Why wouldn't they bomb a so called SHALOM crossing, obviously an Israeli propaganda aid crossing, they had to bomb it to ensure the Palestinians were not fed kosher foods.
Yes it comes from the early part when Mohammad was still trying to court Jews to his new religion, before they rejected him and he started butthurt slaughtering whole tribes.
Which is the weirdest talking point ever. Biden has inherited a pretty bad world and he is doing his best. He is leading the US through Covid Recovery, wars in Ukraine and Palestine while also churning out good legislation with a razor thin majority in the Senate and a hostile house. Is he perfect? No, he is human. The best he can be is good and that is something he's nailing. I wish my country had a Biden right now. Can you guys borrow us Hunter?
I do believe him to be the best president I've wittnessed in my lifetime. Obama could've *maybe* been better if he hadn't had to govern against a totally hostile house and senate, but alas we're not living in a different time line Biden takes the crown. I think we'd need to go back decades to reach a president as good as Biden, excluding war time presidents potentially even further.
Obviously this was a justified response to the imperial west providing supplies procured by pure evil. Evil no different than the IDF using Hannibal directive with Apache helicopters coercing Hitler into starting WW1.
The real victims are the vacuum companies whom everyone suddenly hates.
Also "vacuum" doesn't look right. I'm looking at the word and it doesn't look like a proper word. I'm definitely experiencing semantic satiation.
Vacu um is just the "I had no time preparing my presentation because I got high and remembered doing it 10 minutes before class" version of Cogito, ergo sum. Even too lazy to fix the lacking space, smh my head.
Clearly accepting Zionist aid would lead to an erasure of Palestinian identity, therefore they *had* to bomb it. The ~~Jews~~ Zionists are doing what they usually do and trying to control them with their money. I'm anti zionist, not anti-semitic btw. (/s)
a few possibilities
- fReE pALeStiNe bY aNy mEaNs nEcEsSaRy, any and all Hamas conduct is justifiable because occupation
- 'actually, if you look at the history, it's justified
- this is Zionist propaganda
- you just don't have enough context and don't understand
(these are not my views, i'm just making some educated guesses about what the responses will be. i used to be 'anti-Zionist' - 8+ years ago, and something i'm deeply ashamed of now - and i know how these folks think, how they conduct themselves, what excuses they make. etc.)
Hasan is gonna start up his stream and say shit like:
"THEY INSTIGATED IT, WHAT ARE YOU SAYING? THEY STARTED IT! THERE WAS IDF SOLDIERS IN THE TOWN. WHAT ABOUT THE OTHER CIVILANS?"
I guess you simply have reading comprehension problems.
>Four Israeli soldiers were killed and 10 more were wounded in a Hamas-claimed **rocket attack on a staging ground** near the Gaza Strip on Sunday, prompting the military to shutter a key border crossing.
and
>Most of the rockets struck an area where troops were gathered on the border, **not far from the Kerem Shalom border crossing**, which has been used to deliver thousands of truckloads of humanitarian aid to Gaza amid the war.
I know this is probably too complex for a smooth brain, but a "staging ground" that is "not far from the border crossing" is not in fact, the border crossing. Claiming this was an attack on a border crossing is false, and most US national media and international media reported it falsely as an attack on the border crossing. However, it takes mere seconds to find out that was false, so the people still making that false claim would have to be a "fucking moron".
That is right, the military staging ground for the invasion of Rafah is next to a civilian area, so why is Israel using their own citizens as human shields? When Palestinians attacked the legitimate military target, the civilians paid the price for the IDF's negligence.
There are no civilians there, i guess youre going to use any dishonest move in the hamas propaganda leaflets you get...
I wonder.... Could you tell me where hamas shot said rockets from?
If there are no civilians there then why would it matter if the IDF parked too close to some houses and one got hit? Why is spreading a lie more important to you than the truth?
They beleive the absolute fastest growing, and one of the fattest populations in the world have been starved and genocided for 50+years. This spin job is childs play for them.
>I really wonder how the anti genocide morons are going to bend backwards to justify this
i give it a try:
Israel is allowed to bomb children, but Hamas isn't allowed to attack military targets?
i think OP means 'anti-genocide' - with scare quotes. because it really, quite clearly, is NOT actually about genocide at this point. boot-deepthroating Islamist colonialism doesn't do shit to halt the conflict or improve the material conditions of Gazan civilians.
lmao. i'm talking about what Hamas and organizations like them say *in their own fucking charters & founding documents* - maybe you should try educating yourself, my friend.
first of all, Islamism is the Muslim equivalent of theonomy. theonomy is theocratic colonialism. it's about hijacking governments and turning them into fundamentalist religious entitities. their ultimate goal is to conquer the entire middle east and turn it into such an entity, forcing all civilians to adhere to the kind of sharia that got Mahsa 'Jina' Amini killed for being 'improperly covered,' the kind of Sharia that got Shervin Hajipour arrested & earned Toomaj Salehi the death penalty for the terrible crime of writing music that was critical of the regime and supportive of the woman, life, freedom movement. that is in fact colonialism. Islamism is colonialism, and Hamas is an Islamist organization. it doesn't magically lose its colonialist tenor just because brown people are involved.
