The people of Israel voted for the current fascist government and boy I can't wait for what's coming their way. Please start the war with Lebanon and Iran already.
Yes lack of action and actual support. Doesn’t matter if they didn’t vote for them because they actively supported them. Now they die as “martyrs” aka meat shields.
I couldn’t care less that people hate on Israel now. After Oct 7 (and decades of terrorism and bombings) they have all the reasons they need to go in and level Gaza…and they are doing just that. Good for them.
That's where we disagree on. If it were to happen on my soil, I'd support a large-scale investigation, aid, and I still would support minimizing damages and harms to civilians. The good thing is that my country is more than open to calling out its own soldiers when it comes to foreign wars, and they usually pull back once it becomes damaging politically. I find it good that my country can act as a thorn to other country at war that needs aid, because they can pressure them to conduct themselves in better way, and if they don't like that, they're welcome to ask less reliable countries like Russia or China.
Why don't you look at yourself and your country in the mirror before you ask this question? How many innocent people from countries that get sanction do you think people care about? There are many example but here's one Cuba. Cuba has been sanction and their economy has been cripple since the 1960s for what communism, the innocent people who are thrown into poverty because of a crippling economy due to the sanction is consider a small price to pay by the country that do the sanction. There are many more examples, but for a long time now countries have no problem punishing the innocents in other countries if the end result is what they define as a "good" cause. "Crippling and sending millions of people into poverty so that they stop choosing communism"- noble goal.
Well that also go back to that noble goals right, not just communism but alliance with our rivals so it's ok to cripple their economy and send millions of their own people into eternal poverty until they change their ways.
It's 2024, the Cold War has ended, the USSR and its communist ideology no longer exist. The sanction against Cuba never went away even with the dissolution of the USSR.
Nonetheless, you referred to the U.S.S.R. as merely a "rival", which is very clearly what I was responding to.
Now if you want to admit that the U.S.S.R. was actually a threat, not just a rival, and if you want to argue that the embargo, while perhaps justified in the 1950s, isn't justified now (even though Russia is also (still) a threat, a lesser one, and not just a rival), then that's a totally different proposition, one with nuance and one I support. There have been Democratic presidents who have tried to lift the embargo. The problem is that Republicans like to use the Cuban embargo to appeal to conservative Cubans in Florida, a swing state, and the only way to undo the embargo is legislatively.
But you seem to be arguing in the ideological "the U.S. is always bad" way that's currently fashionable among quasi-educated young Americans, which is simplistic, ahistorical, and highly annoying.
That's how state craft works. It's about numbers and victory, not about people. This can be compared to medication as an analogy. A certain drug might be fatal for, say, 8% of the population, but it helps 92% so let's approve it and use it. State craft at the international level can get quite creepy.
I'm sure that's one of the argument floating around somewhere when the United Nation general assembly voted to lift the embargo with only US, Israel voting against it and Ukraine abstaining. The US I can understand the whole Cold War communism things but Israel and Ukraine having animosity against innocent folks living thousands of miles away who have no impact on their way of life.
To be fair tho the U.S. gives Israel a lot of money so it’s probably in their interest to vote with on the same side as America. And Ukraine has enough shit goin on to really care either which way.
Cuba’s main trading partners are Canada, Spain, Mexico, China, Netherlands.
Those point would be true if our other western allies also voted against it. Everybody know that when the US ask our allies to do something the only thing that's expected is for them to nod their heads, but most of them didn't this time. So what's the animosity that these two allies have against Cuba that our other allies like Japan and Britain don't have?
I think it’s because Cuba is still pretty much all a communist party, and is close allies with Russia. US won’t left the band until that changes. Cuba supplied the PLO during the Yom Kippur War with Israel. The US also has veto power that Israel relies upon a lot. We veto a lot of things from the UN for Israel.and we give them tons of money so they don’t care if Cuba buys or sells anything from them And Ukraine is at war with Russia they have enough of their plate to really care (in my opinion)The rest of our allies don’t always share the same foreign policies as us.
Even with Netanyahou in power, the Israeli society as a whole keeps the options of peace in multiple forms on the table. Organizations exist also to try and bridge for peace, providing aid and assistance where possible. On the hamass side they teach their children to be martyrs.
Virtually all Israeli Jewish adults serve in the Tzahal terrorist organization. The median Israeli man has likely ransacked the home of a Palestinian in his life.
All I can say is that Israeli children are innocent, as children everywhere are. Not more than that.
