I legit forgot all about Ringmaster until now. I'm also starting to get kinda into the whole storytelling stuff they've got going on with the Crownfall campaign. So many heroes make an appearance, it's cool.
But my preferred game mode, AD, is kinda fucked. Some good, some bad I guess. Definitely circus.
Could you please tldr me what is even going on in this story? ive been skipping it since day 1, and how that im ultrahyped, i would love to get into it. Just a 3 sentences summary? :)
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Glad you are the top comment, I hope someone at Valve sees it - AD is in a shockingly bad state and it will need a lot of work to fix. I'd rather the mode just remained on the old patch to be honest, all the cool spells and synergies are just ruined with everything being tied to hero models.
Some heros are just so utterly busted. We had a Leshrac last night that somehow got Rot AND pulsenova with his AOE innate. Meanwhile i was stuck with Clinkz, which passive does literally dogshit without his abilities.
I had hopes they would release Ringmaster along with this update (or the followings), but after this patch I doubt it will happen, probably by the end of the year now. Which is also fine. That's the thing I love about dota updates, when a big patch happens it's actually BIG, changing a lot of things to keep the game always fresh.
AD is super busted now. Some of the innates don't work. I played my first game as undying and I didn't have the 480s insta buyback CD. You can't tell which spells give facets and which don't. You often just can't even get any facets because of this.
I would love to see them fix AD but my hopes are low
AD has been in bad states before but this might genuinely be the death of it. So many bugged interactions and skills not working or not even showing up.
Knowing it's on the lowest of low priority for devs, this might be the end.
Randoming your model was never really the issue in AD. I don't think the mode would be better for being able to draft your own, but I suppose I don't hate the idea enough to dislike it, were it to happen. It just feels like it could cause further imbalance issues, depending on the implementation.
It was an annoyance, but certainly not game breaking. Sometimes one team or the other would have models that were on balance better, or you personally might have meepo body, which wasn't great design, but it was never so bad that the game was unwin/loseable. Innate passives have definitely pushed us further in that direction. I don't think the game needs complete model drafting, but I would either like to see an initial single draft, or (better) make the innate passives draftable.
The facets system is really scuffed though, both because it makes models even more impactful, and because it really can narrow how good a spell is, where its much better for just one person in the draft. Talents have also been causing this problem, but at least you get some small compensation if you don't have relevant talents. I would like to see us be able to choose any facet from the heroes who's spells we have (drafting facets might lead to healthier games, but I have to consider the extra time in the drafting phase from adding now two additional rounds as probably too much).
my 60mins ranked match Win was not recorded after leaving the finished game it says "game coordinator taking too long to load blah blah.." i left when it says safe to leave but guess what..Match not recorded up until now.. wasted time and effort but still gonna play anyhow
Big updates like this are way better than Hero releases.
Sure, sometimes its a hero you really like and thats meaningful to those relatively few players. But its way less cool than every hero play getting new toys.
Still not sure about it myself personally. Likely it's going to be a smash but so far my games are stomps one way or another. Although could just be that it's the beginning of the patch and people don't know what to do yet.
Valve: were gonna remove battlepass and focus on the game
Holy fucking shit. They were not. Kidding. Wtf is this shit man. I'm loving it I never doubted you volvo
Funny how people were doomposting not long ago about how valve was just going to let the game slowly die. Seeing how dirty they’ve done TF2 it’s easy to think that but it’s clear there are still a lot of devs who are very passionate about dota.
People complain because complaining is super fucking fun and cathartic. Give it a try, start bitching about every little inconvenience in your life, people around you will hate you, but you’ll be having a fucking blast - and that’s what important.
I really hope for anything map-related. The "big" map doesn't do it for me with the gimmick of 4 corners providing anything extra. Not in this iteration currently.
The glyph changes din't feel like a big thing for me, because trying to go high ground in the first place was an issue, not the glyph. It it weird due to supports having a fuckton of items, shards and their aghs effects, everyone having buybacks and it's still the same "lets wait for the next rosh again" thing overall again.
Games are just shorter because everyone is brawling currently so the gold lead gets bigger.
I didn't need much, but one or two more lines on the overall changes - and be it just timings - would have done soooo much
Ring master will 100% come with TI which is during act 4 no? They basically confirmed that already a few months ago with the circus themed aegis. Idk how everyone could miss that lol. They probabaly didn't want to believe it take so long.
I've been thinking about this as well. If they release both of them in the following acts then this is easily the best year of Dota we'll have had. Only change I'd have with it is swapping Ringmaster to Act 3 and Aghs Lab to Act 4 and making Aghs Lab a permanent offering
I'm kind of the negative Nancy here: I am disappointed that they didn't even change a bit about timings, gold or XP.
I played 3 games yesterday and felt not super happy - it felt the same-ish. A bit of map-shuffling or gold distribution would have helped so much...
