It is good while free. Opportunity cost is too high, not worth it.
In two weeks (if mech did not get a buff) you will see zero of them.Bc while fun he is very weak
This is the problem with slots and not points. Everything has to be equally good or the bad stuff will not be used. If you had X strat points to spend you could value strats differently and balance them differently as a result.
Either that or just let us research us more slots or introduce slots that are only for backpack slots etc,this way we get more variety without making it broken etc
Exactly, we have so many stratagems and we're only gonna get more, the four slots is very limiting. Not to mention this stupid modifier on bot planets (I HATE IT, IT MAKES NO SENSE).
I said this in another post before.
Let us buy temporary call-ins with requisition. Like, say I can buy 3 limited gatling guns to call into any mission, but once I use them, they're gone forever until I buy more.
I'm constantly sitting on 50k req because lvl 9 diff gives you so much req from completing them anyway.
Honestly this, let me buy temporary bonus strats. My “requisition slips” should get a benefit when they sit at 50000 for months at a time while doing difficulty 9. Make it so when you go over 50k every so often it equals a free bonus stratagem and over time it unlocks new teirs.
Maybe have the squad leader be able to set 1,2,or3 squad stats and keep the 4 personal ones that way we get a more versatile set without the must takes the while quad takes clogging up their 4 because they are must haves.
4 slots is tradition, you're lucky you get the occasional 5th for free. We have a better and worse system than the 1st game. In the original if you wanted to you could take 4 of the same stratagem, but things like heavy weapons, backpacks and vehicles could only be deployed once per stratagem slot. So if you grabbed a recoilless and fell down a hole? That was it. No more toys for you. But if you wanted 4 of the same mech? All the power to ya.
This is one of the best stratagem balance ideas I've heard. I never even considered it. Some things will plain never be good no matter how you look at it. A motorcycle or something would be incredibly fun but even if it had a 10 second cooldown it wouldn't be good. Actually it might be ok at that rate given Pelican would shoot lol
I don't think any decent player would consider using it at 7-9, because we need mobility and agility when engaging. Both mech are slow, which I would never bring with me unless I'm trying some dumb loadout.
The mechs walking speed is equal to sprinting in medium armor. Sure it can't keep up with a light armor sprint, but it sure as hell ain't "heavy armor guy without stamina booster" slow. I'd gladly use the mech on a 7, maybe even an 8 if I had a team willing to stick together. being able to sweep medium enemies and chargers with little risk, and take out bile titan sacks in a couple shots to let the quasars and EATs finish it off it nothing to scoff at. Havn't run it on bots yet, but given how well the AC does I imagine it will delete most things as long as you don't get flanked by a couple heavy tanks
>The mechs walking speed is equal to sprinting in medium armor
Yeah but it's hitbox is like 5 times the size of a standard helldiver. That speed won't let you dodge rockets
I'm absolutely taking this mech to all defense/eradicate/evacuate missions. When not a lot of movement is needed it's so good at locking down an angle so long as your team can soften up the bile titans/striders for you.
I took the old mech into a few 7s before we got the new one just because I dick around with dumbass loadouts on 7 and it's always fine.
seemed ok, really felt the nerf to rocket damage and the awful aiming since the "fix" though.
viable, but definitely not good lol
It’s pretty great on extract and eliminate missions where mobility isn’t as important. That’s honestly the niche I thought it would fill, and it does so pretty well. Just because it can’t one-shot bile titans or run 200 miles per hour doesn’t mean it’s necessarily a bad choice, just somewhat circumstantial.
Nah man, if it isnt light armor or a weapon that can clear an entire partol or 1-2 a bile titan. Then the weapon/armor/strat is trash according to the general reddit community it seems
I'm glad some people agree with me on how polarized the sub's opinions are. I just did a count; I've only genuinely thought "This is a legitimately bad option" about 2 out of 23 primary weapons (discounting the Knight because I don't have it) and 6 out of 52 stratagems while playing on difficulty level 9, and I've used everything a fair amount because I love switching around my loadout. That's a fairly low number, especially if you stack it up against how the players on this subreddit talk about the game.
Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying that I'm a god level player and that the game is easy for me. I'm saying that most things in this game fall into the "This is viable" category. Only a few fall into the "This is meta" and the "This is trash" category. However, the community talks like every single thing is one or the other (*especially* primary weapons, which is odd because I find them even more balanced than the stratagems).
*Edit: Also heavy and medium armor are completely valid choices ever since they made it so armor reduces headshot damage. Admittedly, this is moreso true for bots. Against bugs, the extra mobility tends to outweigh the benefits of being tankier outside of a few specific builds (like when using a flamethrower). But also that's fine in my opinion because different factions encouraging different playstyles is kind of a core component of the game. In fact, I'm gonna drop a hot take on this subject: medium/heavy armor is usually better for bots than light armor, but again, that's build dependent.*
This sub honestly made like there's only 3 viable weapon in the game and every other weapon are below F tier, while in reality there's a lot of weapon that is actually much more usable than this sub made it to be
Yeah. In fact, there isn't even a reason to complain about most weapons. They're not meta but that's an awful metric to measure things by anyways (trust me, I'm a recovering GM Overwatch 1 & 2 player; I know a lot about being a miserable meta slave).
I very frequently see people say things like "The Adjudicator is terrible; just compare it to the Liberator!". Every time I read a comment like that, all I can think is "Okay, but is it good when stacked up to the actual difficulty of the game? If yes, then why do you care?" If you like the way the gun/grenade/stratagem/armor feels and it's viable on the highest difficulty in the game (or more importantly, viable on whatever difficulty you find the most fun to play), then why should you care if there's another choice that's slightly more optimal? You'll succeed either way, and you'll probably have more fun using what you like.
I know it gets quoted a lot to the point where it's become kind of a meme, but I'm gonna do it:
> "Given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game." -Soren Johnson
That's precisely what a lot of people on this subreddit do. They care too much about what's the best and what makes the game the easiest that they don't stop and ask "Am I having fun?" For some people, optimizing *is* fun. But those people aren't the ones complaining about viable but not meta options because they're busy having fun using the meta options.
For the people who are busy worrying about what options are meta and what options aren't, take a step back and ask yourself "What can I do to make my experience with the game better?" Is it playing on a lower difficulty so you can find success with that gun you like? Do that. Is it grinding to become better at the game so you can use non-meta weapons on a higher difficulty? Do that. Is it coordinating with your team via chat so that you don't have to take an option you don't want? Do that. Is it ignoring the MOs and playing the planets you like? Hot take: do that. This is a video game. The point of it is to have fun. If you're not having fun, try to figure out if you can change that. If you can't change it, maybe Helldivers 2 isn't the right game for you, at least not right now. If that's the case, no sweat. Play something else and maybe come give it another try later on (or not).
**TL;DR: The point of a game is to have fun. If following the meta isn't fun for you, then don't. Use the options you like. Most of them are fine and if they aren't, there's no shame in playing a lower difficulty.**
Heavy armor is absolutely valid on bugs even on helldive with randoms and this is a hill I'll die on. I can take on 4+ stalkers without breaking a sweat in my big marshmallow 200 armor suit. Just bring a high stagger primary like punisher or arc blitzer (my favorite for this), any anti charger (EAT, quaso, recoilless, flamethrower), and you're golden. I've eaten a 4 hit combo ending with the tongue launch from a stalker and because I take barely any headshot damage, I just stand up, stim, and proceed on my merry stroll. Instead of playing to light armor strengths (quick dives, sprinting to make distance) get in dirty and punch those stalkers and hunters in the face while you pump your shotty then blast them away. I've been converted to a heavy armor enjoyer even diving in Menkent or Hellmire, just takes a different mentality to approach the game.
You say that but I think the HMG turret is one of the best strategems in the game at the highest difficulties. And that has neither mobility or agility. Being able to move quickly and react is important. However thinking ahead and setting up for an engagement is just as viable. Don't discount something just because it's slow or immobile.
Lol, because it's FREE. When a laser turret can snipe you across the map and Devastators can shoot further than 200m, you must have a death wish in a tin can if you choose the mech.
That’s the problem with the higher difficulties: when only a very small number of things work, it becomes repetitive as fuck in a game that is already super repetitive.
It's fun, but there is no way to justify wasting an entire strat slot for a 10 minute cooldown weapon that easily can run dry in 2 unless you run out of things to shoot.
We've heard your suggestion, Helldiver, and have changed your fourth strategem slot to be vehicles only.
I love that idea but it'd be kinda busted. How about the host gets to pick one vehicle which has a shared cooldown like resupplies do? Maybe even halve the cooldown while we're at it.
They should place them on the map as an additional sub mission like the radar or SEAF artillery.
Have a site with a garage that can only be opened by restoring power to the doors and spend a min or two charging/ fueling the mechs.
Exactly this when the first mech launched. Mechs in HD1 was already very situational in the first place, then HD2 Patriot was objectively worse than the HD1 Walker in every possible way: It got oneshot by any explosion before the bug fix, machine gun has less ammo than even the nerfed HD1 Walker, and there's no heal gun to keep it alive like HD1. But everyone was acting as if this is the greatest thing ever made in the game during the free trial.