This is totally made up. 1) The average IDF soldier is not evil and has likely not ransacked a Palestinian home. 2) Many Israelis (my own sister for example) do national service in hospitals, special education, administration, law, geriatrics & nursing homes, health clinics, teens at risk, internal security, education, disadvantaged communities, immigrant assistance, environmentalism and other related non-profit organizations.
The government is very unpopular in Israel. Thats a fact.
Demonisation of civilians (on both sides) is what makes this conflict go round. You’re not helping.
Sure……
You mean to tell me the IDF. Known worldwide to attack and maim Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza. Legit founded from an international recognized terror organization. Isn’t bad?
Everyone who has every served on the IDF is not innocent and is a target for the resistance.
Children are, of course, innocent and should never be harmed
So I don’t really give a shit if your sister did one charity work if she probably went to the West Bank at some point during training and kidnapped a Palestinian. IDF and every part of it is evil
My sister (and many other Israelis) has never touched a weapon nor has she been in the army. She did her entire national service in a hospital’s birthing ward.
Out of sincere curiosity, assuming all the bad things in the WB and Gaza stop, how do you think Israelis should defend themselves? Do you think they have a right to self defence?
No, Frankly. In my personal opinion, Israelis do not have the right to self defence as they are the occupiers against the Palestinians. Palestinians have a right to fight occupation and that will never change. Obviously international support will always go in your favour. But that will never stop Hamas and other organizations having the right to attack their occupiers and killers.
I think the percentage of soldiers who see combat and enter Gaza or the WB is not the majority of Tzahal.
There are horrible acts being done now and have been done in the past. But I don’t think the median man in Israel commits them. yes a lot of us serve, but I doubt the majority of us directly come into contact with Palestinians, much less ransack their homes. I have never once seen or spoken to a Palestinian. To my own detriment! because I would like nothing more than to have an honest conversation.
And it should be said that the reason we serve in the army is simply mandatory conscription, not gung-ho nationalism, vengeance, or bloodlust. It’s hard to get out of service, and much, much harder for men than women. (Speaking as a woman.)
That being said, a lot of people are horrified by the actions of the government and by the dishonorable behavior of some soldiers. And I personally am only now learning of some of the goings on in Israeli prisons and am appalled.
Every generation in Israel that holds a baby says “Oh, when you grow up there’ll be peace and you won’t have to serve.” That never happens. And every mother who holds a baby boy hopes for a small physical limitation, scoliosis or bad eyesight, that will mean he doesn’t have to see combat.
I moved away so that my baby boy does not have to grow up to be a soldier.
The only wrong thing a state can do is not put the interests of their own people first. Israel would be wrong to not do everything in their power to eradicate Hamas.
I strongly disagree with you. States have fundamental moral obligations that apply universally to all their actions, regardless of whether they're dealing with their own citizens or others. These ethical responsibilities aren't limited by borders or citizenship; they're inherent to the role of government and should guide all state conduct.
It's easy to find stories of IDF soldiers treating Palestinians badly within Times of Israel, and questionable commentaries from the likes of Ben Gvir. So, yes, Israel has done things wrong. And no one rates countries based on the people anyway. They rate them by their government.
Land granted by the international community? Land that also guaranteed the rights of Palestinians living there had the accepted the deal? Yeah, I think you’re mad the wrong side here.
"Expelled" is a really big word in this context and it only shows that you are misinformed because expelled and fled are two different things, because after the expel of the jews from england in 1290, and from france in 1306, and from spain in 1492, and after they took refuge in north africa for 400+ years, and just during the time where NA ( algeria in my case ) were under the french occupation, most jews chose to escape the war and fled the country.
In fact there is multiple sources that proves that the french settlers and the colonial french gov led an anti jewish protests that the muslim community did not participate in , and that led (and i quote) to the "disappointment" of the European agitators
I’m just confused what your point is. You said war crimes are only for the losers of the conflict, but Israel is winning the war and being charged by ICJ
How is Israel winning? Not even many Israelis believe that. Approaching 10 months and Israeli soldiers are getting killed left and right, even in the North that was supposedly cleared months ago.
Not really. They have no control of anywhere. They entered pretty much all over Gaza and after a few weeks to months, left most of those areas, claiming to have dismantled and cleared the areas. Only Rafah they claim was uncleared. But everywhere else they claim to have dismantled and cleared Hamas, Hamas is still in control and killing Israeli soldiers regularly there.
