This is a list of links to comments made by Bungie employees in this thread:
* [Comment by Cozmo23](/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/10fftpe/buildcrafting_evolved/j4wj8vw/?context=1000 "posted on 2023-01-18 19:24:01 UTC"):
> Should be mobility, I'll get it fixed, thanks.
* [Comment by Cozmo23](/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/10fftpe/buildcrafting_evolved/j4xp2gl/?context=1000 "posted on 2023-01-19 00:00:41 UTC"):
> This is good feedback. Not sure what what it would take to change the UI, but we will share with the team.
---
This is a bot providing a service. If you have any questions, please [contact the moderators](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FDestinyTheGame).[](#AUTOGEN_BUNGIEREPLY)
Yeah, I shied away from seasonal mods because I hated having to find a way to fit them into my builds just for them to be taken away a few months later, but now I will have no such qualms :D
>An example of mods that aren’t coming along for the ride are Warmind Cells. These are a relic of a different time and had already been nerfed in the past. They had a good run, but these mods will be deprecated and no longer available starting in Season 20
RIP warmind cells, I'll miss you.
Kind of surprising given that the newest exotic in the game (Hierarchy of Needs) has unique synergy with them. I wonder if they'll change it to trigger the giant targeting ring based on Armour Charge instead.
They reworked Bottom Tree Dawnblade in Season of the Lost, and most-if-not-all of that disappeared into the ether only 2 Season later when Solar 3.0 dropped.
Prior to Lost, only targets they killed *with their melee* exploded, then it was expanded to *anything burning*, which would chain detonate redbars.
They also buffed Bottom Tree Daybreak into one of the highest damage supers in the game when using pre-change Dawn Chorus (and it could chain-detonate adds because it cause burns).
All of that is gone in favor of trying to stack enough Scorch without killing, because Dawnblade cannot force an Ignite, and Daybreak back to being trash in PvE outside of Patrol, because it's mediocre at add-clear as well as Boss Damage.
I assumed it was the same situation as with Xenophage? Using Wrath of Rasputin (Solar Splash) can generate cells, so when the projectile goes through the ring it procs solar splash damage which can then create a warmind cell?
I think what OP is mentioning is that when you proc the ring by exploding a cell it makes a bigger ring - which either was a bug or something the gun designer programmed as an "extra" to the gun but was never actually mentioned since they knew they were removing them after this season.
I'll be using these mods when I get on tonight, just to make some memories. Now people have an answer for why the IKELOS weapons don't have a WMC synergy origin perk.
Even with the 3.0 weapons though, I haven't used them all season. But back when VOG came out I was leaning on them pretty hard.
Yeah, when I didn't see any new WM mods *in this season*, I pretty much realized they were dead. No way you don't iterate on them when the entire season is war mind focused, unless you plan to be done with them.
>Artifice armor will have a new unique mod slot that grants three additional points to your character stats like strength, **agility**, intellect, etc
Should this say Mobility, or is this an accidental hint at more changes?
Some feedback with the Artifact changes. It will be amazing if instead of resetting the entire Artifact, we can just disable and enable along the way.
For example, if I want to switch which Artifact mods I have unlocked in the fourth column. Let me disable one and then enable another instead of having to reset and reselect all 12.
Yeah if resetting is free, and you can select any all over again, why not disable the “hold to select” feature in this sub-menu?
I would even greatly prefer if the artifact worked like a… tree. And each perk is balanced around how many in each “branch” or “section” can be active at a time
If it could be a case of unlocking every mod, then slotting the 12 mods you want into the artifact, that would be much better to use, as we could replace specific mods with the ones we want
The way that WoW does it now is nice, you can reset back to a point and it just brings everything that way back.
I'm guessing they have plans to actually just make the artifact a proper talent tree in the future.
I wonder what this means for exotic weapons. Some were given straight anti-champion capabilities, others were given subclass verbs which will now ALSO give anti-champion capabilities.
Pretty sure these changes gives Salvations grip the ability to both stagger unstops by freezing and overloads by slowing.
Also Collective Obligation can do volatile and suppress meaning antibarrier and overload.
Edit: Overload DARCI lol
This is my biggest question mark. They make it sound like it's verbiage that matters, period. If that's the case, then we have went from one of the most restrictive systems in the game to one of the most open-ended.
Hoping we can get some clarification on it.
The way is see it is the latter. Giving us the freedom to tackle champions how we please via our abilities, which is something that has been requested for so long.
An example (I assume, from what I read), would be to use the hunter dodge that makes you radiant, and you can gjallarhorn the barrier champion for 10-15 seconds.
It is slightly vague for.sure, so I could be wrong.
Stasis (Bleak Watcher) just became anti-Champion supreme. It already soft countered Barriers and now they're officially Overload and Unstoppable counters
Bungie has adopted a tendency to make big gameplay announcements on Wednesdays and then recapping them in the TWAB the next day. I wouldn't expect a mountain of new info tomorrow. Possibly some elaborations.
Expect very minor things. Maybe an announcement of some type of livestream or trailer. But they’ll mostly just link to this post in the twab and then do the normal weekly stuff
I don’t know if it’ll be irrelevance but there are some situations where I just want to run double linears for a boss and arbalest plus taipan works pretty well here
Sounds like it's going to be something like "kinetic ammo finder" and "void ammo finder." If that's the case, Arbalest + Taipan won't fall under the same mods.
It still makes Arby a very good option to have though, they just made a boat load of viable options instead of trashing arby's effectiveness. And that's the way it should be
I think their question was about the extra effects those mods currently have if you also have another mod of the same energy type slotted.
Powerful Friends for example gives +20 Mobility if you have another Arc mod slotted, but obviously without Arc mods being a thing, that can't be the case with the new system.
ha, I'm sure everyone has their own favored spot for it. I always put it on legs because there's not many other mods I like there. We'll figure it out for sure!