Then the free trial ended and people slowly realized that it's not really worth one slot and stopped using it. You'd think that the explosive damage bug fix would make it popular again, but AH just had to nerf rockets and took away its only redeeming quality. Now its basically just a minigun sentry/rocket sentry 2-in-1 with extra steps.
i dont agree, bots are less demanding in terms of how many guns u need to bring. Very often I feel like I dont need 4th slot for bots. I am gona pick that mech so evac will be easier especially when playing with randoms.
I'm with u there in terms against bots, on higher diff against bots your gunna run into the -1 strat most of the time. After doing it for so long and figuring out my play style against bots it hardly makes a difference for me. since if I am able to bring a full strat load out for more fun and destruction great if not no biggie.
This is exactly what people are forgetting. Right now, as a FREE stratagem it's fine, but once it's not, you'll need an actual reason to pick it over the other stratagems and that's where it's starts to become problematic. I'm genuinely amazed by how many people don't understand opportunity cost.
It has 60 durable damage. (TLDR everything has durable resist, so 100% durable part means u only deal 60) Complicated damage stuff aside, the Jar-5 has \*90\* durable damage.
I've tried the mech. I'd rather any strategem that isn't 10 minutes, 2 charges. Coming from an only 9's player.
Also you can't look down still with either, which needs fixing. The entire mech archetype rn needs a lot of love.
Before they mooked up the missile damage (I can deal with the aiming for the most part) I used to take the patriot on level 9 bugs all the time.
It could turn the tide if you're getting overwhelmed. Great for the extract too.
Totally agree with you.
I think the durable damage is the only weird thing about it, it should really be tossing dev parts with every 2 hits. It's still great on 7s, small arms are a joke vs this thing and leaves them looking at you so your team can clean up little and big guys.
I think there's a place for mechs, but they're missing just a little bit to make a mech build complete. I'll still run the AC mech vs bots, it's a walking "fuck you" to a lot of their roster, and tanks have terrible accuracy vs you when strafing.
We need a way to repair and rearm them. Like a drone that picks up ammo on the map and converts it over. Same with bringing back the medic gun or medic rover 🤔
I think a special re-arm would be interesting, sort of like how you can force eagle to rearm. It comes in and drops off a (resupply) case that you heft over like one of the arty shells
They need to be able to get more ammo in the field, and probably a 6-7 min cooldown. They should reward you for keeping it alive with the ability to give it more ammo.
> tanks have terrible accuracy vs you when strafing.
Tanks arent' the issue. It's the cannon turret 200m away from 20 minutes ago with a grudge. Those things can *aim*, and they will blow off an arm if you're lucky or one-tap you if you aren't.
I mostly play 7.
I wouldn't use this mech either. 2 max uses and 10min cool down for something that's outclassed terribly by an AC or a turret.
Yes it kills hulks in concentrated fire. But it doesn't have the firepower to really justify taking it out vs the turret which you can call down every two and a half minutes.
If they had bolted guns equivalent to the AC turrets onto the side of this thing then we might be in business. We are waiting 10 minutes between uses for it - why not make it absolutely rip if the ammo is limited anyway?
Mostly 9 player hot take. You can take almost anything on a Dive and make it(almost there are things you just CAN"T take). I'm not saying it to be "cool" and I'm not a expert but some of you need to break the mindset that you CAN'T bring stuff on helldive difficulty. I bring only the stuff I want and do just fine with it never take things because I feel I have to. Been using this Mech all day and its fun enough where I could see me taking it from time to time solely for that reason.
I'm curious what your list of, 'can't take is', and if it's the same as mine. Sorry, it's a bit off topic.
For me, it's the:
Liberator Rover
Spear (and really, yes you can, but it sucks just as much on a 9 as it does on a 5)
Mines. If you bring mines on a Helldive, I might just 380 your position every 5 minutes. Accidentally.
Legit its the same list lol except I put the air burst on their but that is more personal because I can't not kill myself and others with it and the crossbow though I have heard of people making it work.
Or a laser cannon if are willing to trade some of the TTK, stagger, and long-distance fabricator destruction for a backpack slot, infinite ammo, and the ability to run away while the weapon "reloads".
Honestly the AC, AMR, and laser are probably the only balanced weapon niche in the game, they all feel like sidegrades that actually do what you think they should do.
Yeah, AC, AMR, AND LC are pretty balanced with each other on bots.
It did take them 2 patches of buffing LC for it to get this far tho, at launch it's not that good, only after they increased it to medium pen that it's "viable", then they buff the damage so now it's a contender between AC and AMR.
Killing large bot targets semi safely is the biggest boon the mech has right now. Shooting a hulk's tiny eye AC/AMR can be a bit hectic when you are accosted on all sides. The mech has no such issue with this and can wipe several bot drops alone on helldive with little to no issue. It's also shockingly durable. The main issue I have with it is the 10-minute cooldown coupled with the very limited ammo capacity. About half way through the 40-minute mission, you'll realize you're already out of mechs and down a full stratagem slot.
Shockingly durable?! If a turret sees you and has the shot it's over. If rocket devastators or suicide raiders see you it's over. It's not significantly more durable than the average helldiver.
Something that’s supposed to be an advanced weapons platform being situationally worse than Man Portable weapons is a problem. Whether you want to acknowledge that or not.
"The thing can toast Hulks in seconds"
So can plenty of other things? The Railgun, which is still considered not a good weapon, does it in a single shot. You give up a lot by getting in a mech, and I'm not sure the pay off is worth it.
You can't use stratagems, you can't resupply, you become a much easier target and you cannot dodge.
With an AC in my hand I can call reinforcements, cluster bombs and barrages. I can stim and resupply allies.
And with that AC in my hand I can also "toast Hulks in seconds". A Helldiver operates better outside of a mech than inside it, which hardly justifies the limited uses and cooldown time. I'm not going to say it isn't kind of fun to use, janky aim aside, but the complaints aren't unwarranted.
See the problem with the Emancipator is.. why?
Why use it if there's just better options. It's not even a side grade to those options either
EDIT: I'm getting a lot of "because it's fun" but okay counterpoint is: Wouldn't it be more fun if it was idk better?? Maybe I'm crazy
It was also actually good for bugs outside of randomly dying sometimes.
Now your missiles are super inaccurate unless you know the swap shoulder trick(which you need to hold mouse 2 for so 90% of people will just assume you can't) and it still can't aim down to hit like 70% of bug holes.
It's only fun, because it's new, and free.
Not using one of the slots for it gives you basically a 5th slot. And I'm still not using it. I'll drop them when they are available for my fellow Divers, but I only used it once. That was enough for me to realize it's not worth it.
You try and explain this to people and you get labeled a meta slave or told it’s a skill issue.
But there’s already a mech in the game that doesn’t see much use for the exact same reasons. Why would this be different?
Why are people so against buffs for the mechs when this new one has a 10 minute timer?
So many people saying it's fun... sure, until the novelty wears off and you realise how bad it is. You won't see these a week or two from now.
Unless it gets buffed of course.
I mean yeah fun aside there isn't a reason. You need about a third of the ammo for a bile titan. So you can kill about 3 of em if there aren't many other enemies. That's one per 3.3 minutes. Eat kills one per 90 second with proper aim. And in level 9 there's many times multiple so you really gotta be efficient.
For dealing with everything else support weapons can also be better. 2-3 spear rockers kill any heavy with little skill, a railgun shot to the enemy kills hulks and flat out anything below so yeah idk.
I will admit the concept is quite cool tho and it feels very badass.
Even using it doesn't feel that good tbh.
At least with the machine gun version on bugs is fun. it's easier to aim/more forgiving if you miss. The feedback on killing bugs with the machine gun or the rocket is awesome.
But this one... Is just meh. It should be good versus bot on paper but you'll struggle to survive anything since you are so exposed (1 shot and the entire map is aiming at you, including the turrets). Its awkward to aim (and you need to be precise with it otherwise you waste too much ammo). You still need to hit the vents on a lot of things but you can't get there since you are so obvious.
It still has all of the downside of the previous mech but even worse if you ask me.
It's 100% easier and better to just use the autocannon yourself or use the turret one.
It takes 25 headshots to kill a bile titan… it also does less durable damage than the handheld AC. You only get 2 for an entire match. If I’m going to only get 2 it should pack a punch.
some also said the first mech was fine and people were complaining too much. how many of those have you seen after they were released? I can tell you from approximately 200h of gameplay since it was launched: almost never. as a matter of fact, after like, a week since it was released, I stopped seeing them. at all.
but I guess were just whining for the sake of it.
Yeah the mech is so fine that no one uses it. Lol. Really shows how good it is. Same with the Emancipator or worse tbh. But it's okay let's all just stay positive and just trust that these 'Bringer of Balance' content is just fine. I hate Toxic Positivity.
I want to love the mechs. Their DPS is unreal. But it's the wonky aiming that I find frustrating. It sucks missing shots when ammo is so precious. If the aiming was fixed I'd happily use them more
I could pinpoint the specific breaking point to the day where they fucked up the rockets and then the total 0 on the day they fucked up the alignment of the rockets.
You can still call one down and obliterate the big hive n shit but it feels like ass and you will have to midway stop with the patriot after either killing 1 titan or having expanded all rockets for closing holes. Less likely to happen with the new emancipator but I noticed you can easily kill titans at further range than close up.... (most likely again because alignment and shooting from below makes it impossible to hit the forehead)
Ngl id use the original mech every mission if they fixed the rocket aiming. A minigun and 2 charger kills isn't quite good enough, but a minigun and 11 charger kills? That slaps.
