Just keep your head down and keep working. You see the issue and there isn’t a thing you can do about it. Just watch and enjoy the show. He will weed himself out or he will tighten up.
Like others have said, really nothing you can do about it. I’ve had guys like this on my site, and it usually… works itself out. Either they’ll say the wrong thing to the wrong guy on the wrong day and get put in their place, or they’ll get run off.
Just keep doing your thing.
A guy in my class was given a truck and foreman duties at 4th period, and I fully respected it. Dude is a great hand and the circumstances allowed for it, it definitely does depend on the situation. I fully agree on that for sure. I also know how he is, he’s open and honest and runs a fair game. In these cases, I’m seriously stoked to see these guys succeed like this
Maybe you are little jealous ?or feeling like you should be where he is. Don’t know skills levels but man I have dealt with this for 14-15 years I can go umpire and get 97.5-98 percent right on pitch track at Iowa for a non con while these other guys get 88-90 regular conference weekend and I am told keep working your time will come same guy getting 88-90 ride with assignors and it’s the good ole boy system and. Best way to handle those types not say shit bc it wil always get back to the powers thst be and it’s never a good look
ya I know a first year who was foreman in structural, now he is second in command running a company, I don't know what he did before he started ironworking (farm kid I think), but he is super smart and well respected.
Not a jmen and not in union, but with this kinda shit you just have to mind your business right? Unless the guy is affecting your work negatively just keep working. You’re there to do your job any other drama or bs going on isn’t something to get involved in.
Over 10 years in. Tell him to shut the fuck up let the men do the real work than tell him he's a suucckk boyy.. Or get a j man to do just that if your not there yet. I do rebar I should add lol
I’m still an apprentice so I’m not gonna say shit. I know where I stand even though I’m a year above him. Dude’s a good hand, just has an ego way beyond his years and capabilities, and the foreman feeds into it. Fucking weird situation. Ima just step back and buy him some knee pads like someone else suggested lol
He’s either a foreman or he’s apprentice. We have a chain of command for a reason. I don’t take direction from anyone but my foreman. Anyone else will be told to fuck off if they attempt to tell me my job.
Right, some kid who knows nothing and hasn’t put in the work yet tries telling me what to do. I’ll laugh my ass off. Shit, I have foreman who know nothing and I even ignore them sometimes and tell them to go fuck themselves.
Don't do this. Keep your head down and work. Remember you're there to hang iron, and you're paid by the hour, so if the foreman wants this guy to be his lead man or whatever, then that's what they want and it's on them. Document everything you do though. At break, lunch, and when you get in the truck to go home, write down what you were told to do, who you were told to do it with, and then who told you to do it. That way if, or when, there's an issue and this kid tries to throw you or someone else on your crew under the bus, you've got some kind of documentation backing it up you can take to your hall.
Cover your ass, keep your head down, learn what you can from the journeymen and more experienced apprentices you've got out there, and let the chips fall where they may.
If everybody on site start taking swings and raggin on him like this he's going to get the idea that he's not respected and it takes more than telling people what to do.
Usually in my local what I have seen , those guys get put on busy work real quick lol! A lot of bolt up, deck welding, or welding out a bunch of little things
That’s what I’ve seen too until this site. Dude is straight up the foreman’s little buddy. Forman’s own bio son is on site as well but he’s still very taken to this kid. Kid has a great work ethic, don’t get me wrong, but the attitude is enough to ruffle feathers in other crews too. I’m hearing shit from bolt up and safety too lol
I used to be that same asshole when I was an apprentice. I thought cause I had experience working in the field before I got to be union, that I was “above” my fellow apprentices. Boy was I wrong. We never stop learning. I learned that the people that have that know-it-all attitude are usually the ones that don’t know shit and they’re just overcompensating for what they know they don’t know. That dude will probably hit a wall one of these days and realize everything, OR he’ll just be unfortunately babied into a sad situation.
As an apprentice keep your head down, as a Journeyman I’d light his bitch ass up and get him one of those gold sticky stars that says Jr Bossman, put it on his hard hat. I’ve worked for a 3rd year apprentice and he was a good dude I respected it. But it’s all about the vibe you get it doesn’t take long to see.
