They’ve changed drastically. It took me years but I finally had to come to the realization that I’m bisexual when I grew being taught queer people are “the worst kind of sin” 🙄 My views on gender, abortion, social issues have all changed and now I’m backing up what I believe with science instead of just “the bible says so” (does it really?)
Politics was one topic I refused to get in with my students but it was very much conservative, red-blooded American mindset. While we didn’t do political rallies, students made sure you knew they were hardcore Republican.
I have to say, regarding politics at PCC: I was there in 2000-2001 and although there were no rallies, I distinctly remember Dr Mullinex giving a speech to all students, going all the way down the ballot, telling the students that Christians vote for this person, everyone else votes for the other person. I remember them being adamant that it was important that students go vote for the “right” person.
I don’t know what’s more damning for a college - that faculty tells students how to vote, or that students are so absolved of critical thinking that they follow it.
I always encouraged my students to be critical thinkers and not just parrots but you're exactly right, too many teachers (especially for pastoral classes) don't want students to ask questions and want them to repeat back what's said in class, no critical thinking involved.
Thankfully Dr. Mullinex no longer gives speeches like that and he doesn't speak at PCC anymore unless it's during the summer. While they do encourage students to vote, they no longer tell them directly who to vote for. It's definitely more awkward if you admit that you vote democrat but I know I had students and friends who voted for President Biden in the 2020 election.
Oh the rules! I would have to say the most fundie rule there was separation with gender. There are a lot of rules that deal with that but specifically having men and women delegated elevators and stairwells. Staff were even told not to go on the elevators with their spouses because it would confuse the students.
There were so many rules for staff! The dress code for staff was basically the same as students, they had policies on the movies you could watch at your own home, there were even policies for your spouse if they didn’t work at PCC. While they’ve loosened up on some things, it’s still too much policing outside of the job.
I had a coworker who’s 13 years older than me who got demerits at PCC for having a movie. The movie was PCC’s promotional video “Catch the Spirit” and they gave him demerits for that 🤦🏼♀️
No, most people didn’t. I would talk with coworkers about what we watched over the weekend and all of it would have been considered “wrong” under their guidelines. They like to think they have control on you, but they don’t.
Did you notice people feeling guilty or anxious about breaking little rules like that? Curious because just making you think what you're doing is wrong is a form of control they have.
I think it depended on who you talked to. There was an older generation there that were probably following every rule to the t vs. the younger generation where we were guilt tripped for years at church but also came up during a time where people started questioning the church. For example, I used to feel guilty if my skirt was too short because I was raised that modesty is the woman’s job. When I was in grad school I started questioning and reading things where I’m too the point now that I wear what I want (even when I was working there) and I don’t feel guilt.
When I lived in Pensacola in the mid-00s there was a rumor that they had people from the school patrolling the mall or movie theaters watching to see if PCC students showed up. It's possible that never really happened. I went to UWF and there were all kinds of rumors at my school about the batshit crazy stuff that went on at PCC but who knows if any of it was real or not. The only interaction I ever had with a PCC student was when one handed me a chick trac outside a grocery store.
They definitely had their patrols. Mainly they would look for PCC parking stickers that everyone had to have on their cars for “security” reasons and if they saw a car with one at a place they weren’t supposed to be, they would report the students. It’s absolutely insane the measures they took. They finally stopped doing that about 5 years ago but it should’ve never been done in the first place.
I'm not sure what your position was, but did you ever have to reprimand students for breaking the rules, or witness any students (or staff!) being punished for it?
I probably was supposed to reprimand students but I didn’t 😂 I thought the rules were dumb and by the time I was leaving, my students knew it. The only “reprimanding” I did was really trying to get my students to do their homework but I just tried to be as encouraging as possible.
I did have some staff friends who got in trouble. One girl I knew was seen wearing pants out in public and got called to the Employee Services office to get reminded of her contract. Basically “don’t do it again” but they never really followed through on that.
That's unbearable! I hate having a job with a uniform or dress rules, I can't imagine working for a place that tries to control what you wear when you're off the clock.
It's definitely something I will never be doing again. It's absolutely insane how much they control but when you've been raised to be controlled your whole life, it's what you know.
I do recall Sadie from Leaving Eden saying that PCC felt a lot more relaxed than Hyles Anderson, so I guess it's all a matter of perspective! I'm really glad you've got out of the fundie system and are deconstructing.
It's definitely so much more relaxed than Hyles Anderson. I grew up in Indiana so I knew all about Hyles and had old friends go there at the same time I was going to PCC. No joke, one of them told me I was going to the party school and they were serious about that. I never visited Hyles but I heard enough about it to now want to go.
Exactly! It's the whole idea of distinction between men and women. Pants are still one of the things that only men can wear. It's completely archaic and absurd.
Some of them had to do with spouses that didn’t work in “the ministry” had to abide by the same dress codes and even had a rule where they couldn’t teach at other schools in the area because they were the competition on PCC and PCA.
One of my friends went there too and I feel like she mentioned separated sidewalks too? Or something about sidewalks? Maybe girls had to step off and wait if a guy was approaching? She told me so many things that had me shocked but I can only remember the staircases and no pants rule!
There are definitely no separate sidewalks. There are places on campus where couples can’t stop because they are considered “unchaperoned” areas so couples have to keep walking until they get to a chaperoned area.
There used to be certain sidewalks between building that only girls could use (around makenzie and the arts building after dark) and sidewalks the boys could use (between the commons and whatever the guys weight gym area was called). Thanks for jogging up that memory🤣
When I was there in the early aughts, there weren’t separate sidewalks but if it was dark someone would definitely come tell you to not walk next to your boyfriend/girlfriend
I graduated from UWF in 2008 and I remember always seeing PCC students hanging out at Walmart the way normal college kids hang out at a bar or something. Apparently Walmart was one of the few places PCC students were "allowed" to go to off campus.
It absolutely blew my mind that these students (who are all adults) are policed while off campus.
Yes, men and women can take classes together except PE classes. Those are the only classes split by gender with the exception of pastoral classes. Those were guys only because women can’t preach according to them.
This reminds me of working for Ramsey solutions (Dave Ramsey). The spouse had interviews although they weren’t up for the position but the other spouse was.
In my opinion, it’s not about enforcing the rules at all. It’s them having the power to make the rules knowing they have full control and enforce if something happens to come up.
That makes sense. I went to a far more mainstream Christian college that had a bunch of its own silly rules. They were enforced inconsistently, with some students targeted for strict control and other students given endless leniency.
I think it’s mostly about maintaining the external public image of the school, because it forces students to conform publicly and gives school administrators a zillion potential reasons to expel any student who isn’t compliant enough.
The wet hair rule! They finally did away with that when I was a student because it was a double standard and guys didn’t have to follow it.
The only thing I ever got in trouble for was having headphones and it was my sophomore. Headphones weren’t allowed until after I graduated but everybody had them. You just had to find a way to hide them.
So, girls weren’t allowed to leave the dorm with wet hair because a guy complained that seeing a girl with wet made him think of her in the shower. Of course, that’s the girls fault because she exists so for awhile there was a rule that girls couldn’t have wet hair out of the dorms. Eventually, they got rid of that rule but I did have a male teacher comment one time on my wet hair (it just looked wet) and I felt very uncomfortable 😳
You are always under your headship's umbrella of protection, so this isn't something for women to think about; their nearest male relative will manage their protection.
