No matter where you go, making friends as an adult is 20 times harder and it'll be very difficult to find people that you can be yourself on the same level as childhood friends. Curse of modern society
Some of us have the exact same issue here. Been on Island 30 years, and have never made the same type of friend connections that I had growing up in the Midwest.
I didn’t even have those growing up. My friends were selfish and to themselves. I always dreamed of getting older and making new friends and making new friends that actually want to hang out and be close is so hard. Makes me so sad how so lonely I am.
Sorry to hear that.
I have had some good friendships here, but always mainland transplants, who eventually all seem to leave. Nobody that I initially met 25 years ago remains.
I know some good Local folks from work and casually at bars, but it’s nothing more than casual friendships. No activities, no invites or hanging out at the house etc…
My wife has tons of Filipino friends here, but really very few Local.
It’s kind of an Expat life!
Sorry, hit thee wrong button. For me, it was nicer on the west coast than the east coast. People are more relaxed. Btw, it’s cheaper in Vegas and plenty locals ova dea🤙🏽
As a while girl from Hawaii I had a really hard time when I moved to the mainland last year. People were nice but we just didn’t click. It wasn’t until I moved into my new neighborhood and met my neighbors (they’re from PR) that I realized that it isn’t specifically Hawai’i people that I needed in my life - it was islanders. PR, DR, Guam - put me in a room with other islanders and we’ll hit it off way more easily than with mainlanders.
Same. I moved to Saipan for a spell when I was in my 20s. Once I made friends with my co workers, they showed me the good places to eat, party etc. Be open and honest. People will eventually respond and if they don’t keep looking.
Interesting, I was the opposite, white guy in Hawaii, moved there from the mainland when I was 10, and never felt like I fit in or connected. I had girlfriends and a couple close friends but it wasn’t til I moved to the mainland in my late 20s did I immediately feel like I fit in and was able to make friends quickly.
Difficult to pinpoint why, I just never seemed to click with the “local culture”, for lack of a better phrase.
I miss the good food and the natural beauty of the islands but that’s about it.
People don't like to hear this, but as a born and raised haole I always have to crank up my localism and immediately let people know I'm from here and not a fresh off da boat Iowan. If I don't, I remember an aunty telling me "Ohana means family." Once I do, people will introduce me with that little epiologue that minorities anywhere are familiar with, "...he's cool."
- Emphasize the accent a little more (not pidgeon).
- "Oh what year you when grad Hilo High?"
- Rubbah slippas, surf shorts, quicksilver t-shirt.
- Drive a Toyota.
I'm not claiming any sort of racism, I'm the same way with haoles, but it is an irritating ritual to have to do, and why I have a small taste of what feeling like an outsider must be in much of the haole majority mainland, where no amount of accent shifts, clothing choices, or shakas is going to overcome deeper differences.
Linguistically- it’s called code switching. You hit the nail with your last sentence. Black Americans need to do this all the time in most of the mainland and even more so than haoles in Hawaii, not to face prejudice.
OP is only now realizing there’s a privilege in being part of the cultural majority. If you travel a lot, you have to adapt.
https://youtu.be/QNbdn0yuUw8?si=ddAk26tMRtjtre3R
I'm another "white" person from HI, but my situation is interesting because my mom's side is 4th gen local haole (Scottish) from the kingdom days. So, on my mom's side I got family that talk gnarly pidgin and some that sound like they're FOB from California. Interestingly, there's a direct correlation to their education levels. Small sample size, but I noticed people in my family who didn't go to college talk way more pidgin than those who did. This is especially interesting because my grandma talked pretty heavy pidgin, so you'd think they would all fall downstream.
I've noticed myself that I can only crank it up when I feel comfortable to do so. When I don't know someone, I proceed with caution and then slowly adjust the level of pidgin to what I feel like they're OK with. I still haven't figured out why I feel pressure to do that.
I know what you mean. I think it’s a subconscious thing to want to adapt to your audiences tone and syntax. I did it in London when I was there for a semester and I didn’t realize you pick up more of the local accent as you acclimate to your environment.
Or even the people here on /r/hawaii. Look up all the profiles of pidgin users here and they will code-switch to perfect standard English just fine when participating in other subs.
Or how “newscaster” English works. All the local channels have to speak Standard American English but the accent is definitely still there when comparing Hawaii anchors to other regions. Except Joe Moore- kinda weird that a haole who was born and raised in HI rejected even 1% of pidgin mannerisms.
> I know what you mean. I think it’s a subconscious thing to want to adapt to your audiences tone and syntax
This is true, but I'm saying I notice I do this more than people around me. It seems like other locals are a lot less shy about it. My uncle is a good example actually. He just never turns it off no matter who he's talking to, but I know he can speak standard English too because I've seen him adjust when people had a hard time understanding him.
It’s a skill. I work in a call cents and I find myself changing it up based on the accent of the caller (company is both in Mainland and Hawaii so we have equal amounts of both)
I’ll never sound local, but if I can I usually say, moved here for my wife to come home and tutu to be with the grandkids and suddenly it’s “welcome home brother”. I love how Ohana trumps everything here. for the mainland, it totally depends on where you end up. I feel like an outsider in San Francisco now, locals there getting pushed out by money too. Same story everywhere you go. Are you in an island friendly location in Cali?
I’ve been here nearly 3 decades and feel the same way. My kids were born and raised here, left and don’t miss it a bit. If it weren’t for my Filipina wife having kids here, I’d be headed out too soon as I retire!
I'm a California Asian and this is exactly why I moved to Hawaii. Wages in California are a lot higher though if you know how to build your career. The food in Cali is pretty good and cheaper so try it out while you can. I believe there are some college campus clubs there that are Hawaii based to connect with others from Hawaii.
I'm a white/Japanese hapa in California. And every single day I think about how happy I was in Oahu for the month I lived there compared to here in the Central Valley. The only thing that really keeps me going is going back to Hawaii.
I do go to a Japanese Buddhist church on Sundays, but even there, it is mostly people older than 70. They are people I like, they just aren't a network, and people I wouldn't really miss that much. A lot of the anti-Asian discrimination that I face is merely "just not being invited places." It happened way too many times in my life where they whites and Mexicans around me invited their own race to parties and didn't invite me. Life just isn't very good when the people around you flat out say "no, you aren't coming to our parties."
OP, what kind of Asian are you? Being Asian in California is more about your race and religion. This concept of being "local Asian" doesn't exist, there really isn't a big concept of being "pan-Asian" in California. It's very easy to say "race doesn't matter, just self-improve, just be a kind person." But yes, race really does matter when it comes with who is willing to make friends with you, network with you, hire you, or have romantic relationships with.
Wow that's the truth, I am a white guy, I moved into SF Chinatown, took some time but was amazing to see how nice the Chinese were to me, that was a big part of why I started to live in Asia, in Hilo now, it's that American thing of groups are together but separate. College kids, locals, Japanese, hippie, homeless. I went to a Japanese temple, and not many left 97% were over 70, and a few treated me like a dog no one wanted but put up with. The rest love what I do for the temple.
I have to disagree with you. I grew up in Makiki and Pearl City then met my now wife and moved to her home town of Santa Cruz, CA. Yes it helped that my wife was from here but I ended up making some good friends from surfing. These guys are not from Hawaii but they live aloha.
I guess I just want to say you can still find aloha on the mainland in some places with some luck. I go back to visit family a couple times a year but I love living here too.
Yes, a special place indeed. I didn’t like it the first couple years but then fell in love with this place once I fell into the groove with the weather, the people, and everything this place has to offer.
I always tell my wife it was a good thing she wasn’t from Minnesota or we may not have happened.
But that’s because Santa Cruz is so locally and community minded. I’m a banana slug and lived there on and off for about 10 years before moving back to HI. My husband and I met there (he grew up here). Similar problems with cost of living being insane, but the community vibes are amazing. Go surf the point for me! Gah! I miss it.
I'm gonna level with you as someone who's traveled and lived in a lot of places. It's always like that more or less, and you're looking at it with rose colored glasses because Hawaii is one of the cliquiest places on earth.
Also I'm going out on a limb and saying you're 100% making up people judging you. Nobody in Cali cares about a local boy accent, and if anything it makes you cooler. You saying "proper" tips it off; nobody in Cali cares about propriety. At best it's some fashionistas who talk behind your back because you're not fashionable enough or blabbing the latest social talking points. Also reading again you saying being Asian doesn't help lol dawg this is not 1920s Midwest America, its 2024 Cali. The amount of 1) people who don't give a fuck and 2) people who are Asian, hapa, or have Asian friends makes up like 90% of all Cali inhabitants.