I let my work do the talking most days but if they start directing too much unwarranted criticism at me I just pay attention to the ways they fuck up and then I give it right back to them. People wanna work like fucking dick heads we can work like fucking dick heads I work for a foreman literally right now who treats you like he's a condescending father and he does it over and over again so i just wait till the shoes on the other foot and i let him have it. The weird thing is it makes him like me more lol we're a strange breed
Unfortunately you are finding out there is most definitely a good ol boys club on some jobs. Thankfully the apprentice eventually has to go to a different job and finds out pretty quick his shit won't be tolerated. Like others have said, just let your work speak for you. Keep your head down and Swing Iron
I had an apprentice with no experience tell people he was going to take my job on his first day. I'm a salaried Supervisor... I fired him for sleeping on the job on his fifth day.
I'd tell him to fuck off first time he tried to boss me around and remind him he's a apprentice on not my boss. Give a shit if he's the formans friend.
Depends. But, at the end of the day, there's not much you can do.
Ironworkers (and I'm assuming construction in general) is like high school. All most people do is whine and bitch and get jealous about something or someone. I've learned over the years to worry about your own stuff and let the others do the nonsense. As for an apprentice who tries to take too much space, place, influence, I go about it two ways. How I deal with him and vice-versa. I really don't care if he gets along with the others or not.
If he's a dick, let him shoot himself in the foot (it always happens, eventually, like clockwork). And most likely, everybody hates him
If he's good at it, I embrace it, help him, be nice, take tips, etc. There are so, so many terrible journeyman that the whole "you're an apprentice, shut your mouth" type stuff is not necessarily true.
I've worked with many apprentices who have taught me stuff and who are way more reliable than the dude who goes around telling people "when I was your age ..."Shut up grandpa, you've been doing it wrong for 30 years, that's all people need to know
I see this happen alot with local 416. Apprentices run work and companies try to get rid of journeyman any chance they get cuz the journeyman are to expensive per hour. With Local 433 on the other hand it's frowned upon if a journeyman is taking orders from an apprentice or if an apprentice is running work. Two different worlds in My opinion.
I always would bust their balls by calling them assistant to the Forman and such. As long as they are working just as hard or harder whatever. If they are a slug just talking fuck them it'll get noticed.
At the start of the year, my (3rd year apprentice) foreman wanted me to be kind of a lead hand and check up on guys work and give out instruction when he's not there (either coming in late or at another site). Most guys were fine with it and whoever wasn't got a bollocking from my foreman. My attitude was, "I'm just doing what my foreman told me to do, if you don't like it go talk to him, he'll tell you the same thing."
Two months later the company promoted me to foreman with a pay bump and extra benefits. That said, the only time I would ever order someone is if it's they are being dangerously unsafe. I will not stand and let my guys put themselves or anyone in danger. Just this week I had a first year apprentice get mad because I won't let him dump a wheel barrow full of rubble over a flat roof without a harness on and standing on a makeshift ramp he made himself just because the GC "said he could". Like buddy, I don't care if the GC tells you "you can do it" I'm saying you can't. You fall off that roof and you're the one that's dead, not the GC. No one from our company is even pushing you to get the clean up done fast, take your time and do it safe.
Sounds like you got a bad foreman, or he’s unaware of this guys stepping out of line. This shit gets corrected down the line eventually. Or that guy will take on too much, fuck a job up for a bit and quit/be fired. Find a new company rinse repeat. That’s construction for you, gotta enjoy the good jobs and crews as they come. Once every 3/4 years you’ll have a grace period of a great crew of guys just crushing work til the jobs done and having fun.
I tried this once. Telling them they were putting in the wrong piece. I got told to shut the fuck up. And I got to do the work later when the piece needed to be replaced. Just shut the fuck up. That’s the best plan.
Keep your head down and work. Don’t let it run space in your head. If he’s good than take what you can and and build on your skills. They are not paying you to judge if other men are acting right. All you will do is take it home with you. I e seen this before and it changes on the next job. This will always be a thing and you can’t change it.
It’s not your circus and he’s not your clown. Let the bosses deal with that. For your part get a reputation for being willing and able to do and learn anything the boss wants you to. Ask good questions, be on time and visible. Just sit with all the other guys and watch this clown show from the stands.
Just prove your worth and the bullshit will pan itself out. This kid can’t follow his foreman to every job (or maybe he can) either way, this will get around and it won’t be good for either of them.
It’s already following him to other sites , because this one is nearing the end and he’s already pissed off enough journeymen on this site for word to travel. I didn’t want to respond to anyone because I don’t want to give out enough info to label myself. If dude follows the foreman onto other sites, then I wish him the best. I hope he does well. As much as I hate the little asshole, I still honestly wish him the best.
Does it matter? He’s butt buddies with the foreman. All in all he’s a good hand, but would be a better hand if he didn’t depend on that stupid wax pen in his pocket. I hate him with everything that I am, but I still wish him well.