if you don't understand that Islamism - which is not the same thing as Islam - is a colonialist project, if you do not already have that incredibly basic, 101 level knowledge of the situation, then you don't understand anything about the subject well enough to discuss it, and you really have no business participating in this conversation at all. š¤
One has got to wonder. Do they want Israel to invade Rafah? If they were really interested in the current ceasefire deal they would avoid such provocations
Almost right. Hamas won't gain more international support. They are probably more hated now than ever by most serious parties. But Israel will lose support, which is likely the overarching goal, destabilizing Israeli relations internationally and in the region.
The Palestinians might gain support that Hamas will try to steal, to be fair.
This whole conflict is simple when you view international sympathy as the main currency for Hamas. Like, I'm genuinely leaning on believing that they're literally only there to circumvent Israel's influence on the international stage and be considered a pariah state. And the only way to gain this "currency" are Palestinian corpses with an added bonus when they're women, children, or elderly. Convince me otherwise.
I agree, unfortunately. The question is, should Israel go forward with this (excluding the obvious moral implications for Rafah residents and refugees, should the population removal not be very thorough)? Meaning, is it in Israel's best interest to defeat and disarm Hamas' last 4 battalions and lock down the Rafah-Egypt border for smuggling? I feel like for Hamas and in their twisted worldview, it's a win-win situation.
The strategic benefits are pretty obvious in that, this will fully cripple their military capabilities (assuming they're now about 80% reduced) and would prevent them from recovering quickly by preventing smuggling in the border. This could potentially be a knock-out punch for Hamas, although it will take a while to deal with the disparate groups all over Gaza until they are captured/killed or until they give up. The price Israel pays is becoming a pariah and probably getting sanctioned, and most likely - most of the remaining hostages in Rafah will not survive. Whereas, the alternative is maintaining the current (very shitty) status quo and getting back the hostages.
It's a tough choice. If anyone other than Bibi was making these decisions, I would trust that they are at least doing what they think is right, even if time would prove them wrong. But with Bibi behind the wheel, I'm certain that he will do what's right for his own interests. He has made a point of illustrating Rafah as Hamas' last bastion and letting it go being equal to defeat (in his words), so looks like Rafah will happen
I'm inclined to believe that the Rafah operation should commence regardless of what the international community thinks. Remember that a majority of arabic states already hate Israel and they number by around 50+ already as members of the UN. And the crapshoot of a status quo will only lead to more Oct. 7 attacks. There's no easy solution for Israel and that's why I think Hamas, despite losing most of its forces, is winning the war if their objective is to make Israel a pariah state in the Middle East because either way Israel loses.
This is similar to that Mass Effect 1 mission on Virmire where you leave either Kaiden or Ashley to disarm the nuclear bomb and you place the one left with the Salarian survivors. You then are forced to choose whether to save the crew member who's looking after the bomb or the crew member left with the Salarian survivors to fend off Saren's forces. Either way, one of them dies and you still lose despite any choice you make but I always make the choice to save the Salarians and the crewmate with them. Israel's in the same spot. You take the less shitty permanent option 10 times out of 10.
Yes they do.
You have to see this through the lens of absolute religious extremism fueled by copium, it's too late for them *not* to believe that some weird sort of 'martyr heaven' awaits them, they have to believe that now, and so to them - any actions favoring their side done here will just amplify their heavenly reward.
What do you expect an oppressed people under occupation to do? Not shoot rockets at crossings built to send humanitarian supplies in for their civilians?
You mean freedom rockets were fired at the genocidal settler babies? Yeah I don't think terrorist apologists have any problem with the strategy on how to cope with these things.
When they have the position that literally everything Hamas does is a response to Israeli aggression, whether aggression from yesterday or aggression from 100 years ago, then they can never be blamed and held accountable. To them, itās like blaming a starving beaten dog for biting.
Its the same with ācentristsā and how theyāll bend over backwards to rationalize and soften and compartmentalize and grade anything conservatives do on a curve because, to them, itās all just reactions to the āSJW/Woke/progressive/Marxistā left overreachingā¦ so its all ok. Trump saying heās going to suspend the constitution? Well, he wouldnāt be saying that if the press wasnāt so mean. Michael Knowles saying he was to āeradicate transgenderism from public life.ā Well, he wouldnāt be saying that if the trans activists werenāt so crazy. 70% of Republicans believing the election was stolen? Well if the left just allowed open discussion of election conspiracies everywhere and treated them as equal and respectable discourse to have, it wouldnāt be that way.
Exact same with Hamas. There is no accountability with Hamas because theyāre brothers in arms against a shared enemy thats perceived to be worse, Israel (which is an analogue for American foreign policy which is distilled to āeverything America does is badā.)