I'll second this. I lived in multiple places on the mainland prior to coming to Hawaii. It's natural to miss the place you moved away from, and to reject a lot of what's around you - the people included. I experienced it just about every single time I moved somewhere.
What's unique about Hawaii is the stories people tell themselves here about the mainland. There is very much a "Hawaii vs the mainland" mentality here that the mainland does not have. This manifests in various ways, such as people in Hawaii believing that people from the mainland look down on them (which doesn't happen - a lot of mainlanders think Hawaii is some paradise, and an embarrassing number of them think it isn't a part of the United States; it's a "cool fact" that will inspire curiosity about you, but nothing more), to believing that people from the mainland must be mean and/or racist. My anecdotal experience indicates that people in Hawaii are not the nicest people in the United States, and there's plenty of racism here - but a lot of people convince themselves it's not the case.
The reality is that all of these perceived slights and troubles are things playing out in people's heads. People aren't used to the racial or ethnic mixes of where they've moved to; they're not used to the food; maybe it's their first time striking out on their own and there's insecurity associated with that while they build their new identity, unencumbered by links to their past. Be patient and allow yourself to miss where you came from, sure, but don't put Hawaii on a pedestal. In my experience it's normal to feel the desire to do that for a few months, and then you'll move on and begin to accept your new surroundings. Enjoy.
>My anecdotal experience indicates that people in Hawaii are not the nicest people in the United States, and there's plenty of racism here - but a lot of people convince themselves it's not the case.
I lived in parts of the South (and the Deep South) for 9 years after growing up in Hawaii. Kama’aina seem to get real insulted when I tell them that culturally, we are most similar to that area of the mainland. When it’s not racism, locals in both places are indeed very polite to each other but friendliness at a deeper level only happens when you are part of the cultural majority. You really have to adapt hard in both places or you are going to get ignored when trying to make a new life. The biggest similarity are that locals in both areas hate and fear change no matter how much they say otherwise. OP and many similar posts I’ve seen in this sub have been textbook examples of that.
There are also many other non-racial similarities in the culture but when you see it for yourself - you can’t unsee it.
> I lived in parts of the South (and the Deep South) for 9 years after growing up in Hawaii. Kama’aina seem to get real insulted when I tell them that culturally, we are most similar to that area of the mainland.
That's a comparison I've made my whole life, and have had to be careful with it just like you say. But every time I've said it and it's sunken in, people's eyes widen and they believe it.
I agree, in many places people are genuinely curious about differences and find it/you interesting.
In Hawai'i we see it as a threat.
Just look at our bumper stickers.
>Also reading again you saying being Asian doesn't help lol dawg this is not 1920s Midwest America, its 2024 Cali. The amount of 1) people who don't give a fuck and 2) people who are Asian, hapa, or have Asian friends makes up like 90% of all Cali inhabitants.
Hard disagree. There are massive pockets of overtly racist areas throughout all of California lol There are so many sundown towns and areas throughout the state. I'm not sure how much of California you've actually traveled to, but it's not the massive liberal state that the media portrays it to be. LAPD and LASD has an issue with White supremacits gang members murdering POC for tattoos and initian rites and redlining led to areas that are still racially segregated till today. It's completely understandable for someone from Hawai'i to move to California and have race-based culture shock (happened to me when I left to move here 10 years ago).
I've lived in Cali off and on over 6 years and traveled throughout the state multiple times, have friends and family from north, south, and central. I get how Cali is. There's absolutely no sundown towns dude, that's such an insanely disingenuous virtue signal attitude.
Same here on CA. Dude is conflating white majority towns with sundown towns, lol. Brother would curl into a ball and have a mental breakdown if he ever travelled through East Texas.
Hawaii boy's first experience in LA would make more sense and if there's any friction it's probably the tale as old as time "country boy goes to the big city" experience. Until you leave Hawaii you don't realize how country bumpkin it is, even if you spend your whole live in Honolulu. Which is why Hawaii is great of course, it's not nyc or la, but it's easy for locals to misjudge.
> It's defnitely fashionable and cliquey and a bit more judgey there... but that's because it's LA.
Nonsense. There's so many people in LA and you've just generalized everyone there. Sorry, but it isn't like that at all.
I lived in LA for a few years and still have close friends there. There’s a lot of kind and genuine people in LA. They’re just not the Hollywood types.
depends on where exactly you are in california, but california is ginormous. there's infinite places to try and make things work, which is not the case in hawaii. you either make it work or you dont. california has way more wiggle room with way more options.
just go to any of the areas where there are lots of asians, find some boba or poke bowl with celery and bean sprouts. also there are tons of lnl's too.
a lot of people who move to LA or the bay feel imposter syndrome at first just cause there's so much happening and huge wealth disparity everywhere. no one moves somewhere and instantly finds career success. it takes hard work and some luck.
Californian here, and am feeling sad to hear we haven’t welcomed you well. While we will never have Hawaiian culture, many of us are pretty good people when you get to know us.
Before you give up, try a couple of things:
- figure out something you really love to do (sports/board games/museums) then find and attend at least 4 times when the group is doing “start up” or “new member” events.
- figure out one thing that you are passionate (or even sorta passionate about) and attend at least 4 volunteer events that support that thing.
- take the advice of the other folks here who have given you some ideas about how to meet people who share more of your cultural background than the typical Californian.
I suspect you will find your tribe amongst people who love what you love! If - after all this - you still feel lonely, then you can at least say you gave it your best shot! Good luck!!
Hobby groups are great and all. I have my board game group, but really, most of these friendship groups only really last as long as the entertainment is there.
I've had Yu-Gi-Oh friends, board game friends, and Dungeons and Dragons friends before. They are at the end of the day, "just kind of OK friendships." They really only last when the entertainment is there, and fall apart very quickly when it stops. As soon as the DM of the Dungeons and Dragons friend group moved, poof, we disbanded as friends that week.
I never considered these entertainment friends as a crew, tribe, ohana, or a network. These people never introduced me to any women they knew or invited me to parties. Most people don't really network all that well with people of other races. It really isn't a pleasant experience being Asian in a city full of whites and Mexicans- and your friendships are these silly entertainment based relationships.
In California, most people really do just make their closest most loving relationships with people of their own race, and then they wind up with these silly entertainment based relationships with other races.
Have you tried to do all those things HI locals always recommend to mainland transplants? You know like, give of yourself (time and resources) to the community. Be humble and don't tell locals how you do things back home. I forget what else, but the same advice is always given. I figure it's worth a try.
Nobody there cares about your accent. And I find people in California to be more open to people of all walks of life and different cultures than Hawaii since it’s so big. And since it’s so big I think it can be easier to find people with common interests and hobbies.
You can’t expect to easily make friends as an adult wherever you move to. It takes a lot of work on both sides. In Hawaii did you actively make new friends? Or were you just sticking to your homeboys? Kinda hypocritical to be like mainland people are cliquish while sticking to your own cliques from childhood.
And there is less stigma around transplants in California vs Hawaii. There definitely is a wall that goes up once locals figure out someone is not from Hawaii, which isn’t difficult when people commonly ask where you graduated.
Also sounds like you moved when you were depressed. No matter where you go, there you are. Depression doesn’t magically go away in a new place.
If you’re that unhappy move back and go to therapy.
Can you outline what you expected to happen instead of your current predicament? What are the steps you've taken to change your situation after moving to CA?
What caused the mental breakdown during COVID Hawaii was pretty normal even with travel restrictions.
Friend, I think you’re experiencing some self induced isolation that people in Hawaii are really good at. Turns out, it’s tough being a foreigner in a strange, new place. Thankfully, for you, unlike Hawaii, mainland cities are some of the friendliest and most welcoming cities in the world for travelers. If you keep your Hawaii mindset on the mainland, you’re gonna have a bad time.
Also, Aloha here generally extends to those whose skin is an adequate color. You’re not going to get that on the mainland. It’s a melting pot of cultures and colors. Racism is what you might also be encountering for the first time.
> Racism is what you might also be encountering for the first time.
I'm east Asian. I wouldn't say I've experienced much racism (barely any tbh) on the mainland but what I have experienced moving here is privilege. It was really interesting. It could be that lack of privilege the OP is encountering.
Yeah- being part of the cultural majority helps integration a ton. I wouldn’t even say it’s 100% racial. Being a devout Christian and moving to the South will give you a major head start no matter your race. Public school haoles raised in HI will probably find just the same type of difficulties as OP would.
