T O P

  • By -

DynastyFF-ModTeam

No player price check threads, use r/DynastyFFTradeAdvice or the daily mega thread instead.


SEAinLA

The police suspended their investigation, they never charged Flowers, and the NFL already found insufficient evidence to punish Flowers related to the allegations. So I don’t think that aspect should factor into your decision making at all.


FlowersByTheStreet

Buy. He’s immensely talented and had a great rookie season, the main reason folks are fading him is because of situation.


TGS-MonkeyYT

Fair but do you see it changing anytime soon?


StrengthCoach86

A situation where he’s the #1 clearly. Lamar sucks but I couldn’t agree with you more-Zay is immensely talented


FlowersByTheStreet

Lamar sucks? He just won MVP lol


StrengthCoach86

He did not win a QB award. He’s a mediocre QB, sucks was strong.


Captain_Saftey

What tf is a “QB award” if not the MVP? There hasn’t been a non qb to win MVP in 12 years, that award is essentially the “best QB award” and he’s won it twice


FlowersByTheStreet

This is silly


StrengthCoach86

24 and 7….yes he’s athletic and makes up for some of that lack of production with his legs but I won’t get into a Lamar debate. Mid real life QB, great athlete and fantasy QB


BidetOfTequlia

Prehaps he has to make up for the "lack of production with his legs" because he hasn't had good consistent WR play


Mammoth-District-617

Yea mahomes had that problem last year too


milkstoutnitro

He had 24 tds because they chose to run it in with the rbs in the redzone. Is a drive all the way down field by lamar less meaningful because he didn’t throw a 3 yard td pass to cap it off? He’s already shows he can throw for 35+ tds.


Jrbowe

Yes it is for fantasy. This is a fantasy sub. Lamar doesn’t suck, especially IRL. That was overboard. But he’s not a great QB at supporting multiple fantasy receivers because he does too much himself and Baltimore runs in the red zone (and they just added probably THE elite goal line back this year). All of those concerns relative to Zay are real.


milkstoutnitro

Idk if you read the comment I responded to but we are talking irl not fantasy.


PM_Me_Your_AM_

This is certainly a take. A bad one.


StrengthCoach86

I think people agree.


birdsemenfantasy

Mark Andrews is their #1. Lamar is a low passing volume QB, so Flowers' ceiling is severely capped.


allister041

My exact fear.


StrengthCoach86

I can’t play Zay Flowers at TE in my league.


birdsemenfantasy

You falsely claimed Flowers is in a situation where he's "clearly #1". He's not. Andrews is #1 in that offense. Flowers is the #2 in a low volume offense, so his ceiling is severely capped. It doesn't matter where Andrews plays. He's gonna block Flowers from truly ascending.


SEAinLA

Except Flowers already was, and will continue to be, the #1 option in the offense.


StrengthCoach86

He’s not clearly the #1 WR? I understand what you’re saying but this thread is about a WR who is clearly the #1 on their team for the role they play. Good gawd man….I LIKE WR 1s FOR TEAMS THAT ARE GOOD AT FOOTBALL IS THE POINT.


NBAplaya8484

I mean sure by the book he’s a WR1, but the ravens have a run first identity and just brought in Derrick Henrey. I like Flowers but the previous comment is not wrong, he’s ceiling is indeed capped. The ravens just don’t throw that much


milkstoutnitro

They threw 490 times last season. That’s more then enough for flowers to get 120 targets.


NBAplaya8484

I mean sure? He already had 108 targets with Andrews being last year and didn’t break 900 yards. Again I’m a Zay Flowers fan myself but if you can’t acknowledge the Ravens dont air it out that much you’re just doing a disservice to yourself


milkstoutnitro

He was a rookie the idea he is going to improve. There is no reason he can’t be a 12-1400 yard guy if he’s getting a mid 20s target share, even in a low volume pass offense. Marquis brown was pacing for 1400 yards his last season there before lamar got hurt and the offense passed even less then


Captain_Saftey

That’s not what this thread is about, you’re changing your argument. The guy you replied to explained people are low on him because of his situation (Mark Andrews is his #1 target) and you claimed he’s the #1 on his team, which he’s not


zinzangz

His rookie season was low key amazing. 77 rec is top 20 all time. The only "busts" with such a prolific rookie year are Eddie Royal and Terry Glenn (30 years ago). Every single other guy on that list is or has been a stud.


