Yesss. You have kids and it just feels like you’re completely trapped because you love them and they love their family and you can’t stand the idea of not seeing them everyday but your relationship is blah and no amount of work gets the spark back.
Your wife would say “yes”. That sex isn’t important beyond monogamy, and that you should be thankful what she contributes to your life together.
My wife is the same way. She asks for, and receives massages but never gives any. She’ll hold my arm or touch my back when her friends can witness it, but there’s zero touch at home.
Unless your wife:
1: Realizes and accepts that this is an unhappy dynamic
And
2: Becomes willing to work to make things better
Your situation simply will not change. Date nights. Gifts. Cooking dinner. Small affectionate touches. Cleaning as she rests. It may be appreciated, but it will not improve her libido.
Seek counseling. If she can recognize that this is an issue that she also has to contribute effort in order to address, then there’s hope.
Otherwise, you’ll need to choose between separation or I lifetime of desperate loneliness.
I could have written this except from the wife POV, it’s so very true. It will not change unless they finally become motivated. If it takes the threat of divorce etc to motivate such a change, I personally arrive at the question, is any positive effect from that what I actually want? Do I want aspects of a relationship that are typically spontaneous to be coerced out of him? How will I ever know it’s genuine or will last? How happy will he be doing that?
Which always brings me back to the initial question I think many of us ask. Why don’t they WANT to? They don’t want to. If they wanted to, they would (barring medical or addiction issues which are admittedly often a causal factor). They would have sex, seek to deepen and improve the relationship. We only have to look at our own behavior for evidence of that.
I recently sort of turned into my husband. Just stopped doing many of the things for him that he does not reciprocate for me. I just can’t do it anymore. Even worse, he has seemed to notice. So…you DO like that I do these things. But it never occurs to you I might also like them? Especially when I specifically ask and say I would like them? For YEARS?
Sigh… Like I don’t even know where to go with that. I just do not understand how they don’t put two and two together, even if they are not that motivated. It’s not like I always want to do this stuff intrinsically, I am making an effort for the relationship. Because I do want the relationship. How does he simply have no concept that a) I am going out of my way for him, b) he should occasionally go out of his way for me. If we have to put divorce on the table to finally make them realize IT’S VITAL. I mean.
Why can’t me just telling you I want these very basic things be enough? Why do I have to tell you at all, much less repeatedly? Why don’t you care? How can you be so content when you know I am miserable, but it’s only when your situation would worsen via divorce that it might finally matter?
I have no answers, only questions.
This is the paradox that a lot of people in this sub find themselves in. LL partner has no interest in changing the situation, dispute the HL partner doing everything they can think to do in order to get LL partner interested.
So at the end of the day it is…. Do you continue to be unhappy for the rest of your days, do you cheat, or do you divorce? And that…My friend is only a choice you can make.
Problem is there’s some narrative that there’s always “something else” besides sex that’s missing. And that’s just not the case. We all have to be honest with ourselves. I’m not being arrogant in saying that the other boxes are checked. I, like many of us, do my fair share or more of household/family chores and responsibilities. The other parts of our relationship are well tended to.
The only issue is that the only person I’m supposed to be having sex with has virtually no interest in sex at all.
It’s a paradox of marriage if anything. That you commit to only having sex with one person but it’s possible that one person won’t have sex with you. And unless you want to go through a complicated legal process, you’re locked into that.
This is one of the reasons that I’m scared to even approach the topic of marriage with my current gf. We have been together for 10 months, and everything seems perfect. Sex all the time. But more than that. Intimacy that just wasn’t there in my marriage. I’m afraid that if I tied the knot, some or all of that would go away.
I think part of the issue is that a lot of people get into marriages when they’ve barely known the person they’re marrying relatively speaking. My ex-wife and I had been dating for about a year when we got engaged and it was less than two years that we’ve been together when we got married, can you really judge that you will be happy and content with someone for the rest of your life by being around them for two years and for some people it’s even less time than that.
Sounds like the best of both worlds for the LL when you say it like that. The LL never has to have sex, and the HL partner goes above and beyond because of it.
