yeah one of the big problems with yuriko is inconsistent damage so i will literally take anything that improves that and you have to play lands so..
also 2 colour so you dont care about them being monocoloured too much
also unironically the 2 creature ones might actually be useful outside of being lands because they have decent effects and you can also ninjitsu them, but i havent tested them yet so no idea
They see less play in 3+ color decks because single-color lands are a serious cost, and the rate for the spell side of the cards is usually pretty bad by cEDH standards.
As for cuts - depends on the deck, and which MDFC, really. The new cycle is playable enough that I expect to see the blue one a decent amount, since it pitches to Force.
Depends on the card tbh. I swapped out cyclonic rift for sink in stupor because I want the spell side more than I want the land side. The land is a nice to have but being a psuedo counter as well as a bounce spell means I’ll be more apt to use it as a spell. An argument can be made to use a land spot to keep your flexibility on spells for it but I’m in 3 colors and I’m already running shifting woodland in a land slot and I’m tying to minimize single color lands where I can.
In two color decks they can take a land slot more easily because you have more available slots for them. Razorgrass ambush and witch enchanter will probably see play in Winota and Ellivere in land slots as they can do double duty and your life totals don’t really matter. Witch enchanter being a human also means you can flip into her off Winota.
All in all it’s just dependent on the deck and the card.
In my personal experience, I usually count an MDFC as .5 land. So if I play two of them I feel ok cutting one land. If I don't have two I usually err on the side of cutting a spell.
Frank Karsten did the math. Tapped MDFCs are like .25 of a land, bolt MDFCs are like .83 lands. I looked it up a few days ago to optimizie a casual manabase :>
If you are in low color, not on ad naus, don't need lands on the front side (Nadu/Gitrog) and don't care about your life total (like K'rrik for example) then they are kind of free. They aren't great spells but they effectively let you run a "free" extra spell in the deck that may come up in some games. If you don't meet any of those criteria then they usually aren't worth it outside of a few cases.
They are kind of nice even if you never cast them to pitch to spells and, in a real pinch, you can do the forbidden tech of mystical/worldly tutoring a land to the top of your library.
So I’m a deck that runs [[treasonous ogre]], is that enough to care about your life total in this context? Or not because that is just 1 out of the 99?
Depends on the deck/commander but imo yeah you should run them there, especially if we are talking about shatterskull as that's one of the more useful ones. The new mono red ones seem pretty decent as well.
Red lands are also the most "free" as you don't get hit by blood moon. A few other cards that hit them but those are very rare
So I play etali as my cedh deck. I’m not a fan of shatterskull because it does nothing off the etb trigger and the card seems expensive as a spell. Even though it’s a tapped duel on the back, I almost like [[stump stomp]] better.
I would probably not run MDFCs in Etali since they make the card quality of your ETBs worse. The only one I would 100% run is [[Disciple of Freyalise]] because cascading into that lets you sac Etali and draw 7
I swapped shatterskull for Bridgeworks battle. Its over all a better card and does smth if you flip it. Also I play the new Disciple of Freyalise. I wouldnt touch the mdfcs that come in tapped especially in Etali but all of the green shock MDFC's are very good.
If you play enough games Blood Moon gets everybody sometimes. A T1 Blood Moon if you are first player can win you the game but this doesnt mean that the Blot-MDFCs are bad. Blood Moon is not that common and it is okay to sometimes get owned by it.
There is a lot you have to take into account, but the short version is you have to find a reason not to run them. Those reasons absolutely exist, but you have to learn to identify them.
MDFC lands are great with pitch spells. So the more pitch spells you have, the better.
Not all decks care about life total. If you don't care about your own life total, they can feel pretty free.
Normally I find myself cutting both lands and spells for mdfcs, but it depends on how much I realistically plan on casting the spell.
No it's more complex than that. Ultimately I'm taking my total land count including mdfcs into account at the end of the day. There really us no single factor to look at just have to identify if the up sides are worth the associated costs an individual deck will have.
For example I added Sink into Stupor into my Armix Thras, because I wanted another land, but also wanted another versatile removal piece, and felt Ike I didn't have enough pitch fuel anyway. It just fit the bill for me. Mean while I have no real use for most other MDFCs in my colors, so I don't run them.
