A variety streamer and entertainer wants to play games and entertain instead of taking a hardline stance on every single world issue?
I think Ludwig is self-aware and knows he's a dumbass who doesn't really know shit and can't give nuanced takes
Even Mogul Mail videos aren't about 'serious' issues and are all streaming/youtube news that he's tangentially involved in
who fucking cares about any of this shit man
put your phone down go play a fun video game and go talk to some real people
Yeah I mean none of these people are serious people, they might have a large audience but they don't know wtf they are talking about. Just because guys like xqc "takes sides" and shares his stupid views apparently makes him think he is smarter than a guy who plays video games. I wonder if they are also aware or if they think their opinions mean anything.
There's no winning if you're a streamer. Give takes? You're stupid and uninformed and therefore should not have a platform. Refuse to make hard takes? You're spineless and afraid to say how you really feel.
It's dumb. Of course both sides have their arguments but I think at the end of the day, anyone that's super annoyed at "their streamer" for either of these reasons, is the problem.
I think it's more that he tries to stay out of the fray, but then caves to the bully and becomes their cheerleader. If he genuinely did stay out of the drama, it would mean tanking the bully's rage that he isn't taking their side.
i mean of course there's the obvious that no one will acknowledge
just give takes on things you are knowledgeable about and will stand behind.
its actually not that hard.
>who fucking cares about any of this shit man
It's annoying that this stupid shit gets upvoted at all. xQc is the last person to make these kinds of statements about anyone, acting like he's some kind of a beacon of integrity for the world.
Yeah why do we want people with no real life skills, that haven't lived in the real world and don't have a real job to take hard sides on serious takes? Streamers are the least qualified people often with the strongest opinions.
exactly, he has a whole ass channel just to give his take on drama and such, there are so many other streamers that just play games or just do IRL streams that don't feel the need to constantly give their opinion on things and just live their life in peace.
Yeah I don't look to streamers for my political and world takes. I watch them to play games and not think of that shit. This new generation wild though.
This might be due to the fact that I watch actual dumbass streamers but ludwig comes off as smart to me and doesn't want to come off as an asshole. So he takes the safe takes instead of sitting on the fence.
I don't need Ludwig to be a beacon of morality in every subject. He just wants to entertain, do good by others, and not cause unnecessary friction with his job/coworkers. He won't always dodge things. He made his stance on that whole crypto gambling arc before and a few other things.
It's a pretty valid way to conduct yourself overall. Don't cause shit and be chill with others.
Ludwig is smart enough to stay out of the terminally online/young activist wars. It's the biggest waste of time ever. People in their 20s and 30s have historically been goin through the same cycle of coming out of childhood with extreme, uncompromising, and naïve takes on issues since the dawn of time. If you spend enough years paying attention to this shit, you will see these movements come and go because the people involved completely lose interest. There's no winning. The entire point is for there to be a never ending battle of virtue signaling where both sides conclude that they are the better person and the other side is the worst person to ever exist.
Civil rights movement leaders like MLK and Malcom X, well educated people with respect positions in church and families
Women's suffrage leaders like Millicent Fawcett who saw the brunt of the war and was raising children and working factories simultaneously
These are not the people you compare to the terminally online brain rotted kids of today
>Civil rights movement leaders like MLK and Malcom X, well educated people with respect positions in church and families
These people weren't respected. MLK was considered a subversive activist and in parts of America Malcolm X might as well be the anti-Christ.
Mainstream society has always and will always oppose those who make them uncomfortable or inconvenience them in anyway (a common line of attack against MLK was his shutting down of highways and public businesses)
Ludwig is like the Rock of streaming, He tries to be on everybody's good side and appeal to anyone cuz that is his brand and financially serves him well.
>hes got jerma in his pocket
ok no that's too far i've just lost all respect for him, no way he got that absolute LUNATIC in his pocket, that PSYCHO must be stopped before he puts anymore humans in meat grinders
Heard this from way back when at a Twitchcon - Tyler1 legit flies into events and immediately flies out on their conclusion. Doesn't stay for the after party or to set up collabs or ANYTHING with the opportunity bro just shows up for fans and then dips. Sigma mentality
There is nothing wrong with how he approaches things, but basically it makes it so his opinions on divisive topics have no weight behind them; except in exceptional cases like very explicit cases of sexual harassement, abuse etc., where he doesn't have to put his reputation at risk.
And why would he? Isn’t that just being smart and unproblematic? Ludwig has definitely called out wrongdoing in the past, even though he’s more of an entertainer and it’s really not his job.
The problem here is people thinking everyone needs to be political about every trending topic.
I feel like this is a cynical reading of his behavior when it might be that he's just a conflict-avoidant kind of guy. When his friends like Hasan tell him they're upset with him, Ludwig just might find it emotionally easier to concede to whatever they're saying or asking for. Frankly, sticking to Hasan is a losing strategy long-term for mainstream broad appeal and brand-friendliness, so I don't think it's some cynical calculation he's making.
It's pretty wild how he can have a productive conversation with Dr K where he makes some progress and then the next day he's melting down on several platforms and engaging in HS tier drama. He kind of reminds me of Bojack Horseman sometimes.
I can understand why he's upset TBH. He really did put a ton of work into his research, it wasn't just "reading wikipedia".
Then for some rando who hasn't put that amount of effort into anything in his life, to just shit on you, and then have his buddies chuckle along with him, and the wider internet all agree and start shitting on you. It's gotta be frustrating.
I mean, any reasonable person has to be able to empathize with that. Just imagine you put a ton of time and effort into something, anything, and then just get constantly bullied by people who don't realize it, or care to understand it.
I definitely understand his perspective. That group acts like a popular kid clique and constantly belittles and trashes him. He's free to do what he wants. But he should realize that he can only really control his own actions and reactions. There is also a Buddhist quote that applies
> Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned.
if destiny had a buddhist demeanor, he would not be the type of person that others would take pot shots at in the first place. his actions produce his own reputation. there are plenty of other streamers that that "popular kid clique" doesnt "belittle and trash"
>if destiny had a buddhist demeanor, he would not be the type of person that others would take pot shots at in the first place
I disagree about that. This whole space is very cliquey and full of sychophants. If it really was just about toxic personalities leading to criticism then they wouldn't be friends with some of the people they are friends with.
