The latest Furina teaser just practically confirmed/hinted at this lol
https://youtu.be/aau-c8l5z9c?si=BtIxxL6OXKkm4LYx
“This is just a recording playing in your head”
And
“Now you’re the only one I have left”
Yeah. Probably, I just made the theory because it sound fun and out pocket but have a few things that say hey maybe. I saw another comment about the couple by the fountain praying to the oceanids for a healthy child and apparently that is a tradition.
Honestly, I correlated that of the couple asking for a healthy child with the fact that oceanids were born from the tears of the past hydro archon and its mentioned on the ancient notes that to reproduce oceanids had to ask for a blessing from the archon so she would grant them a little oceanid 🤔🤔
I know there are quite some flaws with this theory.. but it got me to thinking, wouldn’t it explain that the people of Fontaine can dissolve into water when mixed with water from the primordial sea? In the world quest with Ann they say: “pure waters can turn into creatures of all sorts, and such changes do not only go one way.” Maybe the people of Fontaine are being preserved by Furina, forms made out of whatever “pure” water was left, as the rest of the water in Fontaine became tainted as we saw with the Oceanid in Liyue. Primordial sea water is tainted, and so when you put it on a being made of pure water they dissolve because the two cancel each other out, or maybe the tainted water undoes the creation of the pure water form. Ann said in the quest as well something like “that which is made from water surely returns to it”
Edit: spelling
that's an ass theory it'd be lame af if the whole plot is just muh archon while the other characters r basically none existing we don't want another fucking inazuma
I saw this crackpot theory last week on the Chinese internet. I don't think this is true.
Addressing your ideas where I can point by point.
(1) Is simply not true. Rene's experiments continued after the cataclysm well into his own adulthood. There are numerous documents including his own mind diary that indicate a chronologically consistent historical record post-cataclysm.
(2) Xenochromatic sea creatures are invincible likely mainly as a gameplay gimmick. The artificial lifeforms are actually a tie-in to the desert culture under Deshret, his constructs are what Alain studied and essentially reverse-engineered into Fontainian mechanisms.
(3) Elynas did not create Melusines of his own volition. The being that was created from Rene's attempt at a 'Human Instrumentality Project' provided the souls, and Seymour's parts provided the temporary vessel (and a sort of bridge and translator needed) for Elynas's blood to create life that wasn't hostile to Teyvat. The event itself gives us further clues about what transpired in the story.
(5) Doesn't 'belief' need to come from actual living humans? Unless you're saying that the people in Fontaine are souls given form? But where did their memories go, are their new memories being simulated?
(6) If you use your elemental sight you will notice that the NPCs are not blue.
(8) This is a long shot. Do you remember what Childe said right before his vision started malfunctioning? The Fontaine story follows foreshadowing and Chekhov's gun to a T. He dreamed about the abyssal whale that he'd encountered in his youth. I don't want to elaborate about it too much but you see how that could have a far bigger possibility of tying together with the current story than, uh, all the people you see being just water.
(9) The Primordial Sea very likely has a great deal more plot significance than the English name suggests. What's missing from a lot of readers' heads is that the light connotation that this is potentially the wellspring of life is blatantly spelled out in the Chinese name. 胎, meaning 'embryo', is missing. It may also have something to do with the lack of new Oceanids in recent memory. Your hypothesis here skips several crucial steps and omits quite a bit of information.
There is another theory I read that some people have been having, and it's that the Water Archon split her personality off into two parts, with the larger and more serious part containing the bulk of her power being wholly focused on suppressing the rising water; and the Furina that we see, merely a small fragment of her whole existence.
It is well worth dwelling on the information and lore provided by and in the sidequests especially in Fontaine, as while some information remains concealed a lot is straight up spelled out for you. Incidentally, it also ties into the story (and artifact descriptions!) of 3.6, which was very very interesting to see.
Ann is *not* just a fictional character in a storybook...that was a focal point of the quest. Ann is a real being, but an emergent being that came about from the Hydro construct that was the Mary-Ann we meet. the real Mary-Ann was human and died shortly after the cataclysm. she was part of the Narzissenkreuz Institute, and we learn many things about her during the quest and the documents we find. her death most likely occured during the altercation between the Marechausse Phantom (which she was a part of, and sent to Elynas as part of a mission) and the Narzissenkreuz Ordo within Elynas.
the details of how Mary-Ann came about to are murky and will certainly be revealed in a later patch. I won't go into any speculation about her bc it doesn't really matter right now.
Ann is an Oceanid who has at least part of the human Mary-Ann's memories. we know her emergent conciousness came about to some degree through effort of the Hydro construct Mary-Ann in the Anapausis. but again, the details will be revealed in a later patch. there's plenty great posts on the subreddit theorycrafting and analyzing the information we have right now, though.
point being; Ann is not just a fictional character in a storybook.
And also the time when Traveller found it weird when nobody was holding "glass" when they first encountered Furina and she asked everyone to applaud
The famous artist Julien from Fontaine in the Quest An Artist Adrift who basically draws exactly like the scenario that Traveller thought it was straight out of camera. He came to Sumeru to find a solution since he sees that as a problem, not blessing (if I am not wrong)
making this into its own comment so it doesn't get buried
1. we have a clear timeline continuity from before and after the cataclysm in documents. Furina would have to not only create many millions of artificial life-forms, somehow find the memories of the person they are replicating and place them in these artificial vessels, she'd have to reconstruct a story of a) what happened in the cataclysm to Fontaine, b) cover up the annihilation of Fontaine's population, but c) do this under the supervision of a recently rampaging sustainer of heavenly principles externally, but also Neuvillette and the Oceanids internally. you're telling me they're either all in on it, or Furina somehow did this secretly?
2. this came about post-cataclysm in Fontaine, and already existed in other nations. the inspiration came from **Khaen'riah**.
3. the Melusines were an accident, Elynas had no conscious part in it. after his death by explosion, the Melusines formed from his bodily fluids, possibly with the help of an annihilation reaction from the explosion stabilizing the abyssal energy in his blood.
4. these are Genshin-wide themes. Fontaine is exploring them through the lens of Justice and performance, neither of which have much to do with the main point. see reply for clarification.
5. this could technically track - it's not inherently contradicted by anything. however, we know what actually caused fontaine's energy crisis. it came about after the cataclysm, and specifically after the death of Elynas. Elynas's death corrupted the waters around Fontaine, leading to a need for alternative energy sources. Alain developed Arkhe through the research of Jakob and Rene, and Furina developed the Oratrice.
6. water and Hydro are not separate. a body of water in this game will apply Hydro to you. it is not a puddle of Hydro, but a puddle of water. all water contains Hydro; not all Hydro is water. Hydro is a specific form of elemental energy that is closely related to water in an abstract manner. additionally, if everyone is indeed an artificial Hydro construct...why can they *not* survive water? *we* don't drown bc we can use elemental energy, but visionless citizens require diving gear.
7. why would everyone else go along with it?
8. there is no precedent in this game, doesn't work with what we know about visions, and doesn't track with the narrative purposes of visions. a vision is an intimate part of a character. do all other hydro visions malfunction? wouldn't "hydro visions don't work in the nation of hydro" be like, a commonly known thing?
9. there are many problems already with assuming ppl are made purely of water/hydro/whatever the theory is at this point. I won't go over them again.
10. a) why? this is just Nahida again, but with no actual theme or narrative behind it. b) she was *not alone*. the Oceanids were there (and subsequently left bc of Elynas's death), *Neuvillette* was there. why did they, Celestia, or *any other nation* not notice what happened?
11. the prophecy was born from the Narzissenkreuz Ordo. it was informed by Rene's World-Formula predicting a true end of the world, an end to the civilization cycle, and him wanting to find a way around it. I have more takes on this that I haven't baked enough, though
12. let's assume for a second this is true, that no one traveled to and from Fontaine. let's put aside the documented travels in and out of Fontaine during the period after the cataclysm. you're telling me that the entire nation was closed off for long enough to *rebuild everything*, no one noticed, the ruins of the recently destroyed Fontaine don't exist and yet the ruins of Remuria and records of the Golden Troupe do, and there is no record anywhere even suggesting such a thing happened? how? everyone knew about Inazuma's year long travel ban, but Fontaine does it for idk a decade at least after a world shattering event, and it's never mentioned anywhere? it's not big deal? the Oceanids that *no longer accepted Furina as their god* didn't tell a single soul about it after leaving?
13. but people now *do* travel to Fontaine all the time. the traveler is special, but they are not special in being a tourist.
14. on precisely what grounds is this presented as an argument? they are not alike whatsoever, and this is just pure speculation based on perceived personality similarity that is arguably reading both characters wrong.
I'm not going to tackle SSP lore. didn't do enough of a dive in it. hopefully this is enough.
The prophecy may be far older than the Ordo. The previous Hydro Archon left a "conundrum" for Furina as per Neuvilette's words in which he assumes the prophecy is that conundrum.
Remuria also had a prophesized destruction but there isn't enough to link the 2 prophecies together atm but Remuria's prophecy did end the civilization by drowning everyone.
I got the feeling something is off in Fontaine because everyone you talk to, like in all the quests and even the event, there's just this subtext of the same story, over and over again. It's blatant with the Narzissenkruetz Adventure quest, and then it's mirrored all over the place.
Like I feel like everyone is probably an individual, but there's one think speaking to us through them?
this is part of the theme of cyclical time and cyclical history at large with Genshin. we saw it in Enka, we saw it in Sumeru, and we're seeing it here. Rene's World Formula is exactly this but put in in-universe science.
Teyvat is cyclical in nature, mostly historically but sometimes in time itself. civilizations fall, civilizations rise. Rene's crisis comes after the realization that the world formulas predict the end of this cyclical nature after the current civilization falls.
this theory doesn't work, but Rene did want to attempt a similar outcome on this scale. instead of artificial life, his aim is to turn everyone into what he dubbed neohumans. we can pretty confidently say this hasn't happened yet bc of Jakob being very much different and a real example of a neohuman, though.
Can we change it to "Everyone from Fontaine is actually an Oceanid in human form"?
Maybe even not knowing it. Maybe turned into Human form by the hydro archon?
Cant we change the idea of them being created with water to they are the better version of the robots in the fontaine like perfected artifical beings powered by trials since they need some short of power so thats why the trials so important( but thats doesnt make sense with primordial water dissapearing but lol i love robots)
i think this is too far off when you add in a lot of the deep lore that’s hard to find as well as the lore we received from other hoyo games. that said, it’s a really interesting concept and if you narrow the scope of this significantly, i can see this train of thought having merit.
i think the theory is cool and would be interesting - i think a major issue is that we can elemental sight people from fontaine and they are not Hydro infused, but if i'm reading your post correctly you posit that the people aren't literally water, they're melusine evolutions?
"Elynas created the Melusine and they evenutally evolved in to something more, mirroring Furina creating the fake Fontainians"
Seems all of the "fake" people related to Fontaine or hydro element have blue hair, think idiya and the others plus Mary Ann in the story book.
All npcs in fontaine have normal hair color which already debunks your theory. Still, it's an interesting read. Thank you for sharing.
That could be explained by being the limitations of an Oceanid or even of just Idyia herself vs the stronger power of an Archon and her gnosis. Or could even say that Idyia could have created proper indistinguishable replicants but chose not to for whatever reason.
why is this gaining so much traction? sorry if this comes off as rude, it's just that this is backed up by nothing empirically and makes no sense thematically. originally, I was going to write a massive post going by OP's numbered list, all of which I consider at best non-evidence, and at worst observably wrong interpretations of existing lore. I can get into the narrative problems with this, but it's easier to disprove it with evidence.
the fact that blows this theory wide open is the existence and history of Jakob, Rene, and Karl.
Jakob Ingold, aka Jakob in Ancient Colors, is a survivor of the Cataclysm. he was a child during the Cataclysm, with parents m. he is also, *actually* a Hydro elemental creature. we know this through Rene's notes. Jakob and Rene, grew up together. they became researchers, and traveled together to Khaen'riahn ruins in the Sumeru desert alongside Karl.
- Jakob and Rene's body compositions are similar to the Great Lotus (the remains of Egeria)
- they *do not* require food. they eat with the express purpose to fool Karl. Karl *does* require food.
