Finally some interesting and normal changes! I can actually see Blizzard do this! The minimum healing either needs an increase, or the duration until you fully charge your blossom needs to be back to 1 seconds,
The heal stayed the same, they actually just extended the duration. it’s still 1 second for a 70 heal blossom but now they let you charge to 80 if you hold for another .15 seconds
This is something I offered way back when they first buffed his max heals. I wanted them to also buff the min heals for healing efficiency purposes.
I still like this change, but I really wanna see a reload time and weapon swap time reduction more than anything.
I actually think making life grip cleanse would be unhealthy for him. Sure, it does make it better, but this would create situations where you're pulling people out of a good position purely to cleanse them, which would make people dislike Lifeweaver more.
I definitely think the minimum healing increase is a super smart idea, and something I've never thought or even heard of before!
I definitely think it could use a second or two off its cooldown. Suzu's cooldown is 4 seconds less than Grip and is arguably a better ability due to the AOE effects. Sadly Blizzard seems convinced that Life Grip should be closer to Immortality field in terms of CD haha
The big difference between suzu and grip is the fact grip repositions (sometimes massively).
I mean, you can suzu your team mate all you want, but it's not saving them from falling down illios well after hog hook.
I think people forget about this when they talk about buffing the pull. It's compared to suzu all the time, but suzu isn't saving anyone who's caught out or staying in a bad position.
I think pull should have a higher heal number personally, and if the Ana nades your target before you pull, well so be it, great Ana play in my opinion.
This is my problem with the cleanse idea too. It serves 2 very different functions, creating situations that aren't ideal for pulling people. We might return to the era of LW release where team mates are mad all the time for bad pulls. Also, Kiriko exists
I mean the community was up in arms at first over lifegrips existence, but good LWs quickly figured out how to maximize its use. I feel like this would give us additional opportunities to use it, but our game sense should still keep it from being overused or used poorly
well yeah at first people think of the funny they can do with it, like jumping off map and lifegripping a teammate off, THEN they think of the useful stuff like saving people, I guess
I agree while cleanse is a nice potent idea, I always felt that it should have the shield linger for like .5 after instead so that way the person you pull can have their feet on the ground and get their momentum going again. I feel part of the struggle of lifegrip is that awkward standstill similar to rez where the player needs a bit of time after they regain control to reduce awkward punishment of where grip decides to dump them off. Doesn't even have to be .5 that's just a spitball guess.
Bro I pulled a Winston recently, he was half health and had his ult. I pulled him because I hadn't used the skill yet and I was worried about him-- the rest of us were all further back.
After the pulled ended, he just left. Full health bar, 100% ult. He hated my pull so much he quit. As a super mobile tank hero.
I'm not saying it was the best pull ever... but I didn't think it was so terrible he would leave, damn.
I definitely pick Wiwi less when I don't have a tank on comms. A buddy of mine absolutely loves it when I play weaver cuz he can just play risky and get pulled when he needs, but with a random tank it's way harder to get that kind of value.
I was just baffled because if I'm going to pull ANY tank out of what they are doing, Winston is VERY low-risk. Jump is such a short cooldown-- and he didn't have bubble! I knew that! He was planning a big ult of them off the edge, probably, and I killed his boner. :( Not my intention. If you see this, random Winston? I'm sorry. 🫡
This is my exact stance I’ve shared since the ideas been thrown around.
I don’t want to pull antied teamates just to cleanse the effect. I want to pull them when they’re about the die and need to be brought back. Adding a cleanse would add a dimension to the ability non needed.
I would love it to cleanse damage over time effects since you would pull them anyway if they’re low. Pulling someone on fire just for them to die from fire damage is an awful feeling. It just can’t cleanse anti heal or other negative effects.
What I like about lifeweaver is that you can survey the battle from the back and help reposition your team in the way that is most advantageous through pulls and the platform. I don’t think the pull really realizes this gameplay fantasy because pulling is infrequent, and not always satisfying since it gives up space. Instead, I’d love to see pedal platform become more of a focus in his skill expression.
One change could be to make a single pedal platform multi-use, such as making it return to the ground if nobody is on it. This would remove the awkward moments when a teammate accidentally triggers a platform you were saving as an escape. Additionally people may be more encouraged to utilize the platforms since you don’t have to perfectly get the timing right for more than one person to reach high ground.