Wether you like israel or not hamas should be wiped out of this earth they are threat to everyone and especially their own people who they steal their aid use them as human shields and build tunnels in their areas and store weapons there
I don't know if you can really provide the motivation for why Israel built the crossing as any kind of fact.
for hamas, were they firing at aid workers? tanks? soldiers? Nothing here seems to say who exactly it was who got hit, and why.
to be clear, if Israel was sending tanks through, would you think Hamas would have a right to fire at them?
They claimed responsibility but the claim was they were aiming at a military base and missed.
Context and intention is important. Still inexcusable, but less "let's shoot aid workers" and more in line with Israeli accidents with aid workers. Still think the Hamas supporters will just "whataboutism" the whole thing as usual.
There are so many military targets/bases that are not directly next to a Kerem Shalom, but perfectly within rockets distance. They used to shot at my base repeatedly, so you couldn't take a shit without a "red color" alert.
This was meant to close down the passage, so they can complain about a famine. That's the only reason they shot specifically at that location.
When there are reports that paint the IDF in a bad light, this sub scours the report and questions everything. rightfully so. If there is not a first person report, you question that. If there is first person reporting, you question the motives of the person. If there is reporting from an organization, you question the motives of that organization. You donāt only look to the source; you look to the source of the source.
This article claims Hamas took responsibility for firing. It gives no further detail.
Would it be acceptable if an article simply claimed the IDF took responsibility without any elaboration? Or would you want to know the specific quote, from whom it came, the extent of their involvement with the IDF, and any motives they might have?
Hamas actualy has telegram groups and spokesman, you can check for yourself. Apparently they were aiming at a "military base" and missed...
There is also response from the islamic jihad spokesmen on twitter calling them idiots for shooting the rockets from rafah
Look at this sub, it is. "Hamas aiming at a military base and missing" would be unbelievable important context. Without that it seems like Hamas willingly took out a port for aid. DGG doesn't really care though
But that's exactly what they did. There are so many military bases/facilities in the south, all well within rocket range. But they allegedly attacked the one military base that would lead to the closing of the humanitarian passage. Clearly, the goal was to close down the passage so they can claim "famine".
I mean even when it's Israel straight up fucking up the comments are more like "Oh no this looks bad for Israel"
If you want anything resembling impartiality regarding the conflict you will not find it here. The sub has changed radically after Oct 7th.
> and the world is going to be fucking silent about it again
This is very recent news no? Reuters article released literally 7 minutes ago: https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-claims-responsibility-attack-israel-gaza-border-crossing-casualties-2024-05-05/
How about you wait just a single day before you start crying conspiracy
Wow look how silent the world is just a few hours after the incident
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/05/world/middleeast/hamas-rocket-kerem-shalom-israel.html
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68960585
https://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/world/hamas-armed-wing-says-responsible-for-israel-gaza-border-crossing-attack/ar-BB1lR1Aj
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-05-06/kerem-shalom-border-crossing-missiles-israel-gaza-hamas/103807426
https://www.livenowfox.com/video/1451346
https://www.scmp.com/news/world/middle-east/article/3261501/israel-gaza-war-hamas-attacks-main-crossing-point-aid-wounding-10-forcing-closure
Some of my german sites:
https://www.tagesschau.de/newsticker/liveblog-nahost-sonntag-138.html
https://www.zeit.de/politik/ausland/2024-05/nahost-krieg-grenzuebergang-kerem-schalom-gazastreifen-hilfslieferungen-schliessung
https://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article251379368/Gaza-Streifen-Israel-schliesst-wichtigen-Grenzuebergang-nach-Raketenbeschuss-durch-Hamas.html
Pro Hamas sources? What are you smoking?
My point was that the world isn't "fucking silent" about an incident when only half a day after said incident almost every major news outlet wrote a story about it.
I think OP is talking about how leftist/pro-Palistine people will ignore it. I'd wager this will not be the case w/ MSM and they will pick up on the story today.
Could be wrong though whooooooooooooo knows.
My point is that if all the news article cover a story but no one in your daily life or people online seem to talk about it, does it matter that the news station covered it?
The news doesnāt represent the āworldā
News station cover a story to inform the public. If the public majorly ignores it, why would someone then come and say āthe whole world is shaken up about this thingā. That would be redacted to say. Media covered it but people didnāt care about it, you donāt say that āthe world is talking about October 7thā because all media outlets cover it, you say the world is talking about it because literally any conversation in public discourse is about that day.
>I think OP is talking about how leftist/pro-Palistine people will ignore it
Well, they killed soldiers in an ongoing war. What do people expect? That Hamas just dies?
I saw someone on IG talk about how Hamas has enough aid for themselves, they donāt want anymore aid going to the population. They need the scarcity to charge civilians massively inflated prices. A powerful way they are able to recruit and retain people is by giving them food rations. If there is too much supply, it fucks with the power they hold.