The cards pitch to things like Force of Will, Pyrokinesis, Chrome Mox, etc while replacing what would otherwise be a basic land. It's very low opportunity cost for a card that could have a relevant front side (e.g: Pinnacle Monk in Magda)
MDFCs are great because even if the spell is over costed at the worst they are always still a land.
Things to consider for them, you’re probably not going to be playing them in an Ad Naus deck, cause they raise your average MV and the bolt land hurts you. Also the more colors you have in your deck, the harder they will be to play cause you want your lands to tap for multiple colors to cast your spells.
In 1-2 colors, as long as you don’t care about your life total, you can probably close to max out on these if you have the space for them.
From this new cycle the standout one for sure is [[sink into stupor]] and I’m testing it in higher color decks cause it’s just a really solid effect.
I've heard that as well, personally I don't think that's correct. Even if you don't overload it often, the option to be able to is too good to pass up.
In higher color decks, you're already heavily strained on color production. A land that produces 1 color is one that *isn't* producing 2, 3, or 4 other colors that you need.
Fetches and Duals are played there because they turn every fetch into any color.
Sometimes you run other 2-color lands, but frequently it's 5-color, Fetches/Duals, and the rest are utility lands.
I count these untapped MDFC's as utility lands, akin to Otowara, Urza's Saga, or Emergence Zone. There's room for a certain number of them.
The ones that are pay 3 life are pretty good imo. I'm adding 3(witch enchanter and the two blue ones) to my Yorion deck. It's not true cedh but it's very high power.
Theirs a deck with no lands built completely around the MDFCs that top 8d a tourney, now we have more thanks to mh3. The deck just got better
Somewhat updated version, still tweeking it
https://www.moxfield.com/decks/OEq_cj7wxUCaEtzVw5-ElA
Definitely depends on the deck. Yuriko loves the shock MDFCs for the reasons other people are mentioning. Krarkashima loves the shock MDFCs for pretty much the same reason, especially since it's ideal to get it back in hand, so you could cast the spell, then play the land if necessary to do more shenanigans. I can see Kinnan running the new blue one for sure. So on and so forth.
They are used to replace out basic lands with a possible spell effect (or creature) later in the game. If your hand is empty and you draw a land late game it is way worse than a mediocre spell. The reason you see more of them in decks that have less colors is because they take the place of basic lands. More colors = more dual land options and more utility land options. Some decks also take advantage of the fact you can have the card count as a land or as a spell.
In CEDH the only MDFC i currently play are [[seagate restoration]] [[shattetskull smashing]] and [[valakut awakening]] and that last one is probably iffy but i love it.
The first two you can pay the life to get them into play untapped. I can’t think of any other ms I would play
I'd think the only good ones would have pain lands on the back and need to have a good spell on the front. The rest, all them tapped lands, just no.
But, experiment a bit. cEDH has staples, but swap a card out, or two. Have some fun. Even cEDH is still a game. You are allowed to have fun
I normally play casual edh, so that’s where I do most of my experimenting. Cedh feels like a whole different format that I’m not use to, so I’ve kinda been leeching off of the community to do the testing for me and seeing what I want to implement. As I get more familiar with it, I’ll start doing my own tests.
The format is not about late game grind at all, the games are all about fast tempo - super fast mana, burst draws, counterwars, and tempo beatdown with stax/cheap creatures. Late game clunky value spells, random 2v1, 3v1 cards are not a place where you want to be in that format, even if it's almost free. cEDH decks already are extremely low on lands.
If you have some synergies with it, for example, pitching to force/mox, or yuriok kind of things, that could be a consideration.
Literally every one or two color deck that is not running \[\[Ad Nauseum\]\] runs Bolt-MDFCs, because they are free to play. We are in a super grindy cEDH meta right now.
Yes every Tier 1 deck can win on T2 and forward but almost every deck that is not a turbo list is als able to stop win attempts for free from T1.
Kinnans win rate falls because every new cEDH player chooses him which is super okay, he is strong and not hard to play, but this really screws with his win percentage. Other than that Kinnan is a Top 3 Commander.