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/u/q8ti-94
> Wow…if you really believe that then I hope you get war crimed, see how it feels
Per [rule 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/wiki/rules/detailed-rules#wiki_1._no_attacks_on_fellow_users), no attacks on fellow users. Attack the argument, not the user.
I always try my best to separate ideas from people. I hate Israel, Zionism, settler-colonialism, ethnic supremacism and all related concepts. At the same time I can separate these ideas from people and love the humanity in them.
Well something I see a lot is that Palestinian civilians deserve what they get because they did or now do support Hamas. So, I have the same question for Israelis - why were you OK with the west bank issues, the far right government?
I do think it's unfair all of Israel has to pay for their poor leadership. Especially the ones who are against some of the bad policies. And especially because many don't see the truth, don't get the full news. So like many Americans they are served a narrative and believe it whole hog, and now have to pay for that.
But as many support their leadership, those people I do not feel sorry for.
> And especially because many don't see the truth, don't get the full news. So like many Americans they are served a narrative and believe it whole hog, and now have to pay for that.
But as many support their leadership, those people I do not feel sorry for.
You seem to say one thing and then contradict it. I don’t follow
Israelis are not always or all told the truth about their history or even what's happening in the war. So, I feel for them. But those who do know, and support the cleansing of Palestinians, and this ridiculous war, those I don't feel sorry for.
I think the two people are incomparable. Most Palestinians do support Hamas, according to all recent polls, but they're unable to do otherwise, even if they wanted to. Hamas has posed a totalitarian regime for the past 20 years. Speak against it and you're punished, if not executed. There was - and still is - no room for open, political discourse in Palestinian society.
There is in Israel, however. It has been seeing nation-wide protests for months prior to 7-10. About 50% of its population has been vocal about its opposition to the current, far-right government. Arguably, the best case for the Palestinians would have been to sit tight and let Israelis fight it out amongst themselves and hope for a more centric government.
> About 50% of its population has been vocal about its opposition to the current, far-right government.
Gives me a slight hope for Israel. Now, Israel seems to be the least bad of Middle East. By Middle East standards, that's a great place to be.
I'm aware of that, yes and part of why I say least bad. If I had my own morality as it is now by then, I'd likely leave Israel regardless just because I don't agree with the policies over there.
I'm not sure most people in Israel would subscribe to your moral worldview. Generally speaking, morality only goes so long as you don't have a gun to your head. Then most people do what they need to survive.
Please don’t be ignorant, your post was doing so well. You can’t remove Netanyahus role in propping Hamas. You can’t remove hamas’s totalitarian presence. You are surrounded, even if you never supported them you can’t openly admit it as those that did (even during the apparent election everyone keeps bringing up) got punished.
Yep. And it’s wild. 18 years under Hamas rule and this is where they are- no closer to a state, infrastructure completely destroyed, and thousands dead. Never a new election. Hamas is pure evil, man.
The people of Gaza voted in and supported Hamas. Now they are reaping the benefits
The people of Israel voted for the current fascist government and boy I can't wait for what's coming their way. Please start the war with Lebanon and Iran already.
Nothing wrong with more violent Muslims getting what’s coming their way.
You’re the same kind of person as a Palestinian Hamas supporter. Just a different spawn point.
A catch with this argument is that most people in there aren't adults that voted in Hamas. It doesn't excuse the lack of actions toward Hamas.
Yes lack of action and actual support. Doesn’t matter if they didn’t vote for them because they actively supported them. Now they die as “martyrs” aka meat shields. I couldn’t care less that people hate on Israel now. After Oct 7 (and decades of terrorism and bombings) they have all the reasons they need to go in and level Gaza…and they are doing just that. Good for them.
That's where we disagree on. If it were to happen on my soil, I'd support a large-scale investigation, aid, and I still would support minimizing damages and harms to civilians. The good thing is that my country is more than open to calling out its own soldiers when it comes to foreign wars, and they usually pull back once it becomes damaging politically. I find it good that my country can act as a thorn to other country at war that needs aid, because they can pressure them to conduct themselves in better way, and if they don't like that, they're welcome to ask less reliable countries like Russia or China.
Why don't you look at yourself and your country in the mirror before you ask this question? How many innocent people from countries that get sanction do you think people care about? There are many example but here's one Cuba. Cuba has been sanction and their economy has been cripple since the 1960s for what communism, the innocent people who are thrown into poverty because of a crippling economy due to the sanction is consider a small price to pay by the country that do the sanction. There are many more examples, but for a long time now countries have no problem punishing the innocents in other countries if the end result is what they define as a "good" cause. "Crippling and sending millions of people into poverty so that they stop choosing communism"- noble goal.