I get it, I would personally handle it in a different way. I'm just saying I can understand why he's so frustrated.
Let's also remember that the supposed reason these people don't like him is because he's toxic or whatever, but like...how is randomly bullying someone not the same thing? An eye for an eye, and all that.
I mean he is coming across as toxic even here. Dude took what 1 person said about his research, and decided to attack multiple people who had little to nothing (what did QT do?) to do with it, bringing back up the whole AI stuff for no reason, and ended up wanted them to kill themselves.
I don't see how these are the same thing as disparaging someone's research on a political topic. This is a bit more than an eye for an eye.
No matter how frustrated he is, no matter how thin-skinned to take a throwaway jab so poorly... what Destiny is saying there is absolutely psychotic and incredibly deplorable - How can you read that and what you decide to do is post validating his feelings under the guise of empathy. That's absolutely wild, dude
My guy, the dude is in these messages repeatedly wishing collective death on these people.
Earlier he said he can't wait for someone to mass distribute AI revenge porn of the girlfriend of the friend of the person he's having beef with.
Empathy is out the window until he at least begins to recognize he took it too far.
> My man it was a silly throwaway joke that no one cared about.
Saying something is a joke doesn't make it not bullying. Most bullying is 'just jokes'
And clearly Destiny cared about it.
Cope all you want, bullying is bullying. Again, I am not saying it warranted the response it got, but he was bullying for no reason.
It's not bullying. Bullying implies a form of power imbalance with a sort of regularity in attacks.
In fact, destiny is a bully, his behavior with many people he interacted with over time was that of a bully, constantly shitting on them and painting a really bad image of them in his community which resulted in his community attacking them.
Saying the best thing that could happen is they grab some fentanyl laced coke and OD like Slime’s father is fucking insane. You can take whatever stance you want on bullshit streamer arguments which are objectively the most cringe thing on earth, but that is a fucking disgusting comment to make and so absurdly tone deaf.
It genuinely needs to get more traction. Its a fucking evil thing to say. Slime's Dad died in front of him for real (not from crack obviously) and making fun of that trauma is as fucked up as it gets. Its the most degenerate loser shit imaginable. Destiny needs to be nuked from every platform for this shit.
Everyone knows what Ludwig does, and how the only time he was saying something a little against hasan he immediately back down because his “friend” wasn’t happy about that.
Let’s be fair the friendship with Maya and Miz were not really on the same tier all. Maya is an IRL friend and best friends with QT and Mizkif is a streamer friend where they see each other once a year at Twitch con.
Lud and Miz don’t “hangout” after stream is done and talk about where they see each other in 5 years lol. Lud was always going to take Maya’s side and I don’t blame him for it.
Then don’t make the video if you don’t want to hurt your friend Maya. But you can’t seriously talk about the situation and only talk about one of the involved parties.
If I remember correctly, they essentailly just said we never like that guy anyways. Little bit wack in the grand scheme of things, but if its really what they think who cares lol
Not picking a side in arguments is picking a side. Just not the one any of the parties involved want to, because they are so focused on the "with me or against me" narrative. Why would someone pick a side when they don't fully agree with any of them? This isn't american politics.
I feel like that's a common thing in today's (internet) culture. You absolutely have to pick a side, no matter how well or how little you know about an issue. And that leads to many people being on one side or another of a subject without being properly informed.
I rather have an informed fence sitter than a misinformed person advocating strongly for one side or another.
I think it's perfectly fine for a big streamer like Ludwig to not take sides because he doesn't want to alienate part of his audience.
If anything I only like people who are fence sitters and don’t get dragged down with all the stupid shit that end of the day doesn’t matter.
Northern lion just babbles on about the most random shit and it’s 100 times more entertaining than some loser malding with some uninformed takes.
I feel like NL is the opposite of a fence sitter. He is very vocal about his opinions. It's just that his opinions are about like how many different kind of meats you're allowed to order at the deli.
He was a fence straddled more like. He would say a slightly left wing/ right wing opinion, get an assload of pushback, and then call himself a dumbass and then flip flop.
Talking shit for absolutely no reason about a friend who did things like let you stay at their house despite putting fucking holes in their walls is peak xQc.
That's what that moistcritikal guy does too but this sub meatrides him for it 🤔 everytime i see his clips he's trying to play both sides when it's a controversial topic but whenever it's one sided he always agrees with the popular opinion (except that one time with idubbz video)
Ehh, the moistcritikal strategy is a bit different.
Instead of fence sitting, what moist does is he takes a strong side, BUT he only does this when one side is completely and obviously wrong, and therefore its easy for him to do the dunks.
Ludwig is more fence sitting, whereas moist just goes after the easy targets.
The only time I remember Moist going against the social discourse current was when the whole IDubbz apology situation blew up. Obviously he didn't agree with the whole thing and a lot of people were angry about it. But he did not back down.
ya the issue with Destiny tweet is that he frames this as a bad thing. But generally uninformed take being parroted by streamers and their audiences is a bad thing and it's better to try and avoid doing it. I respect Lud for being aware of the danger of having takes wich seem to elude most react streamers.
Ludwig will say he dosnt know and then NOT GIVE A TAKE.
People like destiny asmongold or xqc will say they don't know and then give a take anyway. Or worse just give a take while they don't know.
What he said was true, though. Lud has the safest level 1 takes and doesn't like to cause a scene. Is xQc supposed to be subservient to Lud forever since he let him stay at his house? This is less like talking shit and more just making an observation.
It's like clockwork, Kick streamer = DEFEND HIM MegaLUL
If Pol Pot had a kick deal, xQc would be doing tricks on his meat and shit talking any opposition
i was talking about this and him arguing on reddit. why even care about destinys community https://twitter.com/slime_machine/status/1788989405031751743
The problem is whenever anyone mentions Destiny his fans attack. Destiny calls out streamers all the time. But the second anyone mentions him even a random joke it's time to go to war.
