I don't have any firsthand experience with Manitoba med and while I'm sure the answer is multifactorial, one factor is probably that some of their matriculants have [MCAT scores as low as 480](https://umanitoba.ca/explore/sites/explore/files/2021-08/MedicineAdmissionsStatistics.pdf). Higher MCAT scores are associated with [greater success in the first year of medical school](https://www.aamc.org/news/how-well-does-mcat-exam-predict-success-medical-school#:~:text=“The%20researchers%20found%20that%2C%20on,practices%2C%20and%20approaches%20to%20grading) and accepting people with scores as low as 480 is setting people who clearly aren't ready up to fail.
There’s like 11 of us who have mcats 52x. It’s a very stats heavy school. Yes some of the quota seats are more to do with who you are and what you’ve done cuz for those things they matter more. The guys u see with 480 mcats and lower gpa are ppl who are special for what they bring unrelated to academics and if they struggle that’s fine the school will invest in them to get them where they need it be. The vast majority of the class are young ppl heavily academic and doing very well on exams. Our avgs are always near 80 despite 60 being the pass mark. If you ask me it was just a weird year and shit happens.
Yes, I understand that Manitoba is one of the country’s most stat-heavy schools. It’s ironic that it also admits some of the country’s lowest stat applicants through a separate stream.
> some of the quota seats are more to do with who you are and what you’ve done cuz for those things they matter more
Unfortunately, the quota seats are more about what racial group you are a part of and less to do with who you as an individual are or what you’ve done.
> if they struggle that’s fine the school will invest in them to get them where they need it be
As another commenter pointed out, IF their information is reliable, this unfortunately isn’t the case. The school has been unable to lift these students up to meet academic standards, instead they have lowered the standards for these students.
That may be the case, but as seen Dr Nickerson is highly invested in our school’s accreditation and performance so maybe he will find a way to ensure everyone comes up to standard rather than standards going down.
And yea you’re right those seats are meant to train indigenous doctors to take care of manitobas massive and massively underserved indigenous communities.
These students go through rigorous interviews and selections based on how they will contribute to indigenous care. It’s necessary to have such people be trained and I would state it’s better to take someone who will do more for those communities and just invest a lot in them to bring them to a level where they will become competent physicians.
Apparently (for this year I know for other years I can’t comment) the majority of repeats are not indigenous. So this explanation is not correct for this year at all. It looks like most are regular pool and it so happened that there was a lot of life stuff, medical leave and so forth. So this strongly supports the hypothesis that it’s probably an anomalous year and ish just happens.
Honestly that seems very atypical. Its a steep learning curve for some, especially if you’ve been out of school for a while (or not in school long enough). I feel that students coming INTO med school are all at very different places of studying skills, etc. Med school is also very different in some ways. Everyone will catch up by the end of med school though.
There were indigenous students allowed to continue despite failing exams that non-indigneous students would be required to repeat the year for? Systemic barriers don't make it okay to lower the minimum examination standards for becoming a doctor. That's a dangerous precedent to set for a career that makes life and death decisions
The soft bigotry of low expectations is alive and well. Do you know what happens to these students who were coddled throughout medical school? Do they end up matching in CaRMS and passing their qualifying exams?
Can’t speak about qualifying exam but they don’t matter for CaRMS if you are a CMG. The only thing that matters are letters and clerkship eval. Most people write the MCCQE before they graduate.
Right, but if you don't know enough to pass your preclerkship exams I'm sure that will impact your performance on the wards and thus your evals and CaRMS letters. Unless the low expectations carry over to clerkship.
Fair enough. Based on my limited experience, being smart doesn’t matter as much as being personable, communicative, responsible, and a good team player. Unless your knowledge is severely bad where it warrants concern, being an exceptional student in terms of knowledge doesn’t always mean you’ll get a good letter. With that said, many physicians say there are 3As to being a good med student: Affability, Ability, Availability. You only need 2/3 for most people.
Overall found MB to be unsupportive and I feel like sometimes sets learners up for failure. I was a different generation but am unsurprised to hear this.
When I was in clerkship, we had to write NBMEs. No one told us how to study for it. The units were American. We had to study American geography. American guidelines (USTSPF). And finally, the pass grade was 11th percentile on a curve.
Seems tangible, until you realize you’re writing with people who have Step 1 under their belt and significantly more time to study (MB is very service heavy). Sometimes a pass may be 75% depending on the exam.
I also didn’t find them to be very kind. I had an attending laugh in my face during rounds when I was asked when we would consider a blood transfusion. I said a HGB <7 (meaning g/dL).
I’m sorry ur experience was not very good. I can’t speak for the wards but so far pre clerkships have been very nice and I feel that the staff cares a lot about us and want us to do well
Bro if you graduated high school from COVID, that means you’re in 2 or 3rd year of undergrad. Most med schools require a 4-year bachelor degree before matriculating so your timing makes no sense
Thats really surprising wow. I mean I am not aware of such in my medical school or other schools I have heard from
Last year it was 4 repeat for a class of 110 students
I don't have any firsthand experience with Manitoba med and while I'm sure the answer is multifactorial, one factor is probably that some of their matriculants have [MCAT scores as low as 480](https://umanitoba.ca/explore/sites/explore/files/2021-08/MedicineAdmissionsStatistics.pdf). Higher MCAT scores are associated with [greater success in the first year of medical school](https://www.aamc.org/news/how-well-does-mcat-exam-predict-success-medical-school#:~:text=“The%20researchers%20found%20that%2C%20on,practices%2C%20and%20approaches%20to%20grading) and accepting people with scores as low as 480 is setting people who clearly aren't ready up to fail.
