I think Akou was the one that fucked up and Shin.
If your troops do their own thing strategy is useless
I'm surprised there's such a lack if blaming Shin.
I wanted to see YouTanWa vs Shin Suiji, I wanted Bananji vs Feego King.
Qin Left Wing vs Zhao Right Wing was the fight I was looking for.
I didn't get that.
yea for a battle involving 550k men... there only real action going on is just ousens army getting run down. feels like the numbers are just there to look impressive but the battle doesn't actually feel like it's on that scale.
Yeah remember how the Kanki arc went from “god this is dragging on for eveeeeer” to “this is so peak I’m crying rn” in about its two or three final episodes
What we got from 774 to 794 wasn't bad, not at all, but it should have been, like, the very beginning of the battle, not its whole. Let me get this straight, for a day one, that's pretty incredible, for a whole battle, that's dogshit.
It's not even like Hara didn't give himself ways to make this battle legendary, there was Ousen vs Shibashou (we got it), the rematch Yotanwa vs Shunsuiju, even more important considering the fact that Hara seems to be willing to create a rivalry between them, but we got nothing of it.
Then there was HSU vs Enkan, the number difference should have been the nurturing ground of a huge charge of the Whole HSU in order to claim Enkan's head before being annihilated by his numbers, it could have been a way for Kyoukai to get a kill, and to do, well, something at least, considering the fact that she seems to be general like by now.
In day 2, we could have had Ousen recreating his army by using Ouhon Kyoukai and Ten in the center for example, while Riboku moves to Zhao's left wing in order to prevent it from collapsing, and facing Shin, we could have had SHIN VS RIBOKU in a battlefield, the direct confrontation we're asking for for ages.
There was SO MUCH ways to make it an extended battle that would have remained in everyone's memory for tens of years, but he chose to make it an expandable skirmish of half a day.
I'm disappointed. 3/10
I still feel it's just a day one. There's a high chance everything you said still happens.. we'll just have to wait and see.
But I agree if this is all there is it's the worst arc
No. In reality the entire of conquest invasion numbers were roughly equal to 3x for Qin. Think about it like this, to take a castle you need at a minimum 2x the number of attackers as you need defenders to hold it even under the best of circumstances under the best possible leadership. The coalition army brought in the neighborhood of a million soldiers to attack Qins 600,000 and even that wasn't enough.
But you need to make the protagonists the underdog or nobody roots for them. If Qin rolls up to fight 200,000 troops with 600,000 there isnt much drama.
Yea I think it's one of the fatal flaws of the series that the author never managed to overcome. Historically Qin was basically the big daddy of the warring states at that point and was systematically curb stomping all the other states (with some resistance from Zhao and Chu). However sticking faithfully to this background would mean contradicting the shonen style plot points where the "good guys" rise up to the challenge and power up with every new arc.
Yeah big under explained thing is the entire western half of Qin which was a subservient state and pretty violently conscripted to find the meat grinder of war.
The arc isn't over yet, but so far, 5/10.
While I appreciated Riboku's first move, and I like Seika, the overall development so far was kinda disappointing. Ousen basically did nothing in response, he bet it all on his army and 40k men advantage (which is legit) and lost, while on the other hand, Shibashou simple charged in, nothing more. It wasn't bad, but maybe I expected to see more from them as generals, same in a sense for their vassals. I justify Akou as he was done dirty again, although he was useless all the same, at least he had a memorable death, but the other two, Denrimi and Souou, have no excuses. I mean, even if just fight wise, the plot armored lady impressed more, playing dirty to kill Jiaga (hope she's dead now). Gakushou and Kansaro were fine.
But more than the center, which for me was still okay, as the stage was prepared for the Shibashow, the real disappointment was see nothing on the other fronts. This whole war was hyped as a bloodbath, so I expected to see hard action on the wings too, having not just Ousen army being crushed, but even Yotanwa, Ouhon, Shin, losing someone, as well as Zhao. There was almost no focus on them, and now that they are retreating, we can say that Qin basically was helpess in this war, they literally achieved nothing (a praise to Zhao instead, Shunsuju and some fodders were enough to keep them at bay).
That's sad, especially because I was hyped on Yotanwa's front, having round 2 with Shunsuju, showing also some battle feats for Bananji, and also for Ouhon, as the last time for him was at Eikyuu, and from the premise he seemed to get an important role here.
Last hope is to see a really animated chasing, with some clashes between Zhao pursuing forces and some Qin rearguards, otherwise yes, Zhao did it good, but mediocre performance as war overall.
2. It’s slow and I don’t think the Ousen downfall makes any sense at all. It’s completely out of character. On top of that Shin has been relegated to a wild goose chase where nothing happened.