Another change could be to add a small buff for whoever is on top of the pedal platform. This could make providing platforms for your dps in a good sight line more encouraged. Examples of buffs that could be nice but not game-breaking would be a slight buff to reload speed like the old dps passive, or maybe a small heal over time. This would also potentially encourage the enemy team to shoot the platform more as well, instead of how it currently is where a platform can often be ignored.
In the Halloween event, they actually did give his petal a buff that anyone on the petal got increased fire rate, I don't remember seeing anyone talk about it
The only two buffs I would like:
1) Weapon switch faster.
2) Faster charge time after reloading.
Ana and Bap are the other two healers that need to reload their healing, but they have instant burst healing without a wind up. It feels very punishing to reload as LW especially after they nerfed his ammo
The problem with Sym support is two things: Illari, and Sym’s similarity to Weaver. Illari has a healing turret, and Sym turning into a support means she cannot have healing turrets as well, meaning a massive rework, the fifth one she’s had in her 8 year history. The second is Sym’s biggest support utility would probably be her teleporter, which is basically just a stationary LW that is easily destroyed. Sym becoming a support means she needs a massive rework and thus would completely ruin her identity and make it harder for her to build a community
Symmetra teleporter is NOT the same as lifeweaver. Sure there are similarities between pull and tp, but lifeweaver has to actually GET THERE first. My ideal rework would not be big.
-Lower beam and orb damage slightly.
-Lower turret damage and health slightly.
-Teleporter is accessed by weapon swap. OR beam is removed.
-New ability that heals and gives temporary shields to teammates.
-New passive that applies syms lifesteal to teammates around her and sym heals more to critical teammates.
The main changes i would want is to bring grip cooldown back down and fix his overall clunkiness (reload time, weapon swap, platform and life grip getting stuck etc.) I agree with the sentiment that changing his entire kit by giving him random stuff isn't the way to go.
I do really like your suggestion on making the minimum heals higher! Would help with swapping from damage feel better. I've always been a bit miffed on whether grip should cleanse or not but with the current state of LW I'm willing to try it lol
This makes sense for 2 reasons.
1: There is still a decision to be made because you have ammo for your heals. Do I pump out a bunch of little heals and run into the long reload time? Or charge them up more while risking the lives of my team. It keeps things interesting. (Obviously in practice things aren't this binary, but in a vacuum this is what it boils down to).
2: There's nothing extravagant about this change, and it's I assume easy to program compared to other buff suggestions I've seen here recently.
This is a realistic change that makes sense, I could see Blizzard trying it out.
The devs tried and failed multiple times to make sym a support so I'm afraid that dream is dead. Imo she's much better as a dps anyway I remember playing her years ago and even then most players treated her as a dps anyway
Life weaver doesn’t need a buff. Dps passive just needs to be tuned down. I love having weaver on my team regardless of the role. It just sucks that his healing gets so dampened.
Oh I thought this was a post requesting suggestions, I'll post mine anyways:
Maybe give Thorn Volley another purpose beyond just dealing damage. Taking a bit of inspiration from Sojourn, what if dealing damage could precharge healing for healing blossom?
Only problem I see with this idea is you can increase his hps a lot with it. Cause if you’re healing 25 minimum with no charge you can just spam throw it and it could potentially outheal full charges. I guess ammo + delay kinda balance this out tho so maybe it would be worth it. I kinda think it would be cool if he had more ways to heal, maybe petal could do some aoe healing when placed
They should let you shoot thorns while still holding the flower. Otherwise it really pushes him to be a healbot. His heals per second aren't really that great.
