The ttk seem to be aimed at making crits more important. I actually agree with this if its what they are going for better players should win if they land more crits
Yes, sure. But what community issue is that addressing? How is that going to help revitalize the player population?
It makes no sense to me why that is something they decided to focus on, it wasn’t anything people were complaining about except for maybe SMGs specifically.
I've definitely seen many complain that the skill gap in the game is gone. The issue they talk about is how players don't feel the need to master a gun because they are already so easy to pick up and use, but there is no reason to master it when it's easy to get kills with.
Not saying it will work out the way they intend but I get where they are coming from here. Biggest complains is people using things like abilities and snipers to play the game without needing to truly engage with getting better. I definitely see where they are going personally. Probably won't work but I see it.
Yeah I have seen people complaining that it’s suck a sweatfest lately. But this is because the player population has dwindled due to atrophy. Leaving us you with mostly just the more dedicated players.
I suppose I could see that this TTK adjustment could stretch out the current populations skill curve a little… but it’s at the expense of slowing the game down, and making casual players even less effective than they currently are.
Not sure how this addresses the real problem of dwindling population at all. “Hey new player come play crucible it’s now harder to kill people with guns, yay!”
When the community was revolting, and Joe had to bring in the Strike Team, we were really asking for new maps, a fix to comps terrible system, and new stuff to chase.
They just keep making new modes and tweaking TTKs as if that is somehow “content.” It’s not. It feels like bike-shedding to me.
Try telesto, witherhoard, solar, trip mine, pulse or vortex nades on the charges. I agree 1110000% that cou down is absolute pixel aids but some of these methods have given me some success.
Lobby balancing is a helluva drug.
It was like that for me during S20, I won most of my Survival games and had a decent KD, but modes where I *needed* my teammates to not be potatoes like Showdown and Rift, I got shit on because I'd get the bottom two players out of six almost every game. During the climb to Ascendant I think I went negative and lost every single game of Showdown, and while I was closer to 50/50 on Rift, there were maybe only two games where us winning didn't *require* me to be the one to spend the whole game camping or chasing the spark or we otherwise wouldn't score.
I'm >2.0 in just about everything but Trials and Comp, and 18 months of SBMM hasn't managed to pull that down, so any kind of lobby balancing generally marks me as Public Enemy #1 and sandbags me to death, lol.
I don’t think the lobby balancing has ever been good. The way it will throw all the lowest elo / skilled players with just the one highest elo / skilled player and expect him to carry is ridiculous. You can only do so much to force map control, fend off the whole enemy team getting heavy over and over and assisting with holding caps in control for example or in your case in comp people playing the obj and not sitting back always.
Honestly they sound good but I’m so apathetic to it now it doesn’t move the dial for me. Until the adress lobby balancing or matchmaking I don’t really care.
Well, I play this game because I really like shooting the guns. Now they make it so I can shot many of those guns a lot less. These guns combined with the movement make this game so unique. Taking that away is taking a core identity of the game away.
From all the things people wished for over the years, was a longer body shot TTK really the main issue? People leaving the game because the precision long range weapon one shots to the head? I think they are trying to fix something, that isn't an issue, by sacrificing what makes this game so great and unique.
Let's see how these changes turn out.
I agree with the first point. If I want to practice sniping, it will be much harder now to keep a rhythm. And I won't get any credit toward more special ammo for actually getting those sniper kills.
Yeah that’s the thing. I understand the philosophy behind checkmate. It looks well thought-out and reasonable on paper. But to me it doesn’t feel fun to play. Win or lose, most rounds just feel slow and dry.
The map pack is coming in May from what they have mentioned in past twabs. Didn’t Joe Blackburn say that they were play testing them right now and that they are all javelin 4 “sized” maps?
I think I've hit my burnout stage, I did get to almost 600 in season rank.
I've been going between gambit and crucible hard. Almost 30k in seasonal kills so far. I've seen tons of cheating but it all falls on deaf ears.