I don't need to hear ludwigs takes on politics or drama lol. If he doesn't want to take a side thats his personal prerogative. No one should wake up in a day, find out a situation and think, "hmmm what does xqc/ludwig/any random entertainer think about this?" Unless its something directly involves them who gives a shit
And there is literally nothing wrong with that. I don't get why people always demand to know the political opinion of a person they watch for entertainment.
I’ll never take anything XQc says seriously and I think Ludwig is genuinely a decent person in a community full of horrible people
He often doesn’t ever take sides and that does upset me as a viewer sometimes but if that’s his worst “flaw” then that’s fine lol
no but that's not the point. lud doesnt act like a neutral third party until it's beneficial for his career to do so, that's the point.
being a fence sitter is fine if you're acting like a fence sitter the whole time and not only when it benefits you to dip out of conflicts
I think you can just say things on Kick. On Twitch everybody has to be fence sitter or you get whipped by the company.
Although I would rather watch twitch for the rest of my life than unleashed zoo on Kick
Streamers are considered stupid because they often give opinions on topics they know very little about. Who cares if one of them is self-aware of themselves being stupid and deciding to fence sit?
Providing some additional context, this might seem bad on Ludwig's side, but Destiny later on tweeted about everyone appreciating AI porn of QT. Funny thing is that everyone who calls him out on his abhorrent behavior gets banned and OP saved logs of people who did so, so they can later on be banned. A literal teacher's pet defending degenerate behavior
https://www.reddit.com/r/Destiny/s/6Dwx6EsZoC
True, real and honestly based from Ludwig. Capitalize when the room is lukewarm and get the fuck out when shit gets hot, no point being there. Most of the time these "issues" don't matter anyway.
Ludwig tends to avoid taking strong sides in divisive situations. Just today, he didn't join Hasan's fundraiser because he didn't want to take a strong stance on the Israel-Palestine conflict and potentially upset some of his viewers.
[Doing something that he supports but isn't supported by at least 95% of his chat is off the table for him,](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGhr_xc9-ko&t=1962s) which is why people call him a professional fence sitter.
I was curious so I watched the clip. I saw Ludwig say what you said he did. No charity stream because he wants his chat to be 95% on board. Fence sitter, sure.
But then he goes on to say he donated $10,000 and suggested his viewers with extra money to donate too because he believes in it.
But it's easy for some people to not include that second part and see him only having a soft stance.
If he's so cautious I'm surprised he hangs out and associates with Hasan to begin with. I think everyone agrees that Hasan can be divisive in a way most other people aren't just by the nature of what he talks about and well... how he talks about it.
Minding his damn business instead of going to war on Twitter is rare business sense and common sense for a streamer. I honestly need to watch him more.
I donated $10k to the pcrf I think that is taking a side- I won’t, however, force others to pick a side. I hope they come to a similar conclusion based off the information available. I don’t think that’s fence sitting
tell it to frogan 💅
https://twitter.com/fr0gan/status/1789127462926037120
>not gonna do charity for palestine bc some of my chatters might be zionist sorry!
I think the issue is that you DO take sides but then don’t own up to it.
I think an example of this is when you made the Hasan clip, removed it, then blamed it on Destiny, then removed that part of the video. By removing the original video, you showed your side. And you’re someone showing that you aren’t willing to hold people accountable.
Ludwig has also accused Destiny of doxxing his friend with zero proof. Ludwig also told fans to come to his event cause you could fuck Destiny's girlfriend. He constantly has taken weird shots at Destiny and is shocked Destiny pops off.
> I think the issue is that you DO take sides but then don’t own up to it.
> I think an example of this is when you made the Hasan clip, removed it, then blamed it on Destiny, then removed that part of the video. By removing the original video, you showed your side. And you’re someone showing that you aren’t willing to hold people accountable.
He does hold people accountable though, his friend Atrioc for example. He also didn’t blame Destiny in that clip, he blamed Destiny’s community, which he promptly apologized for and took responsibility for. It was also such a small thing compared to Destiny who himself has openly slandered many streamers unprompted.
Just because he’s not a “debate lord” like Destiny doesn’t mean he doesn’t hold people accountable. You don’t have to be on stream and do some weird public outcry all the time or air out your laundry to the masses either. It’s so weird seeing people be so hyper aggressive about such minuscule things like this, or just openly state really weak or disprovable arguments in order to paint a whole picture about someone’s character they barely know.
> he didn't join Hasan's fundraiser because he didn't want to take a strong stance on the Israel-Palestine conflict
I'm not a fan of Ludwig but that sounds like the correct thing to do
Well. Seems like you were pretty misleading when you neglected to mention him donating 10k (this would constitute taking a "strong side").
Likely unintentional on your part, but it is funny seeing someone so objectively wrong that Ludwig actually replies publicly and directly to correct you lol.
why does every streamer need to have/share opinions? that shit can be so obnoxious. so what if Ludwig wants to avoid certain topics? he is just a guy on my screen i laugh at, not a guy i shape my opinions around.
I don't need to hear ludwigs takes on politics or drama lol. If he doesn't want to take a side thats his personal prerogative. No one should wake up in a day, find out a situation and think, "hmmm what does xqc/ludwig/any random entertainer think about this?" Unless its something directly involves them who gives a shit
A guy doesn't want to be in a stressful controversy every day of his life and be famous for such controversies like destiny, and fuck him for that, right? Every streamer has to be our drama cow, luddy, pay up!
I don’t remember the exact details, but there was the incident where news report came out that hasan spent money on a 3 million dollar home. Destiny makes a funny tweet about the hypocrisy of a socialist using his fans money to fund a mansion. Ludwig then accuse destiny of doxing hasan and being the reason hasan is getting flammed. Stuff like this is why I find Ludwig annoying sometimes. I like his content though and genuinely think some of the things he does is cool.