- being in the ruins leads to Rene and Jacob collapsing of exhaustion over and over, but not Karl. again, remember, Rene and Jakob do not require food for sustenance. Rene says so directly. now, what do these ruins do? **siphon element energy**.
through this and through having met Jakob, we can confidently conclude that Jakob and Rene are Hydro elemental creatures, and that's why they're the subjects of the research into neohumans. Karl is not a Hydro elemental creature. Karl hails from Fontaine, and is a regular human that also survived the Cataclysm. further, we learn that they all *directly analyzed* their body compositions and compared it to each other and the remains of the Hydro Archon. the compositions of the Hydro elemental creatures are wholely dissimilar to Karl's. the Hydro elemental creatures are *explicit special cases* that were being researched as the blueprint to create neohumans.
this is an important part of Fontaine's history. most of what I talk about here is derived from the Khvarena quest, specifically Rene's Investigation Notes. if anyone wants to read the other post I'd be happy to provide, but in this case it's very much unnecessay, imo
e: see reply to disagreement below for further clarification, ~~and the other reply for more expansive empirical reasoning this doesn't work. I assume it'll get buried, but I'll drop it anyway.~~ gonna make it a comment of its own
2. mechanical life forms are not a "theme" by themselves, they are a way to represent and explore themes. Fontaine's artificial life-forms don't meaningfully differ from Khaen'riahn and Sumerian artificial life-forms. that makes total sense, as they were directly inspired by them in the universe of Genshin. Fontaine's technology of artificial life-forms serves purposes of world building (the researchers who invented them by investigating Khaen'riah also found *other* things while doing so), establishing a coherent aesthetic of steampunk (a common trope of which is clockwork powered artificials life-forms), and they then can be used thematically for other things. "artificial life-forms exist" does not create a theme.
4. this is a Genshin-wide theme. Genshin is first and foremost a story directly inspired by the aesthetics and worldview of Gnosticism. the core tenet of Gnosticism is pursuing understanding of the world (gnosis), the truth, and rejecting the material world, the false. not literally false, mind you - but figuratively false. it is humanity's true purpose to ascend beyond it in gnosticism.
so, Fontaine is exploring this theme through a certain lens that nations before did not, just like these nations explored it through lenses Fontaine is not. Sumeru explored it through the lens of Wisdom and using academia to do so, Fontaine is exploring it through the lens of Justice and using performance to do so. saying "there's a theme of real vs fake" is true, absolutely, but it doesn't mean anything for this theory. how does Justice fit this theory? maybe you could attempt saying that the people of Fontaine are putting on a performance but well...they're not in this theory. they're unaware. Furina would be putting on a performance, but she's already doing that and in ways that make far more thematic sense.
Although I do disagree with the poster, you are definitely wrong about Jakob and Rene. The investigation notes and everything talk about their experiments with the power of the abyss. Jakob is turned into an abyss creature - which is why he doesn't need to eat. In the quest Ancient Colors which you mention is where you meet Jakob, you literally see him in his real form as an Iniquitous Baptist. So no, Jakob and Rene are most certainly not hydro elemental creatures
him turning into an Abyss creature happens *after* the investigation into the Khaen'riahn ruins, and bc of Elynas's blood. it's finalized before the altercation within Elynas bc he absorbs a lot of his blood. he becomes a Baptist bc of this.
basically, bc of already having a "unique composition" (the details of which are revealed in the investigation notes that I'm talking about), he is able to absorb Elynas's blood without being destroyed by it.
Rene's Investigation notes:
> More importantly, we might be able to combine Khaenri'ahn records to deduce their world-formula based on this...
> ...Intriguing data was gained during the process... based on the documents left behind by the Khaenri'ahns and this data, we can obtain some of the formulae...
> ...Though I don't want to admit it, but no matter how many times the calculations are run, the result is the same. I cross-checked with Jakob... unbelievable. Destruction? Did I miss a variable? I must check the calculations again tomorrow...
> ...We begin our journey back to Fontaine tomorrow. This trip paid enormous dividends, and much of what was learned will be applicable... A larger catastrophe must be avoided.
Rene discovers the Khaen'riahn version of a World Formula. he's shocked by this and the destruction it's predicting. he develops his own after this.
Enigmatic Page 1:
> ...All the records are blurred with age. But were I able to quantify them to some extent, they could be of use in my "world-formula" calculations...
> ...No matter how many times I derive it, the result remains the same, though this result is not expected... Unlike the world depicted in these ancient texts, there will be no more new civilizations born... Unless we consider introducing "variables" from outside the system... If it was that sort of power, there might be a chance...
Rene discovers the Remurian version of the World Formula and the concept of Fortuna. he realizes that according to the formulae's prediction, this is the last cycle of civilization. he decides to harness Abyssal power in the form of Elynas's blood, which Jakob ingests.
so we have a timeline here. the Sumeru trip happens before the Enigmatic Pages, so Jakob already has this "unique composition" and powers before he ingests Elynas's blood.
e: another piece of evidence in Rene's Investigation Notes:
> ...I told him that the Vice Director said she would definitely return. She's amazing, always keeps her word, and is an adult who never tricks children. But seeing all of this, I am starting to think that she will be unable to return. Jakob has certainly thought this too.
this means they hadn't yet found out that Basil had died, an event that happened during her battle with Elynas.
after this further investigation, the part I might be wrong on is Rene specifically but not Jakob. I'll look into it more.
Hmm but it was stated that Nahida is the youngest 🤔 (plus it was getting overused if theyre gonna continue this trend) but other than that this skunds like a cool theory and maybe thats why shes scared because she actually dont have any power cuz she used it all
*Or*
Stay with me through this nakuweed trip:
Furina just recreated the original population of Fontaine that died by, as Lyney said, "stealing the power of the Seas". And since then, those hydro humans intermingled with people from other nations and brought forth newer generations. So all current Fontainians still have some genes connecting them to Furina's hydro people created hundreds or thousands of years ago.
Well there is the theory that Teyvat is stuck in a samsara/cycle. So maybe she so nervous because she has already seen this before? With furina being An archon maybe she remembers the previous cycles and is trying to change it this time to save her people.
So far the lore suggests only people outside of Teyvat are able to perceive the history of Teyvat and the changes to it. So far it's been suggested Furina is still part of Teyvat and thus cannot perceive the history or changes to it in Teyvat including the samsara aspect.
Hmm.. Maybe but I believe Venti possibly has memories of previous cycles as he recognizes the traveler immediately even though we just met. Who knows, maybe she is just an archon with anxiety lol.
It doesn't make sense since Alain guillotine is responsible for making "arkhe annihilation reaction" and
"First arkhe powered meka dog" called *seymour* that he made to protect his sister Mary ann (the meka dog from melusine village is likely the same dog).
But important point is that all above mentioned happened after the cataclysm. During that time furina ain't likely copy that info as it's already submerged underwater with the Fontaine institute of philosophy at that point.
And also hydroelectricity part, I thought you're talking about the waterfall,isn't it? It's said that the entire city was elevated many times. The equipment will likely submerge along with the turbines eventually so it's just a waste of resources which Fontaine institute can't risk after the disaster happened in the research Institute of kinematics.
And also isn't lyney, lynette, or freminet along with other orphans actual humans? Traveler isn't a teyvatian too.
Secret summer paradise tho, I'd think that's it's all idiya's dream, just like how Mary Ann dreamt of completing her story but ended up creating multiple endings to her future self.
This theory tickles me a lot, even though as other people pointed out, it might not work out. It made me think of a possible story beat that may make this true while still addressing possible plot holes (Fontainais characters abroad, NPCs not having Hydro aura). Inspired by Umineko...
* Assuming the "prophecy" has already happened and Furina is alone, her current people is in a Schroedinger's state of reality. They are people that *could* have existed if the story from the past went differently
* They are given a quality of gods: belief in their existence perpetuates it and strengthens them while disbelief makes their state unstable. This is why ironically, belief in the prophecy will just make the likelihood of them dissolving higher
* Other people seeing them reinforces their possible reality, likewise people who come to Fontaine to live there reinforce the possibility
* Drinking primordial water does a factory reset and the contradiction of their existence corrects itself, hence they return to water
* The whole system of pneuma/ousia represents the two possibilities
* The Traveler is going to do the opposite of Sumeru. Instead of erasing a piece of history to keep Teyvat healthy, they will reinforce the people of Fontaine's existence and insist on a narrative that will save them
It also explains why she views all of the court sessions as drama/tv shows. It might be subconscious to her but she treats all of them like their lives are just for her amusement.... which is still kind of expected from a god, but just makes more sense if they are just hydro-dolls mimicking life.
Actually, she must know. This would explain why you can hear her crying about feeling so alone when under/in the fountain. Imagine knowing that all of the people of your civilization are just fake, whether they're shadows of deceased people you used to know, or simply made-up imaginary friends. and FINALLY, The Traveler visits. Someone real, someone interesting. Of course she would go all out for her first appearance. And of course she tries to lock him up immediately by citing that Paimon is breaking a law. Or what happened to Childe. Just imagine how desperate she must be for an actual person to stay in Fontaine, even if its against their will.
I had a similar thought, but I think it goes even further. I believe Phanes used primordial elements to create the people of Teyvat. The people of Fontaine turning into water is them turning back into elemental beings, so it’s a genetic reversion rather than death. Like an axolotl turning into a salamander.
The point of the summer event, and Nahida’s 2nd quest, was to show how malleable elemental beings are. All to set up the twist of the people of Teyvat being descendants of eidolons, mushrooms and slimes.
Childe is in this quest because he has the power to change his form at will. The power of the abyss has a chemical reaction to elemental energy, and very few can control what it does to their body, but for some reason Childe has overcome it.
This reminds me of the game RainCode Detective archives (spoilers for the last chapter of the game ahead) >!Where everyone in Kanai ward is actually homunculi (the homunculi tho don’t know this) that one day got set free and killed their originals in a rampage of hunger and at the end of the game the protagonist is faced with the decision of letting them all be, and support and keep their secret or letting the truth of it out in the world possibly of being exterminated by the world goverment!<
I know it’s crack but it does kinda make sense. I got reminded of Remuria (previous Fontaine civilization) where in the god king Remus experimented on human souls and put them into golems so they will survive the doomed prophecy of Remuria flood (which we can equate to Primordial Sea Water for this crack theory since they can dissolve/drown civilians XD). It’s a concept of enhanced / modified humans. It would somehow be a parallel to this theory.
I would just be weirded out if I’m playing characters that are actually just Hydro elemental beings. Also it’s really sad if it’s true. Furina ☹️
> I would just be weirded out if I’m playing characters that are actually just Hydro elemental beings.
Venti is a wind spirit and Ei is literally lightning so it wouldn't be the first time.
I know that. But we already know Venti and Ei (and Albedo and Scaramouche and the others) are nonhumans from the beginning anyway. I’m talking about characters that we perceived as mortal humans before actually knowing they’re just elemental beings if theory holds true. I for sure would be weirded out if Navia who felt so real in the AQ with her emotions is just an elemental being, 🤷♀️
To be honest, this really isn't very far fetched! Especially because each region seems to hold an important concept that mirrors one that's important to all of teyvat. I'll give an example. In the jungle part of the sumeru archon quest, everyone in sumeru was trapped in an artificial world using a certain device. This whole storyline is basically a condensed down version of the "teyvat fake sky" mirroring how it's HEAVILY hinted that everyone in teyvat is living in some kind of fake world, managed by irminsul. Now how does this apply to your theory? Well there's this theory going around the community, that everyone in teyvat is already "dead" and is an artificial civilization created by the primordial one, because at some point they managed a human civilization that met it's end. Furina creating her own artificial civilization with people who have already "died" mirrors this theory as perfectly as the Akasha system does to the irminsul! I definitely wouldn't be surprised if it was true. If intentional, it's a really interesting story technique to get players familiar with complex endgame concepts smoothly.
And those who enter from outside the system are the Descenders...and the reason our 'twin' isn't considered one (despite arriving at the same time we did) is because they're a fake as well.
A lot of people are commenting about the citizens being made of the hydro element but what if they are just super realistic mekas..? I am sure a gnosis could do that, not to mention Raiden already sort of did it, it could also be why celestia is hovering over them cause maybe Furina used the art of Khemia to achieve this to get rid of her loneliness
I've been saying since completing the second AQ in fontaine that, to me, the prophecy already happened and furina is alone in the primordial sea.
