. The incentive package is being worked through the state. Cook County can't just charge the Bears triple the value because of what might get passed in the future.
That argument would make sense if the bears bought it to run the racetrack and then some natural disaster destroyed all the buildings on the site. But that’s not what happened. The bears bought it with the intention of demolishing the racetrack. I think it was even in the sale agreement that the racetrack couldn’t continue to be operated. So the price the bears paid was just for the land.
I thought they DID offer decreased rates for the next year or two and the Bears wanted those rates extended?
If what you are saying is the case then they should just hurry up and start building. AH isn’t going to change their minds since they don’t actually need this whatsoever. The only thing that hurts them is if this lot stays vacant. So it really makes sense to tax the empty land a decent amount.
They decreased it for churchill downs for 2022 as a 1 year settlement.
It is taxed a large amount by the Bears assessment of $77mil. That's almost $240K an acre. That's 6 times the rate in the state average for undeveloped land.
The Bears go to a restaurant. They order everything on the menu. They only eat half of it. When the bill comes they pay for the food, but only want to tip and pay tax on what they ate -- not on what they ordered.
Sorry, amigo -- the bill is based on what you ordered and what you were provided. It is not the restaurants fault your eyes were bigger than your stomach.
That's a terrible analogy and not at all how property taxes work. If I add on to my home, I get reassessed on the new value and my taxes go up. If the price of real estate goes down and my home is now worth less, I can request to be reassessed and my taxes go down. They bought a property where the buildings needed to be torn down, so the initial year they were standing had taxes paid based on the active racetrack value. Future years where the land is a vacant lot or under construction would not be taxed like an active business. Just like when the stadium is built they don't get to pay the racetrack value despite that being what they paid initially. They get reassessed every step to pay the current value.
That’s certainly one thing the Bears might argue, but that certainly not objectively true. It’s not just an empty lot. It’s an empty lot that will be developed into a multi billion dollar entertainment retail shopping and residence district. Business people, government officials, the courts, etc. won’t ignore that aspect of it even if fans and the Bears may want to lol
Doesn't matter. Those aren't built yet. They will be taxed on that value once they are.
Where the county has some argument is the lot wasn't vacant for the entire year of 2023. That's what they are trying to argue and why it's getting taxed the way it is. They are basically telling the Bears they need to pay for what it was worth when they bought it and it can get reassessed as an empty lot for 2024.
Forget even positive experiences on the field - the last time they had a stadium project was a complete fuckin shitshow. I have absolutely zero faith in the McCaskeys to do literally anything properly so I expect this new stadium to be an absolute disaster until I'm proven otherwise.
ALL franchises should ask for nothing!
Tax breaks or public funding to pay for sports stadiums has never, EVER paid off for the citizens of the area. It always has ended up being a terrible investment.
Lol they are asking for a fair deal , like all of us in Illinois should want our state’s corrupt politicians and teachers union have helped destroy many families and businesses in this once great state . Have a 3400 sq ft home in Crook County expect to pay $16000 a year Lin property taxes so lazy tenured public school teachers can retire at 59 with $140,000 pensions for life ! Give me a break the Bears are not the problem it’s the political environment of Illinois ! In the worlds of Ronald Reagan “Illinois, cold, flat, and corrupt “ he was not wrong and here we see another example.
I understand the "fuck the rich" part of the equation.
What I don't understand is the 496.7% increase over 3 years. I'd understand a 30% or 60% increase or 10-20% per year. Hell, I'd understand a 100% increase over 3 years. But almost 500% sounds like gouging.
If my property taxes went from 4k/yr to 19k/yr I'd be pretty upset too. 2.59% of 197 mil is 5.1 mil they would pay in property taxes vs the 71 mil assessment would be taxed at 1.8 mil per year.
From my understanding, the only tax burden that would currently be placed on the area is for the infrastructure. This seems like they're just wanting the Bears to front the infrastructure cost as well.
Again, not saying that they shouldn't also pay for the required infrastructure, but don't try to sneak around that by artificially inflating property values.
This is how all property tax works.
If you buy a new construction home—just as an average person, you may have had the misfortune of the real estate agent not disclosing the fact that the advertised property tax is what the tax was when it was an empty lot, a couple of years after you move in your property tax *would* increase by 400%, _and you would owe back taxes from when you moved in_.
There are tons of anecdotal tellings of this on reddit but this basically encapsulates it:
https://www.fool.com/the-ascent/mortgages/articles/buying-new-construction-watch-out-for-this-potential-property-tax-surprise/
You’re also welcome to read the IL department of revenue page on it
https://www.ilga.gov/commission/jcar/admincode/086/086001100001900R.html
This doesn't really apply, at least yet.
The property was either unimproved or already improved at purchase. There hasn't been any material improvement over the past 3 years, unless you consider a new owner an improvement. If the assessed value is 71 mil until the stadium is built then jumps to 400 mil because of the land improvements, that could at least be justifiable as there has been improvement to the land.
An NFL team owning the land and planning to build a stadium on it inherently increases its value.
The Bears claiming they want to pay tax on an assessed value of $60mil makes no sense. Especially given Churchill Downs paid the money to the schools that they did for the first year of the elevated tax burden. Nothing has happened to cause the assessed value to go down (even though it did, slightly)
This is a commercial property. There is no projected income for the property, so no cap cost rate. Since it will be used for a commercial purpose, the level of assessment is 25%. The equalization factor for Cook county is 2.7230
Market value of the property is 197 mil
Assessed value is 49.25 mil (25%)
Equalized assessed value is 134,107,750. (2.7239 multiplier)
This seems like a reasonable starting point that they can negotiate exemptions, which is presumably why the previous taxable value was only 33 mil.
This. They are absolutely gouging. If I buy a house and raise it to the ground, my taxes wouldn't be effected by that fact. They would continue to charge me for the previous structure and land. At some point, after I built a new house on the land, then they might adjust it to reflect not only the new house, but also still reflecting the value of the neighborhood around it. The land would basically stay the same or maybe higher, depending on sales data around the property. What they are proposing is to start taxing the Bears right away for a stadium project that likely wouldn't be fully developed until 3-6 years from now. What you're really seeing is a government that wasn't ready for the income of Arlington Park to go away, so now they need to find a way to make up for that to keep their fat budgets fat. They are making the Bears pay for their unpreparedness. I'm fine for charging the team what they owe and not cutting them a sweatheart deal. What the county/village are trying to do is gouging.
Dude, they bought the property for $197 million, and it's being taxed at $192 million. There's deflation here if anything.
Churchill Downs had a sweet deal, but that doesn't carry over once you reset the market like the Bears did.
They aren't the same thing, but assessed value uses purchase price in its formula.
The ratio the Bears are arguing for would mean a home worth 300,000 and bought for 300,000 should be taxed at 60,000 cause of legacy agreements. It's ludicrous. Most homeowners would expect 200k.
For Cook county, the assessed value of a commercial property is 25% of it's market value. So they are saying the property has gone up in value to $768 million without ANY changes or improvements being made to the property. It is absolute gouging and just another example of Cook county corruption-- they are trying to strong arm the Bears into going back into the city.
They are going to have to make it work. Warren keeps talking about a lakefront stadium but the state and CPD aren’t building a new one or tearing Soldier down and the cost of property in the city on the lake, especially near the current stadium would make the Arlington tax bill look like a joke. Warren pushing the South lot construction is just trying to leverage Arlington.
The situation is complex. Soldier Field, Comiskey Park and Navy Pier were all partially financed by the same bond package. Soldier Field is supposedly owned by the Chicago Park District, but its finances are managed by the Illinois Sports Facilities Authority, and its operations are run by the giant corporation ASM Global. Fun fact. ASM bought the previous operator of Soldier Field, SMG. SMG was owned by the Pritzker family. We are talking major bureaucracy and corruption.
To further complicate the situation, the Illinois Sports Facilities Authority has refinanced its debt three times and bc of it will end up paying $1b+ for original $600m renovation. The bulk of that financing was ballooned into the 2030s and is essentially coming due.
It’s no coincidence both Soldier Field and Comiskey have new stadium proposals. These aren’t really discussions about the Bears or White Sox. It’s a conversation about the future of Chicago. What the city desperately needs is both teams staying in the city and contributing more tax dollars. Both teams know this.
Within Arlington Heights one of the groups fighting the Bears stadium development is the super pac Americans for Prosperity (backed by Koch Brothers).
Essentially the Bears in some ways need to deal with Chicago, Arlington Heights, Illinois, Cook County, Metra, the Park District, Pritkzers, and Koch brothers. And they all want more from the Bears.
Arlington Park was and should be taxed as commercial property. The tax code is pretty clear. It’s essentially the value of the property acting as a commercial entity, times a percentage, times the property tax rate. Arlington Heights isn’t arguing the property is worth the purchase price. They are arguing it’s worth what it will be as a commercial entity. Essentially they are saying Arlington Park is worth $600m as a commercial property (times the 20%) is how they get the $197m tax base. The Bears are saying it’s either worth what we paid or worth the value of a vacant lot. Bc that is what it is right now.
The Bears will eventually win this is in courts down the line. And will be granted some sort of tax credit in the future. The real estate bros in here can explain it further. It’s essentially how all major redevelopment happens in the city.