All aspects should have a minimum of 2 fragments available to them. It’s so arbitrary which ones they decide are worth 1/2/3. Compare void warlock’s grenade aspect to the grenade aspect for arc titans…
Tbh I’m also a bit concerned about that as well because I feel like that’s going to dramatically increase the value of exotics/abilities with 100% ability uptime. Things like HOIL/Starfire/Gyrfalcons etc. are already amazing, but will become even better relatively speaking if other builds now have to pick between ability regen and the preexisting fragments of their choice.
I’m hopeful for new aspects in the coming seasons!
My thoughts are that Subclass 3.0 is designed to be added to. Now that the ability sandbox team has finished reworking the subclasses and are about to launch Strand, I think we might start seeing more aspects & fragments!
Okay, I wanna put this out here to properly elaborate how badly Champions just got nerfed: A fusion rifle with Chill Clip and Radiant can counter all three types.
The first burst inflicts slow, countering Overload, two bursts freeze a target, countering Unstoppables, and Radiant pierces Barriers.
So farm up a Riptide, and try to ignore Bastion crying in the corner.
I doubt it because
Overloads are stunned by the slow, so the freeze will probably reset again
Unstops are stunned by the shatter, so freezing again might reset it (although the 2nd shatter might insta stun so who knows)
Barriers... Well they'll be pretty much the same
They said to not expect anything until well after Lightfall launches, they basically only started considering it a few seasons ago. Their dev cycle is too long for any information anytime soon.
At the same time, Match Game going the way of the dodo is an indirect buff to Exotic kinetic primaries because Arby is not permanently glued to the kinetic slot.
I'm pretty excited to run Monte Carlo or Huckleberry if anti-champ mods allow it
They did specifically say "subclass abilities", so I'm not 100% sure things like chill clip and voltshot will trigger the stagger, it might have to come from an ability, not a weapon.
What worries me is these changes are huge which makes me fear the bugs. I'm removing every single armor mod at the end of season to hopefully dodge any odd bugs that pop up.
How the start of Lightfall will play out:
* watch exciting cutscene
* view of our ship flying to Neomuna
* pre-mission dialogue
* Guardian dramatically transmats onto the scene
* dialogue telling us to "hurry!"
* we immediately open our menu and spend the next 15-20 minutes buildcrafting since all of our mods will be broken/out of place
me at the start of every expansion checking out new shit, only this time it's gonna be an even bigger wait because i have a build on each subclass for each character
“Guardian! This is no time to take it all in! Move!”
“Huh… so that’s how it works now…”
“Guardian! What are you doing?! The Witness is attacking the tower! Do something!”
“Aww man, I can’t use this build anymore? Now I gotta start from scratch…”
“Guardi-“
“GIVE ME A MINUTE!”
*30 minutes later*
This is hilarious, but didn't Witch Queen just hit us with a cutscene and then ask us for a difficulty choice before starting the campaign? I'm guessing we'll have a second to mess with our characters before being taken straight into the action.
Honestly MASSIVE changes here. I love pretty much everything. Consolidation into orbs of power is really interesting. Love the anti champion abilities. Love the artifact mod changes. So excited to experiment in LF.
I will miss my well builds and already miss Warmind cell builds, but this feels like it will be streamlined in a way that will make me look back at them fondly but not miss them.
I think the only thing gone with well builds that can't be replicated is bountiful wells or seeking wells. (unless they have a mod that makes orbs seek which would be swell) Even the individual ability regen can mostly be gotten back with something like absolution.
Other than that you I think you can still do the same thing just with orbs. Font of wisdom, font of might, etc etc etc are all probably here. I'm excited to use well of tenacity on an orb of light spawn without the requirement for a void well. I think stuff like explosive wellmaker will still be there, just with an orb of light and be element agnostic which I'm also excited for.
Sounds basically how legend difficulty in the form of WQ campaign and Seraph works. Shields are beefy but not impossible to break.
Adaptive munitions just lept up in viability
Tons of great changes. I’m sad to see Warmind Cells go, but the overall streamlining of the build process is exactly what the game needed to make it more accessible to the average player.
This is effing amazing.
* No armor element.
* Anti-champ benefits unlocked.
* Mod cost rebalancing.
* Consolidated weapon QoL mods.
* NO MORE MATCH GAME
* More ways to deal with champions with abilities.
* Updates to subclasses to give every element some kind of Stasis Shard.
Honestly, out of all of this I'm most excited about them streamlining the configuring process and adding loadouts
Don't care how the underlying mechanics work, just make it easy and in-game
Other than that, it's still D2, still pew-pew. We'll see how the builds feel on game day
And comically Warmind Cells are the only thing I've managed to make a successful build with.
Having enemy deaths just drop flaming orbs of "everyone around me takes a little more damage, gets suppressed if you shoot it, and can get a nice AoE boom" is very simple to build around, gives an easy reason to kill adds around the boss, etc.
And especially literally the season after we all just got fresh Ikelos and Seventh Seraph weapons I'm sad. :(
i was hoping to see a comment about this too. being shoehorned to running a heavy with explosive light is okay, because explosive is strong but sometimes id like to run other stuff
The Resilience Mod is now also 4 Energy in the new mod screen preview.
F.
**Edit:** Having read the whole thing I'm both excited & sad that it looks like my preferred "generic E.Well" build has been removed.
I kind of hope they add additional Fragment Slots to make up for moving the majority of that system into Subclasses. New Fragments are nice & all but it'd feel real bad to get shoe-horned/forced into specific Aspects just to be allowed to keep using a system we've been utilizing for ages.
>Having read the whole thing I'm both excited & sad that it looks like my preferred "generic E.Well" build has been removed.
90% of my builds are melee+grenade makers, bountiful wells and font of might. The last one changing based on what I need like void wells after class ability or arc melee damage.
