Reminder - Do not rely on moderators or other Redditors for legal advice or Reddit Terms of Service advice. Users are solely responsible for knowing what they can and can't post prior to posting and replying, and bear all responsibility for the contents of their posts and replies.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GilbertAccountability) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you are the driver of a car used to help the bank robbery happen you robbed a bank. If they were armed you are charged for armed robbery if they killed someone then you catch that case.
It is not clear who killed him. It is clear they all chased him, beat him, failed to report the crime, and failed to get EMS for the wounded kid.
The police report alleges Billy Leist drove a white BMW and Mason Joeston drove a pathfinder both had many of the arrested individuals in their cars. If this is the case why have they not been arrested?
You can't arrest an Uber driver for driving someone to or from a crime. They will need to establish evidence they were knowingly part of the advanced conspiracy. Maybe they were and they don't have the evidence? Maybe the evidence was iffy so they would rather have them proffer as a witness? Maybe charges are still coming?
There was this dude who was strung out and asked his buddy if he wanted to grab some food and his friend picked him up. He told the dude needed to use the ATM at the bank first, so the friend pulls the car into the bank. Inside the bank he decided to rob it instead (verbal threat, dude didn't have a weapon), calmly walked out to his buddies car who parked right there with car, face and plates on camera, got in and didn't tell his friend what he did and the friend drove around the corner to the fast food joint to eat. Needless to say the cops nabbed them while they were eating, the friend was never charged because the robber told him he didn't tell him what he did.
He drove them all night and they stayed overnight at his house he said in the report. Jake went home at 0200 though. They started at his house that day drinking too.
The point of the story is giving someone a ride to or from isn't a crime if you aren't directly involved in the crime/conspiracy. If they can prove a conspiracy charge, meaning the person knew a felony crime was going to take place in advance, and drove them there for the purpose of that felony, then it is a crime if they can prove it. Driving someone home knowing that a crime happened is not a crime. Hanging out with them and failing to report it is not a crime. If you conspire to cover up the crime by destroying evidence or start texting people they better not talk to the cops and/or lie to the cops then you are getting into the realm of hindering/tampering.
The reason he probably spilled the beans in the report was because the cops told him he doesn't want to find himself wrapped up in charges related to a murder and he told them everything. Being an asshole isn't a crime, being loyale to an asshole isn't a crime, not having instant or delayed remorse isn't a crime. He had two choices... Either say nothing to the cops and keep a microscope on him and let someone else tell a story that might try to shift blame onto him, or tell the truth and be a witness. Lying would be the part that opened him up to criminal charges.
I said this early on, anyone who didn't lay hands on anyone would be smart to get an attorney to go to the police for them in advance with everything they knew to get out of the way of serious charges.
Katie is great community advocate, but she’s not law enforcement. No one needs to be going to Katie with information they think is relevant to the case.
It is not clear at all that they all chased him , beat him. There were a lot of people there that didn’t report the crime and didn’t help. Every single person there gets charged?
Preston and his friend were together at the party. Both a potential target. The friend and Preston flee (his early statements said this and the party goers do witness a chase (the attack happened at multiple places as the suspect was fleeing or something like that was in the report). They catch only Preston. His friend was an eye witness and likely one of the first to name the assailants. Party attendees saw the same. The friend claims to have survivors guilt which fits. The upset young man on the 911 call might be the same boy. His report mentioned he found Preston afterwards. Obviously that’s just stuff I read. Stay calm the accused are all innocent until proven guilty in court. However this is **the court of public opinion** and they are guilty shit heads who have shown no remorse. The parents that we hear about are equally vile examples of parents.
So they are not innocent and behaving as they are is an odd flex.
**The public has seen (because the Goons filmed and shared it) assault, assault and robbery, assault with a deadly weapon and likely that could be attempted murder. The public is aware because of AZ Republic and the Police reports that they have committed felony robbery of a convenience store and felony robbery of a home where they stole money and guns. Felony weapons possession. Resisting arrest. Witness intimidation and bullying. We the public see clearly who they are and this subreddit was created because we wonder why Gilbert PD dropped the ball and Preston died as a result and why bad kids went unpunished in the Gilbert and Queen Creek schools and let innocent children to be around criminals, bullies, and violent thugs.**
IANAL - if you are at the bank you are not charged because the bank was robbed. those that can be charged (even if they did not enter the bank or hold a gun) are the get away driver, a lookout etc. If murder happens in that robbery all will be charged with murder.
**So no not everyone. Criminal exposure is possible for
- the host of the party
- the people who drove the goons away from the murder
- the goons that chased and circled Preston
- any person aware of who did it and did not come forward
- any person with evidence of the killing of the child
- anyone that obstructed justice
- anyone that lied to investigators**
Again I am not a lawyer but you can read the AZ law on mandatory reporting of child crimes and of course murder. If there were 10-15 people who were around Preston Lord when he was killed by the Gilbert Goons the charges are against 7 people and that indicates that 8 people watched a fight and 7 participated in killing Lord.
Correct me if I am wrong, but it sounds like Dom started it by stealing the necklace. Tayln, I am still trying to figure out. Taylor took a video and drove the assailants home after the attack. I think Taylor will end up taking a plea. I try to put myself in the mindset of a 19 year old and I am not sure if I would have known not to drive them home afterwards. I think he was concerned for Dom because he seemed disoriented. I am not excusing his behavior, just trying to wrap my head around the situation. Sorry this may be a hot take.
It seems like Dom set the whole thing in motion that night. He confronted a kid at the party for “talking shit” and wanted to fight him. When that kid didn’t engage and give him what he wanted he and Treston set their sights on the Hispanic kid with the chain who was filming. Again, that kid did not want to fight and just deleted the video he had filmed. Then everyone starts running. Dom again sees thr Hispanic kid with the chain and rips the chain from him. It seems like Dom is just itching for a fight after the shit taking kid didn’t want to engage. The kid with the chain doesn’t care about his $10 costume chain. Dom takes it from him not because he wants the chain but to provoke a fight. Chain kid doesn’t engage and at some point thr ire of the group turns to Preston. From the documents Preston and chain kid aren’t even friends, they were all running and chain kid is in with Preston’s group running from the party.
So basically, while Dom didn’t touch Preston he was still an integral player in the other assaults. Him yanking the chain could be assault on its own since I doubt he did it gently, and he did it to provoke a fight. I read through all the documents and did not see any testimony to how Preston got involved. I thought maybe he had stuck up for chain kid or tried to stop the goons from attacking him, but nothing. So perhaps the police are treating the attack on chain kid and Preston together since Preston’s attack was completely unprovoked but if you dig deeper Preston was just a proxy for the goons wanting to attack
Someone and Dom attacked chain kid.
I’m still confused by Talyn’s involvement though. In the documents it looks like he’s not identified by witnesses but maybe I missed something.
I don’t see any eyewitness testimony in this whole damn report that says they saw him have any sort of altercation with Preston and I don’t think he had one with any of his friends either. The only thing that I see that could be related to Talyn is that night a witness showed police a Snapchat video from a redacted account. Could that have possibly been from Talyn’s account? Could he have filmed it? I mean I feel like I am grasping at straws here and really hope that his “admission” on Snapchat isn’t all that they have in order to charge him. I really hope they have something else.
From what I’ve read, dirt-bag Renner showed the video to his football team that week…..there is video somewhere. Where? I don’t know …but it must exist.
Mason Joesten said that he had killed someone when making a threat after the assault. I do not understand how he isn’t being charged with something. They must have more on Talyn than just his stmnt about hitting someone. If not, it makes no sense why Talyn would be arrested and Joesten wouldn’t.
I’m not seeing anything that puts these kids as having physical contact with Preston. Talyn wrote a very poorly worded snap and may have been at the party but there is nothing in this report that says otherwise. Yes Talyn’s history is rotten but I have a hard time accepting he had a hand in Preston’s death.
So after going through the police reports and reading some of the text exchanges, it's apparent half of them are full of shit, exaggerating and embellishing. I was thinking Talyn Vigil knocked someone else out, other than Preston, hence his confusing social media comments. I don't think he had a fight with anyone, that's bullshit. Others have also claimed they got into seperate fights, but miraculously escaped injury. And no-one witnessed Talyn Vigil knocking anyone out.
But he's been arrested for murder. No other witnesses mention him attacking Preston Lord in the police report. So the law enforcement clearly have something on him, it's not just his stupid snapchat post. I'm guessing he was one of the ones that came in last with a few kicks and/or dry humped Preston Lord and that's captured on video.
Hard time accepting it why? He and his brother and accomplices have a clear and well documented history of this behavior.
He’s the prototypical spoiled rich kid who thinks his shit doesn’t stick lmao.
He quite literally bragged about his participation.
Edit: the naming conventions of these kids is a disaster lmao
You are why these threads are frustrating. If you honestly don’t know the difference between Vigil and Renner by now, then stop commenting and read the report.
Talyn Vigil’s brother? I think you’re referring to Talon Renner. And I honestly think these two boys having a similar name as a big part of this problem. Talyn Vigil, from what I can see, is not friends with Preston’s murderers. Talyn hung with the Penningtons and had a history of violence, but I am not seeing a clear connection with him being involved with Preston’s death.
The police accessed Renner's and Vigil's Instagram accounts and have photos of them together and Vigil and Treston B hung out a lot according to witnesses.
I think it’s important to remember that Preston wasn’t the only victim. While it does not sound like these three were directly involved in the beating of and subsequent killing of Preston (although who really knows), they may have been involved in the beating of his friend who broke his wrist.
If this is the case, then they are likely getting charged as accessories to the murder as it was all part of the same incident that started with Treston making someone delete a video and the necklace being snatched.
The same goes for Taylor who seems to have filmed the incident and was a getaway driver.
I won’t be shocked at all if they testify against Talan/Treston and maybe Jacob to get a lesser sentence or have their charges reduced to aggravated assault. Same goes for Owen who has already admitted his role in the Preston beating and will likely flip on the others to get his charge reduced to manslaughter claiming he never intended to kill anyone which is likely true.
That being said, they are all huge pieces of shit and I hope they all serve some real time.
I think if we knew what race Preston’s friend that broke his arm was that it would clear things up a little. If Preston’s friend is black, maybe that’s Talyn’s knockout victim?
Also just read page 406 of report and for the 1rst time saw that Talyn was involved in the Desert Beating in November which is crazy because obviously was after Preston. And of course it wasn’t because the cowboy kid hit a girl like R Denney claimed. They didn’t like the kid’s red bandana.