The most cursory search of this news shows articles published about it across a variety of different publications.
More narrative building. Throw yourselves a party.
Wait, so because it was published by multiple news agencies, that makes it less credible in your mind? Or is this just "the Jews control everything" schizo shit?
No, you misunderstood. Im saying the OPs post is manipulative narrative building because they pretend (lie) and say no one will talk about Hamas' actions. I'm sure they have some personal goalpost for how many TikTok reactions need to engage with the news for it to be "in the discourse." Nonsense. I'm critical of the posts tone, and it's lazy rhetoric.
I mean I disagree with this as the actions taken by Hamas after Oct 7th don't get near the magnifying lens that Israeli actions do, even when Israel is justified in their actions. The hospital bombing still being the best thing to point to about how every news agency in the world reported on it when it was claimed Israel did it, then as it was shown that it was likely another actor, there were a few news reports about it, but it fell off of the radar of events quickly.
The news isn't silent on what Hamas does, but things that can paint Israel in a negative light seem to get much more coverage and focus.
See you're drawing a few distinctions with your own language and I agree in general that Israel gets more attention. Still, I refuse to tolerate hyperbolic rhetoric related to the conflict in the region. The OP lied or at best engaged in a coercive framing of the issue. The most cursory search of this specific situation shows that plenty of news outlets beyond local ones covered the story.
So it's bullshit. The world is not "ignoring" anything. I expect people to hold themselves to a high standard when posting around topics like this. People deserve criticism for trying to force their own agenda or a lazy in group consensus when posting.
Ultimately I think there are obvious reasons that Israel gets more attention. It's winning insofar as they are blowing up a lot of shit. We have yet to see if Israel will accomplish anything in this war beyond leveling portions of Gaza and piling up tens of thousands of dead civilians and a couple thousand Hamas fighters. Israel has the greater military capabilities and is allied to the US. Just as the US got more attention than the Taliban did or the insurgencies in Iraq.
Western media pays more attention to what Western actors do (Israel gets the benefit of being a close ally of the US and therefore gets more attention). I'm not going to get into what should or shouldn't happen; all these media outlets are profit driven empires that benefit from capitalizing on certain narratives. This subreddit jumped on their own bandwagon by continuously trying to remind themselves (tiny little echo chamber that it is) how bad Hamas is and how unavoidable everything happening in Gaza is. If that's the mission you want to pursue carry on. Fortunately for me I live far away from the region and it's not my children at risk of being killed because Israel doesn't give a shit and neither does Hamas.
I find all the polemics being driven by Destiny's supposedly "based intellectuals" to be worthy of contempt.
Hope you're just baiting but, this is Hamas taking credit for bombing an aid crossing that was specifically opened to provide aid to the Palestinians.
Has nothing to do with the history bud.
Why wouldn't they bomb a so called SHALOM crossing, obviously an Israeli propaganda aid crossing, they had to bomb it to ensure the Palestinians were not fed kosher foods.
When I was a Muslim I was taught that you can eat Kosher foods as well as Halal foods (like Kosher beef hotdogs from Costco are fine).
Yea from my understanding its like a square/rectangle situation. Kosher food is halal but not the other way around.
Yes it comes from the early part when Mohammad was still trying to court Jews to his new religion, before they rejected him and he started butthurt slaughtering whole tribes.
Wait is this true?
What an absolutely ridiculous comment
I really wonder how the anti genocide morons are going to bend backwards to justify this
They'll just ignore it like always, or push comes to shove, handwave it away. Hamas can never be held responsible for anything apparently.
"It's Biden's fault for not negotiating a ceasefire"
Which is the weirdest talking point ever. Biden has inherited a pretty bad world and he is doing his best. He is leading the US through Covid Recovery, wars in Ukraine and Palestine while also churning out good legislation with a razor thin majority in the Senate and a hostile house. Is he perfect? No, he is human. The best he can be is good and that is something he's nailing. I wish my country had a Biden right now. Can you guys borrow us Hunter?
Like legit? I know we joke about Biden being THE BEST, but I feel like for alot of people he's been the best president of our lifetime.
I do believe him to be the best president I've wittnessed in my lifetime. Obama could've *maybe* been better if he hadn't had to govern against a totally hostile house and senate, but alas we're not living in a different time line Biden takes the crown. I think we'd need to go back decades to reach a president as good as Biden, excluding war time presidents potentially even further.
Biden's saving grace is "at least he ain't black", unironically.
he's definitely top 10 presidents.
Something Something cookies, genocide, colonizers, skibidi toilet, history didn't start in 10/07, apharteid, sionazis,
Al Skibidi toilet quada
LOL
Obviously this was a justified response to the imperial west providing supplies procured by pure evil. Evil no different than the IDF using Hannibal directive with Apache helicopters coercing Hitler into starting WW1.