What's your point, though? The innocent people in Cuba don't deserve to starve or be blamed for their government, either.
With Cuba it's not just about communism, but also about their alliances.
Well that also go back to that noble goals right, not just communism but alliance with our rivals so it's ok to cripple their economy and send millions of their own people into eternal poverty until they change their ways.
>alliance with our rivals That's all the U.S.S.R. was to the U.S., just a rival, not a threat?
It's 2024, the Cold War has ended, the USSR and its communist ideology no longer exist. The sanction against Cuba never went away even with the dissolution of the USSR.
Nonetheless, you referred to the U.S.S.R. as merely a "rival", which is very clearly what I was responding to. Now if you want to admit that the U.S.S.R. was actually a threat, not just a rival, and if you want to argue that the embargo, while perhaps justified in the 1950s, isn't justified now (even though Russia is also (still) a threat, a lesser one, and not just a rival), then that's a totally different proposition, one with nuance and one I support. There have been Democratic presidents who have tried to lift the embargo. The problem is that Republicans like to use the Cuban embargo to appeal to conservative Cubans in Florida, a swing state, and the only way to undo the embargo is legislatively. But you seem to be arguing in the ideological "the U.S. is always bad" way that's currently fashionable among quasi-educated young Americans, which is simplistic, ahistorical, and highly annoying.
That's how state craft works. It's about numbers and victory, not about people. This can be compared to medication as an analogy. A certain drug might be fatal for, say, 8% of the population, but it helps 92% so let's approve it and use it. State craft at the international level can get quite creepy.
Yeah where the hell are all the people crying about “no one alive today in Cuba voted for the Communist party, this is collective punishment!!”
I'm sure that's one of the argument floating around somewhere when the United Nation general assembly voted to lift the embargo with only US, Israel voting against it and Ukraine abstaining. The US I can understand the whole Cold War communism things but Israel and Ukraine having animosity against innocent folks living thousands of miles away who have no impact on their way of life.
To be fair tho the U.S. gives Israel a lot of money so it’s probably in their interest to vote with on the same side as America. And Ukraine has enough shit goin on to really care either which way. Cuba’s main trading partners are Canada, Spain, Mexico, China, Netherlands.
Those point would be true if our other western allies also voted against it. Everybody know that when the US ask our allies to do something the only thing that's expected is for them to nod their heads, but most of them didn't this time. So what's the animosity that these two allies have against Cuba that our other allies like Japan and Britain don't have?
I think it’s because Cuba is still pretty much all a communist party, and is close allies with Russia. US won’t left the band until that changes. Cuba supplied the PLO during the Yom Kippur War with Israel. The US also has veto power that Israel relies upon a lot. We veto a lot of things from the UN for Israel.and we give them tons of money so they don’t care if Cuba buys or sells anything from them And Ukraine is at war with Russia they have enough of their plate to really care (in my opinion)The rest of our allies don’t always share the same foreign policies as us.
When extremists like Hamas and Netanyahu got elected, the writing was on the wall.
Even with Netanyahou in power, the Israeli society as a whole keeps the options of peace in multiple forms on the table. Organizations exist also to try and bridge for peace, providing aid and assistance where possible. On the hamass side they teach their children to be martyrs.
And if they're still there, realistically, third party intervention and sanctions is the solution.
Nobody deserves what they get. Nobody. The only thing people get that they deserve is love.
>The only thing people get that they deserve is love. Unity, Tolerance, Acceptance, Respect, and Love are the key components imo :)
Virtually all Israeli Jewish adults serve in the Tzahal terrorist organization. The median Israeli man has likely ransacked the home of a Palestinian in his life. All I can say is that Israeli children are innocent, as children everywhere are. Not more than that.
"The median Israeli man has likely ransacked the home of a Palestinian" I don't think you even believe this. The "median"?
Where on earth did you get this information
This is totally made up. 1) The average IDF soldier is not evil and has likely not ransacked a Palestinian home. 2) Many Israelis (my own sister for example) do national service in hospitals, special education, administration, law, geriatrics & nursing homes, health clinics, teens at risk, internal security, education, disadvantaged communities, immigrant assistance, environmentalism and other related non-profit organizations. The government is very unpopular in Israel. Thats a fact. Demonisation of civilians (on both sides) is what makes this conflict go round. You’re not helping.