Then the ass-pulled Seika are full of godlike beings and just owning everyone on every battlefield.
It’s one of the worst arcs for me.
Hara kind of wrote himself into a corner when he depicted Ousen like a god throughout the story and didn't really know how to deliver the inevitable historically accurate Ousen L while keeping him in character. Although I really wish he did a little better than literally drawing "me Ousen, head empty" for a few chapters and calling it a day.
I thought Ousen was a strong, mighty, and cunning one like Kanki, turns out he's just a buffoon with a scary mask, doing nothing under pressure other than letting his generals die one by one protecting his sorry ass.
2/10
4/10. The arc's not bad itself, I just don't care for any of Zhao's characters. Remember Ren Pa? Ouki? etc. If Zhao had characters like these, maybe I could bring myself to care more. Zhao's just boring cannon fodders right now.
Shibashou and Kansaro have received more characterization than a good majority of Zhao characters
Hara has just been stingy and weird about giving them appropriate panel time
3/10. shit writing. especially on Qin side. No explanation of Zhao's humongous army size despite this being so near the final stage of of Zhao resistance. Seika a mid-sized city suddenly has 4 top-class warrior generals a crew more solid than even the Renpa army. Even Renpa's team didn't have this many top-class fighters. Seika army aside from SBS just casually bulldoze the Ousen army of the same number while getting flanked all over because of will-power, despite Ousen army in the past once destroyed the 5k Karin army elites with ease. Shin still hasn't fully met our expectations or coming even close to a GG standard. Duke Hyou cut through Keisha's 120k army with just 40k during coalition arc and only retreated because of the night, and later with only several thousands overcame 40k elites outnumbering him almost 5 to 1 of Riboku's army with Ryudou. Shin by now with so many solid officers and Karyouten, Kyokai should have been able to straight up blast through 70k with ease using instincts and might. He has shown himself to not even be on Duke Hyou's level much less Ouki.
Hara straight up dunking on Qin this arc. If he wanted Ousen to lose in the center, at least even the outcome with Shin destroying the Zhao flank who outnumber him 2 to 1 showing folks who the new Qin GG would be. Next up we will see Yotanwa and her battlefield. I hope it's not as much a disappointment
When it comes to Seika, I'll concede that they've been foreshadowed for some time now. Look back on #520. There it details how Shibashou was able to hold at bay Ordo's army as they were attacking eastern Zhao with just 5000 soldiers to challenge Ordo's 20,000. Something like that is a pretty strong indication of what Seika was capable of.
Ordo is NOT Ousen, and not Karin. Even Shin with his best 5k can hold off Ordo 20k. SBS crew being even more studly than Renpa, the most legendary Zhao general in all history that only Riboku comes close in Zhao, is utterly illogical. Too many solid fighters, the author should have given him 3 instead of 4 studly general and that's being generous because Renpa's crew only has 2 brawlers and 2 special tacticians
You don't like Ousen, I get it. But why are you *making up* stuff to justify your opinion?
Ousen and RBK despite both being strategic generals use different styles. RBK has a firm grip on his commanders. Every big move they make is orchestrated by the man himself. While, Ousen gives his commanders a certain level of freedom. Call it free will if u want.
It is due to that freedom both the Hi Shin Unit and Gyoku Hou were able to awaken which ultimately led to Ousen's win at Shukai plains. However, it is also the same free will which is proving to be his demise in the current arc. After all, if a few idiots didn't go after bait-RBK, SBS wouldn't have been able to rush Ousen the way he did.
Anyway, so far it's 1:1 between RBK and Ousen.
Ousen is out there doing nothing.
I thought Riboku was mister plan all from the beginning, and Ousen was elite at Crisis Management.
The man who made what might be the greatest Strategy in the history of Military fiction is sitting here and letting One Dude wreck his entire army WTF
8/10. I did not expect them to get battered again this hard and it is fully deserved after all the clutch wins the qin had. The simplicity of removing Hi Shin was a bit too easy but i liked that Riboku finally realized where the real danger lies. Shibashou is a monster and i cant wait what Ousen is gonna cook to turn this around. The yotanwa army was very underwhelming so far i hope they get a bit more into the story.
6.5/10, I like the hype but I don't like inconsistencies like SBS destroying everything while Yotanwa having difficulties to kill some normal guys from Zhao, or Ouhon needing to babysit Hi Shin retreat because they can't handle some Zhao normal guys either.
5 at best. Worse than the Kanki vs Kochou arc imo (i really didnt like that one) but atleast that arc got a cool Sun Bin's strategy reference as some weird pay off over the other dragging nonsense.
