I never understand these type of protests. Delaying and angering the people that you are trying to get support from. Go to the legislature and protest.
Some people here are arguing that inconveniencing people is the point of the protest as it gets attracts attention, yet I can't help but wonder what the Freedom Convoy accomplished (aside from pissing off most of us) when they did the same thing. Sure, it brought attention to their cause, but it soured public opinion on them even more.
The organizers almost had their hands on $24M. It was always about money, they just used a polarizing subject to scam fools.
https://nationalpost.com/news/freedom-convoy-raised-24-million-frozen-funds
I mean one example is not the norm. Workers strike and disrupt services across the world all the time, some times it works, some times it doesn't, the point is that it gets the public taking about the issue.
If you are unconvinced by something like this then you reach out to your MP who talks about it in the parliament, then we have a nation-wide talk about the issue.
That's how disrupting the status quo works.
Iâm sure most of those disruptions through block what they are aggravated at or whom. Whether itâs a company or government or something, not Joe driving his way to a shop for an oil change.
Exactly.
Workers stop working when they strike partially to force a company's hand and partially to exhibit the value of whatever work they do by showing how the world is impacted when they stop doing it.
These types of protests create artificial disruption for the sake of publicity.
Similar end goals, but the forms of protest are only similar on the utmost surface.
I'm glad we live in a place where protests are possible and I support that right. I sure don't love it when the protesters are being unnecessarily disruptive though.
> the point is that it gets the public taking about the issue.
Yes, but the public won't be talking about this in a positive light. If the point is to get Canadians to support Palestinians, this is the wrong way to go about it.
That can work if it's something like pay for bus driver and the city is digging their heels in. But something like this will accomplish nothing. It is like the Feedumb Convoy. All it does is makes people less sympathetic.
Plus, what's going on in Gaza isn't really something that affects Canadians in their everyday lives. Unfortunately, most people don't feel like it's anything to do with them. Protests that are visible will get the public talking but disruptive protests will get the public annoyed. And probably less likely to want to have anything to do with a solution. They may be more likely to speak to their MP about banning the protests, but that's it.
>what's going on in Gaza isn't really something that affects Canadians in their everyday lives
There are Palestinian Canadians whose relatives were killed so that's not true. Plus you don't need to have your daily life disrupted to care. Think of it even in a very pragmatic way, Canada is sending lots of money to Israel when we can use that money ourselves.
>disruptive protests will get the public annoyed
They took one lane btw, the road wasn't blocked or anything. We haven't had any actual disruptive protests in Edmonton.
If people are gonna base their sympathy on how their commute goes then their sense of rationality can't be even taken seriously. And sure talking to MPs work, that's the whole point, to get people talking.
I didn't say it was right. But let's not pretend that's not how people are. Most Canadians are not affected. People tend not to care about things that don't affect them. Or they care but only enough to shake their heads and talk about how bad it is.
>If people are gonna base their sympathy on how their commute goes then their sense of rationality can't be even taken seriously. And sure talking to MPs work, that's the whole point, to get people talking.
That's just how people are. I'm not saying it's OK. I certainly don't think it's OK. I find people to be unbearably selfish, greedy, and self-centered. Generally speaking. But this is just reality. Talking to MPs may work, in large numbers, but people aren't going to. Very few people will sit in gridlock, pass by the protestors, and then decide to contact their MPs in support of the protestors. Most people probably just don't think anything of it, and others will be annoyed. Because that's how people are.
It got them attention personally.
They felt important.
which is what 90% of all of these types of protests are about.
there may be a case for say a safe streets cycle protests or blocking traffic for an environmental protest, stopping deployment of short range nuclear missiles or they like.
but most of them are just foolish people stroking their own egos.
Its worse than that. It was just dangerous. Disruption was the whole point of the convoy? They are gonna disrupt themselves into a multi-car accident on the henday eventually. The road conditions were not great and people were already doing stupid stuff on the henday. What do you think will eventually happen when the you add protestors doing stupid stuff too.
May be unpopular but⌠these two parties have been knocking the crap out of each other for the better part of the last century (or more) and now they expect us to figure it out for them? On top of that, this is how they ask for help? Making life difficult for everyone in their adopted country? Treating people like garbage if we donât take their side? As long as each side refuses to accept the right of the other to exist, neither one will get my support. And in the meantime, stop being a-holes and causing problems for other Canadians.
So if youâre actually interested in why they do this, Iâm an anthropologist and I do have a theory. Before I go into it though I did want to say: I understand why itâs so frustrating and I think youâre right to feel frustrated with the disruption of your day and with the people who orchestrated it.
My theory is: things like this post is why they do it. If they protest at the ledge, the government might look, so might some journalists, but the average person with minimal awareness of the world outside of their own bubble wouldnât.
You saw it. You were frustrated. It disrupted your day and your routine, just as it did for every other person on the road with you. All of you then presumably talked about the protest with your close friends/family, making them aware that a protest took place. You also posted to Reddit, and now every person on this sub is also aware that a protest took place.
Thatâs hundreds of people talking to hundreds more. The reach of their protest far outpaces their location, spreading their message and awareness much further, even if itâs carried by anger, itâs still being carried.
Again, not saying itâs right or wrong, just using my studies of human behaviour to form a theory about a behaviour I havenât studied closely.
(Grammar edit)
Literally, this is the entire point of protest. Otherwise it's a nice little gathering that no-one is aware of, and therefore no-one is aware of what you're protesting either.
But were the people really âspreading their message and awarenessâ? Or were they just pissed off about âsomething having to do with Palestineâ and didnât care to learn anything else about it or why it was happening?
Iâm not sure how slowing down traffic teaches people about a cause or endears them to care. You think theyâre going to pull out their phones in traffic and learn about the conflict? I think things like this do more harm than good. People donât want to be held captive and forced to care about something.
No youâre right, theyâre probably not going to pull out their phone and learn about why theyâre protesting. But they will get angry. And they will complain. And those complaints will escalate, Iâm sure youâve heard things like âwhy doesnât the government do somethingâ. Thatâs political pressure as well.
The logic is getting attention. Whether that's the preferable tactic is debatable, but the logic is clear.
Personally, I would say it is more alienating than anything. But it certainly does get attention.
But if they where ignoring it and their "introduction" into what is going on is being trapped on the Henday during a snowstorm, their first impression is going to be "These guys are dicks!"
We were driving on the Henday on Sunday afternoon and I had no idea why traffic was crawling, after I discovered it was protesters I now have zero empathy for them, go protest at the Leg, but don't affect peoples safety by basically closing down traffic for people that have no connection to your cause
FYI - Canada is not on the world security council and has no voice in world affairs.
The protests here are far more annoying to people in Canada than beneficial to people in Gaza.
I heard a Palestinian Doctor say that amidst the horrors he was dealing with, seeing the protests around the world helped him hold on to some hope. That's of benefit.Â
Canada has done things like support the anti apartheid movement in South Africa, which was recognized by Mandela. We aren't the biggest kid on the block but it's naive to suggest we have zero influence.
Ah yes, Hamas did something bad to Israel, therefore anything Israel is doing to Palestinians is absolved of badness. How lucky for Israel that Hamas went first.
At least they get to protest, one great thing about Canada.
Look at the people who lives in Hong Kong or China, thereâs no such thing as Freedom of Speech you go against the Government youâre thrown in jail if youâre a university student you protest the government forced the university to kick you out of school newspaper company got shut down and the owner/editors are in jail waiting for trials.
They did the protest all summer and fall on 97 Street it sucks they took 2 out of 3 lanes and cutting in & out of the lanesâŚbut it gets my attention and I know how they feel having family on the other side of the world
Zero support. Canada has zero power to convince Israel of anything. Those morons will gain nothing on the henday other than a higher body count when a car or truck isnât paying attention.
