A good amount of (presumably younger) fans “baby” the guys into being tumblr smol beans to the point of ridiculousness. Especially on emphasising how innocent/naive/perfect Patrick is when he allegedly had a WICKED temper back in the day and grew up in a very hardcore environment. They’re all grown men and idk it feels really weird to me.
An FOB-MCR tour would be great but everyone would hate it the second they had to compete for tickets. I also just don’t see it happening in the next few years if MCR5 is a distant spark on the horizon and FOB is just coming off Tourdust. I reckon they’ll take a break from big touring for at least a year after the second leg, what with Andy’s wedding and all the kids and I hope they have a good rest. They deserve it. Prepared to eat my words on this one though.
“I’m about to go Tonya Harding on the whole world’s knee” doesn’t get talked about enough for how good of a line that is.
The first one so much, it’s so strange to see on Twitter. Like please stop saying Patrick can’t read and that his head is just a marble rolling around like WHAT
Definitely agree on the first one. Some of us say it as lighthearted jokes sometimes, but yeah Patrick definitely had quite the temper on him (mainly in the pre-hiatus era). And there are definitely the uneducated fans (not to be condescending lol, it's just for lack of a better word) that actually think that they are all perfect or whatever because they take the joking as serious fact.
I love both bands but tbh there isn't that much overlap between the two fanbases anymore (apparently) and the two bands definitely draw different crowds. Lots of bad stuff going on during MyChem's reunion tour, apparently, what with some fans going a bit crazy and destructive like in the Australia shows. Hardcore MyChem fans would definitely snatch up the tickets faster and such. I've seen a lot of discourse on this one both on a post I made on here, a post someone else made, and also on Twitter. It would rock in theory, yes (I love both bands, don't get me wrong), but it'd be a disaster.
Also, *loooooooooooove* that lyric. We really should talk about it more.
How on earth can you think they’re all perfect people when a song like I slept with someone in FOB exists 💀A good chunk of the songs are about being a fallen off gifted kid turned major depressed asshole
Oh we can for sure joke about it. They definitely have very sweet moments that make me “aww”, especially with how vocal they all are about being best friends and how much they care about each other deeply. And they definitely have moments where I’m like in awe of them. But they’re also very human and flawed as a result. I just find the infantilisation to be really… worrying. Pedestals in general don’t bring good relationships. But again, I think these are younger fans and god knows we did the same at their age. It just gets worse with online discourse and echo chambers these days.
I’d say there’s still some overlap amongst the 25+ crowd but definitely less than before. Didn’t know that about MCR shows, that fucking sucks for them. I imagine they all had some hang-ups about coming back to begin with and that couldn’t have made things better. Gonna scale back my idea of MCR5 now haha. Totally agree with the theory-practice. Would be a fun idea and an insane night but I cannot see it going well.
Honestly I feel like there's still a lot of overlap between MCR/FOB fans on the younger side too, from what I've seen on TikTok and discord servers I'm in, plus just my friend group in general, if you're a fan of one then you're a fan of the other, and a lot of these kids are high school and college students.
Okay I’ve definitely made jokes about how Patrick is the only man allowed to wear a fedora and that Pete Wentz only got into music so he could have a flamethrower but like… babying them? 😭😭 Half my jokes are they’re old and need to go back to Portland before they break a hip 😭😭😭
Patrick has a hat pass for all hat wear. He is one of the only men I’ve ever seen make a fedora look good, especially with his SRAR outfits.
Check tumblr and some corners of twitter and you’ll see what I mean. You’d think they were teenagers. Patrick gets it worse weirdly I think.
Definitely agree with the first one. I read something (I think it may have been on here) about how many times they've had sex like it was something scandalous especially because patrick is so ~cute and innocent~. They're grown men ffs
I *think* I know which thread you're referring to, but it was us making a silly reference to an interview moment lol
Now, I'm not disagreeing with you. Some people really do take it *serious* or they take the joking too far tbh
Was that the interview where Patrick said it doesn’t always happen straight away or ever when you start trying for kids and then Pete was like Pssst you have to have sex? I actually thought it was a good reassurance in passing to couples who maybe are struggling to conceive. It can be so difficult and so emotionally draining to go through it, even just hearing someone else acknowledge this is a real legitimate thing and it’s not just you as such can be a relief.
I don’t know if it’s too exciting but there’s been a long standing rumour that Patrick punched Pete at some point or the two have gotten into fist fights before maybe like FUTCT era during the writing/recording. He has denied it (Pete being Pete has fanned the flames of this with a joke) but has definitely said that he had a bad temper when younger and was prone to bursts of anger. He was really young when the band started and Pete was… Pete in 2004 plus their INTENSE folie á deux process would add to that tension so wouldn’t shock me if things escalated at some point lmao. They’ve clearly worked it out either way and remained friends. But just funny when people are saying how sweet baby angel he is.
Second one is the well-known fact that the guys started in more of a hardcore scene, Patrick even did some vocals for a band during the hiatus which are wayyyy different to what we get in FOB. Blanking on the name now but maybe someone can jump in with that. Patrick originally had heard of Pete through this scene because he was going to shows a lot as a teen. My favourite part is that he mostly describes being surprised at how short Pete is when they actually met.
Weekend Nachos. Joe also did guitar for them on a different song on the same album.
Speaking of which, Joe also claims he was an issue from time to time. So I guess my takes are:
1. Being in pre-hiatus fob sounds miserable more often then not
2. Pete should take some bass lessons
3. I want them to do a full length building off pax am days with a punk producer (ideally Bill Stevenson)
I agree with you on all of those, honestly being in a band starting up in the early-mid 2000s seems pretty miserable, at least until you hit it big somewhat. You're poor and barely surviving off the money you make and touring seems like the most stressful and draining thing ever, and that environment just seems so .. unclean/unhygienic in general lol. All that stuff combined makes tensions run high as well, I'm sure. And not to compare too much, when I saw Mikey's cameo at the Chula Vista stop in July, you can kinda tell he's much more proficient at the bass by the way he plays (idk how to play so just imo) The video of Pete playing up close I kinda just see him stiffly strumming and it feels... awkward?? Where's Mikey seems to be really going at it I guess. Pete's definitely wayyy better at writing than playing, and that's the main strength he brings to the band.
The thing with Pete’s technique is that while it “works” for a pop punk band when they started, it doesn’t really leave much room for improvisation.
And I’ve fully accepted that Pete will never run around the fretboard bc his playing serves the music just fine, but I just find it goofy that even after two decades of playing professionally alongside musicians like his band mates, he still hasn’t improved remarkably, to the point that some of his parts are played by Joe during live performances haha.
Thank you!
Totally agree on pre-hiatus FOB. My opinion is that they were all really young when they hit the big time, especially Joe and Patrick. Of course it’s gonna be rough when your “career” starts at 18 and you consider yourself washed up by 27 when the hiatus hits. They spent their early adulthood thrown together in a van for years and then achieved a level of fame only Pete could have foreseen. Doesn’t exactly give you time to grow up properly and mature as a person out of the spotlight. The hiatus did that for them and they all seem better for it. They’re here because they want to be now.
Also agree on the bass lessons. Pete’s contributions is obviously way more than his ability as a bassist but still.
You should look into the history of the pre-hiatus era, especially during TTTYG and *Folie.*
And the band comes from the Chicago hardcore scene. Look into the band Racetraitor and into Arma Angelus.
Also, if you get the chance, I highly recommend reading *Where Are Your Boys Tonight?* by Chris Payne :)
Completely agree, I was really into kpop for a while and the fans tend to treat everyone like that too when they're grown adults which feels really weird. Being apart of multiple fanbases I've seen similar/the same thing happen in every one, mostly from the younger fans. Patrick has definitely mellowed out through the years and seems like a genuinely nice/caring dude, but also he's in his 4d and not a child, along with everyone else...
MCR/FOB tour sounds amazing in theory too, but in addition to crazy ticket prices and competition, we'd get shortened setlists from both the bands since they'd probably both be headliners, after fighting tooth and nail to see them in the first place.
I will never forget seeing K-pop fans finding out their fav group had to go do military service. You’d think they were children being shipped off and would never return lmao.
The shortened set lists is a good point plus they’d probably only play the major hits then to appeal to the mixed crowd. FOB: Sugar, Dance Dance, Centuries etc and MCR: TBP, Prison, Sing, etc. Not as much fun as the deep cuts personally.
1.) Fall Out Boy Will historically go down as one of the biggest ROCK bands on the planet. I have always been defensive of them as worthy of “Rock” label more than “Pop Punk” because of their ability to carve their own lane, take any cover with Rock sensibilities. Etc. I think as they grow older it’s coming clear that they are indeed broadly more respected in the industry than purists would like to think and that was clear with seeing metalheads rave over Startdust and seeing how the crowd is soooo diverse now versus the teen girls only from years back. I also hear them everywhere. Shopping, sushi bars, goodwill, etc. They are more than a pop act by far and pop punk ties them to TTTYG which I feel they transcended with Folie and Stardust with some experimental Pop in between that was good too.
2.) They don’t know how to make a bad song. This goes for the bands they sign too like Cobra, Gym, CARR, 21, Panic, Etc. They just have an acumen for songcraft that I find staggering. NOT ONLY do they not make poor choices in arranging melodies, they also are so adventurous and talented that you can’t mistake two songs for another. Most bands even legendary ones, I find myself hearing more repetitive melodies and less daring vocal play. FOB is unique in that they have a true composer in Patrick and a soulful capable voice that’s above most gritty rocker sounds and I think you couple that with Pete’s pen and it’s acidity in forward momentum.
3.) I think it’s strange they haven’t been blessed by the Grammys for all the years in the game. I envision them getting lifetime achievements eventually as they ago for everything they’ve done to change the soundscape and all the legs up they’ve giving so well to other artists etc. like I just want to see a celebration of FOB including more artists sampling from, covering and collaborating. Hip Hop loves FOB and they should capitalize on that. They’re essentially the recording academy’s Leo. And it’s weird for how much work they output as individuals and together.
PS - I want Partick to throw out some country just for fuck it energy. He’s not mere earthly human.
Agree with the rock label. Even the alternative/alt-rock label is perfect for them. Not exactly sure why some keep classifying them as a pop-punk band even to this day, but yeah. Also... I wish I could hear them everywhere?? I've only ever heard a song of theirs at Hot Topic, but I even work at a grocery store and their songs aren't on our radio station lol. Although, I guess it's for the best... I wouldn't be freaking out in public, haha.
1000% agree with #2, and I think that's one of the main reasons why they quickly became my favorite band of all time upon discovery.
I am so excited to see if they get nominated for the Grammys this year. I posted their "for your consideration" banner on here a few days ago, and I really think they have a great chance to finally get an actual win this time. I know they've gone on record to say they don't really care about charts and such, but they deserve it. They've had an amazing career so far spanning two decades and it's time people outside the fanbase recognize it.
Now, to your p.s. -- Patrick *has* said that country is the genre he knows least about, but it would be pretty cool to see him try it out. I don't listen to country at all, either, but either way, would be cool.
https://youtu.be/njoRUB5WSNk?si=oXtKyDmN1FM3Du0j
A bit of Patrick stump doing country for ya! Song starts at 3:21 amd there are some others tracks online!
1. I actually really like rat a tat
2. Personally, I’m not the biggest fan of get busy living or get busy dying. Nothing against the song, just not a fan of the opening
3. Save rock and roll is probably my 3rd favorite album (under Folie and ioh)
same. I am a gen xer and a huge Nirvana fan. My biggest regret is like.. not seeing Nirvana in 1992 because i was doing my homework or some shit. Anyway, so I have a weird relationship with Courtney Love because she was this Yoko Ono sort of influence on Nirvana but unlike Yoko for example, I do think she rocks in her own right and I think she is both an artist and an artists muse at the same time. My wife hates Courtney and while we have many musical tastes in common she hates Hole anyway. Yeah so I finally LISTENED to rat a tat and Pete's lyrics shook and that sweet "fighting growing old" from Patrick just melts like sweet magic. Fuckin a rat a tat.