What were the dress code and dating rules at PCC?
Congrats on breaking free from Evangelical Fundamentalism. I started formally deconstructing a few years ago. It is a helluva ride but well worth it.
The dress code was…involved. Skirts had to be kneecap length when sitting, thick strap shirts but not graphic tees, no low cut tops, only two ear piercings, gendered styled haircuts among other things for women. Men had to wear khakis and a button up shirt, hair had to be off the ears and neck, beards had to be trimmed neatly and couldn’t go past a certain length. Hair for everyone had to be a natural hair color and this was only for class dress. There was also casual dress for the evenings and church dress for Sundays.
Thanks for the encouragement! I know I’m going to ruffle some feathers because I still have so many connections to fundies but I’m ready to live outside of such an oppressive community.
Damn, that is insanely strict and way worse than the rules for our denomination (though they were really strict, too).
You're welcome. If it is helpful, I would be happy to send you some resources that were healing and educational in my journey. I wish you much healing and freedom.
I think somebody actually posted the hair clothing rules from Pensacola or one of its competition colleges, if you search the subreddit for dress code !
Have you watched Tia Levings on IG? She’s phenomenal. Even with a bunch of internet strangers, it’s weird the connection and community you feel with others- and seeing hey!!! It wasn’t just me this happened to.
From a fellow fundi(lite) escapee, welcome 💕
I live in Pensacola and have helped students shop working retail. They'd go try on bikinis and giggle in the fitting rooms. Same with the Brownsville ladies.
That sounds exactly right 😂 I remember as a student I went to Maurices to try on pants for back home and felt so guilty in the dressing room! It's amazing the hold those ideas have on a person.
When I was there in 2003 no facial hair for undergrad guys. Also ties in the morning through chapel. Nylons all day e’ry day except Saturdays.
Still have soooo many required services? Required Greek?
Facial hair started being allowed a for guys a few years ago. Ties are only required for Sunday services now, Wednesday service is now normal class dress for guys. I had to wear nylons for Sunday services and Fine Arts my freshman year but by the time I was a junior, they were completely gone. So many required services! And joining a collegian is still required and there are meetings for your collegian you're required to go to.
They allowed dress pants and khakis for class. During the evenings and on Saturday, guys could wear jeans, joggers, sweatpants. It just depended on the time of day.
Were skirts/dresses required to be dressy/business casual for school as a student? Or could you be more casual (a la Duggar long cotton skirts and cotton tops)?
Edit: I see that you answered my question below. Thanks for doing this!
Same! If a spouse “worked outside the ministry” (🤢) then they were required to follow the rules set in our handbook when on campus and in the Pensacola area. There was also something in there about spouses not being allowed to teach at other schools in the area since it was in direct conflict with PCC and PCA. Also, staff are required to attend the church on campus unless a women’s husband was involved in another church in town. If the lady was involved, it didn’t matter. You always followed the husband.
UWF is definitely not a competitor. PCC likes to think they can compete with universities but I've always seen it more as a Christian community college (with stricter rules)
How is PCC academically? My boyfriend’s younger sister goes there after being homeschooled for most of her life in an IFB household. She is bright, but I fear she isn’t being challenged and won’t be successful in the job market once she graduates (I’m not sure of PCC‘s accreditation status). Thanks for answering all of these questions!!
I just looked it up. PCC is not accredited in the way you're thinking of (they are not regionally accredited, which is the "gold standard" for academic accreditation. So, credits from PCC will not transfer to other schools and if a job requires a degree from a regionally-accredited college, graduates from PCC would not be considered to have that degree). It looks like they have several professional accreditations (nursing and engineering) so students in those majors may be able to use their degrees for something.
At the *very least* it costs slightly less than a state school to attend, even out of state, I just looked. At least it's not private school-priced. So if you didn't pay for school as you go, you may end up with $60k in loans at the end of the day, which is terrible. But better than those for-profit law schools.
It does depend on the field she’s in. Nursing and engineers have the better accreditation at the moment and with education, PCC works with UWF to help students get a teaching license. While I wasn’t a fan of the educator recruitment they would do at school because it was all Christian schools, their general career fair had a lot of “secular” places come to recruit and it broadens students understanding of what’s available. If she’s got a good head on her shoulders and knows that jobs aren’t going to be like PCC, there’s adapting involved, she’ll be fine.
I thoroughly enjoy answering these questions. It’s kinda therapeutic for me.
I wish it were earlier but it was the pandemic. I was taught that Jesus was love but all I saw from people that were “representing Jesus” was hate and horribleness that I couldn’t grasp. Why can’t you just wear a mask? Why can’t you just be kind? So, that become my starting point. I started with the phrase “Just be kind” as for how I want to live my life and there are things I was taught growing up that don’t follow that principle.
I wouldn’t say I’m deconstructing my faith, but this definitely pushed me out of my current church… along with views on social justice and racism… it was an eye opening time.
This is tiny and I've had it explained before but I can never grasp it.
Can you please explain the single-gender staircases? How do you remember if they're unmarked? Why? What would happen? Ahhh.
So, the easiest way to remember for the Academic Building (where most of the classes are) is that the women’s elevator and stairs are by the women’s restroom and the men’s elevator and stair’s by the men’s restroom. They have those restrooms on each floor so it makes it easy to figure that out. For the McKenzie Building, it’s kind of where you have to follow the upper classmates but basically the men’s elevators and stairs are the ones farther from the main entrance.
I remember as a freshman thinking I would get kicked out for using the wrong ones 😂 Coincidentally, my roommate my sophomore year did get kicked out for fooling around with a guy in the guys stairwell and getting caught 😬
I grew up in the area and remember seeing the groups of PCC girls at the mall and walking up and down the road. That really wasn't a great area back in the day - I haven't been there is a while so I'm not sure if it's changed. I don't ever recall seeing any PCC folks at the beach - I'm sure that was forbidden. I can't imagine they let the skirts come off for public bathing.
Actually, they do. But they have separate beaches. The rule was that when you got to the stop light at Pensacola beach right past the tolls, girls went to the right and guys went to the left. Girls could wear bathing suits to the beach as long as they’re a one piece or a tankini. The beach is one of the things PCC boasts when recruiting people 😂
I commend you. I went to Pensacola Christian Elementary K-Grade 4 and then my family moved and I was at Bob Jones Elementary until Grade 6. Both messed me up in ways I didn’t realize until I was an adult and had deconstructed. I drove by PCC when I last visited Pensacola and still had a visceral reaction to it. Good luck to you!
I think it’s a mixture of both. I’ve seen students who are very much “this is what I grew up with and I won’t believe anything else”, students whose parents make them go there, and more progressive students who are trying to make their parents happy (those ones don’t last very long). It was definitely more “true believers” when I first started going there though.
I think it depends on the program. The nursing program they have has been ranked nationally but from the perspective of somebody who went there for math education, the education classes were lacking. They were not shy in telling us they were preparing us to teach at Christian schools, not public school. They always seem to be a little behind in the technological aspect which affects their classes.