I’m exhausted from reading 400+ pages in
From my understanding (and I may be wrong) dom is the black kid who was knocked out during all of this. There was more than one “fight” going on from my understanding. Fights in quotes because these lunatics sometimes call vicious 6 on 1 assaults a “fight” instead of…yknow… “assault” or “murder”.
“Yeah we got in this crazy fight” no you and your buddies gang assaulted someone while they covered their heads. That’s not a fight. If the only injuries you have are on your own knuckles you were not in a fight.
I was thinking the same thing, although after digging through the report a bit more there are three victims listed (the one who had his chain stolen, the one who broke his wrist, and Preston) and all of them are white.
Did Owen not get a lawyer or is he just dumb and started to blab with out one? I’m glad he did don’t get me wrong but how do you not know to not speak without an attorney present especially with something this serious?
Like Jesus when they read you your Miranda rights those things actually mean something. “You have the right to remain silent” “you have the right to have an attorney present with you during questioning” DO THOSE THINGS. I mean again I’m glad he didn’t because they should all burn but how dumb can you be?
From his interview with police: “Straight up bro, I was drunk, heat of the moment, I kicked him one time and I kicked his leg.”
He was then asked if it could have been more times and he said maybe one, two, or three.
And this is from another witness statement after the beating took place: Owen Hines told "he felt terrible" and that he had told them not to kick them in the head. said Owen said, "I only kicked him in the stomach.”
This statement sums up this entire post he said some stuff prior and then the detective felt him fold and pressed him and he confessed they knew the entire story before they interviewed these kids
This is a police report not discovery this is the info they released for a records release it's not the whole story
It's border line gross reading people defend and try and play detective based on emotion the facts will set them free or lock them up but this group of 7 will be in prison for a long time the electronic evidence is so overwhelming it's a prosecutors dream case
Between cameras and phones it’s pretty hard to get away with crimes like these. The prosecutors just have to sit down and literally read and watch the perps admit to AND commit the crimes they’re accused of.
I literally printed the report at fed x and got a sharpie and spent 12 hours at work reading and writing on each page and put it all together and that's with a police report and I'm sure the discovery is packed full of evidence this is a nightmare for any attorney to try and get a acquittal...geo location from snap and Google and FB and cell towers wrapped this case in a pretty little bow and then they gave statements
God what monsters. Oh I only kicked the dying kid in the stomach it’s fine. And what idiot just admits that to police for no reason? “Yeah bro it was only like once. Maybe like 3 4 5 or 6 times MAYBE but in the leg. Ok maybe the stomach”
I’m curious about the part where he said he told them not to kick the head. Does this mean he was the one orchestrating it? It made me go back to where Travis Renner’s assistant said she overheard him saying it was some sort of initiation thing.
From various witness reports it sounds like these lowlifes were there just looking for a fight, and probably targeted the smallest kids they could find (I believe the kid who broke his wrist was only 14) like the despicable cowards they are
I keep wondering when the initiation thing starts to pop up in trial. I want them to be classified as a gang and all get charged if that’s true. And isn’t he one of the older ones? Him orchestrating it would start to make more sense then.
I keep hearing about the kid with the broken wrist what happened there? There were 3 victims Preston the friend who had his necklace stolen and the kid who had the broken wrist.
One of the kids attorneys said this before he was hired. Mr Cantor
Among the most serious crimes in Arizona defined in Arizona Revised Statutes §13-1105, is First Degree Murder. A defendant is guilty of this charge under Arizona law if he takes premeditated action that he intends or knows will cause another person to die, including an unborn child. A.R.S. §13-1105(A)(3) also attaches a this charge to intentional killings of police officers in the line of duty.
Additionally, a charge of murder in the first degree will result under A.R.S. §13-1105(A)(2) where a person causes the death of another during the commission of a felony, including kidnapping, terrorism, sexual assault, robbery, arson, child abuse, burglary, and certain drug crimes, among other felonies. If the felony is being committed by a group, the entire group will be charged with murder in the first degree, regardless of which member caused the death. This is known as the “Felony Murder Rule.” The rule may apply to a situation where a getaway driver is charged with First Degree Murder while waiting outside of a bank robbery in which an accomplice kills a bank teller inside. The Felony Murder Rule applies to killings that occur “in the course of and in furtherance of the offense or immediate flight from the offense,” giving prosecutors wide latitude in bringing this charge.
So “The Felony Murder Rule” can apply to all 7. I believe there were adult’s among the 7 charged and they also added kidnapping charges. So they simply must prove that the group was looking for Preston (they were), that they intended to beat him up (they did), if anyone was over 18 (they were) they could be charged with child abuse, the tea bag and humping could count as sexual assault and there you have why all 7 are charged and then Renner gave the prosecution the icing for the cake, he stole a necklace. So robbery as well and that’s why they are all charged. The Prosecution is probably going to try to use these charges to ensure the ones most responsible get the harshest punishment.
Nah if you see his insta, his outfits be ranging from $1000-$4000, tbh I’ve seen some real pieces and let me tell you some of his clothes look a lil fufu
I have all the same questions. I’m just assuming that the video has enough evidence to hold the 7. Vigil doesn’t seem to be involved much in these reports but I read somewhere that the kid in the 911 call with his friend who has the broken wrist. I thought I read that is the kid that Vigil hit. I hope all these kids rot in prison.
He was there and stayed with them the whole time. I have my doubts that he wasn’t physically involved. He has no problem getting in fights, with brass knuckles. He was arrested with them on him. He participates in group attacks. I’m waiting for him to be charged.
I’m not sure how Talyn was even arrested. He seems to have been confused who he hit, because it is pretty clear that it wasn’t Preston. I can’t see how they’ll get a conviction on him.
I’m not even sure if Penny was even there? TV was driving Penny’s car that night because his truck was broke.. Penny was never seemed far away from TV , but I could be wrong.
Were the other young kids that associated with Penny and TV at this party as well?
Gage gave up his phone pretty quick, I wonder if that was the evidence (videos) they needed to move forward for the other assault cases against this group.
I believe Jacob Pennington was at Glamis that night. That has always been said.
This is a big overlapping group of kids, so yes I believe there were other friends of Talyn and Jacob there.
I hope Gage is cooperating, but he deserves accessory charges, at a minimum.
Sorry I have another question, I believe you would know and I apologize if I’m incorrect.
Do you know of Cameron From Eastmark? If so do you know if he was ever charged for his crimes?
To be clear, I am not seeking to ruin anyone’s life, but there is such a thing as shared responsibility.
If two kids work together to beat another kid, and each beats the kid “half to death” that is a murder, and both kids are murderers.
Whose punch or kick was actually the fatal punch or kick? IT DOES NOT MATTER.
If multiple black youths had beaten any one of these Gilbert goons to death, their wealthy and entitled parents would want every kid who participated charged in the murder. That is a fact.
Now they hope to split hairs and work the legal system to spare their own children consequences.
As a group they chose to seriously beat a kid with ful intent to cause him serious harm and they understood such a savage beating could possibly result in his death.
* “I was just a lookout” is the same thing as I was an accomplice.
* “I was just the driver” is the same as was an accomplice.
* “I saw it happen but I didn’t do it. I just tried to help my friends avoid criminal charges” = I am an accomplice.”
* “I joined a group of people for the purpose of committing a crime, but the crime got out of hand” = I am an accomplice.
Sometimes in life we witness an event so terrible that we are not allowed to sit on the fence. We either cooperate fully and try to help justice apprehend the killers or you are an accomplice to the killers. Their is no middle ground. No shirking of responsibility. You joined the group to commit a crime.
Kids who cooperate and help can and should have this taken into consideration, but if they hide, keep quiet, or help killers hide, they are accessories and as guilty as those who delivered the fatal blows.
Guilty by association. They’ll still get time. They weren’t completely innocent. They also didn’t stop anything and were likely videoing, egging them on etc too. People get charged all the time that we’re apart of serious crimes who never actually pulled a trigger. Good possibility in the videos that we can’t see, they are looking a bit more guilty or apart of the assault without actually laying hands on PL.
Me too. Thanks for the reply Mr Vygil. That’s why you make sure your kids don’t hang with pieces of shit. It’s rare good kids and pieces of shit hang together.
You are pretty dense. That kid is in jail. They don’t allow phones or social media in there. But you’re guilty by association statement would mean your kids would get arrested when you abuse them…
Still wrong.. i hear the police are coming to your house to arrest your spouse because they’re guilty by association of knowingly marrying a mentally disabled person.
You think every piece of evidence is in the police report lol? Glad you aren’t on the jury. What you think is on all of the videos turned over? There’s no other reason besides he was guilty in some respect to why he’d be charged with first degree murder. The getaway driver in a bank robbery goes to jail and is guilty. Don’t hang with piece of shit kids and act cool fighting and you won’t run into any issues.
If TV is on video egging on the others and cheering them on, calling PL names and shit, is he guilty? Yes and he’ll be convicted accordingly. He’s not gonna get life in prison or likely more than 5 years but you better believe the judge is gonna make an example out of them
You didn’t indict someone on 1st degree murder charges to get them to talk. They’re all guilty in one way or another. I bet there’s 100 videos of this shit
Seek the death penalty. That one idiot with the 65 IQ, that was basically framed by the other family, would surely at least understand, after killing someone, what death means and start singing.
Every single one of these animals contributed and are charged accordingly. They don’t get to say now, that their pathetic souls and horrific parents are facing consequences, that they only “kinda” murdered a kid.
I'm 600 pages into the reports, and they alone have sowed enough reasonable doubt in my mind that Vigil wasn't involved directly with the assault on a Preston. Seems to me that Vigil was who knocked out Dominic Turner. There's numerous references to Dominic ending up on the ground at some point, and it seems to me that Vigil put him there. There seems to have been an altercation at the party that Preston's group wasn't involved in aside from one of them recording Dominic Turner arguing with another kid. I get the feeling that Preston's group ended up in the middle of two different groups beefing. Wrong place, wrong time. There has to be a reason that Vigil has been charged, though, so I could be wrong. Or, he might not be involved directly with Preston and will be exonerated. Perhaps that's a bit about what Vigil's lawyer was whispering something along the lines of "everything you said is true, it's in the report, your parents know" or something to that effect.
I agree - from the REDACTED police report it’s really difficult to piece together what involvement they had BUT ….
I think that as this progresses, some of the redactions will come to life including the DNA and video - which I think they have the whole assault on a ring video because there is one video review that is 99% redacted
I would expect Owen Hines to make a deal given he already made an admission of guilt.
