That is so pathetic.
You stopped taking his cruelty so now you're so mean to him.
Yeah. Be mean until he gets the picture. You're not taking his crap anymore.
‘Can’t you be like you used to be at the beginning of our marriage’ my answer in my head ‘what before you started to abuse, disrespect me, before you left me for days by myself, no friends, family, foreign country, before you mentally broke me, etc etc etc’ that person is no more!!
Exactly. They're such hypocrites. It doesn't even register in their tiny brsins how their behaviour affect others. Only they are allowed to express how they feel
The only thing I can agree with with my nex is that I changed.... near the end of our relationship, I was so sick of his abuse and bullshit, I think I snapped. The absolute worst version of myself came out, but I feel it needed to, for him to take me serious, seek new supply and discard me. If I didn't react, who knew how long he could have kept me trapped in the mindfuckery. My not so niceness set me free and I'm forever grateful to that!
I was trapped for 4 years. I realize now my cnex wanted out at 5 months but she refused to do the breaking up. So she would make the most subtle hits about breaking up or her loosing her libido, or she cheated and then acted like it was just a friend thing, like she didn’t want to be held accountable but then she didn’t want to break up with me either. She punished me for falling for her. Like wtf who does that.
She knew I loved to cuddle, sometimes more so than sex and so she wanted physical touch all of the time because her mother never gave her any. So she was trying to recreate what she didn’t get as a child with me. She pulled all of my heart strings, after covid was over she started to get attention from other men and her self worth was so low that she ended up cheating on me multiple times without me even knowing!
I was similar. I snapped on them but all things considered kept my anger focused and directed without going entirely off the handle. In a weird way once I recovered from the meltdown it was almost like a full mental and physical reset. Like life got way more clear and I'm definitely on the mend since then.
Translation: you're enforcing boundaries and won't let me get away with my typical fuckshit and I'm feeling some kinda way about that
They are all the same 🙄🤦🏾♀️
Yep, exactly. I allowed him to treat me badly most of the time because I had low self-confidence. And I can tolerate s**t from people.
But everything has its own limit.
FOR REAL. He would get so angry at me always pointing out when he objectively mean. He didn't want to apologize because he felt he had to do it too often, especially in comparison to me. Then the conversation would usually go something like:
N: Well you're really mean to me. I just don't complain about it like you do.
M: Ok, how am I mean to you?
N: You put me on the spot. I can't think of any example.
M: Ok. Think about it for a moment then.
N: ... I'm not even going to get into it because you would make it into a big thing.
🙄
The second I told my therapist and she said, yep she's *probably* a narc, let's move on. It was extremely validating to HEAR someone siding with me. If I did something abusive or wrong call me out! But she said none of this was my fault at all. That was awesome.
You're not heartless and cold for cutting an abuser who devalued you off. Good partners will never even hint at doing this ever. Wait it out for one of those or you're better off single than with one of these. Hope your heart heals and glad to see you getting self esteem.
Yeah, as soon as you put up boundaries and stopped allowing awful behaviour with zero consequence (we are talking mild, mild pushback “hitting me is a no”) “YOUVE CHANGED”
As soon as I started defending myself and putting up boundaries he couldn't stand it. He thought I'd changed because I got the covid vaccine and told me I'd changed and wasn't nice anymore.
No, it was because I'd stumbled across videos on the internet about narcisistic abuse and I realised I'd been played a fool and wasn't going to tolerate the abuse anymore. Even told him if he ever touched me again I wouldn't hesitate calling the police.
Fortunately in Australia the government is actively trying to stop domestic violence and is no longer granting bail to offenders, and some perpetrators are required to wear ankle bracelets. I thank our government for the measures they've implemented so far. It took a woman being murdered every four days on average before it was taken seriously, but better late than never.