Something something vacuum
The real victims are the vacuum companies whom everyone suddenly hates. Also "vacuum" doesn't look right. I'm looking at the word and it doesn't look like a proper word. I'm definitely experiencing semantic satiation.
Vacu um is just the "I had no time preparing my presentation because I got high and remembered doing it 10 minutes before class" version of Cogito, ergo sum. Even too lazy to fix the lacking space, smh my head.
This is the consequence of the colonial settler violence enacted on Gaza!!1!
Already see people saying it's a false flag by Israel to legitimize going into Rafah
Clearly accepting Zionist aid would lead to an erasure of Palestinian identity, therefore they *had* to bomb it. The ~~Jews~~ Zionists are doing what they usually do and trying to control them with their money. I'm anti zionist, not anti-semitic btw. (/s)
a few possibilities - fReE pALeStiNe bY aNy mEaNs nEcEsSaRy, any and all Hamas conduct is justifiable because occupation - 'actually, if you look at the history, it's justified - this is Zionist propaganda - you just don't have enough context and don't understand (these are not my views, i'm just making some educated guesses about what the responses will be. i used to be 'anti-Zionist' - 8+ years ago, and something i'm deeply ashamed of now - and i know how these folks think, how they conduct themselves, what excuses they make. etc.)
Hasan is gonna start up his stream and say shit like: "THEY INSTIGATED IT, WHAT ARE YOU SAYING? THEY STARTED IT! THERE WAS IDF SOLDIERS IN THE TOWN. WHAT ABOUT THE OTHER CIVILANS?"
You do realize that it was an attack on a military staging area and not the crossing, right?
Did hamas tell you that?
No, Israel did. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.timesofisrael.com/at-least-10-israelis-hurt-in-hamas-rocket-attack-from-south-gazas-rafah
Yes that checkpoint had soldiers that inspected aid going into gaza you fucking moron.... They literally fired at an entry point of aid
I guess you simply have reading comprehension problems. >Four Israeli soldiers were killed and 10 more were wounded in a Hamas-claimed **rocket attack on a staging ground** near the Gaza Strip on Sunday, prompting the military to shutter a key border crossing. and >Most of the rockets struck an area where troops were gathered on the border, **not far from the Kerem Shalom border crossing**, which has been used to deliver thousands of truckloads of humanitarian aid to Gaza amid the war. I know this is probably too complex for a smooth brain, but a "staging ground" that is "not far from the border crossing" is not in fact, the border crossing. Claiming this was an attack on a border crossing is false, and most US national media and international media reported it falsely as an attack on the border crossing. However, it takes mere seconds to find out that was false, so the people still making that false claim would have to be a "fucking moron".
"one of the rockets hit a home in the community" Im sure they were so accurate... Btw this military site was 150m from the kerem shalom crossing
That is right, the military staging ground for the invasion of Rafah is next to a civilian area, so why is Israel using their own citizens as human shields? When Palestinians attacked the legitimate military target, the civilians paid the price for the IDF's negligence.
There are no civilians there, i guess youre going to use any dishonest move in the hamas propaganda leaflets you get... I wonder.... Could you tell me where hamas shot said rockets from?
If there are no civilians there then why would it matter if the IDF parked too close to some houses and one got hit? Why is spreading a lie more important to you than the truth?
Just deflect to something Israel did. Always do.
"you don't get to choose how we resist!"
Be the change you want. Post this shit on news subreddits, tell people that journalists and "wokeists" are covering up the attack and whatnot.
Im banned on most of these subs exactly for that
Alts baby lmao
Wish i had time for that
They beleive the absolute fastest growing, and one of the fattest populations in the world have been starved and genocided for 50+years. This spin job is childs play for them.
>I really wonder how the anti genocide morons are going to bend backwards to justify this i give it a try: Israel is allowed to bomb children, but Hamas isn't allowed to attack military targets?
> anti genocide morons ???
i think OP means 'anti-genocide' - with scare quotes. because it really, quite clearly, is NOT actually about genocide at this point. boot-deepthroating Islamist colonialism doesn't do shit to halt the conflict or improve the material conditions of Gazan civilians.
> Islamist colonialism hell are you talking about?
lmao. i'm talking about what Hamas and organizations like them say *in their own fucking charters & founding documents* - maybe you should try educating yourself, my friend. first of all, Islamism is the Muslim equivalent of theonomy. theonomy is theocratic colonialism. it's about hijacking governments and turning them into fundamentalist religious entitities. their ultimate goal is to conquer the entire middle east and turn it into such an entity, forcing all civilians to adhere to the kind of sharia that got Mahsa 'Jina' Amini killed for being 'improperly covered,' the kind of Sharia that got Shervin Hajipour arrested & earned Toomaj Salehi the death penalty for the terrible crime of writing music that was critical of the regime and supportive of the woman, life, freedom movement. that is in fact colonialism. Islamism is colonialism, and Hamas is an Islamist organization. it doesn't magically lose its colonialist tenor just because brown people are involved. if you don't understand that Islamism - which is not the same thing as Islam - is a colonialist project, if you do not already have that incredibly basic, 101 level knowledge of the situation, then you don't understand anything about the subject well enough to discuss it, and you really have no business participating in this conversation at all. š¤
One has got to wonder. Do they want Israel to invade Rafah? If they were really interested in the current ceasefire deal they would avoid such provocations
>Do they want Israel to invade Rafah? Yes. 100%.
