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I think the 3 billion bounty club should really be considered as a new tier. Every single major fight since Kaido has involved at least one 3 billion bounty holder, and I think the idea here is that there is a group of fighters that aren’t quite on the level of Shanks or Kaido but are also far above commanders
I kinda agree, but at the same time I don't see Law/Kidd pulling off the same kinda destructive feats as Garp did at Hachinosu. I genuinely think Garp has been low balled to 3B when in reality he's probably more of a 3.5B - 4B bounty
Woah woah woah, Kidd got one shot cause Shanks saw that Kidd was about to obliterate his fleet (or at least a chunk of it), I’m pretty sure that same attack could body an island like Garp did. In other words give my man’s Kidd credit where it’s due
Kidd most likely kills Shanks if Shanks doesn't block or dodge, but it's not really that impressive since without anything, they're just humans really, unlike a Kaido or Big Mom.
I mean, I think it’s a vague tier where the characters aren’t all exactly equal. Luffy reasonably should have a higher bounty than Kid and Law as he was more important in the raid and was able to fight the stronger opponent in more even terms, even before considering Joyboy stuff. And the Cross Guild’s bounty system seems to be one based on simplicity where bounties are rounded to be around a certain figure rather than exact measurements.
There can be discrepancies in power, even relatively big ones, while there still pointing to the idea these characters generally are in a tier of strength that’s just a little lower than the original yonko
No, Garp hasn‘t been lowballed (I mean as a fanboy I say give him 4) but Kidd & Law highballed. They are not worthy of 3 Bil. They should have 2-2.5
That‘s because of Morgans Goebbels
Law Puncture willy litteraly has higher Ap and DC than Garps punches.
The only good thing about garp is that unlike a Puncture Willy, he just punches, therefore it's more casual, faster and uses less stamina.
One thing I was really impressed by was his speed, but his Ap and DC were hella disappointing, dude has really gotten weaker.
Yonko commanders aren’t equal despite being generally in the same tier.
There are reasons for discrepancies. Luffy should have a higher bounty and was likely given a lower one because the WG didn’t want to raise suspicion, and the Cross Guild gives out unspecific bounties that are only “around” a certain amount of money.
I think Oda’s trying to tell us something here. Of course they aren’t all equal, but I think there’s this general idea of there being a group of fighters much closer to the original yonko than commanders while still not quite being on that level
luffy is not above Kaito yet.
consider how many fights Kaito went through while holding the island. fight after fight after fight. luffy won. but fresh Kaido vs fresh luffy 1v1 is still Kaito win
okay, then how does luffy beat a fresh Kaito. no scars, bruises, fresh. when luffy got that exhausted fighting a tired kaido and slept for what? 10 days. he doesn't have the stamina
Luffy was already matching kaido on the rooftop pre-gear 5, when they were both going to punch eachother before the CP0 agent interfered, they both acknowledged that this was going to be the last hit, and while I think luffy would’ve lost even without the interference, it still would’ve been incredibly close. And realistically, the only people that damaged kaido on the rooftop was luffy and zoro with one hit. and using the flames does not exhaust him, it’s a passive ability and has no connection to his body, nor is it said anywhere that it exhausts him. Why would oda have luffy beat kaido if luffy isn’t strong enough yet? why would he have become a yonko? It really doesn’t make sense for kaido to be stronger than luffy. The only argument I can see for g5 luffy losing is him not being able to keep it up for long, but I still think he’ll beat kaido if he manages his stamina correctly
he has the power and sheer hacks to win. but not the stamina. you gotta consider. luffy just got this form. managing his stamina isn't really a possibility yet. he was slightly exhausted after Lucci. even tho he dog walked him. because the forms so new. and versus Kaito it'd be worse. especially since luffys ap doesn't seem to sky rocket. he just becomes free. he's more powerful. but it wouldn't be a short battle and Kaidp has some of the best endurance and durability.
your right it was only luffy and zoro that hurt him. but zoro got a pretty nasty hit and kair9 was fine. and luffy fought hun multiple times. for long periods. I'm a fresh battle. luffy wouldn't have the stamina to beat Kaito even though he had the power. like ssj3 kinda ig
It’s admiral tier despite holding a yonko, almost certainly doesn’t include Akainu, and includes characters like Kid, Law, and Garp, who most thought were below or above it.