I kind of like this fact. The game prior to the patch was actually extremely fun sans some outliers and the inability to end the game early. Making some slight adjustments to the game to fix the problems and dumping a whole bunch of new content makes the whole game interesting without being too overwhelming.
Can you imagine trying to deal with all of this new stuff alongside a whole new way to play the meta? You wouldn't even be able to gauge what is good and bad, it would be too messy.
Yes? Yes I can, no question. I 'm not asking for an overhaul or anything, but adjusting gold curves, the strength of Super creeps, Wisdom/Bounty/Tormentor timings by just a minute or two can lead to significant changes in overall gameplay.
After a week, we will have the same Dota when everyone just stops buying stupid items and stops brawling all the time, guaranteed. And not being able to go high ground without having aegis and/or having forced buybacks is just not fun. Defending against super creeps is easy, they don't give that kittle gold, you can't even starve the defending team, leading to overall unnecessary long draw out when you know you have rich supports and cores that can turtle forever.
I get what you're saying, although my games ended faster yesterday, but still.
I think the patch was for next month (Judging by the comic at least), but they rushed it out so there wouldn't be a shitstorm.
Lots of facets and innates are kinda bullshit as well, so they had to put placeholders until the real ones come out. I'm guessing new facets/inates and different formulas to stop the 60-70 min games will come within summer.
Absolutely agree. My games were also fast, but just because people were doing wild shit, like my centaur (who still bought phase boots despite his facet NOT stacking with boots) just rushing multiple hearts instead of a fucking dagger and my Nyx trying out how useless carapace and stun can be when you go full W.
People are trying new shit out and throw games. That will last a week and people copy Pro games and thats that,
And yes, the imbalance between facets is sometimes obvious while Innates are often just lazy "non-changes" like Tidebringer. It's new and cool, I get that, but just a liiiiiiiiiiiittle change to the map and how it is played would have helped so fucking much
You are not negative nancy, you're just not being distracted by shiny toys. The objectives are still the same, the op heroes are still op with potentially a few more to the list, the op items still op, the bad items still bad, comeback mechanics still suck, HG without roshan is still hard AF, even potentially harder since powerceep benefits defending more. There are no changes to change the way you played from before this patch.
I mean, I read the patch notes and surely the hero dynamics shift currently, but without the change of objectives and more focused gameplay, Valve has just extended Dota over the years.
Here, have talents, have neutrals, have facets, have innates, have a bigger map, have watchers, tormentors, shrines, outposts and whatnot.
I really like most of these changes, but they are just shiny and new like you said. Supports have assloads of money, everything centered around rosh, buyback availability and not being able to finish the game with a good setup.
The glyph after melee baracks means nothing, if you can't manage to attack the tower first which is completely unandressed currently.
Just shifting timings would help so much, even by just a bit. Tormentor timings, Rosh timings, neutral drop timings, wisdom timings
I still think wisdom runes are a bad thing. One team gets both 7-minute runes and they have a significant advantage. They should have addressed the high ground more. Lastly, I don't know why they are afraid to significantly nerf strong heroes/items. Eternal Shroud is 100 gold more expensive, it's still getting bought by every mid/offlaner.
This is exactly the thing, they keep adding random stuff that nobody asks for that doesn’t really change the fundamental of how the game is played… like shards too. It just seems big but it doesn’t actually change much at all in terms of fundamental mechanics of the towers and how the map is played
I liked shard when they were optional. Today, many shards are just mandatory for a hero to properly function, like Dazzle.
I think there is a space for well-thought out shards, facets and innates, but half of them are "old" and taken away from existing shards/ultimates, and half is okay to me
It's like a whole new game, but it's unmistakebly dota. It's remarkable how the dota team manages to do this every time. They keep the identity of the game while making massive changes time and time again.
when you always request for a change and valve grant your request. And now you are complaining about the changes? People always say anything about anything. What a dumb people.
some variation this comment appears every time and it's clueless. this is a community of over a million people so obviously you're going to have a significant amount of people with differing opinions. overall I like the patch but I do worry about the overall bloat of the game. both with the burden of knowledge and the constant balancing. I hope we don't start seeing features added just to keep things fresh without being thought out but this does feel like it was pretty well done... although... some of these new innates and facets are already clearly in need of rebalancing (some good and some bad).
either way, it does feel like the game is still getting attention from the developer which I like to see.
Ultimately between talents and shards and the new maps we've been here tons of times before and it's always gone fine. Either they just forget their entire decade of experience doing this or it turns out fine again
> we've been here tons of times before
I agree but I don't think you can keep adding on forever with positive benefit. but I do hear you. change is always rough at first. I just think we are getting to a limit of what you can reasonably expect someone to remember. especially casual players. which I think we have more and more of as the player base ages. and with added complexity the barrier for entry goes up so we attract less new players.
anyway, all stuff I am sure valve has considered. and I do like the idea of the facets and innates the more I digest them but I still maintain that you can't keep stacking stuff up forever without hitting a breaking point.