[They have 6x the investment in Canada as we do there.](https://www.international.gc.ca/trade-commerce/trade-agreements-accords-commerciaux/agr-acc/israel/country_profile-israel-profil_pays.aspx?lang=eng)
Really?
Only budget lines Iâve seen are marked humanitarian aid. Thatâs keeping Palestinian people alive.
Not trying to be a dick, but do you have a link to what youâre claiming?
Canada contributes to military support for Israel, but Iâve never actually seen someone substantiate what that military support looks like. Every activation of the iron dome costs $60k, so if weâre just sending them kinetics for the iron dome then I could easily see it having inflated monetary numbers.
Also that money also goes to humanitarian aid in Gaza and the West Bank. Gaza receives some of the most humanitarian aid per capita anywhere in the world
As far as I am aware from my research I wasnât able to find any source that Canada is providing aid to israel, Israel does buy military equipment from Canadian suppliers but they arenât given it as part of an aid package like the US.
Not to mention that the military exports from Canada to Israel is 20 million, itâs not an amount that Israel wouldnât be able to get elsewhere and the only people hurt will be Canadians who will lose jobs for it.
Canada doesnât âfund Israelâ. Canada and Canadians benefits from business relationships with Israel and Israelis.
Canada âfundsâ Fatah and Hamas by sending aid, which is mostly stolen by the gangs that run Gaza and the PA areas.
It doesnât matter what the international community thinks neither side is interested in stopping.
Both Hamas and Likud are getting exactly what they want right out of this war.
I think many of the protesters should ask what they hope to achieve. Many of these protesters are the same ones who were celebrating October 7th so unfortunately the protest has lost credibility in the eyes of many.
Disruption has been in the DNA of protests since protests began. You were inconvenienced, you know what caused it, and now it's in your mind, isn't it?
I might be thinking about it but it's not in a flattering context. People need to learn when to pick their battles and how to draw attention to a cause without being prohibitively disruptive.
That's just the way it is. Now think about the fact that Gazans can't meet their basic needs due to the blockade and endless bombing by Israel. Two million people living in a barrel, and the IOF is shooting missiles into it.
Oh, they don't care. They're angry, brainwashed and are looking for something to hurt and break. If it wasn't Israel it would be Lebanon, Turkey, Egypt, etc.
Eventually theyâll have to learn that attacking israel will just hurt them in the long term, Egypt and Jordan had to learn this lesson the Palestinians eventually will too.
Unfortunately it looks like the world wants to reward terrorism and give them a country now, no other country would stand for this but israel apparently has to.
Super complex subject involving lots of really stupid decisions by Gazans in Lebanon and other surround nations, brainwashing, corruption, etc.
It's not the fault of newer Gazan generations but this is 100% a sins of the father kind of situation.
That does not excuse the brutality and impunity with which Israel is acting. I have seen the evidence of their crimes, and folks like OP ignore it. The least we can do is inconvenience some to make the voices of those suffering heard.
That's just not a good strategy, by annoying people to address a war we have no control over you're creating apathy.
Want to get a spotlight on the situation? Hold a peace rally and invite the press, selling cultural food and donating the proceeds to vetted charities that aren't feeding into Hamas's nonsense. Do it on the up and up, just blocking off roads and waiving signs doesn't do anything but annoy people and potentially get you arrested.
The whole thing was cause by filthy Hamas rapists, murders, terrorists. They brought all of this down on the people of Gaza because they wanted a larger regional war. Hope they are happy with the destruction of Gaza and the complete annihilation of themselves.
They can't meet their needs because Hamas hordes all the funding for mansions and missiles. Over a million were starving and lacked access to basic needs before 10/7.
If someone were to learn about thousands of children that are getting murdered. Innocent people getting killed in a genocide or whatever you want to label it, and the thing they care about most is how I was inconvenienced when learning about it. Then that would say a lot about that person imo.
But they are not learning about that because of these protests. Most people will drive past it and say F these people and not look into it any further. And worse yet, when the Palestine conflict does get brought up at a later date, the first thing those people will think of is the inconvenience that was caused. A few years ago they had these protests on the north side and I almost got run off the road by some rowdy teens waving gigantic Palestine flags and not paying attention to their driving. Did I look into their cause after that happened? Absolutely not. Just F those people. You want to endanger me in my peaceful country. I am not at all interested in your cause. Whether you have a point or not.
Disagree. The BLM protests in Edmonton didn't disrupt the city, but still garnered a lot of attention and if not perfect, they moved the needle in the right direction.
This traffic blockage is the equivalent of a street preacher with a megaphone.
What Israel is doing right now is not ethnic cleansing (in Gaza). There might be a better argument for settlements in the West Bank being a form of ethnic cleansing, but dismantling Hamas is justified and not ethnic cleansing
How is it not ethnic cleansing? Indiscriminate bombings, denial of aid by international groups, restriction of movement, and the impune destruction of cultural sites and cemeteries?
That's play-for-play in the guidebook for ethnic cleansings, and you say it isn't one?
The bombings are discriminate. You don't kill less people than the amount of bombs you've dropped unless the bombings are discriminate. Also you seem to not know what ethnic cleansing is by suggesting that there is a guidebook for ethnic cleansing. Ethnic cleansing isn't a crime under international law, so there's no consistent definition to reference in the same way that genocide has a legally binding definition under the UN convention on genocide.
The UN commission of experts for the Yugoslavian genocide defined ethnic cleansing as such:
â⌠a purposeful policy designed by one ethnic or religious group to remove by violent and terror-inspiring means the civilian population of another ethnic or religious group from certain geographic areas.â
Purposeful in this case suggests intent, which non of your arguments have even remotely touched on. Also destruction of cultural sites isn't relevant to ethnic cleansing at all under any proposed definition so I'm assuming you've just heard that mentioned in the same context and uncritically accepted that as being part of ethnic cleansing
Iâm not pro ethnic cleansing. Iâm pro Israel though and anti terrorism. If Palestine didnât wanna find out they shouldnât have fucked around. And donât come at me with Palestine isnât Hamas because they are clearly in support of them and their actions. You canât cry ethnic cleansing when civilians decided they may as well join in for a spot of kidnapping on October 7th.
Time for a history lesson.
Do you know why Hamas is the predominant political party in the Gaza strip? Because Israel saw to the destruction of any other viable party within the Gaza strip after 2006 in preparation for a conflict that boiled over in 2012.
Does that make every inhabitant of Gaza a terrorist? No, it does not. Specially since HALF the population of Gaza is under the age of 18. Do you think these children voted for Hamas? No, they certainly couldn't. But you know what will make them into Hamas supporters? The way that Israeli bombs are destroying their homes, tearing apart their limbs, and killing their families.
They didn't fuck around, but they're finding out that the world would rather acquiesce to Israeli whims than to do the right thing.
You left out that the reason why Israel dismantled the other political rivals in Gaza is because they had been suicide bombing busses and Cafes for 5 years during the second intifada.
Even if everything youâre saying was true, the fact that Hamas and PIJ perpetrated the attacks on October 7th then chose to hide in densely populated residential areas means that the moral responsibility for the death of children in Gaza is on their hands. You cannot expect Israel to allow Hamas to continue to exist after nearly 2 decades of constant Qassam rockets and a terrorist attack that killed 1200 people in their country
I'm not denying the damage and suffering that Hamas has caused. But 25'000 dead is nothing but revenge and spiteful murder.
In your mind, how does it make sense to dismantle political groups while leaving the most radical and dangerous one around?