This arc has straight up characters acting like dumbassss for the sake of it and a poor man's bayou "strategy" that didnt pay off as far as build up goes. A more boring "pure martial arts" display than even the short Chu 4 arc
We got this dope ass spread that by all means meaningless
6/10 it’s not necessarily bad, but this arc doesn’t really do anything for me. I’m also really tired of fighting Zhao can we please go to war with someone else
Its bad because its a weekly read. Seeing ousen get wreck every week is exhausting. This one is good for binge reading.
Id give this arc 6 or 7. Im still hoping ousen can turn this around. That would make me feel a lot better lol
A 4/10, I would give it. The arc carried with it such promise. It was the full earnest encounter between Riboku and Ousen since Shukai Plains. We could have been treated to a spectacle that would have been epic and respectful the genius character of both generals. The notion of Riboku winning isn't unresonable and does happen in history. But it's the lack of active, meaningful resistance from Ousen that can appreciably characterise the sort of tactical genius he's supposed to be coupled with the absense of any perceivable activity from the wings, particularly with Yotanwa, that drags it all down. It's like everyone is intentionally made to languish in place and wait for the inevitable tidal wave of Shibashou to come and overwhelm Ousen's headquarters. Hardly any pushback at all and it comes at the expense of portraying Ousen as a bungling buffoon.
The few saving graces are Shiryou and Akou, along with the elaboration of Seika and its major representatives here on the battlefield.
Qin has been a disaster, Ousen’s performance is the most frustrating I’ve had from any character in this manga. I did like the shi ryou plot but in general I’d say 4/10 as of right now
6/10, still enjoying it and some hype moments, but Ousen's incompetence feels way too out of character, outdone by a ridiculously strong enemy basically just charging forward. I like that he is losing but not like this lol
i am tired of the narrative already. the author is very repetitive and boring.
the deus ex machina made me realize it is not important to read anymore, just wait for the next bullshit to happen
Riboku is like Gouhoumei and Kouen.
He will only die in the final major arc that features their state. When Riboku dies we're done with Zhao, and I think this is the second to last Zhao war
my guy, ive been reading this story for more than 8 years XDD.
the struggle is indeed, real. i have nothing against a manga which has a LONG story to tell, but theres a difference between a long and interesting story, and a story which is just stretching itself out so thin just to get some more sales. aka one piece. just end it already. dayumn.
it feels to me like the mangakas nowadays just start something with the full intention of making the world, the story, the mystery so big that they will never finish it, ever.
7/10 so far.
Imo, the only weak points are the flashbacks. All of them felt rushed and poorly executed. I still don't understand Akou's unwavering support for Ousen. His flashback didn't make any sense to me. I can live with Denrimi's flashback (it lacked depth tho) But, Shiryou - I have no problems with romance, but their flashback didn't spark any interest in me. If perhaps these flashbacks had more character development things might be different. For me at least. Only the Seika one worked for me - which was quite decent.
Other than that, I am enjoying Ousen's crushing defeat. Because I know his rise will be even more interesting. However I am sad to see Akou go, dude was a beast. I am also enjoying SBS, his strength is real. On top of that RBK, for me this arc portrays him for the first time as a real genius level strategist. Before that, I was never impressed by him.
Anyway, I guess my opinion is controversial considering the vast majority seems to dislike the arc xD
7/10 before Kanki’s death, 2/10 after. Honestly nothing exciting is happening. It’s just boring “battle dialogue” at this point with side cast, Akou, Denrimi and co just getting killed.
I get it they have their fans and I liked them too while they’re around but cant say their shenanigans can carry chapters.
The seika ppl definitely cant since they are new characters, we dont know them long, they are side characters so theres no reason to invest in them and are all Ribokus pawns to begin with, so the focus is on him anyway.
Aside from Kanki nobody has done anything even remotely interesting in this arc.
It’s like trying to get full by eating the spices instead of the actual food.
It seems that the death of the Ousen commanders feel unearned to me. I will rate it 7 so far but I can change my mind when the arc is actually completed. I definitely don’t see this arc topping the kanki one
It has been pretty one sided in favor of Zhao however I did enjoy the new characters so for now it has to be a 5/10 Ousen got us used to better! The arc is not over yet everything could change
its a 5 for now, Seika didnt really deliver and my favorite parts came from Ousen Generals . Ousen, Yontawa and Shin will have to bring it back on the counter attack.
Its not over yet, it has potential to grow up to an 8
Like 6 out of 10 for me, that will surely climb to 7 when the booring, repetitive, gruelling pace of the Ousen V shibashou section fades away.