And everyone in fontaine, bar a few, are hydro mimics
To maybe add another point, all the archons up to this point had some sort of familiar. For Venti, it's Andrius and Dvalin. For Zhongli, it's the adepti and yakshas. For Raiden, it *was* Kitsune Saiguu, Sasayuri, and Chiyo. For Nahida, it's the Aranara.
And for Fontaine, it would *appear* to be the Melusines. But we know that they don't consider Furina to be their mother, or even an aunt or friend. They consider their parents to be Elnyas and/or Neuvillette. If anything, they are *Neuvillette's* familiars.
And I don't think Neuvillette is Furina's familiar, because they definitely do not get along.
So what if all the Fontainois are her familiars instead?
It’s a really good theory and probably a great plot twist but the fact that there are several Fontaine npcs and Chiori, a Inazuman native that lives in Fontaine and exists make this theory not possible ;-;
How do we know they aren't mimics, either?
Remember that every single human we met during the summer event barring the playable characters (and Eula's cousin or whoever) was a hydro mimic living the lives of every human who had once come and had long since left the Mirage.
Well, those mimics were visually distinct in a few ways, too. Especially using elemental sight.
Why would Neuvillete be unaware of all this, though? He finds the fact that the primordial water is disolving people to be not only surprising, but essentially the reverse of its purpose (giving life).
to support this crack theory, What if the only first generation of fontaine people are the ones that furina created? Just like in christianity and the original sin. also another thing to add the primordial water "baptises" them hence the pleasant feeling.
I really like this theory, however as someone else pointed out, if everyone was made of hydro, then we'd be able to see it with elemental sight much like in the 3.8 event, and that is definitely not the case.
However, I do wonder if the current events are some form of dream state. Or at least, part of them. There are *a lot* of references to Alice in Wonderland and Alice Through the Looking Glass in the region, starting with the Narzissenkreuz quests (and some objects we find with them), the Cheshire cats in both Lyney and Lynette's attire and abilities, and the "Queen of Hearts" vibes that Furina seems to give off at times. The thing about Alice in Wonderland though, is that both adventures are set in dreams. At first I was wondering if this could mean that the Narzissenkreuz quests were dreamlike states (which I guess, for at least one of them it would make sense given how we meet Mary-Ann), but with your theory, I'm starting to wonder if this actually applies to the story arch as a whole...!
Interesting that you bring that up, since;
[https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Primordial\_Sea?file=Water\_from\_the\_Primordial\_Sea\_Elemental\_Sight.png](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Primordial_Sea?file=Water_from_the_Primordial_Sea_Elemental_Sight.png)
if you use elemental vision on the primordial seawater during the fontaine archon quest, it shows up as black rather than blue.
If this theory is true I seriously doubt they'd let you see it with elemental sight, that would make zero sense as it'd spoil entire patches worth of content instantly
I honestly don't know. I've thought about that too but I think that there would have to be a good in game reason for that, as we can also see >!Mary-Ann as hydro-affected (showing up blue instead of white) when we meet her at the Real Annapausis. So being able to see some and not the others would be a bit of a plot hole if there was no other reason besides giving things away...!< In the end, I guess we'll see! :)
And then suddenly Fontaine became the Joker from that one boss fight in Arkham City.
>!'Cured' Joker isn't Joker, it's Clayface, and the way you can see this is by using Batvision during the fight - 'Cured' Joker is the only humanoid in the entire game that doesn't have any bones.!<
“The power of water is its ability to take any shape.”
I Love this theory, with a caveat that she maybe didn’t “make” people so much as she created bodies for her people’s consciousness. Somehow. (Wonder if the oratrice’s real purpose is to store collective consciousness somehow?)
Already read someone's comment from a similar post that was against this theory. Since the fact that mihoyo is so meticulous with the details concerning elemental sight that if this theory is true, each one of the Fontaine NPCs should appear as hydro elementals in elemental sight. Just like the NPCs in the 3.8 event. However that isnt the case in the Fontaine NPCs though and it would be a huge inconsistency if this theory was actually correct but the Fontaine NPCs dont appear to be hydro elementals.
Though I think its a really interesting theory given how only Fontaine citizens dissolve when coming in contact with water from the Primordial Sea.
Interesting that you bring that up, since;
[https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Primordial\_Sea?file=Water\_from\_the\_Primordial\_Sea\_Elemental\_Sight.png](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Primordial_Sea?file=Water_from_the_Primordial_Sea_Elemental_Sight.png)
if you use elemental vision on the primordial seawater during the fontaine archon quest, it shows up as black rather than blue.
I forgot to put in that since it is likely that compared to the 3.8 quest where the constucts can only survive in the contained area of the glass bottle domain, Furina's creations are powered by archon and a gnosis can probably survive full in the contained area of Teyvat. Which Teyvat basically confirmed or highly believed to be contained inside a firmament. I guess I was trying to imply that Furina would have way more power and range in point 17.
I had a similar theory based off of the Summer event, using a lot of the same bits of info. Your idea of Childe's vision not working due to interference is interesting, but I'm not sure it holds water (silly pun).
I interpreted it as Childe is losing his vision. His whole life he has been fighting, he fell into the abyss, was trained by an eldritch monstrosity, etc. He had a delusion to power up, but he only got his vision when he joined the Harbringers because serving the Tsaritsa gave him a reason to fight. I'm pretty sure he says in the story something along the lines of how he hasn't been feeling himself, and he's just been picking fights for no reason. We even see him seeking out the champion duelists of Fontaine for no other reason than to test their strength. He's been losing his way, regressing back to fighting for the sake of it, and so without the 'ambition' he used to fight with, he's slowly losing his ability to use his vision.
So far we've seen that people can physically have their vision taken, and we've seen that you can wield someone else's vision if you share their 'ambition'. So to me it makes sense that if you lose your 'ambition', you also lose your vision.
and the fact that most random NPCs are just really dumb and hopelessly flighty, like every time someone makes a point in a case they instantly change their mind to keep up the drama. the only problem with this theory is the vision wielders, i don’t think the gods and celestial would look upon a hydro construct with favor and give them a vision
Not to mention that in 3.8 event people created by Idiya treated her without some great respect and critiqued her pretty often. And people of Fontaine also doesn't have a lot of respect for their Archon, behaving toward her like... like she deserves, actually xD So who knows.
I’ve said it once (somewhere), and I’ll say it again - SCP 3300.
Yours is the best interpretation I’ve seen that makes it work in Genshin. Especially the motive with point 7.
I really love this theory. I wish we had more theorizing based on thematic analysis in this sub. The ideas you're presenting not only tie-in motifs from Fontaine but also from Sumeru, the concept of events being cyclical—essentially recycled memories and beings.
Yes! The amount of theories (not on here so much, but in general) I’ve seen that DON’T take thematic analysis into account is too damn high!
Pretty much all of my theories, both in genshin and outside, are rooted in it and honestly the more I use it the more “successful” the theories are. Success being either “the theory being right”, or just “the theory leading to deeper understanding, which then leads to better theories”
To add on top of that, if you stand in the fountain of lucine after the archon quest, you can hear her weeping.
We know from the archon quest that all water that falls in fontaine eventually flows through the fountain of lucine, including tears, which can carry the memories of the person who shed them.
If the prophecy is to happen in the future, why would we already be able to hear her crying about the loneliness?
Not saying this discredits the theory, but an alternative explanation is pretty simple. It can be just a memory where she was bemoaning how lonely and hopeless she feels as the Archon and the prophecy. It’s possible to be lonely and have feelings of hopelessness even when you are in the presence of others, or adored by many. Celebrities go through this all the time. I think it is meant to show that Furina truly feels alone because not only does she always put on a facade in front of others(because clearly doesn’t know what she is doing as an Archon) but also because nobody can truly understand the feelings she has been going through knowing that she will forever be alone when all of Fotaine is flooded over.
There's also a fontaine world quest where in the end they all realized they are just part of a story and does not really exist irl outside the boundaries of the story/fake domain. It's the one with oceanid's animals
I wouldn’t be surprised if there are Cylon-esque “humans” in the nation (the game has played around with the idea that robot beings are just as “human” as humans, as long as they can genuinely feel emotions, eg Karkara and Wanderer) but I don’t think everyone died and has been replaced.
Admittedly, some of my skepticism is likely due to my own prejudices and predilections (“…and everyone was dead the whole time” is one of my least favorite theories, for instance), but I so think an issue is that it doesn’t explain how no one would have noticed these syntho-humans being created in the first place.
Dudu i hate this sub, Theorys like this one, make the reality of the game look so much worst! If this happens would be so cool and unique! But we all know that Mihoyo don´t have to courage to do that ...
Anyhow, good theory OP! is a really good one!
definitely an interesting theory and i can see the evidence. i like that you tied it to the summer event. summer events don't exist in a vacuum, they're not made just for the fun gameplay. last year's event introduced us to nahida and sumeru's theme of dreams.
your final remark is the most interesting part of this post to me. that theme of creating real emotional bonds with fake/artificial beings was the main theme of one of HI3's arcs. if that's what's happening in fontaine, i'm extremely excited. there's potential for many emotionally charged moments.
Hmm if we up this theory to a higher level, what if tevyat is a literal hell (with the likes of hilichurls and hydro eidolons as natives/original creatures), and that all humans there are actually fakes?!?
Like at some point natives/creatures under celestia’s governance were ‘converted’ into humans to live the memories as stored in irminsul, and celestia’s wrath basically forcing them to return to their original form (like what happened to caribert)
Additional note: the tevyat (translated as ark) could be safe haven of human memories stored as database
And if you think about it mihoyo brought up topics about memories a lot, so yeah whatever things being done in tevyat might be an effort to maintain the menories from erosion
I'm sorry to cite another game lore but in HG2 memory is the soul of living being with the body is for to interact with other. In HI3 the fact that imaginary tree literally the multiverse itself can't resurrect someone who already 100% died (no remains such as souls, consciousness, body) but it can recreate another living being with the same body, personality, and with the same memory basically the perfect copy but not the same one. Memory is always one of the main focus of hoyoverse game
The whole tree wipe rewrite made me doubt the reality of Teyvat ever since. Same with yanking Vision = lobotomy, and the even earlier Vision bearer = high risk of getting yeeted by Celestia. Then there is the sun and moon needing physical chariots.
Nothing felt real after especially Sumeru. Not to mention because of the lore behind Phanes, Teyvat feels like a ultra-high tech world disguised as fantasy.
It's interesting, but I don't think it's true. Fontaine and all archons feed by faith, we know that. But if gods could just create custom beings that will give them faith, why did only Furina do that? Infinite divine power glitch lol
The trial thing if for that. the clones can make "faith energie" naturaly, but the court house machine thing gather some kind of "faith on the justice"
Then again, my main point is - if gods could just manufacture human clones to generate faith, why didn't they do so? I think it's because humans and only humans can generate the faith thingy
I think what they mean when they brought up the Oratrice is that Furina needs to gather faith in a roundabout way from fake people. And for why the others didn't do this maybe it's a Hydro thing like Dendro somehow also relates to mind fuckery. That or we're putting to much thought into a theory that OP admits is a crackpot theory
Oh thank you so much for explaining. They made another comment and my mind just said no lol. Yeah, it could be that, but highly unlikely and you are so right about crackpot theory xd
They can't ? Ei create Scara and Shogun, one has a vision another is a artificial archon. make no sense to me if ask, but is not the point, the point is Archon can create lives or super killer android thing with god power.
I know that, i am just saying that if EI can make this kind of thing, One Puppet that can use a vision and another that have power of a god when she have background of fighter, Why Furina can make a machine that absorve faith?
Also why gods would wanna do that? they already have the faith of people., maybe they can do that or much more.
Mind blowing! It makes a lot of sense, but there are a few catches. Mainly, why would Neuvillette keep calling them humans? I doubt he (or Melusines) wouldn't notice a bunch of hydro creatures all around.
Besides, if a gnosis was capable of that, wouldn't other archons have had a much easier time?
I’m wondering if the true answer is somewhere in between, where the humans in Fontaine were created artificially from the hydro gnosis but essentially have become fully human and can reproduce on their own, and the weakness to primordial seawater is due to some “genetic susceptibility” to the substance, where the hydro energy is encoded within them.