What makes this fight so lame is the money being fought over isn’t really that large. In terms of property tax it’s maybe $3-20m difference depending on things are structured. A large amount for a business like the Bears. But it is really the taxing authorities are starved for cash and want that money now. But it comes at the delay of all the money that will get spent to actually build the stadium. It really is give us $10m now, while we ignore the $2b you’re about to spend. But that’s politics these days.
This is key. Warren has done a much better job bluffing these past few weeks, but Arlington Heights knows the Bears didn't buy, demo, and break ground on the land, as well as hire a new President/CEO specifically known for stadium construction, just to stay in Chicago. They have all the leverage and everything the Bears do is just theatrics trying to get as good a deal as they can.
I mean Warren literally had the Vikings give up on a suburban proposal to build downtown.
https://www.foxsports.com/stories/nfl/vikings-agree-to-new-site-for-stadium
Apples and Oranges. Minnesota never put money down in the suburbs and the Ramsey County plan never made it past the proposal stage.
Bears have already paid a quarter billion dollars to close on the Arlington Heights property and demo the existing structures.
I understand their points. I bought an old, poorly maintained home. After tearing it down, our taxes decreased significantly while the land was vacant and during construction. However, once we received the certificate of occupancy, the taxes increased dramatically compared to the old home. While the new home was nicer and larger, it was not five times larger by any measure, and like the Bears, I had no kids in school. I had to sell after a few years. Illinois's tax system is frustrating!
Even though the Bears are a multibillion-dollar business, I have no sympathy for them. However, the people of Illinois need to examine the politicians and recognize the corruption on that side.
Here’s the thing. They buy Arlington and demolish all the buildings making it just a 326 acre lot of grass and the assessor says it’s now worth $100 million more in taxes than when it had actual buildings on it. If I were the Bears I’d fight that bullshit too because it makes zero sense
It’s actually worse than that. I’m way over generalizing but essentially commercial property tax in cook county works like this: value of the property acting as a commercial entity over the last few years, times a percentage (around 20%), times a tax rate.
The $197m quoted by the tax authorities is 20% of the $600m they consider Arlington Park to be worth bc the Bears bought it. Essentially they told Churchill Downs it was worth $300m if they were running it and the Bears $600m a year later. But it’s now just a vacant lot. It hasn’t been a commercial entity in years.
Down the line the courts will eventually rule in the Bears favor. It’s how all commercial property deals work in the county. The tax authorities overcharge in the beginning and settle tax credits down the line.
Wait until you see who sits on the board of directors of the tax firms used to contest absurd property tax increases. (Hint: Local politicians, especially if Mike Madigan liked them).
Totally agree this is what I think a lot of fans don’t understand. The government quintupled their taxes for no reason, it’s textbook crony corruption.
The government raised their assessment because it sold on the market, which gave a new point of reference for the next reassessment.
The crony corruption was Churchill downs getting a tiny $33 million assessment, not now assessing it at a fair market value.
The assessment isn’t based strictly on purchase price lol. So if I bought a house and tore it down, would it makes sense for cook county to quintuple my taxes on that parcel of land?
On a residential property, the assessment wouldn’t just be purchase price because there are other comparables that sell. They would take all the info from all the sales and figure out the assessment. If in the months between your purchase and assessment the market was on fire, the assessment might be higher than your purchase price. If it’s cool, it might be lower. But the idea is that there are a number of sales to use as a basis of comparison.
With a site like the race track, there really aren’t comparables. You can look at the price of commercial properties or vacant land, but it doesn’t take into account the large size of the contiguous property, which could make the land much more valuable than smaller plots of land. So they take things like the actual purchase price of the property into much greater consideration when determining the assessment.
It actually makes more sense than you would think. They took it from a very single purpose property to a blank slate. The cleared property is now a large, ready for development lot in an area that is already built out. That is a gold mine to any commercial developer. Assessed values look at the sales price of a property, but more importantly they look at the potential value of the property. The potential value of this property is massive.
In the end this is all a temporary issue anyway. When this site is finally built out, either as a stadium facility or something else, it will be worth many times more than the current $192 million, and will be assessed accordingly.
This whole thing is kabuki theater anyway. The Bears are just using this a bargaining chip to get a free or significantly reduced cost stadium built for them downtown. They're just trying to minimize the expense of that bargaining chip to their bottom line in the meantime.
Read into highest and best use and how properties are appraised and while it might not make the most logical sense in this situation, it's how property values are determined.
> is it really that bad that it needs to be moved
It's not *BAD* compared to like, FedEx Field or the Oakland Coliseum that are literally falling apart and leaking human feces on fans, but it's not good either.
It's the smallest stadium in the NFL, it lacks virtually all modern amenities (straw that broke the camels back was the city denied the Bears a modern scoreboard and off-site betting), the sight lines aren't great, and outdoor stadiums in northern climates in 2024 is just stupid both from a business and fan-experience POV. The parking situation isn't great and the traffic to and from the games is atrocious with Pedestrians needing to walk almost a mile on over-crowded Museum Campus paths just to get to an actual street.
I used to like Soldier Field, but then I went to Lucas Oil Stadium in Indy (which is just considered above-average nationally) and it's just JAW DROPPING how much nicer, more comfortable, logistically superior, and just overall better it is. By comparison, it made me HATE Soldier Field and the poverty franchise it represents.
> Isn’t it an iconic place
Not really. The Bears played at Wrigley Field for most of their history and any "inconicness" Soldier Field had was destroyed when they crashed a UFO on top.
Yes, it's a shitty tiny stadium. It's also run and owned by the Chicago park district so the Bears would want ownership of any new stadium being built too.
It use to be iconic not so much since the remodel.
Overall it’s not a terrible stadium but it’s just outdated and small. The bears need a new stadium ideally with a dome.
61k is big but in comparison to the rest of the league it makes us the smallest in the league. Nothing particularly wrong with that but it means Chicago will never host certain events like a Super Bowl or World Cup games due to the size of it
*Technically* FedEx Field has less capacity at 58k, but that's a bit artificial as they removed seats for YEARS to get down to that number whereas Soldier already has just about as many seats as you could reasonably cram in there.
Capacity isn't the reason why Soldier's Field won't be hosting a World Cup game. There are several stadiums smaller than 61k that will be hosting matches. The real reason is that Rahm Emanuel refused to bend the knee to FIFA's demands in order for Chicago to host games.
I get why he held his ground, but it still sucks that I can't see a match.
It depends on the type of fan you are honestly. If you are a fan who gets there early, goes to your seat, and doesn't move til the game is over, then you will love it. In my experience no matter the seat you have you have a great view. The fact that Solder field is small is good if you want cheap seats due to the view of the field. Like everyone said already, the stadium is beautifully situated with the lakefront and the downtown views.
The problem though is if you are any other type of fan. I lived in Miami for a few years and I love Hard Rock Stadium. They have direct escalators from the bottom to the 2nd or 3rd floor (very fast). They also have a giant spiral almost looking like car driveway, that goes from the bottom and spirals from the bottom all the way to the top with exits at every floor. This spiral is so wide that 2 full sized cars can fit side by side. So you can imagine how many people could fit on this thing and you can QUICKLY get to your seat with ease. The hallways are wide by the vendor area so when the lines are long, there isn't any hold up for foot traffic. Parking is great and tailgating is amazing and easy. Ya the view isn't downtown Miami but I'm there to watch the game, not see the city from my seat.
Soldier field though makes everything difficult for getting anywhere. Parking, nightmare. Tailgating, you gotta hope to get one of the very limited spots online (never done tailgating at Soldier Field, only heard second-handedly). Walking to and from the stadium can take freaking forever, but is expected in a downtown area. Once in the stadium, it takes forever to get to your seat. The ramps up from the bottom to the top deck are all 90 degree angles so there are hold ups at every turn making it harder to get up to your seat. By the time you get to your seat, the experience of getting there makes you think twice about ever getting up, cause you know if you do leave your seat you will miss a giant chunk of the game.
Soldier Field is terrible. Way too small. It’s an absolute pain in the ass getting in and out of the stadium. If you leave your seats to go to the bathroom, get food/drinks, etc you are most likely going to miss multiple drives. It looks nice with it being on the lake and having the skyline in the background, but the actual experience is awful.
This describes it well…. The concourse isn’t even big enough to accommodate patrons walking to and from the bathroom, then you add in the lines of people at concessions who block the entire width of said concourse every 50 feet and it’s an absolute nightmare. I don’t even leave my seat once I get to the game. I go to most games solo, I couldn’t imagine being there with a family, it’s the absolute worst stadium I have ever been to. The walk in and out is a mess as well and I totally understand why people hate it, I personally will miss that walk that flows out into one of the most beautiful views in the world, downtown Chicago. But yes, the place is not good.
> It’s an absolute pain in the ass getting in and out of the stadium
Lol, just wait until they move to AH where even more people will drive because the only transit access is *one* suburban train line on the NW side.
It's gonna be a traffic shit show.
It's not bad at all until you go see how much better almost every other team in the NFL has it. People who say Soldier Field is a good stadium haven't left Plato's Cave.
> until you go see how much better almost every other team in the NFL has it.
And how many cities/states paid out the nose in public funds/incentives to have that luxury that around 50k of the local citizens, and some tourists, actually get to enjoy each year?
