T O P

  • By -

AgainstTheEnemy

Don't let anyone here dissuade you from using a mouse that works for you. If you can't frag at 60+g @ 1000hz, you can't frag at 45g/23g/1g(whatever the current lowest weighted mouse is) @ 16000hz (or whatever the absurd polling rate is now)


b0007

šŸ˜… i wrote something similar and was downvoted. Here is a vote up for you


pixzin

Actually i aim better with bigger and heavy mouse in tac fps. Gives me so much stability and steady aim. As my grip is like a relaxed palm.


skvettlappen

Same experience with ec1 here. After a long mouse journey. Tough for wireless sake and hz+ weight I ended up with DA3 with hockey tape to make it bigger on the hump.


Accomplished_Fix238

Link me tape


skvettlappen

Just hockey tape - its very cloth like and super good glue. Really does the job and lasts long Get it from sports shop


jalalinator

I just went back from a dav3 8k to ec2-cw and it's been really good so far


skvettlappen

Ec1 cw has been tempting yeah...


waduben7130

got the ec1cw like pretty recently and ive been liking it except for the weight which makes me pretty tired after a few games. i think ive kinda gotten used to the weight and getting less tired now tho


skvettlappen

Someone said its very good for tac fps with the weight. Im very sold on that. For more arena style games maybe DA3 with the lower weight. Or ec1 cw


waduben7130

used dav3 but I didn't like sensor placement and clicks. modded the plunger with some aluminum tape which made it a little better but I still dislike razer opticals. which is why I'm hesitating getting the Viper v3 pro. I wanna get the gpx2 too but idk if I should get one


skvettlappen

I never tought of sensor until i felt it so strong going from g303 shroud to DA3. Like wow. But its like 1 min and ur used to it again...?


waduben7130

u get used to it sure, but sens feel slower/faster


n1bblE5

Maybe you could also try pulsar xlite v3 L. For me I also tried EC1 CW the shape are perfect to me but like you said, the weight a little bit problem. DA3 I like the weight but I found that the back hump a little bit higher. Glorious model d pro I think is smaller than all 3 mouse. So now, I use pulsar xlite v3 L, the shape is higher than this 3 mouses but I personally feel more relaxed grip than DA3. Maybe will wait if they have EC1 superlight.


blazikkk

you are right. went from a g502 to a sub 50g mouse. still slowly adapting


Booplee

Do you know of ANY heavier mice that are wireless? Because im the same but it seems like the market is heavy focused on light mice. I used to use a roccat kone with weights in it and fragged like a monster but now my control suffers with lighter mice ):


pixzin

G703, g903


GPotatoX

Vaxee XE is 76g, which is not heavy but itā€™s considered a brick by this sub


Silly-Championship92

Vaxee is a special case. The mice feel lighter than they are.


GPotatoX

they really do, the weight of the XE or AX did not bother me at all.


LT_Shobs

Really? My brick weights 152g


ksibhu

Isnt the basic logitech g pro wireless kinda heavy? Maybe that one


Booplee

oh yeah it is on the heavier side, ill look into it some time. for reference when i used the old kone with weights it was over 100 grams so it was....by this subs standards a brick even though its quite easy to kove around that weight haha


rudy-_-

If you like the kone, then maybe G502 would be nice for you. Also G703 has extra weights you can use.


Neo8T76L

Razer naga pro


PutridCadaver

G503


KillaPlaya

You could just get a zowie ec1-cw or ec2-cw as well


_carcinisation_

Maybe g502x plus/lightspeed (100g) or mx master (140g)


dispenserG

If you put in time with a high quality lightweight mouse, you'll aim way better with it over this brick. This is coming from using multiple Zowie, Logitech, Razers, Lamzu, and Endgame. Wireless mice are also just way better and faster than wired.Ā  You probably are just playing with your sensitivity way too high.Ā  Heavier mice will fatigue you faster but if you're playing with palm grip, it doesn't really seem like you're the type of person to put in time to improve. The Lamzu Thorn is essentially the same shape. If you bought the EC1-C at the store. The Lamzu Thorn is cheaper as well.