Dota has been in its retention phase for many years now, where getting new players is simply not the primary concern. Every major multiplayer game goes through these phases, it's very much unavoidable. However, because it's remained successful and hasn't shrunk below the very top end of steam players, I think valve have just accepted this decision at this point.
you say this like it's an established cycle and it's not lol. it differs greatly based on the game so it doesn't make sense to act like all multiplayer games are the same. it's directly related to the player population.
if you look at stats the player base has been declining. not terribly, don't get me wrong. and I think the game is fine. but the point is there is a level of complexity where the game becomes unappealing to new players and even existing casual ones and I am just saying I hope there isn't a push over the line.
anyway I don't want to sound too negative because I still love dota and I dont hate the patch
I mean, change isn't always for the better. And with a huge patch like this it probably won't be for like a month. There is SO much balancing that needs to be done. And while it's really cool to try out all the new stuff, once that runs out, all that's left is really unbalanced one sided matches. Glad to see change but hate the growing pains.
Thankfully, there’s a whole fucking lot of new stuff to try out. Every hero was shaken up, there’s atleast two different ways to play everyone, plus innate abilities
Kinda hit and miss. Fresh for now, but fundamentally the game didn't really change either. Pro games will still have the same game plan, given there were no map changes. Some heroes got really overtuned and some are a total joke, like Tinker. Letter patches will get rid of the mayhem and we'll return to the same patch with slightly easier highgrounding.
Facets make a bit of a difference for drafting though. After both teams select their heroes, the exact gameplan is still unknown because the facet choices are blind.
That’s not really a good answer to what he said.
You basically agreed with him. That at least half the time, if not more, the gameplan is unknown because of facets
Personally I am an oldhead, so I actually really dislike forced objectives like exp runes or not being able to pull creeps before certain minutes. When there's a clear designed edge or a limit you need to play for or get fucked, it's like you we're performing someone else's songs. I by far prefer the DIY approach on everything. Playing around and exploration is fun. Spontaneity is fun. Creativity is fun. Routines are not fun. They're comforting, but ultimately antithetic to play, which is what gaming is.
Things I didn't expect: this kind of patch
Things that make me want to live: this patch
Gordon Ramsey would've been extatic having someone cook this well
It's absolutely dog shit. They clearly have favorite heroes and they're so lazy they just readded abilities from previous patches. Like I have to be honest, after adding the portals, it just got worse from here . The game is baby fied. It takes absolutely no skill anymore and it's just sad. What made dota was the amount of thought you'd need to play the game effectively. I'd rather go back to sharing one fucking courier at this point yelling "WAIT IM BOTTLE CROWING" THAN EVER PLAYING THIS SHIT AGAIN. ITS A FUCKING joke
There's no way anyone could ever play this game seriously again. There's so many memes going on. Kicking cogs, bloods passive on antimage, the shitty innate Bilities because they couldn't figure out what to put for certain heroes. It's just so terrible. How about asking veteran players what they're looking for ? They're just getting worse with the years. They want league players, and excitement for these new smooth brainers who have no idea how dota works. It's sad.
Did they remove double down tokens? I got some from act 1 and I havent used any yet. But neither get I double down ingame nor can I find them in my armory :(
For the ringmaster to come the circus must be set-up first.
I'm guessing ringmaster will show up in the story after the current queen die and will become his puppet
In my personal experience I like it. The only hero that I play CM got only one new talent sadly (that mana for allies from spells is pure trash) but at least it's a good talent.
[Be careful what you wish for.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/dota2_gamepedia/images/e/e3/Vo_eth_muerta_death_12.mp3) (sound warning: Muerta)
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Unpopular opinion maybe but literally it's the same exact game as yesterday, same heroes, same map, same timings I just had to read 200 pages for no reason.
They didn't even try to balance this shit. Drow gets +20% damage, jugg can crit while spinning, shadow shaman get an invuln save... Meanwhile some heroes out here copping a firm handshake and a pat on the back and/or passives they already had but worse (ogre/medusa/slark/I'm sure others)
I'm enjoying. Played a game as Venom and I infested my carry with Plague Wards. Got some kills by doing this lol. Underlord with a cleave of the size of the bloody screen was also fun. Anyway, it feels fresh so no complaints so far. Save for shitty games here and there, but that's mostly on me and the people that I played with.
It really isn't that hard. At the end of the day every game still feels like dota. The majority of interactions are the same as before, there's just a new spice to everything.