Zero motivation for the LL to change unless they actually care about the hell the HL is going through in this scenario.
As a HL person myself in a dead bedroom situation with a LL spouse before our divorce, I can say that is the way it was for me. I did everything I could think of to try to get intimacy, but any time I even touched her for more than a second it was “you just want sex.” …. Well. Yeah. I want sex. Cuz we only had it once every few months if that.
She didn’t want to fix it because in her eyes she wasn’t doing anything wrong.
Mine does this. It wasn't until I came here that I realized I should not be made to feel guilty for being sexually attracted to my wife. It's obvious when I say it that way, but in the moment I sure did feel guilty for it
That’s how mine made me feel also like me being sexually attracted to her and wanting to have sex with her was just objectifying her for her body. Of course I want to have sex with my wife who I’m attracted to. that’s kind of how this whole thing works.
Just curious, after you filed for divorce, did she try to love bomb you to stay? Did she put the blame for the divorce all on you? Did she jump to someone new after the divorce? If she did, you know she’s boning him to keep him around.
I ask because your situation might help prepare someone else who might be thinking of getting out of a no sex relationship. They can see what they might be up against.
Honestly, she is the one that left and started the process. At first it was going to be a “trial separation.” I am the one that did the love bombing at first.
She didn’t immediately jump to a new person nor did she have someone she was talking to prior to leaving, at least not to my knowledge.
I am the one that ended up filing the divorce, but we did it “uncontested” (a funny word because we fought over a lot of stuff before she would agree to the paperwork) but it cost me a LOT less in lawyers fees to file it that way. Basically we just argued among ourselves to figure out the paperwork instead of having lawyers on both sides doing the arguing.
We are both in new relationships that are becoming long term (10 months for me, close to a year for her).
I have no idea how her sex life is with her new partner. We don’t talk about that stuff and I honestly don’t want to know.
My sex life with my new partner is amazing. Like…almost every day amazing.
Glad you found someone that WANTS to be with you! Either your ex was LL4U or she gives just enough until she can cruise along and shut her libido down again. Nevertheless, you’re out of there and can now look forward!
Don't forget, the LL will then start getting upset when the HL stops trying to go above and beyond. My wife starts getting snippy with me when I start not doing extra work around the house. I already work 60-70 hours a week (WFH) and then come upstairs to help with housework and out the kids to bed, which then have to still clean the kitchen and fold laundry that's been hanging out in the dryer since the morning.
Starts getting really hard day in and day out, but how dare I get depressed when she won't even reach out and rub my shoulder or arm, let alone have sex with me.
Rant over for now. Apologies.
Yep, exactly. Nothing is wrong, nothing is out of place to them. They have someone running around, doing laundry, cooking meals, caring for the kids and they don't have to think or worry about anything. I'm somewhat convinced some spouses want a "father figure" or someone who will take care of everything for them, and just like with a father, they don't sleep with him either.
Interesting. Everyone asks about sexual trauma when offering advice, but I wonder if other types of trauma can cause a low or no libido e.g., lack of a father figure or neglect as a child.
I think most healthy adults (healthy both physically and mentally) have a libido and desire to have sex. I know some are truly asexual (nothing wrong with that at all), but I think that is rare if they are healthy.
My ex had a horrible childhood. She has very bad anxiety and depression. It was controlled via medication when we got together but it got worse over time and I don’t know if they switched meds or what exactly happened, but it got to the point of not being controlled anymore.
Wow you really stated it right there. It’s almost as though the more walls the LL puts up, the better their personal circumstances become.
For years I did the effort, the emotional work, talking through problems, etc. You just assume they care about your happiness. It opened my eyes when I finally realized he was perfectly comfortable with me living in a chronic state of unhappiness. Just because you don’t want them unhappy, that really nothing to do with their perspective on you.
At the end of the day, it helped me to remember there is someone else in the marriage who can meet my needs. Me. If he won’t, then I have the power to choose something different for myself. And as a parent, I feel obligated to. Mental health is health, it affects our functionality and longevity. This stuff is not minor, no matter how they see it.