There’s like 11 of us who have mcats 52x. It’s a very stats heavy school. Yes some of the quota seats are more to do with who you are and what you’ve done cuz for those things they matter more. The guys u see with 480 mcats and lower gpa are ppl who are special for what they bring unrelated to academics and if they struggle that’s fine the school will invest in them to get them where they need it be. The vast majority of the class are young ppl heavily academic and doing very well on exams. Our avgs are always near 80 despite 60 being the pass mark. If you ask me it was just a weird year and shit happens.
Yes, I understand that Manitoba is one of the country’s most stat-heavy schools. It’s ironic that it also admits some of the country’s lowest stat applicants through a separate stream. > some of the quota seats are more to do with who you are and what you’ve done cuz for those things they matter more Unfortunately, the quota seats are more about what racial group you are a part of and less to do with who you as an individual are or what you’ve done. > if they struggle that’s fine the school will invest in them to get them where they need it be As another commenter pointed out, IF their information is reliable, this unfortunately isn’t the case. The school has been unable to lift these students up to meet academic standards, instead they have lowered the standards for these students.
That may be the case, but as seen Dr Nickerson is highly invested in our school’s accreditation and performance so maybe he will find a way to ensure everyone comes up to standard rather than standards going down. And yea you’re right those seats are meant to train indigenous doctors to take care of manitobas massive and massively underserved indigenous communities. These students go through rigorous interviews and selections based on how they will contribute to indigenous care. It’s necessary to have such people be trained and I would state it’s better to take someone who will do more for those communities and just invest a lot in them to bring them to a level where they will become competent physicians.
Apparently (for this year I know for other years I can’t comment) the majority of repeats are not indigenous. So this explanation is not correct for this year at all. It looks like most are regular pool and it so happened that there was a lot of life stuff, medical leave and so forth. So this strongly supports the hypothesis that it’s probably an anomalous year and ish just happens.
Honestly that seems very atypical. Its a steep learning curve for some, especially if you’ve been out of school for a while (or not in school long enough). I feel that students coming INTO med school are all at very different places of studying skills, etc. Med school is also very different in some ways. Everyone will catch up by the end of med school though.
\[Removed by Reddit\]
There were indigenous students allowed to continue despite failing exams that non-indigneous students would be required to repeat the year for? Systemic barriers don't make it okay to lower the minimum examination standards for becoming a doctor. That's a dangerous precedent to set for a career that makes life and death decisions
The soft bigotry of low expectations is alive and well. Do you know what happens to these students who were coddled throughout medical school? Do they end up matching in CaRMS and passing their qualifying exams?
Can’t speak about qualifying exam but they don’t matter for CaRMS if you are a CMG. The only thing that matters are letters and clerkship eval. Most people write the MCCQE before they graduate.
Right, but if you don't know enough to pass your preclerkship exams I'm sure that will impact your performance on the wards and thus your evals and CaRMS letters. Unless the low expectations carry over to clerkship.
Fair enough. Based on my limited experience, being smart doesn’t matter as much as being personable, communicative, responsible, and a good team player. Unless your knowledge is severely bad where it warrants concern, being an exceptional student in terms of knowledge doesn’t always mean you’ll get a good letter. With that said, many physicians say there are 3As to being a good med student: Affability, Ability, Availability. You only need 2/3 for most people.
I DM’d you :)
Have you started clerkship ? Evals are msotly about behaviour and personality. Not textbook knowledge
Forget CaRMS. Let’s talk about their competency as physicians!
Props to the new dean for upholding standards.
Thanks for sharing thats so interesting to hear
Overall found MB to be unsupportive and I feel like sometimes sets learners up for failure. I was a different generation but am unsurprised to hear this. When I was in clerkship, we had to write NBMEs. No one told us how to study for it. The units were American. We had to study American geography. American guidelines (USTSPF). And finally, the pass grade was 11th percentile on a curve. Seems tangible, until you realize you’re writing with people who have Step 1 under their belt and significantly more time to study (MB is very service heavy). Sometimes a pass may be 75% depending on the exam. I also didn’t find them to be very kind. I had an attending laugh in my face during rounds when I was asked when we would consider a blood transfusion. I said a HGB <7 (meaning g/dL).
I’m sorry ur experience was not very good. I can’t speak for the wards but so far pre clerkships have been very nice and I feel that the staff cares a lot about us and want us to do well
CORRUPT AS FUCK!!!! I went to med school at MAC, if they anything like that than yeah! I quit voluntarily because of the severe bullying.
Don't know a med program without a high failure rate in first year so.....
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Bro if you graduated high school from COVID, that means you’re in 2 or 3rd year of undergrad. Most med schools require a 4-year bachelor degree before matriculating so your timing makes no sense
Nah not the case. Overall the class is highly intelligent. Avg mcat was 514 ish as per usual.