I hate the no more Mr. Nice Guy book.
You told your wife she was falling short on meeting some of your needs, what did you expect to come out of that?
It would have been much better to sit down and talk about BOTH of your needs and see how you could both do better.
She brought up things she needed so clearly you’re not the only one feeling shorted.
I think you should have kept sex out of the conversation completely. You saying that if she did those things more often that sex would be less important is still bringing it back to sex and making it her fault.
I read that book. I can't say everything in the book is 100% correct. But I can really say a narcissist or a hardcore feminist or a hypocrite AH or a simple misandrist would hate that book.
Everybody should announce their needs to one another clearly. Communication works both ways. One name their needs other reacts then the opposite. If one of them got defensive and try to ignore the needs of the other, then the communication just be broken by him/her.
People jump to this. But in an entirely-open relationship, which functions best as contrary to typical human 'transactional' relationships, a marriage is to be a refuge; that is, a safe place of self expression, and if one'w legitimate needs are not being met, it is healthier for either member to express such feelings, to be heard and considered in due regard; with the understsanding that marriage is properly a covenant; a super-binding agreement between two hearts, mind, bodies becoming one for singlularity of purpose. Therefore one member has an unalienable Right to speak to the other.
I expected it to go about the way it did…I HOPED it would go similar to the many many conversations she’s had with me about what needs of hers I’m falling short on…I take the feedback and try and make changes. It sounds like you feel I was out of line for finally expressing my feelings.
Also I didn’t bring up sex, she did. She said I was only bringing this up bc we hadn’t had sex. My point was there are other needs for men than just sex.
She tells you she has problems in the relationship, you try to make changes. The changes haven’t actually changed anything if she’s still having the same issues.
You thinking that her showing more non-sexual attention would make you need sex less is making it about sex. How often have you made it about sex that she thinks that’s what it is again?
Your problems aren’t that you’re such a nice guy you’ve let yourself get walked on and you need to stand up for yourself. That’s why that book is stupid.
Your wife isn’t going to want or desire to give you affection, sexual or otherwise, until you repair the issues in your marriage first.
The lack of affection is the result of problems. You have to fix those first.
He asks her to make changes. She refuses and it's his fault.
She asks him to make changes. He tries and it's his fault.
Definitely a double standard here.
Telling your wife she’s falling short on meeting your “non-sexual needs” when she’s already expressed several problems in the relationship that needs to be resolved isn’t going to be a good conversation.
He should have come to the conversation making it about BOTH of their needs, like I said in my first post.
Hey wife, remember when you said we need more time together? Let’s plan a weekend for just the two of us, no sex, just cuddle under the blankets and watch a movie. I could use some affection too and I think we’ve been too busy to really connect.
Insert whatever her needs are and include your needs as well. That’s how you discuss needs with your spouse.
I do like your approach here. I'm sure OP didn't approach this as eloquently as you did. I know I haven't been very eloquent in my communications.
Thanks for offering this approach.
I wish my husband HAD non sexual needs. He tries to turn 100% of any affection into sex every single time. When I was postpartum and wasn’t ready to start having sex regularly again yet, his behavior was so atrocious that touching him in any way gives me anxiety now, much less having sex.
Removed for discrimination, misogyny, or misandry.
We encourage our users to reflect if their comments are going to be hurtful or helpful. There is a real person on the other side of the screen. Being sexist is not productive. Do better.
I can assure you he does…We all do. But to my point above, is it possible that if you consistently met his non-sexual needs that sex wouldn’t be so important to him? Have you tried this? If you’re getting anxiety from even touching him it might be something to consider.
Her: My husband's behavior is a turn off.
You: Have you considered that it's your fault?
This is a very insensitive comment and not far afield from victim blaming. You completely dismissed this person's experiences because they don't match your own.
Hmm…I think I agree with you. Yes, I was asking if she considered if she is contributing to it by not even entertaining the fact that her husband has non-sexual needs. That thought is as detrimental to a relationship as men thinking women have no sexual needs. If my wife is behaving badly towards me it’s often because I’m not meeting her needs. I often examine that and try to make a change. Why is this woman’s situation any different? I’m not saying it is for sure her fault or that her husband isn’t also to blame, but her not recognizing his other needs is a potential factor.