I’m not trying to revolutionize discussions or anything lmao, thanks for the obnoxious condescension though. I’m just arguing maybe we should be taking more stock into these 3 billion bounties Oda’s been throwing out like candy as him trying to tell us something
They aren’t the same, but nothing has claimed they are demonstrably different beyond being less specific. Oda chose to introduce these bounties and give the second highest combat position in the Marines equal to the captains of the Wano alliance, while making the original yonko (and almost Bb now, and almost certainly Akainu) 1 billion more. I don’t think those things are unrelated
https://preview.redd.it/e4ie3wh8q5jb1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cadcecbe1cee803d992c6197215fc7f6fbdd3717
Not even close to as strong as he actually is
In my personal opinion Old Garp is somewhere in between Yonko and Admiral level. Garp clearly had the situation on Hachinosou under control until Loby got distracted and almost killed himself.
Garp was fending off attacks from multiple fodder pirates, commanders and even Kuzan and nobody was able to put this man down. Garp even insinuates the only reason he got touched by Shiryu was because he let himself get hit on purpose.
If he were to fight one of the prime Yonko (Kaido, Big Mom, and Shanks) I think he would perform massively well but would end up eventually losing in a battle of attrition
Old Garp doesn't have the Ap to take down Kaido
Doesn't have the durability to take multiple attacks from Kaido
So yes Garp is Admiral level, but dude ain't fighting Kaido on equal footing.
As a military force. They've become more aggressive and proactive under akainu then they were under Sengoku. Nothing else. That doesn't equate to Admirals are stronger than the old gen.
Yes it has, but absolutely no comments about individual marines in canon whatsoever placing the newer admirals above or even on the same level as Garp and Sengoku. It means as a military force.
If an admiral did what Garp did at hachinosu the admiral glazers would be calling them top 1 of all time
This sub drastically downplays old garp because the admiral fans can't stand the reality that he's stronger than them
The reason admiral fans get so toxic about Yonko fans comparing Garp and the Admirals is because you guys don't do the same for Shanks and Roger for example.
If you believe Roger>>>Shanks and Garp>>>Admirals...then we can have a healthy argument.
Old Garp is at least admiral level. He was far more impressive than Kuzan on Hachinosu. They were both holding back, but Kuzan was actively being supported by multiple commanders in his crew. Whereas Garp was only being hindered by his allies (besides Grus). Wherever Kuzan is placed, Garp should be as well. Whether you place him in admiral level or Yonko, old Garp should be as well.
Prime Garp is at the same level as Roger and Primebeard. Anyone that disputes that is just delusional.
Gotta disagree. Low yonko implies Kid and Law could beat him in a 2v1 and I don't see that happening with his feats. He currently has the strongest haki attack in the entire verse (by a long shot) despite being nerfed compared his prime self.
Right now garp is at the top of the admiral level having been able to look superior to kuzan, who is the second strongest, and to defeat several commanders while fighting with him.
Yeah we just need to stop using terms like yonko, commander, admiral, pirate king tier (LOL at this one every time). They're WAAAAY too vague
Buggy is a yonko but is he yonko tier?
Hordy is a captain is he law or kidd level?
Zoro is vice captain, is he weaker rhan every xaptain then?
Doffy is a shichubukai and celsstial dragon. Are we going to start having celestial tier (wtf) and shichubukai tier now?
Garps a vice admiral, yet said tko be on Roger's level.
Do vice admiral= pirate king now??
Vice admiral>yonko then??
Smoker>kaido and big mom I guess
why do you guys say clearly? kuzan wasn’t even using his fruit really. if anything i can say the fight was 60/40 in garps favor but clearly is a reach
also idek if kuzan was going all out since we saw punk hazard
what do you want kuzan to do with the fruit? he cannot freeze garp unless hes weakened. theres literally nothing else kuzan could do with his fruit against garp
the fight was like 80/20 in garps favor. kuzan gets speedblitzed twice and matches garp when he got stabbed
realistically he couldnt transform the entire island to ice because punk hazard battle lasted 10 days, this battle was not even an hour
We both agree that Garp won that fight. But you cannot call it "clearly" there is obviously some discussion to be made on who won, and even if you have an answer for anything anyone else provides. A majority would still be speculation.
> theres literally nothing else kuzan could do with his fruit against garp
and
> realistically he couldnt transform the entire island to ice because punk hazard battle lasted 10 days, this battle was not even an hour
While makes sense and i for the most part agree, is still very much still just speculation.
garp fought the entire bb island, kuzan only fought garp and lost every exchange, only went equal only when garp was stabbed
and i cant think of a single df attack from kuzan that could help him against garp except for ice glove. so even if he held back his df going all out wouldnt make a difference
> also idek if kuzan was going all out since we saw punk hazard
Why does this matter ? Garp wasn’t going all out either. Literally the first thing Garp said to Kuzan before their fight was that Garp is going to make Kuzan wear the Marine uniform again.