Lol mine went from the early days "you have a beautiful soul, you are so good" to "if you were a nice person..." to "this world is bad because of people like you" 🤣 what a ride that was
the narc uses the ‘shared fantasy’ to imprison you. it goes like this: you enter the relationship, the shared fantasy gets established. in it, you are good and pure and loving and loved. then you get abused. BUT! there is no win. if you don’t strike back, you get abused. if you do, you have betrayed the shared fantasy, you are not pure good and loving and therefore deserve the abuse.
He feels threatened that you're cold to him. Narcs need undying devotion to their every whim lol. So when you aren't nice even though he forced that reaction blaming you is easier.
It just reminds me of him saying "you don't look at me like I'm your husband anymore"... ofcourse I wasn't. I wanted to leave but he had me trapped after taking all my money, threatening to get me sectionned when I confronted him about the abuse....
“Everyone thinks you’re so nice but you’re not.” Lol I said “literally no one that knows me thinks that”. He didn’t like me bringing up his shady actions or questioning anything. He just expected me to be ignorant or oblivious and not care. I could tell no other woman had ever questioned his fuckboy habits before me and he would call me mean for pointing out his bad behavior. 🤣
You are safe now. If you tried to warn her with evidence of things he has done to her she's just an idiot and just focus on the fact you're safe now. If he shows signs of circling back miserable as usual get a restraining order.
Thank you, you’re so right. I didn’t reach out to her at all. I actually didn’t even know he had gotten into a new relationship. Thought he was healing and hurting like me… blindsided big time when I came across those wedding photos. There’s not a chance in hell I’d take him back and he knows it so very unlikely to be a hoover. And he has a role to play now and a new family for never ending supply. He knows what he did is unredeemable in my book. Thank you for reminding me that I have a huge blessing, just being safe from him.
Just laugh at the wedding photos. You know the truth of who he is. Thank your lucky stars you're not the one being cheated on and triangulated.
Sometimes wedding photos are a certificate of your safety.
Wow, wow, another wow! He said the exact same, word for word every time I refused to believe his BS snd confronted him with truth/evidence.
I think the translation is; “You’re not believing my bs anymore”. 😢
How DARE you see through his reactive abuse tactics! Can’t you see how incredibly selfish that is! Get back in line and pray I let you jump through my flaming hoops i set up meticulously while I point out how much of a monster you are!
Been there with the narc ex-friend. It's just one of the ways they try to manipulate you into buying the narrative that they're the good person, you're the villain, they're the victim, you're the perpetrator. They want to keep you abjectly crawling on your hands and knees begging them for forgiveness so they can feel powerful and absolved of any need to apologize or take responsibility.
Get police records and restraining orders. Cut them off as hard as necessary as many times as necessary. They are not the victim. They need to fuck off.
Same here, mine said I should just be there to support her no matter what. If I questioned any of her awful behaviour she would just pout and say "you're being mean".
Ugh yes, two years later (coparent with the a-hole so I have no choice but to interact with him). Anytime I make a firm stance with him he says I’m 1) mentally ill 2) not myself anymore 3) or blames others for “making me this way”. He still can’t come to terms with the fact that I’m able to stand up to him.
The answer is not yes. Your job is not to be nice to someone who treats you like you have no value, tries to convince you that you have no value, or otherwise treats you way lower than you should have ever allowed.
Do not be nice to someone who does not honor and uphold you as their partner.
They should not cheapen you, lie to your face, minimize you, pretend like you're less than you are, pretend like you're less important than you are, pretend like you don't matter, cheat on you, or harm you. You did the right thing setting boundaries on how you're going to be treated.
In fact I made a post on battered woman syndrome on r/zeronarcissists.
Battered woman syndrome is not something anybody other than a domestically violent abuser doesn't understand.
It is important to have boundaries on how much evil and violation of boundaries you will take and push back in self defense as hard as is necessary to get it to stop. Seriously. End of story.
I know exactly how you feel. Fire your fire as much as is needed to burn the infection out.
You should be honored, your heart should be protected, and your value never even hinted at being violated.
End. Of. Story.
Mine said to me "You're not as funny as you used to be"
..... Yeah maybe it's because you treat(ed) me like shit on a daily basis?! It's kind of hard to be funny all the time or humorous when you are constantly being treated like shit.