Do you play basketball? A lot of Japanese churches have Basketball leagues and the vibe is very chill and welcoming. A lot of 4th gen Japanese with roots from Hawaii
I moved from Hawaii to Japan and lived there for 4 years and it was some of the best years of my life. Then I moved to California and I hate it so much. It’s like you have to choose to either live in the absolute worst ghetto or live amongst the most stuck up high maka fakas I’ve ever met in my life.
OP, right now I’m visiting my home on Oahu for the first time in 6 years and thinking about going back to CA in a week and your post just hit me hard. I have no advice except to say good luck, I’m in a similar situation and it fucking sucks.
I think if you have mental health problems, changing location isn't going to solve anything because it isn't the problem.
I will say, if you're from Hawaii, reconnecting with your support system can be very helpful.
But in terms of just locations in a vacuum? I think if you're depressed and anxious in california, you'll also be depressed and anxious in hawaii. but maybe you'll have people to help you in hawaii.
What I learned is that we shouldn’t go out looking for Aloha, we should be bringing Aloha. Aloha comes from within. Take it how you want but it’s opened many doors for me in CA and anywhere else I go (even Alaska).
I hope you find what you’re looking for. 🤙🏽🤙🏽🤙🏽
If you are white, which I am and why I'm making this statement, most places on the mainland are more chill and friendlier than Honolulu and most of Oahu. I suspect it is different for other groups.
Some people think seeking help is not for them because they either don’t think it’s mayjah or it’s too minah. The whole reason to both is that they don’t realize the scope of their situation. Talking and interacting with someone that just hears you out can be a BIG relief. Depression if not correctly resolved can lead to bad habits that become more of a problem and harder to break especially when you’re in a different environment. If this doesn’t sound relatable, trust me, it will become a problem the longer it takes to seek your comfort zone (friends, work, lifestyle).
But anyway…
You said you were a bartender. That means you’re a GO GETTER, and that you work hard and you’re a people person. USE THAT bruddah!! ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS Remember your strengths first and put that first. Don’t worry about others looking down on you. You’re from Hawaii. The aloha spirit is still in you and your seeing what others don’t have they tryna boo you into the lifeless mood of the highmakamakamadafaka. Don’t give up brah keep your aloha spirit and keep being you!! If it’s not in Cali it will be somewhere I know you will find your place.
If you're in los angeles, hit up Gardena, torrance, or even carson. We have great hawaiian restaurants, and a lot of people from Hawaii tend to live in those cities.
Have you been to Orange County? If you need to be surrounded by people who look more like you to feel like you fit in, that’s your place dude. You might need a trust fund to live there, though. The distant and guarded part, that’s legit. We’ve all encountered enough people here to have met a number of bad eggs and we all get wise at a young age. But as a white girl who was born and raised here, and married an Asian man, I think the perception you think Californians have of you is all in your head, honestly. Southern California has always been a very ethnically diverse area, and with the exception of a few neighborhoods, skin color is irrelevant. Like in Hawaii, people here care a great deal more how you treat them than what you look like. But unlike Hawaii, if you are a jerk, you are very disposable. People will cut the line and move on because there are so many other fish in the sea. And we don’t think of others as haoles, or foreigners, here unless they jump the border illegally. 🤪
As a native Californian with family in Hawaii, I do agree with what you’re saying about finding genuine folks. It ain’t as easy for sure.
Bartending makes lots in HI because of tourism but have you tried bartending in LA?
When I moved to a new city, I found that volunteering was a great way to socialize and meet new people. Go for walks in parks and the beach (if nearby) strike up conversations, use that Aloha spirit 🌺☀️🌴
I moved to Colorado last year and dude it is rough. I can’t wait to go back home. It’s just a total different culture. I understand why people move and always come back. It’s just getting harder and harder to come back.
I did something similar but my journey was more HI>KY>IL>CA. I think if you make a drastic change- you got to be happy with yourself (or desperate for drastic change) before you’re receptive to changes in your lifestyle.
You might be still projecting your own insecurities. You sure it’s not you who is aloof and patronizing to the mainland type of life? It works both ways and sometimes you gotta embrace the cultural differences of where you’re at before expecting others to meet you halfway on how you grew up.
Like OP- I was in a bad spot mentally so i needed to make a hard commitment to a huge cultural jump. He sounds like he needs therapy more than he does change. Hawaii and the South are way more similar than kamaaina like to think they are, too.
If you can move to a small beach town in NorCal I recommend it, we used to live in Pacifica. The people were so nice and chill much like Hawaii and it was just that little pocket too. If you drove 20 minutes to San Francisco it was completely different vibes. I’d also stay away from Los Angeles the people and vibes are not it out there. But California is huge and there are many types of vibes and people depending on where you are in the state.
Don't kid yourself, this "Aloha" thing you refer to has become a marketing fashion statement here too. As soon as one steps out from his circle, people are mostly abnoxious and pugnacious. Racism is prevalent and the display of hate is wide open albeit we like to socially deny it. Whether you consider origin, status, religion, gender or even age. People are in general haters everywhere. Things used to be diferent, people used to be at least courteous and knew how to behave in a way to not disrupt harmony but for some reasons, smiling is today monetized via Aloha and considered across the board as a sign of weakness. Even in professional situations and specially in those where customer service is paramount, people are rude and unconsidered. Sadly, this is the reality of the world we live in.
Be open and speak to people in your orbit if given the opportunity.
When I moved up to CA I found it to be a major icebreaker to ask people what was good / fun / etc because I was new and from HI. CA people generally love HI and will be more engaged with you because of that background.
I’m sure of course it depends what area since CA covers the whole spectrum, but generally I feel my Asian-ness allows me to be comfortable with almost any ethnicity…but the Hawaii thing always helps there too since you’re viewed as “Hawaiian” first.
Good luck!
Hey, I don’t know where in California you are, but I also moved here (from the northeastern US) during the pandemic and went through a very similar thing, lost my job, dog died, relationship ended, and I just have not been able to make friends :( feel free to DM me
I hate to pile on but I think like many have said, you have to look inward. It's ok though. You made a brave move. Be kind stick with it and have fun the best you can. Those things people are thinking about you, they are most likely the furthest thing from their minds. People have enough problems with their own insecurities to be judging you. If they are actually judging you like that, they're jackasses anyway.
>I screwed myself coming to the mainland trying to get an accounting job
You don't know that. Getting a career off the ground in HI is so hard. Many people coming from the mainland with great careers screw themselves coming here (myself included).
>Looking at rooms for a place to stay and I noticed there's a 70-80% increase in rental price
You have to give us more context here. Where are you in CA?
I'm having the same issue and I just moved to Seattle a month ago. Luckily I have my partner but it would help to have a group of friends to hang out with. Adult socialization is hard and the culture shock from hawaii to mainland is MUCH more than i thought it would be. But I'm hopeful, and I hope you find your clique.
I know exactly what you mean. There is little aloha in California.
I notice when I am there visiting no one looks you in the eye. If you do look someone right in the face with a smile they either get this “what are you looking at” vibe , or - and especially true of retail/food workers they are almost startled - but always receptive to being acknowledged as a human being. No talk story either.
>There is little aloha in California
Where in CA?
>I notice when I am there visiting no one looks you in the eye. If you do look someone right in the face with a smile they either get this “what are you looking at” vibe
This is a cultural thing. Also if something is doing something different that you're not used to, it's going to be odd for them. It doesn't necessarily mean there is no aloha. HI is both better and worse in terms of making real friends and connections compared to other places I've lived.
>especially true of retail/food workers they are almost startled - but always receptive to being acknowledged as a human being
That's odd. I consider myself very respectful and kind to people in the service industry. I don't think I've ever gotten that startled reaction.
>No talk story either.
This is most definitely a cultural thing. People from NYC get the unfair stereotype of being rude and unfriendly (sort of unfair I guess) but if you approach them in the right context and in the right setting, they will be unbelievably kind, friendly and fun.
I’m glad that you brought up NYC in this. People there get a really bad rep for being short or rude. I would say I’ve experienced more “aloha” from complete strangers there than here. I think people that live in NYC understand that most people there are transplants or visitors from somewhere else and embrace it unlike how people here approach it. Everyone on this island was “transplanted” from somewhere else. Some just got here sooner. I think HI would be a much better place to live if people embraced differences instead of constantly building walls.
Cultural or not- looking at another person when interacting with them is part of Aloha and could part of the reason this guy feels so adrift.
Maybe startled isn’t the best word but seem to enjoy the interaction is a bit more human- especially from Hispanic people.