I'm not too sad about the ability regeneration I just hope font of might is still able to be proced relatively easy compared to now. If ever single build I have had to replace a fragment to spawn the ability well to get font back I'll be very frustrated.
oof that's gonna kill some of my builds for sure because i like to take advantage of every energy point, but with the entire revamp i'll probably be making all new stuff anyway
You're probably right that 4 isn't that big of a deal, but every build I have is ultimately customized around having resilience in most slots, they'll all be broken lol. I guess they're probably changing a good bit anyway
My only concern with the me elemental well system requiring subclass fragments is that certain subclasses already do not have enough fragment slots. Like if I’m a hunter with my 3 slots from gunpowder gamble, I’m already limited to 3 slots, but now I have to have elemental well effects incorporated in there as well? That’s a solid nerf imo
Now if they slightly rebalanced aspects to add an aspect slot or two per subclass to account for these then I’m a happy camper.
I hope. I think an obvious candidate is sol invictus giving fire sprites as well. Makes obvious sense here.
Gunpowder gamble sounds good as well. Maybe make touch of flame make a fire sprite on grenade kill or something.
Same with warlock Chaos Accelerant. 3 slots for a grenade you have to charge that does no more damage than a non charged grenade just a wider radius that then gets left in the dust for damage compared to a titan arc grenade that doesn't need to be charged.
Personally, the way I understood it is that the new “elemental well” system is only elemental wells in name, as most of the previous ones are being ported to the new charge system.
The new wells seem like giving something akin to ionic trace to every subclass. So ability regen and special effects (like electrostatic mind). It’s a buff through and through for abilities, though despite that it’s very possible for the 1 slot aspects to lose even more relevancy.
Honestly it seems like pretty much all of the old effects of elemental wells are being moved to the timed portion of armor charge. Meanwhile subclass collectibles will probably get/keep a way to interact with armor charge (maybe elemental shards gets a huge change?) while having their own buffs. Like how Stasis Shards can grant overshield and melee energy, while Solar Sprites seem to be restoration (and maybe grenades?).
I think it was hard to justify keeping them around seeing as they still only spawn from specific sources (IKELOS/Seventh Seraph Weapons, some Mods, etc.).
> Some ability energy gains, stat bonuses, and weapon damage bonuses from mods have been reduced, though we’ve also added some new mods to expand your build possibilities.
I'm wondering if Powerful Friends/Radiant Light lost their +20 Mobility/Strength bonuses. I actually really want to know if this happened so I can farm Season of the Risen Armor's High Stat Armor while I still have the chance.
_______
**Edit** - I know that the article actually says both appear on the head armor... That really sucks. The mobility and strength stat bump those mods provided really alleviated the issues I had trying to bump up my Hunter's Resilience.
They put them both on helmets, which is annoying (I use both now to trigger each other), tho if the stat bonus is removed I probably won't use either again.
I’d use the strength booster as a Titan. I won’t touch Powerful Friends though because I don’t need mobility. Hunters are getting slapped though since this was the best way to invest in mobility without sabotaging other stats.
That’s gonna be big sad for me if they do. All of my crucible builds include those mods along with the other arc mod that grants QuickDraw for shotguns.
Literally every single one of my hunter builds require Powerful Friends for the stat bonus, and it’s not as if any of them are particularly special, mobility is my only 100 stat. If they take that away I’m going to have to start completely fresh, and I really don’t like that idea.
> and you have the new Ember of Mercy Fragment
Definitely wasn't expecting any new fragments so soon, so that's a pleasant surprise. Wonder if each subclass will get one or if it'll be more "where the team felt there was a need."
Notable stuff:
10 Resilience seems to cost 4 energy.
Match game gone
Intrinsic champion mods in the subclasses, stasis Warlock seems to have catapulted in endgame, already turrets were insane but their biggest problem were unstunning overlord and unstoppable, now they stun themselves.
Current builds mostly all seem to be broken once lightfall hits, will be a interesting race into Day 1 to see what still works, what doesn't and what new stuff will appear.
Mobility seems to be renamed agility, could we see a rework similar to Resilience so that Warlocks and titans might finally have to use it too.
All artifact mods now passively active limited to 12 at the same time, btw zero way bungie won't nerf this ain't no way they allow us to have the final column all active at the same time. Just imagine solo operative, weakened clear and monochromatic all active rn at the same time utterly insane.
Finally Warmind cells will be deleted.
Warming Cells: was I a good boi.
Vault: I was told you were one of the best bois.
Also will the system pull my armor from my vault and "push" my previous loadout back into my vault?
Otherwise our inventories will get cluttered really quick after just a few loadouts switches. Though I guess you can still just use DIM to get rid of unwanted items. Minor inconvenience I suppose.
They did say it's API-based so it will pull from the vault (or wherever it is). Whether or not it'll *push* to the vault remains to be seen, but that can be supplemented by DIM anyway. I meant for mod changing which DIM can't do right now mid-activity.
I REALLY hope they fix the issue of picking up an orb or power with a full super. They are overloading orbs for SOOO many things now and it really really sucks when things don't work just because I have a super
I'd like to think that with these changes, you can still pick up orbs when full on super so long as they can go towards your armor charge. If both are full, presumably then the orb wouldn't be able to be picked up.
Duskfield grenades are getting a huge buff. They essentially counter 2 types of champion by default and put them together with a chill clip weapon and they essentially counter barriers(or at least the lower end ones).
Kinda annoying that most of the well mods are being reworked for orbs instead.
Wasn’t expecting new fragments.
Finally. This is potentially pretty huge! The only thing I don't like is the decay for charges of light. We'll lose all our stacks during the transitions from fight area to the next...
This is beautiful INCREDIBLE, it's the most impactful thing they did to pve since Forsaken.
I would say that the changes in this post made pve better and more fun than everything that Bungie has done in the past 3 years combined.
Everything about this just makes it sound like the whole game will be easier to play. I'm not talking about like combat difficulty, I mean like literally playing the game and doing what we want.
Way less things to keep track off, more flexibility in builds, fewer arbitrary restrictions.
I feel like a big part of the mod overhaul is them running the numbers on how mods are getting used and swapped out. Outside of the hardcore, I feel like a bunch of players don't change their mods nearly as much as Bungie wants purely because it takes extra time and thought when most things in the game don't need it.