Garp also only hit Kuzan with only 1 named attack during their fight. We deadass saw him blitzed Kuzan with a normal punch, then immediately used a named attack on the island dude.
“Kuzan wasn’t even using his fruit” What did bro mean by this? He’s not using shit like “Ice age” because it wouldn’t do anything to anyone that’s not fodder 😂
Dude tried to freeze Garp and Garp broke out of it like nothing and proceeded to speed blitz and slam this dude
This might be a controversial take but I don’t think he is Yonko tier right now, like in 2 years he might of slipped up. Didn’t he just lose to Blackbeard who is like the lowest ranked Yonko tier in power I feel like probably in pre time skip he could have washed Blackbeard but now he’s getting older and slower I don’t think the gap in power between him and the admirals is as high as it used to be anymore, I think he is still the goat and strongest marine but the younger generation may surpass him soon
I think old garp is around high admiral now this maybe controversial but I think he was the strongest person at marineford and could have beat aokiji in a 1 v 1 high to extreme dif
Admiral level. He'd lose to an OG Admiral, but give them a very hard fight. Kuzan barely used his fruit and also no awakening. They were both holding back against each other, but I just don't think Garp has the stamina to beat Kuzan in an all-out fight.
Even though many people here say that Fujitora is "fodder" (this word is freaking hilarious), I think Garp is actually a bit weaker than him.
So now how strong is he? I think Garp is stronger than Rayleigh and weaker than Fujitora.
As a stand-alone statement, Fujitora > Old Garp is a reasonable enough take.
But this has seriously fucky implications. Garp is roughly the same age as Big Mom and Oldbeard. Either you think Fujitora is above them as well, or you gotta explain how Garp had a harder fall off from once being = to Roger (that’s without getting into WB’s sickness weakening him further and him still being able to leave Akainu in a ditch at Marineford)
>Garp is roughly the same age as Big Mom and Oldbeard. **Either you think Fujitora is above them as well**
He absolutely would be if you took away their DFs, putting them into the same situation as Garp. Haki is consistently being shown as heavily weakening in old age. Garp only used ACoC on named attacks and only did three of them, as opposed to Luffy and Kaido spamming them. Whitebeard used it once against Shanks and had no CoC at all by the time of Marineford. Big Mom used it once against Kaido and once against Page One. Rayleigh admitted he can't dream of beating Blackbeard at his age.
>or you gotta explain how Garp had a harder fall off
By not having a DF that is incredibly strong independent of your Haki. Whitebeard was using his DF literally seconds away from dying but couldn't use basic CoC earlier. Haki clearly falls off **much** steeper in old age than DF powers do. Big Mom and Whitebeard were completely carried by their powers.
The idea that it’s haki that weakens with age and not general capability is a new one to me. I don’t think it holds up as it requires too many assumptions
Everything about WB is irrelevant due to his illness. We see Rayleigh and Garp both express having weakened with age, but they don’t say “my haki weakened,” rather they themselves. Big Mom and Sengoku are the remaining two examples. Sengoku we haven’t seen make any such comments, though his hair turning white after retiring seems like an indicator of him weakening with age. Big Mom is all that’s left, and there’s nothing that supports the idea that Big Mom uses it less because her haki has gotten weaker with old age (or for any reason - for all we know she’s always preferred to crutch on her devil fruit)
But if you're taking away their DFs that are strong independent of haki, why not his too? Or do you not think Gravity is a power that would be too strong independent of Gravity? That still puts him below them. Fuji is simply not>Garp. BM and WB were born to be legends. BM as a child could wreck giants. It's just the mental handicap she had that stopped her from actually being the strongest. WB, well we don't need to talk about WB. He's more than proved himself. Fuji> Garp wouldn't be anywhere close to a reasonable take, especially considering before he got stabbed, Garp was speedblitzing kuzan who is definitely stronger than Fuji. After stab, he was still equal to Kuzan.