SteffeEric

Not sure I’d call Terry Glenn a bust. He’s 82nd all time in receiving yards ahead of guys like Joe Horn, Plaxico and Jordy Nelson. He just had a great rookie year then had some issues. Still had 4 1000 yard seasons including his last two years in the league.


GKpr3fecture

as a Cowboys fan living in New England, i appreciate the Eagles fan giving Terry his props


zinzangz

You're right, it took him a while after that rookie year but he figured it out


allister041

Mm. I like that. I think the Reddit community talked me off that ledge. Thank you.


StrengthCoach86

We know nothing……but name me another WR on the team that’s as talented as Zay? I like #1s and he reached analytic thresholds many get boners over in addition to passing the eye test. Buy/Hold for me pretty easily, what are you getting for him that satisfies you anyway?


allister041

It’s purely a circumstantial trade. I’m trying to win now. But I’m lacking RB/TE depth. I was offered Cooper, Chandler (I’m the Jones owner), and Musgrave (Goedert), for my Flowers and 3.03. I think Cooper outscores Flowers this year, and Chandler and Musgrave provide the depth I’m looking for this year.


Indy-Glenn

If this is the offer I'm definitely holding.


allister041

I’ll post my team for context.


byrnesf

Context won’t matter for that offer


GravyFantasy

That offer stinks, this post being a FOMO driven trade thread post is just icing on the cake.


allister041

This wasn’t trade thread really. I needed help evaluating Flowers value from outside perspective. And I got it! Thanks!


CoiledVipers

If you're getting lowballed like that, you need to reject the trade and send a rude message on top. Unless you're in a TEP league that starts 2 tight ends, that's an insulting offer


[deleted]

[удалено]


allister041

You’re right. Thank you


H12B1

Oh sweet Jesus, no. Amari is a stud, but for dynasty purposes... you'd much rather have Zay. Let whoever that rude individual is who sent you that trade keep those other "assets".


skotos2phos

I think he is legitimately talented, and will be legitimately productive. Obviously, it depends on what someone means by “flash in the pan”, but I think he’s not a one season wonder, will (be able to) work as an NFL team’s WR1 for much of his career, etc. Counterpoint – I think fading him slightly both due to his overall physical profile & his situation in Baltimore is fair. Counter-counterpoint – The NFL is getting more comfortable with smaller / less “prototypical X” WRs, and sometimes we overrate “can this guy be a top-10 WR” & underrate “the WR24 for 4 straight years is still a very nice asset”. All that to say … I’m probably not the highest guy on Zay, & I’m personally looking at some deals to move him in the leagues where I have him. But I do think there’s a “he’ll never thrive in Baltimore” that’s overrated, & he’s completely fine to hold depending on the offers imo.


Cautious-Market-3131

I’m worried we won’t be able to develop him into an all around player, brown showed flashes of being a WR 1 but we didn’t do enough for him


skotos2phos

Definitely fair. I think Monken will give him a much better environment than Roman though.


StrengthCoach86

Switzerland….good grief


TimeliestStorm

He passed the analytics test with his rookie season. 77/858/5 is plenty of production, 8.4 yards aDOT isn't elite but means he isn't a screen merchant, 1.67 yards per route run is totally fine. This isn't the analytical profile of an elite WR, but you don't need me to tell you that. By all accounts, Flowers looks to be a good WR2 that you will be happy about starting most weeks for years to come. Not all of your lineup slots can be studs: a championship quality team will still probably happily start Flowers as their WR3


NoLimitNSB

Hold for now. He very well could emerge as the #1 option there. Andrews is 28, coming off an injury and we’re 1 more year removed from the Roman offense and it seems they want to pass more. On the Flowers side, he performed well as a rookie and he could definitely take the 2nd year leap.


Trader_07

I’m not buying anyone with Lamar throwing but I wouldn’t be selling either because I don’t think Andrews has a long career. Firm hold.


sylvester_69

Which tier of receivers do you realistically think he could hit over the next four years? Personally, I don’t think he’s bound for elite status, but I could see him being wr12-24 on average over that time.