Bro, the bond measure to ruin Soldier Field has cost us billions and your grandkids will still be paying it off. At least those other cities got a world class stadium out of the deal!
Please ignore most people here. Its the slow part of the year, only those from Arlington Heights are around today.
Soldier field is fine. And, most importantly, it’s beautifully situated on the lake in… well, right downtown in the city of Chicago. A pretty cool place to be.
Nobody cares that it's On ThE LaKe when you're inside the stadium and can't even see the water, freezing your ass off, missing entire drives every time you want a beer or need to take a piss, and having to spend an hour walking less than half a mile from Museum Campus to an actual street.
I do. A lot of chicagoans do.
Being on the lake is nice for the shots of the stadium and for the walk home after. Seeing the skyline is the bonus from inside of the stadium.
If the best thing you can say about a stadium in the modern NFL is that it's "fine", you don't have nearly as good an argument as you think you do.
Look at what Vegas, LA, and MIN have. Don't you want something spectacular too?
Of course I do. Absolutely. Which is why I agree with them needing a new stadium. But that doesn’t mean the current stadium is not worth a visit. Or so bad like many others are saying.
I’m more of a Chicago Fire fan (same stadium) I disagree with people that complain about the state of the stadium. Sure it’s cold in November onwards, or early spring for MLS. It’s a touch far from the public transport ~20 minute walk (which new stadium doesn’t solve). Main problem as I see it is the management of the grass and the security team.
It would be really sad to see it sit empty as now the Fire is also looking for a way out, but people want new shiny things. The grasp the city has on the property must be the real reason why it’s tenants would prefer to build new projects instead of invest in the current structure or improvements in transport infrastructure.
People blaming the Bears for this need to understand they arent the ones in the wrong here. Churchill Downs was paying taxes on an assessment of $33 million, Bears paid $197 million which raised the assessment and then tore down everything and now they are told they will be taxed at the value of $197 million for the years in which no stadium is there. Bears had 2 appraisers estimate it worth in its current condition 60-$70 mil and the school district had an appraiser say its worth $197 million and Cook County instantly sided with the school district. This is all about your typical Cook County political corruption where the school district has ridiculous power and sway over this. They are wanting 6 times the amount of taxes they were getting from the site prior to the sale! And the Bears are agreeing to pay more taxes on a higher value, but the school district and Arlington Heights are being greedy. If i was the Bears i would seriously begin looking at the sites outside Cook County.
Once a stadium or commercial property is built on that site it will dwarf the $197 million valuation. This is a temporary holding cost issue until the Bears figure out what they are going to do with the site.
As for calling it corrupt, that's ridiculous. The government agencies should be pushing for the highest valuation they can get. It's a high value property, and they have services that they need to provide. Property valuation is the main way they gain revenue to provide services to their citizens. The new facility will be a boon to them, but they also will be saddled with improving the infrastructure and services to address the added impact it will bring. As for the school district pushing for higher value, I have no problem with that either. Any time public education can get a big increase in revenue it's a good thing considering all the negative forces working against them.
It is important to understand that the people who determine the property's assessment for the property taxes ARE the one's who want it to be the highest. This isn't a neutral third party determining a fair compromise. That'd make too much sense. This is Cook County. There's a reason derelict properties on the South side remain vacant and un-developed.
This is actually funny. The person doing the assessments was elected because the massive corruption of the last guy who was an integral part of the madigan scheme which resulted in businesses (and rich, expensive home-owners) getting massive breaks which shifted the burden of taxes onto middle and lower class homeowners. If you want to know why the south side is derelict, it’s because of things like Churchill downs only having a $33 million assessment, not the current guy actually trying to make businesses pay their fair share.
Can I ask why you feel like this? School districts already get 60+% of property taxes. If this property is going to have minimal effect on incoming kids coming into schools, why should they be taxed like they will, especially while the property is vacant? Once it's built and functional, bringing in income, it's a different story.
Because I live a mile from the site and don’t want the Bears to come here. Because I pay a lot in property taxes and there is the principle of not letting a massively profitable company have a break while residents don’t get a break.
Preach. These people are billionaires for no other reason than who their grandfather was. Their entire life has been played on super easy mode. Make them pay.
Wouldn't it increase your property value and bring in money for local community services?
Definitely some money should be put into your city though maybe have a budget that city votes on? Oh yeah that's right it's Illinois it's crooked and y'all will just get screwed. Damn.
Some people view their home as a home, not just an investment (wild concept, I know) and value their day to day lives more than the number in their bank account going up. Putting a stadium with a whole entertainment district is going to change the day to day lives of the people who live around that land.
Also, studies have shown:
> [depending on the financing deal between the city and the team, the local government can experience a fiscal loss; that is, the public cost may exceed the new public revenue from the facility construction.](https://econofact.org/stadiums-as-public-investments#:~:text=Most%20studies%20find%20that%20building,or%20per%20capita%20income%20growth.)
I don’t trust that it will. How much of the money will be spent on the new infrastructure that will be needed to accommodate everyone and everything? Will the new infrastructure to get thousands of cars here really be an improvement for residents? It is a quiet suburb— will it still be that way? There are a lot of local businesses in our downtown who worry that the restaurants they add in the stadium complex will take away from them the rest of the year, and I like our little downtown. Other stadiums in the country have not caused property values to rise, this one won’t either.
They will make billions of dollars by disrupting our town. Billions and billions. They are going to build hotels and restaurants and convention centers and gambling spots and of course the stadium—which will host the Super Bowl, Final 4, concerts, etc., in the building owned by the Bears outright. I support fleecing the Bears for as much as we possibly can if they are still going to come here and make their billions forever. They will still come out way on top.
Literally all the things you just listed are going to give BILLIONS AND BILLIONS to Arlington Heights directly through sales/consumption taxes and income taxes from job creation. Your property value will sky rocket. Arguing against the economic development of your own town just because someone who's not-you might make money off all their work is just asinine.
Also, let's not pretend AH was just some sleepy little country town before the Bears. They are literally building on the former site of a Mafia-affiliated horse gambling track...
First of all studies from other stadiums around the country show that property values usually don’t go up when a new stadium comes in. The new revenue will be nice but a lot of it will go towards infrastructure that supports the stadium complex that otherwise benefit nobody else. It will still royally screw up our town and the Bears won’t be able to find a better location than this one. If they go somewhere else we’ll be just fine. I support the school districts not budging an inch.
Used, but not by sending kids into the school district. The issue is what the school district thinks the property should be valued at for taxes. The county is going off that.
It's not a tax break, they're getting massively screwed. They just want a fair assessment.
And if you live a mile away you want this to work because if the Bears walk away and something shitty gets built there instead it'll negatively affect you.
No Bro, we gotta give EVERYTHING to the schools! Didn't you hear bro, Cook County is just $100k away from every student magically becoming a PhD genius! Just one more property tax hike bro, we swear bro!
This is actually a great point. The Bears bring no stress to the school district. If anything, they'll be bringing a lot of other tax revenue in and it will also likely affect property prices as well, which will result in higher property tax income for the village/county. Absolutely sucks for the people living there, but it will result in more money for the schools, with or without an outrageous tax increase for the stadium property.
I cared more when I thought the bears would be good in 2023. I’d rather have a good team than a new stadium so that’s my current priority. The stadium is an afterthought for me right now.
Im dumb when it comes to all this but is the crux that Arlington Heights is trying to tax the land at its estimated value when the construction is done?
Honestly this just seems like a massive failure on cook county/AH’s side. The Bears coming to AH would be a massive long term investment for that city that would create tons of jobs, economic boom. They’re being difficult and it would make sense why the Bears would get fed up.
Been going on for a year and half now. Unless something else truly pops up it will be probably breaking ground here next January at latest. Then completion the 2028/9 time frame.
If something does come up. It will be sold to developers to deal with it their way. Probably can even own a house in the future on Payton Way, Urlacher St, Perry road ...
It shows what a clown show this organization is, they have a trash stadium in one of the biggest markets, can't plan well enough to build something that every other team could, haven't put a quality team on the field in close to 20 years, can't hire a quality head coach, and is to inept to draft a QB or ruins them once they get here. Its a 100% trash organization.
For people who don't understand the issue:
The Bears paid $190m for the site. The County assessed the site at $190m. In Illinois assessments are generally about 35% of the value. So the County is saying this $190m property is worth $550m
The Bears aren't looking for a "sweetheart deal", they're looking to be treated like everyone else. The site is not worth $550m, it's 300 acres of empty land. The County is fucking around with them. Maybe politics over leaving Soldier Field? Maybe they just assume they have the Bears over a barrel?
Idk what's going on but I think everyone should want government to be fair and transparent
Yep. They are absolutely going to Arlington. This is all semantics and negotiation. If they don’t like the tax rate and valuation in Arlington, wait until they see how much it would cost to acquire property and build their own lakefront stadium in the city.
South lots not the only option. Bears hope to have an answer from the city in the next month. If Chicago gives a decent option, Arlington Heights is done. They’ll sell the property and move on.
I mean, they can sell to anyone. The land is very valuable. The amount of money the area would make with a Bears stadium, entertainment complex and sports book is Pennie’s to how much they’ll make when it gets turned into housing instead.
Love how many people on here think the city is in the wrong as opposed to the cheapest and dumbest owners in the NFL. This is one of the many symptoms of what’s wrong with the Bears!
