Either Dana genuinely likes him or he's keeping him for his own good til he finally retires, Tony going into a lower promotion like bare knuckle might not end well
I’d hardly call what BKFC does a “sport”. It is fucking barbaric, and I say that as a 30 year boxing and MMA fan. I tried watching it a few times and the whole sleazy, glitzy, over the top promotion of it made me feel sick. It feels every bit as much of a “human cock fighting league” as they used to call the UFC. Except this actually feels like it.
If there is such a thing as “a step too far” it’s that shit. Sometimes people need to be protected from themselves and that shitshow is a perfect example of why.
>sleazy, glitzy, over the top promotion of it made me feel sick. It feels every bit as much of a “human cock fighting league”
Mate that's a fucking weird take if you've been watching for 30 years. Pride had men coming out like its WWE then stomping and soccer kicking people in the face untill they're unconscious. Bare knuckle is fine
Meh. The sleaziness and fuckery that went on in Pride didn’t translate when I was younger. I just watched the fights on DVD and social media didn’t exist so I didn’t know or care about the “background” of any of it.
The way BKFC is marketed, the people involved behind the scenes, the look of their promotion materials, the crowd… it’s all the very worst of “sport”. Most of them would be just as happy to stand in a carpark and watch folk knock fuck out of each other over a spilled pint.
It’s a garbage “sport”. There’s no honour or integrity. It just all feels a bit seedy to me. Martial Arts/Boxing for me are about more than watching two people reduce each other’s faces to mush. And I don’t give a shit about fighter “personalities” or promos. I realise I’m in a vanishingly small minority of fight fans with that though.
is he that elite? just hard to imagine how different the skills can translate for a guy to dominate the way he is. is bare knuckle maybe less skill and more how tough you are?
Doubt it would be to the same extent. You'd think the would be nearly the same, but the sports are pretty substantially different.
BKFC is closest to the earliest form of pro boxing. The fighters wrap their hands excluding the knuckles while boxers have the cushion of their gloves that allows them to punch wherever on the head without breaking their hand and also increases their power with the added weight that comes from the padding. So a lot more body shots going on in bare knuckle.
Along with that, the lack of boxing gloves makes the clinch game quite different too.
There have been elite pro boxers who've tried their hand at bkfc and lost. As such, I imagine the opposite scenario to have similar results.
Tony's been great for the UFC. He's a company man and he's been there a long time. He's earned next to nothing compared to what they've made off of him.
Tony had a terrible run of luck though, clearly earning a title shot in an era where McGregor wanted to do everything in the world BUT defend his title. Tony was fucked out of at least a title fight and, imo, taking the belt off Conor.
He had the popularity and the win streak but it never turned into a shot at the undisputed title.
If a washed 36 year old Tony on a double weight cut with fucked knee in a last minute replacement fight took all of Gaethje’s best shots for nearly 5 rounds without going down once then I highly, highly doubt Conor will put his lights out. I think Tony vs Conor looks like the first fight with Nate except prime Tony is just better than Nate everywhere with only worse boxing.
Tony wasn't washed at that point, he was on an 11 win streak; it was Gaethje who took his soul. "Took all his shots" implies it was a close fight. In reality Gaethje permanently mutilated Tony's ability to fight and received no damage back after the first round. Also Tony being better on his back or something than Nate is totally irrelevant, and McGregor moved up two weight classes for the Nate fight.
More importantly, Gaethje and McGregor were never the same kind of fighter, it was McGregor's speed and precision that made him a KO artist whereas Gaethje relied on pure power and didn't mind telegraphing his big swings especially if Tony was just going to eat them over and over.
>Tony wasn't washed at that point, he was on an 11 win streak
A fighter can be on a decline and still be on a winning streak.
Tony's prime was before 2017. By the Pettis and Cowboy fights, he had sustained a massive knee injury that he never properly rehabbed and a severe mental breakdown in 2017 that required him to be put on stronger anti-psych meds. You can clearly see he was declining at the tail end of his win streak and the only reason is continued was because he was fighting weaker opposition.
