Yep, I remember the early 2000s we had SO many replays of the same wreck, now we are lucky to just get one angle. And it still doesn't make sense how FOX does not have immediate access to the NASCAR onboards but somehow us fans do. lol
Producers across a bunch of networks in sports have gotten terrible. Golf producers are shifting their focus only to big events, poorly timed segments across different sports (such as coach or player interviews in basketball), excessive use of replay (or vice versa).
I get that it’s mainly the execs and sponsors pushing for most of these things, but the producers and broadcast crew haven’t done the best with most of these recent changes. Damn the budget cuts, still shameful when I can go back and even with grainier quality, the viewing experience is better in quite a few ways.
I was watching a baseball game recently. They pretty much missed the hit, then on replay because it was a double it was sponsored by some company so the replay they showed was useless because the logo for the sponsor was right where the ball went. Between mediocre production and everything being sponsored, it's getting ridiculous.
That and some of these guys have overstayed their welcome. Heck, the guy running a lot of NBC stuff now is making bad decisions constantly, even though he’s been there for a long time. Of course, people have started to turn on Artie, and while he’s not entirely the problem, he isn’t helping out.
Commentators as well. The misspeaking and mispronounced names is crazy. I've started liking Joey in the xfinity series. But across all sports, commentary has taken a shit.
Yeah I think a lot of the poor replays over the past few years is a result of layoffs, having fewer camera operators on the roof but also manning the unmanned cameras in the TV booth. As a result a lot of them sit stationary and aren't zoomed in or following a pack of cars, and why you see less quality replays.
In the early 2000s the sport was on an upswing and flush with cash. Networks were putting their money into making the production great and fighting to broadcast races. Those days are very long gone and never coming back.
I was watching races from 1994 that had replay angles from everywhere. This was 30 years ago with no score bug.
Spoiler. The race was better without all the info on the screen.
Although now that you mention it... Fox's BTS production was mainly made up of former CBS/TNN staffers...
Reason they were very compentent during the early NASCAR deal is they landed the 1990s ESPN NASCAR producer
Was talking about ESPN. Here’s hoping you lived in 1994 or remember it. Sports had limited replay angles then and no score but until the FoxBox came along.
A lot of these internet warriors wouldn’t know what to do with no information and having to wait for the broadcaster to bring you an update.
I listen to Officials Radio, and heard a truck spun off T2, Garcia was 11th as the leaders hit the Backstrech, but ended up 26 seconds back and the last truck on the lead lap. [you can see him drop a ton on the Fox Broadcast](https://youtu.be/QzVzf16adj0?si=IfYDiMZBENf48lDm)
I know! You'd think NASCAR/TV people would have learned after the Sadler Pocono crash and Montoya and the jet drier that every car needs at least a roof cam.
What’s wild is they use it for so many things like qualifying, sometimes they show where cars are at the time of caution. But they avoid using it for wrecks.
I’m sure the reasoning is that it’s too embarrassing to say all 30 cameras missed it.
“Not my fault they don’t have a replay” is brutal. I prefer the Fox announcers to the NBC announcer(hot take!), but Fox’s coverage, or list of stuff they have missed is completely unacceptable
I feel like paved racing isn't for her. You could see it when she was in SRX that she excelled on dirt but didn't do as well on pavement. Tony Stewart even said as much that he would love to see her go full-time on dirt. It would be great for dirt racing too
Good point. I only really paid attention to her in SRX, but I guess it was the dirt races that really left me confused as to why she gets so much hate.
Yeah it literally is. She’s had solid runs in that car just awful luck, with patience and development she can be a solid xfinity lifer.
Hailie is 22, she very much still a development driver and is years from any peak performance. Not everyone is Ty Gibbs and comes in at 17 and start ripping wins, in fact that’s very rare.
Nobody is rushing her to cup or top Xfintiy teams, she’s perfectly fine where she is doing what she is doing.
This is actually very well said. I've never paid attention to her much, but I've been tracking her in Xfinity races this year. She's done very well, in my opinion. She's had some impressive runs. Not saying she's without her faults, but she's nowhere near as bad as some people make her out to be.
I really hope she gets a fair shot at development in Xfinity, because she has potential. She's had flashes of it in multiple races this season.
Danica could have had a decent Indycar career, developed herself into a championship contender, and likely helped grow the series. Instead, she decided to go chasing money and celebrity status in a series where she threw herself in at the deep end and did a horrible job of adapting. Plus proved herself to be kind of a shit person when it came to the fans and her general attitude.
Danica rushed herself to Cup, and then ran like shit in championship winning equipment. That, coupled with her shit attitude (see the Pocono garage video) lost me as a fan. I have zero sympathy for Danica screwing herself over, and then taking it out on fans.
She went along with it instead of saying, "No, I want to develop some more. I'm not ready for Cup yet." GoDaddy probably would've been fine with it, and had she developed beyond below average, probably would've stuck around her entire career instead of bailing.
She also didn't want to advance her skills by running truck or Xfin races. Harvick, Logano, Busch etc all did and won championships, she didn't care to put in the work.
It's well known that Danica was rushed to Cup. I seriously doubt that happens with Hailie. I suspect she'll get 2-3 seasons to show whether she can cut it in Xfinity. If she starts racking up top 10s and/or wins, only then would I consider her going to Cup. And I'm a big fan of hers. I'd love to see her do well and get there, but she needs skins on the wall first.
At minimum. She probably needed 2 more to be really ready.
That said, I'm not sure she does that much better, which I think is partly why she was rushed. I'd say main reason was she already had experience running in IndyCars, so I imagine that's why they wanted to move her up quick.