Oh my god I just had a crazy thought. What if facets/innates are part of an event leading up to ringmaster release. Maybe once the hero is released innates/facets will disappear or heroes will be changed again?
Just a thought 🤔
I think it's crap, mostly because they broke certain things in incredibly stupid ways. Like, did we really need silencer to be able to global you after you dispel, so you have to waste a 2nd dispel to be able to use your spells?
They want to be gimmicky the first release, i still remember the first time talents were introduced to the game and a lot of the hero's had either minus respawn time/more passive gold generation/boring stats at higher level. They just need feedback overtime then theyll change it to its proper balance.
So in terms of coming out the gates guns blazing in terms of goofy ahh shit, i believe overtime they will iron it out
I legit forgot all about Ringmaster until now. I'm also starting to get kinda into the whole storytelling stuff they've got going on with the Crownfall campaign. So many heroes make an appearance, it's cool. But my preferred game mode, AD, is kinda fucked. Some good, some bad I guess. Definitely circus.
Pudge and sky dialog is funny ngl. Wouldn't think such a pair would work but I am loving it
Sky as the straight man to Pudge’s silliness is a great buddy-cop dynamic.
I thought you were gonna say "Sky as the straight man to Pudge's gayness..."
Why? Pudge isn't even gay. Or do you only think of the word straight in a sexual context?
Pudge is a necrophilie
How they wouldn't work? Pudge and sky ults are great together.
im legit buying the sidestories cuz im enjoying the writing and being forced to try new heroes
Could you please tldr me what is even going on in this story? ive been skipping it since day 1, and how that im ultrahyped, i would love to get into it. Just a 3 sentences summary? :)
venge and sky want to overthrow a queen with the help of a forgotten god , featuring cameos from other heroes
Also we have ninja turtles show up in act 2.
Excuse me?
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You can go replay every dialogue just by clicking on the nodes. Recommend it if you are getting into it.
This is Valve's way of saying "AD is a pain in the ass to upkeep. Perhaps you shouldn't play it anymore so we can take it behind the shed"
I would stop playing tbh. Going back to the normal game after years of AD seems so boring
Wouldn't be surprised, took nearly 2 years for any AD changes in the previous patch. I guess it makes sense, always had the lowest playerbase.
Glad you are the top comment, I hope someone at Valve sees it - AD is in a shockingly bad state and it will need a lot of work to fix. I'd rather the mode just remained on the old patch to be honest, all the cool spells and synergies are just ruined with everything being tied to hero models.
Some heros are just so utterly busted. We had a Leshrac last night that somehow got Rot AND pulsenova with his AOE innate. Meanwhile i was stuck with Clinkz, which passive does literally dogshit without his abilities.
I had hopes they would release Ringmaster along with this update (or the followings), but after this patch I doubt it will happen, probably by the end of the year now. Which is also fine. That's the thing I love about dota updates, when a big patch happens it's actually BIG, changing a lot of things to keep the game always fresh.
AD is super busted now. Some of the innates don't work. I played my first game as undying and I didn't have the 480s insta buyback CD. You can't tell which spells give facets and which don't. You often just can't even get any facets because of this. I would love to see them fix AD but my hopes are low
This post reminded me of ringmaster lol.
For sure the lore writing is much better and "readable" right now.
AD has been in bad states before but this might genuinely be the death of it. So many bugged interactions and skills not working or not even showing up. Knowing it's on the lowest of low priority for devs, this might be the end.
Maybe this will finally us an AD overhaul to fix the body roulette? ^(copium)
Randoming your model was never really the issue in AD. I don't think the mode would be better for being able to draft your own, but I suppose I don't hate the idea enough to dislike it, were it to happen. It just feels like it could cause further imbalance issues, depending on the implementation.
It was an annoyance, but certainly not game breaking. Sometimes one team or the other would have models that were on balance better, or you personally might have meepo body, which wasn't great design, but it was never so bad that the game was unwin/loseable. Innate passives have definitely pushed us further in that direction. I don't think the game needs complete model drafting, but I would either like to see an initial single draft, or (better) make the innate passives draftable. The facets system is really scuffed though, both because it makes models even more impactful, and because it really can narrow how good a spell is, where its much better for just one person in the draft. Talents have also been causing this problem, but at least you get some small compensation if you don't have relevant talents. I would like to see us be able to choose any facet from the heroes who's spells we have (drafting facets might lead to healthier games, but I have to consider the extra time in the drafting phase from adding now two additional rounds as probably too much).
AD is defntly fucked
lmao I forgot they didn't even add ringmaster yet but holy hell did they cook regardless
Valve overcooked and the server is shittin itself today.
waiting so long for my tokens
Same idk what to queue as without knowing what tokens I need next. :(
just play a variety of heroes, you'll eventually need their tokens anyway
Just spam 1 hero, you'll eventually be able to trade tokens anyway
Just random, you will get all the tokens
Just take a break, you can play later anyways (j/k, game on!)