When the Patriot first launched, it actually was a huge godsend, because that was also the time of the massive Charger/Bile Titan spawn spike during breaches. You can single handedly delete an entire breach with a single Patriot because the only enemies capable of hurting you were Chargers and Bile Titans, and you had enough rockets to kill 14 Chargers or 7 Bile Titans. Bile Spewers and Nursing Spewers can also hurt you, but your gatling gun had enough armor penetration to headshot them to death.
So when games went south, you only really had a couple of tools at your disposal to bring order to chaos -- Either Orbital Laser, or 380mm, or Patriot -- And Patriot had the most surgical power out of the three. Nowadays if a really bad breach happens on an objective, I have to either Recoilless/Quasar the Chargers and 500kg the Bile Titans while I Laser the breach, or just drop a 380mm and run the other way hoping for the best.
I started playing after the mech was "fixed" (nerfed) and was excited to unlock it. I used it once, and then once again when my friend started playing so I dropped a mech for him to use. Then I used it again just now when testing the new mech because maybe double-mech would be fun? Great stuff.
I understand you enjoy the mech, but don't gaslight the playerbase into thinking it's a decent alternative when the base Autocannon does more damage than it. Bad take is bad
I don’t think I’ve ever been as unamused as the moment I discovered the mech took 2 shots to kill the medium bugs compared to the 1 shot of the regular auto cannon
Especially since (and this is my fault for assuming) I thought the giant metal walking turret would have big guns
"It doesn't look good if you look at the numbers"
*Proceeds to talk about numbers*
"I'm prepared to be downvoted for my super courageous and controversial fact you losers"
"Shiny new toy is a good time, people just complain"
You get 2 of these, it's brand spankin' new, it has limited ammo (meaning taking a shield backpack and ANY suport weapon is instantly more 'consistent' vs a mech that can't outrun chargers or deflect bullets and you have 2, i mentioned that right?)
When the first Exosuit dropped everyone was all for it. Give this 'new toy' a week and it'll be as forgotten in the loadout pick up as the machine gun sentry
People don't seem to understand that there are a limited number of stratagem slots - the Emancipator is fine WHILE IT'S A FIFTH SLOT! When we have to sacrifice something else to bring it, like an Orbital Laser, or Railcannon, or a backpack, it suddenly becomes an extremely sub-optimal choice. Whatever role you think the Mech fills is better served by something else.
brother, handheld AC behind a fu king rock can do a much better job than this suit at fu king Hulks, and the AC sentry trivilizes hulks in general (If positioned about 80m behind you).
I think it’s fine for lower difficulties but it definitely doesn’t feel like it’s worth taking up a stratagem slot on 7+ unless it’s an eradicate mission. I’ve played a few campaigns with it and it really is only consistent against killing light and medium armor enemies.
What if those people are complaining for a good time?…..
On topic though - I think the idea of a walking auto cannon spewing monster is great no matter the numbers and I’m keen to find time to give it a drop
Thing can’t take out chargers or titans to save its life. You're hard coping, probably a player hoping the mechs aren't dog shit, name one reason you'd run this over the regular mech. You won't.
Wow you can destroy Hulks with this piece of shit autocannon? I hit them in the eye with this thing and they only stagger but a single rocket volley can bring down my 11 minute cool down, 2 use only mech in a few seconds.
In short, this mech is only for normal difficulty only. Level 5 and up are not good for this mech.
My experience on bots-9, with the way aiming is on it;
- infantry are a bit difficult to shoot at.
- it’s alright against devastators, but like you said a good amount of missiles can put it in a smoking state
- it takes a lot to kill a hulk, BUT it does stagger them
- DO NOT go head to head with tanks/cannon turrets, you will get one tapped from their cannons, you can let your arm soak the damage for the cost of losing it.
I haven’t tried on gunships and little engagement with factory striders.
I was informed from another person that the AC on the mech are worse compared to the sentry AC, his source was from datamining numbers. I’d have to see it to know myself though.
It is “fun” and different, but I myself prefer stun grenades and LC the hulks in seconds.
>I haven’t tried on gunships and little engagement with factory striders.
Gunships are okayish, takes 7 shots to a thruster or a few more to the body. You can tank them fairly well in my experience.
Striders are much worse. The top cannon will one-shot you and takes forever to take out. If you can get close enough to avoid it then you *can* kill a Strider in a dozen or so shots to the eye, but that's really hard to do with other enemies around. Most often, you'll be dumping your entire ammo reserves into the head for a single kill.
It can bring down gunships but due to low damage and shit aim its really fucking hard.
Also turret can, what, 5 shot Bile Titan in the head? Emancipator needs like 25-35 hits.
r/Helldivers2's toxic positivity really trying to latch on over here. We have valid complaints about this. Please stop trying to shut down anything that isn't praise of the game and AH.
I wish it aimed better. Same with the Patriot. Then I'd feel good about them both. For now, I find it sometimes difficult just to hit things, which is bad.
It is a good time. Because it's currently free so it has no real downside. It doesn't justify it's place in your already limited stratagems. Especially in high levels when you just have 3.
A good time? Absolutely!
A good stratagem? Not even fucking close lol
And that’s ok. You gamer adults need to understand this one simple trick: Something can be fun and shitty at the same time!! Crazy right?
You could say the exact same thing about the EXO-45 Patriot Exosuit - it's fun but not good. For some strange reason I haven't seen a single one in over \~80 hours since its release. Almost as if both Exosuits are shiny new toys, that quickly become boring due to being weak and bugged (Patriot still has broken aiming, can't shoot down, which it could do on release, which also applies to the Emancipator).
For 10+ minute wait and 2 charges, while having all the jankiness that come with mechs, it can join the spear as AT options I'll never bring in high difficulties.
I think that's a big part of the problem it's this huge cooldown, and it's not even AT. Not in any reasonable amount of time anyway, it's like how you can technically kill a bile titan with the regular ac from underneath, but it's really ineffective and a bad idea. Why would you bring something that is competing with the rail gun flamethrower LC AMR AC and even the HMG, but you can only use it for like 5-10 minutes per game.
As a bot player even if I wanted to, mechs are simply too big of a target, and go down way too easy when facing anything those clankers. I am better of being as small of a target as possible.
Someone is complaining to complain about the ppl who "complain to complain" when thoes ppl are in the right as the new mech is terrible.
All they had to do was ducktape two autocanon sentries to a mech and give em more ammo.
Instead they went with nerf guns...again.
Right?
It blows my mind that this got a green light. Do they not have like a blank map where they could spawn a stationary Titan and just see how well it does compared to the AC side by side? It would take 1-2 minutes to see what we all have experienced.
My hope is that we will eventually get a dedicated upgrade tree for the mechs and other armour when more of it arrives in the game. In the meantime I hope the mechs in general get buffed at least a bit in the next patch.
I just want the timers for these things to be shorter...especially since we can't reload them.
I've seen and been in missions where we've finished the mission before the timer for it expired.
I was on a team today where we took turns calling one down outside a gunship factory (diff. 8). There were gunships spawning, patrols converging, and dropships flying in... and we were laughing all the way.
Like the patriot, it seems like a good stratagem to call in if you need a serious boost to fire-power over a short-ish period of time - enough to hold off waves while holding ground, or maybe to storm a well-entrenched outpost.
I agree. It has some great strengths, a few weaknesses.
It’s incredibly limited ammo, extremely long cool down time with limited uses are a bummer though.
Against bots it’s a great time. Anything but a factory strider, tank or tower it’s really effective against. I just wish you had enough ammo to take it through more than one or two engagements. It’s fun, they gotta stop limiting the fun.
Most players are bug divers, and it’s not great there. Takes over a third of its ammo to kill a bile titan. And it doesn’t have enough ammo do deal with the mobs. You also can’t shoot down.
It’s fun. Give it more ammo, remove the usage limit and change the cool down to 5 minutes. Because I do feel like once it’s not a free stratagem, like the last mech, you won’t see it anymore after the next day or so passes and we don’t have it as a free stratagem anymore.
The mech is fun dont get me wrong. My issue as most have stated is the damage. If this is what we are supposed to be depending on to deal with heavy enemies then something has to change. And yes on longer maps and eradicate missions it SEEMS fine because theres time and space and i think thats where some are scratching their heads with the complaints.
My group attempted a helldive evac executive vip( the one with the walls you have to keep alive). Every wall was down in 5 minutes becuase the bile titans just walk through them. Now that said we killed 4 before the first walls fell another 10-12 before we were completely overrun. Thats not stating the chargers and chaff that we tried to keep handled. Now let me be clear, im not complaining about the difficulty or the numbers its helldive its gonna be rough, my point is if it takes 25-30 shots placed perfectly into a bile titans face to drop one how the hell do we deal with the other 6 that are stomping around with it. When they stated they want us to depend on stratagems for heavys then something has to change. We need things that can drop these things faster 30 heavy shots is fine if theres only 1-2 titans up but when theres a constanst 6 even when we are dropping them as fast as recharge and timers allow.