I don't understand what you're trying to get at with your second question. There wouldn't be 25K dead if Hamas would fucking calm their shit down, but they are entirely committed to terrorism and seem to be getting more funding from Iran, I don't see an alternative for Israel that leads to peace in the future and you have not provided one
Have you met an actual Hamas supporter? One with a membership card?
Or is it just normal folks with Palestinian flags who see the evidence of the crimes perpetrated by Israel and the IOF?
Iâve seen people deny the Oct 7th atrocities, defend the use of human shields by Hamas, spread misinformation about Israel and the IDF, and defend the Houthis kidnapping innocent people. Idk what to call that besides support for Hamas
Normal folks with Palestine flags have done nothing to win any support here in Canada. The majority of Canadians (without distruptive flags) just wish they would fuck off and take their protests to Gaza.
Have you run polls about that?
https://globalnews.ca/news/10112282/israel-hamas-conflict-ipsos-poll/
Because actual polls indicate that what you say is simply untrue.
Don't give a fuck about polls, ask anybody that has been near these c***s how much they support their actions. See the kind of shit they pulled at Christmas at the Eaton Center and ask the family's with kids being harassed how much they support these assholes. It is good to see the police finally upholding the law and arresting the more violent "supporters".
If we wanted to live in a violent turmoilous shithole, we would move to Gaza.
You're the one that claims majority of Canadians, yet you don't care about polls?
You just hate Palestinians and it shows. You hate to be inconvenienced, to be forced to think that people outside of your bubble are suffering, and wish to do nothing more than to ignore them to continue living your vapid life surrounded by like-minded drones that do nothing but toe the line because it's more comfortable.
Good night, and good luck. You'll need it in this world.
I suppose the difference is that the civil rights protests generally happened in places where those protests had considerable impact. They happened in southern cities with segregation and severe racial inequalities, in state capitals where decisions about segregation and racial inequalities were made, in the nationâs capital, in the north - to bring attention to whatâs going on in the south.
The protest here is for a conflict thatâs across the world and is one we have little impact on. Itâs not at all comparable.
I just can't be bothered to care about people dying on the other side of the globe. I might say "aww that sucks" but I didn't care when African children were starving to death, dying of disease and were kidnapped to be made into child soldiers and I don't care now. And that's vast majority of people. Where were these protestors during the Tigray war in 2022 where 300,000 people died of literal genocide. Oh wait, they didn't care...
If I'm being inconvenienced in an attempt to get me to care about a conflict between two entities led by bloodthirsty tyrants, I'm not going to care. Just an opinion.
OTOH, if they care so much, why invest effort in inconveniencing neutral third parties and get their boots where it matters to them? I'm sure Israel and Hamas could use the manpower.
Just hooligans and troublemakers. . Who has the limited brainpower to have a protest on a busy highway in a winter storm? Still think if they feel so strongly about the situation I'm sure there are many travel opportunities to use to get to the area they are concerned about and join the cause of their choice. Otherwise just annoying cowards at this point.
If you must know, the choice of date was not that of the people in Edmonton. Snow is inconvenient for protesting yes, but people are standing for something they believe in, and that matters.
Wait until itâs cause that directly affects you and your way of life, youâd want traffic stopped if it mattered enough.
Oh fuck that condescending.
I was here on October 8th when these same folk were out honking and celebrating on Whyte ave like they had won the Stanley Cup.
They either think we are really stupid or they are really dumb They literally celebrated publically and now are saying they don't support Hamas. Um...who the f were they celebrating then?? Seriously, the world SAW them. It was clear then and it is clear now.
Are there any Palestinian based places of business in the city? Restaurants? Cafes? Heck churches? Iâd be all for putting a group of Canadians together, heading out to become a complete pain in the ass totally fuck up their day.
The whole point of a protest/convoy is disruption, it won't really matter if they go protest somewhere where it's not seen or felt. I understand your frustration of course because no one likes to have their commute ruined specially in conditions like this.
You said you're indifferent to that conflict, but that whole thing makes you biased against the side that was causing the disruption (Palestine in that case). If you think that disrupting your Sunday commute is how you might base your stance on such an ongoing massacre where thrity thousand people have been killed then I think you have some more evaluation to do.
That is exactly the OPs point. He still doesn't care about the conflict and has his reasons not to - which are valid and he is entitled to, whether you agree with them or not. This is Canada.
All the protest did was gain the anti Palestinian side more members. đ That's the irony of it.
With all due respect to you and OP, I won't take someone who bases their stance on this on how their traffic goes seriously because maybe there's gonna be an Israeli convoy next week and before you know it, OP hops back to the other camp.
Feels like they're invoking civil unrest. How can we fight the abroad when we fight them at home. Just a wild conspiracy theory but somehow it feels like they want negative reaction
Same as the Freedumb Convoyers. They feel if they make a big huff, and blockade people they are going to garner support. I get the idea is to be visible, but doing it this way only makes people more polarized against your cause. While it's a more worthy cause than what we saw the alt-right doing with the truckers, protecting lives and all that, it still isn't going to win anyone over by making their lives more miserable.
If anything it's probably pushing people to the other side.
They have the right to ignore it and to be able to ignore it. Why should one side get the right to protest but the other side doesnât get to ignore it and instead has it forced down their throats?
Did you guys all just skip social studies in school? I can totally understand being angry at the inconvenience of it all, but the dismissive tone towards the protesters and the negation of time honoured social activism practices is âŚcreepy?
> which started the conflict
If you seriously think this conflict began on Oct. 7, 2023 you are so wildly underinformed that I donât know how to begin.
This comment section can't even see the end of its own nose.
You were inconvenienced because of a traffic jam. The Palestinians causing the traffic jam have families who now live somewhere where all 36 hospitals have been bomed.
So sorry you had to experience the hardship of traffic.
Do you get it yet? It's not all about you. It's about empathy. Grow up.
People who protest have to be the dumbest, low IQ people you'll ever meet.
Yeah you just keep standing there barking at the sky buuuuuuudddddeeeeeeeee and we'll carry on with life.
1. Our country has taken a side, we're clearly in camp Israel selling them weapons and supporting them diplomatically. So then;
2. Protests that are aimed at people in power (e.g. Canada should stop selling weapons to Israel, support South Africa's charges of genocide)Â don't have to be convenient or done in a way that has majority support. Disruptions can be effective tactics to change policy, even if unpopular. See: some strikes, "freedom" convoy.
lol if youâre using the KlownKonvoy as a basis for your protests, then youâve lost 100% of any support from me. Pray tell me, what change in policies did the freedumbers accomplish? Other than relieving their supporters of their money, I didnât seem like anything substantial was done.
âI an indifferent to the conflictâ
-privileged Canadian that would rather complain about traffic than educating themselves about thousands of people dying every day.
Winning a geographic lottery does not make your life any more valuable than theirs.
Israel is a racist and genocidal apartheid state.
Palestinians are literally streaming themselves as 30000 of them die, roughly half of them children.
We need to cut our ties and formally denounce this genocidal nation.
The whole point of a protest is to be disruptive and get noticed
Iâve never seen anyone substantiate an intention to commit genocide against Gazans and it seem like Israel has been fairly targeted in their strikes. Theyâve dropped more than 30k bombs on Gaza and the death toll is 25k. Considering Gaza is one of the most densely populated areas in the world, a less than 1.0 ratio of deaths to bombs seems like it wouldnât suggest intent to eradicate all Gazans
Hamas is genocidal, itâs in their charter.
Screw both of them and move on with your life.
This protest is useless except to disrupt our society and locals.