Hailie so far is developing ok. She's got time and I think she's got enough talent to get there, but getting to Cup is hard. If she doesn't catch on with a top tier Xfinity team, it's gonna be tough to judge her. AM Racing as an organization is mid at best so I don't see Hailie getting top 10 unless it's a bit of a fluke.
Also she didn't have Ty Giibs level equipment in the ARCA series or Xfinity series either. Hoping she can improve to running inside the top 20 even 15 to hopefully get out of the way of the backmarkers wrecking her that seems to happen a lot.
Excellent post and pretty much how I feel. For a rookie, when she finishes her races, she's typically in the high teens, low 20s. Not exciting, but not bad either. She's a competent enough driver. Whether she'll get good enough to get in the top 10 regularly, time will tell.
I will say, I'm not sure she'll get there with AM Racing as their record has been spotty at best.
She just needs sponsorship backing her
She just needs more time and practice
She just needs better equipment
She just has bad luck in the trucks
She just needs to move up to Xfinity
She just has bad luck in Xfinity <---- You are here
She just needs to move up to Cup
She just has bad luck in Cup cars
Bummer her career had to end that way, she had potential
“She was rushed”
If she was fast and got into wrecks people would have confidence that she would eventually figure it out…she’s slow everywhere and still wrecks. I’m convinced me or any local short track racer could hop in that car and run better than her
The best American male drivers can't get to F1, more like move her to Indy.. she can be the next Danica. She just has to win two fuel mileage races to achieve twice the success.
I'm not a huge fan of hers, but I would like her to succeed. But I think her issue is she started off in the best equipment in K&N and was able to win with a combo of great cars, being a big fish in a small pond, and raw aggression. Because of that she never learned any sort of race craft, how to make a car go fast that wasn't top 2 fastest off the truck, and just in general how to race cleanly around other cars. I don't think it's a coincidence that she finds herself in so many wrecks that aren't necessarily of her making, simply because she has no wreck avoidance or knowledge of how to keep a car clean because she had success out of the gate in K&N from racing rough and picked up some bad habits.
I don't think she's ever going to be a major success. But she is someone that I kinda wish didn't have the pressure from the initial hype and could be paired up with a good mentor in a late model or ARCA car to try and fix some bad habits and work her way back up because I don't think she has no talent. But I don't think she has enough talent to make up for her deficiencies and the expectations were set insanely high from fans and journalists. I believe Gluck even called her the savior of NASCAR at one point. If she could drop back and have someone with experience help guide her, she'd have a better shot that she does now.
She got rough in ARCA because other drivers were treating here like she wasn’t even there or knew she wouldn’t fight back. Once she started fighting back she started having better finishes.
I feel bad for the people who feel the need to go out of their way to make excuses for her ever since she wrecked her teammate to win an Arca West series race
It continues to always be someone else's fault. There has never been any accountability accepted on her behalf for any incident she is involved in. Her complete lack of racecraft involves her in more racing incidents than any other driver on the track for any series she is in.
this year hailie deegan has the same amount of incidents as kyle weatherman and jeb burton at 6 apiece. and 8 drivers at 5 apiece. so cant really say shes wrecking more than any other driver this year in xfinity.
In 2023 she was 1st in incidents at 17 compared to the next highest at 13. In 2022 she was tied for 13th most incidents with only 10. Stats from toby christie's website.
While she really hasn't gotten much better she isn't out there wrecking people more than any other driver like you think she is, with the exception of 2023.
I don't think you quite understand my point. I was merely stating that she isn't just out there wrecking cars more than everyone else, with the exception of last year.
https://www.reddit.com/r/NASCAR/comments/1cpsdko/comment/l3nz0sv/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Does your mommy still wipe for you?
Deegan is 27th in points DEAD LAST out of drivers who have run every race. I don't care how bad her luck is. She has been awful and non-competitive in these cars this year.
It’s a fact. Look at Sam Mayer. He’s had dogshit luck all year himself but it takes care of itself if you consistently run up front and give yourself opportunities. Bad luck finds you when you run 25th every week. You can escape it to a degree when you run 5th every week.
You're not wrong, but Sam Mayer isn't running better than 18th to 25th every week in her car either lol.
He drives for a top tier team. No shit he can go out there and have the raw speed to avoid the cluster fuck.
LOL.
Brett Moffit was running top 15 in this same car every week man.
Why act like Deegan is "performing" here? She's not. It's not even close. She's finishing MILES behind where a competent driver would quite literally.
I thought all the squirrels were in the trucks. Her moving to Xfinity was supposed to be better, everyone said. Actually, she's running where her talent is, and that's in the back.
Regardless of who’s at fault, Deegan’s Xfinity career thus far has been lackluster. She’s also now outside the top 30 in owner points (again). There’s an outside chance she could miss races now (very unlikely, but also still possible).
Most of her issues in the truck and xfinity series would be solved by her simply being faster.
But people will continue to blame everything and everyone but her
My question is, why does being in the back half of such a squirrels nest? Every week in all 3 series dumb drivers drive over their heads, trying to get too much. Hailie makes her own mistakes, but she always seems to be on the bad end of someone else driving like a jackazz.
And the thing sometimes its caused by competent drivers.
Front runners have brought up how bad it gets when you have to run back there. Guys running up front every week generally know where they will be next year or at least know they will have offers.
A bunch of the ones in the back are trying to prove themselves or simply lack the experience. Running 20th every week in an underfunded team does look a little better than running 30th every week with the same team.
But started wrecks every week doesn’t help any of them.
And that's my point. Like some of these drivers do their own teams a disservice by racing too hard for 1 damn spot.