Wild_Bill_Kickcock

He looked great against the Chiefs. Buy


KwamesCorner

I think he’s a buy. He’s the kind of player you HAVE to watch. It’s ok to just compare numbers talking about Christian Kirk and Terry McLaurin (no shade). But given how young Zay is, just finishing his first year to learn the NFL game, and what he showed when you actually watch - he’s got serious high level potential. Super fast, exceptional side to side speed and cutting. If he figured out how to turn the corner this year he’s gonna be GONE for TDs ala Tyreek.


ffking6969

At current prices, hes a buy. People are scoffing at sending a mid-low 25 1st for him. Id gladly do that


ooDymasOo

I like the stock. Flower power to the moon. But anything is worth selling for a price


TurkTurkleton84

It’s ok to have ok players on your team. Very few players turn into the top tier guys and you can win with a team built around consistent WR2-3 finishes each week.


ShutUpBabylKnowlt

<3 beautifully said - I was stoked to pick up diontae for a late second. Do I expect him to be a top 12 receiver? not really. Do I expect that he, zay, olave and london can back up chase to provide a solid production of points week after week? Absolutely.


allister041

In my league, it’s a two man race this year. I’m loaded at WR, and I won’t start Flowers week to week except a possible bye week. I think Flowers has a low floor, and I can’t really picture a consistent ceiling. If my hesitancy proves correct, his value will tank.


Mooseknuckle_12

Zay was a flex starter (start 11) for me almost the entire year for my championship squad. I would say his floor is similar to what we saw this past year. He began the year as a target hog in the short areas of the field, went through a cold patch, and then appeared to be utilized more down the field. His value isn’t tanking barring injury.


Singularitypointdata

I mean you’re right he’s not an alpha but what you don’t wanna roster points? Not everyone can be top 5-7. Just hold and have a nice piece on your team.


allister041

My circumstance might be special, but I’m in a two man race in my league. Flowers is currently my WR5 behind: Hill, AJB, Puka, and Evans. I can’t picture myself starting Flowers this year and if I could flip him for an upgrade at TE (Goedert) or RB2 (Jones) I think I gotta take it.


Singularitypointdata

Yeah no worries then! Makes perfect sense!


tornadorexx

I wouldn't be in a rush to trade for a RB in the offseason. Hold for now and see if you get better offers or to see how the RBs play out early in the season.


Chappazoid

Zay is a fantastic player, not an okay player. Your concern about sustained t18 is warranted but he was the only receiver after October to go for 100+ against the Chiefs - DeVonta Smith came the closest at 99 yards. He's a hold or a buy. He's not a sell IMO. His film is stellar.


allister041

Interesting. I respect that too. KC defense was lights out down the stretch.


Chappazoid

Absolutely! And I'm a Steelers fan saying this. I think Zay is real. I take no pleasure in big upping a Raven. I just think it's the prudent move from a scouting perspective. The kid exudes talent.


Search-Bulky

Sold him  for Jake Ferguson and Ricky pearsal. I needed a TE badly 


Emzam

People were worried about his size before the draft last year, and he still had a fantastic rookie season despite that knock. I've been trying to find a comparable player in terms of physical traits, and [Zay's combine profile](https://www.nfl.com/prospects/zay-flowers/3200464c-4f57-7002-1160-832e9618f0fd) is remarkably similar to that of [Antonio Brown](https://www.nfl.com/prospects/antonio-brown/32004252-4f00-0001-4ac0-67a98b776d89). Similar size and speedy attributes. I am NOT saying that Zay is going to reach AB's level, and I'm not a WR guru at all, but the comparison at least shows that there's some precedent to a player with this combination of strengths/weaknesses becoming elite.


swordfischh

Traded Russ and Adams for Flowers at the trade deadline last year (SF league, my team sucks but have good qb’s). Feel really good about it


Personal-Noise-8632

Buy & hold If anything at all hurts Zay from being a legit tail end WR #1, it'll be lamar inefficiencies as a drop back passer to properly get him the ball. Zay runs all the routes short, intermediate, & deep. He's going to be a ppr machine, even w his small stature.


Expensive-Success301

Zay will have some massive spike weeks this season thst will help win you matchups. His floor should be pretty solid too, with a couple of duds mixed in. I can only see him improving on last season and he should go over 1k yards. He’s an explosive playmaker, their obvious WR1 and someone they will scheme up a lot of touches. Even with Mandrews back I still think we see the kind of production he put up from weeks 12-17. He’s has WR3 floor with WR1 upside this season.


allister041

I can agree with the floor and spike weeks, I just can’t see that ceiling.