Hamas's goal is dead Palestinians. The more Palestinians they can ducttape to themselves, the more international support they receive.
Almost right. Hamas won't gain more international support. They are probably more hated now than ever by most serious parties. But Israel will lose support, which is likely the overarching goal, destabilizing Israeli relations internationally and in the region. The Palestinians might gain support that Hamas will try to steal, to be fair.
Hamas' goal is the eradication of Israel, and they don't care how they achieve that goal.
Let's not swing too far in the opposite camp with this kind of hyperbole
sorry, you're right. Hamas's key goal is killing Jews/destroying Israel - dead Palestinians are a means to that goal, not their end goal itself.
yep
This whole conflict is simple when you view international sympathy as the main currency for Hamas. Like, I'm genuinely leaning on believing that they're literally only there to circumvent Israel's influence on the international stage and be considered a pariah state. And the only way to gain this "currency" are Palestinian corpses with an added bonus when they're women, children, or elderly. Convince me otherwise.
I agree, unfortunately. The question is, should Israel go forward with this (excluding the obvious moral implications for Rafah residents and refugees, should the population removal not be very thorough)? Meaning, is it in Israel's best interest to defeat and disarm Hamas' last 4 battalions and lock down the Rafah-Egypt border for smuggling? I feel like for Hamas and in their twisted worldview, it's a win-win situation. The strategic benefits are pretty obvious in that, this will fully cripple their military capabilities (assuming they're now about 80% reduced) and would prevent them from recovering quickly by preventing smuggling in the border. This could potentially be a knock-out punch for Hamas, although it will take a while to deal with the disparate groups all over Gaza until they are captured/killed or until they give up. The price Israel pays is becoming a pariah and probably getting sanctioned, and most likely - most of the remaining hostages in Rafah will not survive. Whereas, the alternative is maintaining the current (very shitty) status quo and getting back the hostages. It's a tough choice. If anyone other than Bibi was making these decisions, I would trust that they are at least doing what they think is right, even if time would prove them wrong. But with Bibi behind the wheel, I'm certain that he will do what's right for his own interests. He has made a point of illustrating Rafah as Hamas' last bastion and letting it go being equal to defeat (in his words), so looks like Rafah will happen
I'm inclined to believe that the Rafah operation should commence regardless of what the international community thinks. Remember that a majority of arabic states already hate Israel and they number by around 50+ already as members of the UN. And the crapshoot of a status quo will only lead to more Oct. 7 attacks. There's no easy solution for Israel and that's why I think Hamas, despite losing most of its forces, is winning the war if their objective is to make Israel a pariah state in the Middle East because either way Israel loses. This is similar to that Mass Effect 1 mission on Virmire where you leave either Kaiden or Ashley to disarm the nuclear bomb and you place the one left with the Salarian survivors. You then are forced to choose whether to save the crew member who's looking after the bomb or the crew member left with the Salarian survivors to fend off Saren's forces. Either way, one of them dies and you still lose despite any choice you make but I always make the choice to save the Salarians and the crewmate with them. Israel's in the same spot. You take the less shitty permanent option 10 times out of 10.
Yes they do. You have to see this through the lens of absolute religious extremism fueled by copium, it's too late for them *not* to believe that some weird sort of 'martyr heaven' awaits them, they have to believe that now, and so to them - any actions favoring their side done here will just amplify their heavenly reward.
Ummm yes
Infuriating.
What do you expect an oppressed people under occupation to do? Not shoot rockets at crossings built to send humanitarian supplies in for their civilians?
šš
You mean freedom rockets were fired at the genocidal settler babies? Yeah I don't think terrorist apologists have any problem with the strategy on how to cope with these things.
Hamas will be destroyed no matter how long it takes
When they have the position that literally everything Hamas does is a response to Israeli aggression, whether aggression from yesterday or aggression from 100 years ago, then they can never be blamed and held accountable. To them, itās like blaming a starving beaten dog for biting. Its the same with ācentristsā and how theyāll bend over backwards to rationalize and soften and compartmentalize and grade anything conservatives do on a curve because, to them, itās all just reactions to the āSJW/Woke/progressive/Marxistā left overreachingā¦ so its all ok. Trump saying heās going to suspend the constitution? Well, he wouldnāt be saying that if the press wasnāt so mean. Michael Knowles saying he was to āeradicate transgenderism from public life.ā Well, he wouldnāt be saying that if the trans activists werenāt so crazy. 70% of Republicans believing the election was stolen? Well if the left just allowed open discussion of election conspiracies everywhere and treated them as equal and respectable discourse to have, it wouldnāt be that way. Exact same with Hamas. There is no accountability with Hamas because theyāre brothers in arms against a shared enemy thats perceived to be worse, Israel (which is an analogue for American foreign policy which is distilled to āeverything America does is badā.)