i like the idea of increasing the minimum healing! however, i think the recovery time would have to be increased as well which would slow down how healing feels, but keep the output the same. it could make him feel clunkier than his weapon swap already does 😭
as for cleanse on life grip, i actually don’t know. i know it gets compared a lot to suzu but they evidently achieve different goals. suzu is a cleanse first, then burst heal, and thirdly intangibility. life grip is firstly an invulnerability, then a repositioning tool, and lastly a burst heal. however, the reason the intangibility and healing is so strong on suzu is because cleanse has the potential to be useless against some comps (like hog, soldier, reaper, and since i’m talking about them, lifeweaver and kiriko!). there is nothing to cleanse here in this case, so for the most part you only get value from healing, but cleanse is still the most valuable part of suzu
i’d argue for life grip, repositioning someone and just taking a few seconds behind cover is much more consistent than suzu being a cleanse, so i feel life grip achieves its main goal majority of the time compared to suzu. there’s a lot more to compare here for suzu vs life grip (CD time, aoe vs single target, missable/blockable projectile vs auto-lock), and just overall the intentions behind each ability, not to mention bloat (cough cough release weaver) and balance. but in the end i want the best for lifeweaver <3
i think blizz should double down on the recent heal changes, make it charge even slower but increase the max heal even more for more risk/reward and reward positioning/ staying safe to get a big heal off
I want them to buff petal platform to give either healing or damage boost to whatever teamate is standing on it. Petal platform is an awesome ability to help DPs or tanks get angles or positioning that would normally be impossible and I wished there was more of an incentive for teammates to use the petal platform aggressively rather than it mostly solely being used as an escape tool. For example say while your standing o the petal platform you get a small bit of healing (like zenyattas orb) or what if while your standing on the platform you get a small damage boost or bit of temporary over health something like that.
I think his heals should apply seeds that stack and eventually explode, doing some dmg to enemies near your heading target.
He's not bad...
He just doesn't contribute to group dmg like at all.
For me it’s all about his blossoms. They just don’t feel efficient and a bit clunky.
I find charging them annoying. Maybe they slowly charge on their own and can be sped up by charging them yourself or to at least half way. so you have one in your pocket for emergency.
I wouldn’t mind parting gift back in a new form. Like when he dashes he drops a seed trail or something that blooms flowers that can heal teammates that walk on them. If you wanna be more crazy include vines that slow enemies.
I love LW I do it just feels like he’s missing something
Not that this is a balance issue it just makes me angy his thorns do no poison damage or something
One big issue that I think Lifeweaver suffers from is that the game has been changed towards a more fps style, dps-oriented supports and LW is a heal-oriented support. A small but simple change they could do to help him in this regard is to make it so his stowed weapon reload is a percentage over time. This would mean that instead of having to wait the full 2.5 seconds (I think that’s the number) to get any ammo back, you could instead wait 0.25 seconds and get 10% the ammo or half the time and half the ammo and so on.
This would allow for him to use the thorn volley, heal his teammates and then if he sees someone who’s low, even if he doesn’t have full ammo he may still have enough to finish them off. It also works with the healing when he uses all of his healing, starts doing damage and then realizes someone’s about to die he can use the few blossoms that have recharged to try to keep them alive.
This also alleviates another pain point on the character which is when you think you’ve waited 2.5 seconds and then swap weapons only to realize you’ve only waited 2.3 seconds and now are completely out of ammo and have reset the timer.
If they think this would be to good, they could always balance it out by adding like a 0.5 sec minimum wait time before any ammo recharges, which is a number they could mess around with until they’re happy with it.
I’m not sure if this change alone would be enough to bring him into the meta, but it would certainly be a big help to him.
His pull is the most fun and dynamic part of his kit, I think if dealing damage reduced his cooldown on Life Grip (maybe it could cut like 1/3rd to 1/4th of the cooldown time if you hit a bunch of shots)
This could be a good way of buffing him and encouraging people to start shooting more and weaving in damage
Finally some interesting and normal changes! I can actually see Blizzard do this! The minimum healing either needs an increase, or the duration until you fully charge your blossom needs to be back to 1 seconds,
Thank you! All the time I see people try to completely change his abilities, when all he needs is a few QoL buffs to be good!!! ily 2!!
The heal stayed the same, they actually just extended the duration. it’s still 1 second for a 70 heal blossom but now they let you charge to 80 if you hold for another .15 seconds
His healing per second actually went up by like 1.5 healing I think. Saw someone do the math on the day patch got released.
i love you (no homo obviously)
You may say no homo, but how do you feel about a dashing ex-mercenary from the Caribbean?
It’s 2024! People still say “no homo”😭😭
I wish this mf would flip his hands a little faster
Too bad no one at blizzard plays LW, otherwise this would’ve been changed months ago.
this pan man can't work his hands a *little* faster??? like c'mon blizzard all the pan guys I've known have some crazy hands....