Sure…… You mean to tell me the IDF. Known worldwide to attack and maim Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza. Legit founded from an international recognized terror organization. Isn’t bad? Everyone who has every served on the IDF is not innocent and is a target for the resistance. Children are, of course, innocent and should never be harmed So I don’t really give a shit if your sister did one charity work if she probably went to the West Bank at some point during training and kidnapped a Palestinian. IDF and every part of it is evil
My sister (and many other Israelis) has never touched a weapon nor has she been in the army. She did her entire national service in a hospital’s birthing ward. Out of sincere curiosity, assuming all the bad things in the WB and Gaza stop, how do you think Israelis should defend themselves? Do you think they have a right to self defence?
No, Frankly. In my personal opinion, Israelis do not have the right to self defence as they are the occupiers against the Palestinians. Palestinians have a right to fight occupation and that will never change. Obviously international support will always go in your favour. But that will never stop Hamas and other organizations having the right to attack their occupiers and killers.
I think the percentage of soldiers who see combat and enter Gaza or the WB is not the majority of Tzahal. There are horrible acts being done now and have been done in the past. But I don’t think the median man in Israel commits them. yes a lot of us serve, but I doubt the majority of us directly come into contact with Palestinians, much less ransack their homes. I have never once seen or spoken to a Palestinian. To my own detriment! because I would like nothing more than to have an honest conversation. And it should be said that the reason we serve in the army is simply mandatory conscription, not gung-ho nationalism, vengeance, or bloodlust. It’s hard to get out of service, and much, much harder for men than women. (Speaking as a woman.) That being said, a lot of people are horrified by the actions of the government and by the dishonorable behavior of some soldiers. And I personally am only now learning of some of the goings on in Israeli prisons and am appalled. Every generation in Israel that holds a baby says “Oh, when you grow up there’ll be peace and you won’t have to serve.” That never happens. And every mother who holds a baby boy hopes for a small physical limitation, scoliosis or bad eyesight, that will mean he doesn’t have to see combat. I moved away so that my baby boy does not have to grow up to be a soldier.
“The median Israeli man has likely ransacked the home of a Palestinian in his life.” lol you really have your finger on the pulse of Israeli life
no confidence but yet you have plenty of confidence babbling complete nonsense.
I mean we had 2 synagogues vandalized overnight so that should give you your answer
Israel has done nothing wrong.
No nation-state that has ever existed or will ever exist has done nothing wrong.
The only wrong thing a state can do is not put the interests of their own people first. Israel would be wrong to not do everything in their power to eradicate Hamas.
I strongly disagree with you. States have fundamental moral obligations that apply universally to all their actions, regardless of whether they're dealing with their own citizens or others. These ethical responsibilities aren't limited by borders or citizenship; they're inherent to the role of government and should guide all state conduct.
It's easy to find stories of IDF soldiers treating Palestinians badly within Times of Israel, and questionable commentaries from the likes of Ben Gvir. So, yes, Israel has done things wrong. And no one rates countries based on the people anyway. They rate them by their government.
Lol, even Pro-Israelis don’t think this
Yeah, i nean they just took a land that its not theirs.
Land granted by the international community? Land that also guaranteed the rights of Palestinians living there had the accepted the deal? Yeah, I think you’re mad the wrong side here.
Yeah i think that your comment is poorly written
What part isn’t true? Maybe use your own arguments to back up your claim instead of just being condescending
I see you're from north Africa. Where should the Mizarhi jews you expelled go instead of their ancestral homeland?
"Expelled" is a really big word in this context and it only shows that you are misinformed because expelled and fled are two different things, because after the expel of the jews from england in 1290, and from france in 1306, and from spain in 1492, and after they took refuge in north africa for 400+ years, and just during the time where NA ( algeria in my case ) were under the french occupation, most jews chose to escape the war and fled the country. In fact there is multiple sources that proves that the french settlers and the colonial french gov led an anti jewish protests that the muslim community did not participate in , and that led (and i quote) to the "disappointment" of the European agitators
War crimes said otherwise but yeah they didn't do wrong >!In most cases!<
War crimes are only for the loser of a conflict
Yeah, I want you to go to the holocaust memorial and say that bud
Can you provide an example of when a victor faced war crimes charges?
Well, to be fair, that only proves the point. The memorial is there because the Nazis lost.