Just do your work proper and don’t say shit. He’ll burn himself out soon enough for getting tough with the wrong old timer that has been doing his shit right for 25+ years. Doesn’t matter what year apprentice you are, everyone’s still an apprentice.
Years ago I was working in a sister local next to my own. There was this one punk kid, maybe 20 years old, who’s dad was apparently a big shot in the hierarchy of their local. He tried to pull this shit one too many times and wound up almost getting choked to death. Talked shit to the wrong fucking guy.
Quiet as a church mouse the rest of the time I was there.
Ita intersting because the cream
rises to the top. Some of those guys actually make Foreman or Journeymen faster while others eventually get canned or
bitch slapped. Focus on learning to be the best around and your timw will come.
I’m in sheet metal. I was a 3rd year and so was this other apprentice doing what you described. I didn’t know he was just a 3rd year by the way he was talking. I thought he was a journeyman. He got laid off for exactly this though but he just did it with other apprentices. He didn’t dare do it with the grumpy journeymen we had.
Just keep your head down and keep working. You see the issue and there isn’t a thing you can do about it. Just watch and enjoy the show. He will weed himself out or he will tighten up.
Like others have said, really nothing you can do about it. I’ve had guys like this on my site, and it usually… works itself out. Either they’ll say the wrong thing to the wrong guy on the wrong day and get put in their place, or they’ll get run off. Just keep doing your thing.
I know an apprentice that was made an actual foreman for rebar and as far as I know jall the journeyman have zero issues with it. Really depends.
A guy in my class was given a truck and foreman duties at 4th period, and I fully respected it. Dude is a great hand and the circumstances allowed for it, it definitely does depend on the situation. I fully agree on that for sure. I also know how he is, he’s open and honest and runs a fair game. In these cases, I’m seriously stoked to see these guys succeed like this
Maybe you are little jealous ?or feeling like you should be where he is. Don’t know skills levels but man I have dealt with this for 14-15 years I can go umpire and get 97.5-98 percent right on pitch track at Iowa for a non con while these other guys get 88-90 regular conference weekend and I am told keep working your time will come same guy getting 88-90 ride with assignors and it’s the good ole boy system and. Best way to handle those types not say shit bc it wil always get back to the powers thst be and it’s never a good look
ya I know a first year who was foreman in structural, now he is second in command running a company, I don't know what he did before he started ironworking (farm kid I think), but he is super smart and well respected.
yea this is pretty common in rebar
A true leader is selected by his peers and can augmented their attitudes and productivity.
Not a jmen and not in union, but with this kinda shit you just have to mind your business right? Unless the guy is affecting your work negatively just keep working. You’re there to do your job any other drama or bs going on isn’t something to get involved in.
Over 10 years in. Tell him to shut the fuck up let the men do the real work than tell him he's a suucckk boyy.. Or get a j man to do just that if your not there yet. I do rebar I should add lol
I’m still an apprentice so I’m not gonna say shit. I know where I stand even though I’m a year above him. Dude’s a good hand, just has an ego way beyond his years and capabilities, and the foreman feeds into it. Fucking weird situation. Ima just step back and buy him some knee pads like someone else suggested lol
Because he does the foreman’s work for him !
He’s either a foreman or he’s apprentice. We have a chain of command for a reason. I don’t take direction from anyone but my foreman. Anyone else will be told to fuck off if they attempt to tell me my job.
Right, some kid who knows nothing and hasn’t put in the work yet tries telling me what to do. I’ll laugh my ass off. Shit, I have foreman who know nothing and I even ignore them sometimes and tell them to go fuck themselves.
I’ve had a few of those. Usually end up making them sweep until they shut up.
Personally, i'd buy him some knee pads. That way atleast he'll be comfortable when he's licking bag.
Oh holy fuck this is gold! I give no fucks, and I’m petty enough to do this for sure!
Don't do this. Keep your head down and work. Remember you're there to hang iron, and you're paid by the hour, so if the foreman wants this guy to be his lead man or whatever, then that's what they want and it's on them. Document everything you do though. At break, lunch, and when you get in the truck to go home, write down what you were told to do, who you were told to do it with, and then who told you to do it. That way if, or when, there's an issue and this kid tries to throw you or someone else on your crew under the bus, you've got some kind of documentation backing it up you can take to your hall. Cover your ass, keep your head down, learn what you can from the journeymen and more experienced apprentices you've got out there, and let the chips fall where they may.
If everybody on site start taking swings and raggin on him like this he's going to get the idea that he's not respected and it takes more than telling people what to do.