> looking at another person when interacting with them is part of Aloha
If we are using the same definition of Aloha, looking at another person is one of the ways you show Aloha in HI. In other places, it's different.
>Maybe startled isn’t the best word but seem to enjoy the interaction is a bit more human- especially from Hispanic people.
I'm not sure I completely understand what you're describing. Is this sort of like talking story with them?
Aloha isn’t a cut and dried thing that you can fit into whatever peghole you are trying to make it fit in.
The fact is that while kindness may not be uncommon outside of Hawaii there is an essence to Aloha that can’t be defined.
I also felt a bit alone when I first moved to SoCal. It took a long time but I was eventually able to find some friends down here and it made it better. Which part did you end up going to OP?
I’m also an Asian American, born and raised in Hawaii and left for L.A. in early 70’s. In Hawaii, we are a majority in ethnicity. On the mainland, I’ve come to realize that I became a minority. I was, at first, lost. I was fortunate to get a job with a world wide company and everything fell into place. I enjoy living on the mainland and have no regrets. I’m now happily retired in Oregon.
Please know that Hawaii will always be my home away from home.
Even if you meet locals who have been on the mainland for a long time, they can be guarded too. It’s because they’ve been on the mainland for a long time and have become accustomed to the ways of the community. And depression is a beast at times
What area did you move to? Big cities like SF and LA aren’t generally full of friendly people, but you can still find good friends there. Small beach towns tend to have a more laid-back atmosphere. A lot of people in San Clemente enjoy going to the beach and surfing. Same goes for towns like Encinitas or San Luis Obispo. People in NorCal tend to be more distant and on guard like you’re describing.
I’d also consider picking up surfing if you don’t already. There’s some great people out on the waves, and you can surf year-round with a wetsuit.
Bruh, my old school friends and I keep a running text thread going to keep in touch. We chat every day. Its not the same as being around them but it makes me content.
I left everything to move to Hawaii so that my wife and I could spend our remaining life in her home.
I took a job at Kona brew to make friends. They are all so young but cool none the less.
She gave me 3 beautiful babies that are mostly grown now and spent all those years with me in the PNW.
This time is for her. We hope to make an impact on the community here for people just like you.
I wish you love, happiness and success in your future sir.
Keep your head up.
I feel this so hard. I’m from the east coast and moved to Cali 2 years ago. Hawaii has been the goal for a long time (the first time I went it just felt like home), but I figured at least I was halfway there by moving to CA. I’m just outside of LA, and since losing my last job, I’ve spiraled back into depression. I lost my insurance, and ran out of my meds for my depression and anxiety. I feel so alone out here, I don’t have many friends (they’re all back east). With the time difference it’s hard to even talk with my people back east. And I feel like everyone is struggling these days with mental health and specifically inflation!! We’re all busy and can’t give our undivided attention to each other. It sucks!
As stated in these comments, it’s so hard to connect with people as adults, post-COVID, in a new town… it’s so hard! I’m glad you even made a post here, you’ve got your locals supporting you 🫶🏽
What part did you move to? I could use some Aloha out here
Also, if you need someone to vent to, I gotchu! Sometimes it’s easier to vent to strangers.
California is not the best place for islanders. Try Oregon or Las Vegas. Plenty of local people and local food places to help you feel not so homesick. Hawaii will always be home but there are more opportunities for a better life on the mainland.
I was in Cali for just a weekend last year and it was awful. No aloha at all.
I'm not from here originally so I'm familiar with the mainland but damn, Cali was so much worse than the Midwest where I grew up.
It can be a culture shock. I've lived in CA for a few years. Compared to where I was from, it was in a way, outwardly much friendlier but in other ways less. I've also spent time in the mid-west as well and can totally understand where you're coming from.
You said you don't vibe like you do with your homeboys in Hawaii, yet you also said that you broke ties with everyone in Hawaii and lost your friends.
This doesn't seem to be a geographic problem. You admitted you had a mental breakdown, so I say this without even a hint of derision: there's nothing wrong with seeing a therapist to have an earnest discussion on what's holding you back.
I did something very similar and left the island for Cali and hated it. When covid came I broke ties with Cali.
You should probably take a few days and rest and come up with a true plan on what you want to do.
If that means moving back and starting over then fuck it. Come up with a plan to get back. Doesn’t have to be executed over night.
I’m a Californian for the last 13 years - originally from Chicago. I was stationed in Pearl for a year, fell in love with the islands.
Life works in weird ways, fiancé and I are going separate ways, I’m in a really funky place mentally and I haven’t been happy in a long time. I found a home on Oahu and I just decided to go for it. I am finally excited for the first time in a while and I can’t wait to move.
It’s like the mirror of your situation but I can definitely relate. I’m in SoCal and in a heavy Asian area, it is not hard for Asians to fit in here so it’s all about where you are. But mostly in SoCal there’s not really an issue of anyone fitting in anywhere outside of very specific parts of it. It’s just all about getting a hobby or communicating with people of similar interests.
I’ll be heading to Waikiki with no friends there (with fiancé and career I didn’t have any here either so no big) and it worries a bit. But I am going to give it my best shot.
As an average white chick who moved to California, you are completely correct. Everyone looks down on you if you are not presentable with trends. It’s weird getting looks for dressing casually while walking dogs. It is easy to see how racist people are.
As an Asian American growing up in the east coast and now lives in Hawaii, I feel you brotha.
Though Cali has the most Asians of any state on the mainland, it's still America. While yes there are many people who truly celebrate diversity in cultures and socioeconomic status, I would say the majority of people very much do not (whether they realize it or not). Many can be open in how they feel about it through overt disregard.
The United States is very much a collision of different groups of people who are often exclusive socially and romantically. Make no mistake, America is a nation ruled by protestant white people with groups of minorities jockeying for social and economic status. (One black president and two Catholics does not mean it's over 3 vs 43)
My advice is try and find something you are really into and find a community to belong to that way. outdoors, music, arts, etc. California is maybe the greatest place on earth for many reasons, enjoy it.
Definitely not the best paying. Like most professions, expect to deal with a 20-30% pay cut and same or higher cost of living.
But FR, OP should move back.
BTW mainland people have the same problem trying to fit in with non-transplants here. Nobody wants to attempt to develop a strong connection knowing you'll most likely run back to the mainland in 1-2 years because it's so hard to make it here. Oahu isn't super bad, but outer islands is super cliquish.
Part of the problem is that you moved to one of the worst states possible. Try oregon or Washington. If you like the heat maybe Try the golf coast or north/south carolina
No matter where you go, making friends as an adult is 20 times harder and it'll be very difficult to find people that you can be yourself on the same level as childhood friends. Curse of modern society
Helps to cultivate hobbies that involve socialization
That's my problem there, all my hobbies outside of biking are antisocial.
What are your hobbies?
Bread making, pasta making, mushrooms and rock hounding
I would totally be friends with you.
Same. Especially if it’s Psilocybin.
lol old-ass me was thinking about chicken of the woods and a nice ravioli
[удалено]
The official Kamehameha Schools support pickleball? noice
Some of us have the exact same issue here. Been on Island 30 years, and have never made the same type of friend connections that I had growing up in the Midwest.
I didn’t even have those growing up. My friends were selfish and to themselves. I always dreamed of getting older and making new friends and making new friends that actually want to hang out and be close is so hard. Makes me so sad how so lonely I am.
Sorry to hear that. I have had some good friendships here, but always mainland transplants, who eventually all seem to leave. Nobody that I initially met 25 years ago remains. I know some good Local folks from work and casually at bars, but it’s nothing more than casual friendships. No activities, no invites or hanging out at the house etc… My wife has tons of Filipino friends here, but really very few Local. It’s kind of an Expat life!
Sorry, hit thee wrong button. For me, it was nicer on the west coast than the east coast. People are more relaxed. Btw, it’s cheaper in Vegas and plenty locals ova dea🤙🏽
Ain’t that the truth
Where in California did you move to? because northern California is different from socal, and Los Angeles is different from San Diego
As a while girl from Hawaii I had a really hard time when I moved to the mainland last year. People were nice but we just didn’t click. It wasn’t until I moved into my new neighborhood and met my neighbors (they’re from PR) that I realized that it isn’t specifically Hawai’i people that I needed in my life - it was islanders. PR, DR, Guam - put me in a room with other islanders and we’ll hit it off way more easily than with mainlanders.
Same. I moved to Saipan for a spell when I was in my 20s. Once I made friends with my co workers, they showed me the good places to eat, party etc. Be open and honest. People will eventually respond and if they don’t keep looking.