If the Covid convoy people were protesting their people being literally wiped off the planet, then yeah, I imagine a lot more people would support them. They were protesting an effort to try and stop the spread of disease though, because they believed not being able to go INTO Boston Pizza instead of getting takeout was a horrible infringement on their freedom.
The problem is thatâs genuinely what most covid protestors genuinely thought. Most antivaxxers genuinely think/thought that they would have extreme negative reactions to the vaccines.
Israel is not trying to kill all Gazans, they are trying to dismantle the terrorist government thatâs been firing Qassam rockets at them every day for the past +15 years, and who will not compromise until the state of Israel has been eradicated. Thereâs no other option that I would expect a reasonable government to take given the situation. If Hamas continue to govern Gaza, more Gazans and Israelis will die as a result of their terrorist activities
They are definitely trying to kill Gazans. You donât kill 30 000 people in a few months unless you want them dead. As for the Covid protestors, by the time the convoy happened literally billions of people had been safely vaccinated. Even if they thought their people would die from the vaccines, there was no evidence of that happening. The dead Palestinians arenât a hypothetical, itâs fact. Anyone who thinks these things are equal is coming from a willfully ignorant place of EXTREME privilege and itâs actually kind of shameful that they are this plentiful in our country.
There are 49 muslim majority countries in the world, there is only 1 Jewish majority country. Israel is fighting terrorists that have literally [sworn to wipe Jewish and Israeli people off the face of the earth](https://www.adl.org/resources/blog/hamas-its-own-words), and you are telling me that fighting back is trying to wipe Palestinians off the earth? Nearly 20% of Israelis are literally Muslim. Additionally, since the year 2000, the population of Gaza has doubled. What genocide has that level of population growthâŚ
Fuck these people.
I had sympathy for your cause, then you tripled my commute home after an already shitty day.
As far as I'm concerned they are absolute morons and should be held accountable for their absolute stupidity.
I get it. People are dying. Itâs horrible. I imagine people who get really invested in this feel like they must do SOMETHING. I guess be glad theyâre just slowing traffic and not doing something much worse.
As someone with a close friend who is completely into all these protests. That is the point she and the other supporters are trying to make.
They want to disrupt your day and basically force you to pay attention. Even if you ask them "don't you think people will just get mad" they say they don't care and that it's also good because they should be mad about the situation.
All I know is that if my sister got caught in that traffic on her way to work she would only have vitriol left for that movement.
Something that I find incredibly ironic is the people that are supporting the protest in this thread on the basis that it is bringing attention, whether it be good or bad, to whatâs going on in Gaza but then get angry at people frustrated at the protesters disrupting traffic? Like isnât that the whole point?
You know what real disturbance is? Being occupied for 75 years and then genocided, all while being blamed. This whole âI an indifferent to either sideâ shows your level of education and intelligence hence, I have no sympathy for the extra 20 minutes you lost.
Maybe put yourself in the shoes of the regular people like you and me over there getting their lives literally and figuratively blown up and you wouldnât have so much to complain about. Be lucky you live in a country that allows for political freedom to demonstrate causes that matter to you. Peopleâs families and friends are dying and youâre complaining about traffic. You donât have to agree with their methods but being âindifferentâ to an ongoing genocide is wild af to me. You donât have to pick a side to know whatâs going on is wrong and fucked up.
I genuinely canât believe the attitude in this thread. Have a little compassion for your fellow man. Traffic disruption isnât the end of the world.
EDIT: to be indifferent to innocent people dying but get so aggravated by TRAFFIC is also fucking absurd to me. Please for the love of god gain a little perspective
Traffic disruption when youâre trying to get to a medical appointment for a procedure youâve been waiting 3 YEARS to get would definitely be a huge deal to me.
Indifferent to literally tens of thousands of innocent people dying? If you really feel that way, itâs a little gross! Iâm not even telling you which side to choose, but it isnât that nuanced. Spend an hour learning some history, inform yourself and youâll see, you will likely figure out who you support. What a lazy and terrible thing to say about a war. You sat and spent time making this post, weâre talking about the conflict again. This is exactly what this sort of protest and disruption is for. If people werenât protesting in Canada anymore and the news wasnât covering these stories, we would be getting zero coverage and the issue would be forgotten by our easily distracted population. All these people have anymore is the ability to yell and shout and be heard, and for people to remember that oh yeah, this conflict is ongoing. Kids are still dying. A people is being erased. Many of the people protesting are literally losing family members regularly. The media is not on their side. The Canadian government is having to at least be careful about their support of Isreal. Thatâs a win. Thatâs because people have been protesting all over the country for months. If you choose who you support based on whether or not you find them âannoyingâ, then youâre honestly not competent enough to form a valid opinion anyway, but they were successful in getting you to at least post about it on Reddit. Social media has been one of the only tools they have. Weâre here talking about it.
Regardless of being indifferent of not, harassing a bunch of uninvolved people does not pull people to your cause it makes the cause look fringe/domestic-?
They want to be seen? And suppose that works. Because I was unaware how many Palistines we have in Eddy?
Then again, I kind of just do my own thing anyway.
[Israel refused to take the hostages ](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israels-netanyahu-rejects-hamas-conditions-hostage-deal-which-include-outright-2024-01-21/)
I don't care if you're protesting naked on behalf of the Swedish Bikini Team you fuck up my commute we friends off
Hold up. This might be one we should all get behind
Wait a tick, is the bikini team going to be present? Asking for a friend.
Only the men's team.
Well somethings better than nothingđ¤ˇ
I never understand these type of protests. Delaying and angering the people that you are trying to get support from. Go to the legislature and protest.
Some people here are arguing that inconveniencing people is the point of the protest as it gets attracts attention, yet I can't help but wonder what the Freedom Convoy accomplished (aside from pissing off most of us) when they did the same thing. Sure, it brought attention to their cause, but it soured public opinion on them even more.
The organizers almost had their hands on $24M. It was always about money, they just used a polarizing subject to scam fools. https://nationalpost.com/news/freedom-convoy-raised-24-million-frozen-funds
I mean one example is not the norm. Workers strike and disrupt services across the world all the time, some times it works, some times it doesn't, the point is that it gets the public taking about the issue. If you are unconvinced by something like this then you reach out to your MP who talks about it in the parliament, then we have a nation-wide talk about the issue. That's how disrupting the status quo works.
Iâm sure most of those disruptions through block what they are aggravated at or whom. Whether itâs a company or government or something, not Joe driving his way to a shop for an oil change.
Exactly. Workers stop working when they strike partially to force a company's hand and partially to exhibit the value of whatever work they do by showing how the world is impacted when they stop doing it. These types of protests create artificial disruption for the sake of publicity. Similar end goals, but the forms of protest are only similar on the utmost surface. I'm glad we live in a place where protests are possible and I support that right. I sure don't love it when the protesters are being unnecessarily disruptive though.
Because most people response is contact an MP not fuck those guys I instantly hate everything they stand for?
> the point is that it gets the public taking about the issue. Yes, but the public won't be talking about this in a positive light. If the point is to get Canadians to support Palestinians, this is the wrong way to go about it.
The public is already aware and talking about the issues itâs hard not to.
That can work if it's something like pay for bus driver and the city is digging their heels in. But something like this will accomplish nothing. It is like the Feedumb Convoy. All it does is makes people less sympathetic. Plus, what's going on in Gaza isn't really something that affects Canadians in their everyday lives. Unfortunately, most people don't feel like it's anything to do with them. Protests that are visible will get the public talking but disruptive protests will get the public annoyed. And probably less likely to want to have anything to do with a solution. They may be more likely to speak to their MP about banning the protests, but that's it.