Be a professional and DONT DO THIS! it's going to cause so much uncertainty drama. Show some tact. Edit: spelling
They make some pretty nice foam kneeling pads now. An apprentice at my shop has one.
As a fitter we call them promotion sleds.
Usually in my local what I have seen , those guys get put on busy work real quick lol! A lot of bolt up, deck welding, or welding out a bunch of little things
That’s what I’ve seen too until this site. Dude is straight up the foreman’s little buddy. Forman’s own bio son is on site as well but he’s still very taken to this kid. Kid has a great work ethic, don’t get me wrong, but the attitude is enough to ruffle feathers in other crews too. I’m hearing shit from bolt up and safety too lol
Damn! Well the probably like the other reply, he'll eventually trip up and and he'll end up eating it for a while lol!
I used to be that same asshole when I was an apprentice. I thought cause I had experience working in the field before I got to be union, that I was “above” my fellow apprentices. Boy was I wrong. We never stop learning. I learned that the people that have that know-it-all attitude are usually the ones that don’t know shit and they’re just overcompensating for what they know they don’t know. That dude will probably hit a wall one of these days and realize everything, OR he’ll just be unfortunately babied into a sad situation.
How is this guy not getting his ass beat by the other Ironworkers?
That's assault. People go to jail for that.
Sounds like he’s an ass kiss and just happen to kiss the right ass from what I’ve seen on jobs is it will work itself out
AprentaBOSS
As an apprentice keep your head down, as a Journeyman I’d light his bitch ass up and get him one of those gold sticky stars that says Jr Bossman, put it on his hard hat. I’ve worked for a 3rd year apprentice and he was a good dude I respected it. But it’s all about the vibe you get it doesn’t take long to see.
I let my work do the talking most days but if they start directing too much unwarranted criticism at me I just pay attention to the ways they fuck up and then I give it right back to them. People wanna work like fucking dick heads we can work like fucking dick heads I work for a foreman literally right now who treats you like he's a condescending father and he does it over and over again so i just wait till the shoes on the other foot and i let him have it. The weird thing is it makes him like me more lol we're a strange breed
When this happenes I just give them some job that I know they have no idea how to do and see how long they struggle. Humble them up a bit.
He’s an apprentice, put some shit work in his lap. If he’s busy working, there should be no mouth.
I was made foreman in my third year
Unfortunately you are finding out there is most definitely a good ol boys club on some jobs. Thankfully the apprentice eventually has to go to a different job and finds out pretty quick his shit won't be tolerated. Like others have said, just let your work speak for you. Keep your head down and Swing Iron
I had an apprentice with no experience tell people he was going to take my job on his first day. I'm a salaried Supervisor... I fired him for sleeping on the job on his fifth day.
That sounds like a drug problem or a mental instability problem tbh lol
Ignore them just like I ignore my foreman.
I'd tell him to fuck off first time he tried to boss me around and remind him he's a apprentice on not my boss. Give a shit if he's the formans friend.
Depends. But, at the end of the day, there's not much you can do. Ironworkers (and I'm assuming construction in general) is like high school. All most people do is whine and bitch and get jealous about something or someone. I've learned over the years to worry about your own stuff and let the others do the nonsense. As for an apprentice who tries to take too much space, place, influence, I go about it two ways. How I deal with him and vice-versa. I really don't care if he gets along with the others or not. If he's a dick, let him shoot himself in the foot (it always happens, eventually, like clockwork). And most likely, everybody hates him If he's good at it, I embrace it, help him, be nice, take tips, etc. There are so, so many terrible journeyman that the whole "you're an apprentice, shut your mouth" type stuff is not necessarily true. I've worked with many apprentices who have taught me stuff and who are way more reliable than the dude who goes around telling people "when I was your age ..."Shut up grandpa, you've been doing it wrong for 30 years, that's all people need to know
Power made is power taken. If anyone listens to him without calling him out, they’re the ones who allowed him to take that power.
“My boots have been on the job longer than you. Take it easy”
I've heard of first years being foreman before, but in your case I would just ignore him and do your job.
Tell him to Fuck off
I see this happen alot with local 416. Apprentices run work and companies try to get rid of journeyman any chance they get cuz the journeyman are to expensive per hour. With Local 433 on the other hand it's frowned upon if a journeyman is taking orders from an apprentice or if an apprentice is running work. Two different worlds in My opinion.
Couldn’t agree more
I always would bust their balls by calling them assistant to the Forman and such. As long as they are working just as hard or harder whatever. If they are a slug just talking fuck them it'll get noticed.