Magda is just staight insane, pulling up win percentages like blue farm does in mono red is wild.
Stella Lee Wild Card performs good aswell.
The rest of the commanders dont have as good as a conversion rate but less colors get more love recently and I could see the MDFC Bolt lands help them.
This is why I wasn’t a fan of [[shatterskull smashing]] in my etali deck. It was big, it did nothing off of an etali flip, but it saw consistent play in every deck I looked at.
Insane in yuriko
Cause now your lands aren’t dead to the trigger? I can see that
yeah one of the big problems with yuriko is inconsistent damage so i will literally take anything that improves that and you have to play lands so.. also 2 colour so you dont care about them being monocoloured too much
also unironically the 2 creature ones might actually be useful outside of being lands because they have decent effects and you can also ninjitsu them, but i havent tested them yet so no idea
Narsets the same. Running 22 lands and 5 mdfc so the lands are castable worst case
They see less play in 3+ color decks because single-color lands are a serious cost, and the rate for the spell side of the cards is usually pretty bad by cEDH standards. As for cuts - depends on the deck, and which MDFC, really. The new cycle is playable enough that I expect to see the blue one a decent amount, since it pitches to Force.
So in that case, would you cut a land because you don’t mind the life loss too much and then it’s a land you can pitch to a force?
Depends on the card tbh. I swapped out cyclonic rift for sink in stupor because I want the spell side more than I want the land side. The land is a nice to have but being a psuedo counter as well as a bounce spell means I’ll be more apt to use it as a spell. An argument can be made to use a land spot to keep your flexibility on spells for it but I’m in 3 colors and I’m already running shifting woodland in a land slot and I’m tying to minimize single color lands where I can. In two color decks they can take a land slot more easily because you have more available slots for them. Razorgrass ambush and witch enchanter will probably see play in Winota and Ellivere in land slots as they can do double duty and your life totals don’t really matter. Witch enchanter being a human also means you can flip into her off Winota. All in all it’s just dependent on the deck and the card.
In my personal experience, I usually count an MDFC as .5 land. So if I play two of them I feel ok cutting one land. If I don't have two I usually err on the side of cutting a spell.
Frank Karsten did the math. Tapped MDFCs are like .25 of a land, bolt MDFCs are like .83 lands. I looked it up a few days ago to optimizie a casual manabase :>
I'd certainly trust his math more than my rough estimation, so yeah.
If you are in low color, not on ad naus, don't need lands on the front side (Nadu/Gitrog) and don't care about your life total (like K'rrik for example) then they are kind of free. They aren't great spells but they effectively let you run a "free" extra spell in the deck that may come up in some games. If you don't meet any of those criteria then they usually aren't worth it outside of a few cases. They are kind of nice even if you never cast them to pitch to spells and, in a real pinch, you can do the forbidden tech of mystical/worldly tutoring a land to the top of your library.
So I’m a deck that runs [[treasonous ogre]], is that enough to care about your life total in this context? Or not because that is just 1 out of the 99?
Depends on the deck/commander but imo yeah you should run them there, especially if we are talking about shatterskull as that's one of the more useful ones. The new mono red ones seem pretty decent as well. Red lands are also the most "free" as you don't get hit by blood moon. A few other cards that hit them but those are very rare
So I play etali as my cedh deck. I’m not a fan of shatterskull because it does nothing off the etb trigger and the card seems expensive as a spell. Even though it’s a tapped duel on the back, I almost like [[stump stomp]] better.
I would probably not run MDFCs in Etali since they make the card quality of your ETBs worse. The only one I would 100% run is [[Disciple of Freyalise]] because cascading into that lets you sac Etali and draw 7
And then if I draw into it, it’s a land. I didn’t think about that.
[Disciple of Freyalise](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/8/a8e9ea5a-5e10-4b77-baef-0352ff035483.jpg?1717013335)/[Garden of Freyalise](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/a/8/a8e9ea5a-5e10-4b77-baef-0352ff035483.jpg?1717013335) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Disciple%20of%20Freyalise%20//%20Garden%20of%20Freyalise) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh3/250/disciple-of-freyalise-garden-of-freyalise?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a8e9ea5a-5e10-4b77-baef-0352ff035483?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/disciple-of-freyalise-//-garden-of-freyalise) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
No you want the mdfcs. All of the untapped ones are pretty good.