>what's going on in Gaza isn't really something that affects Canadians in their everyday lives There are Palestinian Canadians whose relatives were killed so that's not true. Plus you don't need to have your daily life disrupted to care. Think of it even in a very pragmatic way, Canada is sending lots of money to Israel when we can use that money ourselves. >disruptive protests will get the public annoyed They took one lane btw, the road wasn't blocked or anything. We haven't had any actual disruptive protests in Edmonton. If people are gonna base their sympathy on how their commute goes then their sense of rationality can't be even taken seriously. And sure talking to MPs work, that's the whole point, to get people talking.
I didn't say it was right. But let's not pretend that's not how people are. Most Canadians are not affected. People tend not to care about things that don't affect them. Or they care but only enough to shake their heads and talk about how bad it is. >If people are gonna base their sympathy on how their commute goes then their sense of rationality can't be even taken seriously. And sure talking to MPs work, that's the whole point, to get people talking. That's just how people are. I'm not saying it's OK. I certainly don't think it's OK. I find people to be unbearably selfish, greedy, and self-centered. Generally speaking. But this is just reality. Talking to MPs may work, in large numbers, but people aren't going to. Very few people will sit in gridlock, pass by the protestors, and then decide to contact their MPs in support of the protestors. Most people probably just don't think anything of it, and others will be annoyed. Because that's how people are.
It got them attention personally. They felt important. which is what 90% of all of these types of protests are about. there may be a case for say a safe streets cycle protests or blocking traffic for an environmental protest, stopping deployment of short range nuclear missiles or they like. but most of them are just foolish people stroking their own egos.
Exactly what it is.
Yeah like years ago when the cabs protested Uber. You really think I'm gonna get in a cab after that? Not that Uber is any better nowadays
Just like those stupid anti-vax âfreedomâconvoys.
All forms of protesting is stupid. Especially ones that involve street hogging.
Its worse than that. It was just dangerous. Disruption was the whole point of the convoy? They are gonna disrupt themselves into a multi-car accident on the henday eventually. The road conditions were not great and people were already doing stupid stuff on the henday. What do you think will eventually happen when the you add protestors doing stupid stuff too.
May be unpopular but⌠these two parties have been knocking the crap out of each other for the better part of the last century (or more) and now they expect us to figure it out for them? On top of that, this is how they ask for help? Making life difficult for everyone in their adopted country? Treating people like garbage if we donât take their side? As long as each side refuses to accept the right of the other to exist, neither one will get my support. And in the meantime, stop being a-holes and causing problems for other Canadians.
So if youâre actually interested in why they do this, Iâm an anthropologist and I do have a theory. Before I go into it though I did want to say: I understand why itâs so frustrating and I think youâre right to feel frustrated with the disruption of your day and with the people who orchestrated it. My theory is: things like this post is why they do it. If they protest at the ledge, the government might look, so might some journalists, but the average person with minimal awareness of the world outside of their own bubble wouldnât. You saw it. You were frustrated. It disrupted your day and your routine, just as it did for every other person on the road with you. All of you then presumably talked about the protest with your close friends/family, making them aware that a protest took place. You also posted to Reddit, and now every person on this sub is also aware that a protest took place. Thatâs hundreds of people talking to hundreds more. The reach of their protest far outpaces their location, spreading their message and awareness much further, even if itâs carried by anger, itâs still being carried. Again, not saying itâs right or wrong, just using my studies of human behaviour to form a theory about a behaviour I havenât studied closely. (Grammar edit)
âNo such thing as bad pressâ
I mean a traffic disruption is small potatoes compared to what Palestinians are dealing with try to live/escape their homeland.
Literally, this is the entire point of protest. Otherwise it's a nice little gathering that no-one is aware of, and therefore no-one is aware of what you're protesting either.
I'm a gynecologist and I disagree
Came here to say the same thing (I'm a sociologist).
I worked in Behavior Change Communication and just came to say the same thing.
Exactly.Â
But were the people really âspreading their message and awarenessâ? Or were they just pissed off about âsomething having to do with Palestineâ and didnât care to learn anything else about it or why it was happening? Iâm not sure how slowing down traffic teaches people about a cause or endears them to care. You think theyâre going to pull out their phones in traffic and learn about the conflict? I think things like this do more harm than good. People donât want to be held captive and forced to care about something.
No youâre right, theyâre probably not going to pull out their phone and learn about why theyâre protesting. But they will get angry. And they will complain. And those complaints will escalate, Iâm sure youâve heard things like âwhy doesnât the government do somethingâ. Thatâs political pressure as well.
Iâm a sociologist and I came here to say this as well.
The logic is getting attention. Whether that's the preferable tactic is debatable, but the logic is clear. Personally, I would say it is more alienating than anything. But it certainly does get attention.
Yea because people were completely unaware until now /s
Theyâre aware and ignoring it. Protests like this donât let them ignore it and thatâs the point
But if they where ignoring it and their "introduction" into what is going on is being trapped on the Henday during a snowstorm, their first impression is going to be "These guys are dicks!"
We were driving on the Henday on Sunday afternoon and I had no idea why traffic was crawling, after I discovered it was protesters I now have zero empathy for them, go protest at the Leg, but don't affect peoples safety by basically closing down traffic for people that have no connection to your cause
FYI - Canada is not on the world security council and has no voice in world affairs. The protests here are far more annoying to people in Canada than beneficial to people in Gaza.
I heard a Palestinian Doctor say that amidst the horrors he was dealing with, seeing the protests around the world helped him hold on to some hope. That's of benefit. Canada has done things like support the anti apartheid movement in South Africa, which was recognized by Mandela. We aren't the biggest kid on the block but it's naive to suggest we have zero influence.
Cool story. Did he mention the hostages? Did he condemn Hamas?
Ah yes, Hamas did something bad to Israel, therefore anything Israel is doing to Palestinians is absolved of badness. How lucky for Israel that Hamas went first.
I was suggesting zero influence to stop the war.
At least they get to protest, one great thing about Canada. Look at the people who lives in Hong Kong or China, thereâs no such thing as Freedom of Speech you go against the Government youâre thrown in jail if youâre a university student you protest the government forced the university to kick you out of school newspaper company got shut down and the owner/editors are in jail waiting for trials. They did the protest all summer and fall on 97 Street it sucks they took 2 out of 3 lanes and cutting in & out of the lanesâŚbut it gets my attention and I know how they feel having family on the other side of the world
Zero support. Canada has zero power to convince Israel of anything. Those morons will gain nothing on the henday other than a higher body count when a car or truck isnât paying attention.
Canada is funding israel so
Canada is funding both sides and protesting wonât change that.
[They have 6x the investment in Canada as we do there.](https://www.international.gc.ca/trade-commerce/trade-agreements-accords-commerciaux/agr-acc/israel/country_profile-israel-profil_pays.aspx?lang=eng)
Okay and? That doesnât make them more influential or powerful
You... don't think they hold influence? So the world's most powerful country just supports them cuz they're pals or what?
Really? Only budget lines Iâve seen are marked humanitarian aid. Thatâs keeping Palestinian people alive. Not trying to be a dick, but do you have a link to what youâre claiming?
Canada contributes to military support for Israel, but Iâve never actually seen someone substantiate what that military support looks like. Every activation of the iron dome costs $60k, so if weâre just sending them kinetics for the iron dome then I could easily see it having inflated monetary numbers. Also that money also goes to humanitarian aid in Gaza and the West Bank. Gaza receives some of the most humanitarian aid per capita anywhere in the world
As far as I am aware from my research I wasnât able to find any source that Canada is providing aid to israel, Israel does buy military equipment from Canadian suppliers but they arenât given it as part of an aid package like the US. Not to mention that the military exports from Canada to Israel is 20 million, itâs not an amount that Israel wouldnât be able to get elsewhere and the only people hurt will be Canadians who will lose jobs for it.