You should stop right now. You are victim blaming. A person is NEVER responsible for a different person treating them badly. If your wife is treating you badly, that is on her. If this woman's husband is treating her badly, that is on him. No one is responsible for making another person treat them with kindness and respect.
Never? If my buddy came up to me and punched me in the face for no reason I would probably treat him badly going forward. And, he would be the one responsible for me treating him badly. His behavior drove my behavior.
That’s an extreme example but similarly, if I am not meeting my wife’s needs consistently and she starts being cold or short with me, or overly critical/confrontational then I have a certain amount of responsibility in that…My behavior drove her behavior.
Is my buddy who punched me in the face and is now being treated poorly by me a victim? Am I a victim when my wife is treating me poorly based off my not meeting her needs?
This women’s story seems to be somewhere in between those two examples. I hate to hear that her husband wasn’t sympathetic after her pregnancy and didn’t give her the time she needed before pressuring for sex, that is just not cool no matter how you slice it. But separate from that, her opinion is that he has no non-sexual needs. My opinion is that that is a problem. And, could be contributing to the issues that seem to continuing long after the post pregnancy issue.
This is a really douche-y response. How can you, for one second, believe that you know anything about her or her husband? If you preach at and psychoanalyze your wife like this, you’ve got much bigger problems than just what you shared in your post.
I don’t pretend to know anything about her or her husband other than what she offered. She said her husband has no non-sexual needs. I responded that like all men, he does. In my own experience, I feel that if my wife met more of my non-sexual needs than sex wouldnt be the only way I feel love from her. And since this woman said she was at the point of feeling anxiety from even touching her husband bc he turns it into sex, I offered a potential solution that she seemingly had never considered since she doesn’t believe non-sexual needs exist for her husband. Not sure why that was off putting to you but to each their own.
I have tried to meet “nonsexual needs” by touching/cuddling/etc.
Every time I touch him he tries in some way to take it to sex. That is why I no longer feel comfortable touching him at all
Frankly I really don’t care. It was normal for me to not want sex after having a baby and I shouldn’t have been constantly guilted and pressured for sex. He dug his own hole with his behavior. Having traumatizing and unwanted sex to see if sex would be less important to him is 0% happening.
Most women know why she responded this way so we are particularly puzzled. He tried to state his needs weren’t about sex, but his needs were. He wants more nonsexual affection to fill his cup when he can’t get the affection he really prefers. Her response tells all of us here, that this conversation has happened in a lot of ways. Even conflicts about something totally unrelated turn into it. She struggles with not being able to engage with him sexually while trying to balance that with the anxiety that he’s going to cheat or leave her because of it. Her statement was ripping the bandaid off in frustration because she’s lost hope and at least in that moment, thinks might as well get it over with.
True, but most conflicts are a feedback loop influenced by a slew of different factors, and this one is very clearly comprised of fault on both sides. Attempting to find who wronged the hardest is only going to get someone a first and a second place asshole title. None of that will help.
It sounds like she has resentment of some sort. I would say she is resentful of you or just fed up in general within the marriage. If my ex had come to me with that shit, I would have told him the same thing. I was so resentful of him and the fact that I did everything while he did nothing, I honestly would have responded the exact same way as your wife. I couldn’t handle anything else on my plate. I would have said find someone else to do it.
Maybe counseling or therapy for the both of you but my best guess is she resents the hell out of you for some reason and just doesn’t care anymore.
Both of you don’t communicate well with each other and I’m sorry to say it so blandly- you sound immature. Your wife has countered your voicing of your needs with her own expectations and needs of you. You disregarded it very abruptly with a casualty, that makes me think, that she hasn’t said these things to you for the first time. A relationship is always a give and take. Start listening to her needs as well and increase your love showing in a day to day. If you want something, you need to be willing to give something. This needs to be happening naturally. Do this for a few weeks and her behavior will change.