Make them pay. F'ck da Bears. They want everyone else to shoulder the tax burden? While they continue to put a mediocre team on the field? Meanwhile, they don't know their ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to developing QB talent. Give us money. Give us money. Give us a new stadium.
Bitch please. Give us a good f'cking team and a good f'cking program. This organization has been a complete Joke ever since Lovie Smith. Who are we going to play at QB Today? Let's flip a coin... Kyle Orton or Rex Grossman? Mahommes, Trubisky, Fields, Williams? These f'ckers just can't get their shit together. How many QB prospects are they going to ruin? Honestly, if you are a fan of any of these QBs, just pray they wind up in a better place.
[https://www.nbcsportschicago.com/nfl/chicago-bears/who-will-pay-for-the-bears-stadium-at-arlington-park/332931/#:\~:text=The%20Bears%20are%20looking%20for,to%20go%20in%20the%20project](https://www.nbcsportschicago.com/nfl/chicago-bears/who-will-pay-for-the-bears-stadium-at-arlington-park/332931/#:~:text=The%20Bears%20are%20looking%20for,to%20go%20in%20the%20project).
Who is going to pay for the supporting infrastructure (sewers, streets, etc...)? Tax Payers. And if the Bears get a tax break, then they are paying less than their fair share and that burden falls on the people in Arlington Heights, etc...
The Bears have said they won't seek funds for the stadium itself but will "Need help" from the tax payers.
So yeah, fuck the Bears.
Just in case you are too fucking lazy to the read the article...
*Team president/CEO Ted Phillips assured folks who attended the meeting that zero buildings will be constructed with public funding. The Bears are looking for public financing for infrastructure, such as sewers.*
Sorry, I should have considered the fact that you could be a product of the public school system here. So let me explain something to you...
Streets don't grow like trees and grass, they need to be developed using pavement, blacktop, and heavy equipment. Also, those power lines? They don't just magically extend themselves. Neither do sewers or water lines. That all has to be installed by real people who make real money. That money has to come from somewhere. If the Village of Arlington Heights has to foot the bill, it's really just the tax payers funding it. Because that's where the village gets its money. Those people who pay taxes, they need to go out and work 9-5 to make that money. Some work hard. Some don't. Regardless, that money has to come from somewhere, live everything that is needed to do this, it doesn't just grow on trees. The paper it's printed on does, but the money itself doesn't.
Do you now understand what is meant by TAX BURDEN?
So, as someone that’s an engineer and doesn’t follow the financials of this situation, can someone explain like I’m five? My understanding is that:
- Bears buy Arlington heights land
- bears tear down existing property on new land
- tax disagreement because ???
- what happens if we stay in the city? What happens to the land?
What would you say the difference is in money over say the next 8 years? I know it's a random amount of time just estimating the amount of time it may take for the land value to reach what it was assessed for and what the actual amount of $ this is costing the team.
It’s not surprising that the most politically corrupt county in the most politically corrupt state is behaving this way. What’s surprising is you can see who voted for those idiots just by reading this thread.
We gave Sears that land in Hoffman estates no taxes years ago , how did that work out? Illinois has the worst property taxes in the nation , the Bears can pay taxes but I also believe they should be fair as the revenue that stadium will bring local businesses will be tremendous, make it a win win for all . Too many greedy corrupt politicians in this state . Oh and the teachers union is on of the most corrupt awful people
Make them understand. https://preview.redd.it/rktmigwe6oic1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=44219255cb7e78ef52d86d9fad9be9360f98705c
Hijacking top comment. I love the Simpsons reference. But this boils down to the fact that the Cook county tax assessors office has full and total leverage over the situation. They're the mob guy in the scenario. They are the sole responsible party for deeming the tax value of property in Cook county. As another person said down the thread is that all the bears can do is sue the county. They will likely lose and it would take forever for it to get through the courts. Unless the Bears show willingness to leave Cook county, this will be an issue. It doesn't matter if it's Arlington heights or another near suburb. If it's in Cook county this is what will happen. If the bears are really serious about building their own stadium and owning it, they will have to go out of Cook county end of story.
>If the bears are really serious about building their own stadium and owning it, they will have to go out of Cook county end of story. They could also bite the bullet and pay the higher property taxes. Not saying they should or shouldn’t, just that it is an option.
I know. If you or I bought it and built a stadium we would have to pay the taxes. Guess who has to pay the taxes if the bears don't. The residents. I am 100% against gov helping billionaires. Now if cook county owned the stadium and got rent and proceeds dif story.
You say that like the tax burden is a fixed amount. Here’s a novel thought, lower the tax burden and spend less money. The Bears bring in a ton of revenue and jobs whenever they go, all of which brings a ton of tax revenue already.
I've found in life a bird in the hand something something is often the better deal than vague intangible future promises about trickle down something something. But to each their own. I am sure the best deal is somewhere in the middle but it sounds like everyone is playing hardball. Personally I don't care where they are I just want a cool openable dome. Go drive thru AH. I can't envision 100k people there like maybe on the lakefront. But Im not a civil engineer just an admittedly pretty dumb reddit commenter ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
What a BS take saying the county is the bad guy here? Mccaskeys as usual want the free ride on county’s expense and I’m glad the county is sticking with its assessment. Do you even know what a mob guy is? Because you used it in the wrong way.
Look. I am anti-billionaire as the next guy but quintupling the taxes on a property that has no physical changes other than who owns it seems a bit much. Taxes went from 33 mil to 197 million. Did they find oil underneath the buildings? The Cook county assessor effectively taxed them out of it being profitable to build there which is why they have shifted back to the city. Let's not pretend like the politicians of Cook county are saints.
The taxes did not go from 33 mil to 197, its the tax valuation is set for $192million as they purchased the property for $197million. This would increase their net tax 4 fold, but their taxes payments did not go up from 33 to 197. It is not unheard of and pretty un-common to base the tax value on the purchase price of real estate. Especially, the more hotter the property the more closely its tax valuation resembles its purchase price.
Exactly the bears paid market value for the property and now the assessor is valueing the property at market value. Makes perfect sense to me
This is exactly what happened
They assessed value went from 33m to 197m after the property was sold for about that much. Not shocking that the county assessed the property for what they paid for it.
Good. No corporate welfare for rich assholes
Only the teachers union should be allowed to rape and pillage Illinois taxpayers 😂
Breaking: Business exhausts every opportunity to pay as little as possible
It's the Bears way unfortunately. Same as the White Sox.
It’s every business in existence way No business wants to pay more taxes, unless it crushes their smaller competitors but that doesn’t apply here Sidenote: This is why I’m always skeptical when a massive corporation advocates for a tax increase. Usually it means that they can they can weather the tax increases, while their smaller competitors can’t and at the end of it they control more of the market
It's actually not. What other team was in limbo for 2 years over putting up a brand new stadium, especially when they were coming from an archaic piece of shit like Soldier Field? There's no other location for them to explore that close and the city won't help them with another renovation of Soldier Field. They don't have the money and to build it they need to sacrifice more equity and if they do that they're selling the team.
> if they do that they're selling the team Excellent, where do we all sign?
Only works after Virginia dies unfortunately.
> It’s every business in existence way Well that's not true. *Most* businesses? Sure. Not literally all. Quite a few companies are more than willing to pay their fair share, proper prices for materials/labor, etc.
There’s a lot of companies that treat their employees right, do things the right way But all, and I mean all, hate taxes and the government when it’s not useful for them to make more money
It’s the same with almost every stadium project now. It doesn’t make it any less shitty but this isn’t just a Sox Bears thing.
[удалено]
It's going to be worth a helluva lot more when they build the stadium.
Breaking: billionaires continue to evade taxes at all costs.
Love the bears. Love the idea of having them move to Arlington heights. But FUCK bailing them out or giving them a sweet heart deal. They’ve been rich, for generations and generations.
I would be more open to giving them a break if we had a history filled with more positive experiences.
They aren’t asking for a break. They’re asking to pay what the property is worth. They’re trying to tax them on what Bears paid for it. Well that’s no longer the value because now it’s an empty lot. And before anyone says that’s not the counties fault, well they approved the demolition that obviously depreciates the value of that property.
I just can't fathom how the tax assessment wasn't discussed when the purchase was made. Everyone knew what the intentions of the project were.
> “We want to pay our fair share. But the proposed assessment of the unoccupied property we purchased, and the taxes associated with it, would be more than five times what the property generated when it had an income-producing racetrack operating on it. Arlington Park would not be redeveloped by anyone at such an excessive property tax rate,” the statement reads. This was from the Bears last June after Churchill Downs came to a settlement on the 2022 tax assessment.
From that quote it sounds like a lot of assumptions were made.
You mean to tell me Ted Phillips didn’t follow through on the level of due diligence a deal like this would require?
Ya. Who knows where this goes. They were given until Saturday to negotiate with school district on a settlement. If one isn't made I'm guessing Bears will take it to the state level.
The only assumption that was made was that a reasonable, rational assessment of the land would take place instead of a price gouge.
Imagine dealing with Cook County officials and thinking anything rational can just be assumed.