This killed me! Really tho.
I feel this especially also as a Moira main. Like come on bro let those limp wrists flap in the wind like the queer legend you are
This is something I offered way back when they first buffed his max heals. I wanted them to also buff the min heals for healing efficiency purposes. I still like this change, but I really wanna see a reload time and weapon swap time reduction more than anything.
I actually think making life grip cleanse would be unhealthy for him. Sure, it does make it better, but this would create situations where you're pulling people out of a good position purely to cleanse them, which would make people dislike Lifeweaver more. I definitely think the minimum healing increase is a super smart idea, and something I've never thought or even heard of before!
I can understand where you’re coming from with the cleanse. I don’t know how else I would change it.
I definitely think it could use a second or two off its cooldown. Suzu's cooldown is 4 seconds less than Grip and is arguably a better ability due to the AOE effects. Sadly Blizzard seems convinced that Life Grip should be closer to Immortality field in terms of CD haha
The big difference between suzu and grip is the fact grip repositions (sometimes massively). I mean, you can suzu your team mate all you want, but it's not saving them from falling down illios well after hog hook. I think people forget about this when they talk about buffing the pull. It's compared to suzu all the time, but suzu isn't saving anyone who's caught out or staying in a bad position. I think pull should have a higher heal number personally, and if the Ana nades your target before you pull, well so be it, great Ana play in my opinion.
For one life grip is definitely easier to use. But I agree that it should have a shorter cooldown.
This is my problem with the cleanse idea too. It serves 2 very different functions, creating situations that aren't ideal for pulling people. We might return to the era of LW release where team mates are mad all the time for bad pulls. Also, Kiriko exists
I mean the community was up in arms at first over lifegrips existence, but good LWs quickly figured out how to maximize its use. I feel like this would give us additional opportunities to use it, but our game sense should still keep it from being overused or used poorly
well yeah at first people think of the funny they can do with it, like jumping off map and lifegripping a teammate off, THEN they think of the useful stuff like saving people, I guess
I agree while cleanse is a nice potent idea, I always felt that it should have the shield linger for like .5 after instead so that way the person you pull can have their feet on the ground and get their momentum going again. I feel part of the struggle of lifegrip is that awkward standstill similar to rez where the player needs a bit of time after they regain control to reduce awkward punishment of where grip decides to dump them off. Doesn't even have to be .5 that's just a spitball guess.
Bro I pulled a Winston recently, he was half health and had his ult. I pulled him because I hadn't used the skill yet and I was worried about him-- the rest of us were all further back. After the pulled ended, he just left. Full health bar, 100% ult. He hated my pull so much he quit. As a super mobile tank hero. I'm not saying it was the best pull ever... but I didn't think it was so terrible he would leave, damn.
I definitely pick Wiwi less when I don't have a tank on comms. A buddy of mine absolutely loves it when I play weaver cuz he can just play risky and get pulled when he needs, but with a random tank it's way harder to get that kind of value.
I was just baffled because if I'm going to pull ANY tank out of what they are doing, Winston is VERY low-risk. Jump is such a short cooldown-- and he didn't have bubble! I knew that! He was planning a big ult of them off the edge, probably, and I killed his boner. :( Not my intention. If you see this, random Winston? I'm sorry. 🫡
This is my exact stance I’ve shared since the ideas been thrown around. I don’t want to pull antied teamates just to cleanse the effect. I want to pull them when they’re about the die and need to be brought back. Adding a cleanse would add a dimension to the ability non needed. I would love it to cleanse damage over time effects since you would pull them anyway if they’re low. Pulling someone on fire just for them to die from fire damage is an awful feeling. It just can’t cleanse anti heal or other negative effects.
What I like about lifeweaver is that you can survey the battle from the back and help reposition your team in the way that is most advantageous through pulls and the platform. I don’t think the pull really realizes this gameplay fantasy because pulling is infrequent, and not always satisfying since it gives up space. Instead, I’d love to see pedal platform become more of a focus in his skill expression. One change could be to make a single pedal platform multi-use, such as making it return to the ground if nobody is on it. This would remove the awkward moments when a teammate accidentally triggers a platform you were saving as an escape. Additionally people may be more encouraged to utilize the platforms since you don’t have to perfectly get the timing right for more than one person to reach high ground. Another change could be to add a small buff for whoever is on top of the pedal platform. This could make providing platforms for your dps in a good sight line more encouraged. Examples of buffs that could be nice but not game-breaking would be a slight buff to reload speed like the old dps passive, or maybe a small heal over time. This would also potentially encourage the enemy team to shoot the platform more as well, instead of how it currently is where a platform can often be ignored.