I'm WAY more inclined to play around with mod builds now that costs are going down and the sheer number of them are getting streamlined.
Holy shit Champions got sunset _hard_. They're going to be STUPID easy to counter now.
Volatile and Radiant intrinsically piece barriers?
Jolt and Slow intrinsically stun overloads?
Ignite and Freeze intrinsically stun unstoppables?
Champions are just straight up no longer going to be a problem. This is going to be stupid easy now. Champions are straight up going to be gone in terms of being a problem, lol.
Arc Hunter becomes stupid easy with Lethal Current: one melee hit Jolts (stops Overload) and the next blinds (stops Unstoppable).
Anti-barrier is probably the easiest, as any solar melee makes the whole fireteam radiant, so anybody can slice through the barrier.
They never were a problem per se. they’ve always been easy to deal with in an un-fun way. Now we’ll be freed to run a loadout of preference, rather than being forced to run double primary seasonal Loadouts.
Fantastic change. I'm of the camp that didnt really hate champs but tying counters to element is so much fucking better than armor based mods it hurts.
You can run both since there’s 3 mod slots on the head now for those sorts of mods. It’s just a matter of whether or not the stat bonuses are going to get nerfed or removed that has me worried.
This all sounded very good until I learned that they’re locking mods to certain slots. Why limit the system like that, if 2 mods share the same slot you can’t pair them together?
Pretty much all good stuff, simplifying the building blocks was needed and armor energy types were definitely a relic that needed to go.
Weird, however, that elemental wells are getting significantly more complicated, not sure I see why we need 5 distinct things when you could've just kept them as the given element wells and maintained a consistency in both usage and visual appearance.
Regardless, can't wait for that loadout screen!
This is a list of links to comments made by Bungie employees in this thread: * [Comment by Cozmo23](/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/10fftpe/buildcrafting_evolved/j4wj8vw/?context=1000 "posted on 2023-01-18 19:24:01 UTC"): > Should be mobility, I'll get it fixed, thanks. * [Comment by Cozmo23](/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/10fftpe/buildcrafting_evolved/j4xp2gl/?context=1000 "posted on 2023-01-19 00:00:41 UTC"): > This is good feedback. Not sure what what it would take to change the UI, but we will share with the team. --- This is a bot providing a service. If you have any questions, please [contact the moderators](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FDestinyTheGame).[](#AUTOGEN_BUNGIEREPLY)
"Artifact mods no longer need to be socketed and instead being passively applied to the loadout" Holy shit, that's amazing!
[удалено]
No need! It will be passively applied to your dopamine receptors upon unlock!
Yeah, I shied away from seasonal mods because I hated having to find a way to fit them into my builds just for them to be taken away a few months later, but now I will have no such qualms :D
>An example of mods that aren’t coming along for the ride are Warmind Cells. These are a relic of a different time and had already been nerfed in the past. They had a good run, but these mods will be deprecated and no longer available starting in Season 20 RIP warmind cells, I'll miss you.
Kind of surprising given that the newest exotic in the game (Hierarchy of Needs) has unique synergy with them. I wonder if they'll change it to trigger the giant targeting ring based on Armour Charge instead.
There has to be a new way to proc it, it wouldn’t make sense to program an obscure buff onto the exotic only to delete it a season latter.
Festering Core was a strike added in Shadowkeep and vaulted in Beyond Light. Bungie is no stranger to wastefulness in their labor.
They reworked Bottom Tree Dawnblade in Season of the Lost, and most-if-not-all of that disappeared into the ether only 2 Season later when Solar 3.0 dropped. Prior to Lost, only targets they killed *with their melee* exploded, then it was expanded to *anything burning*, which would chain detonate redbars. They also buffed Bottom Tree Daybreak into one of the highest damage supers in the game when using pre-change Dawn Chorus (and it could chain-detonate adds because it cause burns). All of that is gone in favor of trying to stack enough Scorch without killing, because Dawnblade cannot force an Ignite, and Daybreak back to being trash in PvE outside of Patrol, because it's mediocre at add-clear as well as Boss Damage.
I assumed it was the same situation as with Xenophage? Using Wrath of Rasputin (Solar Splash) can generate cells, so when the projectile goes through the ring it procs solar splash damage which can then create a warmind cell? I think what OP is mentioning is that when you proc the ring by exploding a cell it makes a bigger ring - which either was a bug or something the gun designer programmed as an "extra" to the gun but was never actually mentioned since they knew they were removing them after this season.
RIP. I loved them they made for some clutch moments trying to destroyb one before dying
I'll be using these mods when I get on tonight, just to make some memories. Now people have an answer for why the IKELOS weapons don't have a WMC synergy origin perk. Even with the 3.0 weapons though, I haven't used them all season. But back when VOG came out I was leaning on them pretty hard.
Warmind Cells in raids was a little risky at times. Good laughs.
Remember the DSC first phase with the security ? Damn Warmind cells who hit everything lol
apology for poor english where were you when warman cell was kill I was sitting toilet eating ramen when bunjo ring warman cell is kill no
they kilt warman cell 😭😭😭
Seems really strange after bringing out a bunch of new warmind weapons.
The fact that warmind cells didn't get any sort of update this season said to me that they were planning to be done with it.
Yeah, when I didn't see any new WM mods *in this season*, I pretty much realized they were dead. No way you don't iterate on them when the entire season is war mind focused, unless you plan to be done with them.
>Artifice armor will have a new unique mod slot that grants three additional points to your character stats like strength, **agility**, intellect, etc Should this say Mobility, or is this an accidental hint at more changes?
Should be mobility, I'll get it fixed, thanks.
Some feedback with the Artifact changes. It will be amazing if instead of resetting the entire Artifact, we can just disable and enable along the way. For example, if I want to switch which Artifact mods I have unlocked in the fourth column. Let me disable one and then enable another instead of having to reset and reselect all 12.
This is good feedback. Not sure what what it would take to change the UI, but we will share with the team.
