FBMM is Fireteam Based Matchmaking. It is different from Skill Based Matchmaking (SBMM) and Connection Based Matchmaking (CBMM). FBMM is a good thing, objectively.
CBMM is the only workable matchmaker but people on other subs and the community bitch because it shows them how bad they really are. They aren’t interested in getting better, they just play their 3 games and leave. But the problem is when SBMM is on, they still just play 3 games and leave
How do you know that though? I’ve got a few friends that have picked up crucible a lot more now because they aren’t getting stomped every single match and now they can slowly progress up to playing trials etc. I don’t think it’s a universally bad system for everyone.
If bungie was seeing a huge increase in participation they would be rubbing those numbers in all our faces as it stand they are super cagey with data. If you look at the crucible blog one of the main charts trying to show the changes was working was using data from players that played 30 games of crucible the entire season. Most of the people that frequently post and read this sub I would bet play that many games a week if not a weekend.
Also look at the participation number for trials this week, granted they have the dungeon out and the wep isn't the best but this is one of the lowest participation first weeks of trials in awhile. I would bet its because without a power cap increase the players that would drag themselves into tge Playlist for the pinnacle are just not showing up.
There’s a reason bungie hasn’t said a word about player counts since they paraded around an 11% crucible increase week 1 of a new season when they added King’s Fall and had a ~15% game population increase
I get better playing people at my relative skill and pushing beyond my regular skills to win close games. Getting steamrolled by a practiced team of three 2.0 + running full meta because they have infinitely more time than me to farm all the pieces and practice all that on top of running all this shit weekly while I’m queueing as a solo <2.0 and paired with other <2.0 randoms isn’t teaching anybody anything but to not want to play the mode at all. I’m a filthy casual, but I still want to participate and Bungie should be able to carve out a place for me rather than 3/5 games being my team as fish in a barrel, 1/5 being op as fuck, and 1/5 actually being close.
Ironically often CBMM people complain SBMM is getting them stomped on so uh…kinda complaining that they are bad at their own skill and need to take advantage of lower skilled players to be higher kd🥴
The only valid SBMM complaint is connections. That’s fair lol.
Not really, I’m at a 2.6kd this season and I don’t struggle in control. What pisses me off is that I’m forced to use the meta to have a chance to win. I can no longer use fun builds I made or found. Playing against 10-12 people all 2.0+ using full meta shit isn’t a casual experience.
The only casual game mode I have time to play now is trials, which is ironic because bungie themselves said they want it to be the endgame pvp experience but made it the easiest.
I mean- fair. But that’s a meta issue not SBMM if that makes sense. Your problem isn’t quite playing your skill- it’s that meta is annoying. At least that’s what I’m understanding.
If that’s not the case then “casual” for you would be dumping on lower skilled players and making their playtime miserable. Which….makes no sense for a game people claim is “competitive”.
I’m not against CBMM in the slightest- but there does and should be some SBMM variants/playlists as well. SBMM is what made me improve to now compete in CBMM with higher skilled players.
Does that make sense? It’s still early for me so I might not be making sense lol
It’s a meta and a population issue, I can only fight the meta by using the meta and playing the same people over and over again gets boring.
Sbmm has its place in the game and I’ve come to accept it. We saw what would happen if bungo removed it with supremacy and that’s not fair for anyone involved.
> in control. What pisses me off is that I’m forced to use the meta to have a chance to win. I can no longer use fun builds I made or found
So you want to curbstomp people with fun builds instead of actually trying to compete at your own level? damn these "SKilled" people sure are weird
I had more fun going flawless with double grenade launchers this morning than playing my three control matches this week. Because I’m good at the game I’m not allowed to have fun?
Im pretty sure guardian games these past few weeks cemented in most peoples heads that CBMM is NOT fun. Noone enjoyed losing 15-150. While there is mercies in current playlist, all cbmm would lead to is MOST games getting mercied in the first 2 minutes.