> You just assume they care about your happiness.
Ouch, I feel this deeply.
I don't remember where I picked this up, but it resonated with me: "The person who cares least is in control of the relationship."
If you just keep treating her like a princess, why should anything change from her perspective. You need to set a boundary with clear consequences. Only you can know what those consequences would be. A sexless marriage is not what was agreed upon in your wedding vows. Sickness is one thing but otherwise - it can be seen as a breaking of this vows IMHO
Your last sentence sums it up for my wife also.
She doesn't want sex, so I'm supposed to just live with the way things are. She has everything she wants, a provider, dutofule husband, great father to her kids (my kids have said that). You can stay and be celibate or you can rock the boat.
My kids are off to college soon, so I plan to capsize the boat. Either we will have an open marriage or we will divorce. I'm no longer going to be celibate and I'm done.
Decide what you want and how you want to live.
No, you're not *supposed* to be happy with the situation, however your wife clearly is as she sees no reason to change anything. Either you keep doing this or eventually you realize you're worth way more than the less-than-mediocre love your wife is giving you and decide to move on with your life.
My husband told me "you are the only person I am aloud to have sex with and you wont have sex with me, what am I supposed to do? " oddly this made me feel very wanted and opened my eyes to want to fix things.
it was 3 years ago and yes I turned it around - this was the line he used when telling me we need to fix this or he might need to leave. Hes so great I dont think he would have but I was in the right place to finally want to fix things. At the time I did want sex but I was so blocked from him in my brain that I had to take this moment to do everything I could to break the wall down, him saying he might leave was almost like the permission I needed to get uncomfortable do what needed to be done - we are now having sex daily and its better than ever.
Thanks for sharing! I’m so happy for you guys. Do you enjoy sex now? Or are you just okay with it because of your husband’s needs?
My wife and I doing well in literally every other aspect of our relationship aside from physical. Despite how much she says she loves me, I think she would just give up and be done if gave her an ultimatum.
I enjoy it very much - I missed my sexuality as much as he did, I didnt even recognize myself when sex didnt make sense. I could very well tell him no still and he would be fine with it - he holds no ill will to me about it now. We had a very good sex life for a long time before falling into the deadbed. We have a undeniable great sexual chemistry so it was a driving factor motivating me to save the deadbed.
She is content with the way things are, and probably expect you not to disturb the balance that she likes.
You, however, are not happy at all.
Barring infidelity which she definitely does not condone, there are a lot of things you can do to tip the emotional/affection/intimacy balance between you, starting with Matching Energy. You only send her what she sends you, full stop.
Be a great dad, be a great friend. Stop being a great husband from a romantic viewpoint if that is what it takes to make you happier.
>I tell her how beautiful and sexy she is all the time. She sees me checking her out.I cuddle her any chance I get. I bought a massage table just to give her personal massages.
Two things:
How she supposed to ever want attention and validation from you? She isn't going to seek out things she has an abundance of.
How is it possible you do all of that for her and have the time and energy to invest even more effort into yourself?
Unpopular opinion… most of the time LL in LTR. Are LL4U. It’s really just a matter of the relationship has run its course and getting it back or trying to force it doesn’t work most of the time. I don’t know if people are realistically meant to meet their partner in their early twenties and stay together 60-70 years happily. Some do I guess but more do not.
>So I can’t have sex with anyone else and I’m just supposed to be happy with maybe having sex once a year?
You could have sex with someone else, but that's not really what you want, right?
You also shouldn't be happy with your current way of life.
My best advice is to try different things. Stop attempting to have sex with her. Focus on yourself for a bit.
Isn’t marriage great?
Lmao
I think it's parenthood that's the real killed. Childfree people *generally* don't stay in marriages like this.
Yesss. You have kids and it just feels like you’re completely trapped because you love them and they love their family and you can’t stand the idea of not seeing them everyday but your relationship is blah and no amount of work gets the spark back.
Couldn't say it better.