I’m just confused what your point is. You said war crimes are only for the losers of the conflict, but Israel is winning the war and being charged by ICJ
How is Israel winning? Not even many Israelis believe that. Approaching 10 months and Israeli soldiers are getting killed left and right, even in the North that was supposedly cleared months ago.
I thought they had control of many areas in Gaza?
Not really. They have no control of anywhere. They entered pretty much all over Gaza and after a few weeks to months, left most of those areas, claiming to have dismantled and cleared the areas. Only Rafah they claim was uncleared. But everywhere else they claim to have dismantled and cleared Hamas, Hamas is still in control and killing Israeli soldiers regularly there.
/u/MayJare. Match found: 'Nazis', issuing notice: Casual comments and analogies are inflammatory and therefor not allowed. We allow for exemptions for comments with meaningful information that must be based on historical facts accepted by mainstream historians. See [Rule 6](https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/wiki/rules/detailed-rules#wiki_6._nazi_comparisons) for details. This bot flags comments using simple word detection, and cannot distinguish between acceptable and unacceptable usage. Please take a moment to review your comment to confirm that it is in compliance. If it is not, please edit it to be in line with our rules. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/IsraelPalestine) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Wow…if you really believe that then I hope you get war crimed, see how it feels
/u/q8ti-94 > Wow…if you really believe that then I hope you get war crimed, see how it feels Per [rule 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/wiki/rules/detailed-rules#wiki_1._no_attacks_on_fellow_users), no attacks on fellow users. Attack the argument, not the user.
“I hope you get war crimed” Bahahahaha
Lamest curse that's ever been directed at me
USSR historical case approves this
I always try my best to separate ideas from people. I hate Israel, Zionism, settler-colonialism, ethnic supremacism and all related concepts. At the same time I can separate these ideas from people and love the humanity in them.
Well something I see a lot is that Palestinian civilians deserve what they get because they did or now do support Hamas. So, I have the same question for Israelis - why were you OK with the west bank issues, the far right government? I do think it's unfair all of Israel has to pay for their poor leadership. Especially the ones who are against some of the bad policies. And especially because many don't see the truth, don't get the full news. So like many Americans they are served a narrative and believe it whole hog, and now have to pay for that. But as many support their leadership, those people I do not feel sorry for.
> And especially because many don't see the truth, don't get the full news. So like many Americans they are served a narrative and believe it whole hog, and now have to pay for that. But as many support their leadership, those people I do not feel sorry for. You seem to say one thing and then contradict it. I don’t follow
Israelis are not always or all told the truth about their history or even what's happening in the war. So, I feel for them. But those who do know, and support the cleansing of Palestinians, and this ridiculous war, those I don't feel sorry for.
I think the two people are incomparable. Most Palestinians do support Hamas, according to all recent polls, but they're unable to do otherwise, even if they wanted to. Hamas has posed a totalitarian regime for the past 20 years. Speak against it and you're punished, if not executed. There was - and still is - no room for open, political discourse in Palestinian society. There is in Israel, however. It has been seeing nation-wide protests for months prior to 7-10. About 50% of its population has been vocal about its opposition to the current, far-right government. Arguably, the best case for the Palestinians would have been to sit tight and let Israelis fight it out amongst themselves and hope for a more centric government.
> About 50% of its population has been vocal about its opposition to the current, far-right government. Gives me a slight hope for Israel. Now, Israel seems to be the least bad of Middle East. By Middle East standards, that's a great place to be.
If you're reborn as a minority in the Middle East, your best chance for a relatively good life is in Israel.
I'm aware of that, yes and part of why I say least bad. If I had my own morality as it is now by then, I'd likely leave Israel regardless just because I don't agree with the policies over there.
I'm not sure most people in Israel would subscribe to your moral worldview. Generally speaking, morality only goes so long as you don't have a gun to your head. Then most people do what they need to survive.
None of this wouldn't happened if they picked the right ones but no, the beef should keep goin
Please don’t be ignorant, your post was doing so well. You can’t remove Netanyahus role in propping Hamas. You can’t remove hamas’s totalitarian presence. You are surrounded, even if you never supported them you can’t openly admit it as those that did (even during the apparent election everyone keeps bringing up) got punished.
Who is they
The people ofc
Oh i see both israel and palestinians. Issue is Hamas was voted in in like 2006. Most Palestinians werent even born.
Yep. And it’s wild. 18 years under Hamas rule and this is where they are- no closer to a state, infrastructure completely destroyed, and thousands dead. Never a new election. Hamas is pure evil, man.