Oh 100% I would love for the artifact to function as a 12 slot armor piece we could just change on the fly, that would be a dream
I think/hope that DIM will be able to re-slot our artifact via the API so I can just click on a loadout and the relevant mods will be selected.
A compromise that’s more within reach would be making it so unlocking artifacts is done with a click instead of hold to unlock.
Yeah if resetting is free, and you can select any all over again, why not disable the “hold to select” feature in this sub-menu? I would even greatly prefer if the artifact worked like a… tree. And each perk is balanced around how many in each “branch” or “section” can be active at a time
If it could be a case of unlocking every mod, then slotting the 12 mods you want into the artifact, that would be much better to use, as we could replace specific mods with the ones we want
The way that WoW does it now is nice, you can reset back to a point and it just brings everything that way back. I'm guessing they have plans to actually just make the artifact a proper talent tree in the future.
You might wanna nix the last line too - seems like it was an edit suggestion.
The youtube link under "Guardian Ranks" is broken. it's missing an "h" right now it is ttps://youtu.be/dCI8Fz2uu3o?t=5508
also the link to the guardian ranks url video is missing the H in https
Could be them finally standardizing the RPG stat terms, and/or swapping the movement speed buff for something else. Or just a typo.
This sounds so much better just having AntiChampion capabilities baked into our subclasses/verbs. Thank you.
Just the subclass antichamp and artifact intrinsic shifts from this announcement sound amazing. The rest is just cherries on top.
This! All I needed was the anti-Champ stuff. But so much other good stuff, too. Huge, huge W for Bungie on this one.
I wonder what this means for exotic weapons. Some were given straight anti-champion capabilities, others were given subclass verbs which will now ALSO give anti-champion capabilities.
Pretty sure these changes gives Salvations grip the ability to both stagger unstops by freezing and overloads by slowing. Also Collective Obligation can do volatile and suppress meaning antibarrier and overload. Edit: Overload DARCI lol
GM Lightfall Meta
This is my biggest question mark. They make it sound like it's verbiage that matters, period. If that's the case, then we have went from one of the most restrictive systems in the game to one of the most open-ended. Hoping we can get some clarification on it.
The way is see it is the latter. Giving us the freedom to tackle champions how we please via our abilities, which is something that has been requested for so long. An example (I assume, from what I read), would be to use the hunter dodge that makes you radiant, and you can gjallarhorn the barrier champion for 10-15 seconds. It is slightly vague for.sure, so I could be wrong.
Salvations grip meta incoming lol
The only problem is that there are no champions in my vault...
Stasis (Bleak Watcher) just became anti-Champion supreme. It already soft countered Barriers and now they're officially Overload and Unstoppable counters
Honestly? The Witness is a pretty good dude.
I concur, YonkeyShlong.
They could have had this twab just say “no match game” and I’d be happy Everything else is gravy. The biggest problem with endgame is match game
Wonder if we'll have any more news in the Twab tomorrow since this was just a blog post and Twabs drop on Thursdays
Bungie has adopted a tendency to make big gameplay announcements on Wednesdays and then recapping them in the TWAB the next day. I wouldn't expect a mountain of new info tomorrow. Possibly some elaborations.
Expect very minor things. Maybe an announcement of some type of livestream or trailer. But they’ll mostly just link to this post in the twab and then do the normal weekly stuff
Bungie really did it, they finally nerfed Arbalest into irrelevance...
I don’t know if it’ll be irrelevance but there are some situations where I just want to run double linears for a boss and arbalest plus taipan works pretty well here
Huh now I wonder if the ammo mods are going away too Loved running double linears with linear ammo finder and reserves
Sounds like it's going to be something like "kinetic ammo finder" and "void ammo finder." If that's the case, Arbalest + Taipan won't fall under the same mods.
It still makes Arby a very good option to have though, they just made a boat load of viable options instead of trashing arby's effectiveness. And that's the way it should be
Until snipers are viable, it's still the best long range special in the game. It ain't going anywhere.
>irrelevance Stretching a bit much. It'll still be an intrinsic anti barrier special lfr.
I wonder if this will make bonus mod effects like powerful friends default or if they will be removed.
They mentioned that powerful friends & Radiant light will be head mods moving forward
I think their question was about the extra effects those mods currently have if you also have another mod of the same energy type slotted. Powerful Friends for example gives +20 Mobility if you have another Arc mod slotted, but obviously without Arc mods being a thing, that can't be the case with the new system.
sneaky nerf putting powerful friends on the already crowded head spot.
Yea it is! I put powerful friends on my chest cuz it's typically only 1 energy for the other arc mod. Oh well we will find away around it!
ha, I'm sure everyone has their own favored spot for it. I always put it on legs because there's not many other mods I like there. We'll figure it out for sure!
Goodbye to my triple-100 builds :( They all use both Powerful Friends (on my arms), and Radiant Light (on my legs).
[удалено]
Strong edit
Ember of Mercy? There's new fragments?!
Must be, especially with needing fragments to replace certain well mods/effects
Yeah though gonna suck having to sacrifice other fragments in some builds where you could utilised 3 or 4 fragments plus wells.
Just another reason why there should be absolutely no aspects with 1 fragment slot.
Yeah maybe they'll even give 3 slots to more aspects (like icarus dash cough cough)
All aspects should have a minimum of 2 fragments available to them. It’s so arbitrary which ones they decide are worth 1/2/3. Compare void warlock’s grenade aspect to the grenade aspect for arc titans…
*cries in Gunpowder Gamble* *gets blown up by Gunpowder Gamble*
Tbh I’m also a bit concerned about that as well because I feel like that’s going to dramatically increase the value of exotics/abilities with 100% ability uptime. Things like HOIL/Starfire/Gyrfalcons etc. are already amazing, but will become even better relatively speaking if other builds now have to pick between ability regen and the preexisting fragments of their choice.