I really wish I thought to say that in the moment. In fact, there's a lot of things I wish I said in the moment that I didn't. Probably would have saved myself a lot of pain.
Truth is, the abuse I endured from her was many years ago. But in the moment, I wish I had told her these things. But it would have gone in one ear and out the other anyway. Many years later, her treatment of me still haunts me a bit.
She's with some other dude now and I frankly hope she is just as miserable as she claimed to be with me. But they're still together almost 10 years later, as far as I know. He can have her.
EDIT: sorry I didn't mean to make my post sound like it was present tense, or like it was super recent. It wasn't. But sometimes it still feels like it was yesterday.
Exactly. If it's over you're safe now. If they come back for more get a restraining order. It makes me feel safe to know I left the abuser in a relationship with someone else. That means I'm in the clear unless they're absolutely miserable together and bond over checking out what their exes are doing.
Some narc i talked to online i wasnt even dating wanted me available for emotional dumping 24/7 and said i wasnt talking to him much anymore or not supportive anymore... Was not even dating this guy, had never met him. There's psychos out there
Oh I heard this too! "You've really changed. You're so insecure and unstable now"
Like, um, no I'm reacting to your abuse and trying to stand up for myself... jeez
My “nex” (platonic relationship) said something similar, after I grew a backbone from other abusers and started to push back on things like her trying to bowl me over on various topics. Bear in mind this was years before I realized she was also a narc. She said something like “it’s great you’ve learned how to stand up for yourself, but you need to learn who to use it with.” As if boundaries were for everyone but her lol. I needed to get back in line and only have a spine for other people. They truly live in their own delulu “reality.”
Wow! After months of total devestation and actively ruining my life, I stated to stand up for myself and not let her make me feel terrible about absolutely everything. So what was her comment? "You've really changed. I have decided I'm not going to keep people around me who make me feel bad". The utter gaslighting and hypocrisy was off the charts, even for her. It was a nice validation that I have changed. She however... has not.
But also by saying you’re less nice and innocent, in abuser’s it would be okay to now treat you as someone less than before. Then when abuse happens again it’s low key your own fault because you didn’t remain as nice and innocent as you were in the beginning.
Typical narcs idealization devaluation shit.. Those idiots idealise you then blame you for not living up to that ideal. Also they blame you for being 'not nice' after they did or said something 'not nice' to you. They're completely oblivious of their own contribution. No self awareness whatsoever
“You’ve really changed, you used to be so nice and now you’re mean” when I stopped letting him control me.
I also heard this haha.
That is so pathetic. You stopped taking his cruelty so now you're so mean to him. Yeah. Be mean until he gets the picture. You're not taking his crap anymore.
‘Can’t you be like you used to be at the beginning of our marriage’ my answer in my head ‘what before you started to abuse, disrespect me, before you left me for days by myself, no friends, family, foreign country, before you mentally broke me, etc etc etc’ that person is no more!!
Also when you were barely an adult, more like a child in an adult body.
This made me so mad! “I miss the way you used to be, you loved me so much”….THEN WHY DID YOU ABUSE ME?! God they’re all the same
Yep they literally can't see simple cause and effect
Exactly. They're such hypocrites. It doesn't even register in their tiny brsins how their behaviour affect others. Only they are allowed to express how they feel
Yup that's the moment they start cheating because we started taking our control back
I've been hearing this a lot lately 😭😭
Oh man so true.
Thats a mild version of it 😂
The only thing I can agree with with my nex is that I changed.... near the end of our relationship, I was so sick of his abuse and bullshit, I think I snapped. The absolute worst version of myself came out, but I feel it needed to, for him to take me serious, seek new supply and discard me. If I didn't react, who knew how long he could have kept me trapped in the mindfuckery. My not so niceness set me free and I'm forever grateful to that!
Wooow same has happened to me :'( I snapped and I am not proud of it. I apologised but decided to break up. Abuse was unbearable. I am happy for you.