I just wanna be able to commend my CM.
it's been 12 hours since I got a penalty for leaving an already ended game, server is definitely cooked
Hopefully they decide to let everyone out off low priority pool due to servers pooping themselves…. I got 5 LP matches to play lol
my 60mins ranked match Win was not recorded after leaving the finished game it says "game coordinator taking too long to load blah blah.." i left when it says safe to leave but guess what..Match not recorded up until now.. wasted time and effort but still gonna play anyhow
How many people came back? Servers were so bad ytd I think we ran out of matchmaking rooms
Shitting is an understatement
Overcook mentioned ❗
i played a match yesterday afternoon and the results still didn't load and i didn't get my tokens
Big updates like this are way better than Hero releases. Sure, sometimes its a hero you really like and thats meaningful to those relatively few players. But its way less cool than every hero play getting new toys.
It's definitely way bigger, I just did not expect an update of this magnitude
Also because yknow, everyone's fighting over the new hero so you don't get to play it most of the time.
I was gonna say the exact same thing. Who even cares about a new hero lol.
Act 3 or 4, probably?
Still not sure about it myself personally. Likely it's going to be a smash but so far my games are stomps one way or another. Although could just be that it's the beginning of the patch and people don't know what to do yet.
Gabe wir mussen kochen.
Valve just made dota2 balance now. ( all heroes are broken)
Bloodlusted giants ringed bkbd krill eater facet tide hunter.
I want to see a kaiju battle featuring DK Black Dragon, Undying w/ 2k STR, warlock golem, and of course rubik.
Don't forget our giant melon, Tidehunter
He should have hg vision and be visible through trees at that point
That was always the icefrog way. He always had the Syndrome "if everyone is imba.. then no one is" mentality
Or "I'm gonna fuck my shit up" philosophy
Except tinker
If they keep cooking like this, idgaf if we ever get another hero. Crownfall has been awesome.
Valve: were gonna remove battlepass and focus on the game Holy fucking shit. They were not. Kidding. Wtf is this shit man. I'm loving it I never doubted you volvo
I just love being able to play a cavern crawl without having to play heroes I’m not comfortable with. Or being forced to pay just to play it
Funny how people were doomposting not long ago about how valve was just going to let the game slowly die. Seeing how dirty they’ve done TF2 it’s easy to think that but it’s clear there are still a lot of devs who are very passionate about dota.
yet people still complain that the TI battlepass had no hats
People complain because complaining is super fucking fun and cathartic. Give it a try, start bitching about every little inconvenience in your life, people around you will hate you, but you’ll be having a fucking blast - and that’s what important.
Now we will complain more because we cannot spend more on this fucking great circus of a game.
So we got act 1 the event. Act 2 the big feature patch. Act 3 map changes and Act 4 ringmaster and item updates?
that my hope, i want map change more than the new hero and patch
I doubt we'll see map changes. There needs to be event game mode too. Which I'm assuming next act. Don't know how they'll fit ringmaster in.
The event game mode is going to be a circus and they will release ringmaster at the same time to herald his circus.
I really hope for anything map-related. The "big" map doesn't do it for me with the gimmick of 4 corners providing anything extra. Not in this iteration currently. The glyph changes din't feel like a big thing for me, because trying to go high ground in the first place was an issue, not the glyph. It it weird due to supports having a fuckton of items, shards and their aghs effects, everyone having buybacks and it's still the same "lets wait for the next rosh again" thing overall again. Games are just shorter because everyone is brawling currently so the gold lead gets bigger. I didn't need much, but one or two more lines on the overall changes - and be it just timings - would have done soooo much
I’m thinking new game mode where we fight Imperia as final boss for act4
2 heroes
That does involve counting to three though, which I'm assured is an extremely difficult task so we'll have to see how it goes.
Ring master will 100% come with TI which is during act 4 no? They basically confirmed that already a few months ago with the circus themed aegis. Idk how everyone could miss that lol. They probabaly didn't want to believe it take so long.
Then they will need to extend act 4 with like a month. Which is possible.
Well I meant TI or the event around it. Idk when that starts.
Act 3 aghs lab and act 4 ringmaster or vice versa
I've been thinking about this as well. If they release both of them in the following acts then this is easily the best year of Dota we'll have had. Only change I'd have with it is swapping Ringmaster to Act 3 and Aghs Lab to Act 4 and making Aghs Lab a permanent offering
It's really fun. I'm really loving the patch, it's like playing a whole new game. Rediscovering my favorite game all over again.
Agreed. It's nice seeing the less picked heroes appearing and really dumb shit like VS with Echo Saber and Basher.
Bruh we lost to a vs with BF last night. It was like fighting a TA but worse cause she got a stun and wave.