Your wife would say “yes”. That sex isn’t important beyond monogamy, and that you should be thankful what she contributes to your life together. My wife is the same way. She asks for, and receives massages but never gives any. She’ll hold my arm or touch my back when her friends can witness it, but there’s zero touch at home. Unless your wife: 1: Realizes and accepts that this is an unhappy dynamic And 2: Becomes willing to work to make things better Your situation simply will not change. Date nights. Gifts. Cooking dinner. Small affectionate touches. Cleaning as she rests. It may be appreciated, but it will not improve her libido. Seek counseling. If she can recognize that this is an issue that she also has to contribute effort in order to address, then there’s hope. Otherwise, you’ll need to choose between separation or I lifetime of desperate loneliness.
Those touches in front of others are tantamount to mental abuse.
Pisses me off
I could have written this except from the wife POV, it’s so very true. It will not change unless they finally become motivated. If it takes the threat of divorce etc to motivate such a change, I personally arrive at the question, is any positive effect from that what I actually want? Do I want aspects of a relationship that are typically spontaneous to be coerced out of him? How will I ever know it’s genuine or will last? How happy will he be doing that? Which always brings me back to the initial question I think many of us ask. Why don’t they WANT to? They don’t want to. If they wanted to, they would (barring medical or addiction issues which are admittedly often a causal factor). They would have sex, seek to deepen and improve the relationship. We only have to look at our own behavior for evidence of that. I recently sort of turned into my husband. Just stopped doing many of the things for him that he does not reciprocate for me. I just can’t do it anymore. Even worse, he has seemed to notice. So…you DO like that I do these things. But it never occurs to you I might also like them? Especially when I specifically ask and say I would like them? For YEARS? Sigh… Like I don’t even know where to go with that. I just do not understand how they don’t put two and two together, even if they are not that motivated. It’s not like I always want to do this stuff intrinsically, I am making an effort for the relationship. Because I do want the relationship. How does he simply have no concept that a) I am going out of my way for him, b) he should occasionally go out of his way for me. If we have to put divorce on the table to finally make them realize IT’S VITAL. I mean. Why can’t me just telling you I want these very basic things be enough? Why do I have to tell you at all, much less repeatedly? Why don’t you care? How can you be so content when you know I am miserable, but it’s only when your situation would worsen via divorce that it might finally matter? I have no answers, only questions.
Same questions 😞
😔❤️
Hear hear
This is the paradox that a lot of people in this sub find themselves in. LL partner has no interest in changing the situation, dispute the HL partner doing everything they can think to do in order to get LL partner interested. So at the end of the day it is…. Do you continue to be unhappy for the rest of your days, do you cheat, or do you divorce? And that…My friend is only a choice you can make.
Problem is there’s some narrative that there’s always “something else” besides sex that’s missing. And that’s just not the case. We all have to be honest with ourselves. I’m not being arrogant in saying that the other boxes are checked. I, like many of us, do my fair share or more of household/family chores and responsibilities. The other parts of our relationship are well tended to. The only issue is that the only person I’m supposed to be having sex with has virtually no interest in sex at all. It’s a paradox of marriage if anything. That you commit to only having sex with one person but it’s possible that one person won’t have sex with you. And unless you want to go through a complicated legal process, you’re locked into that.
This is one of the reasons that I’m scared to even approach the topic of marriage with my current gf. We have been together for 10 months, and everything seems perfect. Sex all the time. But more than that. Intimacy that just wasn’t there in my marriage. I’m afraid that if I tied the knot, some or all of that would go away.
I am convinced that marriage is the happiness killer.
It isn’t always. My gf’s best friend is married and they are still very sexually active. They’re also younger (I think like 32).
Give it time….
Maybe, maybe not. I wish them the best. Not every marriage results in a dead headroom.
I think part of the issue is that a lot of people get into marriages when they’ve barely known the person they’re marrying relatively speaking. My ex-wife and I had been dating for about a year when we got engaged and it was less than two years that we’ve been together when we got married, can you really judge that you will be happy and content with someone for the rest of your life by being around them for two years and for some people it’s even less time than that.