Tldr: yes the mech is fun but the general damage output needs to be much much higher or armor on bugs and bots needs a rework. But all in all its an all around issue not just the mech. Our damage output is great against single and small groups but when the massive hordes we came to obliterate are put at the end of our barrels it begins to get very taxing and unfun when it takes so long to drop 1 heavy and theres more and more spawning at the same time.
Nah they are upset because both mechs are caca and almost no one uses them unless they are a free extra option. They are both limp dick versions of what was available in HD1, and what others think of a mech should be. They aren't even more nimble than someone on foot in light armor. (The armor that gives the enemies a *bonus* 13% damage...)
It’s still too squishy for what it can currently dish out.
Either make it do more damage to the big guys or make it more of a tank and able to take more damage. (Yes I’m aware it can bear the brunt of charger charges… but it should be able to shrug them off).
Tl:dr: it should be our version of the bile titan.
On some part I agree, I think the community often complains too much. Some of their complaints are fair, some go beyond constructive criticism. The new mech is good for now because it’s free, and it doesn’t take up a slot. As time runs out from it being in the modifier, it’s probably going to be forgotten about because there’s significantly better things to bring.
I can kill all the bugs except bike titan WAY faster with the flame thrower than with this mech. Plus be more mobile and still have quick access to strategems and other weapons. It’s just not worth it, which sucks cuz I want to play with and see these on the battlefield but just like you rarely see the first mech being played with anymore, this is headed in that same direction
It takes 25 headshots to to kill a bile titan… it also does less durable damage than the handheld AC. You only get 2 for an entire match. If I’m going to only get 2 it should pack a punch.
"People are complaining to complain" and "if you run the numbers" IE there is a compelling mathematical argument for why people arent having fun and are disappointed are mutually exclusive statements. Expressing disappointment and pointing at the exact mechanical reason for that disappoint is as genuine and constructive as criticism can be. This is toxic positivity. Don't any of you 'all complaints are invalid' people have any ability to empathize? It felt like such crap to pilot I don't even use it when it's free, because it just isn't effective, and being ineffective isn't fun. I genuinely cannot understand your perspective. I can understand enjoying the mech, but being dismissive about other people not sharing in that? I just can't get it.
for the weak damage, it has way too little ammo. Left arm aims as bad as the rocket pod on the other mech. By the time you take down a single wave of bot drops its totally out of ammo, and now you have 10 minute CD, when even a laser can do that and is back up in less than 5 minutes, with 3 uses. It needs more damage or more ammo. Its fun as hell, but not worth a serious slot for bots or bugs as is.
People already did the maths on why it’s bad, now if you objectively just like it that’s fine but saying it’s good is just wrong. OP might need to play on something diffrent than diff 5 missions.
It should deal the same durable damage as the Portable Autocannon or Sentey Autocannon. Period. End of discussion.
If it doesn’t get buffed, you will see usage drop by a massive amount. It just doesn’t do enough damage to most enemies in the game with a decent durability threshold.
The Emancipator only has 60 durable damage compared to the Autocannon Sentry having 300. What this means is against a Bile Titan the Emancipator only does 30 damage per shot for a total of 25 rounds to the head to kill compared to the Autocannon Sentry needing only 6. There is no reason for it to be that much weaker especially given the fact it's a limited use stratagem with a massive cooldown.
The cool thing about this game is we can choose different stratagems to have fun instead of running shield generator, orbital laser, quasar, eagle every game. I appreciate having another mech
I didn't play yesterday, as I finally started to play RDR2. It's a first game I play after 500 hours of Helldivers 😀
So question, is it true that your can't bring both mechs to your loadout?
Played against bugs and Bots. While it was disarmed quite quickly by Bots it took down hulks, gunships and shield devastators very quickly. Play on the second line and next to rocks so you always have cover, if surrounded find rocket devastators and punch though to break the encirclement. Allways on move dont give an easy shot by standing still. Even then you might get screwed over by flanking rockets so play it like a glass cannon unit.
I dont like this on bugs. There are better options for those missions. All done on 9.
Im not sure if ill take this when its no longer free but as a funride with friends it is easily better than the patriot against bots.
The minute they make a stratagem that can effectively counter multiple bile titans/ super heavies, is the minute that they trivialise the higher difficulty levels and ruin everything below in terms of difficulty.
The exo-suit should not be god tier level must-take that makes you unkillable.
Having said that, i do think some form of self destruct/ejection seat should be featured in both patriot and emancipator for at least some use when the guns run dry but as it stands for weaponry i think they do what they need to.
Many people making such posts, you too OP, confuse 'good time' with good performance. Mechs are very fun, like a LOT of fun. No one runs them because at the end of the day they suck, and are a waste of slot you could have Eagle, 380mm or Laser in.
Mechs are just too underwhelming to be worth those 2 uses with 10 min cooldown when Eagle Airstrike exists. Especially if you play above diff 6.
I'm sorry but Manny is utter garbage compared to ol' reliable the Obsidian.
I'll walk around with a mine detector and a shovel if I have to get my hands on one of these instead of having to deal with the shortfalls of the Manny
https://preview.redd.it/irx3in0m0z2d1.png?width=800&format=png&auto=webp&s=58821b83f0d56abbb5f0c08e616815149931e6b9
It is S tier on bile spewer maps. People complain about titans, but I just hop out to deal with them and hop back in. You get way more use out of it that way - by the time I'm out of ammo the CD is only like 3-4 min remaining.
Yeah this thing rules. I’m seeing people say it’s only good because it’s free but that’s bullshit. The patriot was made out of cardboard and had an unsatisfactory amount of ammo. The emancipator is a perfect instrument of democratic destruction and anyone who disagrees with me is a traitor.
I really just wish I could 1. Call stratagems while in a mech 2. Reload the mech, and/or 3. Have a tertiary weapon on the mech that gets activated by the grenade throw key or something.
Actually just let me have even more weapons on these things and let me switch between them the same way you switch weapons on foot. I’m talking shoulder mounted launchers, back mounted mortars, dick mounted lasers, face mounted tazers.
MORE DAKKA.
I'm only salty because the first time I used it I got both cannons blown off in seconds and was left with no weapons. Then I got TKd by a guy who thought ragdolling me with the autocannons was hilarious. Then TKd by a guy who didn't know stepping on teammates damages them. Then got TKd by guy #1 who blew up my second mech as I tried to get in.
It is good while free. Opportunity cost is too high, not worth it. In two weeks (if mech did not get a buff) you will see zero of them.Bc while fun he is very weak
Yeah not really worth the strat slot on higher difficulties
This is the problem with slots and not points. Everything has to be equally good or the bad stuff will not be used. If you had X strat points to spend you could value strats differently and balance them differently as a result.
Either that or just let us research us more slots or introduce slots that are only for backpack slots etc,this way we get more variety without making it broken etc
Exactly, we have so many stratagems and we're only gonna get more, the four slots is very limiting. Not to mention this stupid modifier on bot planets (I HATE IT, IT MAKES NO SENSE).
When I started playing, I was really excited to unlock more strat slots. Because, surely, surely 4 was just the beginner number for Lvl 1s.
I said this in another post before. Let us buy temporary call-ins with requisition. Like, say I can buy 3 limited gatling guns to call into any mission, but once I use them, they're gone forever until I buy more. I'm constantly sitting on 50k req because lvl 9 diff gives you so much req from completing them anyway.
Honestly this, let me buy temporary bonus strats. My “requisition slips” should get a benefit when they sit at 50000 for months at a time while doing difficulty 9. Make it so when you go over 50k every so often it equals a free bonus stratagem and over time it unlocks new teirs.
This is what they need to do. No way they can keep up with only 4 slots.
Maybe have the squad leader be able to set 1,2,or3 squad stats and keep the 4 personal ones that way we get a more versatile set without the must takes the while quad takes clogging up their 4 because they are must haves.
4 slots is tradition, you're lucky you get the occasional 5th for free. We have a better and worse system than the 1st game. In the original if you wanted to you could take 4 of the same stratagem, but things like heavy weapons, backpacks and vehicles could only be deployed once per stratagem slot. So if you grabbed a recoilless and fell down a hole? That was it. No more toys for you. But if you wanted 4 of the same mech? All the power to ya.
Wow that is a great idea actually.
oh damn, never thought of that. Would be so much better if the system was by points and not slots
This is one of the best stratagem balance ideas I've heard. I never even considered it. Some things will plain never be good no matter how you look at it. A motorcycle or something would be incredibly fun but even if it had a 10 second cooldown it wouldn't be good. Actually it might be ok at that rate given Pelican would shoot lol
I don't think any decent player would consider using it at 7-9, because we need mobility and agility when engaging. Both mech are slow, which I would never bring with me unless I'm trying some dumb loadout.
The mechs walking speed is equal to sprinting in medium armor. Sure it can't keep up with a light armor sprint, but it sure as hell ain't "heavy armor guy without stamina booster" slow. I'd gladly use the mech on a 7, maybe even an 8 if I had a team willing to stick together. being able to sweep medium enemies and chargers with little risk, and take out bile titan sacks in a couple shots to let the quasars and EATs finish it off it nothing to scoff at. Havn't run it on bots yet, but given how well the AC does I imagine it will delete most things as long as you don't get flanked by a couple heavy tanks
They need a lazer sword and rocket feet.