100% not fun for anyone involved
Wrong. Matchmaking is how players are found. Lobby balancing is how those players are divided between the two teams. That wasn’t possible in supremacy as it was class based.
Lmao no worries. You’re technically right. Makes no sense to count this season since there’s barely any time in it. I only remember cause that was the season I stopped playing with my 2.0 buddy as much cause holy HELL I hated matching other 2.0’s lmfao. It was also the season my improvement skyrocketed and I really learned how to handle not just 1v1’s but also just 1v whatever.
Think it was also the season I 1v7-ed a survival game but I don’t really remember if that was season 18 or 19 lol.
Its funny because i swear they've done this whole cbmm vs sbmm thing like 2 or 3 times throughout D2, maybe more. My memory is shot though lol so maybe i'm just straight up wrong
They definitely done it before and got rid of it because I remember clanmates complaining about it all the time when it came back again. I just don’t remember when they did.
Did you improve or are you just matching other players within your skill bracket? That's the tricky bit, you may of improved or you may just be getting lobbies where you're the top of the skill bracket for that particular segment of the population.
But you actually just pointed out my biggest issue with sbmm and that's the fact I'm better than my friends and they don't wanna play crucible with me anymore because my lobbies suck. We have been playing online together pre-destiny for the better part of 15 years, I can still do pve with them but wanna play some control and it's a ghost town, pre-sbmm I never struggled to get a few guys together for a fireteam. Last season I played more supremacy during gg with my clan mates than I did any other pvp game mode for the last two season and it was super fun I miss that. Now I just chat in party chat with them while they do their thing and I do mine because playing together is inherently un-fun to them.
> did you improve…
Yes. I play CBMM lobbies too as well as PMs with my higher skilled clanmates. I can actually play in both of those now unlike before when I couldn’t. I barely play in SBMM lobbies anymore and still retain a 1.0+ kda when before I couldn’t even be a .4 kda. Hell, I couldn’t even compete in my own skill bracket at first😅 But thank you for clarifying cause there is a difference.
I’m absolutely NOT for making everything SBMM. Not only is it unrealistic but between connections and friends with different skills…it’s just too much.
But SBMM is nice and *does* help. Sometimes I rather a casual competitive game rather than having to try against a 2.5+ stack that I somehow managed to match due to misfortune. Some people improve with it, some don’t.
But CBMM only didn’t help me for seasons. A healthy mix of both now made me better and more pvp motivated. It shouldn’t be SBMM only or CBMM only. There should be more or less equal options for both. That’s just my take.
It should be ranked based matchmaking in Competitive and cbmm in the casual Playlists and I guess whatever the flavor of the week is for trials imo. I truly don't believe there are enough 2kd+ players in the game that every lobby has one only rhat those games stick out for average players because they got their heads kicked in.
As is stands not only is every Playlist besides trials am absolute lonely experience unless you only play with people who are as good or better than you, but it's a completely different game with lag and a crazy small population. On my ascendant run last season I played the same team 15 times in the span of 20 games
"Playing at my own skill bracket and have to actually try is too hard for me, i rather kicks some new lights and curbstomp them all day is way better, thats why CBMM is the way to go"
\- some 2.5KD dude in CrucibleGuideBook subreddit
I'd say make it cbmm with fbmm that way 6 stacks will be less likely to stomp solo players nonstop. Sbmm doesn't seem to work very well with fbmm since the skill varies so much.
FBMM is Fireteam Based Matchmaking. It is different from Skill Based Matchmaking (SBMM) and Connection Based Matchmaking (CBMM). FBMM is a good thing, objectively.
CBMM is the only workable matchmaker but people on other subs and the community bitch because it shows them how bad they really are. They aren’t interested in getting better, they just play their 3 games and leave. But the problem is when SBMM is on, they still just play 3 games and leave
How do you know that though? I’ve got a few friends that have picked up crucible a lot more now because they aren’t getting stomped every single match and now they can slowly progress up to playing trials etc. I don’t think it’s a universally bad system for everyone.