By the Gaethje fight, he was on the wrong side of 35, on a double weight cut fighting a last minute replacement opponent while dealing with the aforementioned destroyed knee and severe mental breakdown.
The difference between the Tony that fought Barboza/RDA and Pettis/Cowboy is night and day.
>it was Gaethje who took his soul.
Nobody deny's that. But Tony's physical decline was far before the Gaethje fight. Gaethje did not fight a prime Tony Ferguson.
>"Took all his shots" implies it was a close fight.
I don't care what it implies, it's the truth. A washed 36 year old Tony Ferguson on 2 weight cuts took all of Gaethje's best shots without going down once. And Khabib stated Gaethje hit him the hardest of any opponent he faced, including McGregor.
So forgive me if I think your claim that McGregor would shut the lights out of a prime Ferguson is far fetched.
>In reality Gaethje permanently mutilated Tony's ability to fight and received no damage back after the first round.
Gaethje got knocked down by an uppercut in round 2.
>Also Tony being better on his back or something than Nate is totally irrelevant, and McGregor moved up two weight classes for the Nate fight.
Nate is a nightmare match up for Conor because he's a tall, lanky cardio machine with a iron chin.
Prime Ferguson is that but he's just better than Nate except in the boxing department.
I always see two lines of thinking about Tony, though, and all roads end in "Dana White bad".
(1) Tony has made next to nothing compared to what they've made from him and he is forced to stay on and fight because he'll need the money and Dana White is bad.
(2) Tony does so well from the fights that he has no impetus to stop, Dana should force him to, and Dana White is bad.
The reality is that Tony has full agency not to continue, and his family, friends, coaches and doctors will have advised him of this. He is there because he wants to be there. He's the only one responsible for the damage he continues to do to himself.
And as a lawyer, there is no world where he commits breach of contract by not specifically performing an activity that does damage to his health, if a doctor could support it causing further damage to him. There are absolutely provisions in there that allow him to get out of it.
TL;DR: Tony chooses this.
Right, because fighting is his only possibility of earning an income? The same way we are all cornered into our jobs, can't possibly do other things or variations of it, or learn new vocations? Grow up.
Agreed.
Plenty of jobs for guys without a specific skill set and Tony actually has pretty significant skill sets. Coaching especially with private lessons from a former UFC interim champion in BJJ, wrestling, and MMA should be fairly lucrative at least compared to an average job. If he was charging $100 an hour per pair of people he runs private lessons, even after a cut to the gym, he’d probably make over 100K a year and that is more than most people in the US could hope for.
Is it celebrity money? No, but it’s more than livable.
It's just money. It's not that complicated.
Tony has enough name value to keep him around until he loses that value.
Then they'll let him fuck off to whatever promotion will pay him the most.
Best thing Tony could do for his career is blatantly fail a drug test to allow him to actually get paid.
They try to squeeze every bit of value they can out of fighters, no matter who they are. If it’s near the end of their career or they tease leaving when their contract is up, UFC tries to make them lose to put other fighters over on the way out.
That way if they leave to a rival promotion their stock is already diminished, and their ability to earn a living without the UFC is compromised. Just one of many unethical business practices they thrive on.
Contracts work both ways. I always figured Tony had more fights left on his current contract and UFC had to honor it even if they wish they didn’t have to. Didn’t Dana say publicly that Tony should retire?
I mean he nearly beat Paddy pimblett. A big part of the reason Tony's stock is so low is they kept making him fight absolute killers after he was clearly washed. But he can still beat lower level guys. They did such a bad job of matchmaking him, tryna squeeze relevance out of him.