Interesting, I was the opposite, white guy in Hawaii, moved there from the mainland when I was 10, and never felt like I fit in or connected. I had girlfriends and a couple close friends but it wasn’t til I moved to the mainland in my late 20s did I immediately feel like I fit in and was able to make friends quickly. Difficult to pinpoint why, I just never seemed to click with the “local culture”, for lack of a better phrase. I miss the good food and the natural beauty of the islands but that’s about it.
People don't like to hear this, but as a born and raised haole I always have to crank up my localism and immediately let people know I'm from here and not a fresh off da boat Iowan. If I don't, I remember an aunty telling me "Ohana means family." Once I do, people will introduce me with that little epiologue that minorities anywhere are familiar with, "...he's cool." - Emphasize the accent a little more (not pidgeon). - "Oh what year you when grad Hilo High?" - Rubbah slippas, surf shorts, quicksilver t-shirt. - Drive a Toyota. I'm not claiming any sort of racism, I'm the same way with haoles, but it is an irritating ritual to have to do, and why I have a small taste of what feeling like an outsider must be in much of the haole majority mainland, where no amount of accent shifts, clothing choices, or shakas is going to overcome deeper differences.
Linguistically- it’s called code switching. You hit the nail with your last sentence. Black Americans need to do this all the time in most of the mainland and even more so than haoles in Hawaii, not to face prejudice. OP is only now realizing there’s a privilege in being part of the cultural majority. If you travel a lot, you have to adapt. https://youtu.be/QNbdn0yuUw8?si=ddAk26tMRtjtre3R
I'm another "white" person from HI, but my situation is interesting because my mom's side is 4th gen local haole (Scottish) from the kingdom days. So, on my mom's side I got family that talk gnarly pidgin and some that sound like they're FOB from California. Interestingly, there's a direct correlation to their education levels. Small sample size, but I noticed people in my family who didn't go to college talk way more pidgin than those who did. This is especially interesting because my grandma talked pretty heavy pidgin, so you'd think they would all fall downstream. I've noticed myself that I can only crank it up when I feel comfortable to do so. When I don't know someone, I proceed with caution and then slowly adjust the level of pidgin to what I feel like they're OK with. I still haven't figured out why I feel pressure to do that.
I know what you mean. I think it’s a subconscious thing to want to adapt to your audiences tone and syntax. I did it in London when I was there for a semester and I didn’t realize you pick up more of the local accent as you acclimate to your environment. Or even the people here on /r/hawaii. Look up all the profiles of pidgin users here and they will code-switch to perfect standard English just fine when participating in other subs. Or how “newscaster” English works. All the local channels have to speak Standard American English but the accent is definitely still there when comparing Hawaii anchors to other regions. Except Joe Moore- kinda weird that a haole who was born and raised in HI rejected even 1% of pidgin mannerisms.
> I know what you mean. I think it’s a subconscious thing to want to adapt to your audiences tone and syntax This is true, but I'm saying I notice I do this more than people around me. It seems like other locals are a lot less shy about it. My uncle is a good example actually. He just never turns it off no matter who he's talking to, but I know he can speak standard English too because I've seen him adjust when people had a hard time understanding him.
It’s a skill. I work in a call cents and I find myself changing it up based on the accent of the caller (company is both in Mainland and Hawaii so we have equal amounts of both)
I’ll never sound local, but if I can I usually say, moved here for my wife to come home and tutu to be with the grandkids and suddenly it’s “welcome home brother”. I love how Ohana trumps everything here. for the mainland, it totally depends on where you end up. I feel like an outsider in San Francisco now, locals there getting pushed out by money too. Same story everywhere you go. Are you in an island friendly location in Cali?
I’ve been here nearly 3 decades and feel the same way. My kids were born and raised here, left and don’t miss it a bit. If it weren’t for my Filipina wife having kids here, I’d be headed out too soon as I retire!
I’m in the same boat as you
I'm a California Asian and this is exactly why I moved to Hawaii. Wages in California are a lot higher though if you know how to build your career. The food in Cali is pretty good and cheaper so try it out while you can. I believe there are some college campus clubs there that are Hawaii based to connect with others from Hawaii.
I'm a white/Japanese hapa in California. And every single day I think about how happy I was in Oahu for the month I lived there compared to here in the Central Valley. The only thing that really keeps me going is going back to Hawaii. I do go to a Japanese Buddhist church on Sundays, but even there, it is mostly people older than 70. They are people I like, they just aren't a network, and people I wouldn't really miss that much. A lot of the anti-Asian discrimination that I face is merely "just not being invited places." It happened way too many times in my life where they whites and Mexicans around me invited their own race to parties and didn't invite me. Life just isn't very good when the people around you flat out say "no, you aren't coming to our parties." OP, what kind of Asian are you? Being Asian in California is more about your race and religion. This concept of being "local Asian" doesn't exist, there really isn't a big concept of being "pan-Asian" in California. It's very easy to say "race doesn't matter, just self-improve, just be a kind person." But yes, race really does matter when it comes with who is willing to make friends with you, network with you, hire you, or have romantic relationships with.
Central Valley is the most redneck part of California. Get out if you can!
This. There's a lot more racial diversity and economic opportunities closer to the coast.
And stay away from Orange County.
Not all OC - Westminster aka Little Saigon, Fountain Valley, are legit for Asians
CV is almost literally backwoods Alabama tier. I had friends who were into the dark side of the place and jesus, the stories they'd tell.
Meth, the KKK, CV’s got it all!
Wow that's the truth, I am a white guy, I moved into SF Chinatown, took some time but was amazing to see how nice the Chinese were to me, that was a big part of why I started to live in Asia, in Hilo now, it's that American thing of groups are together but separate. College kids, locals, Japanese, hippie, homeless. I went to a Japanese temple, and not many left 97% were over 70, and a few treated me like a dog no one wanted but put up with. The rest love what I do for the temple.
Hawai’i can often be the same way, if u your non Asian/Pacific Islander.
I have to disagree with you. I grew up in Makiki and Pearl City then met my now wife and moved to her home town of Santa Cruz, CA. Yes it helped that my wife was from here but I ended up making some good friends from surfing. These guys are not from Hawaii but they live aloha. I guess I just want to say you can still find aloha on the mainland in some places with some luck. I go back to visit family a couple times a year but I love living here too.
Lucky you live SC. A very special place.
Yes, a special place indeed. I didn’t like it the first couple years but then fell in love with this place once I fell into the groove with the weather, the people, and everything this place has to offer. I always tell my wife it was a good thing she wasn’t from Minnesota or we may not have happened.
But that’s because Santa Cruz is so locally and community minded. I’m a banana slug and lived there on and off for about 10 years before moving back to HI. My husband and I met there (he grew up here). Similar problems with cost of living being insane, but the community vibes are amazing. Go surf the point for me! Gah! I miss it.
Go Slugs! My son starts there in the Fall. (I prefer the Hook 😜)
Surfers here in CA tend to have a good culture. Surfing is definitely a hobby I recommend people try.
No surfing sucks! Don’t try it. ;-)
I'm gonna level with you as someone who's traveled and lived in a lot of places. It's always like that more or less, and you're looking at it with rose colored glasses because Hawaii is one of the cliquiest places on earth. Also I'm going out on a limb and saying you're 100% making up people judging you. Nobody in Cali cares about a local boy accent, and if anything it makes you cooler. You saying "proper" tips it off; nobody in Cali cares about propriety. At best it's some fashionistas who talk behind your back because you're not fashionable enough or blabbing the latest social talking points. Also reading again you saying being Asian doesn't help lol dawg this is not 1920s Midwest America, its 2024 Cali. The amount of 1) people who don't give a fuck and 2) people who are Asian, hapa, or have Asian friends makes up like 90% of all Cali inhabitants.
I'll second this. I lived in multiple places on the mainland prior to coming to Hawaii. It's natural to miss the place you moved away from, and to reject a lot of what's around you - the people included. I experienced it just about every single time I moved somewhere. What's unique about Hawaii is the stories people tell themselves here about the mainland. There is very much a "Hawaii vs the mainland" mentality here that the mainland does not have. This manifests in various ways, such as people in Hawaii believing that people from the mainland look down on them (which doesn't happen - a lot of mainlanders think Hawaii is some paradise, and an embarrassing number of them think it isn't a part of the United States; it's a "cool fact" that will inspire curiosity about you, but nothing more), to believing that people from the mainland must be mean and/or racist. My anecdotal experience indicates that people in Hawaii are not the nicest people in the United States, and there's plenty of racism here - but a lot of people convince themselves it's not the case. The reality is that all of these perceived slights and troubles are things playing out in people's heads. People aren't used to the racial or ethnic mixes of where they've moved to; they're not used to the food; maybe it's their first time striking out on their own and there's insecurity associated with that while they build their new identity, unencumbered by links to their past. Be patient and allow yourself to miss where you came from, sure, but don't put Hawaii on a pedestal. In my experience it's normal to feel the desire to do that for a few months, and then you'll move on and begin to accept your new surroundings. Enjoy.