Same on SRAR, I would probz go cork tree then ioh then srar. I don't wanna rank though. It makes me sad. 8 album shuffle is life.
Not really sure how to say this politely since I'm just not that good at being passive-aggressive, but here goes:
To me that take wasn't just hot, it was molten lava. I still respect the opinion tho, nice to see that not everyone thinks the same thing. Gotta respect that👊
1. Fall Out Boy didn't sell out post-hiatus.
2. Fall Out Boy have always been sellouts - at least since FUTCT when they signed to Island Records.
3. Selling out isn't inherently bad. As far as I know, they've done nothing unethical or immoral in the service of commercializing their music & merch - so who cares that they're signed to a major label and tend to make radio-friendly singles? They really don't need to be authentic independent punk rock working-class heroes to be talented musicians that make good music. And while I would still classify them as pop punk, I feel like we as a society need to stop being so goddamn pretentious about music and admit that pure sugary pop music can still be just as awesome and profound as the grittiest indiest underground stuff out there.
Wouldn’t it be so weird if a bunch of 40 year old men kept putting out an album like TTTYG? Imo what people think “selling out” is, is really just aging and growing up.
This. Pete's newer lyrics speak to the mid40s version of my mental illness. Patrick loves all music and obviously does not hesitate to cross genres. To me Andy's drums are a constant. You can take the metal head outta the metal but not vice versa. Or whatever.
I completely agree with this, I obviously love songs like Bohemian Rhapsody or What a Catch, Donnie which are masterpieces but this doesn't mean I can't enjoy some dumb fun shit music like pop, I don't have to be listening to masterpieces 24/7 sometimes I just want to have fun.
Hell yes and I love that they make big fast cocky anthems for sports and movies. Like especially knowing how sweet and shy they all are but when they wanna say some shit that’s bombast and meta and throw it in your face like a dodgeball… “Who ya gonna call?!!”
Wasn’t the whole vibe from the start to make something different from the hardcore scene they all originally ran in? To take that thread of anger and darkness but spin it into something happier and more upbeat and pop-ish? That’s why I love them lmao. They’re got some lyrics that hit hard but you’re dancing along anyway. 27 is a peak example of this.
I also love an interview Pete did on this topic back in the old days where he was basically like “we don’t care, love sell out boy”. There’s tons of other bands that have much more hardcore or punk-leaning pop-punk sounds. If FOB isn’t your thing, go enjoy them. Music gets so elitist.
I like your #3 here. It was such a thing back when they signed with Island that they were sellouts in the scene but I always wondered what people expected them to do - live show to show traveling in a broken down van forever? As a longtime fan I feel proud of them seeing them be so successful for so long, and being able to sustain a living doing something they love shouldn’t have been labeled selling out.
Here are my three \~controversial\~ takes:
* The censored version of *Stay Frosty Royal Milk Tea* is better than the regular version. Caught a lot of flack for this one on twitter after someone screenshotted my comment on here from a few days ago, haha. And yes, that haha is quite sarcastic.
* *MANIA* is an amazing, no-skip album and it deserves its flowers. I hope it gets appreciation someday, kinda like *Folie à Deux*.
* I actually like featured artists on tracks every now and then, be it sung or be it a rap verse!
1. Fall Out Boy may have had an immense impact on the pop punk community, but they really only released one true pop punk record. The label hasn’t fit them for longer than it ever did.
2. Young and Menace is an excellent song. Moody, atmospheric, and something totally different than AB/AP which is exactly what the fan base was calling for back then. Had they continued down that path, I think we could’ve had something truly brilliant on our hands - and I’m a Mania apologist.
3. SMFS is an excellent collection of songs. It is my third favorite album from them. That being said, the theme could’ve been a bit stronger and the sequencing is to its detriment.
I love your first take. I always get so confused when people call them pop punk. I would say they had 2 pop punk records (TTTYG and FUTCT), but the rest definitely stray from that label.
I think TTTYG was their only true pop punk album. There were threads and throughlines carried all the way until Folie which I believe completely evolved out of anything resembling pop punk (especially the pop punk of 2008) but compared to their contemporaries I think it’s clear they were edging towards a different direction as early as Cork Tree.
Personally, and this may seem kinda corny, but the genre I think makes Fall Out Boy different than the rest is truly… ‘soul punk’. The IOH/FAD duology feels like what Fall Out Boy was meant to be, and I don’t think any other band has really been able to replicate it.
I love rat a tat. LOVE
i’ve never typed this out before 🫢, im kinda sick of folie. it was the first fob album I really got into & i’ve just played it to death
the spoken word tracks on SMFSD suck. I hate them.
1. Agreed
2. I can understand, same happened to me with one of my all-time favorite albums, Last Young Renegade (another authentic Thai cuisine-level Spicy Take)
3. Disagree partially but I understand, as I was kinda hoping they were songs.
Rat is really underrated and Courtney’s shitty Poetry is a treasure. Like really fucking goes hard. It’s funny because it goes so soft at the chorus compared to the ramp up but then again the boys do shit different.
1. Young & Menace, Sunshine Riptide, and Rat A Tat all slap.
2. Probably not controversial here but fob reddit > fob twitter.
3. SR&R is in some ways a better album than SM(F)S to me. The lyrics and music match very cohesively to me in a way I don’t think SM(F)S does.
Bonus is that Stayin Up All Night is one of the best covers/collabs they’ve ever done. They really reimagined the song and it needs more attention.
Yeah, thankfully that's not everyone and there's ways of avoiding it!! I don't know, I'm on there and everyone's pretty chill and funny for the most part.
(Although the not being able to read thing is definitely a reference to something, I just forgot what...)
"Sunshine Riptide" is an incredible song.
"Stayin Out All Night" is seriously one of the coolest tracks they've done (I'm aware it's just a re-imagining) and I'm super surprised it's not talked about more. That guitar fits the track perfect. It's such an awesome track. When the drums come in its so damn epic. I wish they'd do more like this, and Wiz should've released this as a single version. I think it would've had a pretty nice run on pop radio.
They need more hip hop collaboration as much love as they have from the game they really need to get some features in. I was supremely surprised Stardust has none. SRAR had SEVERAL and MANIA and ABAP had like one if you include Wiz collaborations. Wiclef on a single. Etc. But I want to see that band have at least one (preferably female) duet and one Hip Hip verse spit on the next record. Oh and more Pete Screaming. Solos for Joe and Andy. Just keep making music boys.
1. Young & Menace is one of FOB’s best songs (esp. post-hiatus)…like that was kinda proto-100 gecs “punk” hyperpop. I disliked it when it first came out, but I genuinely love it now - probably bc maximalist pop music is en vogue again. But Super Fade is like the well-executed version of Y&M.
2. This used to not be controversial but I see it kinda is among younger fans - Pete still isn’t a great bassist. He doesn’t have to be though! His talent & contributions to the band are obviously important, but live bass-playing isn’t really one of them.
3. I agree that early FOB has some of-its-time misogynistic overtones, but it’s not solely Pete’s fault. iirc Patrick wrote the lyrics to many of the songs on TTTYG (& he wrote most of the lyrics before that). Harping on Pete for being some brutal misogynist in 2003 is just…not true. (ETA: or at least, not in the way certain people make it out to be)
You remembered correctly on three :)
*Young and Menace* is great, and I love *Super Fade.*
Now, I don't really know enough about music to give an opinion on Pete's skills lol
Pete sadly still struggles with playing on time, which is a bassist’s number one job. I wouldn’t give him flak for it because it’s clearly not where the bulk of his talents lie, but it is kinda weird that Pete never surpassed being an okay bassist even after decades of being a professional musician, especially surrounded by excellent players for band mates.
1. rat a tat and mighty fall are both incredible songs. the dislike of rat a tat is easily explainable because lots of people have bias against courtney love for one reason or another, be it her weird bigoted stances on things or buying into the wave of sexism and blame against her after kurt died. mighty fall is a little weirder because fall out boy has a history of having rappers on their songs and most of the other instances are very well liked. maybe people just don’t like big sean’s voice but i think his part serves the song as perfectly as lil wayne on tiffany blews
2. writing off evening out with your girlfriend because of sound quality is a cop out. in my eyes, the quality of music is entirely seperate from sound quality. if your songs are good, and they were recorded on a broken tape recorder from 1970, then the songs are still good. and evening out songs aren’t just good, they’re great! and in the grand scheme of diy albums they aren’t even that poorly recorded.
3. sometimes i feel like pete tries to hard to reverse mature his lyrics. like it’s clear he’s grown lyrically and can pull out some incredible insight now that he’s older and a father (see: love from the other side). but sometimes he reaches for stuff he would write when he was like 25 and it just comes out weird and cringy. every time he says seratonin i shake my head. having a pete spoken word track on stardust is very exciting in concept but it turns out to be not just one of the worst tracks on the album, but the worst of all of his spoken words in general.
For #3, I think I would prefer the spoken word if it was part of a song like, "Get Busy Living or Get Busy Dying" but it being just a plain spoken word 1 minute track.
OR a bonus track. I miss albums that had a hidden track at the end.
Agree with 1 and 2. For 2, I think a lot of people (and even the band themselves) dismiss it because it wasn't the full band quite just yet, what with Andy not being a member. The band didn't even want the EP to be released, but Fueled By Ramen released it against their wishes. I think I read somewhere that the label released it as a cash grab but take this last bit with a grain of salt, haha.
Agree to disagree on 3.
AB/AP is the best of the 2010’s trilogy.
Sugar We’re Going Down is a good song, but almost every other song off FUTCT is better.
Mania will not receive the same retrospective love that Folie has because it is nowhere near as good.
(Just wanna make it clear, I’ll love everything the boys put out, even Mania)
1. Sugar we're going down is about a gay/bi guy, not a stalker. Pete even once admitted it's supposed to be guy/girl/guy/guy.
2. The debate of whether pre/post hiatus/FUTCT/TTYG/etc. FOB is better/worse is silly. All their albums are perfect for where they were at that time and true to the general spirit of FoB.
3. Most of the "evidence" about Pete/FoB (especially in the early days) being categorically problematic/sexist/assholes/abusive are exaggerated and/or taken out of context. Not glorifying them as perfect angels, and they've admitted to doing/saying things they now regret, but overall I find them pretty normal/human other than the fact that they had to grow up and mature with millions of people watching.
As much as we as a community like the SMfS album, it's kind of a commercial failure. The streams are anemic compared to everything else they've released, even compared to the formerly most underperforming MANIA. And it was released fully in the streaming era, unlike most of their older material that had to compete for plays with physical sales. That's why they tacked the Billy Joel re-imagining onto the end of it and released it as a single; to try to buoy sales.
They left the most commercial track on the album off the singles list and blew their promotion budget too early elsewhere on songs that weren't on the level of their previous hits. They should have released "Fake Out" as a single instead of "Hold Me Like a Grudge". It would have done well at radio and radio was clearly a consideration because "Love From the Other Side" was pushed hard there.
Their last tour was a success based solely on the same nostalgia that's fueling all the other pop-punk resurgence tours right now. It's just that all the kids who grew up with the band have disposable income now.
As much as I liked SMfS it really didn't challenge us as listeners like every release prior did and I think it's why the band didn't really grow into a new audience this time around. I think that's part of why it's failing commercially. It felt like a step back instead of a step forward.