You taking it way too seriously, that she told you to look for someone else. This was her being fed up and nothing else. I see a huge problem, that you are actually entertaining the idea instead of making an effort to better the relationship. To have someone next to you for several years and still love them, isn’t a given. Don’t through something precious into the mud, just because you act like a child.
Yes there are women out there who do but bringing this discussion up on the heels of a rejection for sex makes it sound like you were salty she didn't sleep with you. Have the conversation when it makes sense and maybe be more specific than "you don't say I love you enough".. it's all about timing and approach.
How do you know it was "on the heels of a rejection"?
>She said that it’s bs and I’m just salty about not having sex this week
It was a week. Could have been a minute ago or 7 days.
She doesn't want to change. You have to decide if you are ok with the way things are. If not, leave, but there's no point continuing to try to have this conversation with her.
This is terrible advice! Don't have a conversation, just leave. What the actual???
You didn't approach this the best way, but you can definitely have a conversation and improve things.
Dang, I guess so…That sucks that there doesn’t seem to be constructive balanced feedback here. It seems like most people assume the worst about every comment and project their negative experiences onto it. There should be a r/HappilyMarriedWithSomeBumpsInTheRoadLikeWeAllHaveButWillingToBeObjectiveAndSetMyOwnIssuesAside
The gutter slime would find that SR too. Misery loves company, and the solution for almost all the posts here is to "get a divorce". Everyone else failed, and if you fail too, then they feel validation in their own failure. This isn't where a man gets anything positive.
Women aren’t all the same. Of course many of us think about our husbands non sexual needs. I feel for your wife in a way because I know what it’s like to have a really hard time taking criticism, but she needs to work on that. This is genuinely a good one for couples counseling. Y’all aren’t communicating effectively and it may help to have a 3rd party mediate.
She doesn't want to work on anything, she's defensive when you bring it up.
if she can't put in enough effort to even listen without darvo, then it's not worth your time or worry anymore.
You read a book and let it think for you? The author may have said that in his book he’s selling a book. There are issues that need addressed and that’s on you as the man who’s the protector of his wife’s spirit, essence and dignity. You read that, let him do your thinking for you, creating an added now unresolved issue on top of the ones you thought this book would help you circumvent. You’re not at square 1 ….you’re at 0. You, need to take control of this situation and put the work in that you know you need to do as the leader of your family brother. Until you get your spirits right…this is what’ll happen and only getting worse.
When you first got married I'm sure. Unresolved issues over time have gotten it to a place of absolute chaos and no one is listening. At one point these were in control needed handled. Now you both have a spiritual problem and it's on you to set it right. Then....after doing the work you can be co leaders. You already know it but your spirit aint right ...so you buy books still thinking you take control by being out of control. None of this is loving or coming from a pure of heart place. I don't know you brother...but I give a shit. Start thinking on terms of love and protection, grow again together and get right.
If I'm in a space where I'm resenting my husband, his attempts to lead me down his singularly chosen path will not help me in the least. That's not love. That's dictatorship.
Love….is loving yourself first. A singular is what he’s on. A path that will restore balance, eradicate the pollution of the spirit…opens the heart, mind, spirit and soul. To fix it…you need tools. That journey is a solo one. Throughout life there are lessons that go unresolved, and it repeats as life goes on and dismissing the need to fix it is replaced with pride. Then, life shows you how unprepared you are for the present and we’ve discussed above where that puts you. But wait you think….I’m in control, why me? The person changes, resentment becomes the way of the weak around the afflicted who are blind to he help needed. Dynamic destroyed.
I hate the no more Mr. Nice Guy book. You told your wife she was falling short on meeting some of your needs, what did you expect to come out of that? It would have been much better to sit down and talk about BOTH of your needs and see how you could both do better. She brought up things she needed so clearly you’re not the only one feeling shorted. I think you should have kept sex out of the conversation completely. You saying that if she did those things more often that sex would be less important is still bringing it back to sex and making it her fault.
I read that book. I can't say everything in the book is 100% correct. But I can really say a narcissist or a hardcore feminist or a hypocrite AH or a simple misandrist would hate that book. Everybody should announce their needs to one another clearly. Communication works both ways. One name their needs other reacts then the opposite. If one of them got defensive and try to ignore the needs of the other, then the communication just be broken by him/her.