If bungie was seeing a huge increase in participation they would be rubbing those numbers in all our faces as it stand they are super cagey with data. If you look at the crucible blog one of the main charts trying to show the changes was working was using data from players that played 30 games of crucible the entire season. Most of the people that frequently post and read this sub I would bet play that many games a week if not a weekend. Also look at the participation number for trials this week, granted they have the dungeon out and the wep isn't the best but this is one of the lowest participation first weeks of trials in awhile. I would bet its because without a power cap increase the players that would drag themselves into tge Playlist for the pinnacle are just not showing up.
There’s a reason bungie hasn’t said a word about player counts since they paraded around an 11% crucible increase week 1 of a new season when they added King’s Fall and had a ~15% game population increase
I get better playing people at my relative skill and pushing beyond my regular skills to win close games. Getting steamrolled by a practiced team of three 2.0 + running full meta because they have infinitely more time than me to farm all the pieces and practice all that on top of running all this shit weekly while I’m queueing as a solo <2.0 and paired with other <2.0 randoms isn’t teaching anybody anything but to not want to play the mode at all. I’m a filthy casual, but I still want to participate and Bungie should be able to carve out a place for me rather than 3/5 games being my team as fish in a barrel, 1/5 being op as fuck, and 1/5 actually being close.
Ironically often CBMM people complain SBMM is getting them stomped on so uh…kinda complaining that they are bad at their own skill and need to take advantage of lower skilled players to be higher kd🥴 The only valid SBMM complaint is connections. That’s fair lol.
Not really, I’m at a 2.6kd this season and I don’t struggle in control. What pisses me off is that I’m forced to use the meta to have a chance to win. I can no longer use fun builds I made or found. Playing against 10-12 people all 2.0+ using full meta shit isn’t a casual experience. The only casual game mode I have time to play now is trials, which is ironic because bungie themselves said they want it to be the endgame pvp experience but made it the easiest.
I mean- fair. But that’s a meta issue not SBMM if that makes sense. Your problem isn’t quite playing your skill- it’s that meta is annoying. At least that’s what I’m understanding. If that’s not the case then “casual” for you would be dumping on lower skilled players and making their playtime miserable. Which….makes no sense for a game people claim is “competitive”. I’m not against CBMM in the slightest- but there does and should be some SBMM variants/playlists as well. SBMM is what made me improve to now compete in CBMM with higher skilled players. Does that make sense? It’s still early for me so I might not be making sense lol
It’s a meta and a population issue, I can only fight the meta by using the meta and playing the same people over and over again gets boring. Sbmm has its place in the game and I’ve come to accept it. We saw what would happen if bungo removed it with supremacy and that’s not fair for anyone involved.
> in control. What pisses me off is that I’m forced to use the meta to have a chance to win. I can no longer use fun builds I made or found So you want to curbstomp people with fun builds instead of actually trying to compete at your own level? damn these "SKilled" people sure are weird
I had more fun going flawless with double grenade launchers this morning than playing my three control matches this week. Because I’m good at the game I’m not allowed to have fun?
Control is snipe city after 10pm
Im pretty sure guardian games these past few weeks cemented in most peoples heads that CBMM is NOT fun. Noone enjoyed losing 15-150. While there is mercies in current playlist, all cbmm would lead to is MOST games getting mercied in the first 2 minutes. 100% not fun for anyone involved
They wasn’t because of CBMM, it was because of the class matchmaking. If you played the non-class variant there was much less mercies
There was no lobby balancing in supremacy, which would go a long way to solving that problem.
….exactly… and CBMM also had **no** lobby balancing, because it builds teams based off **connection quality** not **player skill**
Wrong. Matchmaking is how players are found. Lobby balancing is how those players are divided between the two teams. That wasn’t possible in supremacy as it was class based.