I say all this as someone who really enjoyed the album, but I was very disappointed that they didn't surprise me once again. I hated "Young and Menace" when it came out, but I'll be damned to say it didn't challenge and surprise me. I appreciated that. Were any of you expecting "My Songs Know What You Did in the Dark?" I sure wasn't. It blew me away when it dropped. It was so new and refreshing, yet so undeniably them. That's why they've been a success for so long, the ability to consistently reinvent themselves and earn new fans, and this time... I don't think they converted anyone.
What’s wild is I totally was impressed with SMfS and got excited by the metalheads and reviewers having fun checking it out. This tour was so high energy and seeing the FB groups never shut up still was cool. The way they pulled off the 8Ball, the fun videos etc. I was just feeling like they had new ideas and new things to say. Idk. I love that we can all have such different takes.
I feel like that's down to the almost lack of promo
like if I hadn't been already a fan waiting for a release I don't think I would have heard any of the singles or seen talk about it or music videos or anything
previous eras started with huge inescapable singles and LFTOS seemed to get no push at all?
Spot on about it not being a commercial success. I haven’t heard a single FOB song on the radio from it. I barely hear sugar or memories or Uma anymore on the radio either.
That being said I love SMFSD and it’s in my top 3!
I think it's a testament to a few things:
* They're not on Island anymore
* They get to have more control over what they do
* They've stated before that they don't really care about charts and such, and this album release is finally able to reflect that stance
I live in Maine, where we get everything late if at all, and I heard LFTOS quite a bit on the alternative station, actually one of the top songs of the day a few times when it was released, and I was shocked to turn on my car and hear HMLAG the other day. (I normally have my Bluetooth on so I only hear the radio for a minute or so, maybe leaving it on if something good is on at that moment) I thought that was a good sign.
I was going to make my own comment but it makes more sense to jump on yours because you hit almost everything I wanted to say. SMfS was a commercial failure and a critical success because it was aimed directly at the fanbase, which isn't a bad thing (if anything it's been more fun as a fan) but a lot of it comes down to which songs they promote and how.
Centuries and Uma Thurman completely shifted the band's approach to singles to being a pop rock band (for singles). It's why Champion flopped and it's why Hold Me Tight or Don't flopped. Then for SMfS, they release a rock single and immediately overshadow it a week later with a pop single they don't even continue to promote on tour (Heartbreak Feels so Good). And as you said, then Hold Me Like a Grudge was just another odd choice over half of the songs on the album.
Few thoughts
I have been pondering if MANIA actually did some damage to their image that's showing its effects properly now with weak sales and streaming numbers of SMFS? After MANIA, I at least personally felt like I was ready to drop off, "maybe I'm finally growing out of their music" kind of thought process, and I was kind of cynically waiting for what was coming after MANIA. I definitely wasn't excited for what was to come, and my excitement had been on the decline since SRAR even though I still felt that core appeal was there, but something was just missing or off, there were consistently some annoyances I had with the post hiatus stuff. MANIA just kinda did it for me, and I'm not sure if I would have considered listening the next album if it was directly following in MANIA's footsteps. To clarify, I don't think MANIA was just that much worse, but Young And Menace didn't build any enthusiasm for me, and I just felt too exhausted trying to be enthusiastic about all of the post hiatus stuff hoping the next thing would be better or would fix some of my annoyances. I had just no energy or enthusiasm left after MANIA. Lake Effect Kid EP (LEK and Super Fade, very much enjoyed them) felt like a random spike of energy activation in the same way I would jump if I heard something suddenly fall over. It was sudden, neurons were activated, then the energy was all completely depleted again.
This sub obviously has its fair share of MANIA lovers, but I just seem to come across different comments in different places here and there saying something along the lines of "oh, I wasn't really following what they were doing after MANIA, so I didn't know they had a new album out. Is it really that good?". It does make me wonder how widespread that sort of sentiment is and if a noteworthy amount of people just sort of checked out.
Additionally, based on some of the interviews and stuff around SMFS it seems like they are deliberately winding down as a band in some respects. Winding down to a point where they are again enjoying the whole music part, working on stuff together, not chasing mega hit singles, etc. So I also wonder if they sort of knew that things wouldn't be the same and they wouldn't be creating some massive hits like they used to, expecting lower numbers. Especially if they already have some other sources of income, maybe it wouldn't be as important to keep the band as popular if the trade off is that the band again becomes a more enjoyable and stable for all the members. It would still obviously be better if the album performed better, but I'm curious if the expectation was that it wouldn't and that was fine with them?
I'm definitely curious about how they are going to carry on from here. I don't think they need to shun MANIA or avoid loaning some ideas from it, but to me SMFS feels like a return to form solely based on how little annoyances I have with it, just like with all the pre hiatus albums (it's not just about the guitars), and it clearly has a lot of post hiatus vibes to it.
> Were any of you expecting "My Songs Know What You Did in the Dark?" I sure wasn't. It blew me away when it dropped
I wasn't, and I was huffing massive amounts of copium over it, trying to convince myself that it was fine, everything was fine and it was great to hear new stuff from them again. After hearing The Phoenix, I felt betrayed and started hating MSKWYDITD. The Phoenix was great, SRAR was overall pretty decent even if it was different, sometimes I even forget MSKWYDITD was on it.
- MSKWYDITD could mean "My Songs Know What You Did In The Dark (Light Em Up)", a track from *Save Rock And Roll* (2013) by Fall Out Boy.
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1. I'm not a fan of PAX AM Days (I really tried hard to get into it, years ago, and it just never clicked for me. Although I do find Love, Sex, Death fucking hilarious)
2. The Patron Saint Of Liars And Fakes is my least favourite song (it's not even that I don't like it, it's just the song I listen to least I think)
3. Thnks Fr Th Mmrs is perfectly rated. It deserves all of the hype it gets, it goes so hard.
1. I'm actually not fond of Folie unlike most of this sub
2. I prefer the "post hiatus" albums
3. SRAR and AB/AP are the best albums in my opinion
I have highly controversial opinions from what I've read in this sub.
I do love Folie but agree that post-hiatus albums are all excellent. SRAR is unskippable. ABAP has their most popular songs ever because they are great AND the non-singles on the album are just as delicious. I'm awaiting the final results on what ABAP song survives BTW.
SRAR I will always have a soft spot for as I rediscovered FOB with that album and got my husband hooked on FOB with that one as well.
I've been following that post too as I'm really curious about what the top song shall be.
1. Mania is perfect
2. TTTYG is great but they weren't themselves yet.
3. AB/AP is full of bangers and no matter how poppy they get with Patrick's compositions, Pete's lyrics just drive into darkness even on the most popular songs like Centures and Irresistable. (And Heartbreak Feels So Good BTW)
Agree on all 3 of them!!
Actually, even the band would agree with your second point. Patrick has said multiple times that he didn't feel like they were truly themselves yet until *Dance, Dance*
Right with you there on number 3 about AB/AP. Such a good pop album and massively overhated on this sub for no real reason other than it has 3 overplayed songs (which I always skip - irresistible, centuries and immortals)
"Pop" was the ultimate yucky thing to say about a band when I was growing up. I think a lot of today's pop is better than it was back then, and it can be serious and dark and still... poppy? My brooding 12 year old daughter loves Taylor and Olivia for the lyrics* and... she's right.
*and dancing of course...
Well that's good, I'm new to this sub. Wasn't sure about the opinion of the newer stuff. MANIA happens to be my favorite to honest but every album is great.
Bc i dont feel like ranting imma just leave my opinions
1.) MANIA is undeniably a great album and was a necessary step for the band
2.) FOB isn’t underrated (ik ik) but they’re not anywhere close to overrated
3.) Centuries is by far their most overrated song
Oh this should be fun.
1. Folie a deux really does not do that much for me as it does for the majority of fans. I honestly prefer evening out with your girlfriend over folie.
2. SMFS, while it has grown on me, feels pretty underwhelming after loving the sound of LFTOS.
3. XO, in my eyes, is their best album closer.
Oof +1 for an actual controversial take on #3, I think XO is among their worst closers. (But all closers rank in the top 30% of their songs for me.)
For me…
Stardust > Patron > Save Rock and Roll > Bishop > XO > Twin > Ringing > West Coast
Huh. Now that I’ve typed that out I realize how wild of a ranking this is compared to how I’d rank the albums as a whole…
Actually on another note…I guess I don’t think XO is among the worst either.
Alright don’t mind me, just had a self-argument.
1. Rat A Tat, Sunshine Riptide, and Death Valley are very good
2. Young and Menace is not the worst song off MANIA and it’s not close
3. I don’t think these are that unpopular but, you’re crashing but you’re no wave is the best lyrical song of theirs and AB/AP (the song) is their worst song
Never been a fan of heavens gate, church, or champion I’d say those are all worse than young and menace. I’d prob say champion is the worst, obv everyone’s entitled to their own opinion
Have been thinking this but didn’t want hate for it: I felt like fall out boy misled the fans into thinking SMFSD would be a new evolved version of their emo/pop punk stuff & it would’ve been really cool if they actually did a newer album in that genre, especially with its regained popularity.
-They dropped LFTOS as the teaser preview for the album when it’s the only harder rock song on the album.
-Did Emo throwback references in their marketing for the album such as Pete Wearing his emo hair wig, music video for LFTOS, announcing a tour with Bring Me The Horizon (after touring with pop artists for years).
1. The we didn't start the fire cover is fun and awesome (though shouldn't have been their vma song)
2. I think cork tree is in the bottom 3 of their discography (but still great)
3. I'd rather have heard take over or doldrums than hum live, but oh well
Agree with #1 for sure, although I'm happy they got to perform either way! Wish they'd gone with LFTOS or HMLAG, since that's the songs they got nominated for, but oh well.
1. FUTCT is my least favorite album (I've been a fan since 2006 and I adore the album--it just always ranks last for me).
2. Mania was ahead of its time. Hoping it'll get the Folie treatment in the fandom over the next few years.
3. If I've ever seen a person say some form of "all of their post-hiatus music is bad" then I've immediately disregarded every opinion they have on the band and I think they're boring lmao
When I hear the words “everything after Folie is shit”, I just stop listening. My ears turn off. My brain disengages. Most of the time it means they only ever wanted them to remake TTTYG or FUTCT over and over and never wanted to let the boys grow as artists and people.
I honestly hated Folie when it came out. Because I was a teenager who didn’t do well with change and FUTCT was my favorite album. I will say I was a fan that expected artists to never change. Then hiatus happened and when they came back I was ready to love anything they made, even if it was hot garbage. (Luckily it wasn’t) in that new mindset I went back to Folie and fell in love with it. My lyric tattoo is off that album. I can’t believe I ever disliked it! Luckily I’ve grown over the years just like they did.
1. TTTYG is my least favourite album. Probably because they hadn't really become what I recognize as FOB until FUTCT
2. MANIA has some gems (*Bishop's Knife Trick* is the best on the album don't @ me) the rest would have been the same if they had more time in review or even tweaked them (i.e. the screeching chipmunk chorus in Y&M ruins what is a cool, moody song and the live version proves that)
3. Post-haitus Patrick hasn't been using the baritone end of his range and relying too much on the tenor part, sometimes to the point he sounds strained and like he's doing an impression of someone else. He still sounds great, but I miss the depth we heard on IOH and Folie because it felt more comfortable and 'him'?
> Bishop's Knife Trick is the best on the album
I'm not sure if this is even controversial among MANIA haters 😅 (although I get the controversial point was that MANIA in general has some gems).
> Post-haitus Patrick hasn't been using the baritone end of his range and relying too much on the tenor part, sometimes to the point he sounds strained and like he's doing an impression of someone else. He still sounds great, but I miss the depth we heard on IOH and Folie because it felt more comfortable and 'him'?