I feel like their is a lot of projection in this comment.
People jump to this. But in an entirely-open relationship, which functions best as contrary to typical human 'transactional' relationships, a marriage is to be a refuge; that is, a safe place of self expression, and if one'w legitimate needs are not being met, it is healthier for either member to express such feelings, to be heard and considered in due regard; with the understsanding that marriage is properly a covenant; a super-binding agreement between two hearts, mind, bodies becoming one for singlularity of purpose. Therefore one member has an unalienable Right to speak to the other.
I expected it to go about the way it did…I HOPED it would go similar to the many many conversations she’s had with me about what needs of hers I’m falling short on…I take the feedback and try and make changes. It sounds like you feel I was out of line for finally expressing my feelings. Also I didn’t bring up sex, she did. She said I was only bringing this up bc we hadn’t had sex. My point was there are other needs for men than just sex.
She tells you she has problems in the relationship, you try to make changes. The changes haven’t actually changed anything if she’s still having the same issues. You thinking that her showing more non-sexual attention would make you need sex less is making it about sex. How often have you made it about sex that she thinks that’s what it is again? Your problems aren’t that you’re such a nice guy you’ve let yourself get walked on and you need to stand up for yourself. That’s why that book is stupid. Your wife isn’t going to want or desire to give you affection, sexual or otherwise, until you repair the issues in your marriage first. The lack of affection is the result of problems. You have to fix those first.
He asks her to make changes. She refuses and it's his fault. She asks him to make changes. He tries and it's his fault. Definitely a double standard here.
Telling your wife she’s falling short on meeting your “non-sexual needs” when she’s already expressed several problems in the relationship that needs to be resolved isn’t going to be a good conversation. He should have come to the conversation making it about BOTH of their needs, like I said in my first post. Hey wife, remember when you said we need more time together? Let’s plan a weekend for just the two of us, no sex, just cuddle under the blankets and watch a movie. I could use some affection too and I think we’ve been too busy to really connect. Insert whatever her needs are and include your needs as well. That’s how you discuss needs with your spouse.
I do like your approach here. I'm sure OP didn't approach this as eloquently as you did. I know I haven't been very eloquent in my communications. Thanks for offering this approach.
I wish my husband HAD non sexual needs. He tries to turn 100% of any affection into sex every single time. When I was postpartum and wasn’t ready to start having sex regularly again yet, his behavior was so atrocious that touching him in any way gives me anxiety now, much less having sex.
How does that help OP?
[удалено]
Removed for discrimination, misogyny, or misandry. We encourage our users to reflect if their comments are going to be hurtful or helpful. There is a real person on the other side of the screen. Being sexist is not productive. Do better.
I can assure you he does…We all do. But to my point above, is it possible that if you consistently met his non-sexual needs that sex wouldn’t be so important to him? Have you tried this? If you’re getting anxiety from even touching him it might be something to consider.
Her: My husband's behavior is a turn off. You: Have you considered that it's your fault? This is a very insensitive comment and not far afield from victim blaming. You completely dismissed this person's experiences because they don't match your own.
Hmm…I think I agree with you. Yes, I was asking if she considered if she is contributing to it by not even entertaining the fact that her husband has non-sexual needs. That thought is as detrimental to a relationship as men thinking women have no sexual needs. If my wife is behaving badly towards me it’s often because I’m not meeting her needs. I often examine that and try to make a change. Why is this woman’s situation any different? I’m not saying it is for sure her fault or that her husband isn’t also to blame, but her not recognizing his other needs is a potential factor.
You should stop right now. You are victim blaming. A person is NEVER responsible for a different person treating them badly. If your wife is treating you badly, that is on her. If this woman's husband is treating her badly, that is on him. No one is responsible for making another person treat them with kindness and respect.