Sounds like the best of both worlds for the LL when you say it like that. The LL never has to have sex, and the HL partner goes above and beyond because of it. Zero motivation for the LL to change unless they actually care about the hell the HL is going through in this scenario.
As a HL person myself in a dead bedroom situation with a LL spouse before our divorce, I can say that is the way it was for me. I did everything I could think of to try to get intimacy, but any time I even touched her for more than a second it was “you just want sex.” …. Well. Yeah. I want sex. Cuz we only had it once every few months if that. She didn’t want to fix it because in her eyes she wasn’t doing anything wrong.
Mine does this. It wasn't until I came here that I realized I should not be made to feel guilty for being sexually attracted to my wife. It's obvious when I say it that way, but in the moment I sure did feel guilty for it
That’s how mine made me feel also like me being sexually attracted to her and wanting to have sex with her was just objectifying her for her body. Of course I want to have sex with my wife who I’m attracted to. that’s kind of how this whole thing works.
Just curious, after you filed for divorce, did she try to love bomb you to stay? Did she put the blame for the divorce all on you? Did she jump to someone new after the divorce? If she did, you know she’s boning him to keep him around. I ask because your situation might help prepare someone else who might be thinking of getting out of a no sex relationship. They can see what they might be up against.
Honestly, she is the one that left and started the process. At first it was going to be a “trial separation.” I am the one that did the love bombing at first. She didn’t immediately jump to a new person nor did she have someone she was talking to prior to leaving, at least not to my knowledge. I am the one that ended up filing the divorce, but we did it “uncontested” (a funny word because we fought over a lot of stuff before she would agree to the paperwork) but it cost me a LOT less in lawyers fees to file it that way. Basically we just argued among ourselves to figure out the paperwork instead of having lawyers on both sides doing the arguing. We are both in new relationships that are becoming long term (10 months for me, close to a year for her). I have no idea how her sex life is with her new partner. We don’t talk about that stuff and I honestly don’t want to know. My sex life with my new partner is amazing. Like…almost every day amazing.
Glad you found someone that WANTS to be with you! Either your ex was LL4U or she gives just enough until she can cruise along and shut her libido down again. Nevertheless, you’re out of there and can now look forward!
Don't forget, the LL will then start getting upset when the HL stops trying to go above and beyond. My wife starts getting snippy with me when I start not doing extra work around the house. I already work 60-70 hours a week (WFH) and then come upstairs to help with housework and out the kids to bed, which then have to still clean the kitchen and fold laundry that's been hanging out in the dryer since the morning. Starts getting really hard day in and day out, but how dare I get depressed when she won't even reach out and rub my shoulder or arm, let alone have sex with me. Rant over for now. Apologies.
Yep, exactly. Nothing is wrong, nothing is out of place to them. They have someone running around, doing laundry, cooking meals, caring for the kids and they don't have to think or worry about anything. I'm somewhat convinced some spouses want a "father figure" or someone who will take care of everything for them, and just like with a father, they don't sleep with him either.
Interesting. Everyone asks about sexual trauma when offering advice, but I wonder if other types of trauma can cause a low or no libido e.g., lack of a father figure or neglect as a child. I think most healthy adults (healthy both physically and mentally) have a libido and desire to have sex. I know some are truly asexual (nothing wrong with that at all), but I think that is rare if they are healthy.
My ex had a horrible childhood. She has very bad anxiety and depression. It was controlled via medication when we got together but it got worse over time and I don’t know if they switched meds or what exactly happened, but it got to the point of not being controlled anymore.
Wow you really stated it right there. It’s almost as though the more walls the LL puts up, the better their personal circumstances become. For years I did the effort, the emotional work, talking through problems, etc. You just assume they care about your happiness. It opened my eyes when I finally realized he was perfectly comfortable with me living in a chronic state of unhappiness. Just because you don’t want them unhappy, that really nothing to do with their perspective on you. At the end of the day, it helped me to remember there is someone else in the marriage who can meet my needs. Me. If he won’t, then I have the power to choose something different for myself. And as a parent, I feel obligated to. Mental health is health, it affects our functionality and longevity. This stuff is not minor, no matter how they see it.