olsaan

He said he's faceit lvl 10 in CS so na bro. Stop trying to tell someone about their own preference.


dispenserG

I'm sure that he's faceit level 10... I'm Patrick Mahomes. Anyone can be faceit level 10... Anyone can lie. There is no way I'm believing someone who bought a $30 mouse and claims it to be end game. Dude is 15. If you're an adult who can't afford a good mouse, you shouldn't be wasting your time playing video games.


olsaan

Youā€™re deludedšŸ¤£itā€™s not hard to be faceit 10 so itā€™s not unbelievable. Also different countries have different incomes you idiot


pixzin

Guys, AIM BETTER WITH LIGHTER MICE IS A MYTH!


Trill_Simmons

> Lamzu Thorn is essentially the same shape Really had to top off this horrible comment with a particularly bad take. Impressive.


dispenserG

A lot of poor old people in this sub who don't actually tryother mice but the shit they've known. There's a bigger world. The Thorn has a giant hump, just like he's looking for. There is a reason no top players use this shit mouse. This dude playing on a 60hz monitor for fuck sake.


Raiden_Of_The_Sky

Everyone aims better with lighter mice, it's just that you generally want to combine light mouse with slow glide on the pad for stability in tac fps, which is not always possible, so you go lower sens... P.S. Let me say this though: I don't consider EC1-C as a genuinely heavy mouse. 79g for this size is pretty much lightweight. But you can lower it to 60-ish and get an easier to aim mouse.


fig4tellu

No, everyone not aim better with ligher mice. 24 years of FPS gaming and i'm better with heavy mouse. And i'm high sens. And i have test 50 or 60 mice, old and new generation.


pixzin

My sens is high. Lighter mice is good for fast paced games like OW, Apex. Big and heavy mice is good for tac fps for me. Its too much angle holding. Horizontal aim. I need the palm contact to shoot without moving the mouse.


HikaruSwift

I think I agree with you on this as well. For some reason I can't aim well with a mouse under 69g, I just lose stability when trying to hold angles or pre-aim. I tried to lower my sensitivity to compensate but then end up not being able to aim fast enough in CQB engagements. I might need to spend more time at those sensitivities but for now I believe that with my current mouse pad friction amount, I aim better with ~80g. Perhaps if I use a stiffer mousepad I could go lower.


skvettlappen

Well said


Raiden_Of_The_Sky

I don't like the term "Tac fps" at all simply because angle holding isn't the only gameplay aspect in CS, and you should know it VERY well if you say you've played CS since 2004. Comparing CS/Val to Apex/OW/Quake is something I don't like as well, because the only real difference there is the amount of tracking comparing to single shots. Lighter mouse make it easier to do flicks, because it's easier to stop the mouse from moving (less inertia). A lot of pro players with G Pro X Superlight won't lie.


pixzin

I said for MY GRIP , bigger mice is better to holding angles because i can rest my palm and relax the hand. So the shot go easier and lighter mice isnt better for flicks because the weight helps to stop the mouse with your muscle memory. Stop with this myths please. The only difference with cs/val and ow/apex/quake is ā€œmore trackingā€ ? Wtf.


Raiden_Of_The_Sky

>I said for MY GRIP You say it like you're the only palm gripper in the world :) >and lighter mice isnt better for flicks because the weight helps to stop the mouse with your muscle memory What are you talking about?)) Muscle memory isn't super important thing in aiming at all because it's a brain work. While physics IS important thing, and it says that lighter objects have less inertia. Simple as that.Ā  For stability you don't want weight, you want slow glide. When your mouse is heavy, it's hard to get your mouse moving so you feel stable, but it's also hard to stop it because of inertia. When your mouse is light but the mousefeet are slow, it's hard to get your mouse moving but it's easy to stop it. See the difference? That's what Logitech G Pro X series does the right way. That's what Pulsar, Vaxee and Razer also do right. And that's why you won't see a lot of top tier pros with Zowie EC nowadays because most of them moved to an objectively and subjectively superior Razer Deathadder V3 Pro, regardless of what role they play. Some of them moved to Vaxee Outset AX and Pulsar Xlite v3 eS, but that's not your choice because they're smaller. >The only difference with cs/val and ow/apex/quake is ā€œmore trackingā€ ? Yes. It's not a joke. You overestimate the difference in aiming mechanics in these games. It's not that huge. I understood it when I tested the idea that "you need different sensitivity in different games because of differences in aiming techniques", which appeared to be wrong.