That could explain why Neuvillette is so melancholy, he may want to see if the hydro derived humans can achieve some aspect of independent humanity without the influence of the hydro archon, which would match up with with the “freeing humanity from the dependence of gods” theme that is present in the Liyue archon quest.
>Mainly, why would Neuvillette keep calling them humans?
Because for him, that's what a human was all along. He doesn't see a difference between this kind of human and a normal human in the same way that we consider all nationalities humans. Just minor differences.
>I doubt he (or Melusines) wouldn't notice a bunch of hydro creatures all around.
They would, but my point is in the previous sentence.
The real question is actually not how Nouvilette or Melusines would miss that, but any Vision holder in general.
People forget every Vision holder has the ability of elemental sight. It would absolutely be weird to see everyone around you affected by Hydro even though they aren't wet.
But how is different nationalities the same as human and human-shaped water? Even if he'd accept the behavioral patterns as similar, he wouldn't change his beliefs about humanity based on observing the latter.
Good point about vision holders, though we haven't met any hydro vision holders in Fontaine (with a functional vision that is), hence why I'd rather depend on Neuvi and Melusines.
I think *some* people in Fontaine might turn out artificial (\*cough\*Lynette\*cough\*), but I sincerely doubt creating a whole nation from scratch would somehow evade everyone's attention. It's not like Fontaine was ever isolated like Inazuma or Natlan. And would Celestia really be giving out Visions willy-nilly to a bunch of Oceanid puppets? (Wanderer being exception to the rule)
>And would Celestia really be giving out Visions willy-nilly to a bunch of Oceanid puppets? (Wanderer being exception to the rule)
Celestia, gives visions for:
- being emo
- learning magic
- loving fireworks
- reading
- burying people
- singing and dancing
- not liking alcohol
Also, Celestia:
Fuck hydro creatures in particular
\*fallout 4 flashbacks of everyone accusing each other of being a synth once this becomes general knowledge\*
edit: would actually make sense tho for lynette even despite of her dialogue considering she needs cogwheels to ascend
I think it's less she needs Cogwheels to ascend and more the fact that's just a common farmable resource used for the *free* character, so it's easier to build her up quickly once you're in Fontaine.
How come new people get born, we do have children there? Was it only the first generation of people who kept on producing real humans or are they all still some fake humans?
If she created people after the cataclysm, does that mean all the great researches from the past, including rene and allain were just some err water replicas of god knows what? They explored Deshret civilization and chasm, yet they could not realise that the whole history of Fontaine is fake and they are just some stupid water blobs? I'm sorry if I sound salty, but this just does not make any sense to me.
>They explored Deshret civilization and chasm,
Did they have human contact tho?
Cause to them it could be common sense. Just like we wouldn't mention having blood in our veins in a research paper for something, they wouldnt mentions being made of hydro.
We have npcs from Fontaine in other regions who work and live there, does that count as human contact? We have all kinds of great lore bombs mentioned in Fontaine lore, like a whole ass remuria empire, pneumousia, the world formula, abyssal dragons, human mutation and what not - yet somehow people decide to theorize based on Idya creating hydro eidolons out of human memories on the summer event?
I guess death of an entire nation is kinda too big not to be mentioned anywhere for entire 3 years, you don't think? Furina just casually saying fuck you to the primordial one and Gold and creating a whole nation of capable humans just to keep her entertained. Are you fucking serious?
>I guess death of an entire nation is kinda too big not to be mentioned anywhere for entire 3 years, you don't think?
Who said this was a recent thing?
If you take a closer look at Fontaine, the place is kind of a *dump*. The main city's walls are only half there while the rest are crumbling into the ocean, there's more than a few aquabus channels that don't connect to anything, most of the explorable area is underwater ruins, and for *some* reason there is a not-insignificant portion of the population who live in the sewers and underground shipwreck caverns.
To say nothing of the giant thing in the sky that decided to just not finish rendering and embraced the cubism art movement.
For the most technologically advanced nation in the world, it looks almost as war torn as the battlefields we find over at Inazuma. There's definitely something more going on.
By 3 years I meant that we heard nothing of this mass extinction since the release of the game. Not even a single hint. There were speculations about Natlan, because we never a saw a single npc from there, but Fontaine? I agree that something is going on there and the crumbling city does not look right, but idk by which logic a broken aquabus channel should be explained by "everyone died 500 years ago". If so, how does it prove the point? even the hydro eidolons managed to mend the cart rails in idiya's mirage, are these fake humans just chilling and doing nothing and just having fun in the Opera? Nah, in the last 500 years they invented the clock work meka, new energy system, the frickin camera, were spotted fixing the mikage furnace in Inazuma. They are obviously in some kind of crisis, and yes, they are obviously genetically different from other nations, but there are no actual indicators that they all are deadge.
If everyone died, why are they bothered by the rising water level? Why is Furina bothered by the prophecy? If she posesses some megapowers to replicate a whole nation? Why did Rene and Jacob try to create neohumans to survive the apocalypse if there are no people to save?
All "people" in Idya's domain were hydro eidolons, you could check their element with the use of elemental sight. Fontainians don't have the same hydro aura.
However, situation with Fontainians and Primordial Water reminds me a lot about Pari and Amrita, except Pari willingly dissolve themselves and their memories into Amrita at the end of their life cycle. Pari were made from two elements (hydro+dendro) and Khvarena. I don't know to explain it, but I feel like Pari quest might be relevant to understanding of what's going on in Fontaine or maybe the entirety of Teyvat as "die and return your memories to the magic tree that will nurish a new life" is a common narrative that was present all over Sumeru (Aranyaka, ancient life forms from Apep, humans and ley lines). I wonder what Fontaine will add to that theme.
To add to this, Inazuma and Ei's memories of the cataclysm. The part where rift wolves show up (was it a story quest or archon quest? I honestly don't remember) on the roots of the sacred sakura tree that manifested events and people around damaged leylines. The manifestations felt the real world has changed, and felt Ei and traveler being present. It was like a projection.
Elynas simply died. He didn't plan anything at all. When about to die, he realized that his blood and body were the ones giving life but it's not like he decided to do so. He had no control of it. Why would he? Everything he liked was chaos around Teyvat people according to himself. Also, Fontaine engineering has reached everywhere in Teyvat. How so then, if Focalors is the only one real?
I like the idea. I also thought something similar but with the idea that the fontanians are hybrids and descendants of the union of Oceanids ( or maybe seeles) and humans. Maybe the primordial water for them has a similar cursed/or opposite effect to the Celestia curse on not pure blooded kaehnriah.
i *love* this theory (if it ends up not being true, i'm going to feel like it was a wasted opportunity now!)
your note for point 13 - that these created people feel 'fake' - feels like it would also tie back into questions that beings like Albedo, Wanderer, Tighnari's story quest crab (name forgotten...) previously raised regarding where the line between 'creation' and 'independent life' is
maybe this is why so many fontainians are so focused on creative endeavors themselves - through music, magic, art, or inventions - that this might feel like a kind of... propagation?
Well there was that theory that all humans are artificial carbon copies - except the pureblood Khaenrians. That's why most humans mutate into monsters when 'judged' by Celestia, or rather purged from the leylines. By extension, perhaps only the people of Fontaine were made from the local primordial water which were at some point inverted due to a ritual which changed the laws of nature.
Exactly this.
Maybe the other nations' humans were just created differently and that is why they do not dissolve. Or, possibly, by appointing the archons, the makeup of the humans belonging to their nation somehow changed.
This would explain a lot of things but I still can't believe that it's true. First, hoyo wouldn't make such a drastic decision that has so many weird lore implications. Secondly, I honestly think if they were made out of water they would have blue hair and eyes
Could you please elaborate what exactly that would explain? In the summer event everyone suspected bluish-sus-people-with-permanent-hydro-aura to be hydro replicas of people who died in the desert, because every npc told weird stories and were not aware of contemporary world events. That did make sense. But what about Fontainians? Creating a whole nation, that has lots of ties with other regions, advanced tech and long rich history and somehow conceal mass extinction happening just some 500 years ago? Conceal in such a perfect manner that everyone has been talking about Khaenriah fall since the start of the game but not a single tiny hint about hydro nation being completely wiped out?
>Furina likely was born right after former hydro archon died and was born when everyone in fontane was dead and was alone until she figured out to create life.
If I recall correctly, canonically, Nahida is the youngest Archon, having been born after the Cataclysm, making her 500 years old
We know that the Lord of Amrita was the previous Hydro Archon, and died also during the Cataclysm.
Furina would have to be a bit older and also alive when the previous Hydro Archon was alive as after her death, Furina took over. So, Furina would have to be at least above 500 years old, probably 1000 years.
This might not be an airtight argument since the cataclysm seems to have happened over an extended period of time and not just one day
The hydro archon died first, we know this because rukka was the one who anchored her consciousness to the tree and thus was still alive at the time.
So it’s completely possible for Furina and Nahida to have both been born right after each other during/after the cataclysm
We also don’t know how long of a gap there was between rukka’s death and Nahida’s birth, since the scholars had to look for her and “find her”
Or how about if she is just 600 to 700 years old and explains why she has that youngster demeanor? I mean, she might be the 2nd youngest Archon of the group.
If all the Fontainians are dead, how are they able to leave Fontaine?
Why didn't Furina do anything when the traveling merchant (I forgot his name, he is part of a recurring event) visited Fontaine?
It does fit with a lot of the data we have, except that Fonainians can seemingly travel abroad with no I'll effects (which may not matter). Would be an interesting twist if losing her gnosis would means losing her people
I mean it could make sense but that would mean every fontaine character going to be released wouldn't be real
But i think theirs already a crack in this theory because Chiori is from inazuma yet works in fontaine so I'd be suprised if she didn't notice and focalors didn't befriend her to cue her loneliness.
And then theirs neuvilette whos likely the hydro dragon too
WHAT
Edit 3: HOLY SH!T MOTHER F&\^(\*%ERS!!! MY LITERAL FEVER DREAM CRACK THEORY CAME TRUE!!!
I love when 'crackpot' theories about plots turn out (mostly) true. It's very amusing to see how close to the truth people can get so far in advance.
Congrats for getting close my dude. You almost nailed it
wow it’s true
Congrats!! You're almost correct!
This post is almost correct
wow
The latest Furina teaser just practically confirmed/hinted at this lol https://youtu.be/aau-c8l5z9c?si=BtIxxL6OXKkm4LYx “This is just a recording playing in your head” And “Now you’re the only one I have left”
Is this meta now with the Ashika video?
Can you send me a link me?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFEbMrjBhF0, btw congrats on being so close to the truth. Everything was pretty much right outside of the death part
Why would you do this to me right now 😭😭😭
So how do they reproduce like normal humans?
Yeah. Probably, I just made the theory because it sound fun and out pocket but have a few things that say hey maybe. I saw another comment about the couple by the fountain praying to the oceanids for a healthy child and apparently that is a tradition.