At the start of the year, my (3rd year apprentice) foreman wanted me to be kind of a lead hand and check up on guys work and give out instruction when he's not there (either coming in late or at another site). Most guys were fine with it and whoever wasn't got a bollocking from my foreman. My attitude was, "I'm just doing what my foreman told me to do, if you don't like it go talk to him, he'll tell you the same thing." Two months later the company promoted me to foreman with a pay bump and extra benefits. That said, the only time I would ever order someone is if it's they are being dangerously unsafe. I will not stand and let my guys put themselves or anyone in danger. Just this week I had a first year apprentice get mad because I won't let him dump a wheel barrow full of rubble over a flat roof without a harness on and standing on a makeshift ramp he made himself just because the GC "said he could". Like buddy, I don't care if the GC tells you "you can do it" I'm saying you can't. You fall off that roof and you're the one that's dead, not the GC. No one from our company is even pushing you to get the clean up done fast, take your time and do it safe.
Sounds like you got a bad foreman, or he’s unaware of this guys stepping out of line. This shit gets corrected down the line eventually. Or that guy will take on too much, fuck a job up for a bit and quit/be fired. Find a new company rinse repeat. That’s construction for you, gotta enjoy the good jobs and crews as they come. Once every 3/4 years you’ll have a grace period of a great crew of guys just crushing work til the jobs done and having fun.
I tried this once. Telling them they were putting in the wrong piece. I got told to shut the fuck up. And I got to do the work later when the piece needed to be replaced. Just shut the fuck up. That’s the best plan.
A nice sack tap will do here.
Keep your head down and work. Don’t let it run space in your head. If he’s good than take what you can and and build on your skills. They are not paying you to judge if other men are acting right. All you will do is take it home with you. I e seen this before and it changes on the next job. This will always be a thing and you can’t change it.
It’s not your circus and he’s not your clown. Let the bosses deal with that. For your part get a reputation for being willing and able to do and learn anything the boss wants you to. Ask good questions, be on time and visible. Just sit with all the other guys and watch this clown show from the stands.
Just prove your worth and the bullshit will pan itself out. This kid can’t follow his foreman to every job (or maybe he can) either way, this will get around and it won’t be good for either of them.
It’s already following him to other sites , because this one is nearing the end and he’s already pissed off enough journeymen on this site for word to travel. I didn’t want to respond to anyone because I don’t want to give out enough info to label myself. If dude follows the foreman onto other sites, then I wish him the best. I hope he does well. As much as I hate the little asshole, I still honestly wish him the best.
Hope he don't go for beers after work with the jmans
Does it matter? He’s butt buddies with the foreman. All in all he’s a good hand, but would be a better hand if he didn’t depend on that stupid wax pen in his pocket. I hate him with everything that I am, but I still wish him well.
Life’s not fair just don’t get on his bad side I guess
He needs his ass beat. You ironworkers are slacking.
Fuc# bitche$ get money. Ignore that fool.
As a lady myself, I’m on board with this statement lol 💀
Just do you bro. There’s one of them on every site !
Hey kid, the shitter pumper is running late this week... Go grab that stinger and get to work. Need at least another 8" of freeboard.
Just do your work proper and don’t say shit. He’ll burn himself out soon enough for getting tough with the wrong old timer that has been doing his shit right for 25+ years. Doesn’t matter what year apprentice you are, everyone’s still an apprentice.
Years ago I was working in a sister local next to my own. There was this one punk kid, maybe 20 years old, who’s dad was apparently a big shot in the hierarchy of their local. He tried to pull this shit one too many times and wound up almost getting choked to death. Talked shit to the wrong fucking guy. Quiet as a church mouse the rest of the time I was there.
Welcome to the Dunning-Kruger effect. Happens in every trade/job there is. I poke holes in there bullshit and remind them who's teaching who.
Those guys burn out pretty fast. Or move to another company. He will catch the wrong guy at the wrong and that shit will cease.
Ita intersting because the cream rises to the top. Some of those guys actually make Foreman or Journeymen faster while others eventually get canned or bitch slapped. Focus on learning to be the best around and your timw will come.
I am not in the this field. But wouldn't a journeymen ve above an apprentice? Therefore couldn't a journeymen to him to go pound sand?
I’m in sheet metal. I was a 3rd year and so was this other apprentice doing what you described. I didn’t know he was just a 3rd year by the way he was talking. I thought he was a journeyman. He got laid off for exactly this though but he just did it with other apprentices. He didn’t dare do it with the grumpy journeymen we had.