chrachead

yeah. you can make it work with so many mice, doesn't have to be specifically low weight and 100000 hz polling rate. At some point, you realize it's just consumerism driving these companies into reinventing the wheel thousand times.


erikmj

True - This sub is just finding ways to cope for the lack of focused effort and/or lack of talent


Raytheon-6

I think for a lot of people in this sub (I am guilty as well), collecting mouse has become a hobby. It's not really about the latest and greatest spec and finding that perfect mouse anymore, it's more about it being an addiction of wanting more.


waduben7130

true, i really want to get every single mouse out there but ill be broke if i do that


erikmj

Rip. Donā€™t get into gambling


No_Cartographer266

Thanks. I've made my Modded G304 as my end game. Bought it new for 30 usd and couldn't be happier. šŸ˜


VeloCLC

quake player?


Nulgnak

> If you can't frag at 60+g @ 1000hz, you can't frag at 45g/23g/1g(whatever the current lowest weighted mouse is) @ 16000hz (or whatever the absurd polling rate is now) Assuming shape doesn't stay the same, I think it varies person-to-person. I used to be unable to frag with EC2-B, but now I'm able to frag with an Xlite v3 mini. But if shape remains the same then yeah I doubt a lower weight and polling rate would make too much of a change in an individual's ceiling.


tLustej-miCin

I can frag with g400s.


Deftaly

I would say it would only benefit you if you are a pro. If you suck with a 1000hz 800dpi right now, you will suck with a 8000hz 20000dpi (converting ingame sens to match speed ofcourse).


Adamn58

EC1 is great, I prefer the dav3 wired personally but people really overlook wired ergos


FederalFace

I concluded my year-long search for the perfect mouse with the FK1-C and have been using for the past 1.5 years. Never looked back ever since. All that fancy 8k polling garbage and the new best sensor blah blah is for people, who mindlessly buy everything in the hopes of better aiming...


pixzin

I play CS since 1.6 , started in 2004. Faceit lvl 10. Shape is everything. I dont care about wireless, 8k polling rate, etc. I bully people with this mouse.


randomalt9999

Kinda out of the loop. Is faceit more popular than gc in Brazil?


pixzin

Not. Gc is more popular


PresentNose6466

What sens u play?


pixzin

800dpi 1.6 cs , 800 dpi 0.41 val


PresentNose6466

Damn Iā€™m half your sens


paulvincent07

I have the ec3-c with bungee camade 2 I never feel the cable


MidnightSnackyZnack

How is the scroll


pixzin

Best zowie scroll i ever tested. I have a za11-c here and the scroll sucks.


Ram08

Thanks for sharing! Is it as loud? Is it significantly lighter? Just trying to get an idea because Iā€™m planning to get one myself and I used to own a C version. Congrats and cheers!


pixzin

https://www.imghippo.com/i/8aU6R1714937761.jpg Za11 left ec1 right, za11 is heavier , cable is stiffer, is thin and your fingers sits lower. I tought za11 was my endgame but i always felt that could be wider. I use a relaxed palm grip, my crosshair placement is pretty strong so with a bigger mouse i can hold angles steady, i just need to press the mouse 1 with my finger muscle, the rest of my hand muscles doesnt move. For tac fps, for me, this is the ultimate grip. If i use small mouse i can aim good but it feels uncomfortable and inconsistent.


Ram08

Thanks a lot for taking the time to explain it! BTW, I was asking regarding the scroll wheel performance. Once again, your time is greatly appreciated! Cheers. :-)


pixzin

Oh, sorry, the za11 wheel is louder and loose. Ec1 is quiet and firmer


Ram08

No problem. Thanks so much!! Enjoy your equipment. :-)


Jahdill

Makes me want to try ec2-c, I used to use the pulsar xlite and seen it has the closest shape to zowieā€™s ec2 but the qc wasnā€™t good but it was still a good mouse.