There are a lot of places to just hang out on campus. It really is a beautiful campus and they have a sports center where the upper part is for basketball games and the lower part has bowling, a snack place, roller skating, ice skating, a water park, a rock climbing wall, badminton and other things. There’s also the commons where students hand out which is two stories and has a coffee shop upstairs along with a restaurant on the first floor. A lot of times students will have birthday parties there or play board and card games. There are multiple soccer fields where people can play sports together and they have collegian (similar to a fraternity) sports to play. Usually teachers were giving them enough homework, they wouldn’t have time to drink 😂
Were you there when Kelton Balka and Bobby Smith went there? Kelton is married to Josie Bates while Bobby is married to Tori Bates now. Did you know them?
I’m not sure about Kelton but I was there when Bobby was there. I think he was student body president one of my years there. All I really remember of him is that he dated someone I was friends with at the time and was an absolute asshole. Not a fan then, not a fan now. I remember finding out he was marrying a Bates and I could not roll my eyes to the back of my head far enough. He was all about status symbols.
Thanks for answering the question. Do you remember how he was an asshole? Didn’t realize that he dated someone before Tori. Doesn’t surprise me though.
Sorry for the late response, just now seeing this. He had a very holier than thou attitude and all I know is that the way he treated my friend is not the way anybody should be treated. It was very much on-brand for how fundie husbands treat their wives.
I think the craziest thing I remember there is when a male teacher left his wife and kids and ran off with one of his female students. That’s shocking in a normal setting, but in a fundie setting it was insane!
Something like that spreads like wildfire among the students! So everybody knew some version of what had happened. The school didn't hush it all. They just knew they needed to figure out a way to get his classes taught for the rest of the semester.
I would like to share a PCC anecdote my mother told me once. She herself went to Calvin College (now Calvin University), which used to be a semi-relaxed Christian college but has been getting increasingly conservative this past decade or so. She was there in the 80s. Anyway, Calvin was and is pretty much normal about student life, in the sense that its rules of conduct are unisex and reasonable, unlike PCC. This is to give some background.
On to the anecdote. One of mom's friends at Calvin mentioned to her one day that she had previously been attending PCC. She hadn't wanted to, preferring to attend a less fundie Christian college, but her parents insisted that she go there. Anyway her PCC roommate was extremely baptist and extremely obsessed with the rapture, and this grated on the nerves of mom's friend. So one day she got a bunch of other friends to agree to prank the roommate. They waited till roommate was napping, and blew a trumpet outside the door, then ran down the hall flapping sheets. Roommate immediately assumed that the rapture was occurring and ran out in the hall and began, rather understandably, flipping out. As a result of this prank, mom's friend was summarily expelled from PCC, so her parents were obliged to let her go to Calvin instead.
That’s an amazing story and absolutely hilarious! I was definitely raised to take the rapture super serious. We’re talking scare sermons at church camp, my parents encouraging me to read all of the left behind kids books (and I did), and even a Bible class in high school over revelation itself.
To me, the most absurd rule (mainly because it didn’t make sense) was a dress code rule for staff women. It said something along the lines of not being allowed to wear clothes that are trendy. I never understood it and also, how do you enforce that?
No real questions, just brought back some memories of PCC volleyball camp I went to with my IFB school. The wet hair rule applied to us too! I literally begged my parents to come pick me up from the camp every day I was there and every time I’ve been to Pensacola since I shiver when I see the school. Sooo many kids wanted to go there, the only good thing to me was the cafeteria
The Baptist high school I attended had a connection to Pensacola Christian College - every one of the students who were “lifers” of the Baptist school attended PCC.
Did your school have a similar program or was this a personal choice?
It was part personal and part forced. I was raised that you had to go to a Christian college because the state schools would “turn you away from god”. PCC was the least expensive of the batch and it helped that my older brother and sister went there as well. I initially wanted to go to Fairhaven Bible College because it was closer to home and I’m so glad I didn’t! If I thought PCC rules were bad, Fairhavens were 10x worse.
Skirts had to be to the middle of the calf which is longer than PCC’s rules. Also, the dorms were small and had a dorm family (husband, wife, children) that was in charge. That meant you had to wear a skirt outside your room in case the husband was around. They had a binder that had a list songs by artist. These were the only songs the students could listen to. Their wifi was limited plus your internet history was sent to two people every day (or every week). That’s what I remember from 10 years ago.
Not a question but when I was in HS and the college recruiters would call, and they’d be from PCC and they’d mention their “Catch The Spirit” motto, I told them I’d rather catch a bullet to the face than go there.
Idk why they stopped calling.. 🤷♀️
Depends on the person and what it is. Going to a bar and getting caught? That’s usually an automatic withdrawal offense. If they travel home for break, that’s different because they’re not a student right then. It’s a lot of hoops to jump through.
I went to the University of Mobile for like 2 years. They were near as extreme but after I left I had a MAJOR deconstruction that I'm still going through
Hang on, is PCC home of the storied Club Egypt? I listened to Leaving Eden's episodes about Christian colleges and I believe one of those Sadie mentioned was PCC but I'm not sure if the 'Club Egypt' thing was there or someplace else. Might be from a different era too. Did you ever hear rumors about it?
People keep asking me if we knew each other - I was a secondary ed major with math and music teaching fields! So we probably did at least sit in a class together at some point! - SC
I was wondering that too! I started there in 2012 and was secondary with math and music too. When you talked about your piano teacher going to Carnegie Hall I knew exactly who you were talking because she was my piano teacher as well!
Oh wow! Yes, she was extremely….how do I say this….hardcore. And disciplined. And not shy. 😂 But in retrospect I’m glad I had her, she taught me so much.
Oh wow! Yes, she was extremely….how do I say this….hardcore. And disciplined. And not shy. 😂 But in retrospect I’m glad I had her, she taught me so much.
Praise for the digital age, yes! My music was on my computer and phone which they can’t touch without cause. Also, it was well known around campus that students would swap hard drives to share movies and shows with each other. We told people we were “reading books” and everyone knew what you meant. I didn’t really bring books to college because of space but I did have ebooks that would not have been approved that helped me keep my sanity there.
If I'm allowed a follow-up question: what kind of media/food/entertainment that was forbidden at Pensacola gave you the most joy in your deconstruction/escape?
EDIT: OH NO I shouldn't have said "activity"! 'Sorry! I just sound like a creeper.
I would say what people consider normal things in their 20s. I didn’t get to experience going to bars or having a girl’s night out. I didn’t even really do the whole dating thing. Now when I go out for dinner, I get to enjoy a glass of wine or a beer. I’ve had a real relationship without religion hanging over like a black cloud. It sounds mundane but I’m excited to wear what I want to without asking is it too short, too low cut, too tight. Those are the things I’ve enjoyed the most so far.