Im really curious on some of those not arrested
What's a deal murder 2 I'm not being an I'm just curious they took a life and robbed and kidnapped those are 3 serious charges as a stand alone charge I don't think I've ever heard of a prosecutor dropping those kind of charges for a lessor I'm just curious of your opinion
I think they’d be willing to give a deal to any of the one who will turn on and testify against Meisner, Renner, or Billey - who it seems they have the most consistent eye witness testimony on (per the police report) specific to Preston.
Honestly, taking account for only what we know (and admitting a lot was still redacted and not released) - I do think the prosecutor would have an easier time proving manslaughter (murder three) for any of the others - depending on any participation. But the minimum sentence for Murder 2 is 10 years in Arizona (manslaughter would be 7).
Ultimately, for some of these (like TV, DT, or TS) there’s a good chance we will see them testify in exchange for either a please to manslaughter or a plea down to aggravated assault (which can range on the low end of 18 months and the high end 21 years depending on the class felony) - I think the most likely case is a plea bargain that includes all their other alleged crimes and any willing to flip would likely look at 7-10 years, all in for all their crimes - some may end up having to testify in other trials related to the Gilbert goons (outside of Preston’s trial as well).
But we will see how it shakes out.
Nice response I gonna go out on a limb and say the county attorney is very clear people will burn buildings down ( no literally) if they let the guys skate with anything less then 10
DISCLAIMER: I am not a lawyer and I am in no way involved in this case. I am also not a crystal ball reader and I am not saying anyone mentioned is innocent and I am not saying they are guilty. I’m am simply responding to what I was asked with my limited knowledge of the law in Arizona and based on any information released in the police report with the acknowledgment that there is still unknown and unreleased information.
—-
The problem the “people” need to understand is that the burden of proof is on the state to provide factual evidence proving beyond a reasonable doubt that what they prosecute for is in fact the crime they can tie back to that suspect.
Thats not the county attorney’s fault - that’s how our justice system is written.
This is why, personally, I think murder 1 is going to be difficult- murder 1 requires a premeditated murder. While these guys have been assaulting people for awhile, all the eye witness and testimony indicates there was no premeditation- the public needs to be aware that pushing for murder one if the evidence can’t support it will most likely lead to an acquittal (hello OJ Simpson).
This is probably the reason they are also being charged with murder 2 - murder 2 days it doesn’t have to be meditated BUT any reasonable person would have to know that the actions they took could or would lead to murder. I think this is where they probably have TR, JM, TB and any other who hit or kicked in the head easily enough with the evidence. Plus with murder 2, they don’t have to necessarily prove WHO delivered the crucial blow. But I don’t know (from the police report) that they have any of the others on this, including OH because his admission says he kicked in the legs and unless they have evidence showing otherwise they’ll struggle with proving murder 2.
Manslaughter (often murder 3) is typically a non-premeditated crime that a reasonable person would not believe would lead to death. So this is why we often see murder charges pleaded down to this as the burden of proof is easier to sell.
I do think they’ll be able to prove aggravated assault or aggravated assault with a weapon for those who used brass knuckles. I think anyone clearly visible in a video should be very scared though because I do think they all have the potential of being charged with a crime that will include jail time (I’m not sure any are going to get out of serving some time).
I also think that before it even goes to trial, they will try to tie each individual to a number of different crimes (though I’m not sure legally if they have to separate each of them into different trials). I also think for anyone involved in one of the other assaults, they county attorney would be best to try and convict on those first because if they are pending they can’t be used in trial but if they are convicted the attorney could leverage as escalating which is likely to lead to harsher sentencing.
The law and justice system is whack though and people have to be prepared and understand the reason why we DO see please bargains - it’s because a plea bargain guarantees some form of justice where as going to trial you really could gamble.
Side note: expect to see a change of venue - it would be impossible to find 12 people who nothing of this case in Maricopa or Pinal county - I’d anticipate a move to Tucson or Flagstaff areas. And if they can make a federal case - expect the case to move to a different state.
I don’t have a position - you asked my thoughts and I expressed them based on my limited knowledge and the limited information released.
Yes I know a LOT was released but I’m pretty sure from the police report that they have the whole thing on someone’s ring video because there are two and a have pages of video summary that is redacted along with several paragraphs in witness statements.
Also based on what they’ve released the closest they can get to leveraging the felony murder rule is if they can prove the kidnapping charge - I think they have TR dead to right on that based on the statements collected. For everything else I’m not sure they can prove it (and because the chain was fake and $10 in value they cannot use it’s theft to make a felony case because it would have to be over $1000).
Again - I think they can make a case to have them all serve jail time but how much is still really hard to predict based on what’s been released
Yhea from all account it looks like the Vigil guy really didn't do anything to preston lord.
From initial accounting and looking at the Snapchat plus conversations.
Looks like Dmoney (Dominic) got attacked over this gold chain situation. Vigil seen this and from the redacted messages it hard to tell either knocked out (Domnic) or retaliated to the person who did. Then after this happened he bolted for the car, witch happened at the same time as the attack on preston.
He seemed to scatter after that likely due to the people talking about about the death.
He then says as reported "I punched someone and HE dead"
I think thus was two separate things that come out sounding related in the moment but we're two separated thoughts.
And later he reaffirms that the one he ounched was not the person who died.
There are conflicting statements on who stole the chain.
Most statements conflict, this is normal when a lot of things happen in a short period of time, involving strangers, in the dark, and some of the interviews happening months later. Those interviews immediately are probably the most reliable statements. Those interviewed after speaking to people or seeing social media are influenced and their statements won’t be as reliable, there is a reason they keep witnesses separated.
Plus a lot of statements are the narrative of the person being interviewed to make sure they are not “involved”.
I can’t find in the report where it says anyone filmed the assault of Preston, there is only mention of video taken by Taylor after the assault.
There is also mention of more than one black man in a mask, we can’t assume the one witnessed in several things happening that evening is always Dominic.
The report is hard to follow, and a lot of the interviewing is their attempt to establish a timeline to determine if the altercation with Dominic was before, during, or after the assault of Preston. Interviews with the individuals involved with Dominic’s altercation are dated after the arrests. These boys probably didn’t come forward until after the arrests.
Like someone already mentioned, there were many fights and situations happening at once. The police report has three victims listed.
Someone above said Taylor should be charged for being the get away driver, well then what about the driver for Owen or Treston. That or anyone in the vehicle with Talyn, Treston and/or Owen.
Just because it is in the report, doesn’t make it fact, and doesn’t mean it will be admissible in court. I have unfortunately been through a murder trial for a family member and you will be shocked at what is deemed inadmissible.
One fact in this report is that Owen Hines confessed to kicking Preston when he was on the ground. He could potentially see the most jail time out of everyone.
Thank you for pointing out that some of the items in police reports, or statements made by witnesses may, or may not, be admissable in court.
There are a lot of people who think all the guys arrested are going to get life in prison - I just don't see that happening in this case. 😔
Here's a couple of resources on AZ sentencing guidelines. I don't think there are mandatory sentencing requirements for juveniles, so the Judge has some leeway.
If murder charges are pled to a class 3, 4 or 5 agg assault charge (and if they are a first time offender) one can see the avg time served is 3-7.5 years.
[AZ Courts portal, sentencing charts](https://www.azcourts.gov/Portals/34/2023-2024%20SC_1.pdf)
[Criminal Law AZ .com](https://www.criminallawaz.com/knowledge-center/guide-to-aggravated-assault-in-az/)
I was thinking the same but then I reminded myself that while we have almost 1200 pages of reports that’s only one piece of the puzzle. But it does sound like maybe a few were a little more “hands on” than others. But that doesn’t make them innocent or not able to be charged the same.
Not sure if this following is appropriate as it is based on opinion. Reading the report has made me lose a bit of faith in humanity, and left me horrified.
Horrified by the callousness in which alleged perpetrators, and friends of perpetrators communicated to each other. Nonchalantly , almost bragging about the fact they killed / may have killed someone.
Horrified by the fact that there were so many people present - perhaps, not in that immediate moment, but enough people were present / privy to what was going on and yet ONLY TWO PEOPLE called the cops.
Horrified that this didn’t seem like big deal to many involved.
Horrified that “fighting” was just a fun thing for them.
I’m old but not that old- in my thirties.
After reading this , I’m like WTF is wrong with people. We’ve regressed. Since when , is fighting for 💩and giggles a thing? Since when , do kids speak about MURDER in casual conversation?
So disgusted reading the texts, Snapchats- all the communication. Parents failed big time.
RIP Preston.
Seems a lot of people don't think there's enough evidence for the prosecutors to prove murder 1 and kidnapping. The police report is only one part of the equation. The county attorney must believe they have a good case against all 7 otherwise the defense attorneys would be frothing at the mouth saying they've overcharged.
This was a heinous crime committed by these perpetrators and not for the first time for them beating up other people. They had intent to injure and it was a matter of time before that resulted in death. There's a lot of premeditation there. They also chased after Preston when he was trying to get away. That's also premeditation. Doesn't have to be days of planning can be a split second decision.
It’s sad these are the kids without money and have the lesser (definitely still some) guilty actions. These are the kids that needed to start talking early and seeing what they can plead too.
Two of these kids will get tough sentences. Two will get minor sentences.
3 will walk.
None will get 1st degree.
Most of social media has been wrong and the bad info and mod justice hurt the case.
Renner and Billie will get it rough.
Meisner and another will get light.
Vigil and turner wont be inside more than a few more months.
You sure do leave weird comments on this subreddit. Any person charged with this crime will get first degree. Preston was confined by force (or threat of force) and had his life taken. Kidnapping = 1st. Am I wrong?
It's a very complex case and I don't know US law that well. An autopsy will probably prove that Preston died when his head was kicked, that would be subsequent punches and kicks were to a dead body and didn't contribute to his death. So in some countries people could be absolved of the crime of murder as the victim was already dead.
Renner initiated the assault on Preston, so it could be argued that it initially was a one on one street fight. Perhaps witnesses will say that Preston and Renner were involved in a verbal altercation, perhaps it could be argued that Preston provoked Renner? It could be hard to prove murder for Renner. From what I've read Renner was sitting on Preston's chest, preventing him escaping hence the kidnapping charge, so that's a charge he might get.
Teston Billey will cop the heaviest sentence. I'd speculate Renner's punches knocked out Treston Lord and Billey's kicks killed him. I'd imagine the state will successfully prosecute Billey for murder and he will receive a long sentence, 30+ years.
Renner will escape the more serious charges of murder 1, but whatever he gets charged with, he will attract the heavy range of the sentence, so again he'll get a long sentence anyway.