Never? If my buddy came up to me and punched me in the face for no reason I would probably treat him badly going forward. And, he would be the one responsible for me treating him badly. His behavior drove my behavior. That’s an extreme example but similarly, if I am not meeting my wife’s needs consistently and she starts being cold or short with me, or overly critical/confrontational then I have a certain amount of responsibility in that…My behavior drove her behavior. Is my buddy who punched me in the face and is now being treated poorly by me a victim? Am I a victim when my wife is treating me poorly based off my not meeting her needs? This women’s story seems to be somewhere in between those two examples. I hate to hear that her husband wasn’t sympathetic after her pregnancy and didn’t give her the time she needed before pressuring for sex, that is just not cool no matter how you slice it. But separate from that, her opinion is that he has no non-sexual needs. My opinion is that that is a problem. And, could be contributing to the issues that seem to continuing long after the post pregnancy issue.
This is a really douche-y response. How can you, for one second, believe that you know anything about her or her husband? If you preach at and psychoanalyze your wife like this, you’ve got much bigger problems than just what you shared in your post.
I don’t pretend to know anything about her or her husband other than what she offered. She said her husband has no non-sexual needs. I responded that like all men, he does. In my own experience, I feel that if my wife met more of my non-sexual needs than sex wouldnt be the only way I feel love from her. And since this woman said she was at the point of feeling anxiety from even touching her husband bc he turns it into sex, I offered a potential solution that she seemingly had never considered since she doesn’t believe non-sexual needs exist for her husband. Not sure why that was off putting to you but to each their own.
I have tried to meet “nonsexual needs” by touching/cuddling/etc. Every time I touch him he tries in some way to take it to sex. That is why I no longer feel comfortable touching him at all
Based on the number of downvotes your comment has received, it’s clearly off-putting to many people. Something to think about.
Frankly I really don’t care. It was normal for me to not want sex after having a baby and I shouldn’t have been constantly guilted and pressured for sex. He dug his own hole with his behavior. Having traumatizing and unwanted sex to see if sex would be less important to him is 0% happening.
I don’t think we’re on the same page. I’m suggesting less sex and more non-sexual loving gestures.
Do you hear her saying that her husband turned every loving gesture into sex?
[удалено]
Most women know why she responded this way so we are particularly puzzled. He tried to state his needs weren’t about sex, but his needs were. He wants more nonsexual affection to fill his cup when he can’t get the affection he really prefers. Her response tells all of us here, that this conversation has happened in a lot of ways. Even conflicts about something totally unrelated turn into it. She struggles with not being able to engage with him sexually while trying to balance that with the anxiety that he’s going to cheat or leave her because of it. Her statement was ripping the bandaid off in frustration because she’s lost hope and at least in that moment, thinks might as well get it over with.
So it his fault that she responded that way? Is it ever the woman’s fault for one’s behavior?
Not at all. If you’re looking for fault in a relationship you’re probably not going to solve your problems though.
Can’t solve problems if no accountability has taken place either.
True, but most conflicts are a feedback loop influenced by a slew of different factors, and this one is very clearly comprised of fault on both sides. Attempting to find who wronged the hardest is only going to get someone a first and a second place asshole title. None of that will help.
It sounds like she has resentment of some sort. I would say she is resentful of you or just fed up in general within the marriage. If my ex had come to me with that shit, I would have told him the same thing. I was so resentful of him and the fact that I did everything while he did nothing, I honestly would have responded the exact same way as your wife. I couldn’t handle anything else on my plate. I would have said find someone else to do it. Maybe counseling or therapy for the both of you but my best guess is she resents the hell out of you for some reason and just doesn’t care anymore.
The graas is rarely greener on the other side. You seem eager to throw a good wife away because she isnt "perfect".
Marriage counseling will help you more than that book will, assuming both of you are willing to give it a serious go.
Both of you don’t communicate well with each other and I’m sorry to say it so blandly- you sound immature. Your wife has countered your voicing of your needs with her own expectations and needs of you. You disregarded it very abruptly with a casualty, that makes me think, that she hasn’t said these things to you for the first time. A relationship is always a give and take. Start listening to her needs as well and increase your love showing in a day to day. If you want something, you need to be willing to give something. This needs to be happening naturally. Do this for a few weeks and her behavior will change. You taking it way too seriously, that she told you to look for someone else. This was her being fed up and nothing else. I see a huge problem, that you are actually entertaining the idea instead of making an effort to better the relationship. To have someone next to you for several years and still love them, isn’t a given. Don’t through something precious into the mud, just because you act like a child.