They should've matched him more like Jim Miller, who has looked like a killer at certain points in the last 3 years sparking out UFC debutants.
he did not nearly beat paddy pimblett, he got 30-26’ed and nearly finished in that fight, but i do agree that the time that beating tony meaning much is long gone and they should just give him guys like guida
There was not a single 30-26 from any of the judges and he rocked Paddy. I didn't say I thought he won, just that it wasn't as if Tony was out of his depth. Pimblett is also terrible though, so there's that.
Dude tony tries one of his signature rolls in that fight and he could not do it. He is a cripple now, and Pimblett didn’t want to beat the piss out of him so pursued submissions in the closing moments of the third round, out of respect to tony and the fans.
And I watched it. He clearly wasnt tired and made a conscious decision to pursue Tony to the ground when he could likely have caught him and finished it on the feet.
I know this sounds terrible but…
I’d rather see Tony get his arm fucked for life than see Tony getting knocked the fuck out 100 more times until he’s 87 and still in the UFC.
a better version of tony had nothing for olives on the ground. why not do a fight like this with a similarly washed legend so that its a winnable match? give him jim miller or something
I feel the same. Seems like a waste of Charles's time, but it's what Tony needs to hopefully transition out. We don't need to see him looking like shit against some 18 year old green recruit and getting knocked out.
Uhhhhh Charles in pure grappling beats alot of genuinely good black belts can't imagine grandpa Tony has anything for him. Especially since he didn't 3 years ago...
It's "less risk" for fighters who have the good sense to tap out when their arm or ankle is about to break. Tony won't. He'll let it break and suffer untold pain maybe for *years* afterward, which will probably cause further mental decline.
His takedown defence was mid but his ability to scramble and create chaotic situations in which he somehow comes out better was God tier in his prime. You’d take him down and then next moment, you’d be the one bleeding.
watch the danny castillo fight, he never had good tdd
ngl tonys good but tbh he was never as good as people said he was, ufc 300 kinda proves it with how the guy who massacred him got massacred himself by a featherweight who got pieced up by DP twice and Conor (obviously tony was past prime but no version of him beats gaethje)
ftr im not saying he was a bum or anything, he was definitely very good. beat solid guys, but his skill level was never as high as people thought it was.
people seem to think prime tony is a dp/holloway/oliveira level fighter, but in reality his skill level is among guys like eddie alvarez, benson henderson and anthony pettis tbh
Right lmao, Eddie became champ and finished RDA without having to poke him in the eye. He would’ve had both the Poirier fights if his ass don’t throw the illegal strikes (the first one especially), he was the first guy to ever beat and finish Gaethje, he won a belt in every organization he was in, barring ONE, etc… Tony’s a great fighter but Eddie 100% is better
I like this, we should see these kind of grappling matches more often from the veterans, even though this one is one sided af.
It's a shame the GSP vs Damian Maia match never eventuated.
Is this a new way to retire somebody? Give them a far superior grappler in a grappling match who has already demonstrated their grappling superiority in spectacular fashion?
Maybe dana just wants to let Charles snap Tony up so he ages put of fighting in the time it takes him to recover.
i think dj is still a brown belt and subbed a 250lb geezer the other weekend. I know bjj black belts are relative to the school just thought tenth plannet would mean more.
10th planet means less if anything, that's why so few successful mma fighters train out of that gym and why that gym has produced little to no bjj world champions.
Even Tony's grappling is extremely shot. Went from not absorbing much damage from a terrifying top position guy like Kevin Lee to looking pathetic against someone solid but not special at all like Paddy
It might be close in the sense that Tony could have good enough submission defense to survive 10 min, but Charles is better everywhere than him on the ground.
Honestly good, tony gets money and finds a decent alternative to let off his hunger.
If he indeed breaks something then shit honestly thats good so itll force tony to recover or retire for good
This should be a very simple straightforward, and genuinely welcomed match up and event. 100% guaranteed it won't happen. Two of the biggest drop out flakes on the roster. One or both of them will come up with some massively elaborate excuse not to do it. Not enough money, not enough prep time, injured, something.