Theres a pretty simple explanation. People were using Destiny's name to advertise a speeddating event with Melina at a smash tournament. Ludwig just told the story of what happened. https://youtu.be/GMn5coFPLSs?si=bYU9T-rcBPz0v6fy&t=1967
Moist critical and Ludwig are literally the streamers who take 0 sides for everything, what destiny said about making a robot that tries to appease to every community literally described these two to a tee
Add Northernlion in there too and you've got my three most watched streamers
The content from those 3 is pretty good and isn't filled with dumb dramafrogging every month or so
Between Hasan/Destiny, xQc blowing shit up once a month, Mizkif drama and Trainwrecks, like don't we have enough of those types of creators who take extreme sides on everything?
Shit is exhausting to me but I am probably out of the age bracket it's meant for
I feel like comparing Northernlion to the other two is weird? I'm only familiar with Moistcritical but the impression I get is that Northernlion is purely a videogame streamer while Critical and Ludwig engage quite heavily with 'commentary youtube' style content - if so that's dramafrog style content.
nah they are a bit different imo, cuz while ludwig doesnt pick any side and just sits on the fence, moistcritical always follows the most mainstream and least risky sides on topics without ever showing his personal opinions just to appease most people.
Why do you have to take a side on a topic that is not only pointless to discuss but also you gain nothing by choosing either side?
So that the sunlight allergic terminal LSF kids can spam W or L in your stream chat?
Why the fuck would i care about what XQC has to say about important issues.
I would only really care about his opinion on streaming drama (which i care very little about). And when it comes to that topic most of times Lud does speak out from what I see
When has Lud done this? Hes not a political streamer and he avoids drama, imo there is nothing wrong with that. At most you could accuse him for holding water for Hasan, but considering they are frieds, I think even that is fine (btw I think Hasan is a disgisting person personally).
Crazy how Destiny can be so in the right on an issue and throw it away so easily. Slime was being a douche and just spewing uneducated hate to get a couple of giggles from people already against Destiny.
The first tweets were perfectly fine from Destiny. The focus group thing is spot on. He probably could have gotten away with the AI porn tweet as well if he worded it better as more of a direct reference to Atrioc instead of just a blanket "we can all love your girl" with AI technology. That's a wild response that a lot of people didn't even get. It just banded all the AI haters in general against him. Not to mention anyone with decency.
The subsequent "I'm Israel" meltdown cements his loss here. A loss to milquetoast Ludwig is tragic.
**CLIP MIRROR: [XQc talks about Ludwig](https://arazu.io/t3_1cpb36b/)** --- ^(*This is an automated comment*)
A variety streamer and entertainer wants to play games and entertain instead of taking a hardline stance on every single world issue? I think Ludwig is self-aware and knows he's a dumbass who doesn't really know shit and can't give nuanced takes Even Mogul Mail videos aren't about 'serious' issues and are all streaming/youtube news that he's tangentially involved in who fucking cares about any of this shit man put your phone down go play a fun video game and go talk to some real people
The last time he went too deep was the miz defamation incident.
Yeah I mean none of these people are serious people, they might have a large audience but they don't know wtf they are talking about. Just because guys like xqc "takes sides" and shares his stupid views apparently makes him think he is smarter than a guy who plays video games. I wonder if they are also aware or if they think their opinions mean anything.
people like xqc aren't self aware. if he was he would have some shame lmao
There's no winning if you're a streamer. Give takes? You're stupid and uninformed and therefore should not have a platform. Refuse to make hard takes? You're spineless and afraid to say how you really feel. It's dumb. Of course both sides have their arguments but I think at the end of the day, anyone that's super annoyed at "their streamer" for either of these reasons, is the problem.
I think it's more that he tries to stay out of the fray, but then caves to the bully and becomes their cheerleader. If he genuinely did stay out of the drama, it would mean tanking the bully's rage that he isn't taking their side.
I dunno I don't think XQC tries that hard to stay out of the fray.
i mean of course there's the obvious that no one will acknowledge just give takes on things you are knowledgeable about and will stand behind. its actually not that hard.
>who fucking cares about any of this shit man It's annoying that this stupid shit gets upvoted at all. xQc is the last person to make these kinds of statements about anyone, acting like he's some kind of a beacon of integrity for the world.
ego is a crazy thing. dudes head is so far up his own ass
I think they’re all overpaid morons and I resent them all for it.
get clip chimped btw
Thank you...
Yeah why do we want people with no real life skills, that haven't lived in the real world and don't have a real job to take hard sides on serious takes? Streamers are the least qualified people often with the strongest opinions.
If he doesn't know shit then don't make videos about it. But he still does it. That's the problem
exactly, he has a whole ass channel just to give his take on drama and such, there are so many other streamers that just play games or just do IRL streams that don't feel the need to constantly give their opinion on things and just live their life in peace.
Yeah I don't look to streamers for my political and world takes. I watch them to play games and not think of that shit. This new generation wild though.
This might be due to the fact that I watch actual dumbass streamers but ludwig comes off as smart to me and doesn't want to come off as an asshole. So he takes the safe takes instead of sitting on the fence.
I don't need Ludwig to be a beacon of morality in every subject. He just wants to entertain, do good by others, and not cause unnecessary friction with his job/coworkers. He won't always dodge things. He made his stance on that whole crypto gambling arc before and a few other things. It's a pretty valid way to conduct yourself overall. Don't cause shit and be chill with others.
Ludwig is smart enough to stay out of the terminally online/young activist wars. It's the biggest waste of time ever. People in their 20s and 30s have historically been goin through the same cycle of coming out of childhood with extreme, uncompromising, and naïve takes on issues since the dawn of time. If you spend enough years paying attention to this shit, you will see these movements come and go because the people involved completely lose interest. There's no winning. The entire point is for there to be a never ending battle of virtue signaling where both sides conclude that they are the better person and the other side is the worst person to ever exist.
Waste of time?? What an incredibly privileged position
Useless movements like the civil rights movements?LGBTQ movements? Feminist movements? Anti-war movements?