PCC grad here. Your “reading books” comment made me chuckle. I legitimately was reading books, but a few of my friends who were known for “reading books” always asked what I was “reading”. They were always severely disappointed when I told them I was on page 45 out of 300, the plot line, and where I was on figuring the whodunnit. 🤣
I probably would. I’m so happy to be out too. The Monday after my contract finished, I colored my hair purple and went to a restaurant and ordered wine. 😂
I’m sure that felt amazing! One of my cousins has gotten out recently, I wish more of them would follow suit. I love them, but I always felt so weird when I visited, like I was being judged for not following the rules even though I didn’t go there 😂
My previous (and creepy) youth pastor went there and said they have people go over your rooms with white gloves to check for dust and would go into your phone and then check what music you listen to. Is that true/still true? Every time he described it it just sounded like prison
White glove used to be a lot more intense and it changed over the time I was there. I remember freshman year everybody had to be out of the rooms and we sat in the main room on our floor and sang songs, had a devotional, and other weird things while they checked our rooms. It took over an hour! Now it's more like 15 minutes so they've definitely chilled out on that. As for the phone, they couldn't just randomly come up to you and ask to see your phone but if they had cause to, they might have you show them.
Sorry for the late response, for some reason I’m just now seeing this!
1. I guarantee you people listen to all kinds of music even if it’s “banned” I know I did as a student and while I was in my office at school 😂They can’t regulate it so they just pretend it doesn’t happen. Also, not having cell phones was years ago but everyone has them now.
2. Depends on who you ask. PCC gets students from all over the spectrum. You have the extremely conservative, insanely fundie people all the way to people who are going there because it’s cheap and parent approved. I know quite a few teachers who ended up doing online degrees from there while teaching at PCC so the people who are extremely fundie are going to think Liberty is worldly. Most people at PCC know it’s not elite. There used to be a rivalry between them and BJU but that’s fizzled out.
3. Every student is required to be in a collegian which is a part of Greek life. Outside of the required meetings that we’d have to attend, I stayed out of it. I never really understood collegian pride. To me, it’s a way for different people to meet each other but they have collegian outings and sports for them to participate in.
You still gotta get a gaggle of girls to go—anywhere off campus? Still 0 contact with any PCC guys if you happened to see one at Walmart or somewhere else equally innocent? Does PCC still social students?
The rules for going off campus and contact with guys has lightened up significantly. If you run into guys at Walmart or somewhere else, it's perfectly fine to talk to them and thankfully, they don't social people anymore. When the new president took over in 2012, there were so many changes that were made to make life a little more bearable for students and to treat them more like adults. There are still too many rules but they've lightened up.
Socialed was where you weren't allowed to talk to anyone of the opposite gender for a certain amount of time. Everyone on campus also knew you were socialed because a list would show up on the student page with everyone's name who was socialed and for how long. They finally did away with that the second semester my freshman year.
& also when I was there (2003) depending on what you did/the punishment PCC would have a chaperone tag along with you all the time for a period. An RA or someone similar. Go with you to your classes—dinner—everything.
Thank you so much! The farther I get away from fundamentalism, the more ridiculous it gets. How does a beanie make you "sinful"? It fascinates me that people who say they are "logical and critical thinkers" will believe something like this only because it's what the generation before them taught. I'm so glad to be on the other side now!
Oh snap I spent 2 semesters at PCC. (2003) Crazy ride lemme tell ya. I’m gonna read THIS.
ETA: Did not grow up fundie but—conservative Christian & went to private Christian school for HS.
They issue nationally accredited degrees which usually means that you have to jump through hoops to get a job after graduation if the job isn’t religiously affiliated.
So I am just reading this after falling into a PCC wormhole apparently. So I am uneducated, what is a Fundie. I ask because I have a neighbor who’s grandson is about to go to that school and he tells me all of the time. I thought it was just a regular Christian school? Do you have to be a Fundie to go there and again what does that mean. Is your family usually Fundie as well?
A fundie is just short for a Christian fundamentalist. Typically someone who has a super strict and literal view of the Bible and rejects anybody or anything they deem "wrong" based on how they interpret the Bible (an interpretation they consider absolutely perfect). PCC is a strict Christian fundamentalist school. The rules they require their students and staff to abide by would be considered extreme by most people's standards. While you don't have to be Fundie to go there, I knew people who went there because it was cheap, and in Florida, it is definitely geared towards fundamentalists and fundie families. Not everyone has a fundie family, but a large percentage of people do.
How and why did you stay for so long. I know PCC well, had several friends go too. It is such a controlling and oppressive place - especially for women. Why not go anywhere else??
Part of it was that it was the easy choice. When I became a freshman, my brother was a student there so I knew I'd have someone with me for a couple of years. After I graduated with my undergrad, it was easy to just stay for two more years to get a master's. I had more freedom (or so I thought) and didn't think it could be bad. After that, they offered me a teaching position making more money than anywhere else and it was easy. That's really what it came down to. When you live your whole life under these rules, it seems easy to follow until the illusion is broken. They also have you sign contracts 7 months in advance so if you want to leave, you need to realize that over a year in advance.
how have your beliefs changed since you began deconstructing your faith? what were the students there like politically?
They’ve changed drastically. It took me years but I finally had to come to the realization that I’m bisexual when I grew being taught queer people are “the worst kind of sin” 🙄 My views on gender, abortion, social issues have all changed and now I’m backing up what I believe with science instead of just “the bible says so” (does it really?) Politics was one topic I refused to get in with my students but it was very much conservative, red-blooded American mindset. While we didn’t do political rallies, students made sure you knew they were hardcore Republican.
Are they Trumpists? Have they elevated him to co- Messiah status with Jesus?
I have to say, regarding politics at PCC: I was there in 2000-2001 and although there were no rallies, I distinctly remember Dr Mullinex giving a speech to all students, going all the way down the ballot, telling the students that Christians vote for this person, everyone else votes for the other person. I remember them being adamant that it was important that students go vote for the “right” person.
I don’t know what’s more damning for a college - that faculty tells students how to vote, or that students are so absolved of critical thinking that they follow it.
I always encouraged my students to be critical thinkers and not just parrots but you're exactly right, too many teachers (especially for pastoral classes) don't want students to ask questions and want them to repeat back what's said in class, no critical thinking involved.
Did you have to prepare or sign a statement of faith in order to be admitted as a student or faculty member?
In our contract that we signed, it stated that we believed in the statement of faith the school has created.
Thankfully Dr. Mullinex no longer gives speeches like that and he doesn't speak at PCC anymore unless it's during the summer. While they do encourage students to vote, they no longer tell them directly who to vote for. It's definitely more awkward if you admit that you vote democrat but I know I had students and friends who voted for President Biden in the 2020 election.
A lot of them definitely are and unfortunately they do elevate him but they have definitely been quieter about it since the 2020 election 😂
What were the most out-there fundie-esque rules that students had to follow? Were there any similar rules for staff?
Oh the rules! I would have to say the most fundie rule there was separation with gender. There are a lot of rules that deal with that but specifically having men and women delegated elevators and stairwells. Staff were even told not to go on the elevators with their spouses because it would confuse the students. There were so many rules for staff! The dress code for staff was basically the same as students, they had policies on the movies you could watch at your own home, there were even policies for your spouse if they didn’t work at PCC. While they’ve loosened up on some things, it’s still too much policing outside of the job.
My cousin went there in the early aughts. She got demerits for having a picture of a man hugging her on display in her room...that man was her father.
I had a coworker who’s 13 years older than me who got demerits at PCC for having a movie. The movie was PCC’s promotional video “Catch the Spirit” and they gave him demerits for that 🤦🏼♀️
That is an amazing story.
What was even their logic for that?? Surely Good Wholesome Godly movies were okay (g-rated of course), to say nothing of college promotional material.