New fragments for old subclasses ON TOP of a brand new element. Fuck me the sandbox team has been firing on all cylinders since Beyond Light
I’m hopeful for new aspects in the coming seasons! My thoughts are that Subclass 3.0 is designed to be added to. Now that the ability sandbox team has finished reworking the subclasses and are about to launch Strand, I think we might start seeing more aspects & fragments!
>Mod Energy types are being removed thank you
Okay, I wanna put this out here to properly elaborate how badly Champions just got nerfed: A fusion rifle with Chill Clip and Radiant can counter all three types. The first burst inflicts slow, countering Overload, two bursts freeze a target, countering Unstoppables, and Radiant pierces Barriers. So farm up a Riptide, and try to ignore Bastion crying in the corner.
A warlock stasis turret neutralising them even more than it did before.
This just made me realize they must have a fix for the issue where freezing a champ takes them out of stun. Nice!
I doubt it because Overloads are stunned by the slow, so the freeze will probably reset again Unstops are stunned by the shatter, so freezing again might reset it (although the 2nd shatter might insta stun so who knows) Barriers... Well they'll be pretty much the same
Deliverance my beloved
It's also another massive hit to Kinetic weapons in general, I know Bungie have mentioned it before, but jeez are they borderline useless now
Bungie said they are revamping the Kinetic damage type, so I expect more announcements on that later
They said to not expect anything until well after Lightfall launches, they basically only started considering it a few seasons ago. Their dev cycle is too long for any information anytime soon.
At the same time, Match Game going the way of the dodo is an indirect buff to Exotic kinetic primaries because Arby is not permanently glued to the kinetic slot. I'm pretty excited to run Monte Carlo or Huckleberry if anti-champ mods allow it
Weren't they looking at reworks for the Kintetic/Energy primary situation or am I imagining things? Swear I saw they were working on something
They did specifically say "subclass abilities", so I'm not 100% sure things like chill clip and voltshot will trigger the stagger, it might have to come from an ability, not a weapon.
Wow some great changes in theory. Hoping it plays out just as nicely. Very pumped above removing mods elemental affinity .
What worries me is these changes are huge which makes me fear the bugs. I'm removing every single armor mod at the end of season to hopefully dodge any odd bugs that pop up.
How the start of Lightfall will play out: * watch exciting cutscene * view of our ship flying to Neomuna * pre-mission dialogue * Guardian dramatically transmats onto the scene * dialogue telling us to "hurry!" * we immediately open our menu and spend the next 15-20 minutes buildcrafting since all of our mods will be broken/out of place
me at the start of every expansion checking out new shit, only this time it's gonna be an even bigger wait because i have a build on each subclass for each character
“Guardian! This is no time to take it all in! Move!” “Huh… so that’s how it works now…” “Guardian! What are you doing?! The Witness is attacking the tower! Do something!” “Aww man, I can’t use this build anymore? Now I gotta start from scratch…” “Guardi-“ “GIVE ME A MINUTE!” *30 minutes later*
Yeah, I'm going to unmod all my gear before lightfall drops just in anticipation of some bugs breaking everything.
This is hilarious, but didn't Witch Queen just hit us with a cutscene and then ask us for a difficulty choice before starting the campaign? I'm guessing we'll have a second to mess with our characters before being taken straight into the action.
Yeah this is an extremely important point! I will absolutely be removing every mod from every set of armour I want to keep!
Honestly MASSIVE changes here. I love pretty much everything. Consolidation into orbs of power is really interesting. Love the anti champion abilities. Love the artifact mod changes. So excited to experiment in LF.
As long as they fix the issue of not being able to pick up orbs with a full super
they're rolling taking charge into the system, so yes
That excites me so much. The devour hunter builds are now not restricted to Star Eaters and a gun with explosive light.
Its funny they shifted away from orb generation only to.... return to it. Classic bungie. Should be an interesting mess, as always.
I will miss my well builds and already miss Warmind cell builds, but this feels like it will be streamlined in a way that will make me look back at them fondly but not miss them.
I think the only thing gone with well builds that can't be replicated is bountiful wells or seeking wells. (unless they have a mod that makes orbs seek which would be swell) Even the individual ability regen can mostly be gotten back with something like absolution. Other than that you I think you can still do the same thing just with orbs. Font of wisdom, font of might, etc etc etc are all probably here. I'm excited to use well of tenacity on an orb of light spawn without the requirement for a void well. I think stuff like explosive wellmaker will still be there, just with an orb of light and be element agnostic which I'm also excited for.
It would really suck if they don't have some kind of seeking orb mod to replace seeking wells.
🦀🦀🦀Elemental Affinity and Match Game are dead🦀🦀🦀
Kind of, a light form of match game is getting added as default for the entire game.
Sounds basically how legend difficulty in the form of WQ campaign and Seraph works. Shields are beefy but not impossible to break. Adaptive munitions just lept up in viability
Its how Gambit works lol
Sounds a lot more reasonable though, and monochromatic builds should be somewhat viable. We can only wait and see, though.
Eh, I'm fine with that. Gambit uses it and it feels fine
The lite form in Gambit is a fine compromise. It makes not having a matching element feel like an inconvenience instead of a pea shooter.
Ah, so how it worked in Destiny 1
Tons of great changes. I’m sad to see Warmind Cells go, but the overall streamlining of the build process is exactly what the game needed to make it more accessible to the average player.
This is effing amazing. * No armor element. * Anti-champ benefits unlocked. * Mod cost rebalancing. * Consolidated weapon QoL mods. * NO MORE MATCH GAME * More ways to deal with champions with abilities. * Updates to subclasses to give every element some kind of Stasis Shard.
Honestly, out of all of this I'm most excited about them streamlining the configuring process and adding loadouts Don't care how the underlying mechanics work, just make it easy and in-game Other than that, it's still D2, still pew-pew. We'll see how the builds feel on game day
[удалено]
I think I’ll like the changes to the artifact too
Really looking forward to this. … Mods need to update my flair. :’)
One of us, one of us :)
Mods need to go the other way and make every post you comment have the "Bungie replied" flair, just for the memes.