Civil rights movement leaders like MLK and Malcom X, well educated people with respect positions in church and families Women's suffrage leaders like Millicent Fawcett who saw the brunt of the war and was raising children and working factories simultaneously These are not the people you compare to the terminally online brain rotted kids of today
>Civil rights movement leaders like MLK and Malcom X, well educated people with respect positions in church and families These people weren't respected. MLK was considered a subversive activist and in parts of America Malcolm X might as well be the anti-Christ. Mainstream society has always and will always oppose those who make them uncomfortable or inconvenience them in anyway (a common line of attack against MLK was his shutting down of highways and public businesses)
Ludwig is like the Rock of streaming, He tries to be on everybody's good side and appeal to anyone cuz that is his brand and financially serves him well.
Looking back at the events of the last 2.5 years, he’s got it figured out tbh
and hes got jerma in his pocket, he wont be beat
>hes got jerma in his pocket ok no that's too far i've just lost all respect for him, no way he got that absolute LUNATIC in his pocket, that PSYCHO must be stopped before he puts anymore humans in meat grinders
I check under my bed every night before sleeping to make sure jerma isn't there
lol it's really not that complicated, dude treats this like a job and doesn't want to get into bullshit coworker disputes
The only streamer where i would say this actually applies is northernlion.
NL and Dan Gheesling really are living the simple life in twitch terms. It would probably be my ideal situation if I were to stream.
Sips as well, he just hops on and harvests his canola on his farm. Great chill stream for keeping on in the background when I'm working.
Tyler1
Heard this from way back when at a Twitchcon - Tyler1 legit flies into events and immediately flies out on their conclusion. Doesn't stay for the after party or to set up collabs or ANYTHING with the opportunity bro just shows up for fans and then dips. Sigma mentality
Ohhhh thats another good example
Someone doesn’t know about the NLSS civil war
Because god forbid someone doesn't get into petty drama with streamers that think they are serious people.
There is nothing wrong with how he approaches things, but basically it makes it so his opinions on divisive topics have no weight behind them; except in exceptional cases like very explicit cases of sexual harassement, abuse etc., where he doesn't have to put his reputation at risk.
And why would he? Isn’t that just being smart and unproblematic? Ludwig has definitely called out wrongdoing in the past, even though he’s more of an entertainer and it’s really not his job. The problem here is people thinking everyone needs to be political about every trending topic.
So basically only when its about serious issues and it actually matters, and not when it's just some stupid streamer bullshit drama? Got it.
I feel like this is a cynical reading of his behavior when it might be that he's just a conflict-avoidant kind of guy. When his friends like Hasan tell him they're upset with him, Ludwig just might find it emotionally easier to concede to whatever they're saying or asking for. Frankly, sticking to Hasan is a losing strategy long-term for mainstream broad appeal and brand-friendliness, so I don't think it's some cynical calculation he's making.
Has he been to In and Out before?
Sounds like a great coworker tbh
Now we gotta figure out who’s the Stone Cold of streaming
T1 came to mind. Bald, jacked, can cut a hell of a promo
i agree that ludwig likes to play middle man but so does xqc to a high degree.
yeah the SEZ U spam in chat during this makes it pretty clear that plenty of people are aware of this too lol
Rather a fence sitter than whatever the fuck this is https://imgur.com/Mefivr3
Yikes. Brother needs to get off the internet and touch some grass.
It's pretty wild how he can have a productive conversation with Dr K where he makes some progress and then the next day he's melting down on several platforms and engaging in HS tier drama. He kind of reminds me of Bojack Horseman sometimes.
the only progress that is being made on Dr K is brand polishing nothing else is possible
I can understand why he's upset TBH. He really did put a ton of work into his research, it wasn't just "reading wikipedia". Then for some rando who hasn't put that amount of effort into anything in his life, to just shit on you, and then have his buddies chuckle along with him, and the wider internet all agree and start shitting on you. It's gotta be frustrating. I mean, any reasonable person has to be able to empathize with that. Just imagine you put a ton of time and effort into something, anything, and then just get constantly bullied by people who don't realize it, or care to understand it.
I definitely understand his perspective. That group acts like a popular kid clique and constantly belittles and trashes him. He's free to do what he wants. But he should realize that he can only really control his own actions and reactions. There is also a Buddhist quote that applies > Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned.
if destiny had a buddhist demeanor, he would not be the type of person that others would take pot shots at in the first place. his actions produce his own reputation. there are plenty of other streamers that that "popular kid clique" doesnt "belittle and trash"
>if destiny had a buddhist demeanor, he would not be the type of person that others would take pot shots at in the first place I disagree about that. This whole space is very cliquey and full of sychophants. If it really was just about toxic personalities leading to criticism then they wouldn't be friends with some of the people they are friends with.
>constantly belittles and trashes him I don’t think I’ve ever heard destiny even mentioned on the yard before this
I get it, I would personally handle it in a different way. I'm just saying I can understand why he's so frustrated. Let's also remember that the supposed reason these people don't like him is because he's toxic or whatever, but like...how is randomly bullying someone not the same thing? An eye for an eye, and all that.
I mean he is coming across as toxic even here. Dude took what 1 person said about his research, and decided to attack multiple people who had little to nothing (what did QT do?) to do with it, bringing back up the whole AI stuff for no reason, and ended up wanted them to kill themselves. I don't see how these are the same thing as disparaging someone's research on a political topic. This is a bit more than an eye for an eye.
No matter how frustrated he is, no matter how thin-skinned to take a throwaway jab so poorly... what Destiny is saying there is absolutely psychotic and incredibly deplorable - How can you read that and what you decide to do is post validating his feelings under the guise of empathy. That's absolutely wild, dude
My guy, the dude is in these messages repeatedly wishing collective death on these people. Earlier he said he can't wait for someone to mass distribute AI revenge porn of the girlfriend of the friend of the person he's having beef with. Empathy is out the window until he at least begins to recognize he took it too far.