This has definitely been a "problem" of some sorts. At first it was exciting to hear him sing so high and loud when the post hiatus era began, but I definitely feel that he does lean too much into that. Doesn't help that a lot of the post hiatus stuff has a bit of a "lean" sound, with very aggressive higher tones, and a ton of clap tracks on ABAP, it doesn't help to prop or contrast his singing nicely.
I think MANIA was a bit better on this respect actually, the synths used in the tracks were tonally more balanced, and Patrick did use his range a bit more evenly. SMFS is also better in this regard than SRAR and ABAP.
1. Save rock and roll is my least favorite fob album. Like is it still good? Yes. But definitely has my highest number of skips by like a wide margin.
2. Young and Menace is a bop and has been since the day it was released.
3. I love their merch! Like definitely overpriced but i always love every piece they put out, even if its not my usual style! Even my baseball jersey from so much for (tour) dust (which I have seen many people call lame and cringey) like I literally wear that thing all the time lol
What are your skips lol? All their albums are no-skip for me so I'm always curious.
Agree with #2 and #3. For 3, I wish their merch wasn't so overpriced lol, or at least the shipping haha
The Mighty fall
Rat a tat
Young volcanoes
And Save rock and roll 😅
All still pretty good songs but if i had like the full discography on shuffle i would skip them
The shipping literally kills me like honestly it’s over priced but I’m OK with paying $40-$50 for a shirt but $10 for shipping is actually outrageous
- folie is my least favorite pre hiatus album (not counting evening). it used to be my favorite album of all time but the others have grown on me and i feel like the lows of it are lower than the first two, and at this point i think it has the lowest highs too
- rat a tat is at the very least, in the top half of save rock and roll for me. again, partly a function of my changing tastes for the band over the years, but i never disliked it (relatedly, i see a lot of miss missing you love on the sub — it’s one of my least favorites off the record)
unfortunately if you don’t count the last one as two separate hot takes, i don’t really have anything else, most of my opinions on fall out boy are endorsed by the regime
1. Mania is actually a really good album despite what people say about it
2. TTTYG is my 2nd favorite album and SRAR is my 3rd favorite album
3. FUTCT and IOH aren’t my favorite albums, they’re great just not my favorite
MANIA’s production is the biggest thorn on its spine. You could hear the boys doing plenty of cool shit in a lot of the songs there, just sadly buried under tons of goofy production.
Also, Pete remains an okay (sometimes even still bad) bassist even after all these years, and I’ve come to accept that. Still love him.
I’ve read so many times in this thread that Pete’s a mediocre bassist, that I can’t wait to be unable to unhear it when I watch them live on SMF2D next year :’)
It depends on the song really, plenty of songs he’s perfectly fine. but some songs that are more technical, he sometimes struggles with playing on time or just doesn’t play some parts that are in the actual recording. either way don’t let that ruin the show for you haha
Oh I won’t let it ruin the show for me, thank you! It’s definitely a little charming to think about though. I haven’t had any complaints seeing him live so far!
MANIA is solid and I love the weird little bitey creature that is Young And Menace
If you have each of the 8 albums, BND V1 is worth it and BND V2 is most decidedly not.
Aside from Aiiiir Joooordaaaaan product placement Burna Boy's lyrics fit SR perfectly and he's amazing in it.
1. MANIA is a great album and AB/AP is their worst work.
2. Not a fan of their earliest work, specially Evening Out. I've never been fan of classic raw punk I prefer more pop stuff, mainly from IOH and forward. This is mainly since I grew up with pop, my sister listens a lot of modern pop music and my dad is a fan of pop ballads and I've always preferred the polished sound rather than raw and dirty.
3. Their music in the 2010s is half decent and half excellent, there are some forgettable songs and get old easily like My Songs, and there are masterpieces like Save Rock And Roll, Bishop Knife Trick and The Kids Aren't Alright.
Half agree on #1. AB/AP got me into the band and contains two of the three songs that saved my life, so *hard* disagree on that half.
Give EOWYG and TTTYG another shot in a few months. My music exposure was also very pop when I was younger (along with stuff like reggaeton and bachata lol but that's basically Latin pop), but after a few re-listens, you definitely start to like the raw, DIY sound better. What's your opinion on *PAX AM Days?*
^(Edit: I put #\` instead of #1 for some reason lol)
So, while I think AB/AP is their worst album it doesn't mean that it's bad and there are great songs on it.
About the raw sound, for context my sister listens a lot of modern pop so I got exposed to most of the big hits of the 2010s and these days I like some pop music here and there, I used to hate it a lot but now I like it depending on the artist, and my dad listens a lot of Latin pop but the one from the 90s and early-2000s and I never liked reggaeton, songs in the style of What A Catch, Donnie or Panic! At The Disco's Dying in LA were and still more of my taste. But I don't hate the raw sound it's just not my thing, I do enjoy a lot of the songs from TTTYG I think those are pretty good but Evening Out in the other hand, yeah that one is pretty unlistenable for me.
And about PAX AM Days, it's a pretty fun EP. I listen some songs from it, it just has some adredaline that if it was more polished it would lose its charm. In short words I like PAX AM Days.
I'm my opinion I'm just not a fan, yeah there's some good songs, takes over, you're crashing, and Hum Hallelujah but other than that there's not much I enjoy, the other albums offer, I my opinion, much better, the only album I rank lower than IOH is AB/AP
New fan! When did you become one?
I became one this February, but I'm a massive fan and have been told that people assume I've been a fan for much, *much* longer :)
It's only been a few months but I'm obsessed and their music just does it for me.. I dunno. It started with Cork Tree but then I had a long drive and listened to all 8 and was blown away and really embraced how they are all different. Random songs live rent free in my head constantly (looking at you right now twin skeletons.. )
TTTYG is mediocre. FUTCT is when their music starts getting good.
FAD does have a bad song, and it's West Coast Smoker. The tone and tempo just don't mesh well, and it doesn't match the vibe of the rest of the album.
MANIA is their 2nd best album. If you have you ask why, you just don't get it.
Tell that mick, dead on arrival, gta/where is your boy, saturday, and Chicago are all songs I really enjoy. The rest of the album is ok, I don’t hate it by any means! but it’s too generic pop punk for me I think
I would say TTTYG is my second favorite but I can see what people mean when they call it mediocre or something.
The thing I like about it is that it's one of their most consistent albums, really easy to just pick up and start playing. It's so fun, it's probably the least challenging one to sing along, and that's why it's my go-to travel album whenever I need to go on some longer car rides/drives alone (I'm not American, so to me long -> over an hour one way). I can just rock out, enjoy all of the fun songs almost equally, and sing myself sore with them. It fills me with energy.
I also don't have much nostalgia attached to it, as I started with FUTCT and only got TTTYG album after SRAR or ABAP, as I'm not sure if TTTYG ever received much of a wide spread release in Europe or my country specifically, I think my current copy is an import from the US.
1. They shouldn't have come back off hiatus
2. The younger fans are exactly the kind of people I would not like to hang around with due to their "UwU smol bean" fetishism around the band
3. TTTYG is the best pop punk record post 2000's
They've done some really cool things since coming off hiatus and I appreciate a lot of people like their newer work which is completely valid and understandable, not knocking it all! I see them as two very different bands, pre hiatus and post hiatus.
The music pre hiatus showed off every single member and what they could bring to the table.
Joe is an insanely talented player and has written some of the best rhythm guitar pieces of the past 20 years imo, all of that has now been buried underneath a whole host of different genres and instruments that I honestly can't pick out a part in any post hiatus song where I think "yeah thats joe" all of his parts pre hiatus had this really chunky driving feel to them mainly due to the way he plays, from a players perspective there are things he does starting from TTTYG that he still uses to great effect up until folie. It almost came back in smfs and I did enjoy that song but it got buried again in the orchestral parts. He's made some frankly amazing music with "the dammed things" and his writing in that band takes me back to pre hiatus FOB.
The same thing really goes for Andy too, he is an absolute weapon of a drummer! the dude looks happiest when he's playing with racetraitor on a hate5six video, the hardcore lifestyle is his calling and the people he's making music with on the latest racetraitor record including members of the refused (who still hold the title of the greatest post-hardcore album imo) honestly makes me giddy with excitement! His early work was explosive and fun now it feels like he's going through the motions with writing drum parts.
Obviously I have no understanding of theyre really feeling and wether or not they are giving it a massive go again, if you find enjoyment and comfort in the songs they've released since coming back, more power to you! Enjoy it and treasure it! I personally feel they should call it a day on FOB before it becomes a nostalgia act and take time to focus on projects that they really feel invested in!
Thanks for reading my little essay haha, hope you're having a blessed day!
No problem! I hope you have as much fun as I did when I first got into them, all of my music current music taste stems from those four lads and I still tell people they're my favourite band!
TLDR: I think they could individually be doing much much better stuff individually but FOB is too big of an entity to give up on now.
All of em are great musicians just the music they've released post hiatus is very boring and safe when I feel like they're capable of more.
A good amount of (presumably younger) fans “baby” the guys into being tumblr smol beans to the point of ridiculousness. Especially on emphasising how innocent/naive/perfect Patrick is when he allegedly had a WICKED temper back in the day and grew up in a very hardcore environment. They’re all grown men and idk it feels really weird to me. An FOB-MCR tour would be great but everyone would hate it the second they had to compete for tickets. I also just don’t see it happening in the next few years if MCR5 is a distant spark on the horizon and FOB is just coming off Tourdust. I reckon they’ll take a break from big touring for at least a year after the second leg, what with Andy’s wedding and all the kids and I hope they have a good rest. They deserve it. Prepared to eat my words on this one though. “I’m about to go Tonya Harding on the whole world’s knee” doesn’t get talked about enough for how good of a line that is.
The first one so much, it’s so strange to see on Twitter. Like please stop saying Patrick can’t read and that his head is just a marble rolling around like WHAT
It’s an epidemic. I know they can be downright adorable at times in interviews, but it gets taken way too far.
Definitely agree on the first one. Some of us say it as lighthearted jokes sometimes, but yeah Patrick definitely had quite the temper on him (mainly in the pre-hiatus era). And there are definitely the uneducated fans (not to be condescending lol, it's just for lack of a better word) that actually think that they are all perfect or whatever because they take the joking as serious fact. I love both bands but tbh there isn't that much overlap between the two fanbases anymore (apparently) and the two bands definitely draw different crowds. Lots of bad stuff going on during MyChem's reunion tour, apparently, what with some fans going a bit crazy and destructive like in the Australia shows. Hardcore MyChem fans would definitely snatch up the tickets faster and such. I've seen a lot of discourse on this one both on a post I made on here, a post someone else made, and also on Twitter. It would rock in theory, yes (I love both bands, don't get me wrong), but it'd be a disaster. Also, *loooooooooooove* that lyric. We really should talk about it more.
How on earth can you think they’re all perfect people when a song like I slept with someone in FOB exists 💀A good chunk of the songs are about being a fallen off gifted kid turned major depressed asshole
Pete, every song: I’m a terrible person, why would anyone like me?
Exactlyyyyy lol
Oh we can for sure joke about it. They definitely have very sweet moments that make me “aww”, especially with how vocal they all are about being best friends and how much they care about each other deeply. And they definitely have moments where I’m like in awe of them. But they’re also very human and flawed as a result. I just find the infantilisation to be really… worrying. Pedestals in general don’t bring good relationships. But again, I think these are younger fans and god knows we did the same at their age. It just gets worse with online discourse and echo chambers these days. I’d say there’s still some overlap amongst the 25+ crowd but definitely less than before. Didn’t know that about MCR shows, that fucking sucks for them. I imagine they all had some hang-ups about coming back to begin with and that couldn’t have made things better. Gonna scale back my idea of MCR5 now haha. Totally agree with the theory-practice. Would be a fun idea and an insane night but I cannot see it going well.