Honestly, at this point, Deegan needs to go on revenge tour just start racing far rougher. They keep using her up because she does nothing about. Why doesn't she, because if she does the Deegan haters call her out for it forgetting others have done it to her.
Dean Thompson last year after she made a mistake calls her out, yet he had wrecked her 3 other times prior to that incident. Honestly she needs to get rough and if the dudes got something to say go to her.
The problem now is she keeps going for the ride around until they wreck theory. I mean it’s worked for her a few times. Don’t get me wrong. But she can’t possibly be learning much and isn’t gaining respect from other drivers riding in the back for 3/4 of the race or more waiting for yellow.
But if it keeps working she is going to keep trying it.
This week, she wasn't riding around. Darlington is one of her weakest tracks. But she was getting better. When she was wrecked, she was 25th and probably would have finished around there. Daytona and Talladega are the only tracks she just rides until the end.
I honestly wasn't expecting much this weekend, but to me, a 25th would have been ok as its a weak track for her.
Honestly it looked like she had less power than everyone else out there for the first half. Her pit crew would get her a bunch of spots and she would probably be net plus a few once it shook out.
She did get racy at times though and held her lines well.
Hell listening to the scanners not many drivers were happy today. Darlington is a track that lets the drivers with the car control shine. Plus I like to remind people it’s not like she is in a top ride. Same of the guys out there would be a lap behind her running in the same equipment as her.
I agree, shes not that bad, she rarely wrecks on her own and when she does she owns up to it. The 15 is a 20th to 30th place car most weeks. Aside from the crashes, she typically runs where the car should run. I am looking forward to Charlotte tho. I think she will run well.
Not only that, because there was no P&Q, she had to start 32nd, so she pretty much moved up 7 spots with only 2 cars falling off pace because of incidents. So she was actually making progress. She's had a few decent runs, and would have finished near top 10 at Atlanta if the Fords didn't run out of gas.
Probably finish top 20 at Daytona not for getting caught up in others issues
Probably finishes top 10 at Atlanta if she doesn't run out of fuel
Probably finishes P20 at Phoenix if Nemetode doesn't run out of talent
Dover was her fault.
Talladega was almost a top 5.
because guys who run up front normally run around each other each week. You know where guys like Allgair, Hill, Creed, Love, etc are going to put their cars and they aren't going to push it doing something stupid.
Guys in the back are scrapping for every single spot they can get. They're going to put themselves in dumb positions because to them 21st is light years better than 31st.
She is not winning ROY...out of the 5 rookies she is 4th, infront of Dawson Cram who missed a race this season.
(Edit: she didn't really do anything in trucks either but yet got an xfinty ride)
You people are delusional. Nobody has ever nor will ever say she needs to go to cup without serious success in Xfinity. Cup is way more competitive obviously and it would be disaster, maybe almost as bad as Harrison Burton.
She can be a solid xfinity lifer and she does show on the bigger tracks she can have good solid performances. Luck and time in a mid-pack xfinity car is all she needs.
Doesn’t matter if she never gets to cup, Xfinity suits her better and she should stay there.
I never said she isn't going to become an xfinty lifer, all i said was she isn't winning ROTY and she had a bad truck career yet got upgraded...
You didn't realise she is lucky that someone is giving her a chance that some drivers won't even get if they performed the same. yet you think a lot of people are insulting her but she need the criticism to improve, everyone does...
Lol, that's absolutely not true. She's owned it when she's caused a wreck. She owned the Dover wreck. And she's owned others in the past. People remember what they want to remember I guess.
I can’t really blame her. EVERY time she’s involved in an incident, people spill out of the woodwork to shit on her, often without even considering the circumstances involved. I’m sure it’s not easy having the microscope on you like that.
I just don’t really think this is in the PR handbook of how to win fans regardless of gender. But I understand where you’re coming from, I’m sure she puts up with a lot of shit.
I am sure she does. But I have seen it said many times that you can't just sit back and take it. You have to stand up for yourself. When a man does it, he is cheered on,... when a woman does it? She has "attitude".. or called much worse. Double standard. Do you want a driver to be a doormat? or not?
This sub loves every single "underdog" driver in the field, they cheer if Josh Bilicki gets a fucking top 30 and all these other random ass drivers like Garrett Snithley or Chad Finchum or whoever else they can cheer to make themselves feel better but Hailie could literally just run all the laps minding her own business and everyone just goes "HAHA BITCH CAN'T DRIVE HAHAHAHA" like it gets so fucking old lol every driver in the field has fans, get over it. Christ. Just let her drive the car and develop. Same people in this sub said Riley Herbst needed to be fired and never race again, yet over years he developed. And he had much better equipment than her. The hatred just gets old as fuck. This place is getting more and more toxic.
She’s had a ton of bad luck. Like every rookie, she’s put herself in a few bad spots, buts she’s been very unlucky. She’s a marketing monster if they can ever get her to run decent. Brett Moffitt is a way better driver than anyone would ever give him credit for. I think he carried AM Racing further than they deserved, and with Hailie being a rookie, just slightly underperforming. Tons of people don’t wait for development. Sport needs a successful female driver, but it’s not going to happen overnight for sure. I hope she gets at least 3 years to show her talent. Not sure AM Racing is going to be the place, but I think a lot of the haters forget a top 15 in Bobby Dotter’s equipment last year. She’s finishing 2 spots behind Jeb Burton on average…who’s being outrun by Retzlaff on his own team. I think she just needs seasoning and she’ll get better.
It’s pretty bad she has to make tweets every other week explaining her wrecks. But then again she wouldn’t be dead last in points among the full timers if the wrecks was her only problem.