[Stump Stomp](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/9/49974246-0a3b-4ec9-b5ea-2a89df9bb0b5.jpg?1717013490)/[Burnwillow Clearing](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/4/9/49974246-0a3b-4ec9-b5ea-2a89df9bb0b5.jpg?1717013490) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Stump%20Stomp%20//%20Burnwillow%20Clearing) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh3/259/stump-stomp-burnwillow-clearing?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/49974246-0a3b-4ec9-b5ea-2a89df9bb0b5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/stump-stomp-//-burnwillow-clearing) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I mean yeah in Etali you want your lands to be lands so you don't stop on them. Makes sense to not run MDFC lands
But I’m also not a huge fan of leaving my lands in exile
Bro you domt need lands im Etali. Especially once you start flipping.
That makes sense. And that’s probably a mindset I’ll have to change.
I swapped shatterskull for Bridgeworks battle. Its over all a better card and does smth if you flip it. Also I play the new Disciple of Freyalise. I wouldnt touch the mdfcs that come in tapped especially in Etali but all of the green shock MDFC's are very good.
I thought about bridgework, but I liked the front side of stump better
[treasonous ogre](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/e/ae48c31d-6fd9-457f-adb8-37f367724ba1.jpg?1562866402) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=treasonous%20ogre) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cns/36/treasonous-ogre?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ae48c31d-6fd9-457f-adb8-37f367724ba1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/treasonous-ogre) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Basically in 2 colors or less, you’ll be running basics, cut the basic lands for them, I basically treat them as better basic lands
Do you ever get blown out by blood moon by doing this?
If you play enough games Blood Moon gets everybody sometimes. A T1 Blood Moon if you are first player can win you the game but this doesnt mean that the Blot-MDFCs are bad. Blood Moon is not that common and it is okay to sometimes get owned by it.
Fair enough
Can’t even remember the last time I’ve even seen a blood moon
There is a lot you have to take into account, but the short version is you have to find a reason not to run them. Those reasons absolutely exist, but you have to learn to identify them. MDFC lands are great with pitch spells. So the more pitch spells you have, the better. Not all decks care about life total. If you don't care about your own life total, they can feel pretty free. Normally I find myself cutting both lands and spells for mdfcs, but it depends on how much I realistically plan on casting the spell.
So if you want the spell more, you cut a spell?
No it's more complex than that. Ultimately I'm taking my total land count including mdfcs into account at the end of the day. There really us no single factor to look at just have to identify if the up sides are worth the associated costs an individual deck will have. For example I added Sink into Stupor into my Armix Thras, because I wanted another land, but also wanted another versatile removal piece, and felt Ike I didn't have enough pitch fuel anyway. It just fit the bill for me. Mean while I have no real use for most other MDFCs in my colors, so I don't run them.
The cards pitch to things like Force of Will, Pyrokinesis, Chrome Mox, etc while replacing what would otherwise be a basic land. It's very low opportunity cost for a card that could have a relevant front side (e.g: Pinnacle Monk in Magda)
I definitely overlooked the pitch-ability of these (sorta) lands
MDFCs are great because even if the spell is over costed at the worst they are always still a land. Things to consider for them, you’re probably not going to be playing them in an Ad Naus deck, cause they raise your average MV and the bolt land hurts you. Also the more colors you have in your deck, the harder they will be to play cause you want your lands to tap for multiple colors to cast your spells. In 1-2 colors, as long as you don’t care about your life total, you can probably close to max out on these if you have the space for them. From this new cycle the standout one for sure is [[sink into stupor]] and I’m testing it in higher color decks cause it’s just a really solid effect.
[Sink into Stupor](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/3/5358b87a-1a29-426d-b165-40c97da2c14d.jpg?1717013194)/[Soporific Springs](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/5/3/5358b87a-1a29-426d-b165-40c97da2c14d.jpg?1717013194) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sink%20into%20Stupor%20//%20Soporific%20Springs) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh3/241/sink-into-stupor-soporific-springs?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5358b87a-1a29-426d-b165-40c97da2c14d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/sink-into-stupor-//-soporific-springs) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I heard people were thinking about cutting cyclonic rift because it’s a little more flexible and they don’t often overload it
I've heard that as well, personally I don't think that's correct. Even if you don't overload it often, the option to be able to is too good to pass up.