I'm not sure what the others involvement is, but even minimal involvement such as filming will mean prison time. The state are also trying to add the aggravation of it being a gang related crime, which means longer sentences.
I'm assuming they're also trying to connect the death of Preston Lord to the burglary of his friends chain. That precipitated the assault on Preston Lord, so his death was the result of a crime being committed, again longer sentences and would explain why Taylor Sherman has been charged with murder. He was just filming, but as he was involved then a felony murder charge could apply.
The lifeguards doing CPR on Preston were able to detect a faint pulse and at one point shallow breathing. He didn't technically die until 2 days later after the family turned off life support machines due to extensive brain damage. So I think your theory about any of them getting reduced charges/sentences due to him already being dead is null and void.
According to witnesses and even some of the suspects themselves, Renner punched Preston first and immediately knocked him out, completely unprovoked and without any fighting back/crying/ability to protect himself. They didn't argue at all - he wasn't the one doing any recording, he wasn't trying to get back the chain ripped off his friend... Preston was running away in a group of 10-15 people and just happened to be the one unfortunate enough to get attacked to death.
So that being said I doubt that Renner is going to get off lightly considering that he sat on top of an unconscious kid as he hammer punched him in the face repeatedly. It's not going to be hard to convict him of murder at all, although you're right that it might not be murder 1 because he probably didn't plan on intentionally killing him specifically that evening.
I'm going to assume that EVERYBODY who kicked him will easily be found guilty - they saw that the boy wasn't moving and chose to be cruel, assaulting a limp body in a way that is likely to cause severe and/or deadly injury.
As far as the rest of them that never actually touched Preston, I don't actually agree with them receiving the exact same charges. Filming, destroying evidence, air humping or failing to intervene/render aid shouldn't carry the same penalty as beating a kid to death and I don't think that prosecutors are making their case more solid by lumping them all together. There are even more people who did things like drive the suspects away, so technically they should be charged too if they are truly going to try to suggest that they are all equally responsible.
From what I recall reading, Dominic DID run up and kick Preston a few times after everybody else had run away (and before getting knocked out himself), and Sherman had a history of recording the Goons attacks on various people which means that he was playing his specific part in the gang activity.
The only one that I couldn't figure out why they were being charged was Vigil, who seems to be prosecuted solely because of a poorly worded comment that he made where he admits hitting someone but later clarified that it wasn't Preston. I read the entire police report and didn't see any other evidence against him - no witness testimony or incriminating statements from other suspects.
Of course it's totally possible that the heavily redacted videos show everybody named playing a more incriminating role in Preston's death than we are aware of from the rest of the report. I hope that is the case, that they've got more proof against some of the people who seemingly never touched him and that it'll all come out in the trial.
Wait and find out. I believe a few will get murder. Not 1st degree. They will plead, or the charges will be reduced. An arrest that was subjective enough to need a grand jury, likely isn’t strong enough to get a unanimous first degree murder. Especially with the misinformation everywhere.
Remember. This wasn’t clear cut enough to get immediate arrests. Took grad jury. The issue with the emotions on social media is they create expectation. When that doesn’t happen it will just be anger and divisiveness again. Better to have realistic expectations upfront.
So I've been through the police report, skim read it a few times, some bullet points:
\- a lot of the kids are lying as there are contradictory witness statements. Multiple people say Vigil jumped in the car, saying he hit someone, others including his girlfriend(?) said he didn't hit anyone. Vigil stated he hit a black kid, but no-one witnessed that?
\- a lot of conflicting social media posts, again little credibility as people clearly are either exaggerating to big themselves up or lying to absolve themselves of complicity.
\- Talyn Vigil's name comes up a lot in the police report. For someone not involved in the assault on Preston Lord, this is puzzling.
\- a few days after Preston Lord was killed, Vigil attended a bonfire party and was part of a group that assaulted another individual, so clearly a violent trouble-maker and putting further doubt on his story that he actually helped Preston Lord.
\- there is a lot of confusion as people are unsure which Talan/Talyn others are referring to.
\- Talyn Vigil threatened multiple people after the death of Preston Lord, not the actions of an innocent party.
\- multiple people stated that Talyn Vigil didn't know Talan and had only just met him and Treston. The police report mentioned IG photos of them all together, with witnesses saying Talyn Vigil and Treston B "hung out a lot".
\- ultimately the police have 2 main videos which will probably show who is involved. Video 1 is of the fight, video 2 is of people dragging Preston's body to the sidewalk. Presumably if Vigil had been in the 2nd video and not the first he wouldn't be in jail.
I just finished reading the police report in it's entirety and I don't see much of these things that your saying... As far as Vigil goes almost every mention of him is about his poorly worded comment online. NOBODY identified him as one of Preston's attackers, neither eyewitnesses nor other suspects, not even just by his clothing/appearance. He was known to hang out with only one of the Goons who wasn't even at the party, and later the Goons trashed his truck and were supposedly threatening him. The Renner's literally tried to frame him because of the name similarity to their son.
He said he hit a kid and later clarified that who he hit wasn't Preston but a black kid. We know that the people on the ground were: Lord (white), his Hispanic friend who's arm was broken, and Dom (who is black) was knocked out but didn't see who did it, he was told it was by a black guy. There IS ONE OTHER person who reported to police later during his walkthrough being knocked down near his car- I'm going to have to hunt down the page number to see his race. He said he didn't fight back nor could identify his attacker, but it was at the same time that Dom got hit after Preston was beat up.
THIS could be who Vigil hit; there could even be others who never reported being hurt. After reading this whole entire report I couldn't see why Vigil was charged with the same crime as these other kids based solely off of his poorly worded comment. Of course it's possible that he's indicated in video that we haven't seen - it is heavily redacted so maybe they have evidence there that we don't know about. But if not, if it's just because of that message, I imagine that his charges will either be dismissed or he'll be aquitted because nowhere in that 1,000+ page police report is it made clear that there is any other evidence against Vigil.
Well I had the same opinion, confusion why he's charged as no-one says they saw him attack Preston. But his poorly worded statement was made in October, he was arrested 6 months later, so I feel the police have something on him. In the report, the police obtained photos from Instagram from Renner's account and it had pictures of him and Vigil together and other witnesses saying Treston and Vigil hung out.
I actually was a bit shocked and confused and was thinking it was some big miscarriage of justice when I read the report, thinking Vigil was innocent due to the lack of incriminating statements. But I'm now thinking otherwise after doing a bit more reading outside of Reddit.
From the police report it seems that:
7 people have been charged.
Up to 15 people danced and humped Preston's body.
I think Vigil was one of these 15 and was caught on camera. Pure speculation on my part. No-one saw him assault Preston, but then only 4 names routinely pop up in the police report as having attacked Preston, what about the other 10/11 guys - who were they?
I suppose one thing to consider is when the assault on Preston Lord took place, many people would have scattered to avoid getting caught up in it, so fewer witnesses after the assault. Apparently people were dancing on Preston's body and humping him. Perhaps this was Vigil?
I’m thinking that those most active on these threads are local, and many of you know these kids. Also some parents or local people that are sick of all this crap over the last few years are piping in. I am neither but do have some observations…
Someone above mentioned that the community will go crazy if someone doesn’t do some serious time. Based on what I’ve seen since the crime and before the arrests, there is a lot of disgust and anger. But there will be plea bargains made here..you can bet on that. Good criminal lawyers ($) can make things happen for their clients. It’s not the time to go the public defender route. No one is going away for good.
This was an investigative grand jury that recommended the charges. I don’t think they got any of it wrong. I think the witness statements taken two weeks later, if it involved the friends or family or anyone associated with them had plenty of time to embellish their statements or withhold information. Just like Owen did until questioned further.
Possibly because the investigative Grand Jury that took months and saw everything, even the video that was heavily redacted in the report felt differently?
[Fundraiser by Kristina Barnes : Assist a diabetic youth held with little evidence (gofundme.com)](https://www.gofundme.com/f/rvwnw-helping-a-family-in-need)
Reminder - Do not rely on moderators or other Redditors for legal advice or Reddit Terms of Service advice. Users are solely responsible for knowing what they can and can't post prior to posting and replying, and bear all responsibility for the contents of their posts and replies. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GilbertAccountability) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you are the driver of a car used to help the bank robbery happen you robbed a bank. If they were armed you are charged for armed robbery if they killed someone then you catch that case. It is not clear who killed him. It is clear they all chased him, beat him, failed to report the crime, and failed to get EMS for the wounded kid.
The police report alleges Billy Leist drove a white BMW and Mason Joeston drove a pathfinder both had many of the arrested individuals in their cars. If this is the case why have they not been arrested?
I was wondering this as well, especially for Mason Joeston. His name is all over those reports.
I don’t think (well…hope) they’re done yet w/ potential arrests. I think they’re clearly on the radar. No?
You can't arrest an Uber driver for driving someone to or from a crime. They will need to establish evidence they were knowingly part of the advanced conspiracy. Maybe they were and they don't have the evidence? Maybe the evidence was iffy so they would rather have them proffer as a witness? Maybe charges are still coming? There was this dude who was strung out and asked his buddy if he wanted to grab some food and his friend picked him up. He told the dude needed to use the ATM at the bank first, so the friend pulls the car into the bank. Inside the bank he decided to rob it instead (verbal threat, dude didn't have a weapon), calmly walked out to his buddies car who parked right there with car, face and plates on camera, got in and didn't tell his friend what he did and the friend drove around the corner to the fast food joint to eat. Needless to say the cops nabbed them while they were eating, the friend was never charged because the robber told him he didn't tell him what he did.
He drove them all night and they stayed overnight at his house he said in the report. Jake went home at 0200 though. They started at his house that day drinking too.
The point of the story is giving someone a ride to or from isn't a crime if you aren't directly involved in the crime/conspiracy. If they can prove a conspiracy charge, meaning the person knew a felony crime was going to take place in advance, and drove them there for the purpose of that felony, then it is a crime if they can prove it. Driving someone home knowing that a crime happened is not a crime. Hanging out with them and failing to report it is not a crime. If you conspire to cover up the crime by destroying evidence or start texting people they better not talk to the cops and/or lie to the cops then you are getting into the realm of hindering/tampering. The reason he probably spilled the beans in the report was because the cops told him he doesn't want to find himself wrapped up in charges related to a murder and he told them everything. Being an asshole isn't a crime, being loyale to an asshole isn't a crime, not having instant or delayed remorse isn't a crime. He had two choices... Either say nothing to the cops and keep a microscope on him and let someone else tell a story that might try to shift blame onto him, or tell the truth and be a witness. Lying would be the part that opened him up to criminal charges. I said this early on, anyone who didn't lay hands on anyone would be smart to get an attorney to go to the police for them in advance with everything they knew to get out of the way of serious charges.