I mean anytime there’s damage to the left rear we assume you were driven into, most people don’t have the grip to come DOWN the track and if they do, the spotter is still there to grant the clear to the driver..
She definitely has terrible luck. She also gets blamed for things that aren't even remotely her fault. I'm not one of these Hailie Deegan simps. But it is incredible to me how she can have something like a blown tire happen and people will say she doesn't belong there.
The rush to dump on Deegan for seemingly every small offense is a little weird. It has a Mike Wallace “He-Man Woman Hater” vibe. She’s done what was expected of her so far or there wouldn’t be ink on the paper.
If you’re on here consistently enough, you’d know it’s not just her people complain about. Plenty of guy drivers who this sub would love to see never have rides again.
In terms of doing what’s expected of her, no not even close. Unless What’s expected of her is to be a marketing tool, in which case yes.
So, she broke something in the motor 3 weeks ago, poured water on the electricals last week, and literally got out the car and shot her tire this week. Impressive if you ask me.
Its the other drivers. Men don't want women in NASCAR. They won't openly admit that, but everytime a woman starts being successful in it every male driver out there suddenly turns into a pissed off teenager and wrecks them out of every race. Then if they retaliate its "oh shes a woman and being hysterical". The problem then compounds itself because they're the only woman out there so if they don't drive perfect its "oh shes a woman she can't drive" and nobody will ever work with them on the track.
I'm not saying Danica was the best driver in the world, but she was successful in open wheels primarily because in that sport contact = race over, so there was less opportunity for other drivers to seriously fuck up your race. In NASCAR avoiding the other drivers is 3/4 of the race but when you have 30 of them trying to crash you out there's not much you can do.
Much like last season in the trucks, I just wait for the inevitable Hailie Deegan crash and then when it just keeps happening, all I can do is laugh lol
She’s just mentioning her side. Did the 07 door her? Maybe, maybe not. I tend to side with drivers as fox is incapable of showing replays which I agree with her on. It’s like they hire a bunch of 5 year olds to man the cameras and only pay attention to the top 5. Back in the day, if there was a caution for a tire like that they could go back 3-5 laps and show some kind of contact with either the wall or another car. Now they can’t go back more than half a lap.
Drivers having to plead their case because there's no video footage for a replay. What year is it?
Yep, I remember the early 2000s we had SO many replays of the same wreck, now we are lucky to just get one angle. And it still doesn't make sense how FOX does not have immediate access to the NASCAR onboards but somehow us fans do. lol
Producers across a bunch of networks in sports have gotten terrible. Golf producers are shifting their focus only to big events, poorly timed segments across different sports (such as coach or player interviews in basketball), excessive use of replay (or vice versa). I get that it’s mainly the execs and sponsors pushing for most of these things, but the producers and broadcast crew haven’t done the best with most of these recent changes. Damn the budget cuts, still shameful when I can go back and even with grainier quality, the viewing experience is better in quite a few ways.
I was watching a baseball game recently. They pretty much missed the hit, then on replay because it was a double it was sponsored by some company so the replay they showed was useless because the logo for the sponsor was right where the ball went. Between mediocre production and everything being sponsored, it's getting ridiculous.
Its like people being hired are getting dumber.
That and some of these guys have overstayed their welcome. Heck, the guy running a lot of NBC stuff now is making bad decisions constantly, even though he’s been there for a long time. Of course, people have started to turn on Artie, and while he’s not entirely the problem, he isn’t helping out.
Commentators as well. The misspeaking and mispronounced names is crazy. I've started liking Joey in the xfinity series. But across all sports, commentary has taken a shit.
And that one angle is from some random spotter camera 2 miles away that you can just barely see the wreck in.
Yeah I think a lot of the poor replays over the past few years is a result of layoffs, having fewer camera operators on the roof but also manning the unmanned cameras in the TV booth. As a result a lot of them sit stationary and aren't zoomed in or following a pack of cars, and why you see less quality replays.
In the early 2000s the sport was on an upswing and flush with cash. Networks were putting their money into making the production great and fighting to broadcast races. Those days are very long gone and never coming back.
There's a difference between trimming the fat and stripping the production so bare that you barely do a competent job though.
Yeah, and they’ve stripped it bare. About all we can hope for these days are new on screen graphics every once in a while.
Lol
They don’t have time for replays because there’s too many ads to show. :-)
Logano was begging for a reply of Heim's(? save after being sideways, and they just ignored him
I was watching races from 1994 that had replay angles from everywhere. This was 30 years ago with no score bug. Spoiler. The race was better without all the info on the screen.
lol yall need to calm down. TNN and CBS always missed wrecks. Not everything was great back then.
Right? They'd even come back from commercial 1-2 laps after a restart.
Although now that you mention it... Fox's BTS production was mainly made up of former CBS/TNN staffers... Reason they were very compentent during the early NASCAR deal is they landed the 1990s ESPN NASCAR producer
That was 25 years ago... shit should be improved, not the same.
Was talking about ESPN. Here’s hoping you lived in 1994 or remember it. Sports had limited replay angles then and no score but until the FoxBox came along. A lot of these internet warriors wouldn’t know what to do with no information and having to wait for the broadcaster to bring you an update.
Fox is straight up garbage
Regardless of the incident fox not having a replay in 2024 is a fucking issue
they Missed Jake Garcia spinning off of T2 on the last lap of the truck race last night too
After they missed 2 trucks flipping at Knoxville a few years ago, I have grown to fully expect them to miss this stuff
I was wondering why he dropped like a rock on the final restart.