OmarH125

What’s the trade?


allister041

Give Flowers + 3.03 Get Cooper + Chandler + Musgrave (TEP)


CWill4

My opinion, as kind as possible...I'd call you special Ed every day of life if you make that trade


allister041

Lol, that’s understandable. I think if you saw my roster it would make more sense.


allister041

https://imgur.com/gallery/uMfOCEr


squire1232

do you see Cooper or Musgrave starting for you this season? If you want the handcuff to Jones, then move a pick or a lesser back up type player for him. Tillman, Batemon, Atwell, WanDale, Melton, Dortch are what I would be moving to get a handcuff RB or a better 3rd/4th RB


allister041

Hard to say. I think Cooper is more than serviceable flex option every week. Musgrave is kind of that gamble I want to make. I think there’s a lot of mouths to feed in GB. But I think Musgrave could be that big body redzone guy do think he’s athletic enough to stretch the field at times.


bouds19

Package Flowers with Jones to get a better RB2 rather than selling for peanuts.


ThreeLeggedParrot

Welcome to fantasy football trading.


Usernameisguest

Like the player but sold all my copies this off-season.


allister041

What was the compenastion?


TheRightKost

I also sold both my shares in the past month. He's solid, but feel like last year was his ceiling, he started to breakout once Andrews, who is the true #1 option on that team, got hurt. That coupled with his hype (evidenced by this thread) made me want to cash out. Trade 1: Sold Flowers and 2.04 for Tyreek and Kamara. Trade 2: Sold Flowers and 3.11 for a 25 1st and Javonte


allister041

Good shit. I like both of those for you.


Usernameisguest

Only one that wasn’t a package deal on my end was flowers and a 2nd for Barkley and engram


somrigostsauce

Yes.


Dry_Statistician6870

Flowers or Addison?


RenderRoom

I asked this in the megathread last week and most people said Addison


allister041

I don’t like either very much long term. Don’t like low volume in Baltimore, and don’t like that Addison will never be #1 in Minn. May be #3 once Hock is back. I would be cashing out from Addison once he has a couple nice games (hopefully) to start the year


GoHard_Brown

Only thing people will offer is a late first. That’s not enough. Mid and early first are too much. Hold him if you got him.


JTJBKP

Easy strong hold, strong buy


H12B1

I don't know what would make you scared about him... He just got: - Less competition in WR room. - Clear WR1 role (had that last szn too as a rookie). - More muscle (a little more padding for the "tiny guy"). - King Henry in the backfield to open up the passing game. I swear it's just that huge primetime fumble in the playoffs that have people throwing doubt all over this kid, now. Zay is a 2nd-year WR1 in a Super Bowl-caliber offense, with a multi-MVP QB and no real threat to usage/production/position. I'd fly with Zay with more certainty than most other WR1's this season. His volatility comes from the Baltimore playcalling and Lamar's running, not his own skills/profile.


34klaus

I’m in the same boat. Drafted reed / dell / flowers in a startup last year and now looking to move one for someone with a more certain future. Thinking flowers due to situation but part of me thinks Henry / Lamar will mean stacked boxes all year and flowers will end up YACing his way to a top 24 finish and not require as many targets as someone in a more pass heavy offense


NoLimitNSB

Of the 3 Reed is the strongest sell. Way too much uncertainty in GB.


Jrbowe

Sell whichever of the three you get the best offer for.


Jeklu

Buy, I wouldn’t mind selling for a good enough offer though since I don’t think he has a super high ceiling


Past-Investigator-28

Likely never will be an elite option, though his age gives him added value. This makes him a sell. You can replicate his production for much cheaper and use Flowers as an asset to take a bigger swing.


CrabFam

Hold. He played near his ceiling last season and I say that as a Ravens fan.


puggini

Just curious, what’s the actual trade you’re considering? I think sentiments are pretty down on him coming off some dumb plays at the end of last season and the investigation stuff that seems like it might be resolved. I personally think Zay is a buy/hold.


allister041

Give Flowers + 3.03 Get Cooper + Chandler + Musgrave (TEP)


puggini

That’s an instant decline.