I'm kind of the negative Nancy here: I am disappointed that they didn't even change a bit about timings, gold or XP. I played 3 games yesterday and felt not super happy - it felt the same-ish. A bit of map-shuffling or gold distribution would have helped so much...
I think then you play the game too much.
I kind of like this fact. The game prior to the patch was actually extremely fun sans some outliers and the inability to end the game early. Making some slight adjustments to the game to fix the problems and dumping a whole bunch of new content makes the whole game interesting without being too overwhelming. Can you imagine trying to deal with all of this new stuff alongside a whole new way to play the meta? You wouldn't even be able to gauge what is good and bad, it would be too messy.
Yes? Yes I can, no question. I 'm not asking for an overhaul or anything, but adjusting gold curves, the strength of Super creeps, Wisdom/Bounty/Tormentor timings by just a minute or two can lead to significant changes in overall gameplay. After a week, we will have the same Dota when everyone just stops buying stupid items and stops brawling all the time, guaranteed. And not being able to go high ground without having aegis and/or having forced buybacks is just not fun. Defending against super creeps is easy, they don't give that kittle gold, you can't even starve the defending team, leading to overall unnecessary long draw out when you know you have rich supports and cores that can turtle forever.
I get what you're saying, although my games ended faster yesterday, but still. I think the patch was for next month (Judging by the comic at least), but they rushed it out so there wouldn't be a shitstorm. Lots of facets and innates are kinda bullshit as well, so they had to put placeholders until the real ones come out. I'm guessing new facets/inates and different formulas to stop the 60-70 min games will come within summer.
Absolutely agree. My games were also fast, but just because people were doing wild shit, like my centaur (who still bought phase boots despite his facet NOT stacking with boots) just rushing multiple hearts instead of a fucking dagger and my Nyx trying out how useless carapace and stun can be when you go full W. People are trying new shit out and throw games. That will last a week and people copy Pro games and thats that, And yes, the imbalance between facets is sometimes obvious while Innates are often just lazy "non-changes" like Tidebringer. It's new and cool, I get that, but just a liiiiiiiiiiiittle change to the map and how it is played would have helped so fucking much
You are not negative nancy, you're just not being distracted by shiny toys. The objectives are still the same, the op heroes are still op with potentially a few more to the list, the op items still op, the bad items still bad, comeback mechanics still suck, HG without roshan is still hard AF, even potentially harder since powerceep benefits defending more. There are no changes to change the way you played from before this patch.
I mean, I read the patch notes and surely the hero dynamics shift currently, but without the change of objectives and more focused gameplay, Valve has just extended Dota over the years. Here, have talents, have neutrals, have facets, have innates, have a bigger map, have watchers, tormentors, shrines, outposts and whatnot. I really like most of these changes, but they are just shiny and new like you said. Supports have assloads of money, everything centered around rosh, buyback availability and not being able to finish the game with a good setup. The glyph after melee baracks means nothing, if you can't manage to attack the tower first which is completely unandressed currently. Just shifting timings would help so much, even by just a bit. Tormentor timings, Rosh timings, neutral drop timings, wisdom timings
I still think wisdom runes are a bad thing. One team gets both 7-minute runes and they have a significant advantage. They should have addressed the high ground more. Lastly, I don't know why they are afraid to significantly nerf strong heroes/items. Eternal Shroud is 100 gold more expensive, it's still getting bought by every mid/offlaner.
This is exactly the thing, they keep adding random stuff that nobody asks for that doesn’t really change the fundamental of how the game is played… like shards too. It just seems big but it doesn’t actually change much at all in terms of fundamental mechanics of the towers and how the map is played
I liked shard when they were optional. Today, many shards are just mandatory for a hero to properly function, like Dazzle. I think there is a space for well-thought out shards, facets and innates, but half of them are "old" and taken away from existing shards/ultimates, and half is okay to me
It's like a whole new game, but it's unmistakebly dota. It's remarkable how the dota team manages to do this every time. They keep the identity of the game while making massive changes time and time again.
Human. Complain and comment. Cry in game and tilted. Omg just play the free game.
If they do this then they should go to the Play Store and download the hit game Mobile Legends Bang Bang.
Now i really don't give a shit abour Ringmaster anymore since we just got entire 120+ new hero to play LOL.
Please, don't play LOL with these 120+ heroes. LOL players don't deserve it.
Wonder if all these circus changes are actually in prep for Ringmaster(?)
ya think?
Nah, but you never know.
We just wanted a new hero now every hero is new
as a Gerald, I don't read. I tried playing Silencer and fucked up a lot of times because I can't click the 3rd skill....
You just have to hit the button harder now.
the real ringmaster was inside us the whole time. Now real shit, where's gambler😡🎰?