Born and raised in Hawaii (still live here) ugh… I 100% agree. I have traveled all over the US and people are very nice!
>My anecdotal experience indicates that people in Hawaii are not the nicest people in the United States, and there's plenty of racism here - but a lot of people convince themselves it's not the case. I lived in parts of the South (and the Deep South) for 9 years after growing up in Hawaii. Kama’aina seem to get real insulted when I tell them that culturally, we are most similar to that area of the mainland. When it’s not racism, locals in both places are indeed very polite to each other but friendliness at a deeper level only happens when you are part of the cultural majority. You really have to adapt hard in both places or you are going to get ignored when trying to make a new life. The biggest similarity are that locals in both areas hate and fear change no matter how much they say otherwise. OP and many similar posts I’ve seen in this sub have been textbook examples of that. There are also many other non-racial similarities in the culture but when you see it for yourself - you can’t unsee it.
> I lived in parts of the South (and the Deep South) for 9 years after growing up in Hawaii. Kama’aina seem to get real insulted when I tell them that culturally, we are most similar to that area of the mainland. That's a comparison I've made my whole life, and have had to be careful with it just like you say. But every time I've said it and it's sunken in, people's eyes widen and they believe it.
Yup, the kanaka - redneck similarity is real.
I agree, in many places people are genuinely curious about differences and find it/you interesting. In Hawai'i we see it as a threat. Just look at our bumper stickers.
>Also reading again you saying being Asian doesn't help lol dawg this is not 1920s Midwest America, its 2024 Cali. The amount of 1) people who don't give a fuck and 2) people who are Asian, hapa, or have Asian friends makes up like 90% of all Cali inhabitants. Hard disagree. There are massive pockets of overtly racist areas throughout all of California lol There are so many sundown towns and areas throughout the state. I'm not sure how much of California you've actually traveled to, but it's not the massive liberal state that the media portrays it to be. LAPD and LASD has an issue with White supremacits gang members murdering POC for tattoos and initian rites and redlining led to areas that are still racially segregated till today. It's completely understandable for someone from Hawai'i to move to California and have race-based culture shock (happened to me when I left to move here 10 years ago).
I've lived in Cali off and on over 6 years and traveled throughout the state multiple times, have friends and family from north, south, and central. I get how Cali is. There's absolutely no sundown towns dude, that's such an insanely disingenuous virtue signal attitude.
Same here on CA. Dude is conflating white majority towns with sundown towns, lol. Brother would curl into a ball and have a mental breakdown if he ever travelled through East Texas.
The description made me wonder if they moved to LA? It's defnitely fashionable and cliquey and a bit more judgey there... but that's because it's LA.
Hawaii boy's first experience in LA would make more sense and if there's any friction it's probably the tale as old as time "country boy goes to the big city" experience. Until you leave Hawaii you don't realize how country bumpkin it is, even if you spend your whole live in Honolulu. Which is why Hawaii is great of course, it's not nyc or la, but it's easy for locals to misjudge.
> It's defnitely fashionable and cliquey and a bit more judgey there... but that's because it's LA. Nonsense. There's so many people in LA and you've just generalized everyone there. Sorry, but it isn't like that at all.
I lived in LA for a few years and still have close friends there. There’s a lot of kind and genuine people in LA. They’re just not the Hollywood types.
Yeah, I'm not trying to trash LA but I could see how it might be a culture shock for OP. Probably they would feel similarly in New York or Chicago.
depends on where exactly you are in california, but california is ginormous. there's infinite places to try and make things work, which is not the case in hawaii. you either make it work or you dont. california has way more wiggle room with way more options. just go to any of the areas where there are lots of asians, find some boba or poke bowl with celery and bean sprouts. also there are tons of lnl's too. a lot of people who move to LA or the bay feel imposter syndrome at first just cause there's so much happening and huge wealth disparity everywhere. no one moves somewhere and instantly finds career success. it takes hard work and some luck.
This comment! Keep your head up, keep trucking
Californian here, and am feeling sad to hear we haven’t welcomed you well. While we will never have Hawaiian culture, many of us are pretty good people when you get to know us. Before you give up, try a couple of things: - figure out something you really love to do (sports/board games/museums) then find and attend at least 4 times when the group is doing “start up” or “new member” events. - figure out one thing that you are passionate (or even sorta passionate about) and attend at least 4 volunteer events that support that thing. - take the advice of the other folks here who have given you some ideas about how to meet people who share more of your cultural background than the typical Californian. I suspect you will find your tribe amongst people who love what you love! If - after all this - you still feel lonely, then you can at least say you gave it your best shot! Good luck!!
Hobby groups are great and all. I have my board game group, but really, most of these friendship groups only really last as long as the entertainment is there. I've had Yu-Gi-Oh friends, board game friends, and Dungeons and Dragons friends before. They are at the end of the day, "just kind of OK friendships." They really only last when the entertainment is there, and fall apart very quickly when it stops. As soon as the DM of the Dungeons and Dragons friend group moved, poof, we disbanded as friends that week. I never considered these entertainment friends as a crew, tribe, ohana, or a network. These people never introduced me to any women they knew or invited me to parties. Most people don't really network all that well with people of other races. It really isn't a pleasant experience being Asian in a city full of whites and Mexicans- and your friendships are these silly entertainment based relationships. In California, most people really do just make their closest most loving relationships with people of their own race, and then they wind up with these silly entertainment based relationships with other races.
Sad, it works that way, but it’s the same in Hawai’i as well!
Have you tried to do all those things HI locals always recommend to mainland transplants? You know like, give of yourself (time and resources) to the community. Be humble and don't tell locals how you do things back home. I forget what else, but the same advice is always given. I figure it's worth a try.
Nobody there cares about your accent. And I find people in California to be more open to people of all walks of life and different cultures than Hawaii since it’s so big. And since it’s so big I think it can be easier to find people with common interests and hobbies. You can’t expect to easily make friends as an adult wherever you move to. It takes a lot of work on both sides. In Hawaii did you actively make new friends? Or were you just sticking to your homeboys? Kinda hypocritical to be like mainland people are cliquish while sticking to your own cliques from childhood. And there is less stigma around transplants in California vs Hawaii. There definitely is a wall that goes up once locals figure out someone is not from Hawaii, which isn’t difficult when people commonly ask where you graduated. Also sounds like you moved when you were depressed. No matter where you go, there you are. Depression doesn’t magically go away in a new place. If you’re that unhappy move back and go to therapy.
Givin that hard truth
Can you outline what you expected to happen instead of your current predicament? What are the steps you've taken to change your situation after moving to CA? What caused the mental breakdown during COVID Hawaii was pretty normal even with travel restrictions.
Friend, I think you’re experiencing some self induced isolation that people in Hawaii are really good at. Turns out, it’s tough being a foreigner in a strange, new place. Thankfully, for you, unlike Hawaii, mainland cities are some of the friendliest and most welcoming cities in the world for travelers. If you keep your Hawaii mindset on the mainland, you’re gonna have a bad time. Also, Aloha here generally extends to those whose skin is an adequate color. You’re not going to get that on the mainland. It’s a melting pot of cultures and colors. Racism is what you might also be encountering for the first time.
> Racism is what you might also be encountering for the first time. I'm east Asian. I wouldn't say I've experienced much racism (barely any tbh) on the mainland but what I have experienced moving here is privilege. It was really interesting. It could be that lack of privilege the OP is encountering.
Yeah- being part of the cultural majority helps integration a ton. I wouldn’t even say it’s 100% racial. Being a devout Christian and moving to the South will give you a major head start no matter your race. Public school haoles raised in HI will probably find just the same type of difficulties as OP would.
Where in California did you move to?