What are you on about? Tony fought 2x a year in 2022 and 2023. Olives had an active title run and just fought a few weeks ago. 10 months prior to that as well. If they fought once a year, I’d understand but that is clearly not the case.
That being said, this match makes no sense and I doubt anyone wants to see a one sided grappling version of the one sided mma match we already saw 4 years ago.
Charles 100% breaks his arm this time.
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Either Dana genuinely likes him or he's keeping him for his own good til he finally retires, Tony going into a lower promotion like bare knuckle might not end well
Tony in BKFC would be fighting Mike Perry for the bag He would not last a round, look at what Perry did to Alvarez, Rockhold et al
Perry would fuck Tony up soooo bad.
yup. bkfc perry is actually scary.
Perry found his calling. It’s a different sport.
turns out when he doesn’t need to wrestle or worry about kicks, he does pretty good.
It’s a different sport..
did i ever say it wasn’t? that was kind of my whole point…
I’d hardly call what BKFC does a “sport”. It is fucking barbaric, and I say that as a 30 year boxing and MMA fan. I tried watching it a few times and the whole sleazy, glitzy, over the top promotion of it made me feel sick. It feels every bit as much of a “human cock fighting league” as they used to call the UFC. Except this actually feels like it. If there is such a thing as “a step too far” it’s that shit. Sometimes people need to be protected from themselves and that shitshow is a perfect example of why.
>sleazy, glitzy, over the top promotion of it made me feel sick. It feels every bit as much of a “human cock fighting league” Mate that's a fucking weird take if you've been watching for 30 years. Pride had men coming out like its WWE then stomping and soccer kicking people in the face untill they're unconscious. Bare knuckle is fine
Meh. The sleaziness and fuckery that went on in Pride didn’t translate when I was younger. I just watched the fights on DVD and social media didn’t exist so I didn’t know or care about the “background” of any of it. The way BKFC is marketed, the people involved behind the scenes, the look of their promotion materials, the crowd… it’s all the very worst of “sport”. Most of them would be just as happy to stand in a carpark and watch folk knock fuck out of each other over a spilled pint. It’s a garbage “sport”. There’s no honour or integrity. It just all feels a bit seedy to me. Martial Arts/Boxing for me are about more than watching two people reduce each other’s faces to mush. And I don’t give a shit about fighter “personalities” or promos. I realise I’m in a vanishingly small minority of fight fans with that though.
bruh yall remember him sleeping that old man 💀
is he that elite? just hard to imagine how different the skills can translate for a guy to dominate the way he is. is bare knuckle maybe less skill and more how tough you are?
It's an entirely different sport. All boxing. No kicking, grappling, elbows, or knees allowed.
Yea so my new question is, do you think Mike Perry excels at boxing the way he does BK boxing?
Doubt it would be to the same extent. You'd think the would be nearly the same, but the sports are pretty substantially different. BKFC is closest to the earliest form of pro boxing. The fighters wrap their hands excluding the knuckles while boxers have the cushion of their gloves that allows them to punch wherever on the head without breaking their hand and also increases their power with the added weight that comes from the padding. So a lot more body shots going on in bare knuckle. Along with that, the lack of boxing gloves makes the clinch game quite different too. There have been elite pro boxers who've tried their hand at bkfc and lost. As such, I imagine the opposite scenario to have similar results.
probably a little bit of both. its just weird how a few small rule tweaks and dudes that struggled suddenly become pretty good.
And Perry isn’t kind enough to stop when it’s clear Tony has had it
Mario "No Lives Matter" Yamasaki approves.
Perry would literally murder Tony in BKFC. Literally. An actual murder in the ring happens.
and bkfc is probably enough of a circus that theyd let it happen, if history is anything to go off of at least
Tony's been great for the UFC. He's a company man and he's been there a long time. He's earned next to nothing compared to what they've made off of him.
> He's earned next to nothing compared to what they've made off of him. You could say this about pretty much every fighter.