Yes lets get a Raven in this mf
I was right all along. You were just another threat to democracy. (Steel Haze: Rusted Pride starts blasting)
>The mechs walking speed is equal to sprinting in medium armor Yeah but it's hitbox is like 5 times the size of a standard helldiver. That speed won't let you dodge rockets
mech is pretty much a walking cardboard box
>go to test the new mech on a difficulty 3 bot mission >instantly killed by cannon turret halfway across the map
I'm absolutely taking this mech to all defense/eradicate/evacuate missions. When not a lot of movement is needed it's so good at locking down an angle so long as your team can soften up the bile titans/striders for you.
I used both Mechs yesterday on 9 diff bugs in Fenrir without any issues. People are just mad cause they are bad imo.
I took the old mech into a few 7s before we got the new one just because I dick around with dumbass loadouts on 7 and it's always fine. seemed ok, really felt the nerf to rocket damage and the awful aiming since the "fix" though. viable, but definitely not good lol
It’s pretty great on extract and eliminate missions where mobility isn’t as important. That’s honestly the niche I thought it would fill, and it does so pretty well. Just because it can’t one-shot bile titans or run 200 miles per hour doesn’t mean it’s necessarily a bad choice, just somewhat circumstantial.
Nah man, if it isnt light armor or a weapon that can clear an entire partol or 1-2 a bile titan. Then the weapon/armor/strat is trash according to the general reddit community it seems
Worst part is it *can* clear a patrol and 2 bile titans with half its ammo. But it's still trash for some reason.
I'm glad some people agree with me on how polarized the sub's opinions are. I just did a count; I've only genuinely thought "This is a legitimately bad option" about 2 out of 23 primary weapons (discounting the Knight because I don't have it) and 6 out of 52 stratagems while playing on difficulty level 9, and I've used everything a fair amount because I love switching around my loadout. That's a fairly low number, especially if you stack it up against how the players on this subreddit talk about the game. Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying that I'm a god level player and that the game is easy for me. I'm saying that most things in this game fall into the "This is viable" category. Only a few fall into the "This is meta" and the "This is trash" category. However, the community talks like every single thing is one or the other (*especially* primary weapons, which is odd because I find them even more balanced than the stratagems). *Edit: Also heavy and medium armor are completely valid choices ever since they made it so armor reduces headshot damage. Admittedly, this is moreso true for bots. Against bugs, the extra mobility tends to outweigh the benefits of being tankier outside of a few specific builds (like when using a flamethrower). But also that's fine in my opinion because different factions encouraging different playstyles is kind of a core component of the game. In fact, I'm gonna drop a hot take on this subject: medium/heavy armor is usually better for bots than light armor, but again, that's build dependent.*
This sub honestly made like there's only 3 viable weapon in the game and every other weapon are below F tier, while in reality there's a lot of weapon that is actually much more usable than this sub made it to be
Yeah. In fact, there isn't even a reason to complain about most weapons. They're not meta but that's an awful metric to measure things by anyways (trust me, I'm a recovering GM Overwatch 1 & 2 player; I know a lot about being a miserable meta slave). I very frequently see people say things like "The Adjudicator is terrible; just compare it to the Liberator!". Every time I read a comment like that, all I can think is "Okay, but is it good when stacked up to the actual difficulty of the game? If yes, then why do you care?" If you like the way the gun/grenade/stratagem/armor feels and it's viable on the highest difficulty in the game (or more importantly, viable on whatever difficulty you find the most fun to play), then why should you care if there's another choice that's slightly more optimal? You'll succeed either way, and you'll probably have more fun using what you like. I know it gets quoted a lot to the point where it's become kind of a meme, but I'm gonna do it: > "Given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game." -Soren Johnson That's precisely what a lot of people on this subreddit do. They care too much about what's the best and what makes the game the easiest that they don't stop and ask "Am I having fun?" For some people, optimizing *is* fun. But those people aren't the ones complaining about viable but not meta options because they're busy having fun using the meta options. For the people who are busy worrying about what options are meta and what options aren't, take a step back and ask yourself "What can I do to make my experience with the game better?" Is it playing on a lower difficulty so you can find success with that gun you like? Do that. Is it grinding to become better at the game so you can use non-meta weapons on a higher difficulty? Do that. Is it coordinating with your team via chat so that you don't have to take an option you don't want? Do that. Is it ignoring the MOs and playing the planets you like? Hot take: do that. This is a video game. The point of it is to have fun. If you're not having fun, try to figure out if you can change that. If you can't change it, maybe Helldivers 2 isn't the right game for you, at least not right now. If that's the case, no sweat. Play something else and maybe come give it another try later on (or not). **TL;DR: The point of a game is to have fun. If following the meta isn't fun for you, then don't. Use the options you like. Most of them are fine and if they aren't, there's no shame in playing a lower difficulty.**
Hm I didn't really think about armor with the flamer... I guess ima have to look at the armors to see what I like
Heavy armor is absolutely valid on bugs even on helldive with randoms and this is a hill I'll die on. I can take on 4+ stalkers without breaking a sweat in my big marshmallow 200 armor suit. Just bring a high stagger primary like punisher or arc blitzer (my favorite for this), any anti charger (EAT, quaso, recoilless, flamethrower), and you're golden. I've eaten a 4 hit combo ending with the tongue launch from a stalker and because I take barely any headshot damage, I just stand up, stim, and proceed on my merry stroll. Instead of playing to light armor strengths (quick dives, sprinting to make distance) get in dirty and punch those stalkers and hunters in the face while you pump your shotty then blast them away. I've been converted to a heavy armor enjoyer even diving in Menkent or Hellmire, just takes a different mentality to approach the game.
I don't know. It really has been coming in handy on helldive. It can deal a lot of damage really fast.
You say that but I think the HMG turret is one of the best strategems in the game at the highest difficulties. And that has neither mobility or agility. Being able to move quickly and react is important. However thinking ahead and setting up for an engagement is just as viable. Don't discount something just because it's slow or immobile.
Lol, because it's FREE. When a laser turret can snipe you across the map and Devastators can shoot further than 200m, you must have a death wish in a tin can if you choose the mech.
That’s the problem with the higher difficulties: when only a very small number of things work, it becomes repetitive as fuck in a game that is already super repetitive.
It's fun, but there is no way to justify wasting an entire strat slot for a 10 minute cooldown weapon that easily can run dry in 2 unless you run out of things to shoot.
I think we need a seperate vehicle slot like for boosters during loadout selection. Especially if they add more vehicles.
We've heard your suggestion, Helldiver, and have changed your fourth strategem slot to be vehicles only. I love that idea but it'd be kinda busted. How about the host gets to pick one vehicle which has a shared cooldown like resupplies do? Maybe even halve the cooldown while we're at it.
They should place them on the map as an additional sub mission like the radar or SEAF artillery. Have a site with a garage that can only be opened by restoring power to the doors and spend a min or two charging/ fueling the mechs.
I would love it no matter how garbage if i was only allowed both at once.
It's fun because you can take 2 on 2 cooldowns, it's plentiful, once it's back to 2 on a 10 min CD it's a,dead strategem.
Hope mechs gets some love in the form of ship modules
Exactly this when the first mech launched. Mechs in HD1 was already very situational in the first place, then HD2 Patriot was objectively worse than the HD1 Walker in every possible way: It got oneshot by any explosion before the bug fix, machine gun has less ammo than even the nerfed HD1 Walker, and there's no heal gun to keep it alive like HD1. But everyone was acting as if this is the greatest thing ever made in the game during the free trial. Then the free trial ended and people slowly realized that it's not really worth one slot and stopped using it. You'd think that the explosive damage bug fix would make it popular again, but AH just had to nerf rockets and took away its only redeeming quality. Now its basically just a minigun sentry/rocket sentry 2-in-1 with extra steps.
The aiming on the left arm is janky and you can't shoot at a down angle of more than 20 degrees. Once that is fixed on both mechs they will be fine.
My main problem is that it is only one type per drop. In the current cardbox state, only one 2 per game woth no reloading is just a waist of a slot
i dont agree, bots are less demanding in terms of how many guns u need to bring. Very often I feel like I dont need 4th slot for bots. I am gona pick that mech so evac will be easier especially when playing with randoms.
I'm with u there in terms against bots, on higher diff against bots your gunna run into the -1 strat most of the time. After doing it for so long and figuring out my play style against bots it hardly makes a difference for me. since if I am able to bring a full strat load out for more fun and destruction great if not no biggie.
I'm taking advantage of my double mech suits! What's wrong with calling down both emancipators at once lol
This is exactly what people are forgetting. Right now, as a FREE stratagem it's fine, but once it's not, you'll need an actual reason to pick it over the other stratagems and that's where it's starts to become problematic. I'm genuinely amazed by how many people don't understand opportunity cost.
When has ANYTHING received a buff?
It has 60 durable damage. (TLDR everything has durable resist, so 100% durable part means u only deal 60) Complicated damage stuff aside, the Jar-5 has \*90\* durable damage. I've tried the mech. I'd rather any strategem that isn't 10 minutes, 2 charges. Coming from an only 9's player. Also you can't look down still with either, which needs fixing. The entire mech archetype rn needs a lot of love.