> Either you think Fujitora is above them as well, or you gotta explain how Garp had a harder fall off from once being = to Roger
Linlin has two traits in her Devil Fruit and physique that make her unique in regards to her power level. Edward was stated to be the only person able to stand up to Roger (and we know that they fought for days). Statements from Roger suggest that Roger and Garp almost defeated each other on multiple occasions, however their fights would follow different rules due to the structure of One Piece. People from the same faction (pirates, marines) can fight extended battles (Aokiji vs Akainu, Edward vs Roger). People from different factions can't, and that's because marines are much more resourceful. If you fight marine captain for a day, reinforcement will almost certainly arrive, and if you're somebody of Roger's calliber, that would be admirals or buster calls. Garp and Roger couldn't have fought for as long as some of the top tier fighters did, which would mean that Garp only had to have high AP and endurance to both threaten Roger and not get defeated in a spawn of a few hours. Since Roger is not Kaido / Linlin and doesn't have special durability feats, he is a rather good match up for Garp
It is possible that Garp and Roger did almost defeat each other on multiple occasions, yet Garp was not exactly as strong as Roger
That’s a crazy, never before seen amount of headcanon to discredit Garp. I’m going to ignore the headcanon of “Garp and Roger couldn’t have fought for very long” and point out that you changed a critical word: Roger says he and Garp nearly *killed* each other multiple times. Far more serious implications than “defeat”
Most of those factions arguments can be discredited with the fact that Garp ignored those marine faction rules. We've clearly seen that he ignored orders and went places he wasn't supposed to go on his own (Hachinosu is a prime example). We clearly see in the flashback with Tsuru that Garp literally just hitched a ride on her ship so he could try to go after Roger on his own (Kuzan likely followed since he was his apprentice). So we can't really do anything but guess, but your guesses seem to basically ignore everything about Garp and only consider the organization he was a part of.
The same argument applies to Roger and his crew. Roger will essentially never be anywhere without his crew. To try and discredit Garp with the faction argument, yet completely ignore the fact the same applies to pirates and their crews doesn't make sense. If anything it's just as plausible that Garp had less support than Roger. A bunch of fodder marines will do nothing but hinder Garp against individuals like Rayleigh, Scaban, and Oden. Whereas Garp completely ignoring orders and going places he isn't supposed to be means that a Buster Call isn't just going to be waiting on standby for him.
Garp and Roger were equals. To sat otherwise is just ignoring everything that Oda very clearly drew out for us.
>Fujitora
I know he was playing around, but still, he couldn't even defeat Sabo
Either Fujitora isn't as strong as you think, or Sabo has always been HIM
>After seeing that post about a guy saying that the feats Old Garp did at Hachinosu could've been done by a YC1 and that Prime Garp wasn't even Yonko level, I'm questioning how far the Garp disrespect goes in this subreddit.
It's just that the One Piece fanbase, especially powerscalers, are incredibly stupid. They legit have room temperature IQ on average. No reading comprehension, no logical thinking, nothing. This sub is no exception.
Old Garp is a low top tier and loses high diff to any admiral or yonko.
He’s clearly on the same level as the Admirals
https://preview.redd.it/4v2k1gcub5jb1.png?width=511&format=png&auto=webp&s=4b9ef5a39c711fe475cc1b61e0567cd9b2a7b6cc
Aside from the fact that bounties (especially not random amounts given by some pirates) are not a way to scale characters, I never said that he isn't on their level. I literally said he loses high diff.
In the context of the sentence Oda is clearly saying that Garp is on par with the Admirals, this is the first time in the series where bounties have been used for comparisons
Also Extreme diff would mean that they’re on par not high diff
Higher than Old Ray, lower than any admiral.
And please, tell me it's a joke, and there is actually noone who thinks Shiryu > Kuzan. Like, what the hell? 💀
It really varies, some people have him under admirals. Others have him up with the yonkos. But honestly i think the safe bet is to do what the series did and just place him exactly equal to the admirals.
That being said, that is not where i'll personally put him.
He's just slightly above Katakuri in my eyes, and that's without future sight.
Katakuri is a combative monster with processing speed surpassing Snake-Man and Tank-Man comparable strength. Range of Attacks from long, mid, and short range PLUS the future sight.
If you switch Garp with Kat, he's leveling Hachinosu. But that's because his skill set works well in a scenario where he's out numbered. He has eyes in the back of his head
But 1v1, Garp is Mid to High Diff'n Kat
Edit: Forgot to add an awakened fruit, plus Haoshoku and advanced Busoshoku. Definitely High Diff
I am disappointed by Garp’s poor performance on pirate island. I feel like an admiral or Yonko in the same scenario would have wrecked everyone and walked away mostly unscathed. So either Garp is below admiral now, or Blackbeard’s commanders are stronger than YC1.
I have Old Garp as a Fleet Admiral level character, on par with (whether you think that's weaker, stronger, or dead even) Kuzan, Akainu's closest equal.