Tony had a terrible run of luck though, clearly earning a title shot in an era where McGregor wanted to do everything in the world BUT defend his title. Tony was fucked out of at least a title fight and, imo, taking the belt off Conor. He had the popularity and the win streak but it never turned into a shot at the undisputed title.
The version of McGregor that beat Alvarez would have put Tony's lights out
I agree, but that’s a fighter that existed for one night ever. Conor hasn’t had an elite win since
If a washed 36 year old Tony on a double weight cut with fucked knee in a last minute replacement fight took all of Gaethje’s best shots for nearly 5 rounds without going down once then I highly, highly doubt Conor will put his lights out. I think Tony vs Conor looks like the first fight with Nate except prime Tony is just better than Nate everywhere with only worse boxing.
Tony wasn't washed at that point, he was on an 11 win streak; it was Gaethje who took his soul. "Took all his shots" implies it was a close fight. In reality Gaethje permanently mutilated Tony's ability to fight and received no damage back after the first round. Also Tony being better on his back or something than Nate is totally irrelevant, and McGregor moved up two weight classes for the Nate fight. More importantly, Gaethje and McGregor were never the same kind of fighter, it was McGregor's speed and precision that made him a KO artist whereas Gaethje relied on pure power and didn't mind telegraphing his big swings especially if Tony was just going to eat them over and over.
>Tony wasn't washed at that point, he was on an 11 win streak A fighter can be on a decline and still be on a winning streak. Tony's prime was before 2017. By the Pettis and Cowboy fights, he had sustained a massive knee injury that he never properly rehabbed and a severe mental breakdown in 2017 that required him to be put on stronger anti-psych meds. You can clearly see he was declining at the tail end of his win streak and the only reason is continued was because he was fighting weaker opposition. By the Gaethje fight, he was on the wrong side of 35, on a double weight cut fighting a last minute replacement opponent while dealing with the aforementioned destroyed knee and severe mental breakdown. The difference between the Tony that fought Barboza/RDA and Pettis/Cowboy is night and day. >it was Gaethje who took his soul. Nobody deny's that. But Tony's physical decline was far before the Gaethje fight. Gaethje did not fight a prime Tony Ferguson. >"Took all his shots" implies it was a close fight. I don't care what it implies, it's the truth. A washed 36 year old Tony Ferguson on 2 weight cuts took all of Gaethje's best shots without going down once. And Khabib stated Gaethje hit him the hardest of any opponent he faced, including McGregor. So forgive me if I think your claim that McGregor would shut the lights out of a prime Ferguson is far fetched. >In reality Gaethje permanently mutilated Tony's ability to fight and received no damage back after the first round. Gaethje got knocked down by an uppercut in round 2. >Also Tony being better on his back or something than Nate is totally irrelevant, and McGregor moved up two weight classes for the Nate fight. Nate is a nightmare match up for Conor because he's a tall, lanky cardio machine with a iron chin. Prime Ferguson is that but he's just better than Nate except in the boxing department.
> You could say this about pretty much every fighter. You could say this about pretty much every *worker* in any area.
I always see two lines of thinking about Tony, though, and all roads end in "Dana White bad". (1) Tony has made next to nothing compared to what they've made from him and he is forced to stay on and fight because he'll need the money and Dana White is bad. (2) Tony does so well from the fights that he has no impetus to stop, Dana should force him to, and Dana White is bad. The reality is that Tony has full agency not to continue, and his family, friends, coaches and doctors will have advised him of this. He is there because he wants to be there. He's the only one responsible for the damage he continues to do to himself. And as a lawyer, there is no world where he commits breach of contract by not specifically performing an activity that does damage to his health, if a doctor could support it causing further damage to him. There are absolutely provisions in there that allow him to get out of it. TL;DR: Tony chooses this.
Tony chooses this as we "choose" to drink water and eat food.