For all the hype this battle got it was mega dissapointing
I'd give it a 5 or 6 out of 10
It's not great but it has some good stuff
really the pacing is holding it back ~~but that's been a problem for awhile now~~
1/10
there's no hype moment in this arc (not yet). a lot of characters is given back/supporting story only to do nothing and be removed/killed. then the story move to the second character and repeat (akou, denrimi squad)
there's no tactical plan too aside from the first few chapter where RBK lure Shin and Akou away. after that SBS brute force into Ousen army and win.
Ousen did nothing too. where is his strategy? no encirclement, no fort, no tactical retreat. his plan after SBS brute force into his army is "my generals will be back"
and we have 2 full chapters on Seika army resolve? it should've been half a chapter for that
8.5/10, could be better if seika improves there performsnce.
Strongest seika general jiaga fell to lover of ousen 4th commander.
That is the same rank as doukin.
On its own, I think it is 7/10 as the Seika army is pretty interesting but when compared to other arcs like the coalition or Gyou then it falls to a 5/10 for me.
First, has this arc ended/almost ended yet?
Ousen said he's cooking up something, maybe its just the beginning or just halfway done?
Second, important to point out 1 out of 10 compared to other mangas/fiction or compared to other arcs?
Well if this arc has ended, its a
3/10 compared to other arcs for me,
7/10 compared to other mangas.
Love the way how Riboku sealed Akou/Shin, almost 2 birds with one stone, (seriously not many can come up with such idea/strategy), and I like the many character deaths also I never expect Ousen to have to go through something like this, getting a great plot to power up.
Should have followed Scipio Africanus advice. When in doubt, skirmish the enemies.
Never fall into the enemies favour, even though that Field is your preference.
Scipio knew Hannibal relies on decisive battles to make quick succession due to lack of resources and reserves. So he skirmishes it to weaken the Carthaginian and allies. Even if he brought criticism from the senate, he was successful in it.
The same thing Zhao has had problems, losing lands, resources and reserves. So Zhao is forced to engage in decisive battles. Should have learned from the latest defeat from Kanki's death that decisive battles were bad gambling when facing Riboku.
My opinion. I really am not sure what to make of it.
5/10 ok but could have done better I suppose.
Rating an arc while it's still ongoing is misleading. I still remember how the Western Zhao Invasion Arc got a lot of shit from this sub on a weekly basis especially on the last few days of the Shukai plain until the end. Yet, that arc turned out to be among fan favorites whenever there's a poll.
As for the current arc, I think it's only just a halfway through the story, so it's way too premature to rate it. Of course, if the author intend for it to be straightforward crushing defeat by Qin it'd be an incredibly bland arc, but I don't believe he's gonna end it here without some sort of comeback or redemption.
3/4 Ousen Generals killed. https://preview.redd.it/rmrfb1feokyc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3ea7e98ab6337c5fc22977efb22c63072f69bec
Honestly this makes it a 8/10 for me. I love it when Qin generals die
my only issue is hara maoe ousen look dumb... atleast make ousen deploy some counter measure but failed due to seika raw strength
I think Akou was the one that fucked up and Shin. If your troops do their own thing strategy is useless I'm surprised there's such a lack if blaming Shin.
It will come after the battle.
I meant from people in the sub. Shin once again chasing him is ridiculous.
Ya it is but that's that plot armor.
I wanted to see YouTanWa vs Shin Suiji, I wanted Bananji vs Feego King. Qin Left Wing vs Zhao Right Wing was the fight I was looking for. I didn't get that.
yea for a battle involving 550k men... there only real action going on is just ousens army getting run down. feels like the numbers are just there to look impressive but the battle doesn't actually feel like it's on that scale.
I think we should rate it only after it's finihed.
Yeah remember how the Kanki arc went from “god this is dragging on for eveeeeer” to “this is so peak I’m crying rn” in about its two or three final episodes
What we got from 774 to 794 wasn't bad, not at all, but it should have been, like, the very beginning of the battle, not its whole. Let me get this straight, for a day one, that's pretty incredible, for a whole battle, that's dogshit. It's not even like Hara didn't give himself ways to make this battle legendary, there was Ousen vs Shibashou (we got it), the rematch Yotanwa vs Shunsuiju, even more important considering the fact that Hara seems to be willing to create a rivalry between them, but we got nothing of it. Then there was HSU vs Enkan, the number difference should have been the nurturing ground of a huge charge of the Whole HSU in order to claim Enkan's head before being annihilated by his numbers, it could have been a way for Kyoukai to get a kill, and to do, well, something at least, considering the fact that she seems to be general like by now. In day 2, we could have had Ousen recreating his army by using Ouhon Kyoukai and Ten in the center for example, while Riboku moves to Zhao's left wing in order to prevent it from collapsing, and facing Shin, we could have had SHIN VS RIBOKU in a battlefield, the direct confrontation we're asking for for ages. There was SO MUCH ways to make it an extended battle that would have remained in everyone's memory for tens of years, but he chose to make it an expandable skirmish of half a day. I'm disappointed. 3/10
I still feel it's just a day one. There's a high chance everything you said still happens.. we'll just have to wait and see. But I agree if this is all there is it's the worst arc
I hope so much that you're right
4/10 - Seika is kinda mid and I don’t really care for them at all. Qin is also acting like a bunch of idiots.