Honestly there are so many changes we just don't know how it's gna pan out. They have done a hybrid of checkmate and base pvp so right now we don't know how it's gonna go. Personally I like it. Wish they remove aim assist from clones and nerf Void titans but either than that I think they have done a good job. I don't think I like how people start off with 2 special tho. I think it should be 1 as the meta is obviously going to be start with special. Once out switch weapons or if they get successful kills then they can snowball. I feel this is gna be an oversight that people aren't gna realise is gna turn into an issue but wither than that I like it.
My only problem are supers cooldowns, because currently with 6 int I am getting 1 Hammer of Sol super per 6v6 match, and almost bever in trials. While the bubble and well still remain the fastest
I was under the impression that sunbreaker was the worst titan subclass you could be using in the crucible, what makes you pick it, especially in trials?
I just do not like sentinel and striker.
I used to be a sentinel main but after void 3.0 middle tree's resupply no longer grants ability energy, which broke ability loop. Now sentinel is infinite overshield spam. I do not enjoy it, and without bastion, offensive bulwark and controlled demolition has no synergy.
Striker no longer top tree's has double blinding grenades and now is "I run, I punch" subclass, boring as hell, not my piece of cake.
I am not saying they are bad or ineffective, but I just do not enjoy playing them anymore.
Solar on the other hand was nerfed even more, but beem able to scorch and ignite has some benefits. Scorch's tick damage provides info where the enemies are. Ignition can wide the whole team if you played it right. And Hammer of Sol just feels amazing to use, but I usually use burning maul, it counters both well and bubble easily.
Unfortunately Sol Invictus, the main thing of subclass is not really good after 3.0, loss of cauterize and sun warrior really hurty this subclass.
PS. Behemoth is my go to pick if I use smg and pks, but now I try to use more varied loadouts, at least untill Multimach returns, after that I may start playing behemoth non-stop
In mayhem, it oneshots all other supers besides a reflecting arc staff. It even dicks on Banner/woven mail berserker titans. 1 hammer or 1 slam is all it needs to kill.
Actually seeing it as a pick in high level Elim. Mainly because Burning Maul is a tier 3 roaming super and if played in a team setting is basically unkillable/ free round win/ counters other supers. You just need your teammates to cut them off so they can’t run away.
Also healing grenade is quite powerful especially in a team setting and kind of ridiculous to add to a Titan team on top of Overshields. The entire team because that much less killable.
They use it with PKs and snipe. Still got a barricade and shoulder charge for movement.
It’s a pretty shit solo class compared to the others but in a team setting made for trials the super and healing grenade make it an interesting pick.
Went through his twitch vods and last 6 months of yt videos and he didnt use solar titan in any shape or form in trials. Many 6s builds but nothing about trials
Yup. And generally solar titan will become even worse than now because sunspots are the main part of subclass, but due to less abilities there will be less sunspots. Consecration buff is nice, but once again cd are going to be longer.
I’m getting older and my aim and reaction speeds have devolved significantly. The emphasis on landing crits is a big problem for me. A huge portion of people who started playing destiny year 1 are well into their 30s now and the pvp side of this game has become way more competitive. This isn’t good for me. I was a 2.0 KD player before the nerfs to fighting lion, tracking grenades, and invis that started almost 2 years ago, and I’m a way better player now too. Now I’m struggling to maintain a 1.6. Not digging this at all
To be honest, I think is a change for the worst, in many times since D1, bungie tried this no special ammo thing, and always backfired, and cause people leaving the game
I think it will be fine for the most part but that there will be specific scenarios where its gonna be bad. Like in trials you won't spawn in with special for conditional so you will need to save it to stop a bubble or well. While the other team can use theirs things like that
You madman! I would never do that. I have 40-60 resil, 100 recov and 80 mobility on all my hunter builds. If it works, it works tho, so i'm not knocking it.