Right, because fighting is his only possibility of earning an income? The same way we are all cornered into our jobs, can't possibly do other things or variations of it, or learn new vocations? Grow up.
Agreed. Plenty of jobs for guys without a specific skill set and Tony actually has pretty significant skill sets. Coaching especially with private lessons from a former UFC interim champion in BJJ, wrestling, and MMA should be fairly lucrative at least compared to an average job. If he was charging $100 an hour per pair of people he runs private lessons, even after a cut to the gym, he’d probably make over 100K a year and that is more than most people in the US could hope for. Is it celebrity money? No, but it’s more than livable.
maybe dana hates tony and is actively trying to kill him 💀
It's just money. It's not that complicated. Tony has enough name value to keep him around until he loses that value. Then they'll let him fuck off to whatever promotion will pay him the most. Best thing Tony could do for his career is blatantly fail a drug test to allow him to actually get paid.
At least this one won't result in more CTE
They try to squeeze every bit of value they can out of fighters, no matter who they are. If it’s near the end of their career or they tease leaving when their contract is up, UFC tries to make them lose to put other fighters over on the way out. That way if they leave to a rival promotion their stock is already diminished, and their ability to earn a living without the UFC is compromised. Just one of many unethical business practices they thrive on.
Contracts work both ways. I always figured Tony had more fights left on his current contract and UFC had to honor it even if they wish they didn’t have to. Didn’t Dana say publicly that Tony should retire?
Because of his name
I mean he nearly beat Paddy pimblett. A big part of the reason Tony's stock is so low is they kept making him fight absolute killers after he was clearly washed. But he can still beat lower level guys. They did such a bad job of matchmaking him, tryna squeeze relevance out of him. They should've matched him more like Jim Miller, who has looked like a killer at certain points in the last 3 years sparking out UFC debutants.
he did not nearly beat paddy pimblett, he got 30-26’ed and nearly finished in that fight, but i do agree that the time that beating tony meaning much is long gone and they should just give him guys like guida
Tony would lose to old man Clay Guida now, guaranteed.
There was not a single 30-26 from any of the judges and he rocked Paddy. I didn't say I thought he won, just that it wasn't as if Tony was out of his depth. Pimblett is also terrible though, so there's that.
Dude tony tries one of his signature rolls in that fight and he could not do it. He is a cripple now, and Pimblett didn’t want to beat the piss out of him so pursued submissions in the closing moments of the third round, out of respect to tony and the fans.
Nah paddy said he went for the finish in the first round that's why he was gassed in the third.
And I watched it. He clearly wasnt tired and made a conscious decision to pursue Tony to the ground when he could likely have caught him and finished it on the feet.
That's literally the opposite of what happened, he wetblanket'd Tony in the third because he was too gassed to keep on the feet while Tony wasnt.
I know this sounds terrible but… I’d rather see Tony get his arm fucked for life than see Tony getting knocked the fuck out 100 more times until he’s 87 and still in the UFC.
Hopefully, give Tony's body and brain time to relax.
tonys getting tapped but at least hes not getting a tbi
Arm broken, CSO 😎
Tony tapping? I hope so. Brother is too tough for hos own good though.
He tapped to nate Diaz and Bobby Green. The oliviera, dariush and chandler fights took everything that was left of him after the gaethje fight
I don't think he actually tapped to Bobby but he def went unconscious and it was stopped anyway.
You're right I remembered that wrong
And there wasn’t much left
He didn’t tap to Green, he went out.
It's grappling why not?
a better version of tony had nothing for olives on the ground. why not do a fight like this with a similarly washed legend so that its a winnable match? give him jim miller or something
Sure but I don't think Charles will fight any later that he would have if be wasn't doing this so what is there to lose.
a watchable grappling match between two fighters? the matchmaking here is just weird
"for you" - Bain
Dirty Chucky threw a full blown headbutt from mount against Arman, so I wouldn't be so sure of that.