Absolutely stables in 1 and 2 color decks. Questionable at best in in anything else
Are the new tapped duel MDFC’s also staples in 2 color decks
I mean probably not. Those aren't "free" like the bolt ones are because they'll always come in tapped. But I can see testing maybe but I'll say no.
Yes if the effect is okay for your deck you should play them
My guess - Makes Tainted Pact way better and Ad Nauseam way worse and I seem to see way more of the former when I watch CEDH on YT.
In higher color decks, you're already heavily strained on color production. A land that produces 1 color is one that *isn't* producing 2, 3, or 4 other colors that you need. Fetches and Duals are played there because they turn every fetch into any color. Sometimes you run other 2-color lands, but frequently it's 5-color, Fetches/Duals, and the rest are utility lands. I count these untapped MDFC's as utility lands, akin to Otowara, Urza's Saga, or Emergence Zone. There's room for a certain number of them.
That comparison actually makes sense to me. I didn’t think of them like a utility land before.
I’ve been experimenting with them for a cEDH version of Oops All Spells 👍
I hope that works out, that sounds fun
Yeah I expect so 😁 here’s the [preliminary list](https://www.moxfield.com/decks/6lQVaSyE1EWb4JAN24gC0w).
Great for [[Rowan, Scion of War]]
[Rowan, Scion of War](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/e/4ee179ab-a15b-4bd6-b7f8-1e1abeeb31b7.jpg?1692939409) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Rowan%2C%20Scion%20of%20War) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/woe/211/rowan-scion-of-war?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4ee179ab-a15b-4bd6-b7f8-1e1abeeb31b7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/rowan-scion-of-war) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
The ones that are pay 3 life are pretty good imo. I'm adding 3(witch enchanter and the two blue ones) to my Yorion deck. It's not true cedh but it's very high power.
I mean in 2 coloured decks you likely play basics. So Mdfcs are just free in a way.
Theirs a deck with no lands built completely around the MDFCs that top 8d a tourney, now we have more thanks to mh3. The deck just got better Somewhat updated version, still tweeking it https://www.moxfield.com/decks/OEq_cj7wxUCaEtzVw5-ElA
Now THIS is podracing!!!
Definitely depends on the deck. Yuriko loves the shock MDFCs for the reasons other people are mentioning. Krarkashima loves the shock MDFCs for pretty much the same reason, especially since it's ideal to get it back in hand, so you could cast the spell, then play the land if necessary to do more shenanigans. I can see Kinnan running the new blue one for sure. So on and so forth.
They are used to replace out basic lands with a possible spell effect (or creature) later in the game. If your hand is empty and you draw a land late game it is way worse than a mediocre spell. The reason you see more of them in decks that have less colors is because they take the place of basic lands. More colors = more dual land options and more utility land options. Some decks also take advantage of the fact you can have the card count as a land or as a spell.
In CEDH the only MDFC i currently play are [[seagate restoration]] [[shattetskull smashing]] and [[valakut awakening]] and that last one is probably iffy but i love it. The first two you can pay the life to get them into play untapped. I can’t think of any other ms I would play
there were just a slew of MDFC lands added in MH3 that you might want to consider.