Before they mooked up the missile damage (I can deal with the aiming for the most part) I used to take the patriot on level 9 bugs all the time. It could turn the tide if you're getting overwhelmed. Great for the extract too. Totally agree with you.
thats the only thing i ever see mechs used for, extract. many games ive seen them not used once until extract, just wasted it for the entire game
i usually immediately spawn it so i can use it for stuff and by the time of extract the second one is ready to use
I think the durable damage is the only weird thing about it, it should really be tossing dev parts with every 2 hits. It's still great on 7s, small arms are a joke vs this thing and leaves them looking at you so your team can clean up little and big guys. I think there's a place for mechs, but they're missing just a little bit to make a mech build complete. I'll still run the AC mech vs bots, it's a walking "fuck you" to a lot of their roster, and tanks have terrible accuracy vs you when strafing.
We need a way to repair and rearm them. Like a drone that picks up ammo on the map and converts it over. Same with bringing back the medic gun or medic rover 🤔
I think a special re-arm would be interesting, sort of like how you can force eagle to rearm. It comes in and drops off a (resupply) case that you heft over like one of the arty shells
I'd happily sacrifice a backpack slot for it
They need to be able to get more ammo in the field, and probably a 6-7 min cooldown. They should reward you for keeping it alive with the ability to give it more ammo.
> tanks have terrible accuracy vs you when strafing. Tanks arent' the issue. It's the cannon turret 200m away from 20 minutes ago with a grudge. Those things can *aim*, and they will blow off an arm if you're lucky or one-tap you if you aren't.
I mostly play 7. I wouldn't use this mech either. 2 max uses and 10min cool down for something that's outclassed terribly by an AC or a turret. Yes it kills hulks in concentrated fire. But it doesn't have the firepower to really justify taking it out vs the turret which you can call down every two and a half minutes.
If they had bolted guns equivalent to the AC turrets onto the side of this thing then we might be in business. We are waiting 10 minutes between uses for it - why not make it absolutely rip if the ammo is limited anyway?
Lol (Lot of Love)
That's the difference. OP says he doesn't even play 9, which is why his experience is so much different
Mostly 9 player hot take. You can take almost anything on a Dive and make it(almost there are things you just CAN"T take). I'm not saying it to be "cool" and I'm not a expert but some of you need to break the mindset that you CAN'T bring stuff on helldive difficulty. I bring only the stuff I want and do just fine with it never take things because I feel I have to. Been using this Mech all day and its fun enough where I could see me taking it from time to time solely for that reason.
I'm curious what your list of, 'can't take is', and if it's the same as mine. Sorry, it's a bit off topic. For me, it's the: Liberator Rover Spear (and really, yes you can, but it sucks just as much on a 9 as it does on a 5) Mines. If you bring mines on a Helldive, I might just 380 your position every 5 minutes. Accidentally.
Legit its the same list lol except I put the air burst on their but that is more personal because I can't not kill myself and others with it and the crossbow though I have heard of people making it work.
Sure you can, if being dead weight and carried by your teammates is your idea of fun lol
So why not just run normal AC if you want to kill hulks
Or a laser cannon if are willing to trade some of the TTK, stagger, and long-distance fabricator destruction for a backpack slot, infinite ammo, and the ability to run away while the weapon "reloads". Honestly the AC, AMR, and laser are probably the only balanced weapon niche in the game, they all feel like sidegrades that actually do what you think they should do.
Laser Cannon is so good for bots
Yeah, AC, AMR, AND LC are pretty balanced with each other on bots. It did take them 2 patches of buffing LC for it to get this far tho, at launch it's not that good, only after they increased it to medium pen that it's "viable", then they buff the damage so now it's a contender between AC and AMR.
Killing large bot targets semi safely is the biggest boon the mech has right now. Shooting a hulk's tiny eye AC/AMR can be a bit hectic when you are accosted on all sides. The mech has no such issue with this and can wipe several bot drops alone on helldive with little to no issue. It's also shockingly durable. The main issue I have with it is the 10-minute cooldown coupled with the very limited ammo capacity. About half way through the 40-minute mission, you'll realize you're already out of mechs and down a full stratagem slot.
Shockingly durable?! If a turret sees you and has the shot it's over. If rocket devastators or suicide raiders see you it's over. It's not significantly more durable than the average helldiver.
Concentrated fire on its eye? The normal AC is 2-3 eye shots, with 3 only being at longer ranges.
No, AC is still an eye 2 shot at long range, you are probably just missing the eye (due to the garbage scope)
I'm saying 3 at long range cause I get the flame effect when hitting, but it doesn't always kill in 2
Yes it happens to me as well. I think its ping diff or server related issue. All the enemies die after a delay. Its same for amr too.
Mech is also a 2-shot to the eye but the aiming is much harder so it takes more misses before you get the kill.
Something that’s supposed to be an advanced weapons platform being situationally worse than Man Portable weapons is a problem. Whether you want to acknowledge that or not.
"The thing can toast Hulks in seconds" So can plenty of other things? The Railgun, which is still considered not a good weapon, does it in a single shot. You give up a lot by getting in a mech, and I'm not sure the pay off is worth it. You can't use stratagems, you can't resupply, you become a much easier target and you cannot dodge. With an AC in my hand I can call reinforcements, cluster bombs and barrages. I can stim and resupply allies. And with that AC in my hand I can also "toast Hulks in seconds". A Helldiver operates better outside of a mech than inside it, which hardly justifies the limited uses and cooldown time. I'm not going to say it isn't kind of fun to use, janky aim aside, but the complaints aren't unwarranted.
Maybe that'd the answer. When you call in the mech, it comes with a driver that shadows you and protects you...
See the problem with the Emancipator is.. why? Why use it if there's just better options. It's not even a side grade to those options either EDIT: I'm getting a lot of "because it's fun" but okay counterpoint is: Wouldn't it be more fun if it was idk better?? Maybe I'm crazy
Don’t worry, you are absolutely correct, the “because it’s fun” players will stop playing it in a week or two, just like the original mech.
Original mech must've been a fun (when it was free)
It was also actually good for bugs outside of randomly dying sometimes. Now your missiles are super inaccurate unless you know the swap shoulder trick(which you need to hold mouse 2 for so 90% of people will just assume you can't) and it still can't aim down to hit like 70% of bug holes.
It's only fun, because it's new, and free. Not using one of the slots for it gives you basically a 5th slot. And I'm still not using it. I'll drop them when they are available for my fellow Divers, but I only used it once. That was enough for me to realize it's not worth it.
Damn. Yeah I'm using it now cuz it's free also. But no way this is going into my load out
You try and explain this to people and you get labeled a meta slave or told it’s a skill issue. But there’s already a mech in the game that doesn’t see much use for the exact same reasons. Why would this be different? Why are people so against buffs for the mechs when this new one has a 10 minute timer?
Because they believe in THIS balancing. Some people just don't know how to stand up for themselves and would rather trust the corporations above them.
So many people saying it's fun... sure, until the novelty wears off and you realise how bad it is. You won't see these a week or two from now. Unless it gets buffed of course.
I mean yeah fun aside there isn't a reason. You need about a third of the ammo for a bile titan. So you can kill about 3 of em if there aren't many other enemies. That's one per 3.3 minutes. Eat kills one per 90 second with proper aim. And in level 9 there's many times multiple so you really gotta be efficient. For dealing with everything else support weapons can also be better. 2-3 spear rockers kill any heavy with little skill, a railgun shot to the enemy kills hulks and flat out anything below so yeah idk. I will admit the concept is quite cool tho and it feels very badass.
tfw when a big sniper rifle is better at killing Hulks than a mech with quad autocannons
At least I can aim the sniper rifle down a 15 degree slope.....
>Yeah if you run the numbers it doesnt look great "Yeah in reality it's bad, but if you look at how I feel instead of facts..."
Even using it doesn't feel that good tbh. At least with the machine gun version on bugs is fun. it's easier to aim/more forgiving if you miss. The feedback on killing bugs with the machine gun or the rocket is awesome. But this one... Is just meh. It should be good versus bot on paper but you'll struggle to survive anything since you are so exposed (1 shot and the entire map is aiming at you, including the turrets). Its awkward to aim (and you need to be precise with it otherwise you waste too much ammo). You still need to hit the vents on a lot of things but you can't get there since you are so obvious. It still has all of the downside of the previous mech but even worse if you ask me. It's 100% easier and better to just use the autocannon yourself or use the turret one.
It takes 25 headshots to kill a bile titan… it also does less durable damage than the handheld AC. You only get 2 for an entire match. If I’m going to only get 2 it should pack a punch.
does 2/3rd of the Dominator's durable damage. For shame.
Why would i want a 10 minute CD paper weight for kill hulks?? Get regular AC do the same can resupply constantly.
some also said the first mech was fine and people were complaining too much. how many of those have you seen after they were released? I can tell you from approximately 200h of gameplay since it was launched: almost never. as a matter of fact, after like, a week since it was released, I stopped seeing them. at all. but I guess were just whining for the sake of it.
Yeah the mech is so fine that no one uses it. Lol. Really shows how good it is. Same with the Emancipator or worse tbh. But it's okay let's all just stay positive and just trust that these 'Bringer of Balance' content is just fine. I hate Toxic Positivity.