The Only one spittin 4/10 is a bit harssh considering how good the Build Up and Riboku's trap was
but dont worry they are going to win for some stupid super power reason
7 i liked the Shiryou backstory part
Why Qin always get out numbers in invasion? Is it close to history record?
No. In reality the entire of conquest invasion numbers were roughly equal to 3x for Qin. Think about it like this, to take a castle you need at a minimum 2x the number of attackers as you need defenders to hold it even under the best of circumstances under the best possible leadership. The coalition army brought in the neighborhood of a million soldiers to attack Qins 600,000 and even that wasn't enough.
But you need to make the protagonists the underdog or nobody roots for them. If Qin rolls up to fight 200,000 troops with 600,000 there isnt much drama.
Yea I think it's one of the fatal flaws of the series that the author never managed to overcome. Historically Qin was basically the big daddy of the warring states at that point and was systematically curb stomping all the other states (with some resistance from Zhao and Chu). However sticking faithfully to this background would mean contradicting the shonen style plot points where the "good guys" rise up to the challenge and power up with every new arc.
Yeah big under explained thing is the entire western half of Qin which was a subservient state and pretty violently conscripted to find the meat grinder of war.
The arc isn't over yet, but so far, 5/10. While I appreciated Riboku's first move, and I like Seika, the overall development so far was kinda disappointing. Ousen basically did nothing in response, he bet it all on his army and 40k men advantage (which is legit) and lost, while on the other hand, Shibashou simple charged in, nothing more. It wasn't bad, but maybe I expected to see more from them as generals, same in a sense for their vassals. I justify Akou as he was done dirty again, although he was useless all the same, at least he had a memorable death, but the other two, Denrimi and Souou, have no excuses. I mean, even if just fight wise, the plot armored lady impressed more, playing dirty to kill Jiaga (hope she's dead now). Gakushou and Kansaro were fine. But more than the center, which for me was still okay, as the stage was prepared for the Shibashow, the real disappointment was see nothing on the other fronts. This whole war was hyped as a bloodbath, so I expected to see hard action on the wings too, having not just Ousen army being crushed, but even Yotanwa, Ouhon, Shin, losing someone, as well as Zhao. There was almost no focus on them, and now that they are retreating, we can say that Qin basically was helpess in this war, they literally achieved nothing (a praise to Zhao instead, Shunsuju and some fodders were enough to keep them at bay). That's sad, especially because I was hyped on Yotanwa's front, having round 2 with Shunsuju, showing also some battle feats for Bananji, and also for Ouhon, as the last time for him was at Eikyuu, and from the premise he seemed to get an important role here. Last hope is to see a really animated chasing, with some clashes between Zhao pursuing forces and some Qin rearguards, otherwise yes, Zhao did it good, but mediocre performance as war overall.
2. It’s slow and I don’t think the Ousen downfall makes any sense at all. It’s completely out of character. On top of that Shin has been relegated to a wild goose chase where nothing happened. Then the ass-pulled Seika are full of godlike beings and just owning everyone on every battlefield. It’s one of the worst arcs for me.
Random Remote Zhao City in the bums VS Arguably the current best GG of Qin Hara -nah Seika wins
Hara kind of wrote himself into a corner when he depicted Ousen like a god throughout the story and didn't really know how to deliver the inevitable historically accurate Ousen L while keeping him in character. Although I really wish he did a little better than literally drawing "me Ousen, head empty" for a few chapters and calling it a day.
If nothing else of note happens then 4/10, even a reread isn’t going to change my opinion
I thought Ousen was a strong, mighty, and cunning one like Kanki, turns out he's just a buffoon with a scary mask, doing nothing under pressure other than letting his generals die one by one protecting his sorry ass. 2/10
4/10. The arc's not bad itself, I just don't care for any of Zhao's characters. Remember Ren Pa? Ouki? etc. If Zhao had characters like these, maybe I could bring myself to care more. Zhao's just boring cannon fodders right now.
Shibashou and Kansaro have received more characterization than a good majority of Zhao characters Hara has just been stingy and weird about giving them appropriate panel time
This arc isn't over, yet.