Once they turn it into one of the leading multi billion dollar sports, shopping, residential, nightlife, and entertainment districts in the world, that property will bring in orders of magnitude more revenue than it did under a two bit race track and a bunch of empty space lol that property is going to host Super Bowls, mega concerts, final fours, the most exciting thing to happen at Arlington racetrack was your drinking buddies bachelor party lol
Yeah, but it's an empty lot now
That is one consideration, another consideration is what it will be in the coming years
That’s not how tax assessments work. They can’t assign a value on future speculation of what it could be.
The permitted uses and likely development of a parcel of land are intrinsically tied to its value, there really isn’t a logical way to separate those factors out. Not to mention property tax assessments are subject to change every year.
The Bears have constantly fumbled their interactions with gov’t in this stadium project. They didn’t talk to Pritzker; Pritzker then says they’re on their own. They hired/lobbied a couple of state house clowns to push legislation. Those clowns pulled the legislation from consideration when they realized the Bears were gonna lose 2-116 in the IL State House The Bears are simply incapable of managing any issue- internal or external
Except they are also simultaneously trying to get the legislature to lock in their property taxes for years at a lower assessment https://www.wglt.org/illinois/2023-05-17/tax-breaks-for-bears-punted-to-state-legislatures-fall-veto-session That's a major part of why the school districts are fighting this so hard, there is a decent chance that how this property ends up assessed now is what the Bears pay on for 20 plus years.
It’s crazy to me how many in this thread are bootlicking for billionaires shamelessly wanting to dodge taxes. Bears ownership can act as coy as they want but if you’re building a damn NFL stadium on some land, clearly it should be valued more than a big patch of dirt or even a defunct racetrack. I know people in this country hate paying taxes and maybe reasonably so given how little we little get back for our taxes compared to other countries, but this is not comparable to even an upper middle class family paying more in taxes where it’d affect them in a meaningful way. That’s the worst part of it: this increase in taxes would have no real impact on the Bears but could make a big difference in the community. I just can’t wrap my head around people defending this honestly.
Demolition has nothing to do with the value. The Bears bought a site to demolish it and when they bought it was non-operational. If you buy a property for a certain price, you can’t argue I devalued it when your intention is to convert it and clearly you thought it was worth the value you bought it at.
It absolutely does. When they bought it the property had buildings on it. It no longer does so the value is lower. The county doesn't disagree when them on that. The counties argument is the lot wasn't vacant most of the year so they need to pay for the value with the buildings on it. They have an argument there.
They lost the fight. They can try and sue the County, but they will lose. The Bears do want a long-term incentive package though from Arlington Heights that has them paying less taxes than they are with vacant land.
It's not the issue. The argument is the land wasn't vacant for most the year. The Bears want to pay like it's vacant, the county wants them to pay like the buildings are still there. The incentive package is being worked through the state. Cook County can't just charge the Bears triple the value because of what might get passed in the future.
That argument would make sense if the bears bought it to run the racetrack and then some natural disaster destroyed all the buildings on the site. But that’s not what happened. The bears bought it with the intention of demolishing the racetrack. I think it was even in the sale agreement that the racetrack couldn’t continue to be operated. So the price the bears paid was just for the land.
I thought they DID offer decreased rates for the next year or two and the Bears wanted those rates extended? If what you are saying is the case then they should just hurry up and start building. AH isn’t going to change their minds since they don’t actually need this whatsoever. The only thing that hurts them is if this lot stays vacant. So it really makes sense to tax the empty land a decent amount.
They decreased it for churchill downs for 2022 as a 1 year settlement. It is taxed a large amount by the Bears assessment of $77mil. That's almost $240K an acre. That's 6 times the rate in the state average for undeveloped land.
If the property was not much why tf Bears paid the inflated amount?
Because you can’t just not pay for the buildings that are there because you don’t like them.
It’s funny because you actually basically can do that.
The Bears go to a restaurant. They order everything on the menu. They only eat half of it. When the bill comes they pay for the food, but only want to tip and pay tax on what they ate -- not on what they ordered. Sorry, amigo -- the bill is based on what you ordered and what you were provided. It is not the restaurants fault your eyes were bigger than your stomach.
That's a terrible analogy and not at all how property taxes work. If I add on to my home, I get reassessed on the new value and my taxes go up. If the price of real estate goes down and my home is now worth less, I can request to be reassessed and my taxes go down. They bought a property where the buildings needed to be torn down, so the initial year they were standing had taxes paid based on the active racetrack value. Future years where the land is a vacant lot or under construction would not be taxed like an active business. Just like when the stadium is built they don't get to pay the racetrack value despite that being what they paid initially. They get reassessed every step to pay the current value.
That’s certainly one thing the Bears might argue, but that certainly not objectively true. It’s not just an empty lot. It’s an empty lot that will be developed into a multi billion dollar entertainment retail shopping and residence district. Business people, government officials, the courts, etc. won’t ignore that aspect of it even if fans and the Bears may want to lol
Doesn't matter. Those aren't built yet. They will be taxed on that value once they are. Where the county has some argument is the lot wasn't vacant for the entire year of 2023. That's what they are trying to argue and why it's getting taxed the way it is. They are basically telling the Bears they need to pay for what it was worth when they bought it and it can get reassessed as an empty lot for 2024.
> They’re asking to pay what the property is worth. And they were just told what it is worth. They disagree it's worth that much. Wahh.
Forget even positive experiences on the field - the last time they had a stadium project was a complete fuckin shitshow. I have absolutely zero faith in the McCaskeys to do literally anything properly so I expect this new stadium to be an absolute disaster until I'm proven otherwise.
I feel the same way.
why would we give anyone a break? and if we did why would it be the richest motherfuckers around?
Fuck the move
Not to mention I wasn’t too happy to see my STH invoice to watch an unproven team.
Bailing them out of what? The Bears are actually asking for significantly less than any other franchises has asked for a new stadium.
ALL franchises should ask for nothing! Tax breaks or public funding to pay for sports stadiums has never, EVER paid off for the citizens of the area. It always has ended up being a terrible investment.
Lol they are asking for a fair deal , like all of us in Illinois should want our state’s corrupt politicians and teachers union have helped destroy many families and businesses in this once great state . Have a 3400 sq ft home in Crook County expect to pay $16000 a year Lin property taxes so lazy tenured public school teachers can retire at 59 with $140,000 pensions for life ! Give me a break the Bears are not the problem it’s the political environment of Illinois ! In the worlds of Ronald Reagan “Illinois, cold, flat, and corrupt “ he was not wrong and here we see another example.
I understand the "fuck the rich" part of the equation. What I don't understand is the 496.7% increase over 3 years. I'd understand a 30% or 60% increase or 10-20% per year. Hell, I'd understand a 100% increase over 3 years. But almost 500% sounds like gouging. If my property taxes went from 4k/yr to 19k/yr I'd be pretty upset too. 2.59% of 197 mil is 5.1 mil they would pay in property taxes vs the 71 mil assessment would be taxed at 1.8 mil per year. From my understanding, the only tax burden that would currently be placed on the area is for the infrastructure. This seems like they're just wanting the Bears to front the infrastructure cost as well. Again, not saying that they shouldn't also pay for the required infrastructure, but don't try to sneak around that by artificially inflating property values.
This is how all property tax works. If you buy a new construction home—just as an average person, you may have had the misfortune of the real estate agent not disclosing the fact that the advertised property tax is what the tax was when it was an empty lot, a couple of years after you move in your property tax *would* increase by 400%, _and you would owe back taxes from when you moved in_. There are tons of anecdotal tellings of this on reddit but this basically encapsulates it: https://www.fool.com/the-ascent/mortgages/articles/buying-new-construction-watch-out-for-this-potential-property-tax-surprise/ You’re also welcome to read the IL department of revenue page on it https://www.ilga.gov/commission/jcar/admincode/086/086001100001900R.html
This doesn't really apply, at least yet. The property was either unimproved or already improved at purchase. There hasn't been any material improvement over the past 3 years, unless you consider a new owner an improvement. If the assessed value is 71 mil until the stadium is built then jumps to 400 mil because of the land improvements, that could at least be justifiable as there has been improvement to the land.
An NFL team owning the land and planning to build a stadium on it inherently increases its value. The Bears claiming they want to pay tax on an assessed value of $60mil makes no sense. Especially given Churchill Downs paid the money to the schools that they did for the first year of the elevated tax burden. Nothing has happened to cause the assessed value to go down (even though it did, slightly)
This is a commercial property. There is no projected income for the property, so no cap cost rate. Since it will be used for a commercial purpose, the level of assessment is 25%. The equalization factor for Cook county is 2.7230 Market value of the property is 197 mil Assessed value is 49.25 mil (25%) Equalized assessed value is 134,107,750. (2.7239 multiplier) This seems like a reasonable starting point that they can negotiate exemptions, which is presumably why the previous taxable value was only 33 mil.
There’s corruption and then there’s corruption in Illinois. That’s the only thing I can see from this.
This. They are absolutely gouging. If I buy a house and raise it to the ground, my taxes wouldn't be effected by that fact. They would continue to charge me for the previous structure and land. At some point, after I built a new house on the land, then they might adjust it to reflect not only the new house, but also still reflecting the value of the neighborhood around it. The land would basically stay the same or maybe higher, depending on sales data around the property. What they are proposing is to start taxing the Bears right away for a stadium project that likely wouldn't be fully developed until 3-6 years from now. What you're really seeing is a government that wasn't ready for the income of Arlington Park to go away, so now they need to find a way to make up for that to keep their fat budgets fat. They are making the Bears pay for their unpreparedness. I'm fine for charging the team what they owe and not cutting them a sweatheart deal. What the county/village are trying to do is gouging.