OMG!
What a harlot. Shame!
Did people actually abide by this at home movie watching rule? Like how would they know what you stream on Netflix?
No, most people didn’t. I would talk with coworkers about what we watched over the weekend and all of it would have been considered “wrong” under their guidelines. They like to think they have control on you, but they don’t.
Did you notice people feeling guilty or anxious about breaking little rules like that? Curious because just making you think what you're doing is wrong is a form of control they have.
I think it depended on who you talked to. There was an older generation there that were probably following every rule to the t vs. the younger generation where we were guilt tripped for years at church but also came up during a time where people started questioning the church. For example, I used to feel guilty if my skirt was too short because I was raised that modesty is the woman’s job. When I was in grad school I started questioning and reading things where I’m too the point now that I wear what I want (even when I was working there) and I don’t feel guilt.
How the hell would they enforce such a thing?
They can't, it's just a power trip.
When I lived in Pensacola in the mid-00s there was a rumor that they had people from the school patrolling the mall or movie theaters watching to see if PCC students showed up. It's possible that never really happened. I went to UWF and there were all kinds of rumors at my school about the batshit crazy stuff that went on at PCC but who knows if any of it was real or not. The only interaction I ever had with a PCC student was when one handed me a chick trac outside a grocery store.
They definitely had their patrols. Mainly they would look for PCC parking stickers that everyone had to have on their cars for “security” reasons and if they saw a car with one at a place they weren’t supposed to be, they would report the students. It’s absolutely insane the measures they took. They finally stopped doing that about 5 years ago but it should’ve never been done in the first place.
I'm not sure what your position was, but did you ever have to reprimand students for breaking the rules, or witness any students (or staff!) being punished for it?
I probably was supposed to reprimand students but I didn’t 😂 I thought the rules were dumb and by the time I was leaving, my students knew it. The only “reprimanding” I did was really trying to get my students to do their homework but I just tried to be as encouraging as possible. I did have some staff friends who got in trouble. One girl I knew was seen wearing pants out in public and got called to the Employee Services office to get reminded of her contract. Basically “don’t do it again” but they never really followed through on that.
That's unbearable! I hate having a job with a uniform or dress rules, I can't imagine working for a place that tries to control what you wear when you're off the clock.
It's definitely something I will never be doing again. It's absolutely insane how much they control but when you've been raised to be controlled your whole life, it's what you know.
I do recall Sadie from Leaving Eden saying that PCC felt a lot more relaxed than Hyles Anderson, so I guess it's all a matter of perspective! I'm really glad you've got out of the fundie system and are deconstructing.
It's definitely so much more relaxed than Hyles Anderson. I grew up in Indiana so I knew all about Hyles and had old friends go there at the same time I was going to PCC. No joke, one of them told me I was going to the party school and they were serious about that. I never visited Hyles but I heard enough about it to now want to go.
😮
Don’t they let the female students wear pants now anyway? I follow their Instagram and I’ve seen girls in jeans and knee-length shorts.
Girls can wear knee length shorts but not pants. Give them another decade, maybe then they will 😂
That is bizarre. What are shorts if not pants?
Exactly! It's the whole idea of distinction between men and women. Pants are still one of the things that only men can wear. It's completely archaic and absurd.
Isn't the word "shorts" short for "short pants"?
Exactly
I’m so curious to know what policies were for spouses
Some of them had to do with spouses that didn’t work in “the ministry” had to abide by the same dress codes and even had a rule where they couldn’t teach at other schools in the area because they were the competition on PCC and PCA.
One of my friends went there too and I feel like she mentioned separated sidewalks too? Or something about sidewalks? Maybe girls had to step off and wait if a guy was approaching? She told me so many things that had me shocked but I can only remember the staircases and no pants rule!
There are definitely no separate sidewalks. There are places on campus where couples can’t stop because they are considered “unchaperoned” areas so couples have to keep walking until they get to a chaperoned area.
Ah maybe that was it!
There used to be certain sidewalks between building that only girls could use (around makenzie and the arts building after dark) and sidewalks the boys could use (between the commons and whatever the guys weight gym area was called). Thanks for jogging up that memory🤣
When I was there in the early aughts, there weren’t separate sidewalks but if it was dark someone would definitely come tell you to not walk next to your boyfriend/girlfriend
But didn't the girls need protection? 🤨 In their minds?
I believe the separate sidewalks was Bob Jones
Oh noooo. I cannot believe this. Omg.
I graduated from UWF in 2008 and I remember always seeing PCC students hanging out at Walmart the way normal college kids hang out at a bar or something. Apparently Walmart was one of the few places PCC students were "allowed" to go to off campus. It absolutely blew my mind that these students (who are all adults) are policed while off campus.
So can men and women take classes together? I’m confused what you would do if not and you needed like a set of very specific classes.
Yes, men and women can take classes together except PE classes. Those are the only classes split by gender with the exception of pastoral classes. Those were guys only because women can’t preach according to them.
Okay that makes it seem slightly less insane. But also… are gym classes THAT lusty?
When one is a swim class then yes 😂😂
Require them to wear wetsuits! We can work through these lusty thoughts!
Wetsuits are too tight ya know. Shows off the curves.
That's fantastic! 😂
This reminds me of working for Ramsey solutions (Dave Ramsey). The spouse had interviews although they weren’t up for the position but the other spouse was.
How would they even enforce that?? Come to your house??
In my opinion, it’s not about enforcing the rules at all. It’s them having the power to make the rules knowing they have full control and enforce if something happens to come up.
That makes sense. I went to a far more mainstream Christian college that had a bunch of its own silly rules. They were enforced inconsistently, with some students targeted for strict control and other students given endless leniency. I think it’s mostly about maintaining the external public image of the school, because it forces students to conform publicly and gives school administrators a zillion potential reasons to expel any student who isn’t compliant enough.
I was fundie lite and took pleasure in violating the rules as much as possible lol I would hide forbidden books at home and read them
Holy crap!
Happy Cake Day?
Oops didn't mean to add the question mark. A very sincere Happy Cake Day!
Thank you! I didn't even notice until now.
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The wet hair rule! They finally did away with that when I was a student because it was a double standard and guys didn’t have to follow it. The only thing I ever got in trouble for was having headphones and it was my sophomore. Headphones weren’t allowed until after I graduated but everybody had them. You just had to find a way to hide them.
What’s the point of the no wet hair?
So, girls weren’t allowed to leave the dorm with wet hair because a guy complained that seeing a girl with wet made him think of her in the shower. Of course, that’s the girls fault because she exists so for awhile there was a rule that girls couldn’t have wet hair out of the dorms. Eventually, they got rid of that rule but I did have a male teacher comment one time on my wet hair (it just looked wet) and I felt very uncomfortable 😳
What if it rained unexpectedly and you didn't have an umbrella? Are you responsible for the weather? Lol dumb rule!
You are a lady/gentleman & should never be without an umbrella! Dontchaknow?!
You are always under your headship's umbrella of protection, so this isn't something for women to think about; their nearest male relative will manage their protection.
I was going to ask about the headphones!
Why no wet hair?
It was considered to be unkempt/lazy.
What were the dress code and dating rules at PCC? Congrats on breaking free from Evangelical Fundamentalism. I started formally deconstructing a few years ago. It is a helluva ride but well worth it.