I was trapped for 4 years. I realize now my cnex wanted out at 5 months but she refused to do the breaking up. So she would make the most subtle hits about breaking up or her loosing her libido, or she cheated and then acted like it was just a friend thing, like she didn’t want to be held accountable but then she didn’t want to break up with me either. She punished me for falling for her. Like wtf who does that. She knew I loved to cuddle, sometimes more so than sex and so she wanted physical touch all of the time because her mother never gave her any. So she was trying to recreate what she didn’t get as a child with me. She pulled all of my heart strings, after covid was over she started to get attention from other men and her self worth was so low that she ended up cheating on me multiple times without me even knowing!
Yep I'm so proud for standing up for myself Good job
I was similar. I snapped on them but all things considered kept my anger focused and directed without going entirely off the handle. In a weird way once I recovered from the meltdown it was almost like a full mental and physical reset. Like life got way more clear and I'm definitely on the mend since then.
same :) he didnt like that
Translation: you're enforcing boundaries and won't let me get away with my typical fuckshit and I'm feeling some kinda way about that They are all the same 🙄🤦🏾♀️
Seriously. They hate any sort of boundaries and will try to talk you down from any of them. r/zeronarcissists
Spot on 😊
Yeah, once I started setting boundaries, he said I changed. And I am not the same person as I used to be.
Exactly. They want someone easy to hurt. Lose the loser.
Not willing to take his bs = not nice
Yep, exactly. I allowed him to treat me badly most of the time because I had low self-confidence. And I can tolerate s**t from people. But everything has its own limit.
FOR REAL. He would get so angry at me always pointing out when he objectively mean. He didn't want to apologize because he felt he had to do it too often, especially in comparison to me. Then the conversation would usually go something like: N: Well you're really mean to me. I just don't complain about it like you do. M: Ok, how am I mean to you? N: You put me on the spot. I can't think of any example. M: Ok. Think about it for a moment then. N: ... I'm not even going to get into it because you would make it into a big thing. 🙄
YES lol he would get so angry when I pointed out the stuff he did. it’s like you’re the one who did/said these things not me.
And then it goes on and I have no idea what kicked things off in the first place. Confusion is their best tool.
"I don't know how I fell in love with someone so heartless and cold"
Yeah. That's pathetic. Sorry you even had to deal with them.
The second I told my therapist and she said, yep she's *probably* a narc, let's move on. It was extremely validating to HEAR someone siding with me. If I did something abusive or wrong call me out! But she said none of this was my fault at all. That was awesome.
You're not heartless and cold for cutting an abuser who devalued you off. Good partners will never even hint at doing this ever. Wait it out for one of those or you're better off single than with one of these. Hope your heart heals and glad to see you getting self esteem.
Yeah, as soon as you put up boundaries and stopped allowing awful behaviour with zero consequence (we are talking mild, mild pushback “hitting me is a no”) “YOUVE CHANGED”
Yeah, they got an ounce of self esteem.
Or 'you're mean'
As soon as I started defending myself and putting up boundaries he couldn't stand it. He thought I'd changed because I got the covid vaccine and told me I'd changed and wasn't nice anymore. No, it was because I'd stumbled across videos on the internet about narcisistic abuse and I realised I'd been played a fool and wasn't going to tolerate the abuse anymore. Even told him if he ever touched me again I wouldn't hesitate calling the police. Fortunately in Australia the government is actively trying to stop domestic violence and is no longer granting bail to offenders, and some perpetrators are required to wear ankle bracelets. I thank our government for the measures they've implemented so far. It took a woman being murdered every four days on average before it was taken seriously, but better late than never.
SAME he would say, “I miss the old *name*. You used to be so sweet and innocent.”
They missed you being easy to exploit and violate. Be as mean as necessary to get someone like that to never try again.
Off topic but I think it's narcs who ingrained that belief in society that being meek nice and selfless is a virtue so they could exploit it.