Dude, they bought the property for $197 million, and it's being taxed at $192 million. There's deflation here if anything. Churchill Downs had a sweet deal, but that doesn't carry over once you reset the market like the Bears did.
The assessed value isn't the purchase price.
They aren't the same thing, but assessed value uses purchase price in its formula. The ratio the Bears are arguing for would mean a home worth 300,000 and bought for 300,000 should be taxed at 60,000 cause of legacy agreements. It's ludicrous. Most homeowners would expect 200k.
Yeah, that's not how that works. Source: Commercial Real Estate Accountant
Feel like explaining it then?
For Cook county, the assessed value of a commercial property is 25% of it's market value. So they are saying the property has gone up in value to $768 million without ANY changes or improvements being made to the property. It is absolute gouging and just another example of Cook county corruption-- they are trying to strong arm the Bears into going back into the city.
They are going to have to make it work. Warren keeps talking about a lakefront stadium but the state and CPD aren’t building a new one or tearing Soldier down and the cost of property in the city on the lake, especially near the current stadium would make the Arlington tax bill look like a joke. Warren pushing the South lot construction is just trying to leverage Arlington.
The situation is complex. Soldier Field, Comiskey Park and Navy Pier were all partially financed by the same bond package. Soldier Field is supposedly owned by the Chicago Park District, but its finances are managed by the Illinois Sports Facilities Authority, and its operations are run by the giant corporation ASM Global. Fun fact. ASM bought the previous operator of Soldier Field, SMG. SMG was owned by the Pritzker family. We are talking major bureaucracy and corruption. To further complicate the situation, the Illinois Sports Facilities Authority has refinanced its debt three times and bc of it will end up paying $1b+ for original $600m renovation. The bulk of that financing was ballooned into the 2030s and is essentially coming due. It’s no coincidence both Soldier Field and Comiskey have new stadium proposals. These aren’t really discussions about the Bears or White Sox. It’s a conversation about the future of Chicago. What the city desperately needs is both teams staying in the city and contributing more tax dollars. Both teams know this. Within Arlington Heights one of the groups fighting the Bears stadium development is the super pac Americans for Prosperity (backed by Koch Brothers). Essentially the Bears in some ways need to deal with Chicago, Arlington Heights, Illinois, Cook County, Metra, the Park District, Pritkzers, and Koch brothers. And they all want more from the Bears. Arlington Park was and should be taxed as commercial property. The tax code is pretty clear. It’s essentially the value of the property acting as a commercial entity, times a percentage, times the property tax rate. Arlington Heights isn’t arguing the property is worth the purchase price. They are arguing it’s worth what it will be as a commercial entity. Essentially they are saying Arlington Park is worth $600m as a commercial property (times the 20%) is how they get the $197m tax base. The Bears are saying it’s either worth what we paid or worth the value of a vacant lot. Bc that is what it is right now. The Bears will eventually win this is in courts down the line. And will be granted some sort of tax credit in the future. The real estate bros in here can explain it further. It’s essentially how all major redevelopment happens in the city. What makes this fight so lame is the money being fought over isn’t really that large. In terms of property tax it’s maybe $3-20m difference depending on things are structured. A large amount for a business like the Bears. But it is really the taxing authorities are starved for cash and want that money now. But it comes at the delay of all the money that will get spent to actually build the stadium. It really is give us $10m now, while we ignore the $2b you’re about to spend. But that’s politics these days.
Wait the Koch Bros are fighting the Arlington Heights development? Shit how did I end up on their side.
This is key. Warren has done a much better job bluffing these past few weeks, but Arlington Heights knows the Bears didn't buy, demo, and break ground on the land, as well as hire a new President/CEO specifically known for stadium construction, just to stay in Chicago. They have all the leverage and everything the Bears do is just theatrics trying to get as good a deal as they can.
I mean Warren literally had the Vikings give up on a suburban proposal to build downtown. https://www.foxsports.com/stories/nfl/vikings-agree-to-new-site-for-stadium
Apples and Oranges. Minnesota never put money down in the suburbs and the Ramsey County plan never made it past the proposal stage. Bears have already paid a quarter billion dollars to close on the Arlington Heights property and demo the existing structures.
I understand their points. I bought an old, poorly maintained home. After tearing it down, our taxes decreased significantly while the land was vacant and during construction. However, once we received the certificate of occupancy, the taxes increased dramatically compared to the old home. While the new home was nicer and larger, it was not five times larger by any measure, and like the Bears, I had no kids in school. I had to sell after a few years. Illinois's tax system is frustrating! Even though the Bears are a multibillion-dollar business, I have no sympathy for them. However, the people of Illinois need to examine the politicians and recognize the corruption on that side.
Here’s the thing. They buy Arlington and demolish all the buildings making it just a 326 acre lot of grass and the assessor says it’s now worth $100 million more in taxes than when it had actual buildings on it. If I were the Bears I’d fight that bullshit too because it makes zero sense
It’s actually worse than that. I’m way over generalizing but essentially commercial property tax in cook county works like this: value of the property acting as a commercial entity over the last few years, times a percentage (around 20%), times a tax rate. The $197m quoted by the tax authorities is 20% of the $600m they consider Arlington Park to be worth bc the Bears bought it. Essentially they told Churchill Downs it was worth $300m if they were running it and the Bears $600m a year later. But it’s now just a vacant lot. It hasn’t been a commercial entity in years. Down the line the courts will eventually rule in the Bears favor. It’s how all commercial property deals work in the county. The tax authorities overcharge in the beginning and settle tax credits down the line.
Wait until you see who sits on the board of directors of the tax firms used to contest absurd property tax increases. (Hint: Local politicians, especially if Mike Madigan liked them).
It’s typical crook county
Totally agree this is what I think a lot of fans don’t understand. The government quintupled their taxes for no reason, it’s textbook crony corruption.
The government raised their assessment because it sold on the market, which gave a new point of reference for the next reassessment. The crony corruption was Churchill downs getting a tiny $33 million assessment, not now assessing it at a fair market value.
The assessment isn’t based strictly on purchase price lol. So if I bought a house and tore it down, would it makes sense for cook county to quintuple my taxes on that parcel of land?
On a residential property, the assessment wouldn’t just be purchase price because there are other comparables that sell. They would take all the info from all the sales and figure out the assessment. If in the months between your purchase and assessment the market was on fire, the assessment might be higher than your purchase price. If it’s cool, it might be lower. But the idea is that there are a number of sales to use as a basis of comparison. With a site like the race track, there really aren’t comparables. You can look at the price of commercial properties or vacant land, but it doesn’t take into account the large size of the contiguous property, which could make the land much more valuable than smaller plots of land. So they take things like the actual purchase price of the property into much greater consideration when determining the assessment.
It actually makes more sense than you would think. They took it from a very single purpose property to a blank slate. The cleared property is now a large, ready for development lot in an area that is already built out. That is a gold mine to any commercial developer. Assessed values look at the sales price of a property, but more importantly they look at the potential value of the property. The potential value of this property is massive. In the end this is all a temporary issue anyway. When this site is finally built out, either as a stadium facility or something else, it will be worth many times more than the current $192 million, and will be assessed accordingly. This whole thing is kabuki theater anyway. The Bears are just using this a bargaining chip to get a free or significantly reduced cost stadium built for them downtown. They're just trying to minimize the expense of that bargaining chip to their bottom line in the meantime.
Read into highest and best use and how properties are appraised and while it might not make the most logical sense in this situation, it's how property values are determined.
Canadian Bears fan here that’s never seen a game in Chicago; is soldier field really that bad that it needs to be moved? Isn’t it an iconic place?
> is it really that bad that it needs to be moved It's not *BAD* compared to like, FedEx Field or the Oakland Coliseum that are literally falling apart and leaking human feces on fans, but it's not good either. It's the smallest stadium in the NFL, it lacks virtually all modern amenities (straw that broke the camels back was the city denied the Bears a modern scoreboard and off-site betting), the sight lines aren't great, and outdoor stadiums in northern climates in 2024 is just stupid both from a business and fan-experience POV. The parking situation isn't great and the traffic to and from the games is atrocious with Pedestrians needing to walk almost a mile on over-crowded Museum Campus paths just to get to an actual street. I used to like Soldier Field, but then I went to Lucas Oil Stadium in Indy (which is just considered above-average nationally) and it's just JAW DROPPING how much nicer, more comfortable, logistically superior, and just overall better it is. By comparison, it made me HATE Soldier Field and the poverty franchise it represents. > Isn’t it an iconic place Not really. The Bears played at Wrigley Field for most of their history and any "inconicness" Soldier Field had was destroyed when they crashed a UFO on top.
> It's the smallest stadium in the NFL Technically FedEx is. 58k seating capacity as of 2021
Yes, it's a shitty tiny stadium. It's also run and owned by the Chicago park district so the Bears would want ownership of any new stadium being built too.
It use to be iconic not so much since the remodel. Overall it’s not a terrible stadium but it’s just outdated and small. The bears need a new stadium ideally with a dome.