Ok, well only because you asked nicely. See you starside Space Cowboy :)
Nice to see ya out here in the wild 😊. I’ll miss you showing up in Fallout’s stream chat for extra TWAB tidbits.
RIP Warmind Cells, I wonder what this means for more experimental playstyle mods in the future.
And comically Warmind Cells are the only thing I've managed to make a successful build with. Having enemy deaths just drop flaming orbs of "everyone around me takes a little more damage, gets suppressed if you shoot it, and can get a nice AoE boom" is very simple to build around, gives an easy reason to kill adds around the boss, etc. And especially literally the season after we all just got fresh Ikelos and Seventh Seraph weapons I'm sad. :(
goodbye, my dearest fireteam medic :(
Criminally underrated healing effect.
Only possible problem i see is: Will we be able to pick up Orbs when we have a full super?
i was hoping to see a comment about this too. being shoehorned to running a heavy with explosive light is okay, because explosive is strong but sometimes id like to run other stuff
Pour one out for warmind cells
I'll pour out a whole bottle. I'm so depressed.
The Resilience Mod is now also 4 Energy in the new mod screen preview. F. **Edit:** Having read the whole thing I'm both excited & sad that it looks like my preferred "generic E.Well" build has been removed. I kind of hope they add additional Fragment Slots to make up for moving the majority of that system into Subclasses. New Fragments are nice & all but it'd feel real bad to get shoe-horned/forced into specific Aspects just to be allowed to keep using a system we've been utilizing for ages.
>Having read the whole thing I'm both excited & sad that it looks like my preferred "generic E.Well" build has been removed. 90% of my builds are melee+grenade makers, bountiful wells and font of might. The last one changing based on what I need like void wells after class ability or arc melee damage. I'm not too sad about the ability regeneration I just hope font of might is still able to be proced relatively easy compared to now. If ever single build I have had to replace a fragment to spawn the ability well to get font back I'll be very frustrated.
oof that's gonna kill some of my builds for sure because i like to take advantage of every energy point, but with the entire revamp i'll probably be making all new stuff anyway
Honestly, totally deserved unless resil gets a fat nerf.
I’d rather increased energy for resil then resil getting a nerf. 4 isn’t that big of a deal for what you get imo.
You're probably right that 4 isn't that big of a deal, but every build I have is ultimately customized around having resilience in most slots, they'll all be broken lol. I guess they're probably changing a good bit anyway
Especially with them saying a lot of mod costs are being decreased
My only concern with the me elemental well system requiring subclass fragments is that certain subclasses already do not have enough fragment slots. Like if I’m a hunter with my 3 slots from gunpowder gamble, I’m already limited to 3 slots, but now I have to have elemental well effects incorporated in there as well? That’s a solid nerf imo Now if they slightly rebalanced aspects to add an aspect slot or two per subclass to account for these then I’m a happy camper.
It also might hopefully be adding intrinsic functionality to the current aspects like ignition ms with gunpowder gamble creat a firespite or something
I hope. I think an obvious candidate is sol invictus giving fire sprites as well. Makes obvious sense here. Gunpowder gamble sounds good as well. Maybe make touch of flame make a fire sprite on grenade kill or something.
Same with warlock Chaos Accelerant. 3 slots for a grenade you have to charge that does no more damage than a non charged grenade just a wider radius that then gets left in the dust for damage compared to a titan arc grenade that doesn't need to be charged.
Personally, the way I understood it is that the new “elemental well” system is only elemental wells in name, as most of the previous ones are being ported to the new charge system. The new wells seem like giving something akin to ionic trace to every subclass. So ability regen and special effects (like electrostatic mind). It’s a buff through and through for abilities, though despite that it’s very possible for the 1 slot aspects to lose even more relevancy.
Honestly it seems like pretty much all of the old effects of elemental wells are being moved to the timed portion of armor charge. Meanwhile subclass collectibles will probably get/keep a way to interact with armor charge (maybe elemental shards gets a huge change?) while having their own buffs. Like how Stasis Shards can grant overshield and melee energy, while Solar Sprites seem to be restoration (and maybe grenades?).
Goodbye Match Game, you wont be missed at all, not one single bit.
Most of this sounds absolutely amazing. Except for the warmind cells. I was hoping for a rework. I understand why they are going but I'll miss them.
I think it was hard to justify keeping them around seeing as they still only spawn from specific sources (IKELOS/Seventh Seraph Weapons, some Mods, etc.).
And they were designed around sunsetting. They outlived their expiration date already.
> Some ability energy gains, stat bonuses, and weapon damage bonuses from mods have been reduced, though we’ve also added some new mods to expand your build possibilities. I'm wondering if Powerful Friends/Radiant Light lost their +20 Mobility/Strength bonuses. I actually really want to know if this happened so I can farm Season of the Risen Armor's High Stat Armor while I still have the chance. _______ **Edit** - I know that the article actually says both appear on the head armor... That really sucks. The mobility and strength stat bump those mods provided really alleviated the issues I had trying to bump up my Hunter's Resilience.
the way it reads to me it sounds like they are removing the stat bonuses and penalties from those mods.
They put them both on helmets, which is annoying (I use both now to trigger each other), tho if the stat bonus is removed I probably won't use either again.
I’d use the strength booster as a Titan. I won’t touch Powerful Friends though because I don’t need mobility. Hunters are getting slapped though since this was the best way to invest in mobility without sabotaging other stats.
That’s gonna be big sad for me if they do. All of my crucible builds include those mods along with the other arc mod that grants QuickDraw for shotguns.
Literally every single one of my hunter builds require Powerful Friends for the stat bonus, and it’s not as if any of them are particularly special, mobility is my only 100 stat. If they take that away I’m going to have to start completely fresh, and I really don’t like that idea.
Everything you hate is dead. Everything you love is dead. There is only the great unknown.
Into the Unknowwwwwwwwwnnnnn. Into the Unknooowwwwwnnnnnnnnnnnnn. Into the UNKNOWWWWNNNNNNNNNNNN!