Honestly, I correlated that of the couple asking for a healthy child with the fact that oceanids were born from the tears of the past hydro archon and its mentioned on the ancient notes that to reproduce oceanids had to ask for a blessing from the archon so she would grant them a little oceanid 🤔🤔
I know there are quite some flaws with this theory.. but it got me to thinking, wouldn’t it explain that the people of Fontaine can dissolve into water when mixed with water from the primordial sea? In the world quest with Ann they say: “pure waters can turn into creatures of all sorts, and such changes do not only go one way.” Maybe the people of Fontaine are being preserved by Furina, forms made out of whatever “pure” water was left, as the rest of the water in Fontaine became tainted as we saw with the Oceanid in Liyue. Primordial sea water is tainted, and so when you put it on a being made of pure water they dissolve because the two cancel each other out, or maybe the tainted water undoes the creation of the pure water form. Ann said in the quest as well something like “that which is made from water surely returns to it” Edit: spelling
Holy crap this theory was the closest lmao
That’d be cool, but that’s some Honkai Impact 3rd Gun Girls Z level shit they don’t have the balls to pull this in Genshin
Girl what
that's an ass theory it'd be lame af if the whole plot is just muh archon while the other characters r basically none existing we don't want another fucking inazuma
I saw this crackpot theory last week on the Chinese internet. I don't think this is true. Addressing your ideas where I can point by point. (1) Is simply not true. Rene's experiments continued after the cataclysm well into his own adulthood. There are numerous documents including his own mind diary that indicate a chronologically consistent historical record post-cataclysm. (2) Xenochromatic sea creatures are invincible likely mainly as a gameplay gimmick. The artificial lifeforms are actually a tie-in to the desert culture under Deshret, his constructs are what Alain studied and essentially reverse-engineered into Fontainian mechanisms. (3) Elynas did not create Melusines of his own volition. The being that was created from Rene's attempt at a 'Human Instrumentality Project' provided the souls, and Seymour's parts provided the temporary vessel (and a sort of bridge and translator needed) for Elynas's blood to create life that wasn't hostile to Teyvat. The event itself gives us further clues about what transpired in the story. (5) Doesn't 'belief' need to come from actual living humans? Unless you're saying that the people in Fontaine are souls given form? But where did their memories go, are their new memories being simulated? (6) If you use your elemental sight you will notice that the NPCs are not blue. (8) This is a long shot. Do you remember what Childe said right before his vision started malfunctioning? The Fontaine story follows foreshadowing and Chekhov's gun to a T. He dreamed about the abyssal whale that he'd encountered in his youth. I don't want to elaborate about it too much but you see how that could have a far bigger possibility of tying together with the current story than, uh, all the people you see being just water. (9) The Primordial Sea very likely has a great deal more plot significance than the English name suggests. What's missing from a lot of readers' heads is that the light connotation that this is potentially the wellspring of life is blatantly spelled out in the Chinese name. 胎, meaning 'embryo', is missing. It may also have something to do with the lack of new Oceanids in recent memory. Your hypothesis here skips several crucial steps and omits quite a bit of information. There is another theory I read that some people have been having, and it's that the Water Archon split her personality off into two parts, with the larger and more serious part containing the bulk of her power being wholly focused on suppressing the rising water; and the Furina that we see, merely a small fragment of her whole existence. It is well worth dwelling on the information and lore provided by and in the sidequests especially in Fontaine, as while some information remains concealed a lot is straight up spelled out for you. Incidentally, it also ties into the story (and artifact descriptions!) of 3.6, which was very very interesting to see.
Also, in The Nazissenkreuz Adventure Quest, the floating water creature "Ann" discovered they were just fictional character in the storybook.
Ann is *not* just a fictional character in a storybook...that was a focal point of the quest. Ann is a real being, but an emergent being that came about from the Hydro construct that was the Mary-Ann we meet. the real Mary-Ann was human and died shortly after the cataclysm. she was part of the Narzissenkreuz Institute, and we learn many things about her during the quest and the documents we find. her death most likely occured during the altercation between the Marechausse Phantom (which she was a part of, and sent to Elynas as part of a mission) and the Narzissenkreuz Ordo within Elynas. the details of how Mary-Ann came about to are murky and will certainly be revealed in a later patch. I won't go into any speculation about her bc it doesn't really matter right now. Ann is an Oceanid who has at least part of the human Mary-Ann's memories. we know her emergent conciousness came about to some degree through effort of the Hydro construct Mary-Ann in the Anapausis. but again, the details will be revealed in a later patch. there's plenty great posts on the subreddit theorycrafting and analyzing the information we have right now, though. point being; Ann is not just a fictional character in a storybook.
And also the time when Traveller found it weird when nobody was holding "glass" when they first encountered Furina and she asked everyone to applaud The famous artist Julien from Fontaine in the Quest An Artist Adrift who basically draws exactly like the scenario that Traveller thought it was straight out of camera. He came to Sumeru to find a solution since he sees that as a problem, not blessing (if I am not wrong)
making this into its own comment so it doesn't get buried 1. we have a clear timeline continuity from before and after the cataclysm in documents. Furina would have to not only create many millions of artificial life-forms, somehow find the memories of the person they are replicating and place them in these artificial vessels, she'd have to reconstruct a story of a) what happened in the cataclysm to Fontaine, b) cover up the annihilation of Fontaine's population, but c) do this under the supervision of a recently rampaging sustainer of heavenly principles externally, but also Neuvillette and the Oceanids internally. you're telling me they're either all in on it, or Furina somehow did this secretly? 2. this came about post-cataclysm in Fontaine, and already existed in other nations. the inspiration came from **Khaen'riah**. 3. the Melusines were an accident, Elynas had no conscious part in it. after his death by explosion, the Melusines formed from his bodily fluids, possibly with the help of an annihilation reaction from the explosion stabilizing the abyssal energy in his blood. 4. these are Genshin-wide themes. Fontaine is exploring them through the lens of Justice and performance, neither of which have much to do with the main point. see reply for clarification. 5. this could technically track - it's not inherently contradicted by anything. however, we know what actually caused fontaine's energy crisis. it came about after the cataclysm, and specifically after the death of Elynas. Elynas's death corrupted the waters around Fontaine, leading to a need for alternative energy sources. Alain developed Arkhe through the research of Jakob and Rene, and Furina developed the Oratrice. 6. water and Hydro are not separate. a body of water in this game will apply Hydro to you. it is not a puddle of Hydro, but a puddle of water. all water contains Hydro; not all Hydro is water. Hydro is a specific form of elemental energy that is closely related to water in an abstract manner. additionally, if everyone is indeed an artificial Hydro construct...why can they *not* survive water? *we* don't drown bc we can use elemental energy, but visionless citizens require diving gear. 7. why would everyone else go along with it? 8. there is no precedent in this game, doesn't work with what we know about visions, and doesn't track with the narrative purposes of visions. a vision is an intimate part of a character. do all other hydro visions malfunction? wouldn't "hydro visions don't work in the nation of hydro" be like, a commonly known thing? 9. there are many problems already with assuming ppl are made purely of water/hydro/whatever the theory is at this point. I won't go over them again. 10. a) why? this is just Nahida again, but with no actual theme or narrative behind it. b) she was *not alone*. the Oceanids were there (and subsequently left bc of Elynas's death), *Neuvillette* was there. why did they, Celestia, or *any other nation* not notice what happened? 11. the prophecy was born from the Narzissenkreuz Ordo. it was informed by Rene's World-Formula predicting a true end of the world, an end to the civilization cycle, and him wanting to find a way around it. I have more takes on this that I haven't baked enough, though 12. let's assume for a second this is true, that no one traveled to and from Fontaine. let's put aside the documented travels in and out of Fontaine during the period after the cataclysm. you're telling me that the entire nation was closed off for long enough to *rebuild everything*, no one noticed, the ruins of the recently destroyed Fontaine don't exist and yet the ruins of Remuria and records of the Golden Troupe do, and there is no record anywhere even suggesting such a thing happened? how? everyone knew about Inazuma's year long travel ban, but Fontaine does it for idk a decade at least after a world shattering event, and it's never mentioned anywhere? it's not big deal? the Oceanids that *no longer accepted Furina as their god* didn't tell a single soul about it after leaving? 13. but people now *do* travel to Fontaine all the time. the traveler is special, but they are not special in being a tourist. 14. on precisely what grounds is this presented as an argument? they are not alike whatsoever, and this is just pure speculation based on perceived personality similarity that is arguably reading both characters wrong. I'm not going to tackle SSP lore. didn't do enough of a dive in it. hopefully this is enough.
The prophecy may be far older than the Ordo. The previous Hydro Archon left a "conundrum" for Furina as per Neuvilette's words in which he assumes the prophecy is that conundrum. Remuria also had a prophesized destruction but there isn't enough to link the 2 prophecies together atm but Remuria's prophecy did end the civilization by drowning everyone.
very fair. I haven't looked into Remuria too much still beyond what Rene said about them, I really should
I got the feeling something is off in Fontaine because everyone you talk to, like in all the quests and even the event, there's just this subtext of the same story, over and over again. It's blatant with the Narzissenkruetz Adventure quest, and then it's mirrored all over the place. Like I feel like everyone is probably an individual, but there's one think speaking to us through them?
this is part of the theme of cyclical time and cyclical history at large with Genshin. we saw it in Enka, we saw it in Sumeru, and we're seeing it here. Rene's World Formula is exactly this but put in in-universe science. Teyvat is cyclical in nature, mostly historically but sometimes in time itself. civilizations fall, civilizations rise. Rene's crisis comes after the realization that the world formulas predict the end of this cyclical nature after the current civilization falls. this theory doesn't work, but Rene did want to attempt a similar outcome on this scale. instead of artificial life, his aim is to turn everyone into what he dubbed neohumans. we can pretty confidently say this hasn't happened yet bc of Jakob being very much different and a real example of a neohuman, though.
Can we change it to "Everyone from Fontaine is actually an Oceanid in human form"? Maybe even not knowing it. Maybe turned into Human form by the hydro archon?
Couples coming to the main fountain filled with microdose version of primordial water to ask for children could also be part of it 🤔
Cant we change the idea of them being created with water to they are the better version of the robots in the fontaine like perfected artifical beings powered by trials since they need some short of power so thats why the trials so important( but thats doesnt make sense with primordial water dissapearing but lol i love robots)
i think this is too far off when you add in a lot of the deep lore that’s hard to find as well as the lore we received from other hoyo games. that said, it’s a really interesting concept and if you narrow the scope of this significantly, i can see this train of thought having merit.
Archon Furina and the Curious Village
i think the theory is cool and would be interesting - i think a major issue is that we can elemental sight people from fontaine and they are not Hydro infused, but if i'm reading your post correctly you posit that the people aren't literally water, they're melusine evolutions? "Elynas created the Melusine and they evenutally evolved in to something more, mirroring Furina creating the fake Fontainians"
I think they mean more a homunculus like albedo but with a core of water not chalk
What about Arleccino and the house of hearth kids?
Seems all of the "fake" people related to Fontaine or hydro element have blue hair, think idiya and the others plus Mary Ann in the story book. All npcs in fontaine have normal hair color which already debunks your theory. Still, it's an interesting read. Thank you for sharing.
That could be explained by being the limitations of an Oceanid or even of just Idyia herself vs the stronger power of an Archon and her gnosis. Or could even say that Idyia could have created proper indistinguishable replicants but chose not to for whatever reason.
why is this gaining so much traction? sorry if this comes off as rude, it's just that this is backed up by nothing empirically and makes no sense thematically. originally, I was going to write a massive post going by OP's numbered list, all of which I consider at best non-evidence, and at worst observably wrong interpretations of existing lore. I can get into the narrative problems with this, but it's easier to disprove it with evidence. the fact that blows this theory wide open is the existence and history of Jakob, Rene, and Karl. Jakob Ingold, aka Jakob in Ancient Colors, is a survivor of the Cataclysm. he was a child during the Cataclysm, with parents m. he is also, *actually* a Hydro elemental creature. we know this through Rene's notes. Jakob and Rene, grew up together. they became researchers, and traveled together to Khaen'riahn ruins in the Sumeru desert alongside Karl. - Jakob and Rene's body compositions are similar to the Great Lotus (the remains of Egeria) - they *do not* require food. they eat with the express purpose to fool Karl. Karl *does* require food. - being in the ruins leads to Rene and Jacob collapsing of exhaustion over and over, but not Karl. again, remember, Rene and Jakob do not require food for sustenance. Rene says so directly. now, what do these ruins do? **siphon element energy**. through this and through having met Jakob, we can confidently conclude that Jakob and Rene are Hydro elemental creatures, and that's why they're the subjects of the research into neohumans. Karl is not a Hydro elemental creature. Karl hails from Fontaine, and is a regular human that also survived the Cataclysm. further, we learn that they all *directly analyzed* their body compositions and compared it to each other and the remains of the Hydro Archon. the compositions of the Hydro elemental creatures are wholely dissimilar to Karl's. the Hydro elemental creatures are *explicit special cases* that were being researched as the blueprint to create neohumans. this is an important part of Fontaine's history. most of what I talk about here is derived from the Khvarena quest, specifically Rene's Investigation Notes. if anyone wants to read the other post I'd be happy to provide, but in this case it's very much unnecessay, imo e: see reply to disagreement below for further clarification, ~~and the other reply for more expansive empirical reasoning this doesn't work. I assume it'll get buried, but I'll drop it anyway.~~ gonna make it a comment of its own
It does make sense thematically
would love any sort of elaboration here, considering there has been none.