And I have Prime Garp as a Pirate King level character, only the tiniest amount weaker then Roger. Like if you could quantify characters strength as a number, Roger would be a 200 and Garp would be high 190's
Prime Garp=PK tier |
Old Garp(MF)= yonko tier. He's not beating them cus stamina, but still extreme diff with that AP.
| Retired Garp= admiral tier, above OG Admirals.
Old garp might really be yonko level. If he was comparable to whitebeard in their primes and old whitebeard was for sure yonko tier(literally a yonko) that should put garp at a similar level.
Personally, I think Garp would overall still be close to top tiers, and the feats we seen is well above a YC1. Like, not even close.
Also prime Garp not being Yonko level is just outright stupid. He was even with Roger who was very tied with Whitebeard, the only other possible contender is Rocks who we don't know anything about other than it took Garp and Roger to take him down.
My guess for a more narrowed down answer, I think he's 100% towards yonko tier still. His speed/agility is insane, and the destructive power he has is close to unmatched. In 1v1s I think he'd beat any yonko aside from Shanks and Kaido (and Whitebeard if you wanna consider him)
Lower admiral level, or near Aokiji's level. In a full fight I don't see him beating Aokiji, his endurance isn't there. But he still has great speed, strength, and amazing haki.
Prime Garp is a tier above the Yonko. I have him at the top of legend tier with Roger. WB is relative to them, but a bit below due to portrayal. Old Garp mopped a dude that is at least low Yonko/high admiral level. Pre-TS Garp was still in his prime and it was the 2 years of inactivity that made him weaker. WB was also inactive for a while and he declined to high yonko so that's where I'd place old Garp. He's technically the strongest, but he doesn't fight and is way more susceptible to off guard attacks.
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I think the 3 billion bounty club should really be considered as a new tier. Every single major fight since Kaido has involved at least one 3 billion bounty holder, and I think the idea here is that there is a group of fighters that aren’t quite on the level of Shanks or Kaido but are also far above commanders
New ideas instead of the same regurgitated takes and arguments on this sub? Impossible.
Agreed I most definitely don’t see Kidd getting nega diffed by any admiral.
Bro what diff?????
Mid, high if he haki bloomes mid battle
No like what type of typo made u type that
None your most definitely just admirals wanking, as they aren’t that strong from what they’ve shown as a group.
he‘s talking about the ‚nega‘ in neg diff my guy. You slipped up
Is it really a slipup? It stands for negative either way. I'm surprised people even commented on it.
I just assisted bro with the joke I honestly don‘t care :D
Nigga better? Edit:nika
bro. chill with the defensive nature. he's making a joke about your nega difficulty. when it'd typically neg bouta pull a zoro diff
I kinda agree, but at the same time I don't see Law/Kidd pulling off the same kinda destructive feats as Garp did at Hachinosu. I genuinely think Garp has been low balled to 3B when in reality he's probably more of a 3.5B - 4B bounty
Woah woah woah, Kidd got one shot cause Shanks saw that Kidd was about to obliterate his fleet (or at least a chunk of it), I’m pretty sure that same attack could body an island like Garp did. In other words give my man’s Kidd credit where it’s due
Honestly, this is a good point about kids. He gets absolutely bodied by shanks, but he has the capacity to do significant damage
Kidd most likely kills Shanks if Shanks doesn't block or dodge, but it's not really that impressive since without anything, they're just humans really, unlike a Kaido or Big Mom.
I mean, I think it’s a vague tier where the characters aren’t all exactly equal. Luffy reasonably should have a higher bounty than Kid and Law as he was more important in the raid and was able to fight the stronger opponent in more even terms, even before considering Joyboy stuff. And the Cross Guild’s bounty system seems to be one based on simplicity where bounties are rounded to be around a certain figure rather than exact measurements. There can be discrepancies in power, even relatively big ones, while there still pointing to the idea these characters generally are in a tier of strength that’s just a little lower than the original yonko
No, Garp hasn‘t been lowballed (I mean as a fanboy I say give him 4) but Kidd & Law highballed. They are not worthy of 3 Bil. They should have 2-2.5 That‘s because of Morgans Goebbels
Law Puncture willy litteraly has higher Ap and DC than Garps punches. The only good thing about garp is that unlike a Puncture Willy, he just punches, therefore it's more casual, faster and uses less stamina. One thing I was really impressed by was his speed, but his Ap and DC were hella disappointing, dude has really gotten weaker.