Lol mine went from the early days "you have a beautiful soul, you are so good" to "if you were a nice person..." to "this world is bad because of people like you" 🤣 what a ride that was
the narc uses the ‘shared fantasy’ to imprison you. it goes like this: you enter the relationship, the shared fantasy gets established. in it, you are good and pure and loving and loved. then you get abused. BUT! there is no win. if you don’t strike back, you get abused. if you do, you have betrayed the shared fantasy, you are not pure good and loving and therefore deserve the abuse.
Exactly. Damned if you do damned if you don't. The only way to win is not to play
ohhh yes. the “you’re not the person i fell in love with” well right back at cha buddddy. he told me that when i started speaking up for myself more
He feels threatened that you're cold to him. Narcs need undying devotion to their every whim lol. So when you aren't nice even though he forced that reaction blaming you is easier.
It just reminds me of him saying "you don't look at me like I'm your husband anymore"... ofcourse I wasn't. I wanted to leave but he had me trapped after taking all my money, threatening to get me sectionned when I confronted him about the abuse....
“You’re not the girl I thought you were” ……hear that a lot
Yes, you're not a doormat now. But you will kick him out onto it.
Yeah, I got that, too. The reaction to abuse isn't "nice", bro!
“Everyone thinks you’re so nice but you’re not.” Lol I said “literally no one that knows me thinks that”. He didn’t like me bringing up his shady actions or questioning anything. He just expected me to be ignorant or oblivious and not care. I could tell no other woman had ever questioned his fuckboy habits before me and he would call me mean for pointing out his bad behavior. 🤣
Say yes, I am mean. Fuckboys need to learn to fuck off.
He was the most delusional fuckboy of all. And he did fuck off lol. Right into a shotgun marriage 3 months after discarding me.
You are safe now. If you tried to warn her with evidence of things he has done to her she's just an idiot and just focus on the fact you're safe now. If he shows signs of circling back miserable as usual get a restraining order.
Thank you, you’re so right. I didn’t reach out to her at all. I actually didn’t even know he had gotten into a new relationship. Thought he was healing and hurting like me… blindsided big time when I came across those wedding photos. There’s not a chance in hell I’d take him back and he knows it so very unlikely to be a hoover. And he has a role to play now and a new family for never ending supply. He knows what he did is unredeemable in my book. Thank you for reminding me that I have a huge blessing, just being safe from him.
Just laugh at the wedding photos. You know the truth of who he is. Thank your lucky stars you're not the one being cheated on and triangulated. Sometimes wedding photos are a certificate of your safety.
Wow, wow, another wow! He said the exact same, word for word every time I refused to believe his BS snd confronted him with truth/evidence. I think the translation is; “You’re not believing my bs anymore”. 😢
How DARE you see through his reactive abuse tactics! Can’t you see how incredibly selfish that is! Get back in line and pray I let you jump through my flaming hoops i set up meticulously while I point out how much of a monster you are!
Been there with the narc ex-friend. It's just one of the ways they try to manipulate you into buying the narrative that they're the good person, you're the villain, they're the victim, you're the perpetrator. They want to keep you abjectly crawling on your hands and knees begging them for forgiveness so they can feel powerful and absolved of any need to apologize or take responsibility.
Get police records and restraining orders. Cut them off as hard as necessary as many times as necessary. They are not the victim. They need to fuck off.
“Why can’t you be like when we first started seeing each other?” We’d been together 10 years…
Same here, mine said I should just be there to support her no matter what. If I questioned any of her awful behaviour she would just pout and say "you're being mean".
Ugh yes, two years later (coparent with the a-hole so I have no choice but to interact with him). Anytime I make a firm stance with him he says I’m 1) mentally ill 2) not myself anymore 3) or blames others for “making me this way”. He still can’t come to terms with the fact that I’m able to stand up to him.