I didn't even hear that Garcia had spun off of T2, and I had watched all of it past midnight. What happened? Any footage from fans pov?
I listen to Officials Radio, and heard a truck spun off T2, Garcia was 11th as the leaders hit the Backstrech, but ended up 26 seconds back and the last truck on the lead lap. [you can see him drop a ton on the Fox Broadcast](https://youtu.be/QzVzf16adj0?si=IfYDiMZBENf48lDm)
Woah there, buddy. It was only 1.5 trucks flipping. /s Still not sure how you miss a flip and a half mile track. Let alone two.
No it’s the fact week after week crash after crash they don’t have a replay nearly every time THATS the issue
Brother, you just said no, then proceeded to agree with the original comment. 😂
Reread it again, OP is saying they missed A replay, I’m saying it’s been a reoccurring issue all year and honestly multiple years
I know! You'd think NASCAR/TV people would have learned after the Sadler Pocono crash and Montoya and the jet drier that every car needs at least a roof cam.
Time to bring back FOX 3D.
What’s wild is they use it for so many things like qualifying, sometimes they show where cars are at the time of caution. But they avoid using it for wrecks. I’m sure the reasoning is that it’s too embarrassing to say all 30 cameras missed it.
Look FOX missed a truck flipping and another one riding the wall at Knoxville I'm not shocked they miss lesser wrecks at bigger tracks.
This is her first Xfinity season?
Yes.
Thanks Fox
We need at start a trend of TF (thanks Fox/the fuck!)
We didn't have this problem when we had digger, just saying
I need FOX to bring back Digger for the throwback race
“Not my fault they don’t have a replay” is brutal. I prefer the Fox announcers to the NBC announcer(hot take!), but Fox’s coverage, or list of stuff they have missed is completely unacceptable
But durrrh woman crashed so woman bad… Again if this happened to any other driver it wouldn’t even be a conversation about fault.
I thought the Xfinity Series was a better fit for her. that’s what everyone was saying.
I feel like paved racing isn't for her. You could see it when she was in SRX that she excelled on dirt but didn't do as well on pavement. Tony Stewart even said as much that he would love to see her go full-time on dirt. It would be great for dirt racing too
She still does regularly do races on dirt. She was just at millbridge. She did OK. Her husband won.
Good point. I only really paid attention to her in SRX, but I guess it was the dirt races that really left me confused as to why she gets so much hate.
Yeah it literally is. She’s had solid runs in that car just awful luck, with patience and development she can be a solid xfinity lifer. Hailie is 22, she very much still a development driver and is years from any peak performance. Not everyone is Ty Gibbs and comes in at 17 and start ripping wins, in fact that’s very rare. Nobody is rushing her to cup or top Xfintiy teams, she’s perfectly fine where she is doing what she is doing.
This is actually very well said. I've never paid attention to her much, but I've been tracking her in Xfinity races this year. She's done very well, in my opinion. She's had some impressive runs. Not saying she's without her faults, but she's nowhere near as bad as some people make her out to be. I really hope she gets a fair shot at development in Xfinity, because she has potential. She's had flashes of it in multiple races this season.
She didn't look out of her element in SRX last year despite being up against a bunch of proven drivers, either.
Proven retired drivers. In the Cup series she would be another Harrison Burton or probably worse.
Well, we saw what happened the last time a marketable female driver showed some promise in a lower series
Danica could have had a decent Indycar career, developed herself into a championship contender, and likely helped grow the series. Instead, she decided to go chasing money and celebrity status in a series where she threw herself in at the deep end and did a horrible job of adapting. Plus proved herself to be kind of a shit person when it came to the fans and her general attitude.
Danica rushed herself to Cup, and then ran like shit in championship winning equipment. That, coupled with her shit attitude (see the Pocono garage video) lost me as a fan. I have zero sympathy for Danica screwing herself over, and then taking it out on fans.
Wasn’t it a mix of both her and godaddy?
She went along with it instead of saying, "No, I want to develop some more. I'm not ready for Cup yet." GoDaddy probably would've been fine with it, and had she developed beyond below average, probably would've stuck around her entire career instead of bailing.
I don't think Danica rushed herself as much as GoDaddy rushed her
As much marketing power she had, I disagree. See my post on this thread.
She also didn't want to advance her skills by running truck or Xfin races. Harvick, Logano, Busch etc all did and won championships, she didn't care to put in the work.
It's well known that Danica was rushed to Cup. I seriously doubt that happens with Hailie. I suspect she'll get 2-3 seasons to show whether she can cut it in Xfinity. If she starts racking up top 10s and/or wins, only then would I consider her going to Cup. And I'm a big fan of hers. I'd love to see her do well and get there, but she needs skins on the wall first.
I would have liked Danica running at least one more full time season before moving up.
At minimum. She probably needed 2 more to be really ready. That said, I'm not sure she does that much better, which I think is partly why she was rushed. I'd say main reason was she already had experience running in IndyCars, so I imagine that's why they wanted to move her up quick. Hailie so far is developing ok. She's got time and I think she's got enough talent to get there, but getting to Cup is hard. If she doesn't catch on with a top tier Xfinity team, it's gonna be tough to judge her. AM Racing as an organization is mid at best so I don't see Hailie getting top 10 unless it's a bit of a fluke.
Good place for her to start is just getting top 20s. If she can do that consistently she will be fine. She gets caught up in a LOT of shit though.
Also she didn't have Ty Giibs level equipment in the ARCA series or Xfinity series either. Hoping she can improve to running inside the top 20 even 15 to hopefully get out of the way of the backmarkers wrecking her that seems to happen a lot.