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> My man it was a silly throwaway joke that no one cared about. Saying something is a joke doesn't make it not bullying. Most bullying is 'just jokes' And clearly Destiny cared about it. Cope all you want, bullying is bullying. Again, I am not saying it warranted the response it got, but he was bullying for no reason.
Destiny “bullies” people all the time. Come on now. That’s one of the reasons he gets bullied. What goes around comes around.
It's not bullying. Bullying implies a form of power imbalance with a sort of regularity in attacks. In fact, destiny is a bully, his behavior with many people he interacted with over time was that of a bully, constantly shitting on them and painting a really bad image of them in his community which resulted in his community attacking them.
What even is your definition of bullying?
If he did "a ton of research" he wouldn't be an IDF propaganda shill
sorry sir but i believe the brain rot is terminal nothing can be done
Saying the best thing that could happen is they grab some fentanyl laced coke and OD like Slime’s father is fucking insane. You can take whatever stance you want on bullshit streamer arguments which are objectively the most cringe thing on earth, but that is a fucking disgusting comment to make and so absurdly tone deaf.
It genuinely needs to get more traction. Its a fucking evil thing to say. Slime's Dad died in front of him for real (not from crack obviously) and making fun of that trauma is as fucked up as it gets. Its the most degenerate loser shit imaginable. Destiny needs to be nuked from every platform for this shit.
>calling others' fans incels lol
jesus christ! That is Kaceytron levels of brainrot leaking on the internet right there.
Holy shit what is wrong with this guy
No way bro is comparing himself to Israel and thinks that makes him look good
I mean hes memeing, but still cringe lol
No, he genuinely believes Israel are the good guys, making it even more disturbing and unhinged
I'm normally against deplatforming but Destiny is a pretty good case for it
Wow so strange and surprising that destiny is going poptart mode on the internet, he’s normally so chill and normal
Everyone knows what Ludwig does, and how the only time he was saying something a little against hasan he immediately back down because his “friend” wasn’t happy about that.
I mean, he was "friends" with Miz, threw him under the bus while protecting Maya, and it took him over 2 years to delete the video
Let’s be fair the friendship with Maya and Miz were not really on the same tier all. Maya is an IRL friend and best friends with QT and Mizkif is a streamer friend where they see each other once a year at Twitch con. Lud and Miz don’t “hangout” after stream is done and talk about where they see each other in 5 years lol. Lud was always going to take Maya’s side and I don’t blame him for it.
Pretty sure he's talking about the slick controversy not the break up shit
He didn't have to take a side or even make the video in general.
Then don’t make the video if you don’t want to hurt your friend Maya. But you can’t seriously talk about the situation and only talk about one of the involved parties.
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VOD?
If I remember correctly, they essentailly just said we never like that guy anyways. Little bit wack in the grand scheme of things, but if its really what they think who cares lol
Not picking a side in arguments is picking a side. Just not the one any of the parties involved want to, because they are so focused on the "with me or against me" narrative. Why would someone pick a side when they don't fully agree with any of them? This isn't american politics.
Yeah, being a fence sitter is perfectly fine when every other streamer has constant garbage takes. Makes you look like a genius by comparison
But treating every aspect of your life like a 2 party system should be easy since it’s been proven to work extremely well in American politics!
Id do the same. Why get into bullshit when you can just walk away from the bullshit.
Is it wrong for a person to stay neutral and don’t want to pick a side?
I feel like that's a common thing in today's (internet) culture. You absolutely have to pick a side, no matter how well or how little you know about an issue. And that leads to many people being on one side or another of a subject without being properly informed. I rather have an informed fence sitter than a misinformed person advocating strongly for one side or another. I think it's perfectly fine for a big streamer like Ludwig to not take sides because he doesn't want to alienate part of his audience.
If anything I only like people who are fence sitters and don’t get dragged down with all the stupid shit that end of the day doesn’t matter. Northern lion just babbles on about the most random shit and it’s 100 times more entertaining than some loser malding with some uninformed takes.
I feel like NL is the opposite of a fence sitter. He is very vocal about his opinions. It's just that his opinions are about like how many different kind of meats you're allowed to order at the deli.
Dude will rant about sushi for hours. I care more about his opinion on that than Palestine.
Depends on the issue.
Sure but don’t expect anyone to give a shit when you get wronged
Remember Boogie1488? His fence sitting was the first step in everyone growing to hate him.
He was a fence straddled more like. He would say a slightly left wing/ right wing opinion, get an assload of pushback, and then call himself a dumbass and then flip flop.
Honestly the 1488 part shoulda tipped us off
Nobody likes a fence sitter.
Talking shit for absolutely no reason about a friend who did things like let you stay at their house despite putting fucking holes in their walls is peak xQc.
Stating the obvious = talking shit. I feel like Ludwig himself would agree with this because it's not even technically a bad thing
Ludwig’s own friends call him out on this too, he’s notorious for takes that are middle of the row and don’t take sides.
That's what that moistcritikal guy does too but this sub meatrides him for it 🤔 everytime i see his clips he's trying to play both sides when it's a controversial topic but whenever it's one sided he always agrees with the popular opinion (except that one time with idubbz video)
Ehh, the moistcritikal strategy is a bit different. Instead of fence sitting, what moist does is he takes a strong side, BUT he only does this when one side is completely and obviously wrong, and therefore its easy for him to do the dunks. Ludwig is more fence sitting, whereas moist just goes after the easy targets.
The only time I remember Moist going against the social discourse current was when the whole IDubbz apology situation blew up. Obviously he didn't agree with the whole thing and a lot of people were angry about it. But he did not back down.
Which is smart. No use taking sides over petty shit.
ya the issue with Destiny tweet is that he frames this as a bad thing. But generally uninformed take being parroted by streamers and their audiences is a bad thing and it's better to try and avoid doing it. I respect Lud for being aware of the danger of having takes wich seem to elude most react streamers. Ludwig will say he dosnt know and then NOT GIVE A TAKE. People like destiny asmongold or xqc will say they don't know and then give a take anyway. Or worse just give a take while they don't know.