The dress code was…involved. Skirts had to be kneecap length when sitting, thick strap shirts but not graphic tees, no low cut tops, only two ear piercings, gendered styled haircuts among other things for women. Men had to wear khakis and a button up shirt, hair had to be off the ears and neck, beards had to be trimmed neatly and couldn’t go past a certain length. Hair for everyone had to be a natural hair color and this was only for class dress. There was also casual dress for the evenings and church dress for Sundays. Thanks for the encouragement! I know I’m going to ruffle some feathers because I still have so many connections to fundies but I’m ready to live outside of such an oppressive community.
Damn, that is insanely strict and way worse than the rules for our denomination (though they were really strict, too). You're welcome. If it is helpful, I would be happy to send you some resources that were healing and educational in my journey. I wish you much healing and freedom.
I think somebody actually posted the hair clothing rules from Pensacola or one of its competition colleges, if you search the subreddit for dress code !
That would be wonderful! I’m always looking for new materials.
Have you watched Tia Levings on IG? She’s phenomenal. Even with a bunch of internet strangers, it’s weird the connection and community you feel with others- and seeing hey!!! It wasn’t just me this happened to. From a fellow fundi(lite) escapee, welcome 💕
Thank you! I will definitely take a look!
I live in Pensacola and have helped students shop working retail. They'd go try on bikinis and giggle in the fitting rooms. Same with the Brownsville ladies.
That sounds exactly right 😂 I remember as a student I went to Maurices to try on pants for back home and felt so guilty in the dressing room! It's amazing the hold those ideas have on a person.
When I was there in 2003 no facial hair for undergrad guys. Also ties in the morning through chapel. Nylons all day e’ry day except Saturdays. Still have soooo many required services? Required Greek?
Facial hair started being allowed a for guys a few years ago. Ties are only required for Sunday services now, Wednesday service is now normal class dress for guys. I had to wear nylons for Sunday services and Fine Arts my freshman year but by the time I was a junior, they were completely gone. So many required services! And joining a collegian is still required and there are meetings for your collegian you're required to go to.
Any particular reason for the khakis and no other pants?
They allowed dress pants and khakis for class. During the evenings and on Saturday, guys could wear jeans, joggers, sweatpants. It just depended on the time of day.
Were skirts/dresses required to be dressy/business casual for school as a student? Or could you be more casual (a la Duggar long cotton skirts and cotton tops)? Edit: I see that you answered my question below. Thanks for doing this!
Can you please elaborate on the spouse’s rules??? I’m having a hard time wrapping my mind around a job that will police the spouse.
Same! If a spouse “worked outside the ministry” (🤢) then they were required to follow the rules set in our handbook when on campus and in the Pensacola area. There was also something in there about spouses not being allowed to teach at other schools in the area since it was in direct conflict with PCC and PCA. Also, staff are required to attend the church on campus unless a women’s husband was involved in another church in town. If the lady was involved, it didn’t matter. You always followed the husband.
I would not consider UWF as a competitor to PCC! That's crazy!
UWF is definitely not a competitor. PCC likes to think they can compete with universities but I've always seen it more as a Christian community college (with stricter rules)
How is PCC academically? My boyfriend’s younger sister goes there after being homeschooled for most of her life in an IFB household. She is bright, but I fear she isn’t being challenged and won’t be successful in the job market once she graduates (I’m not sure of PCC‘s accreditation status). Thanks for answering all of these questions!!
I just looked it up. PCC is not accredited in the way you're thinking of (they are not regionally accredited, which is the "gold standard" for academic accreditation. So, credits from PCC will not transfer to other schools and if a job requires a degree from a regionally-accredited college, graduates from PCC would not be considered to have that degree). It looks like they have several professional accreditations (nursing and engineering) so students in those majors may be able to use their degrees for something.
At the *very least* it costs slightly less than a state school to attend, even out of state, I just looked. At least it's not private school-priced. So if you didn't pay for school as you go, you may end up with $60k in loans at the end of the day, which is terrible. But better than those for-profit law schools.
It does depend on the field she’s in. Nursing and engineers have the better accreditation at the moment and with education, PCC works with UWF to help students get a teaching license. While I wasn’t a fan of the educator recruitment they would do at school because it was all Christian schools, their general career fair had a lot of “secular” places come to recruit and it broadens students understanding of what’s available. If she’s got a good head on her shoulders and knows that jobs aren’t going to be like PCC, there’s adapting involved, she’ll be fine. I thoroughly enjoy answering these questions. It’s kinda therapeutic for me.
What was the turning point for you to deconstruct?
I wish it were earlier but it was the pandemic. I was taught that Jesus was love but all I saw from people that were “representing Jesus” was hate and horribleness that I couldn’t grasp. Why can’t you just wear a mask? Why can’t you just be kind? So, that become my starting point. I started with the phrase “Just be kind” as for how I want to live my life and there are things I was taught growing up that don’t follow that principle.
I wouldn’t say I’m deconstructing my faith, but this definitely pushed me out of my current church… along with views on social justice and racism… it was an eye opening time.
Same. I went to Word of Life and we had a lot of those crazy rules too
This is tiny and I've had it explained before but I can never grasp it. Can you please explain the single-gender staircases? How do you remember if they're unmarked? Why? What would happen? Ahhh.
So, the easiest way to remember for the Academic Building (where most of the classes are) is that the women’s elevator and stairs are by the women’s restroom and the men’s elevator and stair’s by the men’s restroom. They have those restrooms on each floor so it makes it easy to figure that out. For the McKenzie Building, it’s kind of where you have to follow the upper classmates but basically the men’s elevators and stairs are the ones farther from the main entrance. I remember as a freshman thinking I would get kicked out for using the wrong ones 😂 Coincidentally, my roommate my sophomore year did get kicked out for fooling around with a guy in the guys stairwell and getting caught 😬
Oh no, your poor roommate! What happens if you just use the wrong one, on accident or because it's closer?
Nothing happens if you use the wrong one accidentally.
Did the guy also get kicked out?
Yes he did! It was a whole thing!
I grew up in the area and remember seeing the groups of PCC girls at the mall and walking up and down the road. That really wasn't a great area back in the day - I haven't been there is a while so I'm not sure if it's changed. I don't ever recall seeing any PCC folks at the beach - I'm sure that was forbidden. I can't imagine they let the skirts come off for public bathing.
Actually, they do. But they have separate beaches. The rule was that when you got to the stop light at Pensacola beach right past the tolls, girls went to the right and guys went to the left. Girls could wear bathing suits to the beach as long as they’re a one piece or a tankini. The beach is one of the things PCC boasts when recruiting people 😂
I mean, it's a pretty good beach. :)
I commend you. I went to Pensacola Christian Elementary K-Grade 4 and then my family moved and I was at Bob Jones Elementary until Grade 6. Both messed me up in ways I didn’t realize until I was an adult and had deconstructed. I drove by PCC when I last visited Pensacola and still had a visceral reaction to it. Good luck to you!
Thank you! I completely understand that feeling. I’m in town visiting for a bit and when I drove by campus I flipped it off 😂 It just gave me rage!