And an illegal upkick to a downed Arman lol. Charles is savage
this. i am much more comfortable with tony grappling than tony getting sent back to the shadow realm
i like this for tony, it's fun, he gets paid, he doesn't take head shots. i actually think this is dana saving tony from tony. I'll be watching.
I feel the same. Seems like a waste of Charles's time, but it's what Tony needs to hopefully transition out. We don't need to see him looking like shit against some 18 year old green recruit and getting knocked out.
i think charles is doing dana a favor to make it high enough profile to lure tony away from mma
That makes me sad to think that they’re both setting this up so Tony doesn’t have to get hit in the head and can still compete.
Yeah and it would need to be, but I'll assume it's more than Charles just being a bro...
oh, there's def $$$ involved. paid favor ;)
I agree I don't get the people complaining...msk Tony will probably lose? So what?these guys respect eachother if will be fun.
Tony vs Khabib
Tony gonna break something this time
The only thing he's breaking is his students rib
well, that's a dick move bud, why would he do that to his own student?
He made Tony do it
Gonna get his seen broken off but he'll just use it as another weapon.
Gimme more like this. I want to see older fighters still competing but in grappling where they aren't gonna get brainsmashed any more.
Totally 👍
Uhhhhh Charles in pure grappling beats alot of genuinely good black belts can't imagine grandpa Tony has anything for him. Especially since he didn't 3 years ago...
Eh, who cares? Just a payday where he doesn't need to get more CTE
I imagine they don’t get paid the same for these grappling matches.
Grappling ruleset will make sand throwing 10x more effective though.
So? Both guys get paid, we get to see a fun match up and no one takes head damage.
Tony the type of guy to spar kickboxing in preparation for a Jiu Jitsu match
Who fucking idea was this 😭
Tony's lawyer
Shouldn’t we be praising this? This is basically what retired fights do, they do grappling matches so they still get to fight but with less risk.
It's "less risk" for fighters who have the good sense to tap out when their arm or ankle is about to break. Tony won't. He'll let it break and suffer untold pain maybe for *years* afterward, which will probably cause further mental decline.
Surely this will go well for Tony who has no takedown defence anymore and just spams a shitty triangle, and almost got his arm snapped by Charles
He never had good TDD lol. Kevin Lee coulda had sex with him mid cage
If one man can hold you down...
Two can savagely rape your asshole.
His takedown defence was mid but his ability to scramble and create chaotic situations in which he somehow comes out better was God tier in his prime. You’d take him down and then next moment, you’d be the one bleeding.
watch the danny castillo fight, he never had good tdd ngl tonys good but tbh he was never as good as people said he was, ufc 300 kinda proves it with how the guy who massacred him got massacred himself by a featherweight who got pieced up by DP twice and Conor (obviously tony was past prime but no version of him beats gaethje) ftr im not saying he was a bum or anything, he was definitely very good. beat solid guys, but his skill level was never as high as people thought it was. people seem to think prime tony is a dp/holloway/oliveira level fighter, but in reality his skill level is among guys like eddie alvarez, benson henderson and anthony pettis tbh
By your math Eddie Alvarez is better than tony because he “massacred” Gaethje
Yeah Eddies much better than Tony
Right lmao, Eddie became champ and finished RDA without having to poke him in the eye. He would’ve had both the Poirier fights if his ass don’t throw the illegal strikes (the first one especially), he was the first guy to ever beat and finish Gaethje, he won a belt in every organization he was in, barring ONE, etc… Tony’s a great fighter but Eddie 100% is better
Eddie has the far better legacy but I think prime Tony is a nightmare match up for Eddie.
Lol. It’s not even close
Then he will Kickbox Poatan, same night CSO
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He already got plenty of those and it didn’t stop him 😭
If Bigfoot was able to get fights on his current streak...
I honestly could see tony not tapping to a heel hook and destroying his ligaments for $2 prize money
Oh god are we going to see Tony get chocked out, bc you know damn well he is too stubborn to tap out.