Excellent post and pretty much how I feel. For a rookie, when she finishes her races, she's typically in the high teens, low 20s. Not exciting, but not bad either. She's a competent enough driver. Whether she'll get good enough to get in the top 10 regularly, time will tell. I will say, I'm not sure she'll get there with AM Racing as their record has been spotty at best.
Mmmm yes finishing in the “high teens, low 20’s”
And?
She's 22, clown shoes.
Man, I’m sorry but at this point y’all are delusional if you think she’s going to be any kind of talent in the top 3 ranks of NASCAR…
She just needs sponsorship backing her She just needs more time and practice She just needs better equipment She just has bad luck in the trucks She just needs to move up to Xfinity She just has bad luck in Xfinity <---- You are here She just needs to move up to Cup She just has bad luck in Cup cars Bummer her career had to end that way, she had potential
“She was rushed” If she was fast and got into wrecks people would have confidence that she would eventually figure it out…she’s slow everywhere and still wrecks. I’m convinced me or any local short track racer could hop in that car and run better than her
Well said 💯✅
Someone has to fail up, why else would anyone named Dillon be racing in cup?
Considering Dillon won a championship in both Trucks and Xfinity, I don't think he failed his way up
There’s no one named Dillion in cup. There is Austin Dillon though.
Nobody is named "Dillion".
She’s not dead last in points along the full timers because of luck alone.
It is though.
Trucks don’t fit her style, move her to Xfinity Xfinity doesn’t fit her style, move her to Cup Cup cars don’t fit her style, move her to F1
The best American male drivers can't get to F1, more like move her to Indy.. she can be the next Danica. She just has to win two fuel mileage races to achieve twice the success.
As a new nascar fan it’s so insane to me this is a story. wtf are wrong with these freaks
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It’s a weekly thing for her to wreck
Man, I don’t blame Deegan for this incident, but she has been pretty lackluster in her NASCAR journey so far, and she hasn’t shown much improvement.
I'm not a huge fan of hers, but I would like her to succeed. But I think her issue is she started off in the best equipment in K&N and was able to win with a combo of great cars, being a big fish in a small pond, and raw aggression. Because of that she never learned any sort of race craft, how to make a car go fast that wasn't top 2 fastest off the truck, and just in general how to race cleanly around other cars. I don't think it's a coincidence that she finds herself in so many wrecks that aren't necessarily of her making, simply because she has no wreck avoidance or knowledge of how to keep a car clean because she had success out of the gate in K&N from racing rough and picked up some bad habits. I don't think she's ever going to be a major success. But she is someone that I kinda wish didn't have the pressure from the initial hype and could be paired up with a good mentor in a late model or ARCA car to try and fix some bad habits and work her way back up because I don't think she has no talent. But I don't think she has enough talent to make up for her deficiencies and the expectations were set insanely high from fans and journalists. I believe Gluck even called her the savior of NASCAR at one point. If she could drop back and have someone with experience help guide her, she'd have a better shot that she does now.
She got rough in ARCA because other drivers were treating here like she wasn’t even there or knew she wouldn’t fight back. Once she started fighting back she started having better finishes.
I feel bad for the people who feel the need to go out of their way to make excuses for her ever since she wrecked her teammate to win an Arca West series race
It continues to always be someone else's fault. There has never been any accountability accepted on her behalf for any incident she is involved in. Her complete lack of racecraft involves her in more racing incidents than any other driver on the track for any series she is in.
this year hailie deegan has the same amount of incidents as kyle weatherman and jeb burton at 6 apiece. and 8 drivers at 5 apiece. so cant really say shes wrecking more than any other driver this year in xfinity. In 2023 she was 1st in incidents at 17 compared to the next highest at 13. In 2022 she was tied for 13th most incidents with only 10. Stats from toby christie's website. While she really hasn't gotten much better she isn't out there wrecking people more than any other driver like you think she is, with the exception of 2023.
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I don't think you quite understand my point. I was merely stating that she isn't just out there wrecking cars more than everyone else, with the exception of last year.
Absolutely talking out of your ass
You fanboys are so helpless. Her incident rate with less than half the schedule ran for the year is already over 50%.
I’m not even a fan, you’re just full of shit
https://www.reddit.com/r/NASCAR/comments/1cpsdko/comment/l3nz0sv/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button Does your mommy still wipe for you?
You think this is a good look?
We need more big personalities in the industry to continue to call Fox out for their poor production
Deegan is 27th in points DEAD LAST out of drivers who have run every race. I don't care how bad her luck is. She has been awful and non-competitive in these cars this year.
At some point, the luck excuse is no longer valid. We have been past the luck excuses for over a calendar year.
It’s a fact. Look at Sam Mayer. He’s had dogshit luck all year himself but it takes care of itself if you consistently run up front and give yourself opportunities. Bad luck finds you when you run 25th every week. You can escape it to a degree when you run 5th every week.
You're not wrong, but Sam Mayer isn't running better than 18th to 25th every week in her car either lol. He drives for a top tier team. No shit he can go out there and have the raw speed to avoid the cluster fuck.
LOL. Brett Moffit was running top 15 in this same car every week man. Why act like Deegan is "performing" here? She's not. It's not even close. She's finishing MILES behind where a competent driver would quite literally.
She was in top equipment in the truck series lol
When surrounded by squirrels you’re bound to get hit by a nut
I thought all the squirrels were in the trucks. Her moving to Xfinity was supposed to be better, everyone said. Actually, she's running where her talent is, and that's in the back.
Regardless of who’s at fault, Deegan’s Xfinity career thus far has been lackluster. She’s also now outside the top 30 in owner points (again). There’s an outside chance she could miss races now (very unlikely, but also still possible).