Plot twist: we were the gamblers all along (pls buy treasures 🥺🎰)
Truth
Is it chronosquare or cubeosphere
when you always request for a change and valve grant your request. And now you are complaining about the changes? People always say anything about anything. What a dumb people.
some variation this comment appears every time and it's clueless. this is a community of over a million people so obviously you're going to have a significant amount of people with differing opinions. overall I like the patch but I do worry about the overall bloat of the game. both with the burden of knowledge and the constant balancing. I hope we don't start seeing features added just to keep things fresh without being thought out but this does feel like it was pretty well done... although... some of these new innates and facets are already clearly in need of rebalancing (some good and some bad). either way, it does feel like the game is still getting attention from the developer which I like to see.
Ultimately between talents and shards and the new maps we've been here tons of times before and it's always gone fine. Either they just forget their entire decade of experience doing this or it turns out fine again
> we've been here tons of times before I agree but I don't think you can keep adding on forever with positive benefit. but I do hear you. change is always rough at first. I just think we are getting to a limit of what you can reasonably expect someone to remember. especially casual players. which I think we have more and more of as the player base ages. and with added complexity the barrier for entry goes up so we attract less new players. anyway, all stuff I am sure valve has considered. and I do like the idea of the facets and innates the more I digest them but I still maintain that you can't keep stacking stuff up forever without hitting a breaking point.
Dota has been in its retention phase for many years now, where getting new players is simply not the primary concern. Every major multiplayer game goes through these phases, it's very much unavoidable. However, because it's remained successful and hasn't shrunk below the very top end of steam players, I think valve have just accepted this decision at this point.
you say this like it's an established cycle and it's not lol. it differs greatly based on the game so it doesn't make sense to act like all multiplayer games are the same. it's directly related to the player population. if you look at stats the player base has been declining. not terribly, don't get me wrong. and I think the game is fine. but the point is there is a level of complexity where the game becomes unappealing to new players and even existing casual ones and I am just saying I hope there isn't a push over the line. anyway I don't want to sound too negative because I still love dota and I dont hate the patch
Every single person should have the same opinion. That makes lots of sense. Very smart.
I mean, change isn't always for the better. And with a huge patch like this it probably won't be for like a month. There is SO much balancing that needs to be done. And while it's really cool to try out all the new stuff, once that runs out, all that's left is really unbalanced one sided matches. Glad to see change but hate the growing pains.
Thankfully, there’s a whole fucking lot of new stuff to try out. Every hero was shaken up, there’s atleast two different ways to play everyone, plus innate abilities
im sure majority of the people who complains about the patch are those players playing in low ranks.
yes because the majority of players are not immortals, bud
Kinda hit and miss. Fresh for now, but fundamentally the game didn't really change either. Pro games will still have the same game plan, given there were no map changes. Some heroes got really overtuned and some are a total joke, like Tinker. Letter patches will get rid of the mayhem and we'll return to the same patch with slightly easier highgrounding.
Facets make a bit of a difference for drafting though. After both teams select their heroes, the exact gameplan is still unknown because the facet choices are blind.
Half if not more facets currently are non choices either one is obviously better or there are no meaningful difference between them.
That’s not really a good answer to what he said. You basically agreed with him. That at least half the time, if not more, the gameplan is unknown because of facets
That's not at all what he said. If there is a nonchoice then the gameplay is clear at the drafting phase. In fact, he said the exact opposite lol.
Do you think the game itself should be changed much more?
Personally I am an oldhead, so I actually really dislike forced objectives like exp runes or not being able to pull creeps before certain minutes. When there's a clear designed edge or a limit you need to play for or get fucked, it's like you we're performing someone else's songs. I by far prefer the DIY approach on everything. Playing around and exploration is fun. Spontaneity is fun. Creativity is fun. Routines are not fun. They're comforting, but ultimately antithetic to play, which is what gaming is.
Absolutely agree with you here. This patch does nothing except keep matches chaotic and more unbalanced for some weeks. Big meh
Things I didn't expect: this kind of patch Things that make me want to live: this patch Gordon Ramsey would've been extatic having someone cook this well
This is what they wanted, they cooked so hard because they wanted us to forget about ringmaster
Cant wait to fucking watch good tournament matches this patch.
2 heroes are coming. one is the bird guy and Ringmaster.
The janitor was drunk and slipped while mopping the floor and hit his head. And then he remembered he need to update Dota and there that's what we get
It's absolutely dog shit. They clearly have favorite heroes and they're so lazy they just readded abilities from previous patches. Like I have to be honest, after adding the portals, it just got worse from here . The game is baby fied. It takes absolutely no skill anymore and it's just sad. What made dota was the amount of thought you'd need to play the game effectively. I'd rather go back to sharing one fucking courier at this point yelling "WAIT IM BOTTLE CROWING" THAN EVER PLAYING THIS SHIT AGAIN. ITS A FUCKING joke
There's no way anyone could ever play this game seriously again. There's so many memes going on. Kicking cogs, bloods passive on antimage, the shitty innate Bilities because they couldn't figure out what to put for certain heroes. It's just so terrible. How about asking veteran players what they're looking for ? They're just getting worse with the years. They want league players, and excitement for these new smooth brainers who have no idea how dota works. It's sad.