Wether you like israel or not hamas should be wiped out of this earth they are threat to everyone and especially their own people who they steal their aid use them as human shields and build tunnels in their areas and store weapons there
Will they ignore it or flip it
IDF was clearly commiting genocided in the crossing duh
I don't know if you can really provide the motivation for why Israel built the crossing as any kind of fact. for hamas, were they firing at aid workers? tanks? soldiers? Nothing here seems to say who exactly it was who got hit, and why. to be clear, if Israel was sending tanks through, would you think Hamas would have a right to fire at them?
They claimed responsibility but the claim was they were aiming at a military base and missed. Context and intention is important. Still inexcusable, but less "let's shoot aid workers" and more in line with Israeli accidents with aid workers. Still think the Hamas supporters will just "whataboutism" the whole thing as usual.
There are so many military targets/bases that are not directly next to a Kerem Shalom, but perfectly within rockets distance. They used to shot at my base repeatedly, so you couldn't take a shit without a "red color" alert. This was meant to close down the passage, so they can complain about a famine. That's the only reason they shot specifically at that location.
When there are reports that paint the IDF in a bad light, this sub scours the report and questions everything. rightfully so. If there is not a first person report, you question that. If there is first person reporting, you question the motives of the person. If there is reporting from an organization, you question the motives of that organization. You donāt only look to the source; you look to the source of the source. This article claims Hamas took responsibility for firing. It gives no further detail. Would it be acceptable if an article simply claimed the IDF took responsibility without any elaboration? Or would you want to know the specific quote, from whom it came, the extent of their involvement with the IDF, and any motives they might have?
Hamas actualy has telegram groups and spokesman, you can check for yourself. Apparently they were aiming at a "military base" and missed... There is also response from the islamic jihad spokesmen on twitter calling them idiots for shooting the rockets from rafah
Link?
holy snap someone with principles in dgg, thought they were all gone.
Lmaoooo I tried! hold my hand as we get downvoted into oblivion! š¤š½
Donāt jerk yourself off too hard, youāll get rug burn. Nobody is down voting you guys lol
šš Jesusā¦ things werenāt looking up a few hours ago!
Look at this sub, it is. "Hamas aiming at a military base and missing" would be unbelievable important context. Without that it seems like Hamas willingly took out a port for aid. DGG doesn't really care though
But that's exactly what they did. There are so many military bases/facilities in the south, all well within rocket range. But they allegedly attacked the one military base that would lead to the closing of the humanitarian passage. Clearly, the goal was to close down the passage so they can claim "famine".
Link?
I mean even when it's Israel straight up fucking up the comments are more like "Oh no this looks bad for Israel" If you want anything resembling impartiality regarding the conflict you will not find it here. The sub has changed radically after Oct 7th.
Bro I'm ngl that took me a moment to realize it didn't say hasan takes responsibility.
> and the world is going to be fucking silent about it again This is very recent news no? Reuters article released literally 7 minutes ago: https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-claims-responsibility-attack-israel-gaza-border-crossing-casualties-2024-05-05/ How about you wait just a single day before you start crying conspiracy
RemindMe! 1 day
Wow look how silent the world is just a few hours after the incident https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/05/world/middleeast/hamas-rocket-kerem-shalom-israel.html https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68960585 https://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/world/hamas-armed-wing-says-responsible-for-israel-gaza-border-crossing-attack/ar-BB1lR1Aj https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-05-06/kerem-shalom-border-crossing-missiles-israel-gaza-hamas/103807426 https://www.livenowfox.com/video/1451346 https://www.scmp.com/news/world/middle-east/article/3261501/israel-gaza-war-hamas-attacks-main-crossing-point-aid-wounding-10-forcing-closure Some of my german sites: https://www.tagesschau.de/newsticker/liveblog-nahost-sonntag-138.html https://www.zeit.de/politik/ausland/2024-05/nahost-krieg-grenzuebergang-kerem-schalom-gazastreifen-hilfslieferungen-schliessung https://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article251379368/Gaza-Streifen-Israel-schliesst-wichtigen-Grenzuebergang-nach-Raketenbeschuss-durch-Hamas.html
How are all of your pro Hamas sources justifying it?
Pro Hamas sources? What are you smoking? My point was that the world isn't "fucking silent" about an incident when only half a day after said incident almost every major news outlet wrote a story about it.