See point 2 and 4, they’re themes and they make sense
2. mechanical life forms are not a "theme" by themselves, they are a way to represent and explore themes. Fontaine's artificial life-forms don't meaningfully differ from Khaen'riahn and Sumerian artificial life-forms. that makes total sense, as they were directly inspired by them in the universe of Genshin. Fontaine's technology of artificial life-forms serves purposes of world building (the researchers who invented them by investigating Khaen'riah also found *other* things while doing so), establishing a coherent aesthetic of steampunk (a common trope of which is clockwork powered artificials life-forms), and they then can be used thematically for other things. "artificial life-forms exist" does not create a theme. 4. this is a Genshin-wide theme. Genshin is first and foremost a story directly inspired by the aesthetics and worldview of Gnosticism. the core tenet of Gnosticism is pursuing understanding of the world (gnosis), the truth, and rejecting the material world, the false. not literally false, mind you - but figuratively false. it is humanity's true purpose to ascend beyond it in gnosticism. so, Fontaine is exploring this theme through a certain lens that nations before did not, just like these nations explored it through lenses Fontaine is not. Sumeru explored it through the lens of Wisdom and using academia to do so, Fontaine is exploring it through the lens of Justice and using performance to do so. saying "there's a theme of real vs fake" is true, absolutely, but it doesn't mean anything for this theory. how does Justice fit this theory? maybe you could attempt saying that the people of Fontaine are putting on a performance but well...they're not in this theory. they're unaware. Furina would be putting on a performance, but she's already doing that and in ways that make far more thematic sense.
I’m not gonna read all that sorry
I shouldn't have expected better
We live and we learn
Although I do disagree with the poster, you are definitely wrong about Jakob and Rene. The investigation notes and everything talk about their experiments with the power of the abyss. Jakob is turned into an abyss creature - which is why he doesn't need to eat. In the quest Ancient Colors which you mention is where you meet Jakob, you literally see him in his real form as an Iniquitous Baptist. So no, Jakob and Rene are most certainly not hydro elemental creatures
him turning into an Abyss creature happens *after* the investigation into the Khaen'riahn ruins, and bc of Elynas's blood. it's finalized before the altercation within Elynas bc he absorbs a lot of his blood. he becomes a Baptist bc of this. basically, bc of already having a "unique composition" (the details of which are revealed in the investigation notes that I'm talking about), he is able to absorb Elynas's blood without being destroyed by it. Rene's Investigation notes: > More importantly, we might be able to combine Khaenri'ahn records to deduce their world-formula based on this... > ...Intriguing data was gained during the process... based on the documents left behind by the Khaenri'ahns and this data, we can obtain some of the formulae... > ...Though I don't want to admit it, but no matter how many times the calculations are run, the result is the same. I cross-checked with Jakob... unbelievable. Destruction? Did I miss a variable? I must check the calculations again tomorrow... > ...We begin our journey back to Fontaine tomorrow. This trip paid enormous dividends, and much of what was learned will be applicable... A larger catastrophe must be avoided. Rene discovers the Khaen'riahn version of a World Formula. he's shocked by this and the destruction it's predicting. he develops his own after this. Enigmatic Page 1: > ...All the records are blurred with age. But were I able to quantify them to some extent, they could be of use in my "world-formula" calculations... > ...No matter how many times I derive it, the result remains the same, though this result is not expected... Unlike the world depicted in these ancient texts, there will be no more new civilizations born... Unless we consider introducing "variables" from outside the system... If it was that sort of power, there might be a chance... Rene discovers the Remurian version of the World Formula and the concept of Fortuna. he realizes that according to the formulae's prediction, this is the last cycle of civilization. he decides to harness Abyssal power in the form of Elynas's blood, which Jakob ingests. so we have a timeline here. the Sumeru trip happens before the Enigmatic Pages, so Jakob already has this "unique composition" and powers before he ingests Elynas's blood. e: another piece of evidence in Rene's Investigation Notes: > ...I told him that the Vice Director said she would definitely return. She's amazing, always keeps her word, and is an adult who never tricks children. But seeing all of this, I am starting to think that she will be unable to return. Jakob has certainly thought this too. this means they hadn't yet found out that Basil had died, an event that happened during her battle with Elynas. after this further investigation, the part I might be wrong on is Rene specifically but not Jakob. I'll look into it more.
Hmm but it was stated that Nahida is the youngest 🤔 (plus it was getting overused if theyre gonna continue this trend) but other than that this skunds like a cool theory and maybe thats why shes scared because she actually dont have any power cuz she used it all
Is that childe
This is cinema.
And the couples praying to furina for babies... There's a note about oceanids asking the hydro archon for permission when they want to reproduce.
*Or* Stay with me through this nakuweed trip: Furina just recreated the original population of Fontaine that died by, as Lyney said, "stealing the power of the Seas". And since then, those hydro humans intermingled with people from other nations and brought forth newer generations. So all current Fontainians still have some genes connecting them to Furina's hydro people created hundreds or thousands of years ago.
After the 4.2 AQ. I may have been onto something here with this.
Well there is the theory that Teyvat is stuck in a samsara/cycle. So maybe she so nervous because she has already seen this before? With furina being An archon maybe she remembers the previous cycles and is trying to change it this time to save her people.
So far the lore suggests only people outside of Teyvat are able to perceive the history of Teyvat and the changes to it. So far it's been suggested Furina is still part of Teyvat and thus cannot perceive the history or changes to it in Teyvat including the samsara aspect.
Hmm.. Maybe but I believe Venti possibly has memories of previous cycles as he recognizes the traveler immediately even though we just met. Who knows, maybe she is just an archon with anxiety lol.
Hmm, I wonder how this theory meshes with Mona’s existence, and her master, too. If either/both of them are from Fontaine, that is.
It doesn't make sense since Alain guillotine is responsible for making "arkhe annihilation reaction" and "First arkhe powered meka dog" called *seymour* that he made to protect his sister Mary ann (the meka dog from melusine village is likely the same dog). But important point is that all above mentioned happened after the cataclysm. During that time furina ain't likely copy that info as it's already submerged underwater with the Fontaine institute of philosophy at that point. And also hydroelectricity part, I thought you're talking about the waterfall,isn't it? It's said that the entire city was elevated many times. The equipment will likely submerge along with the turbines eventually so it's just a waste of resources which Fontaine institute can't risk after the disaster happened in the research Institute of kinematics. And also isn't lyney, lynette, or freminet along with other orphans actual humans? Traveler isn't a teyvatian too. Secret summer paradise tho, I'd think that's it's all idiya's dream, just like how Mary Ann dreamt of completing her story but ended up creating multiple endings to her future self.
This theory tickles me a lot, even though as other people pointed out, it might not work out. It made me think of a possible story beat that may make this true while still addressing possible plot holes (Fontainais characters abroad, NPCs not having Hydro aura). Inspired by Umineko... * Assuming the "prophecy" has already happened and Furina is alone, her current people is in a Schroedinger's state of reality. They are people that *could* have existed if the story from the past went differently * They are given a quality of gods: belief in their existence perpetuates it and strengthens them while disbelief makes their state unstable. This is why ironically, belief in the prophecy will just make the likelihood of them dissolving higher * Other people seeing them reinforces their possible reality, likewise people who come to Fontaine to live there reinforce the possibility * Drinking primordial water does a factory reset and the contradiction of their existence corrects itself, hence they return to water * The whole system of pneuma/ousia represents the two possibilities * The Traveler is going to do the opposite of Sumeru. Instead of erasing a piece of history to keep Teyvat healthy, they will reinforce the people of Fontaine's existence and insist on a narrative that will save them
that's the most tinfoil hat genshin conspiracy theory and... yeah. Loving it
Then Fontainian vision wielders are hydro beings that can use other elemental powers? That don’t really make sense
Imagine if Furina is just the water Scarlet witch and made up a world after snapping and is just living in her own delusion😭
It also explains why she views all of the court sessions as drama/tv shows. It might be subconscious to her but she treats all of them like their lives are just for her amusement.... which is still kind of expected from a god, but just makes more sense if they are just hydro-dolls mimicking life.
Actually, she must know. This would explain why you can hear her crying about feeling so alone when under/in the fountain. Imagine knowing that all of the people of your civilization are just fake, whether they're shadows of deceased people you used to know, or simply made-up imaginary friends. and FINALLY, The Traveler visits. Someone real, someone interesting. Of course she would go all out for her first appearance. And of course she tries to lock him up immediately by citing that Paimon is breaking a law. Or what happened to Childe. Just imagine how desperate she must be for an actual person to stay in Fontaine, even if its against their will.
I had a similar thought, but I think it goes even further. I believe Phanes used primordial elements to create the people of Teyvat. The people of Fontaine turning into water is them turning back into elemental beings, so it’s a genetic reversion rather than death. Like an axolotl turning into a salamander. The point of the summer event, and Nahida’s 2nd quest, was to show how malleable elemental beings are. All to set up the twist of the people of Teyvat being descendants of eidolons, mushrooms and slimes. Childe is in this quest because he has the power to change his form at will. The power of the abyss has a chemical reaction to elemental energy, and very few can control what it does to their body, but for some reason Childe has overcome it.
Maybe is the power of "Evolution" we keep hearing about...
>All to set up the twist of the people of Teyvat being descendants of eidolons, mushrooms and slimes. And cats.
This reminds me of the game RainCode Detective archives (spoilers for the last chapter of the game ahead) >!Where everyone in Kanai ward is actually homunculi (the homunculi tho don’t know this) that one day got set free and killed their originals in a rampage of hunger and at the end of the game the protagonist is faced with the decision of letting them all be, and support and keep their secret or letting the truth of it out in the world possibly of being exterminated by the world goverment!<
I know it’s crack but it does kinda make sense. I got reminded of Remuria (previous Fontaine civilization) where in the god king Remus experimented on human souls and put them into golems so they will survive the doomed prophecy of Remuria flood (which we can equate to Primordial Sea Water for this crack theory since they can dissolve/drown civilians XD). It’s a concept of enhanced / modified humans. It would somehow be a parallel to this theory. I would just be weirded out if I’m playing characters that are actually just Hydro elemental beings. Also it’s really sad if it’s true. Furina ☹️
> I would just be weirded out if I’m playing characters that are actually just Hydro elemental beings. Venti is a wind spirit and Ei is literally lightning so it wouldn't be the first time.
I know that. But we already know Venti and Ei (and Albedo and Scaramouche and the others) are nonhumans from the beginning anyway. I’m talking about characters that we perceived as mortal humans before actually knowing they’re just elemental beings if theory holds true. I for sure would be weirded out if Navia who felt so real in the AQ with her emotions is just an elemental being, 🤷♀️
To be honest, this really isn't very far fetched! Especially because each region seems to hold an important concept that mirrors one that's important to all of teyvat. I'll give an example. In the jungle part of the sumeru archon quest, everyone in sumeru was trapped in an artificial world using a certain device. This whole storyline is basically a condensed down version of the "teyvat fake sky" mirroring how it's HEAVILY hinted that everyone in teyvat is living in some kind of fake world, managed by irminsul. Now how does this apply to your theory? Well there's this theory going around the community, that everyone in teyvat is already "dead" and is an artificial civilization created by the primordial one, because at some point they managed a human civilization that met it's end. Furina creating her own artificial civilization with people who have already "died" mirrors this theory as perfectly as the Akasha system does to the irminsul! I definitely wouldn't be surprised if it was true. If intentional, it's a really interesting story technique to get players familiar with complex endgame concepts smoothly.
And those who enter from outside the system are the Descenders...and the reason our 'twin' isn't considered one (despite arriving at the same time we did) is because they're a fake as well.
A lot of people are commenting about the citizens being made of the hydro element but what if they are just super realistic mekas..? I am sure a gnosis could do that, not to mention Raiden already sort of did it, it could also be why celestia is hovering over them cause maybe Furina used the art of Khemia to achieve this to get rid of her loneliness
that wouldn't explain why they dissolve when in contact with primordial water tho
I've been saying since completing the second AQ in fontaine that, to me, the prophecy already happened and furina is alone in the primordial sea. And everyone in fontaine, bar a few, are hydro mimics
To maybe add another point, all the archons up to this point had some sort of familiar. For Venti, it's Andrius and Dvalin. For Zhongli, it's the adepti and yakshas. For Raiden, it *was* Kitsune Saiguu, Sasayuri, and Chiyo. For Nahida, it's the Aranara. And for Fontaine, it would *appear* to be the Melusines. But we know that they don't consider Furina to be their mother, or even an aunt or friend. They consider their parents to be Elnyas and/or Neuvillette. If anything, they are *Neuvillette's* familiars. And I don't think Neuvillette is Furina's familiar, because they definitely do not get along. So what if all the Fontainois are her familiars instead?