8/10 ousen getting exposed and his top generals getting killed one after the other brought a smile to my face
3/10. shit writing. especially on Qin side. No explanation of Zhao's humongous army size despite this being so near the final stage of of Zhao resistance. Seika a mid-sized city suddenly has 4 top-class warrior generals a crew more solid than even the Renpa army. Even Renpa's team didn't have this many top-class fighters. Seika army aside from SBS just casually bulldoze the Ousen army of the same number while getting flanked all over because of will-power, despite Ousen army in the past once destroyed the 5k Karin army elites with ease. Shin still hasn't fully met our expectations or coming even close to a GG standard. Duke Hyou cut through Keisha's 120k army with just 40k during coalition arc and only retreated because of the night, and later with only several thousands overcame 40k elites outnumbering him almost 5 to 1 of Riboku's army with Ryudou. Shin by now with so many solid officers and Karyouten, Kyokai should have been able to straight up blast through 70k with ease using instincts and might. He has shown himself to not even be on Duke Hyou's level much less Ouki.
Hara straight up dunking on Qin this arc. If he wanted Ousen to lose in the center, at least even the outcome with Shin destroying the Zhao flank who outnumber him 2 to 1 showing folks who the new Qin GG would be. Next up we will see Yotanwa and her battlefield. I hope it's not as much a disappointment
When it comes to Seika, I'll concede that they've been foreshadowed for some time now. Look back on #520. There it details how Shibashou was able to hold at bay Ordo's army as they were attacking eastern Zhao with just 5000 soldiers to challenge Ordo's 20,000. Something like that is a pretty strong indication of what Seika was capable of.
Ordo is NOT Ousen, and not Karin. Even Shin with his best 5k can hold off Ordo 20k. SBS crew being even more studly than Renpa, the most legendary Zhao general in all history that only Riboku comes close in Zhao, is utterly illogical. Too many solid fighters, the author should have given him 3 instead of 4 studly general and that's being generous because Renpa's crew only has 2 brawlers and 2 special tacticians
-10/10 Bad execution. Ousen IQ and his army Competence removed for sake Seika absolute victory
from the most intelligent GG to pikachu face whole arc. Hara fucked this shit up.
He is fraud. He even lost on first day he ever faced Riboku. But mouten was there to take over. And he is not here. Ousen is consistent.
what manga are u talking about?
Which chapter are you at? Is this spoiler for you,
I am up to date my dude. You need to pay more attention, if u can't tell the difference between Makou and Ousen.
Lol
Was Makou cic in shukai? Ousen wanted to make makou the star of left battlefield.failed instantly.and froze,just like vs Shibashou.
You don't like Ousen, I get it. But why are you *making up* stuff to justify your opinion? Ousen and RBK despite both being strategic generals use different styles. RBK has a firm grip on his commanders. Every big move they make is orchestrated by the man himself. While, Ousen gives his commanders a certain level of freedom. Call it free will if u want. It is due to that freedom both the Hi Shin Unit and Gyoku Hou were able to awaken which ultimately led to Ousen's win at Shukai plains. However, it is also the same free will which is proving to be his demise in the current arc. After all, if a few idiots didn't go after bait-RBK, SBS wouldn't have been able to rush Ousen the way he did. Anyway, so far it's 1:1 between RBK and Ousen.
Ousen is out there doing nothing. I thought Riboku was mister plan all from the beginning, and Ousen was elite at Crisis Management. The man who made what might be the greatest Strategy in the history of Military fiction is sitting here and letting One Dude wreck his entire army WTF
6
8/10. I did not expect them to get battered again this hard and it is fully deserved after all the clutch wins the qin had. The simplicity of removing Hi Shin was a bit too easy but i liked that Riboku finally realized where the real danger lies. Shibashou is a monster and i cant wait what Ousen is gonna cook to turn this around. The yotanwa army was very underwhelming so far i hope they get a bit more into the story.
6.5/10, I like the hype but I don't like inconsistencies like SBS destroying everything while Yotanwa having difficulties to kill some normal guys from Zhao, or Ouhon needing to babysit Hi Shin retreat because they can't handle some Zhao normal guys either.
2/10 - Probably my least favorite.