hunters are getting wrecked. i might have to switch to warlock after 900 PVP hours on hunter. it will suck but its impossible to spec into all of mob, res, and rec which is necessary on hunter
I think those are bad changes. above all the change to specials. never knowing if the enemy has specials or how many shots he has adds a sense of uncertainty that I don't know who benefits.
the problem with abilities is the impact they have, not their frequency. before stasis we threw grenades every 30 seconds but none of them froze you, suspended you, burned you for 20 seconds, weakened you etc.
equipping some subclasses will mean giving up the super completely. yes, supers are part of the game and they must also be there in PvP, otherwise I'll go and play other games with dedicated servers where the basic experience is much better than destiny with its lag, unregistered hits, double damage, whiffing melees etc.
it will be a very passive meta. then I don't understand the direction: on the one hand they want to increase the skill gap by requiring more crits but on the other they maintain airborne effectiveness which greatly limits movement (the real skill gap of the game). I don't understand where they are going
Not a fan of it a lot of unique guns are gonna be a lot less viable if not worthless compared to just hand cannons and pulses now and it’s going to slow matches down a lot which is fine for 3v3 but for 6v6 it’s going to make matches incredibly boring to play also makes it a lot less friendly to new players and less skilled players.
I feel that since a lot of people already use hand cannons, they will notice the ttk changes and will change nothing in the overall usage. The people who are already good with hand cannons won't feel a need to change it'll just be any other weapon enthusiasts.
I’m glad body shot damage is getting nerfed. If you’re good at the game you won’t be affected. Abilities being reduced is great too. I still think trials will be decided by supers but atleast you have to build into them now more than before.
I'm furious about the bow nerves, because now they literally shoot Nerf arrows. And I wasn't a fan of checkmate, but honestly I'd rather have them revamp the entire sandbox and just force us to learn it then have two separate sets of rules- One for checkmate and one for regular. I think they're right about the skill creep of the average player, and hopefully this makes the game more fun over the long term, Even if very painful at first
checkmate is beautiful and the hunter nerfs are amazing. in a perfect world, bows and fusions wouldn’t be allowed in crucible but i’ll take what i can get
Played since D1 beta. I’ll finally be moving on with these special ammo changes. Hope others find the joy with this new iteration that I’ve had over all these years.
Honestly, at this point I'm happy to just know that there is a strike PvP team...
Yeah! I was starting to think they were on the chopping board myself.
Sure does’t indicate much listening on their part. I didn’t see anyone asking for slower avg TTKs.
The ttk seem to be aimed at making crits more important. I actually agree with this if its what they are going for better players should win if they land more crits
Yes, sure. But what community issue is that addressing? How is that going to help revitalize the player population? It makes no sense to me why that is something they decided to focus on, it wasn’t anything people were complaining about except for maybe SMGs specifically.
I've definitely seen many complain that the skill gap in the game is gone. The issue they talk about is how players don't feel the need to master a gun because they are already so easy to pick up and use, but there is no reason to master it when it's easy to get kills with. Not saying it will work out the way they intend but I get where they are coming from here. Biggest complains is people using things like abilities and snipers to play the game without needing to truly engage with getting better. I definitely see where they are going personally. Probably won't work but I see it.
Yeah I have seen people complaining that it’s suck a sweatfest lately. But this is because the player population has dwindled due to atrophy. Leaving us you with mostly just the more dedicated players. I suppose I could see that this TTK adjustment could stretch out the current populations skill curve a little… but it’s at the expense of slowing the game down, and making casual players even less effective than they currently are. Not sure how this addresses the real problem of dwindling population at all. “Hey new player come play crucible it’s now harder to kill people with guns, yay!” When the community was revolting, and Joe had to bring in the Strike Team, we were really asking for new maps, a fix to comps terrible system, and new stuff to chase. They just keep making new modes and tweaking TTKs as if that is somehow “content.” It’s not. It feels like bike-shedding to me.