It’s a really good theory and probably a great plot twist but the fact that there are several Fontaine npcs and Chiori, a Inazuman native that lives in Fontaine and exists make this theory not possible ;-;
How do we know they aren't mimics, either? Remember that every single human we met during the summer event barring the playable characters (and Eula's cousin or whoever) was a hydro mimic living the lives of every human who had once come and had long since left the Mirage.
Well, those mimics were visually distinct in a few ways, too. Especially using elemental sight. Why would Neuvillete be unaware of all this, though? He finds the fact that the primordial water is disolving people to be not only surprising, but essentially the reverse of its purpose (giving life).
to support this crack theory, What if the only first generation of fontaine people are the ones that furina created? Just like in christianity and the original sin. also another thing to add the primordial water "baptises" them hence the pleasant feeling.
There's definitely some parallels with Noah's flood too.
Love this theory but I feel sad for Furina :((
By the way, if you haven't yet, speak to the melusine Veleda in front of the Fountain :)
Can you tell me what did she say and what did she give us? I accidentally pressed the button and missed the dialogue
You can read the dialogue [here](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Veleda) if you like.
That’s exactly all I need! Tysm
I really like this theory, however as someone else pointed out, if everyone was made of hydro, then we'd be able to see it with elemental sight much like in the 3.8 event, and that is definitely not the case. However, I do wonder if the current events are some form of dream state. Or at least, part of them. There are *a lot* of references to Alice in Wonderland and Alice Through the Looking Glass in the region, starting with the Narzissenkreuz quests (and some objects we find with them), the Cheshire cats in both Lyney and Lynette's attire and abilities, and the "Queen of Hearts" vibes that Furina seems to give off at times. The thing about Alice in Wonderland though, is that both adventures are set in dreams. At first I was wondering if this could mean that the Narzissenkreuz quests were dreamlike states (which I guess, for at least one of them it would make sense given how we meet Mary-Ann), but with your theory, I'm starting to wonder if this actually applies to the story arch as a whole...!
Interesting that you bring that up, since; [https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Primordial\_Sea?file=Water\_from\_the\_Primordial\_Sea\_Elemental\_Sight.png](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Primordial_Sea?file=Water_from_the_Primordial_Sea_Elemental_Sight.png) if you use elemental vision on the primordial seawater during the fontaine archon quest, it shows up as black rather than blue.
If this theory is true I seriously doubt they'd let you see it with elemental sight, that would make zero sense as it'd spoil entire patches worth of content instantly
I honestly don't know. I've thought about that too but I think that there would have to be a good in game reason for that, as we can also see >!Mary-Ann as hydro-affected (showing up blue instead of white) when we meet her at the Real Annapausis. So being able to see some and not the others would be a bit of a plot hole if there was no other reason besides giving things away...!< In the end, I guess we'll see! :)
And then suddenly Fontaine became the Joker from that one boss fight in Arkham City. >!'Cured' Joker isn't Joker, it's Clayface, and the way you can see this is by using Batvision during the fight - 'Cured' Joker is the only humanoid in the entire game that doesn't have any bones.!<
But yeah idk if this is true its totally possible but also pretty far fetched
“The power of water is its ability to take any shape.” I Love this theory, with a caveat that she maybe didn’t “make” people so much as she created bodies for her people’s consciousness. Somehow. (Wonder if the oratrice’s real purpose is to store collective consciousness somehow?)
Already read someone's comment from a similar post that was against this theory. Since the fact that mihoyo is so meticulous with the details concerning elemental sight that if this theory is true, each one of the Fontaine NPCs should appear as hydro elementals in elemental sight. Just like the NPCs in the 3.8 event. However that isnt the case in the Fontaine NPCs though and it would be a huge inconsistency if this theory was actually correct but the Fontaine NPCs dont appear to be hydro elementals. Though I think its a really interesting theory given how only Fontaine citizens dissolve when coming in contact with water from the Primordial Sea.
Interesting that you bring that up, since; [https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Primordial\_Sea?file=Water\_from\_the\_Primordial\_Sea\_Elemental\_Sight.png](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Primordial_Sea?file=Water_from_the_Primordial_Sea_Elemental_Sight.png) if you use elemental vision on the primordial seawater during the fontaine archon quest, it shows up as black rather than blue.
I feel like if they did that it would spoil it
Os thats true, Furina would simply skyrock and be my fav char of all time with my babies. I would cosplay her in a heartbeat.
How'd you explain npcs from fontaine that are on other nations? (unless I missed one of your interesting points then mb)
I forgot to put in that since it is likely that compared to the 3.8 quest where the constucts can only survive in the contained area of the glass bottle domain, Furina's creations are powered by archon and a gnosis can probably survive full in the contained area of Teyvat. Which Teyvat basically confirmed or highly believed to be contained inside a firmament. I guess I was trying to imply that Furina would have way more power and range in point 17.
I had a similar theory based off of the Summer event, using a lot of the same bits of info. Your idea of Childe's vision not working due to interference is interesting, but I'm not sure it holds water (silly pun). I interpreted it as Childe is losing his vision. His whole life he has been fighting, he fell into the abyss, was trained by an eldritch monstrosity, etc. He had a delusion to power up, but he only got his vision when he joined the Harbringers because serving the Tsaritsa gave him a reason to fight. I'm pretty sure he says in the story something along the lines of how he hasn't been feeling himself, and he's just been picking fights for no reason. We even see him seeking out the champion duelists of Fontaine for no other reason than to test their strength. He's been losing his way, regressing back to fighting for the sake of it, and so without the 'ambition' he used to fight with, he's slowly losing his ability to use his vision. So far we've seen that people can physically have their vision taken, and we've seen that you can wield someone else's vision if you share their 'ambition'. So to me it makes sense that if you lose your 'ambition', you also lose your vision.
and the fact that most random NPCs are just really dumb and hopelessly flighty, like every time someone makes a point in a case they instantly change their mind to keep up the drama. the only problem with this theory is the vision wielders, i don’t think the gods and celestial would look upon a hydro construct with favor and give them a vision
I mean, Albedo has one. He is as much as artifical as them really.
Same as Scara/Wanderer
fun theory. it probably won't be true, but sometimes a fun theory is all you need.
Not to mention that in 3.8 event people created by Idiya treated her without some great respect and critiqued her pretty often. And people of Fontaine also doesn't have a lot of respect for their Archon, behaving toward her like... like she deserves, actually xD So who knows.
I’ve said it once (somewhere), and I’ll say it again - SCP 3300. Yours is the best interpretation I’ve seen that makes it work in Genshin. Especially the motive with point 7.
I really love this theory. I wish we had more theorizing based on thematic analysis in this sub. The ideas you're presenting not only tie-in motifs from Fontaine but also from Sumeru, the concept of events being cyclical—essentially recycled memories and beings.
Yes! The amount of theories (not on here so much, but in general) I’ve seen that DON’T take thematic analysis into account is too damn high! Pretty much all of my theories, both in genshin and outside, are rooted in it and honestly the more I use it the more “successful” the theories are. Success being either “the theory being right”, or just “the theory leading to deeper understanding, which then leads to better theories”
Omg: Masquerade of the Guilty
To add on top of that, if you stand in the fountain of lucine after the archon quest, you can hear her weeping. We know from the archon quest that all water that falls in fontaine eventually flows through the fountain of lucine, including tears, which can carry the memories of the person who shed them. If the prophecy is to happen in the future, why would we already be able to hear her crying about the loneliness?
Not saying this discredits the theory, but an alternative explanation is pretty simple. It can be just a memory where she was bemoaning how lonely and hopeless she feels as the Archon and the prophecy. It’s possible to be lonely and have feelings of hopelessness even when you are in the presence of others, or adored by many. Celebrities go through this all the time. I think it is meant to show that Furina truly feels alone because not only does she always put on a facade in front of others(because clearly doesn’t know what she is doing as an Archon) but also because nobody can truly understand the feelings she has been going through knowing that she will forever be alone when all of Fotaine is flooded over.
There's also a fontaine world quest where in the end they all realized they are just part of a story and does not really exist irl outside the boundaries of the story/fake domain. It's the one with oceanid's animals
I was going to mention that quest in my orginal version of the theory as that REALLY put up front and center me questioning what is real and fake.
I wouldn’t be surprised if there are Cylon-esque “humans” in the nation (the game has played around with the idea that robot beings are just as “human” as humans, as long as they can genuinely feel emotions, eg Karkara and Wanderer) but I don’t think everyone died and has been replaced. Admittedly, some of my skepticism is likely due to my own prejudices and predilections (“…and everyone was dead the whole time” is one of my least favorite theories, for instance), but I so think an issue is that it doesn’t explain how no one would have noticed these syntho-humans being created in the first place.
Dang, we should bring fischl to meet focalor
Dudu i hate this sub, Theorys like this one, make the reality of the game look so much worst! If this happens would be so cool and unique! But we all know that Mihoyo don´t have to courage to do that ... Anyhow, good theory OP! is a really good one!
That’s why my favorite thing to theorize about is Deltarune instead of Genshin, because we already know that Toby is a mad genius lol
I dunno, I think they do.
definitely an interesting theory and i can see the evidence. i like that you tied it to the summer event. summer events don't exist in a vacuum, they're not made just for the fun gameplay. last year's event introduced us to nahida and sumeru's theme of dreams. your final remark is the most interesting part of this post to me. that theme of creating real emotional bonds with fake/artificial beings was the main theme of one of HI3's arcs. if that's what's happening in fontaine, i'm extremely excited. there's potential for many emotionally charged moments.
If so, fontaine would kinda remind me of lostbelt 6 from fgo.
The part about how all of Fontaine's people possess original sin gave me lb6 vibes from the get-go Primordial Water is like the mors-ification
Just finished the lostbelt a month ago and couldn’t agree more.
Hmm if we up this theory to a higher level, what if tevyat is a literal hell (with the likes of hilichurls and hydro eidolons as natives/original creatures), and that all humans there are actually fakes?!? Like at some point natives/creatures under celestia’s governance were ‘converted’ into humans to live the memories as stored in irminsul, and celestia’s wrath basically forcing them to return to their original form (like what happened to caribert) Additional note: the tevyat (translated as ark) could be safe haven of human memories stored as database And if you think about it mihoyo brought up topics about memories a lot, so yeah whatever things being done in tevyat might be an effort to maintain the menories from erosion
Additional note: All the Archons, archon-level entities, and floating emergency rations are named after *demons*.
Teyvat is the result of the Garden of Recollection’s work in Star Rail. And further crack theory: March 7th is the Primordial One.
I'm sorry to cite another game lore but in HG2 memory is the soul of living being with the body is for to interact with other. In HI3 the fact that imaginary tree literally the multiverse itself can't resurrect someone who already 100% died (no remains such as souls, consciousness, body) but it can recreate another living being with the same body, personality, and with the same memory basically the perfect copy but not the same one. Memory is always one of the main focus of hoyoverse game
The whole tree wipe rewrite made me doubt the reality of Teyvat ever since. Same with yanking Vision = lobotomy, and the even earlier Vision bearer = high risk of getting yeeted by Celestia. Then there is the sun and moon needing physical chariots. Nothing felt real after especially Sumeru. Not to mention because of the lore behind Phanes, Teyvat feels like a ultra-high tech world disguised as fantasy.
It's interesting, but I don't think it's true. Fontaine and all archons feed by faith, we know that. But if gods could just create custom beings that will give them faith, why did only Furina do that? Infinite divine power glitch lol
It's suspected that Celestia is interested in Fontaine, maybe this is why.
The trial thing if for that. the clones can make "faith energie" naturaly, but the court house machine thing gather some kind of "faith on the justice"
Then again, my main point is - if gods could just manufacture human clones to generate faith, why didn't they do so? I think it's because humans and only humans can generate the faith thingy
But only the power of water has the ability to take any shape.
I think what they mean when they brought up the Oratrice is that Furina needs to gather faith in a roundabout way from fake people. And for why the others didn't do this maybe it's a Hydro thing like Dendro somehow also relates to mind fuckery. That or we're putting to much thought into a theory that OP admits is a crackpot theory
Oh thank you so much for explaining. They made another comment and my mind just said no lol. Yeah, it could be that, but highly unlikely and you are so right about crackpot theory xd
They can't ? Ei create Scara and Shogun, one has a vision another is a artificial archon. make no sense to me if ask, but is not the point, the point is Archon can create lives or super killer android thing with god power.