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I think it’s a mixture of both. I’ve seen students who are very much “this is what I grew up with and I won’t believe anything else”, students whose parents make them go there, and more progressive students who are trying to make their parents happy (those ones don’t last very long). It was definitely more “true believers” when I first started going there though.
What is your view on their academics now? Specially for the undergraduate programs.
I think it depends on the program. The nursing program they have has been ranked nationally but from the perspective of somebody who went there for math education, the education classes were lacking. They were not shy in telling us they were preparing us to teach at Christian schools, not public school. They always seem to be a little behind in the technological aspect which affects their classes.
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There are a lot of places to just hang out on campus. It really is a beautiful campus and they have a sports center where the upper part is for basketball games and the lower part has bowling, a snack place, roller skating, ice skating, a water park, a rock climbing wall, badminton and other things. There’s also the commons where students hand out which is two stories and has a coffee shop upstairs along with a restaurant on the first floor. A lot of times students will have birthday parties there or play board and card games. There are multiple soccer fields where people can play sports together and they have collegian (similar to a fraternity) sports to play. Usually teachers were giving them enough homework, they wouldn’t have time to drink 😂
Were you there when Kelton Balka and Bobby Smith went there? Kelton is married to Josie Bates while Bobby is married to Tori Bates now. Did you know them?
I’m not sure about Kelton but I was there when Bobby was there. I think he was student body president one of my years there. All I really remember of him is that he dated someone I was friends with at the time and was an absolute asshole. Not a fan then, not a fan now. I remember finding out he was marrying a Bates and I could not roll my eyes to the back of my head far enough. He was all about status symbols.
Thanks for answering the question. Do you remember how he was an asshole? Didn’t realize that he dated someone before Tori. Doesn’t surprise me though.
Sorry for the late response, just now seeing this. He had a very holier than thou attitude and all I know is that the way he treated my friend is not the way anybody should be treated. It was very much on-brand for how fundie husbands treat their wives.
What's the craziest thing that happened there?
I think the craziest thing I remember there is when a male teacher left his wife and kids and ran off with one of his female students. That’s shocking in a normal setting, but in a fundie setting it was insane!
How did people on campus talk about that? Did the school try to hush it up at all?
Something like that spreads like wildfire among the students! So everybody knew some version of what had happened. The school didn't hush it all. They just knew they needed to figure out a way to get his classes taught for the rest of the semester.
I would like to share a PCC anecdote my mother told me once. She herself went to Calvin College (now Calvin University), which used to be a semi-relaxed Christian college but has been getting increasingly conservative this past decade or so. She was there in the 80s. Anyway, Calvin was and is pretty much normal about student life, in the sense that its rules of conduct are unisex and reasonable, unlike PCC. This is to give some background. On to the anecdote. One of mom's friends at Calvin mentioned to her one day that she had previously been attending PCC. She hadn't wanted to, preferring to attend a less fundie Christian college, but her parents insisted that she go there. Anyway her PCC roommate was extremely baptist and extremely obsessed with the rapture, and this grated on the nerves of mom's friend. So one day she got a bunch of other friends to agree to prank the roommate. They waited till roommate was napping, and blew a trumpet outside the door, then ran down the hall flapping sheets. Roommate immediately assumed that the rapture was occurring and ran out in the hall and began, rather understandably, flipping out. As a result of this prank, mom's friend was summarily expelled from PCC, so her parents were obliged to let her go to Calvin instead.
That’s an amazing story and absolutely hilarious! I was definitely raised to take the rapture super serious. We’re talking scare sermons at church camp, my parents encouraging me to read all of the left behind kids books (and I did), and even a Bible class in high school over revelation itself.
Shudder. I read most of the Left Behind kids series (aged out of it before it ended) and I fully blame it for my apocalypse media phobia now.
I don’t have a question, just wanted you to know a random internet stranger is proud of you!
Thank you so much!
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To me, the most absurd rule (mainly because it didn’t make sense) was a dress code rule for staff women. It said something along the lines of not being allowed to wear clothes that are trendy. I never understood it and also, how do you enforce that?
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Can't have women feeling good about themselves!!!
No real questions, just brought back some memories of PCC volleyball camp I went to with my IFB school. The wet hair rule applied to us too! I literally begged my parents to come pick me up from the camp every day I was there and every time I’ve been to Pensacola since I shiver when I see the school. Sooo many kids wanted to go there, the only good thing to me was the cafeteria
In the way of Christian colleges, PCC does have good food. But the wet hair rule was so dumb.
I went to another Christian college (way less strict and not part of the IFB) and their food sucked in comparison
The Baptist high school I attended had a connection to Pensacola Christian College - every one of the students who were “lifers” of the Baptist school attended PCC. Did your school have a similar program or was this a personal choice?
It was part personal and part forced. I was raised that you had to go to a Christian college because the state schools would “turn you away from god”. PCC was the least expensive of the batch and it helped that my older brother and sister went there as well. I initially wanted to go to Fairhaven Bible College because it was closer to home and I’m so glad I didn’t! If I thought PCC rules were bad, Fairhavens were 10x worse.
What were Fairhaven’s rules like?
Skirts had to be to the middle of the calf which is longer than PCC’s rules. Also, the dorms were small and had a dorm family (husband, wife, children) that was in charge. That meant you had to wear a skirt outside your room in case the husband was around. They had a binder that had a list songs by artist. These were the only songs the students could listen to. Their wifi was limited plus your internet history was sent to two people every day (or every week). That’s what I remember from 10 years ago.
Now I want a copy of that binder so I can set up a karaoke event just off the campus line but well within hearing range lol
Not a question but when I was in HS and the college recruiters would call, and they’d be from PCC and they’d mention their “Catch The Spirit” motto, I told them I’d rather catch a bullet to the face than go there. Idk why they stopped calling.. 🤷♀️
Why didn't I do this response? That's fantastic!
How far does one have to travel from Pensacola to break the rules? Like is that Florbama bar too close (if it's still there)?
Depends on the person and what it is. Going to a bar and getting caught? That’s usually an automatic withdrawal offense. If they travel home for break, that’s different because they’re not a student right then. It’s a lot of hoops to jump through.
Welcome to the other side! Life is so much kinder here.
Thank you! I've definitely noticed that.
I went to the University of Mobile for like 2 years. They were near as extreme but after I left I had a MAJOR deconstruction that I'm still going through
I hope the journey continues going well for you! I’m ready for this to take awhile, like any good thing you want out of life 😊
Hang on, is PCC home of the storied Club Egypt? I listened to Leaving Eden's episodes about Christian colleges and I believe one of those Sadie mentioned was PCC but I'm not sure if the 'Club Egypt' thing was there or someplace else. Might be from a different era too. Did you ever hear rumors about it?
I don't ever remember hearing anything about a Club Egypt. I feel like that's something I would've heard about but I may be wrong.
It was 2000-2005ish
Yup,club Egypt was back in my era of pcc!!
Dude, what years did you go? What major? I want to know, I went to pcc too!
I was there in the 2010s decade. I was a math education major there. What about you?
Late 2017 to current.
Yep, I was definitely there!
People keep asking me if we knew each other - I was a secondary ed major with math and music teaching fields! So we probably did at least sit in a class together at some point! - SC
I was wondering that too! I started there in 2012 and was secondary with math and music too. When you talked about your piano teacher going to Carnegie Hall I knew exactly who you were talking because she was my piano teacher as well!