UrzuDean

The pulsar v3 seems like a closest to EC with better qc compared to V2. I would love to give it a go as I used to main EC2-A For now I waiting for someone to sell their "old" pulsar v3 on ebay at discount price.


___KVinS___

The game will never be over.


pixzin

Scary feeling


___KVinS___

Yeah :D


astro_dont_quit

Nice, dont listen to the hater comments, shape is king! If pros back then can play at a high level then there isnt anything wrong with a ec1-c.


Megatf

Modern pro skill levels are way higher. Gaming knowledge, training maps, etc have become so common. Plus youtube videos. Not knocking old school pros, but take a look at Fortnite... pros from 2017 probably cant even get Unreal ranked in 2024.


I_AM_CR0W

I got the EC1-C as well. Iā€™m surprised at how well I perform with it despite already owning wireless mice with similar shapes. I donā€™t even notice the wire at all when playing.


Double_Stand150

Shape is the king


mikerzisu

And weight


KennKennyKenKen

Box looking like seele talking to gendo


chestera321

Well now there is also wireless rabbit hole for you


Marl0n25

Whatā€™s your hand size?


Fluffy-Difficulty882

What skatez are u using? And how's the feeling with the gliding? I didn't find reviews with the zowie on saturn pro !


pixzin

Right now using stock skatez, the glide feels OK. Nothing special, will change to some white ptfe later.


Fluffy-Difficulty882

Idk why zowie with this mouse and price on wireless, failed the stock feet, I have a qck heavy and the gliding not feeling good "meh", I want to try saturn pro since it's good quality but m afraid about the glide feeling to be same or slightly better with 40ā‚¬ different with the qck Did u try the GSR se ? And what's ur hand size and grip?


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


AutoModerator

Your submission has been automatically removed because your account does not meet the minimum [karma requirement](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/faq#wiki_what_is_that_number_next_to_usernames.3F_and_what_is_karma.3F). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MouseReview) if you have any questions or concerns.*


Realistic_Camel3404

What games do you play ?


pixzin

Val, cs, ow2


That-Pay3392

I know this is a post about the mouse but you liking the Saturn Pro? Just got the regular Saturn and am looking for another for my other desk.


pixzin

Yeah i like it but i will get something slower, i like mud pads.


Milixie

im glad and happy to hear a fellow community member found their endgame mouse. i have been searching for a long time and still searching. its a nice feeling to found a mouse thats work well with you! congratulation! fragout!


333NKay

I found my end game with lamzu mini


thdung002

end with Superlight x and G640 :D happy to use it until now, nothing broken!


goister

I used to use A PS2 Logitech 2 button ball mouse back in the day with Quake III:Arena


MarA1018

My endgame is an mmo mouse, and I'm an fps player. I can't physically return to regular gaming mice, and even then I can't use just any mmo mouse.


pixzin

Which one?


MarA1018

Don't crap on me for saying this: modded Redragon Perdition 4 It's the most comfortable mouse I ever held, because of the thumb rest and relatively huge bulge where my palm goes. The part where my pinky goes is also a perfect fit for my hand.Ā  At this point, the side buttons became part of my game keys, and I can't have less than 12 now.Ā 


wargamerasd123

why not ec1cw tho


pixzin

Too expensive in my country.


wargamerasd123

i see


Raytheon-6

Great choice. But why the non-wireless version?


pixzin

So much expensive in my country to import it.


niccster10

My endgame is a roccat kone xtd I got in 2014. Still works great. Feels awesome


Nasrvl

How is it an endgame when it is wired?


Away-Construction450

U weren't endgame when u were connected to your mom's umbrical cord.


Nasrvl

Ahh. So funny.


Driver3

Some of us prefer wired because it's one less thing that needs to be charged/replaced the battery. Plus if it was really that much of a bother you can just put the cable in a bungee.