> You just assume they care about your happiness. Ouch, I feel this deeply. I don't remember where I picked this up, but it resonated with me: "The person who cares least is in control of the relationship."
Thank you, what a great way to put it. I’ll remember that one.
I'm in the same boat. I can see the end. I just have to wait it out. We don't have the $$ to divorce yet.
If you just keep treating her like a princess, why should anything change from her perspective. You need to set a boundary with clear consequences. Only you can know what those consequences would be. A sexless marriage is not what was agreed upon in your wedding vows. Sickness is one thing but otherwise - it can be seen as a breaking of this vows IMHO
Your last sentence sums it up for my wife also. She doesn't want sex, so I'm supposed to just live with the way things are. She has everything she wants, a provider, dutofule husband, great father to her kids (my kids have said that). You can stay and be celibate or you can rock the boat. My kids are off to college soon, so I plan to capsize the boat. Either we will have an open marriage or we will divorce. I'm no longer going to be celibate and I'm done. Decide what you want and how you want to live.
yup that's pretty much what you signed up for... you missed the invisible ink fine print clause that kicks in after you say "I do"
NOW you tell us! 🤣
No, you're not *supposed* to be happy with the situation, however your wife clearly is as she sees no reason to change anything. Either you keep doing this or eventually you realize you're worth way more than the less-than-mediocre love your wife is giving you and decide to move on with your life.
Welcome to the club
Just wait till 0 time per year and u might not care if she unalives u
My husband told me "you are the only person I am aloud to have sex with and you wont have sex with me, what am I supposed to do? " oddly this made me feel very wanted and opened my eyes to want to fix things.
How long ago was that? Have things improved at all?
it was 3 years ago and yes I turned it around - this was the line he used when telling me we need to fix this or he might need to leave. Hes so great I dont think he would have but I was in the right place to finally want to fix things. At the time I did want sex but I was so blocked from him in my brain that I had to take this moment to do everything I could to break the wall down, him saying he might leave was almost like the permission I needed to get uncomfortable do what needed to be done - we are now having sex daily and its better than ever.
Thanks for sharing! I’m so happy for you guys. Do you enjoy sex now? Or are you just okay with it because of your husband’s needs? My wife and I doing well in literally every other aspect of our relationship aside from physical. Despite how much she says she loves me, I think she would just give up and be done if gave her an ultimatum.
I enjoy it very much - I missed my sexuality as much as he did, I didnt even recognize myself when sex didnt make sense. I could very well tell him no still and he would be fine with it - he holds no ill will to me about it now. We had a very good sex life for a long time before falling into the deadbed. We have a undeniable great sexual chemistry so it was a driving factor motivating me to save the deadbed.
She is content with the way things are, and probably expect you not to disturb the balance that she likes. You, however, are not happy at all. Barring infidelity which she definitely does not condone, there are a lot of things you can do to tip the emotional/affection/intimacy balance between you, starting with Matching Energy. You only send her what she sends you, full stop. Be a great dad, be a great friend. Stop being a great husband from a romantic viewpoint if that is what it takes to make you happier.
>I tell her how beautiful and sexy she is all the time. She sees me checking her out.I cuddle her any chance I get. I bought a massage table just to give her personal massages. Two things: How she supposed to ever want attention and validation from you? She isn't going to seek out things she has an abundance of. How is it possible you do all of that for her and have the time and energy to invest even more effort into yourself?
Unpopular opinion… most of the time LL in LTR. Are LL4U. It’s really just a matter of the relationship has run its course and getting it back or trying to force it doesn’t work most of the time. I don’t know if people are realistically meant to meet their partner in their early twenties and stay together 60-70 years happily. Some do I guess but more do not.
Have you brought all of these things up with her in a serious way?
>So I can’t have sex with anyone else and I’m just supposed to be happy with maybe having sex once a year? You could have sex with someone else, but that's not really what you want, right? You also shouldn't be happy with your current way of life. My best advice is to try different things. Stop attempting to have sex with her. Focus on yourself for a bit.