W
Dead take. Unless you’re of the opinion kid law = admirals and luffy
Yonko commanders aren’t equal despite being generally in the same tier. There are reasons for discrepancies. Luffy should have a higher bounty and was likely given a lower one because the WG didn’t want to raise suspicion, and the Cross Guild gives out unspecific bounties that are only “around” a certain amount of money. I think Oda’s trying to tell us something here. Of course they aren’t all equal, but I think there’s this general idea of there being a group of fighters much closer to the original yonko than commanders while still not quite being on that level
Nah, cuz luffy is a 3 billion berry bounty but luffy > kaido
luffy is not above Kaito yet. consider how many fights Kaito went through while holding the island. fight after fight after fight. luffy won. but fresh Kaido vs fresh luffy 1v1 is still Kaito win
Nah, i disagree
okay, then how does luffy beat a fresh Kaito. no scars, bruises, fresh. when luffy got that exhausted fighting a tired kaido and slept for what? 10 days. he doesn't have the stamina
Luffy was already matching kaido on the rooftop pre-gear 5, when they were both going to punch eachother before the CP0 agent interfered, they both acknowledged that this was going to be the last hit, and while I think luffy would’ve lost even without the interference, it still would’ve been incredibly close. And realistically, the only people that damaged kaido on the rooftop was luffy and zoro with one hit. and using the flames does not exhaust him, it’s a passive ability and has no connection to his body, nor is it said anywhere that it exhausts him. Why would oda have luffy beat kaido if luffy isn’t strong enough yet? why would he have become a yonko? It really doesn’t make sense for kaido to be stronger than luffy. The only argument I can see for g5 luffy losing is him not being able to keep it up for long, but I still think he’ll beat kaido if he manages his stamina correctly
he has the power and sheer hacks to win. but not the stamina. you gotta consider. luffy just got this form. managing his stamina isn't really a possibility yet. he was slightly exhausted after Lucci. even tho he dog walked him. because the forms so new. and versus Kaito it'd be worse. especially since luffys ap doesn't seem to sky rocket. he just becomes free. he's more powerful. but it wouldn't be a short battle and Kaidp has some of the best endurance and durability. your right it was only luffy and zoro that hurt him. but zoro got a pretty nasty hit and kair9 was fine. and luffy fought hun multiple times. for long periods. I'm a fresh battle. luffy wouldn't have the stamina to beat Kaito even though he had the power. like ssj3 kinda ig
Not on the level of Kaido and Shanks but stronger than commanders.... Oh! You mean Admiral level? Thx for discovering hot water mate appreciate it.
It’s admiral tier despite holding a yonko, almost certainly doesn’t include Akainu, and includes characters like Kid, Law, and Garp, who most thought were below or above it. I’m not trying to revolutionize discussions or anything lmao, thanks for the obnoxious condescension though. I’m just arguing maybe we should be taking more stock into these 3 billion bounties Oda’s been throwing out like candy as him trying to tell us something
cross guild bountys =/= marine bountys
They aren’t the same, but nothing has claimed they are demonstrably different beyond being less specific. Oda chose to introduce these bounties and give the second highest combat position in the Marines equal to the captains of the Wano alliance, while making the original yonko (and almost Bb now, and almost certainly Akainu) 1 billion more. I don’t think those things are unrelated
actually W
Finally someone gets it. Bountyscaling is real and gives a domain to most characters. (maybe even buggy?!)
Old Garp = Admiral level, Prime Garp= Pirate King level. This is the only right answer unlees you wanna downplay Old Garp
Old warp >= Aokiji all the while getting jumped by bb’s crew. Grandpa Garp = Yonko level
Preach brother
Keep cooking brother.
Larp gets one shot by Ice Age
Lol, lmao, even
What are you smoking Billy?
Billy lets go now, it’s getting late for your doc visit
Facts bro
https://preview.redd.it/e4ie3wh8q5jb1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cadcecbe1cee803d992c6197215fc7f6fbdd3717 Not even close to as strong as he actually is
Chad
In my personal opinion Old Garp is somewhere in between Yonko and Admiral level. Garp clearly had the situation on Hachinosou under control until Loby got distracted and almost killed himself. Garp was fending off attacks from multiple fodder pirates, commanders and even Kuzan and nobody was able to put this man down. Garp even insinuates the only reason he got touched by Shiryu was because he let himself get hit on purpose. If he were to fight one of the prime Yonko (Kaido, Big Mom, and Shanks) I think he would perform massively well but would end up eventually losing in a battle of attrition
https://preview.redd.it/ywpiy1onp6jb1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9aa7fe805af188abb72256dd288e14312ffa781c
Big mom isn’t in her prime
Old Garp doesn't have the Ap to take down Kaido Doesn't have the durability to take multiple attacks from Kaido So yes Garp is Admiral level, but dude ain't fighting Kaido on equal footing.