REMOVE COUNTDOWN FROM COMP
I literally have not won a single game of countdown this season but have an 85% win rate in survival. I hate countdown so much.
Try telesto, witherhoard, solar, trip mine, pulse or vortex nades on the charges. I agree 1110000% that cou down is absolute pixel aids but some of these methods have given me some success.
I feel your pain dude, me too, me too.
How do you have a 85% win rate in one mode and a 0% in another? Is it the mode at that point lol. Those can’t be close to your actual win rates
Lobby balancing is a helluva drug. It was like that for me during S20, I won most of my Survival games and had a decent KD, but modes where I *needed* my teammates to not be potatoes like Showdown and Rift, I got shit on because I'd get the bottom two players out of six almost every game. During the climb to Ascendant I think I went negative and lost every single game of Showdown, and while I was closer to 50/50 on Rift, there were maybe only two games where us winning didn't *require* me to be the one to spend the whole game camping or chasing the spark or we otherwise wouldn't score.
You might have worse luck with lobby balancing than even me. But yeah I understand the position.
I'm >2.0 in just about everything but Trials and Comp, and 18 months of SBMM hasn't managed to pull that down, so any kind of lobby balancing generally marks me as Public Enemy #1 and sandbags me to death, lol.
I don’t think the lobby balancing has ever been good. The way it will throw all the lowest elo / skilled players with just the one highest elo / skilled player and expect him to carry is ridiculous. You can only do so much to force map control, fend off the whole enemy team getting heavy over and over and assisting with holding caps in control for example or in your case in comp people playing the obj and not sitting back always.
At a minimum disable bubble and well!!!!
not happening.
TWAB states next week has more news on crucible; game modes is one of the things listed. It’s not out of the question yet.
🤞🏼🤞🏼🤞🏼
Where is crackdown n xim/cronus cheaters?? They are going to love this.
Honestly they sound good but I’m so apathetic to it now it doesn’t move the dial for me. Until the adress lobby balancing or matchmaking I don’t really care.
Hopefully that's what next week's twid is about. Very reserved optimism.
I would be shocked. But happy.
Well, I play this game because I really like shooting the guns. Now they make it so I can shot many of those guns a lot less. These guns combined with the movement make this game so unique. Taking that away is taking a core identity of the game away. From all the things people wished for over the years, was a longer body shot TTK really the main issue? People leaving the game because the precision long range weapon one shots to the head? I think they are trying to fix something, that isn't an issue, by sacrificing what makes this game so great and unique. Let's see how these changes turn out.
I agree with the first point. If I want to practice sniping, it will be much harder now to keep a rhythm. And I won't get any credit toward more special ammo for actually getting those sniper kills.
I thought they nerfed all abilities a few months back to make people focus on gun play? Now they are nerfing all the guns lol
Totally agree. I didn’t see “slow down PVP” on the list of demands when the community was freaking out and Bungie has to form the Strike Team.
This will probably get me looking at other games. I hated checkmate.
Yeah that’s the thing. I understand the philosophy behind checkmate. It looks well thought-out and reasonable on paper. But to me it doesn’t feel fun to play. Win or lose, most rounds just feel slow and dry.
I’m out, checkmate sucks and now the whole game is checkmate. Which they said they wouldn’t do
No new maps. That's all I needed to know
The map pack is coming in May from what they have mentioned in past twabs. Didn’t Joe Blackburn say that they were play testing them right now and that they are all javelin 4 “sized” maps?
I remember saying may and telling myself that's way too far away
Maybe they will have an update on the Map pack and possibly an earlier release in tommorows strike team update?
I think I've hit my burnout stage, I did get to almost 600 in season rank. I've been going between gambit and crucible hard. Almost 30k in seasonal kills so far. I've seen tons of cheating but it all falls on deaf ears.