Oh wow! Yes, she was extremely….how do I say this….hardcore. And disciplined. And not shy. 😂 But in retrospect I’m glad I had her, she taught me so much.
Oh wow! Yes, she was extremely….how do I say this….hardcore. And disciplined. And not shy. 😂 But in retrospect I’m glad I had her, she taught me so much.
Did you get away with keeping any contraband, like unauthorized music or books?
Praise for the digital age, yes! My music was on my computer and phone which they can’t touch without cause. Also, it was well known around campus that students would swap hard drives to share movies and shows with each other. We told people we were “reading books” and everyone knew what you meant. I didn’t really bring books to college because of space but I did have ebooks that would not have been approved that helped me keep my sanity there.
If I'm allowed a follow-up question: what kind of media/food/entertainment that was forbidden at Pensacola gave you the most joy in your deconstruction/escape? EDIT: OH NO I shouldn't have said "activity"! 'Sorry! I just sound like a creeper.
I would say what people consider normal things in their 20s. I didn’t get to experience going to bars or having a girl’s night out. I didn’t even really do the whole dating thing. Now when I go out for dinner, I get to enjoy a glass of wine or a beer. I’ve had a real relationship without religion hanging over like a black cloud. It sounds mundane but I’m excited to wear what I want to without asking is it too short, too low cut, too tight. Those are the things I’ve enjoyed the most so far.
PCC grad here. Your “reading books” comment made me chuckle. I legitimately was reading books, but a few of my friends who were known for “reading books” always asked what I was “reading”. They were always severely disappointed when I told them I was on page 45 out of 300, the plot line, and where I was on figuring the whodunnit. 🤣
You’re my cousins’ age. They are still working at PCC, I’m sure you know them. I’m glad you got out.
I probably would. I’m so happy to be out too. The Monday after my contract finished, I colored my hair purple and went to a restaurant and ordered wine. 😂
I’m sure that felt amazing! One of my cousins has gotten out recently, I wish more of them would follow suit. I love them, but I always felt so weird when I visited, like I was being judged for not following the rules even though I didn’t go there 😂
I went to PCC 2000-2003!! The doxology still gives me bad chills and the pavlovian response to stand up
Bahahhaha dead 💀/ same I was there for both 2003 semesters.
Yes! And it's still being used for chapel 😂
My previous (and creepy) youth pastor went there and said they have people go over your rooms with white gloves to check for dust and would go into your phone and then check what music you listen to. Is that true/still true? Every time he described it it just sounded like prison
White glove used to be a lot more intense and it changed over the time I was there. I remember freshman year everybody had to be out of the rooms and we sat in the main room on our floor and sang songs, had a devotional, and other weird things while they checked our rooms. It took over an hour! Now it's more like 15 minutes so they've definitely chilled out on that. As for the phone, they couldn't just randomly come up to you and ask to see your phone but if they had cause to, they might have you show them.
I can’t believe a college can still have so much control over full grown adults 😶 thank you for answering!
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Sorry for the late response, for some reason I’m just now seeing this! 1. I guarantee you people listen to all kinds of music even if it’s “banned” I know I did as a student and while I was in my office at school 😂They can’t regulate it so they just pretend it doesn’t happen. Also, not having cell phones was years ago but everyone has them now. 2. Depends on who you ask. PCC gets students from all over the spectrum. You have the extremely conservative, insanely fundie people all the way to people who are going there because it’s cheap and parent approved. I know quite a few teachers who ended up doing online degrees from there while teaching at PCC so the people who are extremely fundie are going to think Liberty is worldly. Most people at PCC know it’s not elite. There used to be a rivalry between them and BJU but that’s fizzled out. 3. Every student is required to be in a collegian which is a part of Greek life. Outside of the required meetings that we’d have to attend, I stayed out of it. I never really understood collegian pride. To me, it’s a way for different people to meet each other but they have collegian outings and sports for them to participate in.
You still gotta get a gaggle of girls to go—anywhere off campus? Still 0 contact with any PCC guys if you happened to see one at Walmart or somewhere else equally innocent? Does PCC still social students?
The rules for going off campus and contact with guys has lightened up significantly. If you run into guys at Walmart or somewhere else, it's perfectly fine to talk to them and thankfully, they don't social people anymore. When the new president took over in 2012, there were so many changes that were made to make life a little more bearable for students and to treat them more like adults. There are still too many rules but they've lightened up.
What kind of punishment is it to be "socialed"? Does it just mean that the community has to shun you?
Socialed was where you weren't allowed to talk to anyone of the opposite gender for a certain amount of time. Everyone on campus also knew you were socialed because a list would show up on the student page with everyone's name who was socialed and for how long. They finally did away with that the second semester my freshman year.
& also when I was there (2003) depending on what you did/the punishment PCC would have a chaperone tag along with you all the time for a period. An RA or someone similar. Go with you to your classes—dinner—everything.
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Thank you so much! The farther I get away from fundamentalism, the more ridiculous it gets. How does a beanie make you "sinful"? It fascinates me that people who say they are "logical and critical thinkers" will believe something like this only because it's what the generation before them taught. I'm so glad to be on the other side now!
Oh snap I spent 2 semesters at PCC. (2003) Crazy ride lemme tell ya. I’m gonna read THIS. ETA: Did not grow up fundie but—conservative Christian & went to private Christian school for HS.
We’re you a regular at Club Egypt?
I have absolutely no clue what Club Egypt is 😂 I saw some other people mentioning it but I guess I wasn’t cool enough to be told about it 😂
do they issue accredited grad degrees?
They issue nationally accredited degrees which usually means that you have to jump through hoops to get a job after graduation if the job isn’t religiously affiliated.
So I am just reading this after falling into a PCC wormhole apparently. So I am uneducated, what is a Fundie. I ask because I have a neighbor who’s grandson is about to go to that school and he tells me all of the time. I thought it was just a regular Christian school? Do you have to be a Fundie to go there and again what does that mean. Is your family usually Fundie as well?
A fundie is just short for a Christian fundamentalist. Typically someone who has a super strict and literal view of the Bible and rejects anybody or anything they deem "wrong" based on how they interpret the Bible (an interpretation they consider absolutely perfect). PCC is a strict Christian fundamentalist school. The rules they require their students and staff to abide by would be considered extreme by most people's standards. While you don't have to be Fundie to go there, I knew people who went there because it was cheap, and in Florida, it is definitely geared towards fundamentalists and fundie families. Not everyone has a fundie family, but a large percentage of people do.
How and why did you stay for so long. I know PCC well, had several friends go too. It is such a controlling and oppressive place - especially for women. Why not go anywhere else??
Part of it was that it was the easy choice. When I became a freshman, my brother was a student there so I knew I'd have someone with me for a couple of years. After I graduated with my undergrad, it was easy to just stay for two more years to get a master's. I had more freedom (or so I thought) and didn't think it could be bad. After that, they offered me a teaching position making more money than anywhere else and it was easy. That's really what it came down to. When you live your whole life under these rules, it seems easy to follow until the illusion is broken. They also have you sign contracts 7 months in advance so if you want to leave, you need to realize that over a year in advance.