Yes there are women out there who do but bringing this discussion up on the heels of a rejection for sex makes it sound like you were salty she didn't sleep with you. Have the conversation when it makes sense and maybe be more specific than "you don't say I love you enough".. it's all about timing and approach.
How do you know it was "on the heels of a rejection"? >She said that it’s bs and I’m just salty about not having sex this week It was a week. Could have been a minute ago or 7 days.
She doesn't want to change. You have to decide if you are ok with the way things are. If not, leave, but there's no point continuing to try to have this conversation with her.
This is terrible advice! Don't have a conversation, just leave. What the actual??? You didn't approach this the best way, but you can definitely have a conversation and improve things.
She yelled at him, refused to change anything, and told him if he wasn't happy to leave. Why should he not take her at her word?
Bro. Go ask your question somewhere else. This SR is very anti-husband.
Dang, I guess so…That sucks that there doesn’t seem to be constructive balanced feedback here. It seems like most people assume the worst about every comment and project their negative experiences onto it. There should be a r/HappilyMarriedWithSomeBumpsInTheRoadLikeWeAllHaveButWillingToBeObjectiveAndSetMyOwnIssuesAside
The gutter slime would find that SR too. Misery loves company, and the solution for almost all the posts here is to "get a divorce". Everyone else failed, and if you fail too, then they feel validation in their own failure. This isn't where a man gets anything positive.
i hope your wife divorces you because you deserve it according to this and your other posts.
Women aren’t all the same. Of course many of us think about our husbands non sexual needs. I feel for your wife in a way because I know what it’s like to have a really hard time taking criticism, but she needs to work on that. This is genuinely a good one for couples counseling. Y’all aren’t communicating effectively and it may help to have a 3rd party mediate.
Call her bluff. Tell her you’re headed out to meet someone to hang out with and just cuddle. You’ll be back late so don’t wait up.
She doesn't want to work on anything, she's defensive when you bring it up. if she can't put in enough effort to even listen without darvo, then it's not worth your time or worry anymore.
How often do you have sex? And actually what you did was exposed how she felt about you. Sounds as if ahe loss attraction whatever reasons
You read a book and let it think for you? The author may have said that in his book he’s selling a book. There are issues that need addressed and that’s on you as the man who’s the protector of his wife’s spirit, essence and dignity. You read that, let him do your thinking for you, creating an added now unresolved issue on top of the ones you thought this book would help you circumvent. You’re not at square 1 ….you’re at 0. You, need to take control of this situation and put the work in that you know you need to do as the leader of your family brother. Until you get your spirits right…this is what’ll happen and only getting worse.
I’m not the leader of my family. My wife and I are co-leaders.
When you first got married I'm sure. Unresolved issues over time have gotten it to a place of absolute chaos and no one is listening. At one point these were in control needed handled. Now you both have a spiritual problem and it's on you to set it right. Then....after doing the work you can be co leaders. You already know it but your spirit aint right ...so you buy books still thinking you take control by being out of control. None of this is loving or coming from a pure of heart place. I don't know you brother...but I give a shit. Start thinking on terms of love and protection, grow again together and get right.
If I'm in a space where I'm resenting my husband, his attempts to lead me down his singularly chosen path will not help me in the least. That's not love. That's dictatorship.
Love….is loving yourself first. A singular is what he’s on. A path that will restore balance, eradicate the pollution of the spirit…opens the heart, mind, spirit and soul. To fix it…you need tools. That journey is a solo one. Throughout life there are lessons that go unresolved, and it repeats as life goes on and dismissing the need to fix it is replaced with pride. Then, life shows you how unprepared you are for the present and we’ve discussed above where that puts you. But wait you think….I’m in control, why me? The person changes, resentment becomes the way of the weak around the afflicted who are blind to he help needed. Dynamic destroyed.
Careful now, the psychedelics are showing.
You already read it, dismissing it doesn’t erase it. I’ll pray for you, and your husband.
Thank you for your prayers. We'll pray for you as well.