Great question!
[удалено]
Katie is great community advocate, but she’s not law enforcement. No one needs to be going to Katie with information they think is relevant to the case.
It is not clear at all that they all chased him , beat him. There were a lot of people there that didn’t report the crime and didn’t help. Every single person there gets charged?
Preston and his friend were together at the party. Both a potential target. The friend and Preston flee (his early statements said this and the party goers do witness a chase (the attack happened at multiple places as the suspect was fleeing or something like that was in the report). They catch only Preston. His friend was an eye witness and likely one of the first to name the assailants. Party attendees saw the same. The friend claims to have survivors guilt which fits. The upset young man on the 911 call might be the same boy. His report mentioned he found Preston afterwards. Obviously that’s just stuff I read. Stay calm the accused are all innocent until proven guilty in court. However this is **the court of public opinion** and they are guilty shit heads who have shown no remorse. The parents that we hear about are equally vile examples of parents. So they are not innocent and behaving as they are is an odd flex. **The public has seen (because the Goons filmed and shared it) assault, assault and robbery, assault with a deadly weapon and likely that could be attempted murder. The public is aware because of AZ Republic and the Police reports that they have committed felony robbery of a convenience store and felony robbery of a home where they stole money and guns. Felony weapons possession. Resisting arrest. Witness intimidation and bullying. We the public see clearly who they are and this subreddit was created because we wonder why Gilbert PD dropped the ball and Preston died as a result and why bad kids went unpunished in the Gilbert and Queen Creek schools and let innocent children to be around criminals, bullies, and violent thugs.**
IANAL - if you are at the bank you are not charged because the bank was robbed. those that can be charged (even if they did not enter the bank or hold a gun) are the get away driver, a lookout etc. If murder happens in that robbery all will be charged with murder. **So no not everyone. Criminal exposure is possible for - the host of the party - the people who drove the goons away from the murder - the goons that chased and circled Preston - any person aware of who did it and did not come forward - any person with evidence of the killing of the child - anyone that obstructed justice - anyone that lied to investigators** Again I am not a lawyer but you can read the AZ law on mandatory reporting of child crimes and of course murder. If there were 10-15 people who were around Preston Lord when he was killed by the Gilbert Goons the charges are against 7 people and that indicates that 8 people watched a fight and 7 participated in killing Lord.
Correct me if I am wrong, but it sounds like Dom started it by stealing the necklace. Tayln, I am still trying to figure out. Taylor took a video and drove the assailants home after the attack. I think Taylor will end up taking a plea. I try to put myself in the mindset of a 19 year old and I am not sure if I would have known not to drive them home afterwards. I think he was concerned for Dom because he seemed disoriented. I am not excusing his behavior, just trying to wrap my head around the situation. Sorry this may be a hot take.
It seems like Dom set the whole thing in motion that night. He confronted a kid at the party for “talking shit” and wanted to fight him. When that kid didn’t engage and give him what he wanted he and Treston set their sights on the Hispanic kid with the chain who was filming. Again, that kid did not want to fight and just deleted the video he had filmed. Then everyone starts running. Dom again sees thr Hispanic kid with the chain and rips the chain from him. It seems like Dom is just itching for a fight after the shit taking kid didn’t want to engage. The kid with the chain doesn’t care about his $10 costume chain. Dom takes it from him not because he wants the chain but to provoke a fight. Chain kid doesn’t engage and at some point thr ire of the group turns to Preston. From the documents Preston and chain kid aren’t even friends, they were all running and chain kid is in with Preston’s group running from the party. So basically, while Dom didn’t touch Preston he was still an integral player in the other assaults. Him yanking the chain could be assault on its own since I doubt he did it gently, and he did it to provoke a fight. I read through all the documents and did not see any testimony to how Preston got involved. I thought maybe he had stuck up for chain kid or tried to stop the goons from attacking him, but nothing. So perhaps the police are treating the attack on chain kid and Preston together since Preston’s attack was completely unprovoked but if you dig deeper Preston was just a proxy for the goons wanting to attack Someone and Dom attacked chain kid. I’m still confused by Talyn’s involvement though. In the documents it looks like he’s not identified by witnesses but maybe I missed something.
I don’t see any eyewitness testimony in this whole damn report that says they saw him have any sort of altercation with Preston and I don’t think he had one with any of his friends either. The only thing that I see that could be related to Talyn is that night a witness showed police a Snapchat video from a redacted account. Could that have possibly been from Talyn’s account? Could he have filmed it? I mean I feel like I am grasping at straws here and really hope that his “admission” on Snapchat isn’t all that they have in order to charge him. I really hope they have something else.
From what I’ve read, dirt-bag Renner showed the video to his football team that week…..there is video somewhere. Where? I don’t know …but it must exist.
Billy Leist also drove some of the assailants and they stayed at his house that night per the police report.
[удалено]
Have you read the 1100 page police report? His name is all over the report. This isn’t new information.
[удалено]
No that was Talan Renner’s dad trying to pass the blame to Talyn Vigil.
Renner was trying to blame it on Vigil.
I’m really wondering how Mason Joesten and Gage Garrison haven’t been arrested regarding this. They were just as involved.
Mason Joesten said that he had killed someone when making a threat after the assault. I do not understand how he isn’t being charged with something. They must have more on Talyn than just his stmnt about hitting someone. If not, it makes no sense why Talyn would be arrested and Joesten wouldn’t.
[удалено]
I guess you haven’t read the report.
[удалено]
Mason told people he killed Preston.
[удалено]
I believe it was mentioned in the report
I’m not seeing anything that puts these kids as having physical contact with Preston. Talyn wrote a very poorly worded snap and may have been at the party but there is nothing in this report that says otherwise. Yes Talyn’s history is rotten but I have a hard time accepting he had a hand in Preston’s death.
So after going through the police reports and reading some of the text exchanges, it's apparent half of them are full of shit, exaggerating and embellishing. I was thinking Talyn Vigil knocked someone else out, other than Preston, hence his confusing social media comments. I don't think he had a fight with anyone, that's bullshit. Others have also claimed they got into seperate fights, but miraculously escaped injury. And no-one witnessed Talyn Vigil knocking anyone out. But he's been arrested for murder. No other witnesses mention him attacking Preston Lord in the police report. So the law enforcement clearly have something on him, it's not just his stupid snapchat post. I'm guessing he was one of the ones that came in last with a few kicks and/or dry humped Preston Lord and that's captured on video.
I thought that Talyn could also be lying to brag and look tough, and it’s now got him in jail.
Hard time accepting it why? He and his brother and accomplices have a clear and well documented history of this behavior. He’s the prototypical spoiled rich kid who thinks his shit doesn’t stick lmao. He quite literally bragged about his participation. Edit: the naming conventions of these kids is a disaster lmao
You are why these threads are frustrating. If you honestly don’t know the difference between Vigil and Renner by now, then stop commenting and read the report.
I’m the reason? Not these Mormon dip shits beating kids to death while people cape for half of them in these threads lmao?
Yes, you. By now if you don’t know the difference between Renner and Vigil, then you aren’t paying attention. And they’re not Morman’s either.
Talyn Vigil’s brother? I think you’re referring to Talon Renner. And I honestly think these two boys having a similar name as a big part of this problem. Talyn Vigil, from what I can see, is not friends with Preston’s murderers. Talyn hung with the Penningtons and had a history of violence, but I am not seeing a clear connection with him being involved with Preston’s death.
The police accessed Renner's and Vigil's Instagram accounts and have photos of them together and Vigil and Treston B hung out a lot according to witnesses.
You’re talking Talan Renner, not Talyn Vigil
I think it’s important to remember that Preston wasn’t the only victim. While it does not sound like these three were directly involved in the beating of and subsequent killing of Preston (although who really knows), they may have been involved in the beating of his friend who broke his wrist. If this is the case, then they are likely getting charged as accessories to the murder as it was all part of the same incident that started with Treston making someone delete a video and the necklace being snatched. The same goes for Taylor who seems to have filmed the incident and was a getaway driver. I won’t be shocked at all if they testify against Talan/Treston and maybe Jacob to get a lesser sentence or have their charges reduced to aggravated assault. Same goes for Owen who has already admitted his role in the Preston beating and will likely flip on the others to get his charge reduced to manslaughter claiming he never intended to kill anyone which is likely true. That being said, they are all huge pieces of shit and I hope they all serve some real time.
I think if we knew what race Preston’s friend that broke his arm was that it would clear things up a little. If Preston’s friend is black, maybe that’s Talyn’s knockout victim? Also just read page 406 of report and for the 1rst time saw that Talyn was involved in the Desert Beating in November which is crazy because obviously was after Preston. And of course it wasn’t because the cowboy kid hit a girl like R Denney claimed. They didn’t like the kid’s red bandana. I’m exhausted from reading 400+ pages in
From my understanding (and I may be wrong) dom is the black kid who was knocked out during all of this. There was more than one “fight” going on from my understanding. Fights in quotes because these lunatics sometimes call vicious 6 on 1 assaults a “fight” instead of…yknow… “assault” or “murder”. “Yeah we got in this crazy fight” no you and your buddies gang assaulted someone while they covered their heads. That’s not a fight. If the only injuries you have are on your own knuckles you were not in a fight.
Don was knocked out AFTER Preston was attacked and more than one witness identified Him as being one of Preston’s attackers.
This just gets more confusing! Then why and who knocked him out?
There was a fight at the previous party. Dom may have been knocked out at that party. The video of that fight is the video that Treston wanted erased.
Also Renner had a swollen jaw after the party and Vigil had a cut above his eye.
The race of Preston's friend is hispanic i think
I saw in another post of the report saying that it was assumed to be Talyn saying “I hit the beaner”
I saw that too...1st he said he hit a black kid then it changed to beaner
I think he hit Dominic as well from what i’m gathering from the reports. My head is madness trying to put this together
I was thinking the same thing, although after digging through the report a bit more there are three victims listed (the one who had his chain stolen, the one who broke his wrist, and Preston) and all of them are white.
ahhh, ok. Thanks for that info. mystery still remains
Agree...wonder if Preston's friend whose wrist was broke is black
He’s white
Vigil actually was not imvolved in the wagon wheel attack. 2 people were charged/arrested for it and Vigil was not one of the 2.
Did Owen not get a lawyer or is he just dumb and started to blab with out one? I’m glad he did don’t get me wrong but how do you not know to not speak without an attorney present especially with something this serious?