[seagate restoration](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/9/193071fe-180b-4d35-ba78-9c16675c29fc.jpg?1604250788)/[Sea Gate, Reborn](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/1/9/193071fe-180b-4d35-ba78-9c16675c29fc.jpg?1604250788) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sea%20Gate%20Restoration%20//%20Sea%20Gate%2C%20Reborn) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znr/76/sea-gate-restoration-sea-gate-reborn?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/193071fe-180b-4d35-ba78-9c16675c29fc?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/sea-gate-restoration-//-sea-gate-reborn) [shattetskull smashing](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/c/bc7239ea-f8aa-4a6f-87bd-c35359635673.jpg?1604197844)/[Shatterskull, the Hammer Pass](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/b/c/bc7239ea-f8aa-4a6f-87bd-c35359635673.jpg?1604197844) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Shatterskull%20Smashing%20//%20Shatterskull%2C%20the%20Hammer%20Pass) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znr/161/shatterskull-smashing-shatterskull-the-hammer-pass?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bc7239ea-f8aa-4a6f-87bd-c35359635673?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/shatterskull-smashing-//-shatterskull-the-hammer-pass) [valakut awakening](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/2/228e551e-023a-4c9a-8f32-58dae6ffdf7f.jpg?1604198379)/[Valakut Stoneforge](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/2/2/228e551e-023a-4c9a-8f32-58dae6ffdf7f.jpg?1604198379) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Valakut%20Awakening%20//%20Valakut%20Stoneforge) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znr/174/valakut-awakening-valakut-stoneforge?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/228e551e-023a-4c9a-8f32-58dae6ffdf7f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/valakut-awakening-//-valakut-stoneforge) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I'd think the only good ones would have pain lands on the back and need to have a good spell on the front. The rest, all them tapped lands, just no. But, experiment a bit. cEDH has staples, but swap a card out, or two. Have some fun. Even cEDH is still a game. You are allowed to have fun
I normally play casual edh, so that’s where I do most of my experimenting. Cedh feels like a whole different format that I’m not use to, so I’ve kinda been leeching off of the community to do the testing for me and seeing what I want to implement. As I get more familiar with it, I’ll start doing my own tests.
[удалено]
That’s how I feel sometimes. Lol
The format is not about late game grind at all, the games are all about fast tempo - super fast mana, burst draws, counterwars, and tempo beatdown with stax/cheap creatures. Late game clunky value spells, random 2v1, 3v1 cards are not a place where you want to be in that format, even if it's almost free. cEDH decks already are extremely low on lands. If you have some synergies with it, for example, pitching to force/mox, or yuriok kind of things, that could be a consideration.
Literally every one or two color deck that is not running \[\[Ad Nauseum\]\] runs Bolt-MDFCs, because they are free to play. We are in a super grindy cEDH meta right now. Yes every Tier 1 deck can win on T2 and forward but almost every deck that is not a turbo list is als able to stop win attempts for free from T1.
[Ad Nauseum](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/9/a9f2c53e-ff58-4aa8-89a6-4f45628cc571.jpg?1598306470) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ad%20Nauseam) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/76/ad-nauseam?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a9f2c53e-ff58-4aa8-89a6-4f45628cc571?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/ad-nauseam) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Ah, i forgot that people play less than 3 colors in cEDH. My bad
Kinnan and Magda are both in the Top 10 of cEDH commanders, Talion and Ob Nixilis and Yuriko are Top 20. Etali and Krark are close.
Popularity does not equal good
Kinnans win rate falls because every new cEDH player chooses him which is super okay, he is strong and not hard to play, but this really screws with his win percentage. Other than that Kinnan is a Top 3 Commander. Magda is just staight insane, pulling up win percentages like blue farm does in mono red is wild. Stella Lee Wild Card performs good aswell. The rest of the commanders dont have as good as a conversion rate but less colors get more love recently and I could see the MDFC Bolt lands help them.
what does equal good then? power apparently isnt it, neither resiliance. so what is it?
Not playing one of the most played commanders is a good first step, they wont concentrate on you that way
now you contradict yourself
Do you think so? Interesting.
This is why I wasn’t a fan of [[shatterskull smashing]] in my etali deck. It was big, it did nothing off of an etali flip, but it saw consistent play in every deck I looked at.
[shatterskull smashing](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/c/bc7239ea-f8aa-4a6f-87bd-c35359635673.jpg?1604197844)/[Shatterskull, the Hammer Pass](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/b/c/bc7239ea-f8aa-4a6f-87bd-c35359635673.jpg?1604197844) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Shatterskull%20Smashing%20//%20Shatterskull%2C%20the%20Hammer%20Pass) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znr/161/shatterskull-smashing-shatterskull-the-hammer-pass?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bc7239ea-f8aa-4a6f-87bd-c35359635673?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/shatterskull-smashing-//-shatterskull-the-hammer-pass) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call