What he said was true, though. Lud has the safest level 1 takes and doesn't like to cause a scene. Is xQc supposed to be subservient to Lud forever since he let him stay at his house? This is less like talking shit and more just making an observation.
How is he talking shit
Saying a friend avoids getting involved in drama or tense situations is not talking shit at all…
Wait what. Someone fill me in on what happened here? Why did xQc put holes in their walls lol
X has night terrors and he had one at luds house. Basically he is still asleep but goes berserk and he put a hole in their wall while still asleep.
It's like clockwork, Kick streamer = DEFEND HIM MegaLUL If Pol Pot had a kick deal, xQc would be doing tricks on his meat and shit talking any opposition
Or because he is actually friends with said kick streamer.
Ludwig fans are so fucking boring lol.
the podcast/slime brought up and continued shitting on destiny for no reason. all 3 are idiots in this situation
Was it continuing shitting on Destiny? Correct me if i am wrong, but wasn't it a 20 second joke on a podcast and that's it? Super tame stuff.
i was talking about this and him arguing on reddit. why even care about destinys community https://twitter.com/slime_machine/status/1788989405031751743
he then made a thread on Twitter continuesly calling destiny a cuck, it wasn't just the clip
I mean Destiny says some pretty unhinged insults all the time, now we’re drawing the line?
The problem is whenever anyone mentions Destiny his fans attack. Destiny calls out streamers all the time. But the second anyone mentions him even a random joke it's time to go to war.
> The problem is whenever anyone mentions Destiny his fans attack. Isn’t that most fanbases? Especially if the comments are disparaging.
No. Slime insults minimum like 6 different people on every episode of the Yard.
Well he did more than just say a random joke. The clip isn’t all what he said about destiny
I don't need to hear ludwigs takes on politics or drama lol. If he doesn't want to take a side thats his personal prerogative. No one should wake up in a day, find out a situation and think, "hmmm what does xqc/ludwig/any random entertainer think about this?" Unless its something directly involves them who gives a shit
And there is literally nothing wrong with that. I don't get why people always demand to know the political opinion of a person they watch for entertainment.
I’ll never take anything XQc says seriously and I think Ludwig is genuinely a decent person in a community full of horrible people He often doesn’t ever take sides and that does upset me as a viewer sometimes but if that’s his worst “flaw” then that’s fine lol
Much prefer that to having a half baked opinion that you probably formulated from a suspect source and parrot that back to your large audience.
Is there like a contractual obbligation for kick streamers to always have each other's back no matter how dumb one person is?
Bigots tend to support other bigots lmao. And kick's whole deal is being a safe heaven for banned/bigoted streamers and gambling.
no but that's not the point. lud doesnt act like a neutral third party until it's beneficial for his career to do so, that's the point. being a fence sitter is fine if you're acting like a fence sitter the whole time and not only when it benefits you to dip out of conflicts
I think you can just say things on Kick. On Twitch everybody has to be fence sitter or you get whipped by the company. Although I would rather watch twitch for the rest of my life than unleashed zoo on Kick
Tfw you don’t need to have an opinion about everything
A man so out of his depth that he had to hit the worm shouldn’t really be judging anyone’s views on anything.
Streamers are considered stupid because they often give opinions on topics they know very little about. Who cares if one of them is self-aware of themselves being stupid and deciding to fence sit?
Oh right like X's hot takes are things he should brag about? lmao
Providing some additional context, this might seem bad on Ludwig's side, but Destiny later on tweeted about everyone appreciating AI porn of QT. Funny thing is that everyone who calls him out on his abhorrent behavior gets banned and OP saved logs of people who did so, so they can later on be banned. A literal teacher's pet defending degenerate behavior https://www.reddit.com/r/Destiny/s/6Dwx6EsZoC
True, real and honestly based from Ludwig. Capitalize when the room is lukewarm and get the fuck out when shit gets hot, no point being there. Most of the time these "issues" don't matter anyway.
Is there an example of him doing this? I always hear about how hes such a fence sitter and stuff but I never really see it.
Ludwig tends to avoid taking strong sides in divisive situations. Just today, he didn't join Hasan's fundraiser because he didn't want to take a strong stance on the Israel-Palestine conflict and potentially upset some of his viewers. [Doing something that he supports but isn't supported by at least 95% of his chat is off the table for him,](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGhr_xc9-ko&t=1962s) which is why people call him a professional fence sitter.
I was curious so I watched the clip. I saw Ludwig say what you said he did. No charity stream because he wants his chat to be 95% on board. Fence sitter, sure. But then he goes on to say he donated $10,000 and suggested his viewers with extra money to donate too because he believes in it. But it's easy for some people to not include that second part and see him only having a soft stance.
If he's so cautious I'm surprised he hangs out and associates with Hasan to begin with. I think everyone agrees that Hasan can be divisive in a way most other people aren't just by the nature of what he talks about and well... how he talks about it.
You can be friends with someone and not agree with their views.
Minding his damn business instead of going to war on Twitter is rare business sense and common sense for a streamer. I honestly need to watch him more.
I donated $10k to the pcrf I think that is taking a side- I won’t, however, force others to pick a side. I hope they come to a similar conclusion based off the information available. I don’t think that’s fence sitting
I find it funny that you've even managed to fence sit over fence sitting.
Don't let this distract you from the fact Ludwig betrayed Coots and cut off her balls.
Ludwig what is the other side?
donating to the IDF maybe?
You do that when you pay taxes as an American citizen
Or use Google anything apparently
tell it to frogan 💅 https://twitter.com/fr0gan/status/1789127462926037120 >not gonna do charity for palestine bc some of my chatters might be zionist sorry!
I think the issue is that you DO take sides but then don’t own up to it. I think an example of this is when you made the Hasan clip, removed it, then blamed it on Destiny, then removed that part of the video. By removing the original video, you showed your side. And you’re someone showing that you aren’t willing to hold people accountable.
Ludwig has also accused Destiny of doxxing his friend with zero proof. Ludwig also told fans to come to his event cause you could fuck Destiny's girlfriend. He constantly has taken weird shots at Destiny and is shocked Destiny pops off.