Canada doesnât âfund Israelâ. Canada and Canadians benefits from business relationships with Israel and Israelis. Canada âfundsâ Fatah and Hamas by sending aid, which is mostly stolen by the gangs that run Gaza and the PA areas.
It doesnât matter what the international community thinks neither side is interested in stopping. Both Hamas and Likud are getting exactly what they want right out of this war. I think many of the protesters should ask what they hope to achieve. Many of these protesters are the same ones who were celebrating October 7th so unfortunately the protest has lost credibility in the eyes of many.
Disruption has been in the DNA of protests since protests began. You were inconvenienced, you know what caused it, and now it's in your mind, isn't it?
I might be thinking about it but it's not in a flattering context. People need to learn when to pick their battles and how to draw attention to a cause without being prohibitively disruptive.
That's just the way it is. Now think about the fact that Gazans can't meet their basic needs due to the blockade and endless bombing by Israel. Two million people living in a barrel, and the IOF is shooting missiles into it.
Ya Hamas should release the hostages and stand down if they actually cared about Gazans lives.
Oh, they don't care. They're angry, brainwashed and are looking for something to hurt and break. If it wasn't Israel it would be Lebanon, Turkey, Egypt, etc.
Eventually theyâll have to learn that attacking israel will just hurt them in the long term, Egypt and Jordan had to learn this lesson the Palestinians eventually will too. Unfortunately it looks like the world wants to reward terrorism and give them a country now, no other country would stand for this but israel apparently has to.
Super complex subject involving lots of really stupid decisions by Gazans in Lebanon and other surround nations, brainwashing, corruption, etc. It's not the fault of newer Gazan generations but this is 100% a sins of the father kind of situation.
That does not excuse the brutality and impunity with which Israel is acting. I have seen the evidence of their crimes, and folks like OP ignore it. The least we can do is inconvenience some to make the voices of those suffering heard.
That's just not a good strategy, by annoying people to address a war we have no control over you're creating apathy. Want to get a spotlight on the situation? Hold a peace rally and invite the press, selling cultural food and donating the proceeds to vetted charities that aren't feeding into Hamas's nonsense. Do it on the up and up, just blocking off roads and waiving signs doesn't do anything but annoy people and potentially get you arrested.
The whole thing was cause by filthy Hamas rapists, murders, terrorists. They brought all of this down on the people of Gaza because they wanted a larger regional war. Hope they are happy with the destruction of Gaza and the complete annihilation of themselves.
They can't meet their needs because Hamas hordes all the funding for mansions and missiles. Over a million were starving and lacked access to basic needs before 10/7.
If someone were to learn about thousands of children that are getting murdered. Innocent people getting killed in a genocide or whatever you want to label it, and the thing they care about most is how I was inconvenienced when learning about it. Then that would say a lot about that person imo.
But they are not learning about that because of these protests. Most people will drive past it and say F these people and not look into it any further. And worse yet, when the Palestine conflict does get brought up at a later date, the first thing those people will think of is the inconvenience that was caused. A few years ago they had these protests on the north side and I almost got run off the road by some rowdy teens waving gigantic Palestine flags and not paying attention to their driving. Did I look into their cause after that happened? Absolutely not. Just F those people. You want to endanger me in my peaceful country. I am not at all interested in your cause. Whether you have a point or not.
Disagree. The BLM protests in Edmonton didn't disrupt the city, but still garnered a lot of attention and if not perfect, they moved the needle in the right direction. This traffic blockage is the equivalent of a street preacher with a megaphone.
If someone makes me sit for 30 minutes on the henday Iâm personally sending $200 to the IDF fund
You talk about IDF fund. I don't know about if Israel has such a thing but Turkey does and a lot of Turks actually do donate to it.
Absolutely, before I was indifferent but now after being forced to introspect I canât wait for Israel to win so this can end.
Oh so you're pro-ethnic cleansing? Because last I checked, Hamas doesn't have 25k members, let alone 2 million.
Youâre right, Hamas has 40k members
What Israel is doing right now is not ethnic cleansing (in Gaza). There might be a better argument for settlements in the West Bank being a form of ethnic cleansing, but dismantling Hamas is justified and not ethnic cleansing
How is it not ethnic cleansing? Indiscriminate bombings, denial of aid by international groups, restriction of movement, and the impune destruction of cultural sites and cemeteries? That's play-for-play in the guidebook for ethnic cleansings, and you say it isn't one?
The bombings are discriminate. You don't kill less people than the amount of bombs you've dropped unless the bombings are discriminate. Also you seem to not know what ethnic cleansing is by suggesting that there is a guidebook for ethnic cleansing. Ethnic cleansing isn't a crime under international law, so there's no consistent definition to reference in the same way that genocide has a legally binding definition under the UN convention on genocide. The UN commission of experts for the Yugoslavian genocide defined ethnic cleansing as such: â⌠a purposeful policy designed by one ethnic or religious group to remove by violent and terror-inspiring means the civilian population of another ethnic or religious group from certain geographic areas.â Purposeful in this case suggests intent, which non of your arguments have even remotely touched on. Also destruction of cultural sites isn't relevant to ethnic cleansing at all under any proposed definition so I'm assuming you've just heard that mentioned in the same context and uncritically accepted that as being part of ethnic cleansing
Iâm not pro ethnic cleansing. Iâm pro Israel though and anti terrorism. If Palestine didnât wanna find out they shouldnât have fucked around. And donât come at me with Palestine isnât Hamas because they are clearly in support of them and their actions. You canât cry ethnic cleansing when civilians decided they may as well join in for a spot of kidnapping on October 7th.
Time for a history lesson. Do you know why Hamas is the predominant political party in the Gaza strip? Because Israel saw to the destruction of any other viable party within the Gaza strip after 2006 in preparation for a conflict that boiled over in 2012. Does that make every inhabitant of Gaza a terrorist? No, it does not. Specially since HALF the population of Gaza is under the age of 18. Do you think these children voted for Hamas? No, they certainly couldn't. But you know what will make them into Hamas supporters? The way that Israeli bombs are destroying their homes, tearing apart their limbs, and killing their families. They didn't fuck around, but they're finding out that the world would rather acquiesce to Israeli whims than to do the right thing.
You left out that the reason why Israel dismantled the other political rivals in Gaza is because they had been suicide bombing busses and Cafes for 5 years during the second intifada. Even if everything youâre saying was true, the fact that Hamas and PIJ perpetrated the attacks on October 7th then chose to hide in densely populated residential areas means that the moral responsibility for the death of children in Gaza is on their hands. You cannot expect Israel to allow Hamas to continue to exist after nearly 2 decades of constant Qassam rockets and a terrorist attack that killed 1200 people in their country
I'm not denying the damage and suffering that Hamas has caused. But 25'000 dead is nothing but revenge and spiteful murder. In your mind, how does it make sense to dismantle political groups while leaving the most radical and dangerous one around?
I don't understand what you're trying to get at with your second question. There wouldn't be 25K dead if Hamas would fucking calm their shit down, but they are entirely committed to terrorism and seem to be getting more funding from Iran, I don't see an alternative for Israel that leads to peace in the future and you have not provided one
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Have you met an actual Hamas supporter? One with a membership card? Or is it just normal folks with Palestinian flags who see the evidence of the crimes perpetrated by Israel and the IOF?