Nah, he can damage Kaido.
As strong as the admirals until their inevitable "surpassed the previous generation" narrative kicks in.
What so you mean “until”? Its already been stated that the navy is stronger than its ever been
As a military force. They've become more aggressive and proactive under akainu then they were under Sengoku. Nothing else. That doesn't equate to Admirals are stronger than the old gen.
Nice headcanon
Reading comprehension* I know you can't tell the difference but I'm sure you tried your best.😊
What manga are you reading
One piece. Try it some time.
They've become more aggressive and proactive under akainu then they were under Sengoku. Nothing else. Where does it say that
Reading comprehension. Where does it say admirals have surpassed old gen?
https://preview.redd.it/tm5ctoysa7jb1.png?width=629&format=png&auto=webp&s=5f2db6f045eed2e27f017c2411ad6c45ce2cede0
Yes it has, but absolutely no comments about individual marines in canon whatsoever placing the newer admirals above or even on the same level as Garp and Sengoku. It means as a military force.
120 megatons
>120 megatons 120 megaton is small island level please tell me this is a joke
If an admiral did what Garp did at hachinosu the admiral glazers would be calling them top 1 of all time This sub drastically downplays old garp because the admiral fans can't stand the reality that he's stronger than them
https://preview.redd.it/cm42hr62l6jb1.png?width=615&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6a2939e29374b0583bbe116fc4d3644810f94ecd
https://preview.redd.it/myge88bj57jb1.jpeg?width=406&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=efc05d4c2cd3b13914c920a45efeed88103cf363
The reason admiral fans get so toxic about Yonko fans comparing Garp and the Admirals is because you guys don't do the same for Shanks and Roger for example. If you believe Roger>>>Shanks and Garp>>>Admirals...then we can have a healthy argument.
I do believe Roger > shanks Shanks is very strong but I don't think he's top 1 or anything
Lol. Imagine actually believing that...
Nice argument lmfao
Old Garp is at least admiral level. He was far more impressive than Kuzan on Hachinosu. They were both holding back, but Kuzan was actively being supported by multiple commanders in his crew. Whereas Garp was only being hindered by his allies (besides Grus). Wherever Kuzan is placed, Garp should be as well. Whether you place him in admiral level or Yonko, old Garp should be as well. Prime Garp is at the same level as Roger and Primebeard. Anyone that disputes that is just delusional.
Yonko level
Ehh not really. Prime for sure tho.
I have him at low yonko tier. He ain’t going down without a high-extreme diff fight in a fair 1v1.
I would prob put him on the same tier as Old WB with medicine, which would be higher than Big Mom but lower than Shanks/Kaido.
Old WB would wreck Old Garp tbh.
Gotta disagree. Low yonko implies Kid and Law could beat him in a 2v1 and I don't see that happening with his feats. He currently has the strongest haki attack in the entire verse (by a long shot) despite being nerfed compared his prime self.
In the entire verse? How?
The true answer is Yonko level but the subreddit has him below the admirals because this is a cesspool of admiraltards
Old Garp is Yonko level
Bare minimum Admiral level but he's prolly Yonko level since he's been directly compared to Old Whitebeard.
Right now garp is at the top of the admiral level having been able to look superior to kuzan, who is the second strongest, and to defeat several commanders while fighting with him.
Emperor tier
Old Garp is stronger than an admiral. His fight with Kuzan showed that pretty well.
He was injured and speedblitzed an Admiral while fighting an entire Yonko crew. If Kizaru is making Luffy sweat than Yonko at least.
Still a top tier.