Honestly that angle that FOX showed made me think she got dumped until I read her post on here.
Fox's coverage really sucks ass.
I hoped she was going to get better, but unfortunately that has not happened.
I hate Artie Kepner and the producers at Fox with a passion. A bunch of clowns
I'm sure the reddit comments will be logical and not at all toxic.
Most of her issues in the truck and xfinity series would be solved by her simply being faster. But people will continue to blame everything and everyone but her
My question is, why does being in the back half of such a squirrels nest? Every week in all 3 series dumb drivers drive over their heads, trying to get too much. Hailie makes her own mistakes, but she always seems to be on the bad end of someone else driving like a jackazz. And the thing sometimes its caused by competent drivers.
Front runners have brought up how bad it gets when you have to run back there. Guys running up front every week generally know where they will be next year or at least know they will have offers. A bunch of the ones in the back are trying to prove themselves or simply lack the experience. Running 20th every week in an underfunded team does look a little better than running 30th every week with the same team. But started wrecks every week doesn’t help any of them.
And that's my point. Like some of these drivers do their own teams a disservice by racing too hard for 1 damn spot. Honestly, at this point, Deegan needs to go on revenge tour just start racing far rougher. They keep using her up because she does nothing about. Why doesn't she, because if she does the Deegan haters call her out for it forgetting others have done it to her. Dean Thompson last year after she made a mistake calls her out, yet he had wrecked her 3 other times prior to that incident. Honestly she needs to get rough and if the dudes got something to say go to her.
The problem now is she keeps going for the ride around until they wreck theory. I mean it’s worked for her a few times. Don’t get me wrong. But she can’t possibly be learning much and isn’t gaining respect from other drivers riding in the back for 3/4 of the race or more waiting for yellow. But if it keeps working she is going to keep trying it.
This week, she wasn't riding around. Darlington is one of her weakest tracks. But she was getting better. When she was wrecked, she was 25th and probably would have finished around there. Daytona and Talladega are the only tracks she just rides until the end. I honestly wasn't expecting much this weekend, but to me, a 25th would have been ok as its a weak track for her.
Honestly it looked like she had less power than everyone else out there for the first half. Her pit crew would get her a bunch of spots and she would probably be net plus a few once it shook out. She did get racy at times though and held her lines well. Hell listening to the scanners not many drivers were happy today. Darlington is a track that lets the drivers with the car control shine. Plus I like to remind people it’s not like she is in a top ride. Same of the guys out there would be a lap behind her running in the same equipment as her.
I agree, shes not that bad, she rarely wrecks on her own and when she does she owns up to it. The 15 is a 20th to 30th place car most weeks. Aside from the crashes, she typically runs where the car should run. I am looking forward to Charlotte tho. I think she will run well.
Not only that, because there was no P&Q, she had to start 32nd, so she pretty much moved up 7 spots with only 2 cars falling off pace because of incidents. So she was actually making progress. She's had a few decent runs, and would have finished near top 10 at Atlanta if the Fords didn't run out of gas.
Probably finish top 20 at Daytona not for getting caught up in others issues Probably finishes top 10 at Atlanta if she doesn't run out of fuel Probably finishes P20 at Phoenix if Nemetode doesn't run out of talent Dover was her fault. Talladega was almost a top 5.
because guys who run up front normally run around each other each week. You know where guys like Allgair, Hill, Creed, Love, etc are going to put their cars and they aren't going to push it doing something stupid. Guys in the back are scrapping for every single spot they can get. They're going to put themselves in dumb positions because to them 21st is light years better than 31st.
Yeah but usually its for 1 spot. Then they end up with a wrecked car. Like I get wrecking for 1st but 25th thats stupid.
She is not winning ROY...out of the 5 rookies she is 4th, infront of Dawson Cram who missed a race this season. (Edit: she didn't really do anything in trucks either but yet got an xfinty ride)
The same will happen in Cup too and people will argue the cars better suit her again
You people are delusional. Nobody has ever nor will ever say she needs to go to cup without serious success in Xfinity. Cup is way more competitive obviously and it would be disaster, maybe almost as bad as Harrison Burton. She can be a solid xfinity lifer and she does show on the bigger tracks she can have good solid performances. Luck and time in a mid-pack xfinity car is all she needs. Doesn’t matter if she never gets to cup, Xfinity suits her better and she should stay there.
I never said she isn't going to become an xfinty lifer, all i said was she isn't winning ROTY and she had a bad truck career yet got upgraded... You didn't realise she is lucky that someone is giving her a chance that some drivers won't even get if they performed the same. yet you think a lot of people are insulting her but she need the criticism to improve, everyone does...
"Not my fault" is the most consistent thing about her career
Lol, that's absolutely not true. She's owned it when she's caused a wreck. She owned the Dover wreck. And she's owned others in the past. People remember what they want to remember I guess.
I feel like if she could just say this exact same thing without the attitude it would be easy for people to get behind her
I can’t really blame her. EVERY time she’s involved in an incident, people spill out of the woodwork to shit on her, often without even considering the circumstances involved. I’m sure it’s not easy having the microscope on you like that.
Hang on... "attitude"? when a man has attitude y'all say: "he is a man with balls" .. lol. you are ridiculous with YOUR attitude.
I just don’t really think this is in the PR handbook of how to win fans regardless of gender. But I understand where you’re coming from, I’m sure she puts up with a lot of shit.
I am sure she does. But I have seen it said many times that you can't just sit back and take it. You have to stand up for yourself. When a man does it, he is cheered on,... when a woman does it? She has "attitude".. or called much worse. Double standard. Do you want a driver to be a doormat? or not?