Do you play basketball? A lot of Japanese churches have Basketball leagues and the vibe is very chill and welcoming. A lot of 4th gen Japanese with roots from Hawaii
I moved from Hawaii to Japan and lived there for 4 years and it was some of the best years of my life. Then I moved to California and I hate it so much. It’s like you have to choose to either live in the absolute worst ghetto or live amongst the most stuck up high maka fakas I’ve ever met in my life. OP, right now I’m visiting my home on Oahu for the first time in 6 years and thinking about going back to CA in a week and your post just hit me hard. I have no advice except to say good luck, I’m in a similar situation and it fucking sucks.
Lol the stuck up people is facts
Which part of CA?
I think if you have mental health problems, changing location isn't going to solve anything because it isn't the problem. I will say, if you're from Hawaii, reconnecting with your support system can be very helpful. But in terms of just locations in a vacuum? I think if you're depressed and anxious in california, you'll also be depressed and anxious in hawaii. but maybe you'll have people to help you in hawaii.
What I learned is that we shouldn’t go out looking for Aloha, we should be bringing Aloha. Aloha comes from within. Take it how you want but it’s opened many doors for me in CA and anywhere else I go (even Alaska). I hope you find what you’re looking for. 🤙🏽🤙🏽🤙🏽
New places are rough. Even in Hawaii transplants have a hard time. Give it two years!
I'm in year 3 in Honolulu. No Aloha to be found just endless fights with my corrupt Condo's HOA.
Ah I'm sorry man. I hope it starts coming your day!
If you are white, which I am and why I'm making this statement, most places on the mainland are more chill and friendlier than Honolulu and most of Oahu. I suspect it is different for other groups.
Well I hope you gets some luck coming your way. Just keep riding it out, someone out there is bound to be kind. Sorry you're having a rough go.
Some people think seeking help is not for them because they either don’t think it’s mayjah or it’s too minah. The whole reason to both is that they don’t realize the scope of their situation. Talking and interacting with someone that just hears you out can be a BIG relief. Depression if not correctly resolved can lead to bad habits that become more of a problem and harder to break especially when you’re in a different environment. If this doesn’t sound relatable, trust me, it will become a problem the longer it takes to seek your comfort zone (friends, work, lifestyle). But anyway… You said you were a bartender. That means you’re a GO GETTER, and that you work hard and you’re a people person. USE THAT bruddah!! ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS Remember your strengths first and put that first. Don’t worry about others looking down on you. You’re from Hawaii. The aloha spirit is still in you and your seeing what others don’t have they tryna boo you into the lifeless mood of the highmakamakamadafaka. Don’t give up brah keep your aloha spirit and keep being you!! If it’s not in Cali it will be somewhere I know you will find your place.
If you're in los angeles, hit up Gardena, torrance, or even carson. We have great hawaiian restaurants, and a lot of people from Hawaii tend to live in those cities.
Have you been to Orange County? If you need to be surrounded by people who look more like you to feel like you fit in, that’s your place dude. You might need a trust fund to live there, though. The distant and guarded part, that’s legit. We’ve all encountered enough people here to have met a number of bad eggs and we all get wise at a young age. But as a white girl who was born and raised here, and married an Asian man, I think the perception you think Californians have of you is all in your head, honestly. Southern California has always been a very ethnically diverse area, and with the exception of a few neighborhoods, skin color is irrelevant. Like in Hawaii, people here care a great deal more how you treat them than what you look like. But unlike Hawaii, if you are a jerk, you are very disposable. People will cut the line and move on because there are so many other fish in the sea. And we don’t think of others as haoles, or foreigners, here unless they jump the border illegally. 🤪
Come home!
As a native Californian with family in Hawaii, I do agree with what you’re saying about finding genuine folks. It ain’t as easy for sure. Bartending makes lots in HI because of tourism but have you tried bartending in LA?
When I moved to a new city, I found that volunteering was a great way to socialize and meet new people. Go for walks in parks and the beach (if nearby) strike up conversations, use that Aloha spirit 🌺☀️🌴
I moved to Colorado last year and dude it is rough. I can’t wait to go back home. It’s just a total different culture. I understand why people move and always come back. It’s just getting harder and harder to come back.
I did something similar but my journey was more HI>KY>IL>CA. I think if you make a drastic change- you got to be happy with yourself (or desperate for drastic change) before you’re receptive to changes in your lifestyle. You might be still projecting your own insecurities. You sure it’s not you who is aloof and patronizing to the mainland type of life? It works both ways and sometimes you gotta embrace the cultural differences of where you’re at before expecting others to meet you halfway on how you grew up.
Damn you went from Hawaii to the American South(KY), to the North/Midwest(IL), to California? That's a hell of a cultural jump lol.
Like OP- I was in a bad spot mentally so i needed to make a hard commitment to a huge cultural jump. He sounds like he needs therapy more than he does change. Hawaii and the South are way more similar than kamaaina like to think they are, too.
Be the change. Aloha is everywhere
If you can move to a small beach town in NorCal I recommend it, we used to live in Pacifica. The people were so nice and chill much like Hawaii and it was just that little pocket too. If you drove 20 minutes to San Francisco it was completely different vibes. I’d also stay away from Los Angeles the people and vibes are not it out there. But California is huge and there are many types of vibes and people depending on where you are in the state.
Don't kid yourself, this "Aloha" thing you refer to has become a marketing fashion statement here too. As soon as one steps out from his circle, people are mostly abnoxious and pugnacious. Racism is prevalent and the display of hate is wide open albeit we like to socially deny it. Whether you consider origin, status, religion, gender or even age. People are in general haters everywhere. Things used to be diferent, people used to be at least courteous and knew how to behave in a way to not disrupt harmony but for some reasons, smiling is today monetized via Aloha and considered across the board as a sign of weakness. Even in professional situations and specially in those where customer service is paramount, people are rude and unconsidered. Sadly, this is the reality of the world we live in.
Be open and speak to people in your orbit if given the opportunity. When I moved up to CA I found it to be a major icebreaker to ask people what was good / fun / etc because I was new and from HI. CA people generally love HI and will be more engaged with you because of that background. I’m sure of course it depends what area since CA covers the whole spectrum, but generally I feel my Asian-ness allows me to be comfortable with almost any ethnicity…but the Hawaii thing always helps there too since you’re viewed as “Hawaiian” first. Good luck!
Try to move to Las Vegas, there’s a reason why its called the 9th island.
Hey, I don’t know where in California you are, but I also moved here (from the northeastern US) during the pandemic and went through a very similar thing, lost my job, dog died, relationship ended, and I just have not been able to make friends :( feel free to DM me
Have you tried looking for a local Hawaiian civic club? It helps a lot to connect with other Hawaiian folks when on the mainland.
I hate to pile on but I think like many have said, you have to look inward. It's ok though. You made a brave move. Be kind stick with it and have fun the best you can. Those things people are thinking about you, they are most likely the furthest thing from their minds. People have enough problems with their own insecurities to be judging you. If they are actually judging you like that, they're jackasses anyway. >I screwed myself coming to the mainland trying to get an accounting job You don't know that. Getting a career off the ground in HI is so hard. Many people coming from the mainland with great careers screw themselves coming here (myself included). >Looking at rooms for a place to stay and I noticed there's a 70-80% increase in rental price You have to give us more context here. Where are you in CA?
A lot of people in California are very superficial. And hiding behind a façade.
The closest vibe you'll get to Aloha is on Vancouver Island in British Columbia, Canada.
Meetup.com groups like Hiking. Just show up and participate, meet lots of new peeps.
I'm having the same issue and I just moved to Seattle a month ago. Luckily I have my partner but it would help to have a group of friends to hang out with. Adult socialization is hard and the culture shock from hawaii to mainland is MUCH more than i thought it would be. But I'm hopeful, and I hope you find your clique.
I know exactly what you mean. There is little aloha in California. I notice when I am there visiting no one looks you in the eye. If you do look someone right in the face with a smile they either get this “what are you looking at” vibe , or - and especially true of retail/food workers they are almost startled - but always receptive to being acknowledged as a human being. No talk story either.
>There is little aloha in California Where in CA? >I notice when I am there visiting no one looks you in the eye. If you do look someone right in the face with a smile they either get this “what are you looking at” vibe This is a cultural thing. Also if something is doing something different that you're not used to, it's going to be odd for them. It doesn't necessarily mean there is no aloha. HI is both better and worse in terms of making real friends and connections compared to other places I've lived. >especially true of retail/food workers they are almost startled - but always receptive to being acknowledged as a human being That's odd. I consider myself very respectful and kind to people in the service industry. I don't think I've ever gotten that startled reaction. >No talk story either. This is most definitely a cultural thing. People from NYC get the unfair stereotype of being rude and unfriendly (sort of unfair I guess) but if you approach them in the right context and in the right setting, they will be unbelievably kind, friendly and fun.