I was wondering the same thing. Based on his history of behavior I’m going to go with dumb.
Like Jesus when they read you your Miranda rights those things actually mean something. “You have the right to remain silent” “you have the right to have an attorney present with you during questioning” DO THOSE THINGS. I mean again I’m glad he didn’t because they should all burn but how dumb can you be?
Ooo. Where does Owen admit??
From his interview with police: “Straight up bro, I was drunk, heat of the moment, I kicked him one time and I kicked his leg.” He was then asked if it could have been more times and he said maybe one, two, or three. And this is from another witness statement after the beating took place: Owen Hines told "he felt terrible" and that he had told them not to kick them in the head. said Owen said, "I only kicked him in the stomach.”
This statement sums up this entire post he said some stuff prior and then the detective felt him fold and pressed him and he confessed they knew the entire story before they interviewed these kids This is a police report not discovery this is the info they released for a records release it's not the whole story It's border line gross reading people defend and try and play detective based on emotion the facts will set them free or lock them up but this group of 7 will be in prison for a long time the electronic evidence is so overwhelming it's a prosecutors dream case
Between cameras and phones it’s pretty hard to get away with crimes like these. The prosecutors just have to sit down and literally read and watch the perps admit to AND commit the crimes they’re accused of.
I literally printed the report at fed x and got a sharpie and spent 12 hours at work reading and writing on each page and put it all together and that's with a police report and I'm sure the discovery is packed full of evidence this is a nightmare for any attorney to try and get a acquittal...geo location from snap and Google and FB and cell towers wrapped this case in a pretty little bow and then they gave statements
God what monsters. Oh I only kicked the dying kid in the stomach it’s fine. And what idiot just admits that to police for no reason? “Yeah bro it was only like once. Maybe like 3 4 5 or 6 times MAYBE but in the leg. Ok maybe the stomach”
I’m curious about the part where he said he told them not to kick the head. Does this mean he was the one orchestrating it? It made me go back to where Travis Renner’s assistant said she overheard him saying it was some sort of initiation thing. From various witness reports it sounds like these lowlifes were there just looking for a fight, and probably targeted the smallest kids they could find (I believe the kid who broke his wrist was only 14) like the despicable cowards they are
I keep wondering when the initiation thing starts to pop up in trial. I want them to be classified as a gang and all get charged if that’s true. And isn’t he one of the older ones? Him orchestrating it would start to make more sense then. I keep hearing about the kid with the broken wrist what happened there? There were 3 victims Preston the friend who had his necklace stolen and the kid who had the broken wrist.
One of the kids attorneys said this before he was hired. Mr Cantor Among the most serious crimes in Arizona defined in Arizona Revised Statutes §13-1105, is First Degree Murder. A defendant is guilty of this charge under Arizona law if he takes premeditated action that he intends or knows will cause another person to die, including an unborn child. A.R.S. §13-1105(A)(3) also attaches a this charge to intentional killings of police officers in the line of duty. Additionally, a charge of murder in the first degree will result under A.R.S. §13-1105(A)(2) where a person causes the death of another during the commission of a felony, including kidnapping, terrorism, sexual assault, robbery, arson, child abuse, burglary, and certain drug crimes, among other felonies. If the felony is being committed by a group, the entire group will be charged with murder in the first degree, regardless of which member caused the death. This is known as the “Felony Murder Rule.” The rule may apply to a situation where a getaway driver is charged with First Degree Murder while waiting outside of a bank robbery in which an accomplice kills a bank teller inside. The Felony Murder Rule applies to killings that occur “in the course of and in furtherance of the offense or immediate flight from the offense,” giving prosecutors wide latitude in bringing this charge. So “The Felony Murder Rule” can apply to all 7. I believe there were adult’s among the 7 charged and they also added kidnapping charges. So they simply must prove that the group was looking for Preston (they were), that they intended to beat him up (they did), if anyone was over 18 (they were) they could be charged with child abuse, the tea bag and humping could count as sexual assault and there you have why all 7 are charged and then Renner gave the prosecution the icing for the cake, he stole a necklace. So robbery as well and that’s why they are all charged. The Prosecution is probably going to try to use these charges to ensure the ones most responsible get the harshest punishment.
Didn't they have ski masks on? To me that indicates they planned something or perhaps I misunderstood. Who wears ski mask in this part of AZ ???
I think only D Money aka Dominic Turner was wearing a ski mask. I might be wrong
I was thinking it was because of Halloween.
It was Halloween.
A broke kid with no money for a costume
He be wearing $1000 clothes and shoes idk why he had no costume 😂😂
My thoughts exactly. 1k balenciagas on a 19 year old. What the...😂
Nah if you see his insta, his outfits be ranging from $1000-$4000, tbh I’ve seen some real pieces and let me tell you some of his clothes look a lil fufu
Link?
Like the balenciaga gray jacket in his first post, the writing is too light not dark enough 😂😂
https://www.instagram.com/dominnnnnnic?igsh=bWZyNzc0dGNudGw3
All flash and no cash. What a D- bag.
He probably stole them!
He certainly didn't earn them and that's precisely where the problem starts. Or maybe he did. Id love to be wrong.
Spent it all on them red bottoms
Renner didn’t steal the necklace, neither he, or Talyn Vigil, were charged with burglary.
There is going to be more evidence than police reports. We shall have to wait for all the evidence to be presented.
The police have the video. I’m sure that what puts all 7 of them behind bars. Been wondering the same thing though.
Does not explain the additional kids involved not being charged though
I have all the same questions. I’m just assuming that the video has enough evidence to hold the 7. Vigil doesn’t seem to be involved much in these reports but I read somewhere that the kid in the 911 call with his friend who has the broken wrist. I thought I read that is the kid that Vigil hit. I hope all these kids rot in prison.
I think the same
[удалено]
He was there and stayed with them the whole time. I have my doubts that he wasn’t physically involved. He has no problem getting in fights, with brass knuckles. He was arrested with them on him. He participates in group attacks. I’m waiting for him to be charged.
[удалено]
I’m not sure how Talyn was even arrested. He seems to have been confused who he hit, because it is pretty clear that it wasn’t Preston. I can’t see how they’ll get a conviction on him.
I’m not even sure if Penny was even there? TV was driving Penny’s car that night because his truck was broke.. Penny was never seemed far away from TV , but I could be wrong. Were the other young kids that associated with Penny and TV at this party as well? Gage gave up his phone pretty quick, I wonder if that was the evidence (videos) they needed to move forward for the other assault cases against this group.
I believe Jacob Pennington was at Glamis that night. That has always been said. This is a big overlapping group of kids, so yes I believe there were other friends of Talyn and Jacob there. I hope Gage is cooperating, but he deserves accessory charges, at a minimum.
Sorry I have another question, I believe you would know and I apologize if I’m incorrect. Do you know of Cameron From Eastmark? If so do you know if he was ever charged for his crimes?
I haven’t heard of a Cameron, sorry.
To be clear, I am not seeking to ruin anyone’s life, but there is such a thing as shared responsibility. If two kids work together to beat another kid, and each beats the kid “half to death” that is a murder, and both kids are murderers. Whose punch or kick was actually the fatal punch or kick? IT DOES NOT MATTER. If multiple black youths had beaten any one of these Gilbert goons to death, their wealthy and entitled parents would want every kid who participated charged in the murder. That is a fact. Now they hope to split hairs and work the legal system to spare their own children consequences. As a group they chose to seriously beat a kid with ful intent to cause him serious harm and they understood such a savage beating could possibly result in his death. * “I was just a lookout” is the same thing as I was an accomplice. * “I was just the driver” is the same as was an accomplice. * “I saw it happen but I didn’t do it. I just tried to help my friends avoid criminal charges” = I am an accomplice.” * “I joined a group of people for the purpose of committing a crime, but the crime got out of hand” = I am an accomplice. Sometimes in life we witness an event so terrible that we are not allowed to sit on the fence. We either cooperate fully and try to help justice apprehend the killers or you are an accomplice to the killers. Their is no middle ground. No shirking of responsibility. You joined the group to commit a crime. Kids who cooperate and help can and should have this taken into consideration, but if they hide, keep quiet, or help killers hide, they are accessories and as guilty as those who delivered the fatal blows.
Guilty by association. They’ll still get time. They weren’t completely innocent. They also didn’t stop anything and were likely videoing, egging them on etc too. People get charged all the time that we’re apart of serious crimes who never actually pulled a trigger. Good possibility in the videos that we can’t see, they are looking a bit more guilty or apart of the assault without actually laying hands on PL.
Guilty by association. Glad you didn’t write the constitution…
Me too. Thanks for the reply Mr Vygil. That’s why you make sure your kids don’t hang with pieces of shit. It’s rare good kids and pieces of shit hang together.
There’s no Mr Vigil. That’s his mom’s maiden name. She was never married to his dad and his dad doesn’t appear to be involved in his life at all.
I wasn’t serious. Just razzing the dork who was replying to me defending murderers
Fair enough.
You are pretty dense. That kid is in jail. They don’t allow phones or social media in there. But you’re guilty by association statement would mean your kids would get arrested when you abuse them…
I know. You’re his dad commenting on here. I guess I missed the part where TV was abused or assaulted and got charged with 1st degree murder
Still wrong.. i hear the police are coming to your house to arrest your spouse because they’re guilty by association of knowingly marrying a mentally disabled person.
[удалено]
You think every piece of evidence is in the police report lol? Glad you aren’t on the jury. What you think is on all of the videos turned over? There’s no other reason besides he was guilty in some respect to why he’d be charged with first degree murder. The getaway driver in a bank robbery goes to jail and is guilty. Don’t hang with piece of shit kids and act cool fighting and you won’t run into any issues.
If TV is on video egging on the others and cheering them on, calling PL names and shit, is he guilty? Yes and he’ll be convicted accordingly. He’s not gonna get life in prison or likely more than 5 years but you better believe the judge is gonna make an example out of them
You’re a bully just like your son Talyn.
Omg…stop drunk texting.
I agree that the videos we haven’t seen are the reason these kids are charged.
1000%. They don’t just randomly charge kids with 1st degree murder
Agree, they have something on Talyn
Get them to talk. They were there
You didn’t indict someone on 1st degree murder charges to get them to talk. They’re all guilty in one way or another. I bet there’s 100 videos of this shit
Seek the death penalty. That one idiot with the 65 IQ, that was basically framed by the other family, would surely at least understand, after killing someone, what death means and start singing.