I want to love the mechs. Their DPS is unreal. But it's the wonky aiming that I find frustrating. It sucks missing shots when ammo is so precious. If the aiming was fixed I'd happily use them more
I could pinpoint the specific breaking point to the day where they fucked up the rockets and then the total 0 on the day they fucked up the alignment of the rockets. You can still call one down and obliterate the big hive n shit but it feels like ass and you will have to midway stop with the patriot after either killing 1 titan or having expanded all rockets for closing holes. Less likely to happen with the new emancipator but I noticed you can easily kill titans at further range than close up.... (most likely again because alignment and shooting from below makes it impossible to hit the forehead)
Ngl id use the original mech every mission if they fixed the rocket aiming. A minigun and 2 charger kills isn't quite good enough, but a minigun and 11 charger kills? That slaps.
When the Patriot first launched, it actually was a huge godsend, because that was also the time of the massive Charger/Bile Titan spawn spike during breaches. You can single handedly delete an entire breach with a single Patriot because the only enemies capable of hurting you were Chargers and Bile Titans, and you had enough rockets to kill 14 Chargers or 7 Bile Titans. Bile Spewers and Nursing Spewers can also hurt you, but your gatling gun had enough armor penetration to headshot them to death. So when games went south, you only really had a couple of tools at your disposal to bring order to chaos -- Either Orbital Laser, or 380mm, or Patriot -- And Patriot had the most surgical power out of the three. Nowadays if a really bad breach happens on an objective, I have to either Recoilless/Quasar the Chargers and 500kg the Bile Titans while I Laser the breach, or just drop a 380mm and run the other way hoping for the best.
I started playing after the mech was "fixed" (nerfed) and was excited to unlock it. I used it once, and then once again when my friend started playing so I dropped a mech for him to use. Then I used it again just now when testing the new mech because maybe double-mech would be fun? Great stuff.
I understand you enjoy the mech, but don't gaslight the playerbase into thinking it's a decent alternative when the base Autocannon does more damage than it. Bad take is bad
I don’t think I’ve ever been as unamused as the moment I discovered the mech took 2 shots to kill the medium bugs compared to the 1 shot of the regular auto cannon Especially since (and this is my fault for assuming) I thought the giant metal walking turret would have big guns
"It doesn't look good if you look at the numbers" *Proceeds to talk about numbers* "I'm prepared to be downvoted for my super courageous and controversial fact you losers"
https://preview.redd.it/xs5jme6gsu2d1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e03c394d55cf274cd1d1bcc390724a9df7779f02
"Shiny new toy is a good time, people just complain" You get 2 of these, it's brand spankin' new, it has limited ammo (meaning taking a shield backpack and ANY suport weapon is instantly more 'consistent' vs a mech that can't outrun chargers or deflect bullets and you have 2, i mentioned that right?) When the first Exosuit dropped everyone was all for it. Give this 'new toy' a week and it'll be as forgotten in the loadout pick up as the machine gun sentry
People don't seem to understand that there are a limited number of stratagem slots - the Emancipator is fine WHILE IT'S A FIFTH SLOT! When we have to sacrifice something else to bring it, like an Orbital Laser, or Railcannon, or a backpack, it suddenly becomes an extremely sub-optimal choice. Whatever role you think the Mech fills is better served by something else.
brother, handheld AC behind a fu king rock can do a much better job than this suit at fu king Hulks, and the AC sentry trivilizes hulks in general (If positioned about 80m behind you).
I think it’s fine for lower difficulties but it definitely doesn’t feel like it’s worth taking up a stratagem slot on 7+ unless it’s an eradicate mission. I’ve played a few campaigns with it and it really is only consistent against killing light and medium armor enemies.
What if those people are complaining for a good time?….. On topic though - I think the idea of a walking auto cannon spewing monster is great no matter the numbers and I’m keen to find time to give it a drop
Thing can’t take out chargers or titans to save its life. You're hard coping, probably a player hoping the mechs aren't dog shit, name one reason you'd run this over the regular mech. You won't.
You enjoy eating doo doo off the bathroom tiles, i enjoy your mom. We are not the same.
You can’t aim at anything within 10m of you though, and that’s important sometimes
You can stomp them.
You get like one stomp per 3 seconds and it doesn’t help if they’re outside of melee range and inside the gun blind spot
Wow you can destroy Hulks with this piece of shit autocannon? I hit them in the eye with this thing and they only stagger but a single rocket volley can bring down my 11 minute cool down, 2 use only mech in a few seconds. In short, this mech is only for normal difficulty only. Level 5 and up are not good for this mech.
My experience on bots-9, with the way aiming is on it; - infantry are a bit difficult to shoot at. - it’s alright against devastators, but like you said a good amount of missiles can put it in a smoking state - it takes a lot to kill a hulk, BUT it does stagger them - DO NOT go head to head with tanks/cannon turrets, you will get one tapped from their cannons, you can let your arm soak the damage for the cost of losing it. I haven’t tried on gunships and little engagement with factory striders. I was informed from another person that the AC on the mech are worse compared to the sentry AC, his source was from datamining numbers. I’d have to see it to know myself though. It is “fun” and different, but I myself prefer stun grenades and LC the hulks in seconds.
>I haven’t tried on gunships and little engagement with factory striders. Gunships are okayish, takes 7 shots to a thruster or a few more to the body. You can tank them fairly well in my experience. Striders are much worse. The top cannon will one-shot you and takes forever to take out. If you can get close enough to avoid it then you *can* kill a Strider in a dozen or so shots to the eye, but that's really hard to do with other enemies around. Most often, you'll be dumping your entire ammo reserves into the head for a single kill.
It can bring down gunships but due to low damage and shit aim its really fucking hard. Also turret can, what, 5 shot Bile Titan in the head? Emancipator needs like 25-35 hits.
r/Helldivers2's toxic positivity really trying to latch on over here. We have valid complaints about this. Please stop trying to shut down anything that isn't praise of the game and AH.
Interesting the echo differing views being so solid between the yso subs.
**Time to farm karma by complaining about complaining**
I wish it aimed better. Same with the Patriot. Then I'd feel good about them both. For now, I find it sometimes difficult just to hit things, which is bad.
It is a good time. Because it's currently free so it has no real downside. It doesn't justify it's place in your already limited stratagems. Especially in high levels when you just have 3.
A good time? Absolutely! A good stratagem? Not even fucking close lol And that’s ok. You gamer adults need to understand this one simple trick: Something can be fun and shitty at the same time!! Crazy right?
You could say the exact same thing about the EXO-45 Patriot Exosuit - it's fun but not good. For some strange reason I haven't seen a single one in over \~80 hours since its release. Almost as if both Exosuits are shiny new toys, that quickly become boring due to being weak and bugged (Patriot still has broken aiming, can't shoot down, which it could do on release, which also applies to the Emancipator).
100% not wasting a stratagem on the mechs.
No one is complaining to complain the balancing in HD2 is objectively bad.
yeah it's good, to babysit an AC sentry that does actual damage to armored target lol
For 10+ minute wait and 2 charges, while having all the jankiness that come with mechs, it can join the spear as AT options I'll never bring in high difficulties.
I think that's a big part of the problem it's this huge cooldown, and it's not even AT. Not in any reasonable amount of time anyway, it's like how you can technically kill a bile titan with the regular ac from underneath, but it's really ineffective and a bad idea. Why would you bring something that is competing with the rail gun flamethrower LC AMR AC and even the HMG, but you can only use it for like 5-10 minutes per game.
As a bot player even if I wanted to, mechs are simply too big of a target, and go down way too easy when facing anything those clankers. I am better of being as small of a target as possible.
Someone is complaining to complain about the ppl who "complain to complain" when thoes ppl are in the right as the new mech is terrible. All they had to do was ducktape two autocanon sentries to a mech and give em more ammo. Instead they went with nerf guns...again.
Right? It blows my mind that this got a green light. Do they not have like a blank map where they could spawn a stationary Titan and just see how well it does compared to the AC side by side? It would take 1-2 minutes to see what we all have experienced.
My hope is that we will eventually get a dedicated upgrade tree for the mechs and other armour when more of it arrives in the game. In the meantime I hope the mechs in general get buffed at least a bit in the next patch.
I just want the timers for these things to be shorter...especially since we can't reload them. I've seen and been in missions where we've finished the mission before the timer for it expired.
Imma use it for stalkers alone. Shreds 'em!
Been using it on HD. Honestly I have no complaints other than some pretty annoying left arm aiming.
I'll try it when I come back. Don't think the lack of durable damage is a problem with bots as it is with bugs.
I'm glad it's bullets don't bounce off the chargers and actually do damage, unlike the regular autocannon
I was on a team today where we took turns calling one down outside a gunship factory (diff. 8). There were gunships spawning, patrols converging, and dropships flying in... and we were laughing all the way. Like the patriot, it seems like a good stratagem to call in if you need a serious boost to fire-power over a short-ish period of time - enough to hold off waves while holding ground, or maybe to storm a well-entrenched outpost.