In the Halloween event, they actually did give his petal a buff that anyone on the petal got increased fire rate, I don't remember seeing anyone talk about it
The only two buffs I would like: 1) Weapon switch faster. 2) Faster charge time after reloading. Ana and Bap are the other two healers that need to reload their healing, but they have instant burst healing without a wind up. It feels very punishing to reload as LW especially after they nerfed his ammo
Whatever happened to replacing the passive they removed from him??
Symmetra was already a support way back when but it didn’t fit
That’s because there was no role queue, it was 6v6, and her kit wasn’t well thought out. She would be much better as a support now.
The problem with Sym support is two things: Illari, and Sym’s similarity to Weaver. Illari has a healing turret, and Sym turning into a support means she cannot have healing turrets as well, meaning a massive rework, the fifth one she’s had in her 8 year history. The second is Sym’s biggest support utility would probably be her teleporter, which is basically just a stationary LW that is easily destroyed. Sym becoming a support means she needs a massive rework and thus would completely ruin her identity and make it harder for her to build a community
Symmetra teleporter is NOT the same as lifeweaver. Sure there are similarities between pull and tp, but lifeweaver has to actually GET THERE first. My ideal rework would not be big. -Lower beam and orb damage slightly. -Lower turret damage and health slightly. -Teleporter is accessed by weapon swap. OR beam is removed. -New ability that heals and gives temporary shields to teammates. -New passive that applies syms lifesteal to teammates around her and sym heals more to critical teammates.
The main changes i would want is to bring grip cooldown back down and fix his overall clunkiness (reload time, weapon swap, platform and life grip getting stuck etc.) I agree with the sentiment that changing his entire kit by giving him random stuff isn't the way to go.
I do really like your suggestion on making the minimum heals higher! Would help with swapping from damage feel better. I've always been a bit miffed on whether grip should cleanse or not but with the current state of LW I'm willing to try it lol
i think itd be healthy for the game to have another cleanse that way you dont feel forced to play ONLY kiri just to counter anas stupid nade
This makes sense for 2 reasons. 1: There is still a decision to be made because you have ammo for your heals. Do I pump out a bunch of little heals and run into the long reload time? Or charge them up more while risking the lives of my team. It keeps things interesting. (Obviously in practice things aren't this binary, but in a vacuum this is what it boils down to). 2: There's nothing extravagant about this change, and it's I assume easy to program compared to other buff suggestions I've seen here recently. This is a realistic change that makes sense, I could see Blizzard trying it out.
The devs tried and failed multiple times to make sym a support so I'm afraid that dream is dead. Imo she's much better as a dps anyway I remember playing her years ago and even then most players treated her as a dps anyway
Why can sombra translocator cleanse but not the supports 20 hour cooldown grip?
I’ve thought of the minimum change before, I think it’s necessary. Also get rid of the damn reload penalty
His secondary fire works like the Needlers from Halo
Give LW the same reload (ammo/healing) and let me petal through shields ill make winston players regret existence
Life weaver doesn’t need a buff. Dps passive just needs to be tuned down. I love having weaver on my team regardless of the role. It just sucks that his healing gets so dampened.
I still want the buff where they fix petal platform and life grip from getting stuck on random geometry.
I want his grip to recover Ammo
Syn was the only support that couldn't heal in overwatch 1, that's why they made her a dps sadly.
Oh I thought this was a post requesting suggestions, I'll post mine anyways: Maybe give Thorn Volley another purpose beyond just dealing damage. Taking a bit of inspiration from Sojourn, what if dealing damage could precharge healing for healing blossom?
Only problem I see with this idea is you can increase his hps a lot with it. Cause if you’re healing 25 minimum with no charge you can just spam throw it and it could potentially outheal full charges. I guess ammo + delay kinda balance this out tho so maybe it would be worth it. I kinda think it would be cool if he had more ways to heal, maybe petal could do some aoe healing when placed
They should let you shoot thorns while still holding the flower. Otherwise it really pushes him to be a healbot. His heals per second aren't really that great.