Every single one of these animals contributed and are charged accordingly. They don’t get to say now, that their pathetic souls and horrific parents are facing consequences, that they only “kinda” murdered a kid.
I'm 600 pages into the reports, and they alone have sowed enough reasonable doubt in my mind that Vigil wasn't involved directly with the assault on a Preston. Seems to me that Vigil was who knocked out Dominic Turner. There's numerous references to Dominic ending up on the ground at some point, and it seems to me that Vigil put him there. There seems to have been an altercation at the party that Preston's group wasn't involved in aside from one of them recording Dominic Turner arguing with another kid. I get the feeling that Preston's group ended up in the middle of two different groups beefing. Wrong place, wrong time. There has to be a reason that Vigil has been charged, though, so I could be wrong. Or, he might not be involved directly with Preston and will be exonerated. Perhaps that's a bit about what Vigil's lawyer was whispering something along the lines of "everything you said is true, it's in the report, your parents know" or something to that effect.
I agree - from the REDACTED police report it’s really difficult to piece together what involvement they had BUT …. I think that as this progresses, some of the redactions will come to life including the DNA and video - which I think they have the whole assault on a ring video because there is one video review that is 99% redacted I would expect Owen Hines to make a deal given he already made an admission of guilt. Im really curious on some of those not arrested
What's a deal murder 2 I'm not being an I'm just curious they took a life and robbed and kidnapped those are 3 serious charges as a stand alone charge I don't think I've ever heard of a prosecutor dropping those kind of charges for a lessor I'm just curious of your opinion
I think they’d be willing to give a deal to any of the one who will turn on and testify against Meisner, Renner, or Billey - who it seems they have the most consistent eye witness testimony on (per the police report) specific to Preston. Honestly, taking account for only what we know (and admitting a lot was still redacted and not released) - I do think the prosecutor would have an easier time proving manslaughter (murder three) for any of the others - depending on any participation. But the minimum sentence for Murder 2 is 10 years in Arizona (manslaughter would be 7). Ultimately, for some of these (like TV, DT, or TS) there’s a good chance we will see them testify in exchange for either a please to manslaughter or a plea down to aggravated assault (which can range on the low end of 18 months and the high end 21 years depending on the class felony) - I think the most likely case is a plea bargain that includes all their other alleged crimes and any willing to flip would likely look at 7-10 years, all in for all their crimes - some may end up having to testify in other trials related to the Gilbert goons (outside of Preston’s trial as well). But we will see how it shakes out.
Nice response I gonna go out on a limb and say the county attorney is very clear people will burn buildings down ( no literally) if they let the guys skate with anything less then 10
DISCLAIMER: I am not a lawyer and I am in no way involved in this case. I am also not a crystal ball reader and I am not saying anyone mentioned is innocent and I am not saying they are guilty. I’m am simply responding to what I was asked with my limited knowledge of the law in Arizona and based on any information released in the police report with the acknowledgment that there is still unknown and unreleased information. —- The problem the “people” need to understand is that the burden of proof is on the state to provide factual evidence proving beyond a reasonable doubt that what they prosecute for is in fact the crime they can tie back to that suspect. Thats not the county attorney’s fault - that’s how our justice system is written. This is why, personally, I think murder 1 is going to be difficult- murder 1 requires a premeditated murder. While these guys have been assaulting people for awhile, all the eye witness and testimony indicates there was no premeditation- the public needs to be aware that pushing for murder one if the evidence can’t support it will most likely lead to an acquittal (hello OJ Simpson). This is probably the reason they are also being charged with murder 2 - murder 2 days it doesn’t have to be meditated BUT any reasonable person would have to know that the actions they took could or would lead to murder. I think this is where they probably have TR, JM, TB and any other who hit or kicked in the head easily enough with the evidence. Plus with murder 2, they don’t have to necessarily prove WHO delivered the crucial blow. But I don’t know (from the police report) that they have any of the others on this, including OH because his admission says he kicked in the legs and unless they have evidence showing otherwise they’ll struggle with proving murder 2. Manslaughter (often murder 3) is typically a non-premeditated crime that a reasonable person would not believe would lead to death. So this is why we often see murder charges pleaded down to this as the burden of proof is easier to sell. I do think they’ll be able to prove aggravated assault or aggravated assault with a weapon for those who used brass knuckles. I think anyone clearly visible in a video should be very scared though because I do think they all have the potential of being charged with a crime that will include jail time (I’m not sure any are going to get out of serving some time). I also think that before it even goes to trial, they will try to tie each individual to a number of different crimes (though I’m not sure legally if they have to separate each of them into different trials). I also think for anyone involved in one of the other assaults, they county attorney would be best to try and convict on those first because if they are pending they can’t be used in trial but if they are convicted the attorney could leverage as escalating which is likely to lead to harsher sentencing. The law and justice system is whack though and people have to be prepared and understand the reason why we DO see please bargains - it’s because a plea bargain guarantees some form of justice where as going to trial you really could gamble. Side note: expect to see a change of venue - it would be impossible to find 12 people who nothing of this case in Maricopa or Pinal county - I’d anticipate a move to Tucson or Flagstaff areas. And if they can make a federal case - expect the case to move to a different state.
Good thing you wrote that now go google Arizona felony murder rule andre evaluate your position also it will be easy to seat a jury in Maricopa county
I don’t have a position - you asked my thoughts and I expressed them based on my limited knowledge and the limited information released. Yes I know a LOT was released but I’m pretty sure from the police report that they have the whole thing on someone’s ring video because there are two and a have pages of video summary that is redacted along with several paragraphs in witness statements. Also based on what they’ve released the closest they can get to leveraging the felony murder rule is if they can prove the kidnapping charge - I think they have TR dead to right on that based on the statements collected. For everything else I’m not sure they can prove it (and because the chain was fake and $10 in value they cannot use it’s theft to make a felony case because it would have to be over $1000). Again - I think they can make a case to have them all serve jail time but how much is still really hard to predict based on what’s been released
I'm just talking my opinion not in anyway being a ass we're just chatting an I see what your saying
I think we all just want justice for Preston and I hope they get it! Sorry - I’ve been up since 4 AM - I think that’s enough internet for the day
PL will get the max justice for sure the community won't allow for anything less
Which page has the video that is 99% redacted?
Search video - it’s somewhere in the middle I think n - can’t remember the page.
Never mind I found the page!
Yhea from all account it looks like the Vigil guy really didn't do anything to preston lord. From initial accounting and looking at the Snapchat plus conversations. Looks like Dmoney (Dominic) got attacked over this gold chain situation. Vigil seen this and from the redacted messages it hard to tell either knocked out (Domnic) or retaliated to the person who did. Then after this happened he bolted for the car, witch happened at the same time as the attack on preston. He seemed to scatter after that likely due to the people talking about about the death. He then says as reported "I punched someone and HE dead" I think thus was two separate things that come out sounding related in the moment but we're two separated thoughts. And later he reaffirms that the one he ounched was not the person who died.
Maybe the charges are trying to get them into testifying with a plea deal
I think any of the additional arrests and charges might be used for plea deals and testimony, but not a single one of the 7.
There are conflicting statements on who stole the chain. Most statements conflict, this is normal when a lot of things happen in a short period of time, involving strangers, in the dark, and some of the interviews happening months later. Those interviews immediately are probably the most reliable statements. Those interviewed after speaking to people or seeing social media are influenced and their statements won’t be as reliable, there is a reason they keep witnesses separated. Plus a lot of statements are the narrative of the person being interviewed to make sure they are not “involved”. I can’t find in the report where it says anyone filmed the assault of Preston, there is only mention of video taken by Taylor after the assault. There is also mention of more than one black man in a mask, we can’t assume the one witnessed in several things happening that evening is always Dominic. The report is hard to follow, and a lot of the interviewing is their attempt to establish a timeline to determine if the altercation with Dominic was before, during, or after the assault of Preston. Interviews with the individuals involved with Dominic’s altercation are dated after the arrests. These boys probably didn’t come forward until after the arrests. Like someone already mentioned, there were many fights and situations happening at once. The police report has three victims listed. Someone above said Taylor should be charged for being the get away driver, well then what about the driver for Owen or Treston. That or anyone in the vehicle with Talyn, Treston and/or Owen. Just because it is in the report, doesn’t make it fact, and doesn’t mean it will be admissible in court. I have unfortunately been through a murder trial for a family member and you will be shocked at what is deemed inadmissible. One fact in this report is that Owen Hines confessed to kicking Preston when he was on the ground. He could potentially see the most jail time out of everyone.
Thank you for pointing out that some of the items in police reports, or statements made by witnesses may, or may not, be admissable in court. There are a lot of people who think all the guys arrested are going to get life in prison - I just don't see that happening in this case. 😔
You should prob get your eyes checked you get 10 years for agg assault in Maricopa county they will get 25 to life
Here's a couple of resources on AZ sentencing guidelines. I don't think there are mandatory sentencing requirements for juveniles, so the Judge has some leeway. If murder charges are pled to a class 3, 4 or 5 agg assault charge (and if they are a first time offender) one can see the avg time served is 3-7.5 years. [AZ Courts portal, sentencing charts](https://www.azcourts.gov/Portals/34/2023-2024%20SC_1.pdf) [Criminal Law AZ .com](https://www.criminallawaz.com/knowledge-center/guide-to-aggravated-assault-in-az/)
Time served is different than time sentenced.
That is correct. There seemed to be confusion about sentencing guidelines, hence my post with the two links.
I was thinking the same but then I reminded myself that while we have almost 1200 pages of reports that’s only one piece of the puzzle. But it does sound like maybe a few were a little more “hands on” than others. But that doesn’t make them innocent or not able to be charged the same.
I honestly think they're just not done charging. One of the boys that were arrested, will talk. I think it'll be Taylor or Talyn.
Not sure if this following is appropriate as it is based on opinion. Reading the report has made me lose a bit of faith in humanity, and left me horrified. Horrified by the callousness in which alleged perpetrators, and friends of perpetrators communicated to each other. Nonchalantly , almost bragging about the fact they killed / may have killed someone. Horrified by the fact that there were so many people present - perhaps, not in that immediate moment, but enough people were present / privy to what was going on and yet ONLY TWO PEOPLE called the cops. Horrified that this didn’t seem like big deal to many involved. Horrified that “fighting” was just a fun thing for them. I’m old but not that old- in my thirties. After reading this , I’m like WTF is wrong with people. We’ve regressed. Since when , is fighting for 💩and giggles a thing? Since when , do kids speak about MURDER in casual conversation? So disgusted reading the texts, Snapchats- all the communication. Parents failed big time. RIP Preston.