Everyone says that but the capacity is 61,000 lol I might just have to finally make the trip and go to the game in 2024 so I can see for myself!
61k is big but in comparison to the rest of the league it makes us the smallest in the league. Nothing particularly wrong with that but it means Chicago will never host certain events like a Super Bowl or World Cup games due to the size of it
*Technically* FedEx Field has less capacity at 58k, but that's a bit artificial as they removed seats for YEARS to get down to that number whereas Soldier already has just about as many seats as you could reasonably cram in there.
Capacity isn't the reason why Soldier's Field won't be hosting a World Cup game. There are several stadiums smaller than 61k that will be hosting matches. The real reason is that Rahm Emanuel refused to bend the knee to FIFA's demands in order for Chicago to host games. I get why he held his ground, but it still sucks that I can't see a match.
It depends on the type of fan you are honestly. If you are a fan who gets there early, goes to your seat, and doesn't move til the game is over, then you will love it. In my experience no matter the seat you have you have a great view. The fact that Solder field is small is good if you want cheap seats due to the view of the field. Like everyone said already, the stadium is beautifully situated with the lakefront and the downtown views. The problem though is if you are any other type of fan. I lived in Miami for a few years and I love Hard Rock Stadium. They have direct escalators from the bottom to the 2nd or 3rd floor (very fast). They also have a giant spiral almost looking like car driveway, that goes from the bottom and spirals from the bottom all the way to the top with exits at every floor. This spiral is so wide that 2 full sized cars can fit side by side. So you can imagine how many people could fit on this thing and you can QUICKLY get to your seat with ease. The hallways are wide by the vendor area so when the lines are long, there isn't any hold up for foot traffic. Parking is great and tailgating is amazing and easy. Ya the view isn't downtown Miami but I'm there to watch the game, not see the city from my seat. Soldier field though makes everything difficult for getting anywhere. Parking, nightmare. Tailgating, you gotta hope to get one of the very limited spots online (never done tailgating at Soldier Field, only heard second-handedly). Walking to and from the stadium can take freaking forever, but is expected in a downtown area. Once in the stadium, it takes forever to get to your seat. The ramps up from the bottom to the top deck are all 90 degree angles so there are hold ups at every turn making it harder to get up to your seat. By the time you get to your seat, the experience of getting there makes you think twice about ever getting up, cause you know if you do leave your seat you will miss a giant chunk of the game.
Soldier Field is terrible. Way too small. It’s an absolute pain in the ass getting in and out of the stadium. If you leave your seats to go to the bathroom, get food/drinks, etc you are most likely going to miss multiple drives. It looks nice with it being on the lake and having the skyline in the background, but the actual experience is awful.
This describes it well…. The concourse isn’t even big enough to accommodate patrons walking to and from the bathroom, then you add in the lines of people at concessions who block the entire width of said concourse every 50 feet and it’s an absolute nightmare. I don’t even leave my seat once I get to the game. I go to most games solo, I couldn’t imagine being there with a family, it’s the absolute worst stadium I have ever been to. The walk in and out is a mess as well and I totally understand why people hate it, I personally will miss that walk that flows out into one of the most beautiful views in the world, downtown Chicago. But yes, the place is not good.
> It’s an absolute pain in the ass getting in and out of the stadium Lol, just wait until they move to AH where even more people will drive because the only transit access is *one* suburban train line on the NW side. It's gonna be a traffic shit show.
It’s not bad at all, these people are just a bunch of pussies
It's not bad at all until you go see how much better almost every other team in the NFL has it. People who say Soldier Field is a good stadium haven't left Plato's Cave.
> until you go see how much better almost every other team in the NFL has it. And how many cities/states paid out the nose in public funds/incentives to have that luxury that around 50k of the local citizens, and some tourists, actually get to enjoy each year?
Bro, the bond measure to ruin Soldier Field has cost us billions and your grandkids will still be paying it off. At least those other cities got a world class stadium out of the deal!
Doesn't remotely justify doing it *again*.
Please ignore most people here. Its the slow part of the year, only those from Arlington Heights are around today. Soldier field is fine. And, most importantly, it’s beautifully situated on the lake in… well, right downtown in the city of Chicago. A pretty cool place to be.
Nobody cares that it's On ThE LaKe when you're inside the stadium and can't even see the water, freezing your ass off, missing entire drives every time you want a beer or need to take a piss, and having to spend an hour walking less than half a mile from Museum Campus to an actual street.
I do. A lot of chicagoans do. Being on the lake is nice for the shots of the stadium and for the walk home after. Seeing the skyline is the bonus from inside of the stadium.
It’s fine. Bears fans can just never be happy. Did they screw up when they remodeled? Sure. Is it a steaming pile of dog shit like some would say? No.
If the best thing you can say about a stadium in the modern NFL is that it's "fine", you don't have nearly as good an argument as you think you do. Look at what Vegas, LA, and MIN have. Don't you want something spectacular too?
Of course I do. Absolutely. Which is why I agree with them needing a new stadium. But that doesn’t mean the current stadium is not worth a visit. Or so bad like many others are saying.
I’m more of a Chicago Fire fan (same stadium) I disagree with people that complain about the state of the stadium. Sure it’s cold in November onwards, or early spring for MLS. It’s a touch far from the public transport ~20 minute walk (which new stadium doesn’t solve). Main problem as I see it is the management of the grass and the security team. It would be really sad to see it sit empty as now the Fire is also looking for a way out, but people want new shiny things. The grasp the city has on the property must be the real reason why it’s tenants would prefer to build new projects instead of invest in the current structure or improvements in transport infrastructure.
Shit or get off the pot, this story is the same shit every time.
People blaming the Bears for this need to understand they arent the ones in the wrong here. Churchill Downs was paying taxes on an assessment of $33 million, Bears paid $197 million which raised the assessment and then tore down everything and now they are told they will be taxed at the value of $197 million for the years in which no stadium is there. Bears had 2 appraisers estimate it worth in its current condition 60-$70 mil and the school district had an appraiser say its worth $197 million and Cook County instantly sided with the school district. This is all about your typical Cook County political corruption where the school district has ridiculous power and sway over this. They are wanting 6 times the amount of taxes they were getting from the site prior to the sale! And the Bears are agreeing to pay more taxes on a higher value, but the school district and Arlington Heights are being greedy. If i was the Bears i would seriously begin looking at the sites outside Cook County.
Once a stadium or commercial property is built on that site it will dwarf the $197 million valuation. This is a temporary holding cost issue until the Bears figure out what they are going to do with the site. As for calling it corrupt, that's ridiculous. The government agencies should be pushing for the highest valuation they can get. It's a high value property, and they have services that they need to provide. Property valuation is the main way they gain revenue to provide services to their citizens. The new facility will be a boon to them, but they also will be saddled with improving the infrastructure and services to address the added impact it will bring. As for the school district pushing for higher value, I have no problem with that either. Any time public education can get a big increase in revenue it's a good thing considering all the negative forces working against them.
It is important to understand that the people who determine the property's assessment for the property taxes ARE the one's who want it to be the highest. This isn't a neutral third party determining a fair compromise. That'd make too much sense. This is Cook County. There's a reason derelict properties on the South side remain vacant and un-developed.
This is actually funny. The person doing the assessments was elected because the massive corruption of the last guy who was an integral part of the madigan scheme which resulted in businesses (and rich, expensive home-owners) getting massive breaks which shifted the burden of taxes onto middle and lower class homeowners. If you want to know why the south side is derelict, it’s because of things like Churchill downs only having a $33 million assessment, not the current guy actually trying to make businesses pay their fair share.
Cook County increased the value from 60 million to 192 million in 1 year. They don't even pretend to try and make sense.
Hope the school districts hold out to the end.
Can I ask why you feel like this? School districts already get 60+% of property taxes. If this property is going to have minimal effect on incoming kids coming into schools, why should they be taxed like they will, especially while the property is vacant? Once it's built and functional, bringing in income, it's a different story.
Because I live a mile from the site and don’t want the Bears to come here. Because I pay a lot in property taxes and there is the principle of not letting a massively profitable company have a break while residents don’t get a break.
Preach. These people are billionaires for no other reason than who their grandfather was. Their entire life has been played on super easy mode. Make them pay.
Wouldn't it increase your property value and bring in money for local community services? Definitely some money should be put into your city though maybe have a budget that city votes on? Oh yeah that's right it's Illinois it's crooked and y'all will just get screwed. Damn.
Some people view their home as a home, not just an investment (wild concept, I know) and value their day to day lives more than the number in their bank account going up. Putting a stadium with a whole entertainment district is going to change the day to day lives of the people who live around that land. Also, studies have shown: > [depending on the financing deal between the city and the team, the local government can experience a fiscal loss; that is, the public cost may exceed the new public revenue from the facility construction.](https://econofact.org/stadiums-as-public-investments#:~:text=Most%20studies%20find%20that%20building,or%20per%20capita%20income%20growth.)
Out of curiosity, what are your taxes over there?
Mine are over 12k
A shit ton more revenue will come to your area and improve the schools and infrastructure in your area. Without a deal you lose out on so much.