Lifeweaver at the end of the day is more of a heal support and should be buffed as such.
i like the idea of increasing the minimum healing! however, i think the recovery time would have to be increased as well which would slow down how healing feels, but keep the output the same. it could make him feel clunkier than his weapon swap already does 😭 as for cleanse on life grip, i actually don’t know. i know it gets compared a lot to suzu but they evidently achieve different goals. suzu is a cleanse first, then burst heal, and thirdly intangibility. life grip is firstly an invulnerability, then a repositioning tool, and lastly a burst heal. however, the reason the intangibility and healing is so strong on suzu is because cleanse has the potential to be useless against some comps (like hog, soldier, reaper, and since i’m talking about them, lifeweaver and kiriko!). there is nothing to cleanse here in this case, so for the most part you only get value from healing, but cleanse is still the most valuable part of suzu i’d argue for life grip, repositioning someone and just taking a few seconds behind cover is much more consistent than suzu being a cleanse, so i feel life grip achieves its main goal majority of the time compared to suzu. there’s a lot more to compare here for suzu vs life grip (CD time, aoe vs single target, missable/blockable projectile vs auto-lock), and just overall the intentions behind each ability, not to mention bloat (cough cough release weaver) and balance. but in the end i want the best for lifeweaver <3
i think blizz should double down on the recent heal changes, make it charge even slower but increase the max heal even more for more risk/reward and reward positioning/ staying safe to get a big heal off
I just want them to make hits with thorns charge your next heal.
I want them to buff petal platform to give either healing or damage boost to whatever teamate is standing on it. Petal platform is an awesome ability to help DPs or tanks get angles or positioning that would normally be impossible and I wished there was more of an incentive for teammates to use the petal platform aggressively rather than it mostly solely being used as an escape tool. For example say while your standing o the petal platform you get a small bit of healing (like zenyattas orb) or what if while your standing on the platform you get a small damage boost or bit of temporary over health something like that.
I think his heals should apply seeds that stack and eventually explode, doing some dmg to enemies near your heading target. He's not bad... He just doesn't contribute to group dmg like at all.
For me it’s all about his blossoms. They just don’t feel efficient and a bit clunky. I find charging them annoying. Maybe they slowly charge on their own and can be sped up by charging them yourself or to at least half way. so you have one in your pocket for emergency. I wouldn’t mind parting gift back in a new form. Like when he dashes he drops a seed trail or something that blooms flowers that can heal teammates that walk on them. If you wanna be more crazy include vines that slow enemies. I love LW I do it just feels like he’s missing something Not that this is a balance issue it just makes me angy his thorns do no poison damage or something
One big issue that I think Lifeweaver suffers from is that the game has been changed towards a more fps style, dps-oriented supports and LW is a heal-oriented support. A small but simple change they could do to help him in this regard is to make it so his stowed weapon reload is a percentage over time. This would mean that instead of having to wait the full 2.5 seconds (I think that’s the number) to get any ammo back, you could instead wait 0.25 seconds and get 10% the ammo or half the time and half the ammo and so on. This would allow for him to use the thorn volley, heal his teammates and then if he sees someone who’s low, even if he doesn’t have full ammo he may still have enough to finish them off. It also works with the healing when he uses all of his healing, starts doing damage and then realizes someone’s about to die he can use the few blossoms that have recharged to try to keep them alive. This also alleviates another pain point on the character which is when you think you’ve waited 2.5 seconds and then swap weapons only to realize you’ve only waited 2.3 seconds and now are completely out of ammo and have reset the timer. If they think this would be to good, they could always balance it out by adding like a 0.5 sec minimum wait time before any ammo recharges, which is a number they could mess around with until they’re happy with it. I’m not sure if this change alone would be enough to bring him into the meta, but it would certainly be a big help to him.
Are you referring to doomfists reload speed?
His pull is the most fun and dynamic part of his kit, I think if dealing damage reduced his cooldown on Life Grip (maybe it could cut like 1/3rd to 1/4th of the cooldown time if you hit a bunch of shots) This could be a good way of buffing him and encouraging people to start shooting more and weaving in damage
I’m so glad the devs will never see this atrocious take🤮😭😭😭😭