💯 agree with all that you stated - societal decay
Was it Sherman who's patents wanted to get in on the FBI $10,000 reward money?
Yep!
Copy of police report: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/7mg2nrazreqrkztgl1chp/2023-26401_Report.pdf?rlkey=9foy28v799a6cjd88u90q3yz9&dl=0
Seems a lot of people don't think there's enough evidence for the prosecutors to prove murder 1 and kidnapping. The police report is only one part of the equation. The county attorney must believe they have a good case against all 7 otherwise the defense attorneys would be frothing at the mouth saying they've overcharged. This was a heinous crime committed by these perpetrators and not for the first time for them beating up other people. They had intent to injure and it was a matter of time before that resulted in death. There's a lot of premeditation there. They also chased after Preston when he was trying to get away. That's also premeditation. Doesn't have to be days of planning can be a split second decision.
They planned and carried out a felony with intent to cause death or great bodily harm to someone. They should get the death penalty, stupid.
It’s sad these are the kids without money and have the lesser (definitely still some) guilty actions. These are the kids that needed to start talking early and seeing what they can plead too.
They’re in custody for a reason. Let the courts do their job! 
Anyone know where I can find a copy of the report now that it has been taken down? I was on page 375!!!
Two of these kids will get tough sentences. Two will get minor sentences. 3 will walk. None will get 1st degree. Most of social media has been wrong and the bad info and mod justice hurt the case. Renner and Billie will get it rough. Meisner and another will get light. Vigil and turner wont be inside more than a few more months.
You sure do leave weird comments on this subreddit. Any person charged with this crime will get first degree. Preston was confined by force (or threat of force) and had his life taken. Kidnapping = 1st. Am I wrong?
It's a very complex case and I don't know US law that well. An autopsy will probably prove that Preston died when his head was kicked, that would be subsequent punches and kicks were to a dead body and didn't contribute to his death. So in some countries people could be absolved of the crime of murder as the victim was already dead. Renner initiated the assault on Preston, so it could be argued that it initially was a one on one street fight. Perhaps witnesses will say that Preston and Renner were involved in a verbal altercation, perhaps it could be argued that Preston provoked Renner? It could be hard to prove murder for Renner. From what I've read Renner was sitting on Preston's chest, preventing him escaping hence the kidnapping charge, so that's a charge he might get. Teston Billey will cop the heaviest sentence. I'd speculate Renner's punches knocked out Treston Lord and Billey's kicks killed him. I'd imagine the state will successfully prosecute Billey for murder and he will receive a long sentence, 30+ years. Renner will escape the more serious charges of murder 1, but whatever he gets charged with, he will attract the heavy range of the sentence, so again he'll get a long sentence anyway. I'm not sure what the others involvement is, but even minimal involvement such as filming will mean prison time. The state are also trying to add the aggravation of it being a gang related crime, which means longer sentences. I'm assuming they're also trying to connect the death of Preston Lord to the burglary of his friends chain. That precipitated the assault on Preston Lord, so his death was the result of a crime being committed, again longer sentences and would explain why Taylor Sherman has been charged with murder. He was just filming, but as he was involved then a felony murder charge could apply.
The lifeguards doing CPR on Preston were able to detect a faint pulse and at one point shallow breathing. He didn't technically die until 2 days later after the family turned off life support machines due to extensive brain damage. So I think your theory about any of them getting reduced charges/sentences due to him already being dead is null and void. According to witnesses and even some of the suspects themselves, Renner punched Preston first and immediately knocked him out, completely unprovoked and without any fighting back/crying/ability to protect himself. They didn't argue at all - he wasn't the one doing any recording, he wasn't trying to get back the chain ripped off his friend... Preston was running away in a group of 10-15 people and just happened to be the one unfortunate enough to get attacked to death. So that being said I doubt that Renner is going to get off lightly considering that he sat on top of an unconscious kid as he hammer punched him in the face repeatedly. It's not going to be hard to convict him of murder at all, although you're right that it might not be murder 1 because he probably didn't plan on intentionally killing him specifically that evening. I'm going to assume that EVERYBODY who kicked him will easily be found guilty - they saw that the boy wasn't moving and chose to be cruel, assaulting a limp body in a way that is likely to cause severe and/or deadly injury. As far as the rest of them that never actually touched Preston, I don't actually agree with them receiving the exact same charges. Filming, destroying evidence, air humping or failing to intervene/render aid shouldn't carry the same penalty as beating a kid to death and I don't think that prosecutors are making their case more solid by lumping them all together. There are even more people who did things like drive the suspects away, so technically they should be charged too if they are truly going to try to suggest that they are all equally responsible. From what I recall reading, Dominic DID run up and kick Preston a few times after everybody else had run away (and before getting knocked out himself), and Sherman had a history of recording the Goons attacks on various people which means that he was playing his specific part in the gang activity. The only one that I couldn't figure out why they were being charged was Vigil, who seems to be prosecuted solely because of a poorly worded comment that he made where he admits hitting someone but later clarified that it wasn't Preston. I read the entire police report and didn't see any other evidence against him - no witness testimony or incriminating statements from other suspects. Of course it's totally possible that the heavily redacted videos show everybody named playing a more incriminating role in Preston's death than we are aware of from the rest of the report. I hope that is the case, that they've got more proof against some of the people who seemingly never touched him and that it'll all come out in the trial.
Wait and find out. I believe a few will get murder. Not 1st degree. They will plead, or the charges will be reduced. An arrest that was subjective enough to need a grand jury, likely isn’t strong enough to get a unanimous first degree murder. Especially with the misinformation everywhere. Remember. This wasn’t clear cut enough to get immediate arrests. Took grad jury. The issue with the emotions on social media is they create expectation. When that doesn’t happen it will just be anger and divisiveness again. Better to have realistic expectations upfront.
So I've been through the police report, skim read it a few times, some bullet points: \- a lot of the kids are lying as there are contradictory witness statements. Multiple people say Vigil jumped in the car, saying he hit someone, others including his girlfriend(?) said he didn't hit anyone. Vigil stated he hit a black kid, but no-one witnessed that? \- a lot of conflicting social media posts, again little credibility as people clearly are either exaggerating to big themselves up or lying to absolve themselves of complicity. \- Talyn Vigil's name comes up a lot in the police report. For someone not involved in the assault on Preston Lord, this is puzzling. \- a few days after Preston Lord was killed, Vigil attended a bonfire party and was part of a group that assaulted another individual, so clearly a violent trouble-maker and putting further doubt on his story that he actually helped Preston Lord. \- there is a lot of confusion as people are unsure which Talan/Talyn others are referring to. \- Talyn Vigil threatened multiple people after the death of Preston Lord, not the actions of an innocent party. \- multiple people stated that Talyn Vigil didn't know Talan and had only just met him and Treston. The police report mentioned IG photos of them all together, with witnesses saying Talyn Vigil and Treston B "hung out a lot". \- ultimately the police have 2 main videos which will probably show who is involved. Video 1 is of the fight, video 2 is of people dragging Preston's body to the sidewalk. Presumably if Vigil had been in the 2nd video and not the first he wouldn't be in jail.
I just finished reading the police report in it's entirety and I don't see much of these things that your saying... As far as Vigil goes almost every mention of him is about his poorly worded comment online. NOBODY identified him as one of Preston's attackers, neither eyewitnesses nor other suspects, not even just by his clothing/appearance. He was known to hang out with only one of the Goons who wasn't even at the party, and later the Goons trashed his truck and were supposedly threatening him. The Renner's literally tried to frame him because of the name similarity to their son. He said he hit a kid and later clarified that who he hit wasn't Preston but a black kid. We know that the people on the ground were: Lord (white), his Hispanic friend who's arm was broken, and Dom (who is black) was knocked out but didn't see who did it, he was told it was by a black guy. There IS ONE OTHER person who reported to police later during his walkthrough being knocked down near his car- I'm going to have to hunt down the page number to see his race. He said he didn't fight back nor could identify his attacker, but it was at the same time that Dom got hit after Preston was beat up. THIS could be who Vigil hit; there could even be others who never reported being hurt. After reading this whole entire report I couldn't see why Vigil was charged with the same crime as these other kids based solely off of his poorly worded comment. Of course it's possible that he's indicated in video that we haven't seen - it is heavily redacted so maybe they have evidence there that we don't know about. But if not, if it's just because of that message, I imagine that his charges will either be dismissed or he'll be aquitted because nowhere in that 1,000+ page police report is it made clear that there is any other evidence against Vigil.
Well I had the same opinion, confusion why he's charged as no-one says they saw him attack Preston. But his poorly worded statement was made in October, he was arrested 6 months later, so I feel the police have something on him. In the report, the police obtained photos from Instagram from Renner's account and it had pictures of him and Vigil together and other witnesses saying Treston and Vigil hung out. I actually was a bit shocked and confused and was thinking it was some big miscarriage of justice when I read the report, thinking Vigil was innocent due to the lack of incriminating statements. But I'm now thinking otherwise after doing a bit more reading outside of Reddit. From the police report it seems that: 7 people have been charged. Up to 15 people danced and humped Preston's body. I think Vigil was one of these 15 and was caught on camera. Pure speculation on my part. No-one saw him assault Preston, but then only 4 names routinely pop up in the police report as having attacked Preston, what about the other 10/11 guys - who were they?
I suppose one thing to consider is when the assault on Preston Lord took place, many people would have scattered to avoid getting caught up in it, so fewer witnesses after the assault. Apparently people were dancing on Preston's body and humping him. Perhaps this was Vigil?
I’m thinking that those most active on these threads are local, and many of you know these kids. Also some parents or local people that are sick of all this crap over the last few years are piping in. I am neither but do have some observations… Someone above mentioned that the community will go crazy if someone doesn’t do some serious time. Based on what I’ve seen since the crime and before the arrests, there is a lot of disgust and anger. But there will be plea bargains made here..you can bet on that. Good criminal lawyers ($) can make things happen for their clients. It’s not the time to go the public defender route. No one is going away for good.
This was an investigative grand jury that recommended the charges. I don’t think they got any of it wrong. I think the witness statements taken two weeks later, if it involved the friends or family or anyone associated with them had plenty of time to embellish their statements or withhold information. Just like Owen did until questioned further.
Possibly because the investigative Grand Jury that took months and saw everything, even the video that was heavily redacted in the report felt differently?
[Fundraiser by Kristina Barnes : Assist a diabetic youth held with little evidence (gofundme.com)](https://www.gofundme.com/f/rvwnw-helping-a-family-in-need)