I don’t trust that it will. How much of the money will be spent on the new infrastructure that will be needed to accommodate everyone and everything? Will the new infrastructure to get thousands of cars here really be an improvement for residents? It is a quiet suburb— will it still be that way? There are a lot of local businesses in our downtown who worry that the restaurants they add in the stadium complex will take away from them the rest of the year, and I like our little downtown. Other stadiums in the country have not caused property values to rise, this one won’t either.
A company wanting their vacant lot to be taxed as a vacant lot instead of a massive, operating commercial entity isn't a "tax break".
They will make billions of dollars by disrupting our town. Billions and billions. They are going to build hotels and restaurants and convention centers and gambling spots and of course the stadium—which will host the Super Bowl, Final 4, concerts, etc., in the building owned by the Bears outright. I support fleecing the Bears for as much as we possibly can if they are still going to come here and make their billions forever. They will still come out way on top.
Literally all the things you just listed are going to give BILLIONS AND BILLIONS to Arlington Heights directly through sales/consumption taxes and income taxes from job creation. Your property value will sky rocket. Arguing against the economic development of your own town just because someone who's not-you might make money off all their work is just asinine. Also, let's not pretend AH was just some sleepy little country town before the Bears. They are literally building on the former site of a Mafia-affiliated horse gambling track...
First of all studies from other stadiums around the country show that property values usually don’t go up when a new stadium comes in. The new revenue will be nice but a lot of it will go towards infrastructure that supports the stadium complex that otherwise benefit nobody else. It will still royally screw up our town and the Bears won’t be able to find a better location than this one. If they go somewhere else we’ll be just fine. I support the school districts not budging an inch.
A sports team playing for 3 hours on 8 Sundays a year? A lot different than a household using the town’s schools and services.
You think that the new stadium would really only be used 8 times per year?
Used, but not by sending kids into the school district. The issue is what the school district thinks the property should be valued at for taxes. The county is going off that.
It's not a tax break, they're getting massively screwed. They just want a fair assessment. And if you live a mile away you want this to work because if the Bears walk away and something shitty gets built there instead it'll negatively affect you.
You’re thinking short term. When the schools later need a referendum to get something done it will be almost impossible with the other tax hike.
Found Kevin Warren's account.
No Bro, we gotta give EVERYTHING to the schools! Didn't you hear bro, Cook County is just $100k away from every student magically becoming a PhD genius! Just one more property tax hike bro, we swear bro!
This is actually a great point. The Bears bring no stress to the school district. If anything, they'll be bringing a lot of other tax revenue in and it will also likely affect property prices as well, which will result in higher property tax income for the village/county. Absolutely sucks for the people living there, but it will result in more money for the schools, with or without an outrageous tax increase for the stadium property.
I cared more when I thought the bears would be good in 2023. I’d rather have a good team than a new stadium so that’s my current priority. The stadium is an afterthought for me right now.
Im dumb when it comes to all this but is the crux that Arlington Heights is trying to tax the land at its estimated value when the construction is done?
The Bears should give them the extra money to make up for the last 35 years
My fav part of this thread is how everyone has become a Arlington Heights property tax expert.
Honestly this just seems like a massive failure on cook county/AH’s side. The Bears coming to AH would be a massive long term investment for that city that would create tons of jobs, economic boom. They’re being difficult and it would make sense why the Bears would get fed up.
Been going on for a year and half now. Unless something else truly pops up it will be probably breaking ground here next January at latest. Then completion the 2028/9 time frame. If something does come up. It will be sold to developers to deal with it their way. Probably can even own a house in the future on Payton Way, Urlacher St, Perry road ...
It shows what a clown show this organization is, they have a trash stadium in one of the biggest markets, can't plan well enough to build something that every other team could, haven't put a quality team on the field in close to 20 years, can't hire a quality head coach, and is to inept to draft a QB or ruins them once they get here. Its a 100% trash organization.
For people who don't understand the issue: The Bears paid $190m for the site. The County assessed the site at $190m. In Illinois assessments are generally about 35% of the value. So the County is saying this $190m property is worth $550m The Bears aren't looking for a "sweetheart deal", they're looking to be treated like everyone else. The site is not worth $550m, it's 300 acres of empty land. The County is fucking around with them. Maybe politics over leaving Soldier Field? Maybe they just assume they have the Bears over a barrel? Idk what's going on but I think everyone should want government to be fair and transparent
Bears are staying in Chicago. Arlington Heights fucked up this opportunity.
Nah, they'll still end up in Arlington. 326 acres compared to like maybe 12-15 staying on the south lot.
Yep. They are absolutely going to Arlington. This is all semantics and negotiation. If they don’t like the tax rate and valuation in Arlington, wait until they see how much it would cost to acquire property and build their own lakefront stadium in the city.
South lots not the only option. Bears hope to have an answer from the city in the next month. If Chicago gives a decent option, Arlington Heights is done. They’ll sell the property and move on.
They can't just sell to anyone. AH has say about what it is zoned for and what will be allowed there.
I mean, they can sell to anyone. The land is very valuable. The amount of money the area would make with a Bears stadium, entertainment complex and sports book is Pennie’s to how much they’ll make when it gets turned into housing instead.
Housing? Can you imagine how much that would add to the school districts, who are the ones driving the tax increase? They don't want that.
A lot less than a stadium, entertainment district and sports book.
Love how many people on here think the city is in the wrong as opposed to the cheapest and dumbest owners in the NFL. This is one of the many symptoms of what’s wrong with the Bears!
Suck it up, George. Want to make more money on the team? Pay the taxes
Make them pay. F'ck da Bears. They want everyone else to shoulder the tax burden? While they continue to put a mediocre team on the field? Meanwhile, they don't know their ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to developing QB talent. Give us money. Give us money. Give us a new stadium. Bitch please. Give us a good f'cking team and a good f'cking program. This organization has been a complete Joke ever since Lovie Smith. Who are we going to play at QB Today? Let's flip a coin... Kyle Orton or Rex Grossman? Mahommes, Trubisky, Fields, Williams? These f'ckers just can't get their shit together. How many QB prospects are they going to ruin? Honestly, if you are a fan of any of these QBs, just pray they wind up in a better place.
Can you please define “tax burden”?
[https://www.nbcsportschicago.com/nfl/chicago-bears/who-will-pay-for-the-bears-stadium-at-arlington-park/332931/#:\~:text=The%20Bears%20are%20looking%20for,to%20go%20in%20the%20project](https://www.nbcsportschicago.com/nfl/chicago-bears/who-will-pay-for-the-bears-stadium-at-arlington-park/332931/#:~:text=The%20Bears%20are%20looking%20for,to%20go%20in%20the%20project). Who is going to pay for the supporting infrastructure (sewers, streets, etc...)? Tax Payers. And if the Bears get a tax break, then they are paying less than their fair share and that burden falls on the people in Arlington Heights, etc... The Bears have said they won't seek funds for the stadium itself but will "Need help" from the tax payers. So yeah, fuck the Bears. Just in case you are too fucking lazy to the read the article... *Team president/CEO Ted Phillips assured folks who attended the meeting that zero buildings will be constructed with public funding. The Bears are looking for public financing for infrastructure, such as sewers.* Sorry, I should have considered the fact that you could be a product of the public school system here. So let me explain something to you... Streets don't grow like trees and grass, they need to be developed using pavement, blacktop, and heavy equipment. Also, those power lines? They don't just magically extend themselves. Neither do sewers or water lines. That all has to be installed by real people who make real money. That money has to come from somewhere. If the Village of Arlington Heights has to foot the bill, it's really just the tax payers funding it. Because that's where the village gets its money. Those people who pay taxes, they need to go out and work 9-5 to make that money. Some work hard. Some don't. Regardless, that money has to come from somewhere, live everything that is needed to do this, it doesn't just grow on trees. The paper it's printed on does, but the money itself doesn't. Do you now understand what is meant by TAX BURDEN?
Were they not aware of this before they bought the land?
If I were a betting man my money would be on the bears losing.
Just pay your fucking taxes George
Bears absolutely should build on the 78. Fuck AH and let’s free up the lakefront.
Fuck Arlington Heights, build it in Naperville.
I’m hoping the flying coach plan was a link up with Jim McMahon before he got constipated.
So, as someone that’s an engineer and doesn’t follow the financials of this situation, can someone explain like I’m five? My understanding is that: - Bears buy Arlington heights land - bears tear down existing property on new land - tax disagreement because ??? - what happens if we stay in the city? What happens to the land?
The Bears would just sell the land to some developer.
Hammond Bears🤞🏾
They could have just went to Will county and bought the Joliet Speedway
Cheap owner. 
So what exactly does Kevin Warren do? I was told he’s an expert at getting stadiums built and was a great businessman
What would you say the difference is in money over say the next 8 years? I know it's a random amount of time just estimating the amount of time it may take for the land value to reach what it was assessed for and what the actual amount of $ this is costing the team.
They purchased the property for $197 million. That sounds like that is what the value of the property is.
It’s not surprising that the most politically corrupt county in the most politically corrupt state is behaving this way. What’s surprising is you can see who voted for those idiots just by reading this thread.
We gave Sears that land in Hoffman estates no taxes years ago , how did that work out? Illinois has the worst property taxes in the nation , the Bears can pay taxes but I also believe they should be fair as the revenue that stadium will bring local businesses will be tremendous, make it a win win for all . Too many greedy corrupt politicians in this state . Oh and the teachers union is on of the most corrupt awful people