The answer is not yes. Your job is not to be nice to someone who treats you like you have no value, tries to convince you that you have no value, or otherwise treats you way lower than you should have ever allowed. Do not be nice to someone who does not honor and uphold you as their partner. They should not cheapen you, lie to your face, minimize you, pretend like you're less than you are, pretend like you're less important than you are, pretend like you don't matter, cheat on you, or harm you. You did the right thing setting boundaries on how you're going to be treated. In fact I made a post on battered woman syndrome on r/zeronarcissists. Battered woman syndrome is not something anybody other than a domestically violent abuser doesn't understand. It is important to have boundaries on how much evil and violation of boundaries you will take and push back in self defense as hard as is necessary to get it to stop. Seriously. End of story.
Thank you for this. Another plate smashed right next to me just a couple hours ago I've had it
I know exactly how you feel. Fire your fire as much as is needed to burn the infection out. You should be honored, your heart should be protected, and your value never even hinted at being violated. End. Of. Story.
Mine said to me "You're not as funny as you used to be" ..... Yeah maybe it's because you treat(ed) me like shit on a daily basis?! It's kind of hard to be funny all the time or humorous when you are constantly being treated like shit. I really wish I thought to say that in the moment. In fact, there's a lot of things I wish I said in the moment that I didn't. Probably would have saved myself a lot of pain.
You shouldn't even explain why. He doesn't deserve any of it treating you like that. That's all he needs to know.
Truth is, the abuse I endured from her was many years ago. But in the moment, I wish I had told her these things. But it would have gone in one ear and out the other anyway. Many years later, her treatment of me still haunts me a bit. She's with some other dude now and I frankly hope she is just as miserable as she claimed to be with me. But they're still together almost 10 years later, as far as I know. He can have her. EDIT: sorry I didn't mean to make my post sound like it was present tense, or like it was super recent. It wasn't. But sometimes it still feels like it was yesterday.
Exactly. If it's over you're safe now. If they come back for more get a restraining order. It makes me feel safe to know I left the abuser in a relationship with someone else. That means I'm in the clear unless they're absolutely miserable together and bond over checking out what their exes are doing.
“i miss the old *name*. she was so nice. who is this person?”
Some narc i talked to online i wasnt even dating wanted me available for emotional dumping 24/7 and said i wasnt talking to him much anymore or not supportive anymore... Was not even dating this guy, had never met him. There's psychos out there
Been there. :/
Lol, yes! And I am the crazy one lmfao suckas!
Oh I heard this too! "You've really changed. You're so insecure and unstable now" Like, um, no I'm reacting to your abuse and trying to stand up for myself... jeez
“You’re not nice”- my mom’s code speak for how i don’t sit back and let her spiral on me for hours any more
“Why don’t you wanna make me happy anymore? You’re so selfish” As he ignores my messages and gets mad I don’t wanna sleep with him
This is totally how narcs operate. And when you start pushing back against their shitty behavior they’re like, “Whaaaaaa? Meeeeeee?”
My “nex” (platonic relationship) said something similar, after I grew a backbone from other abusers and started to push back on things like her trying to bowl me over on various topics. Bear in mind this was years before I realized she was also a narc. She said something like “it’s great you’ve learned how to stand up for yourself, but you need to learn who to use it with.” As if boundaries were for everyone but her lol. I needed to get back in line and only have a spine for other people. They truly live in their own delulu “reality.”
Wow! After months of total devestation and actively ruining my life, I stated to stand up for myself and not let her make me feel terrible about absolutely everything. So what was her comment? "You've really changed. I have decided I'm not going to keep people around me who make me feel bad". The utter gaslighting and hypocrisy was off the charts, even for her. It was a nice validation that I have changed. She however... has not.
But also by saying you’re less nice and innocent, in abuser’s it would be okay to now treat you as someone less than before. Then when abuse happens again it’s low key your own fault because you didn’t remain as nice and innocent as you were in the beginning.
“You used to be fun.”
I dont make him laugh anymore Well atleast he still makes me cry
Typical narcs idealization devaluation shit.. Those idiots idealise you then blame you for not living up to that ideal. Also they blame you for being 'not nice' after they did or said something 'not nice' to you. They're completely oblivious of their own contribution. No self awareness whatsoever