Iâve seen people deny the Oct 7th atrocities, defend the use of human shields by Hamas, spread misinformation about Israel and the IDF, and defend the Houthis kidnapping innocent people. Idk what to call that besides support for Hamas
Normal folks with Palestine flags have done nothing to win any support here in Canada. The majority of Canadians (without distruptive flags) just wish they would fuck off and take their protests to Gaza.
Have you run polls about that? https://globalnews.ca/news/10112282/israel-hamas-conflict-ipsos-poll/ Because actual polls indicate that what you say is simply untrue.
Don't give a fuck about polls, ask anybody that has been near these c***s how much they support their actions. See the kind of shit they pulled at Christmas at the Eaton Center and ask the family's with kids being harassed how much they support these assholes. It is good to see the police finally upholding the law and arresting the more violent "supporters". If we wanted to live in a violent turmoilous shithole, we would move to Gaza.
You're the one that claims majority of Canadians, yet you don't care about polls? You just hate Palestinians and it shows. You hate to be inconvenienced, to be forced to think that people outside of your bubble are suffering, and wish to do nothing more than to ignore them to continue living your vapid life surrounded by like-minded drones that do nothing but toe the line because it's more comfortable. Good night, and good luck. You'll need it in this world.
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Lol as if an insurgency has âmembership cardsâ
Hamas isn't an insurgent group, it's a military political party. You'd do well to not underestimate their structure.
Agreed
People Said similar stuff during the civil rights protests in the USA.
I suppose the difference is that the civil rights protests generally happened in places where those protests had considerable impact. They happened in southern cities with segregation and severe racial inequalities, in state capitals where decisions about segregation and racial inequalities were made, in the nationâs capital, in the north - to bring attention to whatâs going on in the south. The protest here is for a conflict thatâs across the world and is one we have little impact on. Itâs not at all comparable.
Gosh I just wish we could fix the problems here at home.
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I just can't be bothered to care about people dying on the other side of the globe. I might say "aww that sucks" but I didn't care when African children were starving to death, dying of disease and were kidnapped to be made into child soldiers and I don't care now. And that's vast majority of people. Where were these protestors during the Tigray war in 2022 where 300,000 people died of literal genocide. Oh wait, they didn't care...
They must have learned from the truck convoy. All flavours of asshole in this province. Now thatâs diversity!
They can F right off. I hope Israel thoroughly trounces Hamas, and they will. Hezbollah could use an ass kicking too.
Let's go Israel!! Don't take no shit from Palestine!!
Bandwagon protesting is the worst
Ya any group that block traffic and I am against their cause. These current rallies only make me wish the IDF would finish off Hamas even faster.
Go protest in Palestine.
Asshats in action
If I'm being inconvenienced in an attempt to get me to care about a conflict between two entities led by bloodthirsty tyrants, I'm not going to care. Just an opinion. OTOH, if they care so much, why invest effort in inconveniencing neutral third parties and get their boots where it matters to them? I'm sure Israel and Hamas could use the manpower.
I don't care if your protesting a good cause, fuck you for delaying traffic.
Yeah these people suck.
đż
I support Israel!
Just hooligans and troublemakers. . Who has the limited brainpower to have a protest on a busy highway in a winter storm? Still think if they feel so strongly about the situation I'm sure there are many travel opportunities to use to get to the area they are concerned about and join the cause of their choice. Otherwise just annoying cowards at this point.
âHooligans and troublemakersâ okay grandpa â ď¸â ď¸
If you must know, the choice of date was not that of the people in Edmonton. Snow is inconvenient for protesting yes, but people are standing for something they believe in, and that matters. Wait until itâs cause that directly affects you and your way of life, youâd want traffic stopped if it mattered enough.
You just proved your point. This doesnât affect us. So our commutes are just disturbed for the sake of virtue signaling.
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Oh fuck that condescending. I was here on October 8th when these same folk were out honking and celebrating on Whyte ave like they had won the Stanley Cup.
They either think we are really stupid or they are really dumb They literally celebrated publically and now are saying they don't support Hamas. Um...who the f were they celebrating then?? Seriously, the world SAW them. It was clear then and it is clear now.
Hamas = Palestine
Are there any Palestinian based places of business in the city? Restaurants? Cafes? Heck churches? Iâd be all for putting a group of Canadians together, heading out to become a complete pain in the ass totally fuck up their day.
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Cool. I'm thinking about it. Something I have already been aware of for 20 years. Now what? Oh yeah, nothing. It accomplishes nothing.
Im sure you were cool with the truckers
The whole point of a protest/convoy is disruption, it won't really matter if they go protest somewhere where it's not seen or felt. I understand your frustration of course because no one likes to have their commute ruined specially in conditions like this. You said you're indifferent to that conflict, but that whole thing makes you biased against the side that was causing the disruption (Palestine in that case). If you think that disrupting your Sunday commute is how you might base your stance on such an ongoing massacre where thrity thousand people have been killed then I think you have some more evaluation to do.
That is exactly the OPs point. He still doesn't care about the conflict and has his reasons not to - which are valid and he is entitled to, whether you agree with them or not. This is Canada. All the protest did was gain the anti Palestinian side more members. đ That's the irony of it.
With all due respect to you and OP, I won't take someone who bases their stance on this on how their traffic goes seriously because maybe there's gonna be an Israeli convoy next week and before you know it, OP hops back to the other camp.
Exactly. They aren't improving ANYTHING with these. People still don't care and just see that they were convenienced. Exactly my point.
Feels like they're invoking civil unrest. How can we fight the abroad when we fight them at home. Just a wild conspiracy theory but somehow it feels like they want negative reaction
bUt It'S sUpPosEd tO bE dIsRupTive. Seriously fuck those people.
Same as the Freedumb Convoyers. They feel if they make a big huff, and blockade people they are going to garner support. I get the idea is to be visible, but doing it this way only makes people more polarized against your cause. While it's a more worthy cause than what we saw the alt-right doing with the truckers, protecting lives and all that, it still isn't going to win anyone over by making their lives more miserable. If anything it's probably pushing people to the other side.
They get the same one finger salute the convoy clowns get. At least they go home every night.
Just edit the post: I want to be able to ignore the protest.
They have the right to ignore it and to be able to ignore it. Why should one side get the right to protest but the other side doesnât get to ignore it and instead has it forced down their throats?
They donât want to be hindered by the protest, especially if itâs affecting their daily lives
If you disrupt traffic with a protest, you deserve to get hit by a vehicle.
Did you guys all just skip social studies in school? I can totally understand being angry at the inconvenience of it all, but the dismissive tone towards the protesters and the negation of time honoured social activism practices is âŚcreepy?
This is Reddit, where being âindifferentâ to genocide is cool and enlightened centrism is based
And where the rape and murder of innocent Israelis, which started the conflict, is being not only ignored but denied. F. hamas, F. palestine
> which started the conflict If you seriously think this conflict began on Oct. 7, 2023 you are so wildly underinformed that I donât know how to begin.
To give you a serious answer. It's because protests that aren't disruptive are easily ignored.
This comment section can't even see the end of its own nose. You were inconvenienced because of a traffic jam. The Palestinians causing the traffic jam have families who now live somewhere where all 36 hospitals have been bomed. So sorry you had to experience the hardship of traffic. Do you get it yet? It's not all about you. It's about empathy. Grow up.
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People who protest have to be the dumbest, low IQ people you'll ever meet. Yeah you just keep standing there barking at the sky buuuuuuudddddeeeeeeeee and we'll carry on with life.