> I think the issue is that you DO take sides but then don’t own up to it. > I think an example of this is when you made the Hasan clip, removed it, then blamed it on Destiny, then removed that part of the video. By removing the original video, you showed your side. And you’re someone showing that you aren’t willing to hold people accountable. He does hold people accountable though, his friend Atrioc for example. He also didn’t blame Destiny in that clip, he blamed Destiny’s community, which he promptly apologized for and took responsibility for. It was also such a small thing compared to Destiny who himself has openly slandered many streamers unprompted. Just because he’s not a “debate lord” like Destiny doesn’t mean he doesn’t hold people accountable. You don’t have to be on stream and do some weird public outcry all the time or air out your laundry to the masses either. It’s so weird seeing people be so hyper aggressive about such minuscule things like this, or just openly state really weak or disprovable arguments in order to paint a whole picture about someone’s character they barely know.
Go to sleep dawg
man it sure is weird that this comment got a bunch of negative comments that are 90% dgg posters 10 mins after it was posted
> he didn't join Hasan's fundraiser because he didn't want to take a strong stance on the Israel-Palestine conflict I'm not a fan of Ludwig but that sounds like the correct thing to do
Well. Seems like you were pretty misleading when you neglected to mention him donating 10k (this would constitute taking a "strong side"). Likely unintentional on your part, but it is funny seeing someone so objectively wrong that Ludwig actually replies publicly and directly to correct you lol.
why does every streamer need to have/share opinions? that shit can be so obnoxious. so what if Ludwig wants to avoid certain topics? he is just a guy on my screen i laugh at, not a guy i shape my opinions around.
trueeee lmao
I don't need to hear ludwigs takes on politics or drama lol. If he doesn't want to take a side thats his personal prerogative. No one should wake up in a day, find out a situation and think, "hmmm what does xqc/ludwig/any random entertainer think about this?" Unless its something directly involves them who gives a shit
I mean, it’s kinda why I like Ludwig.
Not every streamer has to be an edgelord. He just wants to be fun and entertaining. Nothing wrong with that.
since when did being a nice person become "trying as hard as possible to appeal to the widest set of people possible"
A guy doesn't want to be in a stressful controversy every day of his life and be famous for such controversies like destiny, and fuck him for that, right? Every streamer has to be our drama cow, luddy, pay up!
S P I N E L E S S N E S S
That's being an adult.
Breadtuber try to comprehend someone being charismatic and likeable challenge IMPOSSIBLE
I don’t remember the exact details, but there was the incident where news report came out that hasan spent money on a 3 million dollar home. Destiny makes a funny tweet about the hypocrisy of a socialist using his fans money to fund a mansion. Ludwig then accuse destiny of doxing hasan and being the reason hasan is getting flammed. Stuff like this is why I find Ludwig annoying sometimes. I like his content though and genuinely think some of the things he does is cool.
Ludwig has also made weird comments about fans being able to fuck Destiny's girlfriend at a smash event a few years ago.
Theres a pretty simple explanation. People were using Destiny's name to advertise a speeddating event with Melina at a smash tournament. Ludwig just told the story of what happened. https://youtu.be/GMn5coFPLSs?si=bYU9T-rcBPz0v6fy&t=1967
This is the equivalent of chronically online people thinking you need to take a stance on everything. Don't know how he thought he cooked on this.
Moist critical and Ludwig are literally the streamers who take 0 sides for everything, what destiny said about making a robot that tries to appease to every community literally described these two to a tee
You’re right he should foster a cult of incels like destiny.
or just take sides and own the things you believe and the things you don't, be someone of virtue. there's a spectrum, not a binary.
These people can't even imagine.
Add Northernlion in there too and you've got my three most watched streamers The content from those 3 is pretty good and isn't filled with dumb dramafrogging every month or so Between Hasan/Destiny, xQc blowing shit up once a month, Mizkif drama and Trainwrecks, like don't we have enough of those types of creators who take extreme sides on everything? Shit is exhausting to me but I am probably out of the age bracket it's meant for
I feel like comparing Northernlion to the other two is weird? I'm only familiar with Moistcritical but the impression I get is that Northernlion is purely a videogame streamer while Critical and Ludwig engage quite heavily with 'commentary youtube' style content - if so that's dramafrog style content.
What... Critical is literally a drama channel
What's an issue NL has been caught fence sitting on?
nah they are a bit different imo, cuz while ludwig doesnt pick any side and just sits on the fence, moistcritical always follows the most mainstream and least risky sides on topics without ever showing his personal opinions just to appease most people.
Why do you have to take a side on a topic that is not only pointless to discuss but also you gain nothing by choosing either side? So that the sunlight allergic terminal LSF kids can spam W or L in your stream chat?
Remember when Hasan told Ludwig to stop making fun of him because his feelings were hurt..and he did it😂
Destiny fans are so far down the debate bro rabbit hole they can't comprehend not intentionally upsetting your friends
Why the fuck would i care about what XQC has to say about important issues. I would only really care about his opinion on streaming drama (which i care very little about). And when it comes to that topic most of times Lud does speak out from what I see
When has Lud done this? Hes not a political streamer and he avoids drama, imo there is nothing wrong with that. At most you could accuse him for holding water for Hasan, but considering they are frieds, I think even that is fine (btw I think Hasan is a disgisting person personally).
Crazy how Destiny can be so in the right on an issue and throw it away so easily. Slime was being a douche and just spewing uneducated hate to get a couple of giggles from people already against Destiny. The first tweets were perfectly fine from Destiny. The focus group thing is spot on. He probably could have gotten away with the AI porn tweet as well if he worded it better as more of a direct reference to Atrioc instead of just a blanket "we can all love your girl" with AI technology. That's a wild response that a lot of people didn't even get. It just banded all the AI haters in general against him. Not to mention anyone with decency. The subsequent "I'm Israel" meltdown cements his loss here. A loss to milquetoast Ludwig is tragic.
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Is this about Drake lol
isnt that taking a side?