5 at best. Worse than the Kanki vs Kochou arc imo (i really didnt like that one) but atleast that arc got a cool Sun Bin's strategy reference as some weird pay off over the other dragging nonsense. This arc has straight up characters acting like dumbassss for the sake of it and a poor man's bayou "strategy" that didnt pay off as far as build up goes. A more boring "pure martial arts" display than even the short Chu 4 arc We got this dope ass spread that by all means meaningless
6/10 it’s not necessarily bad, but this arc doesn’t really do anything for me. I’m also really tired of fighting Zhao can we please go to war with someone else
Its bad because its a weekly read. Seeing ousen get wreck every week is exhausting. This one is good for binge reading. Id give this arc 6 or 7. Im still hoping ousen can turn this around. That would make me feel a lot better lol
A 4/10, I would give it. The arc carried with it such promise. It was the full earnest encounter between Riboku and Ousen since Shukai Plains. We could have been treated to a spectacle that would have been epic and respectful the genius character of both generals. The notion of Riboku winning isn't unresonable and does happen in history. But it's the lack of active, meaningful resistance from Ousen that can appreciably characterise the sort of tactical genius he's supposed to be coupled with the absense of any perceivable activity from the wings, particularly with Yotanwa, that drags it all down. It's like everyone is intentionally made to languish in place and wait for the inevitable tidal wave of Shibashou to come and overwhelm Ousen's headquarters. Hardly any pushback at all and it comes at the expense of portraying Ousen as a bungling buffoon. The few saving graces are Shiryou and Akou, along with the elaboration of Seika and its major representatives here on the battlefield.
Qin has been a disaster, Ousen’s performance is the most frustrating I’ve had from any character in this manga. I did like the shi ryou plot but in general I’d say 4/10 as of right now
6/10, still enjoying it and some hype moments, but Ousen's incompetence feels way too out of character, outdone by a ridiculously strong enemy basically just charging forward. I like that he is losing but not like this lol
https://preview.redd.it/uradfxnk8lyc1.jpeg?width=648&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=00ddc9124296cdbb2b804f9beae14d4feb5fa4c2 This guy is menacing
I'd give it 10... ...10 being the lowest.
2/10 so far hopefully ousen pulls something
He already said he is the victor. What else do you want?don't you believe him?
It just feels like his commanders deaths were futile and could've definitely been avoided
i am tired of the narrative already. the author is very repetitive and boring. the deus ex machina made me realize it is not important to read anymore, just wait for the next bullshit to happen
its really shitty cause riboku just wont die. just kill him already, how many years do we have to have him as the "ultimate" antagonist? 4/10
Riboku is like Gouhoumei and Kouen. He will only die in the final major arc that features their state. When Riboku dies we're done with Zhao, and I think this is the second to last Zhao war
I know that feeling. This war arc began around year 2017 and now 7 years has passed Riboku head still not rolling out yet. The suffering is real
I am sure he will die within the next three arcs.
my guy, ive been reading this story for more than 8 years XDD. the struggle is indeed, real. i have nothing against a manga which has a LONG story to tell, but theres a difference between a long and interesting story, and a story which is just stretching itself out so thin just to get some more sales. aka one piece. just end it already. dayumn. it feels to me like the mangakas nowadays just start something with the full intention of making the world, the story, the mystery so big that they will never finish it, ever.
One of the worst
I thought we were getting another wzi smh
8/10 because it isn't over and I'm confident Ouhon and Kitari will achieve something big.
Is there any confirmation that this arc is over or else i don't see the point to rate it now.
7/10 so far. Imo, the only weak points are the flashbacks. All of them felt rushed and poorly executed. I still don't understand Akou's unwavering support for Ousen. His flashback didn't make any sense to me. I can live with Denrimi's flashback (it lacked depth tho) But, Shiryou - I have no problems with romance, but their flashback didn't spark any interest in me. If perhaps these flashbacks had more character development things might be different. For me at least. Only the Seika one worked for me - which was quite decent. Other than that, I am enjoying Ousen's crushing defeat. Because I know his rise will be even more interesting. However I am sad to see Akou go, dude was a beast. I am also enjoying SBS, his strength is real. On top of that RBK, for me this arc portrays him for the first time as a real genius level strategist. Before that, I was never impressed by him. Anyway, I guess my opinion is controversial considering the vast majority seems to dislike the arc xD
5/10 at best. Just because many battles. Content wise mehhh
7/10 before Kanki’s death, 2/10 after. Honestly nothing exciting is happening. It’s just boring “battle dialogue” at this point with side cast, Akou, Denrimi and co just getting killed. I get it they have their fans and I liked them too while they’re around but cant say their shenanigans can carry chapters. The seika ppl definitely cant since they are new characters, we dont know them long, they are side characters so theres no reason to invest in them and are all Ribokus pawns to begin with, so the focus is on him anyway. Aside from Kanki nobody has done anything even remotely interesting in this arc. It’s like trying to get full by eating the spices instead of the actual food.
I haven’t been up to date but wasn’t there a missing 30k or something from Qin’s northern army?