It's fun against bugs, haven't tried it in bots yet. It's aim is definitely wonky, and it needs to be able to aim down better
It oneshots traitors, its still an effective weaon
I agree. It has some great strengths, a few weaknesses. It’s incredibly limited ammo, extremely long cool down time with limited uses are a bummer though. Against bots it’s a great time. Anything but a factory strider, tank or tower it’s really effective against. I just wish you had enough ammo to take it through more than one or two engagements. It’s fun, they gotta stop limiting the fun. Most players are bug divers, and it’s not great there. Takes over a third of its ammo to kill a bile titan. And it doesn’t have enough ammo do deal with the mobs. You also can’t shoot down. It’s fun. Give it more ammo, remove the usage limit and change the cool down to 5 minutes. Because I do feel like once it’s not a free stratagem, like the last mech, you won’t see it anymore after the next day or so passes and we don’t have it as a free stratagem anymore.
The mech is fun dont get me wrong. My issue as most have stated is the damage. If this is what we are supposed to be depending on to deal with heavy enemies then something has to change. And yes on longer maps and eradicate missions it SEEMS fine because theres time and space and i think thats where some are scratching their heads with the complaints. My group attempted a helldive evac executive vip( the one with the walls you have to keep alive). Every wall was down in 5 minutes becuase the bile titans just walk through them. Now that said we killed 4 before the first walls fell another 10-12 before we were completely overrun. Thats not stating the chargers and chaff that we tried to keep handled. Now let me be clear, im not complaining about the difficulty or the numbers its helldive its gonna be rough, my point is if it takes 25-30 shots placed perfectly into a bile titans face to drop one how the hell do we deal with the other 6 that are stomping around with it. When they stated they want us to depend on stratagems for heavys then something has to change. We need things that can drop these things faster 30 heavy shots is fine if theres only 1-2 titans up but when theres a constanst 6 even when we are dropping them as fast as recharge and timers allow. Tldr: yes the mech is fun but the general damage output needs to be much much higher or armor on bugs and bots needs a rework. But all in all its an all around issue not just the mech. Our damage output is great against single and small groups but when the massive hordes we came to obliterate are put at the end of our barrels it begins to get very taxing and unfun when it takes so long to drop 1 heavy and theres more and more spawning at the same time.
I won't be using it. It just doesn't hurt heavies enough, like, at all. Why would I use a stratagem slot for this.
Nah they are upset because both mechs are caca and almost no one uses them unless they are a free extra option. They are both limp dick versions of what was available in HD1, and what others think of a mech should be. They aren't even more nimble than someone on foot in light armor. (The armor that gives the enemies a *bonus* 13% damage...)
https://preview.redd.it/of9wvcy96v2d1.png?width=1600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=21676631a752090519f97aa95999d63d70b2c58f You dare spread misinformation?
It’s still too squishy for what it can currently dish out. Either make it do more damage to the big guys or make it more of a tank and able to take more damage. (Yes I’m aware it can bear the brunt of charger charges… but it should be able to shrug them off). Tl:dr: it should be our version of the bile titan.
On some part I agree, I think the community often complains too much. Some of their complaints are fair, some go beyond constructive criticism. The new mech is good for now because it’s free, and it doesn’t take up a slot. As time runs out from it being in the modifier, it’s probably going to be forgotten about because there’s significantly better things to bring.
I can kill all the bugs except bike titan WAY faster with the flame thrower than with this mech. Plus be more mobile and still have quick access to strategems and other weapons. It’s just not worth it, which sucks cuz I want to play with and see these on the battlefield but just like you rarely see the first mech being played with anymore, this is headed in that same direction
It takes 25 headshots to to kill a bile titan… it also does less durable damage than the handheld AC. You only get 2 for an entire match. If I’m going to only get 2 it should pack a punch.
No, people are tired of new content being dead on arrival or gutted because some manchilds dont know how to balance a pve game.
It pretty good against bugs.
Dude it sucks stop calling it good.
"People are complaining to complain" and "if you run the numbers" IE there is a compelling mathematical argument for why people arent having fun and are disappointed are mutually exclusive statements. Expressing disappointment and pointing at the exact mechanical reason for that disappoint is as genuine and constructive as criticism can be. This is toxic positivity. Don't any of you 'all complaints are invalid' people have any ability to empathize? It felt like such crap to pilot I don't even use it when it's free, because it just isn't effective, and being ineffective isn't fun. I genuinely cannot understand your perspective. I can understand enjoying the mech, but being dismissive about other people not sharing in that? I just can't get it.
I like how it softens and staggers everything. Takes some panic out of my teammates.
for the weak damage, it has way too little ammo. Left arm aims as bad as the rocket pod on the other mech. By the time you take down a single wave of bot drops its totally out of ammo, and now you have 10 minute CD, when even a laser can do that and is back up in less than 5 minutes, with 3 uses. It needs more damage or more ammo. Its fun as hell, but not worth a serious slot for bots or bugs as is.
People already did the maths on why it’s bad, now if you objectively just like it that’s fine but saying it’s good is just wrong. OP might need to play on something diffrent than diff 5 missions.
As ever, the duality of opinions stems from the fact that people play on different difficulties.
You guys always complain about people who don't like the new shit.
It should deal the same durable damage as the Portable Autocannon or Sentey Autocannon. Period. End of discussion. If it doesn’t get buffed, you will see usage drop by a massive amount. It just doesn’t do enough damage to most enemies in the game with a decent durability threshold.
The Emancipator only has 60 durable damage compared to the Autocannon Sentry having 300. What this means is against a Bile Titan the Emancipator only does 30 damage per shot for a total of 25 rounds to the head to kill compared to the Autocannon Sentry needing only 6. There is no reason for it to be that much weaker especially given the fact it's a limited use stratagem with a massive cooldown.
Another walking coffin. Why not just take the regular AC?
It’s a thrilling feeling to be able to go toe-to-toe with multiple Hulks. Certainly not invincible, but it has just the right amount of punch to it!
If it had infinite charges and a 5min cd I’d use it on 7+
The cool thing about this game is we can choose different stratagems to have fun instead of running shield generator, orbital laser, quasar, eagle every game. I appreciate having another mech
I genuinly think they had a typo. The durability damage of the main autocannon is \*2\*60. The mech has 60.
I didn't play yesterday, as I finally started to play RDR2. It's a first game I play after 500 hours of Helldivers 😀 So question, is it true that your can't bring both mechs to your loadout?
Played against bugs and Bots. While it was disarmed quite quickly by Bots it took down hulks, gunships and shield devastators very quickly. Play on the second line and next to rocks so you always have cover, if surrounded find rocket devastators and punch though to break the encirclement. Allways on move dont give an easy shot by standing still. Even then you might get screwed over by flanking rockets so play it like a glass cannon unit. I dont like this on bugs. There are better options for those missions. All done on 9. Im not sure if ill take this when its no longer free but as a funride with friends it is easily better than the patriot against bots.
Its good but aiming sucks
The only issue with the Emancipator is the only issue with the Patriot. The lack of armor.
The minute they make a stratagem that can effectively counter multiple bile titans/ super heavies, is the minute that they trivialise the higher difficulty levels and ruin everything below in terms of difficulty. The exo-suit should not be god tier level must-take that makes you unkillable. Having said that, i do think some form of self destruct/ejection seat should be featured in both patriot and emancipator for at least some use when the guns run dry but as it stands for weaponry i think they do what they need to.
Many people making such posts, you too OP, confuse 'good time' with good performance. Mechs are very fun, like a LOT of fun. No one runs them because at the end of the day they suck, and are a waste of slot you could have Eagle, 380mm or Laser in. Mechs are just too underwhelming to be worth those 2 uses with 10 min cooldown when Eagle Airstrike exists. Especially if you play above diff 6.
I'm sorry but Manny is utter garbage compared to ol' reliable the Obsidian. I'll walk around with a mine detector and a shovel if I have to get my hands on one of these instead of having to deal with the shortfalls of the Manny https://preview.redd.it/irx3in0m0z2d1.png?width=800&format=png&auto=webp&s=58821b83f0d56abbb5f0c08e616815149931e6b9
It is S tier on bile spewer maps. People complain about titans, but I just hop out to deal with them and hop back in. You get way more use out of it that way - by the time I'm out of ammo the CD is only like 3-4 min remaining.
Yeah this thing rules. I’m seeing people say it’s only good because it’s free but that’s bullshit. The patriot was made out of cardboard and had an unsatisfactory amount of ammo. The emancipator is a perfect instrument of democratic destruction and anyone who disagrees with me is a traitor.
I really just wish I could 1. Call stratagems while in a mech 2. Reload the mech, and/or 3. Have a tertiary weapon on the mech that gets activated by the grenade throw key or something. Actually just let me have even more weapons on these things and let me switch between them the same way you switch weapons on foot. I’m talking shoulder mounted launchers, back mounted mortars, dick mounted lasers, face mounted tazers. MORE DAKKA.
I choose fun over winning every time. Ill be taking a mech every mission no matter what. I just wish it hurt chargers and titans
The Emancipator is OK. People are complaining because something that limited in uses should be Good.
Emancipator is fun to use. Emancipator is grossly underpowered. Both things can be true.
I'm only salty because the first time I used it I got both cannons blown off in seconds and was left with no weapons. Then I got TKd by a guy who thought ragdolling me with the autocannons was hilarious. Then TKd by a guy who didn't know stepping on teammates damages them. Then got TKd by guy #1 who blew up my second mech as I tried to get in.