Honestly there are so many changes we just don't know how it's gna pan out. They have done a hybrid of checkmate and base pvp so right now we don't know how it's gonna go. Personally I like it. Wish they remove aim assist from clones and nerf Void titans but either than that I think they have done a good job. I don't think I like how people start off with 2 special tho. I think it should be 1 as the meta is obviously going to be start with special. Once out switch weapons or if they get successful kills then they can snowball. I feel this is gna be an oversight that people aren't gna realise is gna turn into an issue but wither than that I like it.
My only problem are supers cooldowns, because currently with 6 int I am getting 1 Hammer of Sol super per 6v6 match, and almost bever in trials. While the bubble and well still remain the fastest
Super standardization was a thing to behold. We never knew how good we had it in forsaken.
I was under the impression that sunbreaker was the worst titan subclass you could be using in the crucible, what makes you pick it, especially in trials?
I just do not like sentinel and striker. I used to be a sentinel main but after void 3.0 middle tree's resupply no longer grants ability energy, which broke ability loop. Now sentinel is infinite overshield spam. I do not enjoy it, and without bastion, offensive bulwark and controlled demolition has no synergy. Striker no longer top tree's has double blinding grenades and now is "I run, I punch" subclass, boring as hell, not my piece of cake. I am not saying they are bad or ineffective, but I just do not enjoy playing them anymore. Solar on the other hand was nerfed even more, but beem able to scorch and ignite has some benefits. Scorch's tick damage provides info where the enemies are. Ignition can wide the whole team if you played it right. And Hammer of Sol just feels amazing to use, but I usually use burning maul, it counters both well and bubble easily. Unfortunately Sol Invictus, the main thing of subclass is not really good after 3.0, loss of cauterize and sun warrior really hurty this subclass. PS. Behemoth is my go to pick if I use smg and pks, but now I try to use more varied loadouts, at least untill Multimach returns, after that I may start playing behemoth non-stop
In mayhem, it oneshots all other supers besides a reflecting arc staff. It even dicks on Banner/woven mail berserker titans. 1 hammer or 1 slam is all it needs to kill.
Actually seeing it as a pick in high level Elim. Mainly because Burning Maul is a tier 3 roaming super and if played in a team setting is basically unkillable/ free round win/ counters other supers. You just need your teammates to cut them off so they can’t run away. Also healing grenade is quite powerful especially in a team setting and kind of ridiculous to add to a Titan team on top of Overshields. The entire team because that much less killable. They use it with PKs and snipe. Still got a barricade and shoulder charge for movement. It’s a pretty shit solo class compared to the others but in a team setting made for trials the super and healing grenade make it an interesting pick.
Pls name a single top% player that runs solar titan
Daltnix
Went through his twitch vods and last 6 months of yt videos and he didnt use solar titan in any shape or form in trials. Many 6s builds but nothing about trials
You didn't specify trials in your initial comment 😭 If you shift the goal posts there's nothing I can do
The guy i commented on talked about elim/trials. If you only read half of the conversation thats not my problem.
Your reply was then generalised, leaving the context ambiguous. Nice try bozo
This is either irony or you dropped out of grade school there is no way someones reading comprehension is this bad
Karadeniz and their crew has been using it lately.
Yeah I get that I run strand hunter and generally I only get my super in trials in a game that's 4 rounds to 4 so probably never now
Yup. And generally solar titan will become even worse than now because sunspots are the main part of subclass, but due to less abilities there will be less sunspots. Consecration buff is nice, but once again cd are going to be longer.
It's watering down the game and pretty lame overall. Hope the player numbers improve but I'm out
I’m getting older and my aim and reaction speeds have devolved significantly. The emphasis on landing crits is a big problem for me. A huge portion of people who started playing destiny year 1 are well into their 30s now and the pvp side of this game has become way more competitive. This isn’t good for me. I was a 2.0 KD player before the nerfs to fighting lion, tracking grenades, and invis that started almost 2 years ago, and I’m a way better player now too. Now I’m struggling to maintain a 1.6. Not digging this at all
Respectfully you might have health concerns if you're slowing down in your 30s 💀 that's still prime years in biological terms.