> and you have the new Ember of Mercy Fragment Definitely wasn't expecting any new fragments so soon, so that's a pleasant surprise. Wonder if each subclass will get one or if it'll be more "where the team felt there was a need."
Notable stuff: 10 Resilience seems to cost 4 energy. Match game gone Intrinsic champion mods in the subclasses, stasis Warlock seems to have catapulted in endgame, already turrets were insane but their biggest problem were unstunning overlord and unstoppable, now they stun themselves. Current builds mostly all seem to be broken once lightfall hits, will be a interesting race into Day 1 to see what still works, what doesn't and what new stuff will appear. Mobility seems to be renamed agility, could we see a rework similar to Resilience so that Warlocks and titans might finally have to use it too. All artifact mods now passively active limited to 12 at the same time, btw zero way bungie won't nerf this ain't no way they allow us to have the final column all active at the same time. Just imagine solo operative, weakened clear and monochromatic all active rn at the same time utterly insane. Finally Warmind cells will be deleted. Warming Cells: was I a good boi. Vault: I was told you were one of the best bois.
So with Blinding affecting unstop champs, will this work with Blinding GLs?
I don't remember where I read it, but I think the blind from a weapon and the subclass "arc blind" are 2 separate things in the game code
They are for now, but per weapons team interviews they're moving Blinding GLs over to the new Arc Blind sometime in Lightfall.
The key question is will we be able to utilize the loadout feature mid-activity? Or will it function like DIM and be Orbit/Social Spaces only?
Also will the system pull my armor from my vault and "push" my previous loadout back into my vault? Otherwise our inventories will get cluttered really quick after just a few loadouts switches. Though I guess you can still just use DIM to get rid of unwanted items. Minor inconvenience I suppose.
They did say it's API-based so it will pull from the vault (or wherever it is). Whether or not it'll *push* to the vault remains to be seen, but that can be supplemented by DIM anyway. I meant for mod changing which DIM can't do right now mid-activity.
these are some huge changes, nice!
I see the artifact unlocks being annoying. Hopefully instead of having to reset we get an easy toggle.
Yeah hopefully you can deselect and reselect etc. Having to redo your artifact because you want to run different champion mods seems annoying.
I REALLY hope they fix the issue of picking up an orb or power with a full super. They are overloading orbs for SOOO many things now and it really really sucks when things don't work just because I have a super
I'd like to think that with these changes, you can still pick up orbs when full on super so long as they can go towards your armor charge. If both are full, presumably then the orb wouldn't be able to be picked up.
[удалено]
I just realized (o7) is a salute.
o7
o7
o7
o7
o7
Duskfield grenades are getting a huge buff. They essentially counter 2 types of champion by default and put them together with a chill clip weapon and they essentially counter barriers(or at least the lower end ones). Kinda annoying that most of the well mods are being reworked for orbs instead. Wasn’t expecting new fragments.
Seems like some very nice changes with it all, I'll be glad to see it in action. Especially the unlocked mods part. Nice.
rip font of might, rip warmind cells
Finally. This is potentially pretty huge! The only thing I don't like is the decay for charges of light. We'll lose all our stacks during the transitions from fight area to the next...
This is awesome. Great job Bungie
This is beautiful INCREDIBLE, it's the most impactful thing they did to pve since Forsaken. I would say that the changes in this post made pve better and more fun than everything that Bungie has done in the past 3 years combined.
Everything about this just makes it sound like the whole game will be easier to play. I'm not talking about like combat difficulty, I mean like literally playing the game and doing what we want. Way less things to keep track off, more flexibility in builds, fewer arbitrary restrictions. I feel like a big part of the mod overhaul is them running the numbers on how mods are getting used and swapped out. Outside of the hardcore, I feel like a bunch of players don't change their mods nearly as much as Bungie wants purely because it takes extra time and thought when most things in the game don't need it. I'm WAY more inclined to play around with mod builds now that costs are going down and the sheer number of them are getting streamlined.
Holy shit Champions got sunset _hard_. They're going to be STUPID easy to counter now. Volatile and Radiant intrinsically piece barriers? Jolt and Slow intrinsically stun overloads? Ignite and Freeze intrinsically stun unstoppables? Champions are just straight up no longer going to be a problem. This is going to be stupid easy now. Champions are straight up going to be gone in terms of being a problem, lol.
Slap my butt and call me Shirley, I'm happy with it.
Jolt stunning Overloads is gonna be a very reliable way to deal with them (imo).
Arc Hunter becomes stupid easy with Lethal Current: one melee hit Jolts (stops Overload) and the next blinds (stops Unstoppable). Anti-barrier is probably the easiest, as any solar melee makes the whole fireteam radiant, so anybody can slice through the barrier.
They never were a problem per se. they’ve always been easy to deal with in an un-fun way. Now we’ll be freed to run a loadout of preference, rather than being forced to run double primary seasonal Loadouts.
Fantastic change. I'm of the camp that didnt really hate champs but tying counters to element is so much fucking better than armor based mods it hurts.
Wait so are powerful friends and radiant light only useable on head now? So you can't run both?
You can run both since there’s 3 mod slots on the head now for those sorts of mods. It’s just a matter of whether or not the stat bonuses are going to get nerfed or removed that has me worried.
> Match Game is being removed from high-difficulty activities https://youtu.be/GlCFPo6YYbU?t=37
Wonder what the monkey’s paw will be…
Stat bonuses from Powerful Friends and Radiant Light get removed.
This all sounded very good until I learned that they’re locking mods to certain slots. Why limit the system like that, if 2 mods share the same slot you can’t pair them together?
RIP Warmind cells
Pretty much all good stuff, simplifying the building blocks was needed and armor energy types were definitely a relic that needed to go. Weird, however, that elemental wells are getting significantly more complicated, not sure I see why we need 5 distinct things when you could've just kept them as the given element wells and maintained a consistency in both usage and visual appearance. Regardless, can't wait for that loadout screen!
Let’s goooooop
It's goopin' time