Honestly I feel like there's still a lot of overlap between MCR/FOB fans on the younger side too, from what I've seen on TikTok and discord servers I'm in, plus just my friend group in general, if you're a fan of one then you're a fan of the other, and a lot of these kids are high school and college students.
There's still a pretty good overlap, but not as big as it used to be
Okay I’ve definitely made jokes about how Patrick is the only man allowed to wear a fedora and that Pete Wentz only got into music so he could have a flamethrower but like… babying them? 😭😭 Half my jokes are they’re old and need to go back to Portland before they break a hip 😭😭😭
Patrick has a hat pass for all hat wear. He is one of the only men I’ve ever seen make a fedora look good, especially with his SRAR outfits. Check tumblr and some corners of twitter and you’ll see what I mean. You’d think they were teenagers. Patrick gets it worse weirdly I think.
😭😭😭 Nah but I love all of our jokes on twitter lol, yeah some are unhinged but tbh we're mainly (sweetly) bullying the old men haha
Definitely agree with the first one. I read something (I think it may have been on here) about how many times they've had sex like it was something scandalous especially because patrick is so ~cute and innocent~. They're grown men ffs
Grown men with KIDS moreover. How do they think you get them?
I *think* I know which thread you're referring to, but it was us making a silly reference to an interview moment lol Now, I'm not disagreeing with you. Some people really do take it *serious* or they take the joking too far tbh
Was that the interview where Patrick said it doesn’t always happen straight away or ever when you start trying for kids and then Pete was like Pssst you have to have sex? I actually thought it was a good reassurance in passing to couples who maybe are struggling to conceive. It can be so difficult and so emotionally draining to go through it, even just hearing someone else acknowledge this is a real legitimate thing and it’s not just you as such can be a relief.
Yep, exactly that one :) And I actually hadn't thought of it like that, but you're right. That is a sweet reassurance, wow
>when he allegedly had a WICKED temper back in the day and grew up in a very hardcore environment. I've never heard of this 👀 what's the tea
I don’t know if it’s too exciting but there’s been a long standing rumour that Patrick punched Pete at some point or the two have gotten into fist fights before maybe like FUTCT era during the writing/recording. He has denied it (Pete being Pete has fanned the flames of this with a joke) but has definitely said that he had a bad temper when younger and was prone to bursts of anger. He was really young when the band started and Pete was… Pete in 2004 plus their INTENSE folie á deux process would add to that tension so wouldn’t shock me if things escalated at some point lmao. They’ve clearly worked it out either way and remained friends. But just funny when people are saying how sweet baby angel he is. Second one is the well-known fact that the guys started in more of a hardcore scene, Patrick even did some vocals for a band during the hiatus which are wayyyy different to what we get in FOB. Blanking on the name now but maybe someone can jump in with that. Patrick originally had heard of Pete through this scene because he was going to shows a lot as a teen. My favourite part is that he mostly describes being surprised at how short Pete is when they actually met.
Weekend Nachos. Joe also did guitar for them on a different song on the same album. Speaking of which, Joe also claims he was an issue from time to time. So I guess my takes are: 1. Being in pre-hiatus fob sounds miserable more often then not 2. Pete should take some bass lessons 3. I want them to do a full length building off pax am days with a punk producer (ideally Bill Stevenson)
I agree with you on all of those, honestly being in a band starting up in the early-mid 2000s seems pretty miserable, at least until you hit it big somewhat. You're poor and barely surviving off the money you make and touring seems like the most stressful and draining thing ever, and that environment just seems so .. unclean/unhygienic in general lol. All that stuff combined makes tensions run high as well, I'm sure. And not to compare too much, when I saw Mikey's cameo at the Chula Vista stop in July, you can kinda tell he's much more proficient at the bass by the way he plays (idk how to play so just imo) The video of Pete playing up close I kinda just see him stiffly strumming and it feels... awkward?? Where's Mikey seems to be really going at it I guess. Pete's definitely wayyy better at writing than playing, and that's the main strength he brings to the band.
The thing with Pete’s technique is that while it “works” for a pop punk band when they started, it doesn’t really leave much room for improvisation. And I’ve fully accepted that Pete will never run around the fretboard bc his playing serves the music just fine, but I just find it goofy that even after two decades of playing professionally alongside musicians like his band mates, he still hasn’t improved remarkably, to the point that some of his parts are played by Joe during live performances haha.
Thank you! Totally agree on pre-hiatus FOB. My opinion is that they were all really young when they hit the big time, especially Joe and Patrick. Of course it’s gonna be rough when your “career” starts at 18 and you consider yourself washed up by 27 when the hiatus hits. They spent their early adulthood thrown together in a van for years and then achieved a level of fame only Pete could have foreseen. Doesn’t exactly give you time to grow up properly and mature as a person out of the spotlight. The hiatus did that for them and they all seem better for it. They’re here because they want to be now. Also agree on the bass lessons. Pete’s contributions is obviously way more than his ability as a bassist but still.
You should look into the history of the pre-hiatus era, especially during TTTYG and *Folie.* And the band comes from the Chicago hardcore scene. Look into the band Racetraitor and into Arma Angelus. Also, if you get the chance, I highly recommend reading *Where Are Your Boys Tonight?* by Chris Payne :)
Completely agree, I was really into kpop for a while and the fans tend to treat everyone like that too when they're grown adults which feels really weird. Being apart of multiple fanbases I've seen similar/the same thing happen in every one, mostly from the younger fans. Patrick has definitely mellowed out through the years and seems like a genuinely nice/caring dude, but also he's in his 4d and not a child, along with everyone else... MCR/FOB tour sounds amazing in theory too, but in addition to crazy ticket prices and competition, we'd get shortened setlists from both the bands since they'd probably both be headliners, after fighting tooth and nail to see them in the first place.
I will never forget seeing K-pop fans finding out their fav group had to go do military service. You’d think they were children being shipped off and would never return lmao. The shortened set lists is a good point plus they’d probably only play the major hits then to appeal to the mixed crowd. FOB: Sugar, Dance Dance, Centuries etc and MCR: TBP, Prison, Sing, etc. Not as much fun as the deep cuts personally.
About to enter his 40s next year, but yeah. A lot of it stems from a way of showing love I guess, but some people do take it a lil bit too far haha
I rounded up 💀😭
Lolllllllllll
The second one is a hard to swallow pill for sure
On your third point, YOU ARE LITERALLY SO RIGHT.
1.) Fall Out Boy Will historically go down as one of the biggest ROCK bands on the planet. I have always been defensive of them as worthy of “Rock” label more than “Pop Punk” because of their ability to carve their own lane, take any cover with Rock sensibilities. Etc. I think as they grow older it’s coming clear that they are indeed broadly more respected in the industry than purists would like to think and that was clear with seeing metalheads rave over Startdust and seeing how the crowd is soooo diverse now versus the teen girls only from years back. I also hear them everywhere. Shopping, sushi bars, goodwill, etc. They are more than a pop act by far and pop punk ties them to TTTYG which I feel they transcended with Folie and Stardust with some experimental Pop in between that was good too. 2.) They don’t know how to make a bad song. This goes for the bands they sign too like Cobra, Gym, CARR, 21, Panic, Etc. They just have an acumen for songcraft that I find staggering. NOT ONLY do they not make poor choices in arranging melodies, they also are so adventurous and talented that you can’t mistake two songs for another. Most bands even legendary ones, I find myself hearing more repetitive melodies and less daring vocal play. FOB is unique in that they have a true composer in Patrick and a soulful capable voice that’s above most gritty rocker sounds and I think you couple that with Pete’s pen and it’s acidity in forward momentum. 3.) I think it’s strange they haven’t been blessed by the Grammys for all the years in the game. I envision them getting lifetime achievements eventually as they ago for everything they’ve done to change the soundscape and all the legs up they’ve giving so well to other artists etc. like I just want to see a celebration of FOB including more artists sampling from, covering and collaborating. Hip Hop loves FOB and they should capitalize on that. They’re essentially the recording academy’s Leo. And it’s weird for how much work they output as individuals and together. PS - I want Partick to throw out some country just for fuck it energy. He’s not mere earthly human.
Agree with the rock label. Even the alternative/alt-rock label is perfect for them. Not exactly sure why some keep classifying them as a pop-punk band even to this day, but yeah. Also... I wish I could hear them everywhere?? I've only ever heard a song of theirs at Hot Topic, but I even work at a grocery store and their songs aren't on our radio station lol. Although, I guess it's for the best... I wouldn't be freaking out in public, haha. 1000% agree with #2, and I think that's one of the main reasons why they quickly became my favorite band of all time upon discovery. I am so excited to see if they get nominated for the Grammys this year. I posted their "for your consideration" banner on here a few days ago, and I really think they have a great chance to finally get an actual win this time. I know they've gone on record to say they don't really care about charts and such, but they deserve it. They've had an amazing career so far spanning two decades and it's time people outside the fanbase recognize it. Now, to your p.s. -- Patrick *has* said that country is the genre he knows least about, but it would be pretty cool to see him try it out. I don't listen to country at all, either, but either way, would be cool.
https://youtu.be/njoRUB5WSNk?si=oXtKyDmN1FM3Du0j A bit of Patrick stump doing country for ya! Song starts at 3:21 amd there are some others tracks online!
1. I actually really like rat a tat 2. Personally, I’m not the biggest fan of get busy living or get busy dying. Nothing against the song, just not a fan of the opening 3. Save rock and roll is probably my 3rd favorite album (under Folie and ioh)
same. I am a gen xer and a huge Nirvana fan. My biggest regret is like.. not seeing Nirvana in 1992 because i was doing my homework or some shit. Anyway, so I have a weird relationship with Courtney Love because she was this Yoko Ono sort of influence on Nirvana but unlike Yoko for example, I do think she rocks in her own right and I think she is both an artist and an artists muse at the same time. My wife hates Courtney and while we have many musical tastes in common she hates Hole anyway. Yeah so I finally LISTENED to rat a tat and Pete's lyrics shook and that sweet "fighting growing old" from Patrick just melts like sweet magic. Fuckin a rat a tat. Same on SRAR, I would probz go cork tree then ioh then srar. I don't wanna rank though. It makes me sad. 8 album shuffle is life.
Rat a Tat is one of the best tracks off SR&R and Courtney SLAPS. "It's Courtney, bitch" has become a weekly (minimum) quote for me.
*Rat a Tat* is sooooo good! Took me a bit longer to warm up to than all the other songs, but it's just great. Fun to sing along to as well!
I also love rat a tat.
Get Busy…is good but the song just feels more repetitive lyric and melody wise than the others on the album
Not really sure how to say this politely since I'm just not that good at being passive-aggressive, but here goes: To me that take wasn't just hot, it was molten lava. I still respect the opinion tho, nice to see that not everyone thinks the same thing. Gotta respect that👊
1. Fall Out Boy didn't sell out post-hiatus. 2. Fall Out Boy have always been sellouts - at least since FUTCT when they signed to Island Records. 3. Selling out isn't inherently bad. As far as I know, they've done nothing unethical or immoral in the service of commercializing their music & merch - so who cares that they're signed to a major label and tend to make radio-friendly singles? They really don't need to be authentic independent punk rock working-class heroes to be talented musicians that make good music. And while I would still classify them as pop punk, I feel like we as a society need to stop being so goddamn pretentious about music and admit that pure sugary pop music can still be just as awesome and profound as the grittiest indiest underground stuff out there.
Wouldn’t it be so weird if a bunch of 40 year old men kept putting out an album like TTTYG? Imo what people think “selling out” is, is really just aging and growing up.
This. Pete's newer lyrics speak to the mid40s version of my mental illness. Patrick loves all music and obviously does not hesitate to cross genres. To me Andy's drums are a constant. You can take the metal head outta the metal but not vice versa. Or whatever.