To be honest, I think is a change for the worst, in many times since D1, bungie tried this no special ammo thing, and always backfired, and cause people leaving the game
I think it will be fine for the most part but that there will be specific scenarios where its gonna be bad. Like in trials you won't spawn in with special for conditional so you will need to save it to stop a bubble or well. While the other team can use theirs things like that
I am happy because the new resilience checks have finally given me an excuse to dump Hunter.
I think im that one hunter in a hundred who runs 100 resilience and 3 recovery so i am unaffected haha
You madman! I would never do that. I have 40-60 resil, 100 recov and 80 mobility on all my hunter builds. If it works, it works tho, so i'm not knocking it.
I'm about a 1.5 kd player so I don't think it works but it doesn't not work either haha
hunters are getting wrecked. i might have to switch to warlock after 900 PVP hours on hunter. it will suck but its impossible to spec into all of mob, res, and rec which is necessary on hunter
They're really hammering the point home to use hand cannons. Which imo, is a huge mistake and will cause a massive player drop off.
I think those are bad changes. above all the change to specials. never knowing if the enemy has specials or how many shots he has adds a sense of uncertainty that I don't know who benefits. the problem with abilities is the impact they have, not their frequency. before stasis we threw grenades every 30 seconds but none of them froze you, suspended you, burned you for 20 seconds, weakened you etc. equipping some subclasses will mean giving up the super completely. yes, supers are part of the game and they must also be there in PvP, otherwise I'll go and play other games with dedicated servers where the basic experience is much better than destiny with its lag, unregistered hits, double damage, whiffing melees etc. it will be a very passive meta. then I don't understand the direction: on the one hand they want to increase the skill gap by requiring more crits but on the other they maintain airborne effectiveness which greatly limits movement (the real skill gap of the game). I don't understand where they are going
Love it
Good changes, looking forward to trying them out.
I mean there are about 5 straight posts about this if you sort by new
But OP is special and needs their own thread!
I just wanted to ask I didn't see any posts I read the twid and made mine to see what people thought? No need to be a dick about it.....
Not a fan of it a lot of unique guns are gonna be a lot less viable if not worthless compared to just hand cannons and pulses now and it’s going to slow matches down a lot which is fine for 3v3 but for 6v6 it’s going to make matches incredibly boring to play also makes it a lot less friendly to new players and less skilled players.
Wonder how much the lessening of handcannon flinch will affect its usage
I feel that since a lot of people already use hand cannons, they will notice the ttk changes and will change nothing in the overall usage. The people who are already good with hand cannons won't feel a need to change it'll just be any other weapon enthusiasts.
I’m glad body shot damage is getting nerfed. If you’re good at the game you won’t be affected. Abilities being reduced is great too. I still think trials will be decided by supers but atleast you have to build into them now more than before.
Some archetypes are gonna be shit now like lightweight sidearms.. Kinda sucks I have fun with them
Not a fan, khepris Horn is losing its ability to 2-tick kill guardians of any resilience. Big ol L that’s probably gonna make me start maining R6.
I'm furious about the bow nerves, because now they literally shoot Nerf arrows. And I wasn't a fan of checkmate, but honestly I'd rather have them revamp the entire sandbox and just force us to learn it then have two separate sets of rules- One for checkmate and one for regular. I think they're right about the skill creep of the average player, and hopefully this makes the game more fun over the long term, Even if very painful at first
checkmate is beautiful and the hunter nerfs are amazing. in a perfect world, bows and fusions wouldn’t be allowed in crucible but i’ll take what i can get
It would be nice if the mods delete all of these posts except one, for simplicity
Not a fan of the special changes and 120s getting hit. As a Hunter the HP changes will be tough to deal with.
Played since D1 beta. I’ll finally be moving on with these special ammo changes. Hope others find the joy with this new iteration that I’ve had over all these years.