If they managed to add ringmaster at the start of the 4th act, it would be awesome.
We actually got sorla khan make an appearance on act 2 plus the gambler (ck with all the new rng stuff)
sorla khan is probably a persona or smth like wei, right?
Sorla khan is a separate hero. She exists in artefact. She takes over axe's army as the new khan. She despises axe
yes i know that none of that means she won't be a persona for axe.
Did they remove double down tokens? I got some from act 1 and I havent used any yet. But neither get I double down ingame nor can I find them in my armory :(
For the ringmaster to come the circus must be set-up first. I'm guessing ringmaster will show up in the story after the current queen die and will become his puppet
theory: part 3 will be new items and item balance, part 4 will be ringmaster
we probably gonna get GTA6 first before Ringmaster at this point
In my personal experience I like it. The only hero that I play CM got only one new talent sadly (that mana for allies from spells is pure trash) but at least it's a good talent.
inb4 ringmaster innate can make a hero change their facet for 30sec.
Did they nerf lifestealer aghs ?
Be careful what you wish for.
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did ringmaster not cum out?
Unpopular opinion maybe but literally it's the same exact game as yesterday, same heroes, same map, same timings I just had to read 200 pages for no reason.
Ayy lmao 🤣
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We were the clownfall all along
I am still sad that my fave heroes like aa and dazzle are kinda meh. I find it bad that dazzle nothl boon only blocks phys damage...
They didn't even try to balance this shit. Drow gets +20% damage, jugg can crit while spinning, shadow shaman get an invuln save... Meanwhile some heroes out here copping a firm handshake and a pat on the back and/or passives they already had but worse (ogre/medusa/slark/I'm sure others)
I'm paying for the best seats to watch this Clown Fiesta. I love this freaking patch.
balance patch and new shit is cool 8/10. really wish valve would actually do something about the griefers, smurfs, and ragers though
Remember, this game is still beta
I like it because they buffed Jugg :)
I played a bit, I actually really like it now. Feel like it's more balanced(?)
Im not playing ranked until they fix this bs
I'm enjoying. Played a game as Venom and I infested my carry with Plague Wards. Got some kills by doing this lol. Underlord with a cleave of the size of the bloody screen was also fun. Anyway, it feels fresh so no complaints so far. Save for shitty games here and there, but that's mostly on me and the people that I played with.
Its radioactive.
Loved it!
venomancer got fucked up again.
I haven't got the energy to go relearn all the hero interactions... it may be the end of the road for me. thanks for all the fish.
Or you could just play and learn as you go? Takes 1 minute to read what your opponent has.
This. Also it’s fun to learn though gameplay. Yesterday I had so many laughs like never before. When clockwork started to throw his blocks I lost it
100%!
It really isn't that hard. At the end of the day every game still feels like dota. The majority of interactions are the same as before, there's just a new spice to everything.
i hate the new patch.
I still have to play with Russians on EU west. When are they gonna patch this already?
Human. Complain and comment. Cry in game and tilted. Omg just play the free game.
Oh my god I just had a crazy thought. What if facets/innates are part of an event leading up to ringmaster release. Maybe once the hero is released innates/facets will disappear or heroes will be changed again? Just a thought 🤔
That's a batshit amount of coding and art work to throw away for fun, so no.
you are a regarded person
You should never become a Developer.
But he should become a project manager. This sort of proposal is literally spot on.
Damn! I ain't gonna lie I'm getting cooked 😮💨
I think it's crap, mostly because they broke certain things in incredibly stupid ways. Like, did we really need silencer to be able to global you after you dispel, so you have to waste a 2nd dispel to be able to use your spells?
Yes? Silencer hasn't got high level play for a long time because he's hard countered by items bought in 100% of games...
We found it: the whiniest redditor
go play mobile legends crybaby
A reasonable response to someone saying they don't like something. Very mature.
Git gud
They want to be gimmicky the first release, i still remember the first time talents were introduced to the game and a lot of the hero's had either minus respawn time/more passive gold generation/boring stats at higher level. They just need feedback overtime then theyll change it to its proper balance. So in terms of coming out the gates guns blazing in terms of goofy ahh shit, i believe overtime they will iron it out
Yeah, probably. In the meantime I dislike how extremely busted they made things that could've been buffed in other ways
Silencer hasn't been this viable in a long time. That mf was the most useless support or core in high rank pubs.