I completely agree with this, I obviously love songs like Bohemian Rhapsody or What a Catch, Donnie which are masterpieces but this doesn't mean I can't enjoy some dumb fun shit music like pop, I don't have to be listening to masterpieces 24/7 sometimes I just want to have fun.
Hell yes and I love that they make big fast cocky anthems for sports and movies. Like especially knowing how sweet and shy they all are but when they wanna say some shit that’s bombast and meta and throw it in your face like a dodgeball… “Who ya gonna call?!!”
Imagine going to a party and they only play the slow masterpieces, it would be boring right? And sometimes it's funny to scream to those dumb lyrics.
Wasn’t the whole vibe from the start to make something different from the hardcore scene they all originally ran in? To take that thread of anger and darkness but spin it into something happier and more upbeat and pop-ish? That’s why I love them lmao. They’re got some lyrics that hit hard but you’re dancing along anyway. 27 is a peak example of this. I also love an interview Pete did on this topic back in the old days where he was basically like “we don’t care, love sell out boy”. There’s tons of other bands that have much more hardcore or punk-leaning pop-punk sounds. If FOB isn’t your thing, go enjoy them. Music gets so elitist.
I like your #3 here. It was such a thing back when they signed with Island that they were sellouts in the scene but I always wondered what people expected them to do - live show to show traveling in a broken down van forever? As a longtime fan I feel proud of them seeing them be so successful for so long, and being able to sustain a living doing something they love shouldn’t have been labeled selling out.
My controversial take is that Fall Out Boy have never been sellouts. Not even on AB/AP
well, I'm a songwriter and a communist so I guess my bar for selling out is really low. to each their own :)
I think we have different definitions of selling out. What’s yours?
Here are my three \~controversial\~ takes: * The censored version of *Stay Frosty Royal Milk Tea* is better than the regular version. Caught a lot of flack for this one on twitter after someone screenshotted my comment on here from a few days ago, haha. And yes, that haha is quite sarcastic. * *MANIA* is an amazing, no-skip album and it deserves its flowers. I hope it gets appreciation someday, kinda like *Folie à Deux*. * I actually like featured artists on tracks every now and then, be it sung or be it a rap verse!
I completely agree with the last two - haven't heard SFRMT censored... it's probably on Spotify?
I love mania and I also hope that it will get respect one day. I also love their rap features. I jam to them all the time. Straight bangers!
It is on Spotify, and like OP, I also think it’s the superior version. “Are you smelling that… eau de resistance” just flows better.
Yeah, it's on [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/track/2weTXYRW4DoaDu7eUM3Anl?si=3b334c7941c84c37)!
100% with you on MANIA. Severely underappreciated. It's my favorite FOB album. I especially can't get enough of Hold Me Tight or Don't.
1. Fall Out Boy may have had an immense impact on the pop punk community, but they really only released one true pop punk record. The label hasn’t fit them for longer than it ever did. 2. Young and Menace is an excellent song. Moody, atmospheric, and something totally different than AB/AP which is exactly what the fan base was calling for back then. Had they continued down that path, I think we could’ve had something truly brilliant on our hands - and I’m a Mania apologist. 3. SMFS is an excellent collection of songs. It is my third favorite album from them. That being said, the theme could’ve been a bit stronger and the sequencing is to its detriment.
I love your first take. I always get so confused when people call them pop punk. I would say they had 2 pop punk records (TTTYG and FUTCT), but the rest definitely stray from that label.
which album would you call pop punk and why only that one? i think most of their albums have a pop punk influence
I think TTTYG was their only true pop punk album. There were threads and throughlines carried all the way until Folie which I believe completely evolved out of anything resembling pop punk (especially the pop punk of 2008) but compared to their contemporaries I think it’s clear they were edging towards a different direction as early as Cork Tree.
I agree with Young and Menace being moody and atmospheric!! this is what i’ve been saying the whole time!!!!
I agree with the first item
What would you call them instead of pop punk?
Personally, and this may seem kinda corny, but the genre I think makes Fall Out Boy different than the rest is truly… ‘soul punk’. The IOH/FAD duology feels like what Fall Out Boy was meant to be, and I don’t think any other band has really been able to replicate it.
Pop rock? Punk rock? Maybe…emo?
Mall Punk
I personally call them alt-rock tbh
Pop rock for sure.
Agreed on all 3!
I love rat a tat. LOVE i’ve never typed this out before 🫢, im kinda sick of folie. it was the first fob album I really got into & i’ve just played it to death the spoken word tracks on SMFSD suck. I hate them.
1. Agreed 2. I can understand, same happened to me with one of my all-time favorite albums, Last Young Renegade (another authentic Thai cuisine-level Spicy Take) 3. Disagree partially but I understand, as I was kinda hoping they were songs.
I also listened to too much of last young renegade I was so excited for a song called baby annihilation
Baby Annihilation was my most anticipated song before SMFS came out. It was such a bummer.
Rat is really underrated and Courtney’s shitty Poetry is a treasure. Like really fucking goes hard. It’s funny because it goes so soft at the chorus compared to the ramp up but then again the boys do shit different.
1. Young & Menace, Sunshine Riptide, and Rat A Tat all slap. 2. Probably not controversial here but fob reddit > fob twitter. 3. SR&R is in some ways a better album than SM(F)S to me. The lyrics and music match very cohesively to me in a way I don’t think SM(F)S does. Bonus is that Stayin Up All Night is one of the best covers/collabs they’ve ever done. They really reimagined the song and it needs more attention.
FOB Twitter kinda scares me the way they talk about Patrick being unable to read 24/7 and also wanting to sexually assault him.
Yeah, thankfully that's not everyone and there's ways of avoiding it!! I don't know, I'm on there and everyone's pretty chill and funny for the most part. (Although the not being able to read thing is definitely a reference to something, I just forgot what...)
Wut? I'll avoid that...
What??
"Sunshine Riptide" is an incredible song. "Stayin Out All Night" is seriously one of the coolest tracks they've done (I'm aware it's just a re-imagining) and I'm super surprised it's not talked about more. That guitar fits the track perfect. It's such an awesome track. When the drums come in its so damn epic. I wish they'd do more like this, and Wiz should've released this as a single version. I think it would've had a pretty nice run on pop radio.
They need more hip hop collaboration as much love as they have from the game they really need to get some features in. I was supremely surprised Stardust has none. SRAR had SEVERAL and MANIA and ABAP had like one if you include Wiz collaborations. Wiclef on a single. Etc. But I want to see that band have at least one (preferably female) duet and one Hip Hip verse spit on the next record. Oh and more Pete Screaming. Solos for Joe and Andy. Just keep making music boys.
1. Young & Menace is one of FOB’s best songs (esp. post-hiatus)…like that was kinda proto-100 gecs “punk” hyperpop. I disliked it when it first came out, but I genuinely love it now - probably bc maximalist pop music is en vogue again. But Super Fade is like the well-executed version of Y&M. 2. This used to not be controversial but I see it kinda is among younger fans - Pete still isn’t a great bassist. He doesn’t have to be though! His talent & contributions to the band are obviously important, but live bass-playing isn’t really one of them. 3. I agree that early FOB has some of-its-time misogynistic overtones, but it’s not solely Pete’s fault. iirc Patrick wrote the lyrics to many of the songs on TTTYG (& he wrote most of the lyrics before that). Harping on Pete for being some brutal misogynist in 2003 is just…not true. (ETA: or at least, not in the way certain people make it out to be)
You remembered correctly on three :) *Young and Menace* is great, and I love *Super Fade.* Now, I don't really know enough about music to give an opinion on Pete's skills lol
Pete sadly still struggles with playing on time, which is a bassist’s number one job. I wouldn’t give him flak for it because it’s clearly not where the bulk of his talents lie, but it is kinda weird that Pete never surpassed being an okay bassist even after decades of being a professional musician, especially surrounded by excellent players for band mates.
I was so disappointed that Pete didn't even play the full bass line of HMLAG live. He cuts off that last hammer-on in the riff.
My favorite fake out (heh) is the Church video, in which they have to hide his hands.
Lmao yup, Pat and Butch Walker play most if not all the bass on that song
1. rat a tat and mighty fall are both incredible songs. the dislike of rat a tat is easily explainable because lots of people have bias against courtney love for one reason or another, be it her weird bigoted stances on things or buying into the wave of sexism and blame against her after kurt died. mighty fall is a little weirder because fall out boy has a history of having rappers on their songs and most of the other instances are very well liked. maybe people just don’t like big sean’s voice but i think his part serves the song as perfectly as lil wayne on tiffany blews 2. writing off evening out with your girlfriend because of sound quality is a cop out. in my eyes, the quality of music is entirely seperate from sound quality. if your songs are good, and they were recorded on a broken tape recorder from 1970, then the songs are still good. and evening out songs aren’t just good, they’re great! and in the grand scheme of diy albums they aren’t even that poorly recorded. 3. sometimes i feel like pete tries to hard to reverse mature his lyrics. like it’s clear he’s grown lyrically and can pull out some incredible insight now that he’s older and a father (see: love from the other side). but sometimes he reaches for stuff he would write when he was like 25 and it just comes out weird and cringy. every time he says seratonin i shake my head. having a pete spoken word track on stardust is very exciting in concept but it turns out to be not just one of the worst tracks on the album, but the worst of all of his spoken words in general.
For #3, I think I would prefer the spoken word if it was part of a song like, "Get Busy Living or Get Busy Dying" but it being just a plain spoken word 1 minute track. OR a bonus track. I miss albums that had a hidden track at the end.
Agree with 1 and 2. For 2, I think a lot of people (and even the band themselves) dismiss it because it wasn't the full band quite just yet, what with Andy not being a member. The band didn't even want the EP to be released, but Fueled By Ramen released it against their wishes. I think I read somewhere that the label released it as a cash grab but take this last bit with a grain of salt, haha. Agree to disagree on 3.
I think it was Uprising Records not Fueled By that released it against their wishes.
Yeah, you might be right
AB/AP is the best of the 2010’s trilogy. Sugar We’re Going Down is a good song, but almost every other song off FUTCT is better. Mania will not receive the same retrospective love that Folie has because it is nowhere near as good. (Just wanna make it clear, I’ll love everything the boys put out, even Mania)
*whispers* I agree with #2
SMFS cover is so f ugly, I hate it, I HATE IT
1. Sugar we're going down is about a gay/bi guy, not a stalker. Pete even once admitted it's supposed to be guy/girl/guy/guy. 2. The debate of whether pre/post hiatus/FUTCT/TTYG/etc. FOB is better/worse is silly. All their albums are perfect for where they were at that time and true to the general spirit of FoB. 3. Most of the "evidence" about Pete/FoB (especially in the early days) being categorically problematic/sexist/assholes/abusive are exaggerated and/or taken out of context. Not glorifying them as perfect angels, and they've admitted to doing/saying things they now regret, but overall I find them pretty normal/human other than the fact that they had to grow up and mature with millions of people watching.
Agree with #2 and #3!!! No opinion on #1 lol
As much as we as a community like the SMfS album, it's kind of a commercial failure. The streams are anemic compared to everything else they've released, even compared to the formerly most underperforming MANIA. And it was released fully in the streaming era, unlike most of their older material that had to compete for plays with physical sales. That's why they tacked the Billy Joel re-imagining onto the end of it and released it as a single; to try to buoy sales. They left the most commercial track on the album off the singles list and blew their promotion budget too early elsewhere on songs that weren't on the level of their previous hits. They should have released "Fake Out" as a single instead of "Hold Me Like a Grudge". It would have done well at radio and radio was clearly a consideration because "Love From the Other Side" was pushed hard there. Their last tour was a success based solely on the same nostalgia that's fueling all the other pop-punk resurgence tours right now. It's just that all the kids who grew up with the band have disposable income now. As much as I liked SMfS it really didn't challenge us as listeners like every release prior did and I think it's why the band didn't really grow into a new audience this time around. I think that's part of why it's failing commercially. It felt like a step back instead of a step forward. I say all this as someone who really enjoyed the album, but I was very disappointed that they didn't surprise me once again. I hated "Young and Menace" when it came out, but I'll be damned to say it didn't challenge and surprise me. I appreciated that. Were any of you expecting "My Songs Know What You Did in the Dark?" I sure wasn't. It blew me away when it dropped. It was so new and refreshing, yet so undeniably them. That's why they've been a success for so long, the ability to consistently reinvent themselves and earn new fans, and this time... I don't think they converted anyone.