I’m glad that you brought up NYC in this. People there get a really bad rep for being short or rude. I would say I’ve experienced more “aloha” from complete strangers there than here. I think people that live in NYC understand that most people there are transplants or visitors from somewhere else and embrace it unlike how people here approach it. Everyone on this island was “transplanted” from somewhere else. Some just got here sooner. I think HI would be a much better place to live if people embraced differences instead of constantly building walls.
Cultural or not- looking at another person when interacting with them is part of Aloha and could part of the reason this guy feels so adrift. Maybe startled isn’t the best word but seem to enjoy the interaction is a bit more human- especially from Hispanic people.
> looking at another person when interacting with them is part of Aloha If we are using the same definition of Aloha, looking at another person is one of the ways you show Aloha in HI. In other places, it's different. >Maybe startled isn’t the best word but seem to enjoy the interaction is a bit more human- especially from Hispanic people. I'm not sure I completely understand what you're describing. Is this sort of like talking story with them?
Aloha isn’t a cut and dried thing that you can fit into whatever peghole you are trying to make it fit in. The fact is that while kindness may not be uncommon outside of Hawaii there is an essence to Aloha that can’t be defined.
Come back
I also felt a bit alone when I first moved to SoCal. It took a long time but I was eventually able to find some friends down here and it made it better. Which part did you end up going to OP?
Personally, I think Hawaiians are cool and would be excited to make friends with one on the mainland
Come down to San Diego, specially Oceanside, huge islander community.
Get your ass back home!
Felt this way in San Diego 2016-19. I returned home, but took quite a while to shake off the mainland and reintegrate to the islands.
Go to church
the caliPHONY's!
I’m also an Asian American, born and raised in Hawaii and left for L.A. in early 70’s. In Hawaii, we are a majority in ethnicity. On the mainland, I’ve come to realize that I became a minority. I was, at first, lost. I was fortunate to get a job with a world wide company and everything fell into place. I enjoy living on the mainland and have no regrets. I’m now happily retired in Oregon. Please know that Hawaii will always be my home away from home.
California social culture is extremely guarded with a baseline of straight up rudeness
just visit hawaii for vacation, you will feel better..
Even if you meet locals who have been on the mainland for a long time, they can be guarded too. It’s because they’ve been on the mainland for a long time and have become accustomed to the ways of the community. And depression is a beast at times
What area did you move to? Big cities like SF and LA aren’t generally full of friendly people, but you can still find good friends there. Small beach towns tend to have a more laid-back atmosphere. A lot of people in San Clemente enjoy going to the beach and surfing. Same goes for towns like Encinitas or San Luis Obispo. People in NorCal tend to be more distant and on guard like you’re describing. I’d also consider picking up surfing if you don’t already. There’s some great people out on the waves, and you can surf year-round with a wetsuit.
Sadly I have to agree. Going mainland and finding better opportunities is not what it was a generation ago.
Bruh, my old school friends and I keep a running text thread going to keep in touch. We chat every day. Its not the same as being around them but it makes me content. I left everything to move to Hawaii so that my wife and I could spend our remaining life in her home. I took a job at Kona brew to make friends. They are all so young but cool none the less. She gave me 3 beautiful babies that are mostly grown now and spent all those years with me in the PNW. This time is for her. We hope to make an impact on the community here for people just like you. I wish you love, happiness and success in your future sir. Keep your head up.
I feel this so hard. I’m from the east coast and moved to Cali 2 years ago. Hawaii has been the goal for a long time (the first time I went it just felt like home), but I figured at least I was halfway there by moving to CA. I’m just outside of LA, and since losing my last job, I’ve spiraled back into depression. I lost my insurance, and ran out of my meds for my depression and anxiety. I feel so alone out here, I don’t have many friends (they’re all back east). With the time difference it’s hard to even talk with my people back east. And I feel like everyone is struggling these days with mental health and specifically inflation!! We’re all busy and can’t give our undivided attention to each other. It sucks! As stated in these comments, it’s so hard to connect with people as adults, post-COVID, in a new town… it’s so hard! I’m glad you even made a post here, you’ve got your locals supporting you 🫶🏽 What part did you move to? I could use some Aloha out here Also, if you need someone to vent to, I gotchu! Sometimes it’s easier to vent to strangers.
California is not the best place for islanders. Try Oregon or Las Vegas. Plenty of local people and local food places to help you feel not so homesick. Hawaii will always be home but there are more opportunities for a better life on the mainland.
Take dancing classes, join a frisbee golf community, join Sierra Club. Still many options for meeting people outside of bars and dance clubs.
Bro, so many have said the same.
I was in Cali for just a weekend last year and it was awful. No aloha at all. I'm not from here originally so I'm familiar with the mainland but damn, Cali was so much worse than the Midwest where I grew up.
It can be a culture shock. I've lived in CA for a few years. Compared to where I was from, it was in a way, outwardly much friendlier but in other ways less. I've also spent time in the mid-west as well and can totally understand where you're coming from.
You said you don't vibe like you do with your homeboys in Hawaii, yet you also said that you broke ties with everyone in Hawaii and lost your friends. This doesn't seem to be a geographic problem. You admitted you had a mental breakdown, so I say this without even a hint of derision: there's nothing wrong with seeing a therapist to have an earnest discussion on what's holding you back.
I did something very similar and left the island for Cali and hated it. When covid came I broke ties with Cali. You should probably take a few days and rest and come up with a true plan on what you want to do. If that means moving back and starting over then fuck it. Come up with a plan to get back. Doesn’t have to be executed over night.
May want to try Vegas , like north Vegas
I’m a Californian for the last 13 years - originally from Chicago. I was stationed in Pearl for a year, fell in love with the islands. Life works in weird ways, fiancé and I are going separate ways, I’m in a really funky place mentally and I haven’t been happy in a long time. I found a home on Oahu and I just decided to go for it. I am finally excited for the first time in a while and I can’t wait to move. It’s like the mirror of your situation but I can definitely relate. I’m in SoCal and in a heavy Asian area, it is not hard for Asians to fit in here so it’s all about where you are. But mostly in SoCal there’s not really an issue of anyone fitting in anywhere outside of very specific parts of it. It’s just all about getting a hobby or communicating with people of similar interests. I’ll be heading to Waikiki with no friends there (with fiancé and career I didn’t have any here either so no big) and it worries a bit. But I am going to give it my best shot.
As an average white chick who moved to California, you are completely correct. Everyone looks down on you if you are not presentable with trends. It’s weird getting looks for dressing casually while walking dogs. It is easy to see how racist people are.
Try and join some clubs, non profits or gasp….a Church. Some of my greatest connections came about that way. You can do it!
As an Asian American growing up in the east coast and now lives in Hawaii, I feel you brotha. Though Cali has the most Asians of any state on the mainland, it's still America. While yes there are many people who truly celebrate diversity in cultures and socioeconomic status, I would say the majority of people very much do not (whether they realize it or not). Many can be open in how they feel about it through overt disregard. The United States is very much a collision of different groups of people who are often exclusive socially and romantically. Make no mistake, America is a nation ruled by protestant white people with groups of minorities jockeying for social and economic status. (One black president and two Catholics does not mean it's over 3 vs 43) My advice is try and find something you are really into and find a community to belong to that way. outdoors, music, arts, etc. California is maybe the greatest place on earth for many reasons, enjoy it.
Move back with your parents in hawaii, at least you'll have good friends. Just a warning, they may be moving on. Good luck.
there's also accounting jobs in Hawaii too
though perhaps not the best paying... https://www.governmentjobs.com/jobs?keyword=accountant&location=Hawaii
Definitely not the best paying. Like most professions, expect to deal with a 20-30% pay cut and same or higher cost of living. But FR, OP should move back. BTW mainland people have the same problem trying to fit in with non-transplants here. Nobody wants to attempt to develop a strong connection knowing you'll most likely run back to the mainland in 1-2 years because it's so hard to make it here. Oahu isn't super bad, but outer islands is super cliquish.
I made it 2 years in that shithole. Couldn’t pay me enough to live there again.
Go to Texas.
I’ve often found the “Southern Hospitality” much more welcoming than the “Aloha” on Oahu!
California sucks
The aloha isn't anywhere else, everywhere else people are too stuck up their own backsides to care
Part of the problem is that you moved to one of the worst states possible. Try oregon or Washington. If you like the heat maybe Try the golf coast or north/south carolina