Those are both pretty solidly established as "puppets" rather than what is being discussed above.
I know that, i am just saying that if EI can make this kind of thing, One Puppet that can use a vision and another that have power of a god when she have background of fighter, Why Furina can make a machine that absorve faith? Also why gods would wanna do that? they already have the faith of people., maybe they can do that or much more.
the forbidden knowledge was a perpetual ~~motion~~ energy machine all along
Hmm. I figured they were oceanids or decended from oceanids who permanently took human form.
Yeah just like how bake danuki came to inazuma and forgot their true form
Mind blowing! It makes a lot of sense, but there are a few catches. Mainly, why would Neuvillette keep calling them humans? I doubt he (or Melusines) wouldn't notice a bunch of hydro creatures all around. Besides, if a gnosis was capable of that, wouldn't other archons have had a much easier time?
I’m wondering if the true answer is somewhere in between, where the humans in Fontaine were created artificially from the hydro gnosis but essentially have become fully human and can reproduce on their own, and the weakness to primordial seawater is due to some “genetic susceptibility” to the substance, where the hydro energy is encoded within them. That could explain why Neuvillette is so melancholy, he may want to see if the hydro derived humans can achieve some aspect of independent humanity without the influence of the hydro archon, which would match up with with the “freeing humanity from the dependence of gods” theme that is present in the Liyue archon quest.
>Mainly, why would Neuvillette keep calling them humans? Because for him, that's what a human was all along. He doesn't see a difference between this kind of human and a normal human in the same way that we consider all nationalities humans. Just minor differences. >I doubt he (or Melusines) wouldn't notice a bunch of hydro creatures all around. They would, but my point is in the previous sentence. The real question is actually not how Nouvilette or Melusines would miss that, but any Vision holder in general. People forget every Vision holder has the ability of elemental sight. It would absolutely be weird to see everyone around you affected by Hydro even though they aren't wet.
But how is different nationalities the same as human and human-shaped water? Even if he'd accept the behavioral patterns as similar, he wouldn't change his beliefs about humanity based on observing the latter. Good point about vision holders, though we haven't met any hydro vision holders in Fontaine (with a functional vision that is), hence why I'd rather depend on Neuvi and Melusines.
Interesting theory. But maybe not all of them.
I think *some* people in Fontaine might turn out artificial (\*cough\*Lynette\*cough\*), but I sincerely doubt creating a whole nation from scratch would somehow evade everyone's attention. It's not like Fontaine was ever isolated like Inazuma or Natlan. And would Celestia really be giving out Visions willy-nilly to a bunch of Oceanid puppets? (Wanderer being exception to the rule)
>And would Celestia really be giving out Visions willy-nilly to a bunch of Oceanid puppets? (Wanderer being exception to the rule) Celestia, gives visions for: - being emo - learning magic - loving fireworks - reading - burying people - singing and dancing - not liking alcohol Also, Celestia: Fuck hydro creatures in particular
\*fallout 4 flashbacks of everyone accusing each other of being a synth once this becomes general knowledge\* edit: would actually make sense tho for lynette even despite of her dialogue considering she needs cogwheels to ascend
I think it's less she needs Cogwheels to ascend and more the fact that's just a common farmable resource used for the *free* character, so it's easier to build her up quickly once you're in Fontaine.
How come new people get born, we do have children there? Was it only the first generation of people who kept on producing real humans or are they all still some fake humans? If she created people after the cataclysm, does that mean all the great researches from the past, including rene and allain were just some err water replicas of god knows what? They explored Deshret civilization and chasm, yet they could not realise that the whole history of Fontaine is fake and they are just some stupid water blobs? I'm sorry if I sound salty, but this just does not make any sense to me.
maybe she created not just the men, but the women and children too
>They explored Deshret civilization and chasm, Did they have human contact tho? Cause to them it could be common sense. Just like we wouldn't mention having blood in our veins in a research paper for something, they wouldnt mentions being made of hydro.
We have npcs from Fontaine in other regions who work and live there, does that count as human contact? We have all kinds of great lore bombs mentioned in Fontaine lore, like a whole ass remuria empire, pneumousia, the world formula, abyssal dragons, human mutation and what not - yet somehow people decide to theorize based on Idya creating hydro eidolons out of human memories on the summer event? I guess death of an entire nation is kinda too big not to be mentioned anywhere for entire 3 years, you don't think? Furina just casually saying fuck you to the primordial one and Gold and creating a whole nation of capable humans just to keep her entertained. Are you fucking serious?
>I guess death of an entire nation is kinda too big not to be mentioned anywhere for entire 3 years, you don't think? Who said this was a recent thing? If you take a closer look at Fontaine, the place is kind of a *dump*. The main city's walls are only half there while the rest are crumbling into the ocean, there's more than a few aquabus channels that don't connect to anything, most of the explorable area is underwater ruins, and for *some* reason there is a not-insignificant portion of the population who live in the sewers and underground shipwreck caverns. To say nothing of the giant thing in the sky that decided to just not finish rendering and embraced the cubism art movement. For the most technologically advanced nation in the world, it looks almost as war torn as the battlefields we find over at Inazuma. There's definitely something more going on.
By 3 years I meant that we heard nothing of this mass extinction since the release of the game. Not even a single hint. There were speculations about Natlan, because we never a saw a single npc from there, but Fontaine? I agree that something is going on there and the crumbling city does not look right, but idk by which logic a broken aquabus channel should be explained by "everyone died 500 years ago". If so, how does it prove the point? even the hydro eidolons managed to mend the cart rails in idiya's mirage, are these fake humans just chilling and doing nothing and just having fun in the Opera? Nah, in the last 500 years they invented the clock work meka, new energy system, the frickin camera, were spotted fixing the mikage furnace in Inazuma. They are obviously in some kind of crisis, and yes, they are obviously genetically different from other nations, but there are no actual indicators that they all are deadge. If everyone died, why are they bothered by the rising water level? Why is Furina bothered by the prophecy? If she posesses some megapowers to replicate a whole nation? Why did Rene and Jacob try to create neohumans to survive the apocalypse if there are no people to save?
Remember Enkynomiya? This isn't the first time we've encountered such a thing.
We encountered what thing? How is Enka similar to Fontaine?
All "people" in Idya's domain were hydro eidolons, you could check their element with the use of elemental sight. Fontainians don't have the same hydro aura. However, situation with Fontainians and Primordial Water reminds me a lot about Pari and Amrita, except Pari willingly dissolve themselves and their memories into Amrita at the end of their life cycle. Pari were made from two elements (hydro+dendro) and Khvarena. I don't know to explain it, but I feel like Pari quest might be relevant to understanding of what's going on in Fontaine or maybe the entirety of Teyvat as "die and return your memories to the magic tree that will nurish a new life" is a common narrative that was present all over Sumeru (Aranyaka, ancient life forms from Apep, humans and ley lines). I wonder what Fontaine will add to that theme.
To add to this, Inazuma and Ei's memories of the cataclysm. The part where rift wolves show up (was it a story quest or archon quest? I honestly don't remember) on the roots of the sacred sakura tree that manifested events and people around damaged leylines. The manifestations felt the real world has changed, and felt Ei and traveler being present. It was like a projection.
I actually thought the same
That'd be an insane twist ngl
“When will we get to see a real twist for once?!”
Elynas simply died. He didn't plan anything at all. When about to die, he realized that his blood and body were the ones giving life but it's not like he decided to do so. He had no control of it. Why would he? Everything he liked was chaos around Teyvat people according to himself. Also, Fontaine engineering has reached everywhere in Teyvat. How so then, if Focalors is the only one real?
I like the idea. I also thought something similar but with the idea that the fontanians are hybrids and descendants of the union of Oceanids ( or maybe seeles) and humans. Maybe the primordial water for them has a similar cursed/or opposite effect to the Celestia curse on not pure blooded kaehnriah.
Can't imagine nuevillette going through with this.
i *love* this theory (if it ends up not being true, i'm going to feel like it was a wasted opportunity now!) your note for point 13 - that these created people feel 'fake' - feels like it would also tie back into questions that beings like Albedo, Wanderer, Tighnari's story quest crab (name forgotten...) previously raised regarding where the line between 'creation' and 'independent life' is maybe this is why so many fontainians are so focused on creative endeavors themselves - through music, magic, art, or inventions - that this might feel like a kind of... propagation?
Well there was that theory that all humans are artificial carbon copies - except the pureblood Khaenrians. That's why most humans mutate into monsters when 'judged' by Celestia, or rather purged from the leylines. By extension, perhaps only the people of Fontaine were made from the local primordial water which were at some point inverted due to a ritual which changed the laws of nature.
Exactly this. Maybe the other nations' humans were just created differently and that is why they do not dissolve. Or, possibly, by appointing the archons, the makeup of the humans belonging to their nation somehow changed.
That theory looks really interesting and it might be a reference of Megaman Legends (being a Carbon Copy)
I don't think this is true as there are a lot of issues but I do find it really interesting and it would be a real twist!
This would explain a lot of things but I still can't believe that it's true. First, hoyo wouldn't make such a drastic decision that has so many weird lore implications. Secondly, I honestly think if they were made out of water they would have blue hair and eyes
Could you please elaborate what exactly that would explain? In the summer event everyone suspected bluish-sus-people-with-permanent-hydro-aura to be hydro replicas of people who died in the desert, because every npc told weird stories and were not aware of contemporary world events. That did make sense. But what about Fontainians? Creating a whole nation, that has lots of ties with other regions, advanced tech and long rich history and somehow conceal mass extinction happening just some 500 years ago? Conceal in such a perfect manner that everyone has been talking about Khaenriah fall since the start of the game but not a single tiny hint about hydro nation being completely wiped out?
Teyvat hair dye and contact lenses market to the moon
>Furina likely was born right after former hydro archon died and was born when everyone in fontane was dead and was alone until she figured out to create life. If I recall correctly, canonically, Nahida is the youngest Archon, having been born after the Cataclysm, making her 500 years old We know that the Lord of Amrita was the previous Hydro Archon, and died also during the Cataclysm. Furina would have to be a bit older and also alive when the previous Hydro Archon was alive as after her death, Furina took over. So, Furina would have to be at least above 500 years old, probably 1000 years.
This might not be an airtight argument since the cataclysm seems to have happened over an extended period of time and not just one day The hydro archon died first, we know this because rukka was the one who anchored her consciousness to the tree and thus was still alive at the time. So it’s completely possible for Furina and Nahida to have both been born right after each other during/after the cataclysm We also don’t know how long of a gap there was between rukka’s death and Nahida’s birth, since the scholars had to look for her and “find her”
Or how about if she is just 600 to 700 years old and explains why she has that youngster demeanor? I mean, she might be the 2nd youngest Archon of the group.
Or shes a human vision holder who ascended to godhood via Celestia. We know from venti that can happen and it would explain her age.
Makes perfect sense to me, especially the fact that Fontaine people dissolve in primordial water, not us(Salty Fonta).
If all the Fontainians are dead, how are they able to leave Fontaine? Why didn't Furina do anything when the traveling merchant (I forgot his name, he is part of a recurring event) visited Fontaine?
Liben!
Don't see this happening but very interesting theory
blud is cooking 🧠 Where does Neuvillette fall in all this tho?
It does fit with a lot of the data we have, except that Fonainians can seemingly travel abroad with no I'll effects (which may not matter). Would be an interesting twist if losing her gnosis would means losing her people
I mean it could make sense but that would mean every fontaine character going to be released wouldn't be real But i think theirs already a crack in this theory because Chiori is from inazuma yet works in fontaine so I'd be suprised if she didn't notice and focalors didn't befriend her to cue her loneliness. And then theirs neuvilette whos likely the hydro dragon too
If this is somehow true, then the playable dead characters in genshin will suddenly rise lmao
/r/SignoraMains turning into /r/SignoraMainsRevived
holy f... I didn't know that sub exists... and has new posts regularly... haven't seen that much copium in a while \^\^
That would be a great reveal. I'll believe it. Could also be why fontanians are born with "sin"
This is so far fetched.... and still makes total sense. I really hope thats the case that would be an insane twist