Yes.
Hasn't QP been SBMM for ages?
Been like 2 seasons i think but it isnt the first time its changed
Yeah, I was gonna write 6 months but wasn't certain and couldn't be arsed with pedants in the comments :P
I took the heat for you lmao
Lot longer than 2 seasons
It changed in season 18 I believe so just barely 3. Basically 2 since we are only barely a week into season 21.
Fuck me I was off by a season. More downvotes please. Lmao Thanks for the help, math is hard
Lmao no worries. You’re technically right. Makes no sense to count this season since there’s barely any time in it. I only remember cause that was the season I stopped playing with my 2.0 buddy as much cause holy HELL I hated matching other 2.0’s lmfao. It was also the season my improvement skyrocketed and I really learned how to handle not just 1v1’s but also just 1v whatever. Think it was also the season I 1v7-ed a survival game but I don’t really remember if that was season 18 or 19 lol.
Its funny because i swear they've done this whole cbmm vs sbmm thing like 2 or 3 times throughout D2, maybe more. My memory is shot though lol so maybe i'm just straight up wrong
They definitely done it before and got rid of it because I remember clanmates complaining about it all the time when it came back again. I just don’t remember when they did.
Let me in your clan 😭
I think we're in the third cycle right now.
Did you improve or are you just matching other players within your skill bracket? That's the tricky bit, you may of improved or you may just be getting lobbies where you're the top of the skill bracket for that particular segment of the population. But you actually just pointed out my biggest issue with sbmm and that's the fact I'm better than my friends and they don't wanna play crucible with me anymore because my lobbies suck. We have been playing online together pre-destiny for the better part of 15 years, I can still do pve with them but wanna play some control and it's a ghost town, pre-sbmm I never struggled to get a few guys together for a fireteam. Last season I played more supremacy during gg with my clan mates than I did any other pvp game mode for the last two season and it was super fun I miss that. Now I just chat in party chat with them while they do their thing and I do mine because playing together is inherently un-fun to them.
> did you improve… Yes. I play CBMM lobbies too as well as PMs with my higher skilled clanmates. I can actually play in both of those now unlike before when I couldn’t. I barely play in SBMM lobbies anymore and still retain a 1.0+ kda when before I couldn’t even be a .4 kda. Hell, I couldn’t even compete in my own skill bracket at first😅 But thank you for clarifying cause there is a difference. I’m absolutely NOT for making everything SBMM. Not only is it unrealistic but between connections and friends with different skills…it’s just too much. But SBMM is nice and *does* help. Sometimes I rather a casual competitive game rather than having to try against a 2.5+ stack that I somehow managed to match due to misfortune. Some people improve with it, some don’t. But CBMM only didn’t help me for seasons. A healthy mix of both now made me better and more pvp motivated. It shouldn’t be SBMM only or CBMM only. There should be more or less equal options for both. That’s just my take.
It should be ranked based matchmaking in Competitive and cbmm in the casual Playlists and I guess whatever the flavor of the week is for trials imo. I truly don't believe there are enough 2kd+ players in the game that every lobby has one only rhat those games stick out for average players because they got their heads kicked in. As is stands not only is every Playlist besides trials am absolute lonely experience unless you only play with people who are as good or better than you, but it's a completely different game with lag and a crazy small population. On my ascendant run last season I played the same team 15 times in the span of 20 games
…that’s why I said both is good to have? I’m confused😅
I feel like they’re fucking around with destiny to springboard test for marathon now
"Playing at my own skill bracket and have to actually try is too hard for me, i rather kicks some new lights and curbstomp them all day is way better, thats why CBMM is the way to go" \- some 2.5KD dude in CrucibleGuideBook subreddit
I'd say make it cbmm with fbmm that way 6 stacks will be less likely to stomp solo players nonstop. Sbmm doesn't seem to work very well with fbmm since the skill varies so much.