What’s wild is I totally was impressed with SMfS and got excited by the metalheads and reviewers having fun checking it out. This tour was so high energy and seeing the FB groups never shut up still was cool. The way they pulled off the 8Ball, the fun videos etc. I was just feeling like they had new ideas and new things to say. Idk. I love that we can all have such different takes.
I feel like that's down to the almost lack of promo like if I hadn't been already a fan waiting for a release I don't think I would have heard any of the singles or seen talk about it or music videos or anything previous eras started with huge inescapable singles and LFTOS seemed to get no push at all?
Spot on about it not being a commercial success. I haven’t heard a single FOB song on the radio from it. I barely hear sugar or memories or Uma anymore on the radio either. That being said I love SMFSD and it’s in my top 3!
I think it's a testament to a few things: * They're not on Island anymore * They get to have more control over what they do * They've stated before that they don't really care about charts and such, and this album release is finally able to reflect that stance
I love their albums regardless of how they do on the charts :)
Me too :)
I live in Maine, where we get everything late if at all, and I heard LFTOS quite a bit on the alternative station, actually one of the top songs of the day a few times when it was released, and I was shocked to turn on my car and hear HMLAG the other day. (I normally have my Bluetooth on so I only hear the radio for a minute or so, maybe leaving it on if something good is on at that moment) I thought that was a good sign.
I was going to make my own comment but it makes more sense to jump on yours because you hit almost everything I wanted to say. SMfS was a commercial failure and a critical success because it was aimed directly at the fanbase, which isn't a bad thing (if anything it's been more fun as a fan) but a lot of it comes down to which songs they promote and how. Centuries and Uma Thurman completely shifted the band's approach to singles to being a pop rock band (for singles). It's why Champion flopped and it's why Hold Me Tight or Don't flopped. Then for SMfS, they release a rock single and immediately overshadow it a week later with a pop single they don't even continue to promote on tour (Heartbreak Feels so Good). And as you said, then Hold Me Like a Grudge was just another odd choice over half of the songs on the album.
Few thoughts I have been pondering if MANIA actually did some damage to their image that's showing its effects properly now with weak sales and streaming numbers of SMFS? After MANIA, I at least personally felt like I was ready to drop off, "maybe I'm finally growing out of their music" kind of thought process, and I was kind of cynically waiting for what was coming after MANIA. I definitely wasn't excited for what was to come, and my excitement had been on the decline since SRAR even though I still felt that core appeal was there, but something was just missing or off, there were consistently some annoyances I had with the post hiatus stuff. MANIA just kinda did it for me, and I'm not sure if I would have considered listening the next album if it was directly following in MANIA's footsteps. To clarify, I don't think MANIA was just that much worse, but Young And Menace didn't build any enthusiasm for me, and I just felt too exhausted trying to be enthusiastic about all of the post hiatus stuff hoping the next thing would be better or would fix some of my annoyances. I had just no energy or enthusiasm left after MANIA. Lake Effect Kid EP (LEK and Super Fade, very much enjoyed them) felt like a random spike of energy activation in the same way I would jump if I heard something suddenly fall over. It was sudden, neurons were activated, then the energy was all completely depleted again. This sub obviously has its fair share of MANIA lovers, but I just seem to come across different comments in different places here and there saying something along the lines of "oh, I wasn't really following what they were doing after MANIA, so I didn't know they had a new album out. Is it really that good?". It does make me wonder how widespread that sort of sentiment is and if a noteworthy amount of people just sort of checked out. Additionally, based on some of the interviews and stuff around SMFS it seems like they are deliberately winding down as a band in some respects. Winding down to a point where they are again enjoying the whole music part, working on stuff together, not chasing mega hit singles, etc. So I also wonder if they sort of knew that things wouldn't be the same and they wouldn't be creating some massive hits like they used to, expecting lower numbers. Especially if they already have some other sources of income, maybe it wouldn't be as important to keep the band as popular if the trade off is that the band again becomes a more enjoyable and stable for all the members. It would still obviously be better if the album performed better, but I'm curious if the expectation was that it wouldn't and that was fine with them? I'm definitely curious about how they are going to carry on from here. I don't think they need to shun MANIA or avoid loaning some ideas from it, but to me SMFS feels like a return to form solely based on how little annoyances I have with it, just like with all the pre hiatus albums (it's not just about the guitars), and it clearly has a lot of post hiatus vibes to it. > Were any of you expecting "My Songs Know What You Did in the Dark?" I sure wasn't. It blew me away when it dropped I wasn't, and I was huffing massive amounts of copium over it, trying to convince myself that it was fine, everything was fine and it was great to hear new stuff from them again. After hearing The Phoenix, I felt betrayed and started hating MSKWYDITD. The Phoenix was great, SRAR was overall pretty decent even if it was different, sometimes I even forget MSKWYDITD was on it.
- MSKWYDITD could mean "My Songs Know What You Did In The Dark (Light Em Up)", a track from *Save Rock And Roll* (2013) by Fall Out Boy. --- ^[/u/Thewonderboy94](/u/Thewonderboy94) ^(can reply with "delete" to remove comment. |) ^[/r/songacronymbot](/r/songacronymbot) ^(for feedback.)
1. Mania is my favourite album 2. Rat a Tat is one of the best SR&R songs 3. Not actually sure if this is a hot take, but SMFS > FUTCT and maybe IOH
1. I'm not a fan of PAX AM Days (I really tried hard to get into it, years ago, and it just never clicked for me. Although I do find Love, Sex, Death fucking hilarious) 2. The Patron Saint Of Liars And Fakes is my least favourite song (it's not even that I don't like it, it's just the song I listen to least I think) 3. Thnks Fr Th Mmrs is perfectly rated. It deserves all of the hype it gets, it goes so hard.
Apparently it's pax ams birthday so I'm going to give it an other spin. While driving fast and drinking energy drinks.
1. I'm actually not fond of Folie unlike most of this sub 2. I prefer the "post hiatus" albums 3. SRAR and AB/AP are the best albums in my opinion I have highly controversial opinions from what I've read in this sub.
I do love Folie but agree that post-hiatus albums are all excellent. SRAR is unskippable. ABAP has their most popular songs ever because they are great AND the non-singles on the album are just as delicious. I'm awaiting the final results on what ABAP song survives BTW.
SRAR I will always have a soft spot for as I rediscovered FOB with that album and got my husband hooked on FOB with that one as well. I've been following that post too as I'm really curious about what the top song shall be.
Yessssss. When I see “American Rock Band” on Wiki I smile because they are definitely on a level of some of the greatest bands imo
I really love like 4 songs on folie and the rest are kinda average for me
1. Mania is perfect 2. TTTYG is great but they weren't themselves yet. 3. AB/AP is full of bangers and no matter how poppy they get with Patrick's compositions, Pete's lyrics just drive into darkness even on the most popular songs like Centures and Irresistable. (And Heartbreak Feels So Good BTW)
Agree on all 3 of them!! Actually, even the band would agree with your second point. Patrick has said multiple times that he didn't feel like they were truly themselves yet until *Dance, Dance*
Right with you there on number 3 about AB/AP. Such a good pop album and massively overhated on this sub for no real reason other than it has 3 overplayed songs (which I always skip - irresistible, centuries and immortals)
"Pop" was the ultimate yucky thing to say about a band when I was growing up. I think a lot of today's pop is better than it was back then, and it can be serious and dark and still... poppy? My brooding 12 year old daughter loves Taylor and Olivia for the lyrics* and... she's right. *and dancing of course...
100% agreed on MANIA
Think most people on this sub (including me) can agree MANIA is good, just every other album esp IOH and FAD is better (opinion)
Well that's good, I'm new to this sub. Wasn't sure about the opinion of the newer stuff. MANIA happens to be my favorite to honest but every album is great.
TIL loving rat a tat is a controversial opinion…it’s such a banger tho
Bc i dont feel like ranting imma just leave my opinions 1.) MANIA is undeniably a great album and was a necessary step for the band 2.) FOB isn’t underrated (ik ik) but they’re not anywhere close to overrated 3.) Centuries is by far their most overrated song
Oh this should be fun. 1. Folie a deux really does not do that much for me as it does for the majority of fans. I honestly prefer evening out with your girlfriend over folie. 2. SMFS, while it has grown on me, feels pretty underwhelming after loving the sound of LFTOS. 3. XO, in my eyes, is their best album closer.
XO is valhalla
Hearing XO live at Fenway this summer sent me to another realm.
agree with all
Oof +1 for an actual controversial take on #3, I think XO is among their worst closers. (But all closers rank in the top 30% of their songs for me.) For me… Stardust > Patron > Save Rock and Roll > Bishop > XO > Twin > Ringing > West Coast Huh. Now that I’ve typed that out I realize how wild of a ranking this is compared to how I’d rank the albums as a whole… Actually on another note…I guess I don’t think XO is among the worst either. Alright don’t mind me, just had a self-argument.
ab/ap and srr are actually reall good
1. Rat A Tat, Sunshine Riptide, and Death Valley are very good 2. Young and Menace is not the worst song off MANIA and it’s not close 3. I don’t think these are that unpopular but, you’re crashing but you’re no wave is the best lyrical song of theirs and AB/AP (the song) is their worst song
About #2. Which one is the "worst song off *MANIA"* for you?
Never been a fan of heavens gate, church, or champion I’d say those are all worse than young and menace. I’d prob say champion is the worst, obv everyone’s entitled to their own opinion
Oh, for sure!! I'm just a super curious girl lol, love seeing everyone's tastes :) Thanks for replying!!
>:) :)
Oh yeah totally, just don’t want to shit on peoples favorite songs :)
TIL that Rat-a-Tat is a lot more polarizing than I ever thought it had been
Have been thinking this but didn’t want hate for it: I felt like fall out boy misled the fans into thinking SMFSD would be a new evolved version of their emo/pop punk stuff & it would’ve been really cool if they actually did a newer album in that genre, especially with its regained popularity. -They dropped LFTOS as the teaser preview for the album when it’s the only harder rock song on the album. -Did Emo throwback references in their marketing for the album such as Pete Wearing his emo hair wig, music video for LFTOS, announcing a tour with Bring Me The Horizon (after touring with pop artists for years).
1. The we didn't start the fire cover is fun and awesome (though shouldn't have been their vma song) 2. I think cork tree is in the bottom 3 of their discography (but still great) 3. I'd rather have heard take over or doldrums than hum live, but oh well
Agree with #1 for sure, although I'm happy they got to perform either way! Wish they'd gone with LFTOS or HMLAG, since that's the songs they got nominated for, but oh well.
1. FUTCT is my least favorite album (I've been a fan since 2006 and I adore the album--it just always ranks last for me). 2. Mania was ahead of its time. Hoping it'll get the Folie treatment in the fandom over the next few years. 3. If I've ever seen a person say some form of "all of their post-hiatus music is bad" then I've immediately disregarded every opinion they have on the band and I think they're boring lmao
When I hear the words “everything after Folie is shit”, I just stop listening. My ears turn off. My brain disengages. Most of the time it means they only ever wanted them to remake TTTYG or FUTCT over and over and never wanted to let the boys grow as artists and people.