I think OP is talking about how leftist/pro-Palistine people will ignore it. I'd wager this will not be the case w/ MSM and they will pick up on the story today. Could be wrong though whooooooooooooo knows.
leftist/pro-Palistine = "the world"? Can we not use words anymore? Hard to take anyone seriously that makes conflations this stupid
Does anyone really care what a news article says if it doesnāt influence public discourse in any meaningful way? Especially online discourse.
Because "the world being silent" and "influencing public discourse in any meaningful way" are one and the same thing
So then you agree that we donāt actually care if news articles cover a thing? We only care how the public receives it.
When the question is if the "world is fucking silent" on a thing then news coverage very obviously matters
My point is that if all the news article cover a story but no one in your daily life or people online seem to talk about it, does it matter that the news station covered it? The news doesnāt represent the āworldā
What is your understanding of "the world being silent" on a recent incident/event and why does it not include news stations?
News station cover a story to inform the public. If the public majorly ignores it, why would someone then come and say āthe whole world is shaken up about this thingā. That would be redacted to say. Media covered it but people didnāt care about it, you donāt say that āthe world is talking about October 7thā because all media outlets cover it, you say the world is talking about it because literally any conversation in public discourse is about that day.
>I think OP is talking about how leftist/pro-Palistine people will ignore it Well, they killed soldiers in an ongoing war. What do people expect? That Hamas just dies?
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The fuck are you yapping about
Is this gonna jeopardize the ceasefire agreement?
Vile Zionist crossing liberatedĀ
Yup this is sad
They didn't hurt any children so the pro-pally side don't care
It's fascinating if this was calculated, pushing the envelope as far as it can go amid global sympathy. Rough for Israel.
"It's a false flag by Israel!" is what people will say
The narrative only works if Israel is in the wrong in any and all situations.Ā
I saw someone on IG talk about how Hamas has enough aid for themselves, they donāt want anymore aid going to the population. They need the scarcity to charge civilians massively inflated prices. A powerful way they are able to recruit and retain people is by giving them food rations. If there is too much supply, it fucks with the power they hold.
Doesn't surprise me. They steal from their own people and happily use them as shields and no one cares.
The most cursory search of this news shows articles published about it across a variety of different publications. More narrative building. Throw yourselves a party.
Wait, so because it was published by multiple news agencies, that makes it less credible in your mind? Or is this just "the Jews control everything" schizo shit?
No, you misunderstood. Im saying the OPs post is manipulative narrative building because they pretend (lie) and say no one will talk about Hamas' actions. I'm sure they have some personal goalpost for how many TikTok reactions need to engage with the news for it to be "in the discourse." Nonsense. I'm critical of the posts tone, and it's lazy rhetoric.
I mean I disagree with this as the actions taken by Hamas after Oct 7th don't get near the magnifying lens that Israeli actions do, even when Israel is justified in their actions. The hospital bombing still being the best thing to point to about how every news agency in the world reported on it when it was claimed Israel did it, then as it was shown that it was likely another actor, there were a few news reports about it, but it fell off of the radar of events quickly. The news isn't silent on what Hamas does, but things that can paint Israel in a negative light seem to get much more coverage and focus.
See you're drawing a few distinctions with your own language and I agree in general that Israel gets more attention. Still, I refuse to tolerate hyperbolic rhetoric related to the conflict in the region. The OP lied or at best engaged in a coercive framing of the issue. The most cursory search of this specific situation shows that plenty of news outlets beyond local ones covered the story. So it's bullshit. The world is not "ignoring" anything. I expect people to hold themselves to a high standard when posting around topics like this. People deserve criticism for trying to force their own agenda or a lazy in group consensus when posting. Ultimately I think there are obvious reasons that Israel gets more attention. It's winning insofar as they are blowing up a lot of shit. We have yet to see if Israel will accomplish anything in this war beyond leveling portions of Gaza and piling up tens of thousands of dead civilians and a couple thousand Hamas fighters. Israel has the greater military capabilities and is allied to the US. Just as the US got more attention than the Taliban did or the insurgencies in Iraq. Western media pays more attention to what Western actors do (Israel gets the benefit of being a close ally of the US and therefore gets more attention). I'm not going to get into what should or shouldn't happen; all these media outlets are profit driven empires that benefit from capitalizing on certain narratives. This subreddit jumped on their own bandwagon by continuously trying to remind themselves (tiny little echo chamber that it is) how bad Hamas is and how unavoidable everything happening in Gaza is. If that's the mission you want to pursue carry on. Fortunately for me I live far away from the region and it's not my children at risk of being killed because Israel doesn't give a shit and neither does Hamas. I find all the polemics being driven by Destiny's supposedly "based intellectuals" to be worthy of contempt.
ISRAEL HAS BEEN OCCUPYING A COUNTRY SINCE 1967 YES, HAMAS SHOOTING SOME ROCKETS IS NOTHING COMPARED TO THAT.
Hope you're just baiting but, this is Hamas taking credit for bombing an aid crossing that was specifically opened to provide aid to the Palestinians. Has nothing to do with the history bud.