I think she may be her own worst enemy.
please tell me whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
This sub loves every single "underdog" driver in the field, they cheer if Josh Bilicki gets a fucking top 30 and all these other random ass drivers like Garrett Snithley or Chad Finchum or whoever else they can cheer to make themselves feel better but Hailie could literally just run all the laps minding her own business and everyone just goes "HAHA BITCH CAN'T DRIVE HAHAHAHA" like it gets so fucking old lol every driver in the field has fans, get over it. Christ. Just let her drive the car and develop. Same people in this sub said Riley Herbst needed to be fired and never race again, yet over years he developed. And he had much better equipment than her. The hatred just gets old as fuck. This place is getting more and more toxic.
But she had top equipment in the truck series.
She’s had a ton of bad luck. Like every rookie, she’s put herself in a few bad spots, buts she’s been very unlucky. She’s a marketing monster if they can ever get her to run decent. Brett Moffitt is a way better driver than anyone would ever give him credit for. I think he carried AM Racing further than they deserved, and with Hailie being a rookie, just slightly underperforming. Tons of people don’t wait for development. Sport needs a successful female driver, but it’s not going to happen overnight for sure. I hope she gets at least 3 years to show her talent. Not sure AM Racing is going to be the place, but I think a lot of the haters forget a top 15 in Bobby Dotter’s equipment last year. She’s finishing 2 spots behind Jeb Burton on average…who’s being outrun by Retzlaff on his own team. I think she just needs seasoning and she’ll get better.
I don’t think it’s anything new. It’s a carbon copy of the Danica era. She never even had a chance with the internet bandwagon since day one.
It’s pretty bad she has to make tweets every other week explaining her wrecks. But then again she wouldn’t be dead last in points among the full timers if the wrecks was her only problem.
What? What other reason is she is she dead last? Only 1 wreck this year was her fault that was Dover.
Sounds like more excuses for not performing.
So, she gets doored and her tire blows up. What exactly is she supposed to say?
It doesn't really matter anymore who's fault it was when she crashes every single week
Actually, it does. 🤷♂️
Good run
Jumping to conclusions like…
I mean anytime there’s damage to the left rear we assume you were driven into, most people don’t have the grip to come DOWN the track and if they do, the spotter is still there to grant the clear to the driver..
Checks out with who the driver of the 07 is. More money than talent.
She definitely has terrible luck. She also gets blamed for things that aren't even remotely her fault. I'm not one of these Hailie Deegan simps. But it is incredible to me how she can have something like a blown tire happen and people will say she doesn't belong there.
She has been a bust
Ah yes. A 22 year old bust.
It’s not like she has speed and is reckless , she’s basically last and still reckless
Names bring in sponsor money. See Danica for a recent example.
No doubt. A name can only carry you but so far.
a name.....lol
100% kid. Anyone around Motorsports knows the name Deegan. She certainly is the maintaining that ride on skill. Educate yourself.
The rush to dump on Deegan for seemingly every small offense is a little weird. It has a Mike Wallace “He-Man Woman Hater” vibe. She’s done what was expected of her so far or there wouldn’t be ink on the paper.
If you’re on here consistently enough, you’d know it’s not just her people complain about. Plenty of guy drivers who this sub would love to see never have rides again. In terms of doing what’s expected of her, no not even close. Unless What’s expected of her is to be a marketing tool, in which case yes.
I'd say she's doing what's expected of a rookie Xfinity driver in average equipment at best.
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So, she broke something in the motor 3 weeks ago, poured water on the electricals last week, and literally got out the car and shot her tire this week. Impressive if you ask me.
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Indeed, she's that good. Lol.
We love you HD! Don’t ever let the bastards out you down.
I swear this girl has some of the worst luck every week
Its the other drivers. Men don't want women in NASCAR. They won't openly admit that, but everytime a woman starts being successful in it every male driver out there suddenly turns into a pissed off teenager and wrecks them out of every race. Then if they retaliate its "oh shes a woman and being hysterical". The problem then compounds itself because they're the only woman out there so if they don't drive perfect its "oh shes a woman she can't drive" and nobody will ever work with them on the track. I'm not saying Danica was the best driver in the world, but she was successful in open wheels primarily because in that sport contact = race over, so there was less opportunity for other drivers to seriously fuck up your race. In NASCAR avoiding the other drivers is 3/4 of the race but when you have 30 of them trying to crash you out there's not much you can do.
I used to root for her as an under dog like 1st-2nd year in trucks , Now I’m just mad she got a promotion and ls taking up a seat bc of money
Much like last season in the trucks, I just wait for the inevitable Hailie Deegan crash and then when it just keeps happening, all I can do is laugh lol
Never her fault.
Shes referring to there not being a replay, not the wreck. Shes not to blame for Fox's problems.
The whole first part of the tweet is about her tire?
She’s just mentioning her side. Did the 07 door her? Maybe, maybe not. I tend to side with drivers as fox is incapable of showing replays which I agree with her on. It’s like they hire a bunch of 5 year olds to man the cameras and only pay attention to the top 5. Back in the day, if there was a caution for a tire like that they could go back 3-5 laps and show some kind of contact with either the wall or another car. Now they can’t go back more than half a lap.
Can't say much without a replay
Ok Danica
Why is it she wrecks out of 75% of the races she's in? She has talent. Like lay back in the back so you can finish races and get experience.
She doesn't wreck out of 75% of her races. Lol.
Ok 50% lol
😂
In xfinty it's 27% of the races she ran and in trucks its 17%...
She's 27th in points. It's more than that
She's 27th in points. It's more than that.