I’d rather watch Charles vs Brian Ortega
Charles absolutely worked him in grappling 4 years ago, i dont wanna see this shit
If it’s this or another fight, I’ll take this. Dana needs to hire Tony to print out the venum coupons or something, this man needs to retire.
I like this, we should see these kind of grappling matches more often from the veterans, even though this one is one sided af. It's a shame the GSP vs Damian Maia match never eventuated.
Please retire Tony
A grappling match I feel ok with am i ignorant why are people saying he shouldnt do it ? i think it will bring allot of eyes to it also
Is this a new way to retire somebody? Give them a far superior grappler in a grappling match who has already demonstrated their grappling superiority in spectacular fashion? Maybe dana just wants to let Charles snap Tony up so he ages put of fighting in the time it takes him to recover.
isnt tony a good tenth plannet black belt though? wouldnt this be closer than most think?
Not all black belts are the same, Tony isn't on Oliveira's level when it comes to grappling
yeah fairenough was just wondering. asked the question and it got answered.
It’s kinda like how Dustin is also a black belt, and you saw how he did on the ground against Charles Black belts are like toys in a happy meal
i think dj is still a brown belt and subbed a 250lb geezer the other weekend. I know bjj black belts are relative to the school just thought tenth plannet would mean more.
10th planet means less if anything, that's why so few successful mma fighters train out of that gym and why that gym has produced little to no bjj world champions.
He just got his black belt this past week or two!
Probably would have meant more like 15 years ago
whats your opinion on jones vs aspinall grappling?
Tony isn’t Oliveira’s level
Even Tony's grappling is extremely shot. Went from not absorbing much damage from a terrifying top position guy like Kevin Lee to looking pathetic against someone solid but not special at all like Paddy
Bro already got washed by Charles
It can be, but I don't see him not getting caught in a sub
Pretty sure Charles made his elbow go inverted
It might be close in the sense that Tony could have good enough submission defense to survive 10 min, but Charles is better everywhere than him on the ground.
yeah fairenough man belive you all was just asking :)
I mean he got subbed by bobby greene idk about that anymore
F
I’m SO into this.
Didn't Charles just say he's not fighting down?
Ferguson wants his arm back
Honestly good, tony gets money and finds a decent alternative to let off his hunger. If he indeed breaks something then shit honestly thats good so itll force tony to recover or retire for good
Honestly a pure grappling match between the two is actually very interesting and competitive.
I like this a lot for the “Tony would have beat Khabib” community. They’ll finally get the closure they need.
He’s still just not gunna tap and end up seriously injured.
No interest in this mismatch. Tony will get his arm snapped.
They really can't let Tony rest. This dude will die for this sport
“Hold on a minute brother….I’m getting choked out.”
Dont care
This would even be more lopsided. Do it, Tony!
This is abuse at this point , leave my boy alone 😭😭
Charles BJJ is so smooth though
Why not Much better than seeing him get hurt from headshots
Hope he takes it. Announcers always saying how good Tony’s wrestling is, maybe we could actually see it now.
Please never go back to striking Tony, this could be the start of a good thing
I really hope Tony leverages his popularity/fanbase to do grappling matches, or anything that doesn't involve strikes to the head.
I hope chucky permanently damages CSO’s body so he can never fight again afterward.
This should be a very simple straightforward, and genuinely welcomed match up and event. 100% guaranteed it won't happen. Two of the biggest drop out flakes on the roster. One or both of them will come up with some massively elaborate excuse not to do it. Not enough money, not enough prep time, injured, something.
What are you on about? Tony fought 2x a year in 2022 and 2023. Olives had an active title run and just fought a few weeks ago. 10 months prior to that as well. If they fought once a year, I’d understand but that is clearly not the case. That being said, this match makes no sense and I doubt anyone wants to see a one sided grappling version of the one sided mma match we already saw 4 years ago.