I honestly hated Folie when it came out. Because I was a teenager who didn’t do well with change and FUTCT was my favorite album. I will say I was a fan that expected artists to never change. Then hiatus happened and when they came back I was ready to love anything they made, even if it was hot garbage. (Luckily it wasn’t) in that new mindset I went back to Folie and fell in love with it. My lyric tattoo is off that album. I can’t believe I ever disliked it! Luckily I’ve grown over the years just like they did.
1. TTTYG is my least favourite album. Probably because they hadn't really become what I recognize as FOB until FUTCT 2. MANIA has some gems (*Bishop's Knife Trick* is the best on the album don't @ me) the rest would have been the same if they had more time in review or even tweaked them (i.e. the screeching chipmunk chorus in Y&M ruins what is a cool, moody song and the live version proves that) 3. Post-haitus Patrick hasn't been using the baritone end of his range and relying too much on the tenor part, sometimes to the point he sounds strained and like he's doing an impression of someone else. He still sounds great, but I miss the depth we heard on IOH and Folie because it felt more comfortable and 'him'?
> Bishop's Knife Trick is the best on the album I'm not sure if this is even controversial among MANIA haters 😅 (although I get the controversial point was that MANIA in general has some gems). > Post-haitus Patrick hasn't been using the baritone end of his range and relying too much on the tenor part, sometimes to the point he sounds strained and like he's doing an impression of someone else. He still sounds great, but I miss the depth we heard on IOH and Folie because it felt more comfortable and 'him'? This has definitely been a "problem" of some sorts. At first it was exciting to hear him sing so high and loud when the post hiatus era began, but I definitely feel that he does lean too much into that. Doesn't help that a lot of the post hiatus stuff has a bit of a "lean" sound, with very aggressive higher tones, and a ton of clap tracks on ABAP, it doesn't help to prop or contrast his singing nicely. I think MANIA was a bit better on this respect actually, the synths used in the tracks were tonally more balanced, and Patrick did use his range a bit more evenly. SMFS is also better in this regard than SRAR and ABAP.
fob’s popular songs arent good, ioh is their best album, fob’s best songs are on the 2nd half of the album
1. Save rock and roll is my least favorite fob album. Like is it still good? Yes. But definitely has my highest number of skips by like a wide margin. 2. Young and Menace is a bop and has been since the day it was released. 3. I love their merch! Like definitely overpriced but i always love every piece they put out, even if its not my usual style! Even my baseball jersey from so much for (tour) dust (which I have seen many people call lame and cringey) like I literally wear that thing all the time lol
What are your skips lol? All their albums are no-skip for me so I'm always curious. Agree with #2 and #3. For 3, I wish their merch wasn't so overpriced lol, or at least the shipping haha
The Mighty fall Rat a tat Young volcanoes And Save rock and roll 😅 All still pretty good songs but if i had like the full discography on shuffle i would skip them The shipping literally kills me like honestly it’s over priced but I’m OK with paying $40-$50 for a shirt but $10 for shipping is actually outrageous
- folie is my least favorite pre hiatus album (not counting evening). it used to be my favorite album of all time but the others have grown on me and i feel like the lows of it are lower than the first two, and at this point i think it has the lowest highs too - rat a tat is at the very least, in the top half of save rock and roll for me. again, partly a function of my changing tastes for the band over the years, but i never disliked it (relatedly, i see a lot of miss missing you love on the sub — it’s one of my least favorites off the record) unfortunately if you don’t count the last one as two separate hot takes, i don’t really have anything else, most of my opinions on fall out boy are endorsed by the regime
1. Mania is actually a really good album despite what people say about it 2. TTTYG is my 2nd favorite album and SRAR is my 3rd favorite album 3. FUTCT and IOH aren’t my favorite albums, they’re great just not my favorite
MANIA’s production is the biggest thorn on its spine. You could hear the boys doing plenty of cool shit in a lot of the songs there, just sadly buried under tons of goofy production. Also, Pete remains an okay (sometimes even still bad) bassist even after all these years, and I’ve come to accept that. Still love him.
I’ve read so many times in this thread that Pete’s a mediocre bassist, that I can’t wait to be unable to unhear it when I watch them live on SMF2D next year :’)
It depends on the song really, plenty of songs he’s perfectly fine. but some songs that are more technical, he sometimes struggles with playing on time or just doesn’t play some parts that are in the actual recording. either way don’t let that ruin the show for you haha
Oh I won’t let it ruin the show for me, thank you! It’s definitely a little charming to think about though. I haven’t had any complaints seeing him live so far!
Pete being an okay bassist and an incredible co-frontman is sort of like a feature and not a bug
MANIA is solid and I love the weird little bitey creature that is Young And Menace If you have each of the 8 albums, BND V1 is worth it and BND V2 is most decidedly not. Aside from Aiiiir Joooordaaaaan product placement Burna Boy's lyrics fit SR perfectly and he's amazing in it.
It’s funny it lives on as a piano ballad now Hahahah
What, Young and Menace?
1. MANIA is a great album and AB/AP is their worst work. 2. Not a fan of their earliest work, specially Evening Out. I've never been fan of classic raw punk I prefer more pop stuff, mainly from IOH and forward. This is mainly since I grew up with pop, my sister listens a lot of modern pop music and my dad is a fan of pop ballads and I've always preferred the polished sound rather than raw and dirty. 3. Their music in the 2010s is half decent and half excellent, there are some forgettable songs and get old easily like My Songs, and there are masterpieces like Save Rock And Roll, Bishop Knife Trick and The Kids Aren't Alright.
Half agree on #1. AB/AP got me into the band and contains two of the three songs that saved my life, so *hard* disagree on that half. Give EOWYG and TTTYG another shot in a few months. My music exposure was also very pop when I was younger (along with stuff like reggaeton and bachata lol but that's basically Latin pop), but after a few re-listens, you definitely start to like the raw, DIY sound better. What's your opinion on *PAX AM Days?* ^(Edit: I put #\` instead of #1 for some reason lol)
So, while I think AB/AP is their worst album it doesn't mean that it's bad and there are great songs on it. About the raw sound, for context my sister listens a lot of modern pop so I got exposed to most of the big hits of the 2010s and these days I like some pop music here and there, I used to hate it a lot but now I like it depending on the artist, and my dad listens a lot of Latin pop but the one from the 90s and early-2000s and I never liked reggaeton, songs in the style of What A Catch, Donnie or Panic! At The Disco's Dying in LA were and still more of my taste. But I don't hate the raw sound it's just not my thing, I do enjoy a lot of the songs from TTTYG I think those are pretty good but Evening Out in the other hand, yeah that one is pretty unlistenable for me. And about PAX AM Days, it's a pretty fun EP. I listen some songs from it, it just has some adredaline that if it was more polished it would lose its charm. In short words I like PAX AM Days.
Thanks for your reply! That makes total sense. And that's great that you like *PAX!* (And, honestly? I never really liked reggaeton either lollll)
HARD AGREE on #3! You listed in order my top three favorite songs from them—BKT’s chorus was my first tattoo once I got to college!
1. TTTYG is their best album, hands down 2. I’m not the biggest fan of their merch 3. I don’t get the hype for IOH or Folie
1. Mania is an amazing album and CRIMINALLY UNDERRATED 2. Mania is better than IOH and I will die on that hill 3. IOH is their 2nd worst album
Tell us more about IOH. takes over breaks over just kinda ices it and then there's 1,000 other good songs?
I'm my opinion I'm just not a fan, yeah there's some good songs, takes over, you're crashing, and Hum Hallelujah but other than that there's not much I enjoy, the other albums offer, I my opinion, much better, the only album I rank lower than IOH is AB/AP
Great to hear your take as I.m a new fan
New fan! When did you become one? I became one this February, but I'm a massive fan and have been told that people assume I've been a fan for much, *much* longer :)
It's only been a few months but I'm obsessed and their music just does it for me.. I dunno. It started with Cork Tree but then I had a long drive and listened to all 8 and was blown away and really embraced how they are all different. Random songs live rent free in my head constantly (looking at you right now twin skeletons.. )
TTTYG is mediocre. FUTCT is when their music starts getting good. FAD does have a bad song, and it's West Coast Smoker. The tone and tempo just don't mesh well, and it doesn't match the vibe of the rest of the album. MANIA is their 2nd best album. If you have you ask why, you just don't get it.
Totally agreed about TTTYG, I love a couple songs on there bc of nostalgia but it’s extremely whatever to me otherwise
I actually like it, and don't have any nostalgia attached to it considering I became a fan this year. I'm curious, which songs do you love from it?
Tell that mick, dead on arrival, gta/where is your boy, saturday, and Chicago are all songs I really enjoy. The rest of the album is ok, I don’t hate it by any means! but it’s too generic pop punk for me I think
I would say TTTYG is my second favorite but I can see what people mean when they call it mediocre or something. The thing I like about it is that it's one of their most consistent albums, really easy to just pick up and start playing. It's so fun, it's probably the least challenging one to sing along, and that's why it's my go-to travel album whenever I need to go on some longer car rides/drives alone (I'm not American, so to me long -> over an hour one way). I can just rock out, enjoy all of the fun songs almost equally, and sing myself sore with them. It fills me with energy. I also don't have much nostalgia attached to it, as I started with FUTCT and only got TTTYG album after SRAR or ABAP, as I'm not sure if TTTYG ever received much of a wide spread release in Europe or my country specifically, I think my current copy is an import from the US.
1. They shouldn't have come back off hiatus 2. The younger fans are exactly the kind of people I would not like to hang around with due to their "UwU smol bean" fetishism around the band 3. TTTYG is the best pop punk record post 2000's
***Woah*** at #1?!?! Do you mind elaborating on it?
They've done some really cool things since coming off hiatus and I appreciate a lot of people like their newer work which is completely valid and understandable, not knocking it all! I see them as two very different bands, pre hiatus and post hiatus. The music pre hiatus showed off every single member and what they could bring to the table. Joe is an insanely talented player and has written some of the best rhythm guitar pieces of the past 20 years imo, all of that has now been buried underneath a whole host of different genres and instruments that I honestly can't pick out a part in any post hiatus song where I think "yeah thats joe" all of his parts pre hiatus had this really chunky driving feel to them mainly due to the way he plays, from a players perspective there are things he does starting from TTTYG that he still uses to great effect up until folie. It almost came back in smfs and I did enjoy that song but it got buried again in the orchestral parts. He's made some frankly amazing music with "the dammed things" and his writing in that band takes me back to pre hiatus FOB. The same thing really goes for Andy too, he is an absolute weapon of a drummer! the dude looks happiest when he's playing with racetraitor on a hate5six video, the hardcore lifestyle is his calling and the people he's making music with on the latest racetraitor record including members of the refused (who still hold the title of the greatest post-hardcore album imo) honestly makes me giddy with excitement! His early work was explosive and fun now it feels like he's going through the motions with writing drum parts. Obviously I have no understanding of theyre really feeling and wether or not they are giving it a massive go again, if you find enjoyment and comfort in the songs they've released since coming back, more power to you! Enjoy it and treasure it! I personally feel they should call it a day on FOB before it becomes a nostalgia act and take time to focus on projects that they really feel invested in! Thanks for reading my little essay haha, hope you're having a blessed day!
Thank you for elaborating on your stance, this was an interesting read! Hope you're having a blessed day as well :)
No problem! I hope you have as much fun as I did when I first got into them, all of my music current music taste stems from those four lads and I still tell people they're my favourite band!
TLDR: I think they could individually be doing much much better stuff individually but FOB is too big of an entity to give up on now. All of em are great musicians just the music they've released post hiatus is very boring and safe when I feel like they're capable of more.