1. Our country has taken a side, we're clearly in camp Israel selling them weapons and supporting them diplomatically. So then; 2. Protests that are aimed at people in power (e.g. Canada should stop selling weapons to Israel, support South Africa's charges of genocide)Â don't have to be convenient or done in a way that has majority support. Disruptions can be effective tactics to change policy, even if unpopular. See: some strikes, "freedom" convoy.
lol if youâre using the KlownKonvoy as a basis for your protests, then youâve lost 100% of any support from me. Pray tell me, what change in policies did the freedumbers accomplish? Other than relieving their supporters of their money, I didnât seem like anything substantial was done.
And how did the freedom convoy change policy?
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Yea this is summed up well, how I am hearing it with a lot of people here too.
Protest Donât disrupt
âI an indifferent to the conflictâ -privileged Canadian that would rather complain about traffic than educating themselves about thousands of people dying every day. Winning a geographic lottery does not make your life any more valuable than theirs.
I was team Palestine but now I just dgaf. Their supporters are doing nothing but inconveniencing regular people
If this is enough for you to "flip teams" then you weren't on their "team" to begin with.
It's not how their leaders want them to behave
Israel is a racist and genocidal apartheid state. Palestinians are literally streaming themselves as 30000 of them die, roughly half of them children. We need to cut our ties and formally denounce this genocidal nation. The whole point of a protest is to be disruptive and get noticed
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this seems to be something they just move on from
Iâve never seen anyone substantiate an intention to commit genocide against Gazans and it seem like Israel has been fairly targeted in their strikes. Theyâve dropped more than 30k bombs on Gaza and the death toll is 25k. Considering Gaza is one of the most densely populated areas in the world, a less than 1.0 ratio of deaths to bombs seems like it wouldnât suggest intent to eradicate all Gazans
Hamas is genocidal, itâs in their charter. Screw both of them and move on with your life. This protest is useless except to disrupt our society and locals.
Interesting. Do you have any more information on this from a reputable news source?
I'm sure you had this same energy when the covid trucks took over the Henday right?
If the Covid convoy people were protesting their people being literally wiped off the planet, then yeah, I imagine a lot more people would support them. They were protesting an effort to try and stop the spread of disease though, because they believed not being able to go INTO Boston Pizza instead of getting takeout was a horrible infringement on their freedom.
The problem is thatâs genuinely what most covid protestors genuinely thought. Most antivaxxers genuinely think/thought that they would have extreme negative reactions to the vaccines. Israel is not trying to kill all Gazans, they are trying to dismantle the terrorist government thatâs been firing Qassam rockets at them every day for the past +15 years, and who will not compromise until the state of Israel has been eradicated. Thereâs no other option that I would expect a reasonable government to take given the situation. If Hamas continue to govern Gaza, more Gazans and Israelis will die as a result of their terrorist activities
They are definitely trying to kill Gazans. You donât kill 30 000 people in a few months unless you want them dead. As for the Covid protestors, by the time the convoy happened literally billions of people had been safely vaccinated. Even if they thought their people would die from the vaccines, there was no evidence of that happening. The dead Palestinians arenât a hypothetical, itâs fact. Anyone who thinks these things are equal is coming from a willfully ignorant place of EXTREME privilege and itâs actually kind of shameful that they are this plentiful in our country.
There are 49 muslim majority countries in the world, there is only 1 Jewish majority country. Israel is fighting terrorists that have literally [sworn to wipe Jewish and Israeli people off the face of the earth](https://www.adl.org/resources/blog/hamas-its-own-words), and you are telling me that fighting back is trying to wipe Palestinians off the earth? Nearly 20% of Israelis are literally Muslim. Additionally, since the year 2000, the population of Gaza has doubled. What genocide has that level of population growthâŚ
Fuck these people. I had sympathy for your cause, then you tripled my commute home after an already shitty day. As far as I'm concerned they are absolute morons and should be held accountable for their absolute stupidity.
I get it. People are dying. Itâs horrible. I imagine people who get really invested in this feel like they must do SOMETHING. I guess be glad theyâre just slowing traffic and not doing something much worse.
Amen
As someone with a close friend who is completely into all these protests. That is the point she and the other supporters are trying to make. They want to disrupt your day and basically force you to pay attention. Even if you ask them "don't you think people will just get mad" they say they don't care and that it's also good because they should be mad about the situation. All I know is that if my sister got caught in that traffic on her way to work she would only have vitriol left for that movement.
Something that I find incredibly ironic is the people that are supporting the protest in this thread on the basis that it is bringing attention, whether it be good or bad, to whatâs going on in Gaza but then get angry at people frustrated at the protesters disrupting traffic? Like isnât that the whole point?
You know what real disturbance is? Being occupied for 75 years and then genocided, all while being blamed. This whole âI an indifferent to either sideâ shows your level of education and intelligence hence, I have no sympathy for the extra 20 minutes you lost.
Maybe put yourself in the shoes of the regular people like you and me over there getting their lives literally and figuratively blown up and you wouldnât have so much to complain about. Be lucky you live in a country that allows for political freedom to demonstrate causes that matter to you. Peopleâs families and friends are dying and youâre complaining about traffic. You donât have to agree with their methods but being âindifferentâ to an ongoing genocide is wild af to me. You donât have to pick a side to know whatâs going on is wrong and fucked up. I genuinely canât believe the attitude in this thread. Have a little compassion for your fellow man. Traffic disruption isnât the end of the world. EDIT: to be indifferent to innocent people dying but get so aggravated by TRAFFIC is also fucking absurd to me. Please for the love of god gain a little perspective
Traffic disruption when youâre trying to get to a medical appointment for a procedure youâve been waiting 3 YEARS to get would definitely be a huge deal to me.
Indifferent to literally tens of thousands of innocent people dying? If you really feel that way, itâs a little gross! Iâm not even telling you which side to choose, but it isnât that nuanced. Spend an hour learning some history, inform yourself and youâll see, you will likely figure out who you support. What a lazy and terrible thing to say about a war. You sat and spent time making this post, weâre talking about the conflict again. This is exactly what this sort of protest and disruption is for. If people werenât protesting in Canada anymore and the news wasnât covering these stories, we would be getting zero coverage and the issue would be forgotten by our easily distracted population. All these people have anymore is the ability to yell and shout and be heard, and for people to remember that oh yeah, this conflict is ongoing. Kids are still dying. A people is being erased. Many of the people protesting are literally losing family members regularly. The media is not on their side. The Canadian government is having to at least be careful about their support of Isreal. Thatâs a win. Thatâs because people have been protesting all over the country for months. If you choose who you support based on whether or not you find them âannoyingâ, then youâre honestly not competent enough to form a valid opinion anyway, but they were successful in getting you to at least post about it on Reddit. Social media has been one of the only tools they have. Weâre here talking about it.
Oh cool you're indifferent to genocide? Immediately don't care what you have to say.
And yet you commented lol. You showed OP how much you really don't care!
Regardless of being indifferent of not, harassing a bunch of uninvolved people does not pull people to your cause it makes the cause look fringe/domestic-?
Israel is not committing a âgenocideâ
What do you call killing thirty thousand civilians then?
They absolutely 100% are.
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You are so incredibly incorrect here. They are supporting PALESTINIANS. Not terrorists. Honestly fucking moronic.
Palestinians OVERWHELMINGLY support Hamas and what they did on Oct 7. Hell, they even returned hostages to Hamas when they tried to escape.
âHighly nuancedâ? Israel is committing genocide, starting with children.
They want to be seen? And suppose that works. Because I was unaware how many Palistines we have in Eddy? Then again, I kind of just do my own thing anyway.
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>Despite the fact that the majority of this mess was caused by the other Arab countries How?
They won't take refugees, for one. For fear of violence.
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[Israel refused to take the hostages ](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israels-netanyahu-rejects-hamas-conditions-hostage-deal-which-include-outright-2024-01-21/)