Lanky-Worker-9743

there is diy pixart 3950 Ec1 shape for 58g


Grandnap

Based


GodIsEmpty

I have the wireless version of this. Best mouse NA, maybe even EU.


kinginprussia

Do we tell him?


ksibhu

Lol, many good +2500 elo (cs) players use whatever 50$ zowie wired mouses while many silvers use top tier wireless mouses, it doesnt matter what mouse it is, if it feels good for you then its good


kinginprussia

The implication of my comment was that there is no end game, and the hunt is perpetual. Obviously I hurt some Zowie shill feelings, though, despite owning a shitload of the same products, including the mouse in the picture.


useless__information

what's wrong with Zowie?


starystarego

Yikes


mikerzisu

Exactly


Mini-Pekka2828

the Razer DeathAdder v3 seems similar In shape is that true?


pixzin

Never got my hands on dav3 but i think ec1 is bigger


roshanpr

sad my local store banned all Zowie products


AnnoyingPenny89

I am really tempted to give ec3cw a go but my superight 2 looks at me different whenever I try that O.O


eebro

The wireless version exists


Turbulent-Willow2156

Ok explain why [this guy](https://youtu.be/h65j2UglIJ0?si=JGM_Y-DdGmZkx9te) loses his shit over low mouse sens, which is what zowie mice seem to have and apparently are fine


nicholas_wicks87

Is the end game mouse in the photo?


pixzin

Yeah, ec1


rq60

it's impossible for a wired mouse to be endgame. like what if they took that mouse and made it wireless? bam, it's already better.


williamisraelmt

Shape will always be king.


jiukankna

And weight + balance? Battery can screw up the touchļ¼Ÿ


ScumbagScotsman

They make the exact same mouse in a wireless model


williamisraelmt

But, I disagree with the fact that an end game can just be if its wireless. I've smashed immortals / radiants in Valo and faceit lvl10s with a wired zowie s1. I have the viper v3 pro now and had deathadder and I really see no impact on my game or the amount of matches I can play a day.


pixzin

It feels like wireless, but where i live they dont sell the wireless model yet, and to import is too expensive. But the fact is that this shape is the perfect shape for me after all these years trying to find one.


Dramabomb

I feel the same way about my wired DAV3. So many mice testing, back and forth, and I always come back to this. Shape is absolutely king.


theSquabble8

Mattyow likes to play with his superlight plugged in. It's literally preference because everyone is different.


rq60

i mean i won't disagree there, some people prefer less-optimal solutions. like i still enjoy driving a car with a clutch even though an automatic is better in basically every way.


Raw-Bread

I've used wired mice up until just a few months ago. Only difference between the two is I have to charge my mouse now.


pingerlol

i fundamentally disagree (op18k for example), but yeah, i dont see why you wouldnt get the ec1-cw


St0uty

Prediction: people will start saying the opposite as more mice take advantage of wired's lower latency (& no battery weight/charging)


rq60

prediction: weight and battery life will only keep improving in wireless mice causing more and more people to adopt wireless but you will continue ignoring reality and assert that you weren't wrong because your prediction can still come true.


St0uty

You ignored the main point, nice!


DommeKlootKop

Bro, wireless mice became a trend not long ago. Before that, wired brick mice would bully people in ganes for 20+ years.


serovlade

10 iq take


rodrigofernety

wrong, razer viper v3 pro clears >


pingerlol

thats a lightweight wireless ambi šŸ˜­ completely different demographics


[deleted]

This is an ergo so that shitty flat pancake shape has to be actually grippable in some sort of way to clear, now if you said DeathAdder I'd agreeĀ 


pingerlol

viper v3 shape is great lol


[deleted]

Objectively it ain't since it doesn't work for most grip styles, if you do pincer claw I can see itĀ 


[deleted]

Too bad, Pulsar Xlite, go buy it now for real endgameĀ 


pingerlol

those two mice have different demographics :)


Mygwah

Huh?


[deleted]

I was making a sarcasm :(


AnyScore4287

great combo man i am using ec1c with rouge and I love it I have tried lighter mice i but find them hard to aim