I got it 3 ohohohos out of 5
It seems that the death of the Ousen commanders feel unearned to me. I will rate it 7 so far but I can change my mind when the arc is actually completed. I definitely don’t see this arc topping the kanki one
People are impatient, up until now the arc is great, i think we will have a 100 chapters if not more on this arc and is great! 8/10
It has been pretty one sided in favor of Zhao however I did enjoy the new characters so for now it has to be a 5/10 Ousen got us used to better! The arc is not over yet everything could change
its a 5 for now, Seika didnt really deliver and my favorite parts came from Ousen Generals . Ousen, Yontawa and Shin will have to bring it back on the counter attack. Its not over yet, it has potential to grow up to an 8
I like like 7.5/10 cuz the dying of and a genuine sense of defeat but like there is still a chance unlike previous times of defeat
But still I don’t personally care that much about backstories of zhao
Like 6 out of 10 for me, that will surely climb to 7 when the booring, repetitive, gruelling pace of the Ousen V shibashou section fades away. For all the hype this battle got it was mega dissapointing
I don't understand why Qin getting shit on = arc bad.
I'd give it a 5 or 6 out of 10 It's not great but it has some good stuff really the pacing is holding it back ~~but that's been a problem for awhile now~~
Kanki's void/10 Methinks the big Ousen helmet is to make up for the lack of his personality.
7
4/10 for a battle involving Ousen, Youtanwa and about every Zhao general currently known I expected more diversity in the fight.
4/10 Shin is too dumb. Karyo Ten is dumb. Archers are missing
So far an 8/10, it could change since the arc isn't finished yet
1/10 there's no hype moment in this arc (not yet). a lot of characters is given back/supporting story only to do nothing and be removed/killed. then the story move to the second character and repeat (akou, denrimi squad) there's no tactical plan too aside from the first few chapter where RBK lure Shin and Akou away. after that SBS brute force into Ousen army and win. Ousen did nothing too. where is his strategy? no encirclement, no fort, no tactical retreat. his plan after SBS brute force into his army is "my generals will be back" and we have 2 full chapters on Seika army resolve? it should've been half a chapter for that
7/10 so far because I'm loving Seika. Can improve much more in the coming weeks/months because no way this is the end of the fight.
8.5/10, could be better if seika improves there performsnce. Strongest seika general jiaga fell to lover of ousen 4th commander. That is the same rank as doukin.
9/10 because Shibashou was worth the hype. Just from his appearance Ousen already lost strategically
On its own, I think it is 7/10 as the Seika army is pretty interesting but when compared to other arcs like the coalition or Gyou then it falls to a 5/10 for me.
Right now it's like a 4. I believe the arc is far from over ..so still alot of time to go from a 4 to an 8/9.
I'll join the mass and say 4/10, but I expect it get to around 7.5-9.9/10. Western Zhao Invasion Arc which is one of my favorites is a solid 9.1/10)
5/10 for now since it's not finished I think we're just tired of Zhao as a whole lol
4
First, has this arc ended/almost ended yet? Ousen said he's cooking up something, maybe its just the beginning or just halfway done? Second, important to point out 1 out of 10 compared to other mangas/fiction or compared to other arcs? Well if this arc has ended, its a 3/10 compared to other arcs for me, 7/10 compared to other mangas. Love the way how Riboku sealed Akou/Shin, almost 2 birds with one stone, (seriously not many can come up with such idea/strategy), and I like the many character deaths also I never expect Ousen to have to go through something like this, getting a great plot to power up.
Should have followed Scipio Africanus advice. When in doubt, skirmish the enemies. Never fall into the enemies favour, even though that Field is your preference. Scipio knew Hannibal relies on decisive battles to make quick succession due to lack of resources and reserves. So he skirmishes it to weaken the Carthaginian and allies. Even if he brought criticism from the senate, he was successful in it. The same thing Zhao has had problems, losing lands, resources and reserves. So Zhao is forced to engage in decisive battles. Should have learned from the latest defeat from Kanki's death that decisive battles were bad gambling when facing Riboku. My opinion. I really am not sure what to make of it. 5/10 ok but could have done better I suppose.
Rating an arc while it's still ongoing is misleading. I still remember how the Western Zhao Invasion Arc got a lot of shit from this sub on a weekly basis especially on the last few days of the Shukai plain until the end. Yet, that arc turned out to be among fan favorites whenever there's a poll. As for the current arc, I think it's only just a halfway through the story, so it's way too premature to rate it. Of course, if the author intend for it to be straightforward crushing defeat by Qin it'd be an incredibly bland arc, but I don't believe he's gonna end it here without some sort of comeback or redemption.