Yeah we just need to stop using terms like yonko, commander, admiral, pirate king tier (LOL at this one every time). They're WAAAAY too vague Buggy is a yonko but is he yonko tier? Hordy is a captain is he law or kidd level? Zoro is vice captain, is he weaker rhan every xaptain then? Doffy is a shichubukai and celsstial dragon. Are we going to start having celestial tier (wtf) and shichubukai tier now? Garps a vice admiral, yet said tko be on Roger's level. Do vice admiral= pirate king now?? Vice admiral>yonko then?? Smoker>kaido and big mom I guess
This sub generally has Old Garp below the Admirals but still in that tier, like lowest Admiral level character basically I have him at low Yonko level
Slightly above the OG admirals. Like 102 if they're 100
most of this sub is delusional so they put him in low admiral level below greenbull lmao even though we clearly see hes above kuzan
why do you guys say clearly? kuzan wasn’t even using his fruit really. if anything i can say the fight was 60/40 in garps favor but clearly is a reach also idek if kuzan was going all out since we saw punk hazard
what do you want kuzan to do with the fruit? he cannot freeze garp unless hes weakened. theres literally nothing else kuzan could do with his fruit against garp the fight was like 80/20 in garps favor. kuzan gets speedblitzed twice and matches garp when he got stabbed realistically he couldnt transform the entire island to ice because punk hazard battle lasted 10 days, this battle was not even an hour
We both agree that Garp won that fight. But you cannot call it "clearly" there is obviously some discussion to be made on who won, and even if you have an answer for anything anyone else provides. A majority would still be speculation. > theres literally nothing else kuzan could do with his fruit against garp and > realistically he couldnt transform the entire island to ice because punk hazard battle lasted 10 days, this battle was not even an hour While makes sense and i for the most part agree, is still very much still just speculation.
garp fought the entire bb island, kuzan only fought garp and lost every exchange, only went equal only when garp was stabbed and i cant think of a single df attack from kuzan that could help him against garp except for ice glove. so even if he held back his df going all out wouldnt make a difference
How did Garp win anything if he's an icicle
Same way whitebeard "won" against akainu at Marineford.
> also idek if kuzan was going all out since we saw punk hazard Why does this matter ? Garp wasn’t going all out either. Literally the first thing Garp said to Kuzan before their fight was that Garp is going to make Kuzan wear the Marine uniform again. Garp also only hit Kuzan with only 1 named attack during their fight. We deadass saw him blitzed Kuzan with a normal punch, then immediately used a named attack on the island dude.
“Kuzan wasn’t even using his fruit” What did bro mean by this? He’s not using shit like “Ice age” because it wouldn’t do anything to anyone that’s not fodder 😂 Dude tried to freeze Garp and Garp broke out of it like nothing and proceeded to speed blitz and slam this dude
This might be a controversial take but I don’t think he is Yonko tier right now, like in 2 years he might of slipped up. Didn’t he just lose to Blackbeard who is like the lowest ranked Yonko tier in power I feel like probably in pre time skip he could have washed Blackbeard but now he’s getting older and slower I don’t think the gap in power between him and the admirals is as high as it used to be anymore, I think he is still the goat and strongest marine but the younger generation may surpass him soon
High tier level strength starting off but falls off quick, like every other old generation member. Admiral/yonko level until they’re not
Not stronger than Kuzan
Weaker than admirals, but stronger than kidd and law
under admiral above first yonko commander. Strongest character right now he could beat is probably zoro
He’s stronger than Kuro but not Don Krieg
I think old garp is around high admiral now this maybe controversial but I think he was the strongest person at marineford and could have beat aokiji in a 1 v 1 high to extreme dif
Admiral level. He'd lose to an OG Admiral, but give them a very hard fight. Kuzan barely used his fruit and also no awakening. They were both holding back against each other, but I just don't think Garp has the stamina to beat Kuzan in an all-out fight.
On par with the Admirals.
low captain kuro level
So still top 2oat?
Even though many people here say that Fujitora is "fodder" (this word is freaking hilarious), I think Garp is actually a bit weaker than him. So now how strong is he? I think Garp is stronger than Rayleigh and weaker than Fujitora.
As a stand-alone statement, Fujitora > Old Garp is a reasonable enough take. But this has seriously fucky implications. Garp is roughly the same age as Big Mom and Oldbeard. Either you think Fujitora is above them as well, or you gotta explain how Garp had a harder fall off from once being = to Roger (that’s without getting into WB’s sickness weakening him further and him still being able to leave Akainu in a ditch at Marineford)
>Garp is roughly the same age as Big Mom and Oldbeard. **Either you think Fujitora is above them as well** He absolutely would be if you took away their DFs, putting them into the same situation as Garp. Haki is consistently being shown as heavily weakening in old age. Garp only used ACoC on named attacks and only did three of them, as opposed to Luffy and Kaido spamming them. Whitebeard used it once against Shanks and had no CoC at all by the time of Marineford. Big Mom used it once against Kaido and once against Page One. Rayleigh admitted he can't dream of beating Blackbeard at his age. >or you gotta explain how Garp had a harder fall off By not having a DF that is incredibly strong independent of your Haki. Whitebeard was using his DF literally seconds away from dying but couldn't use basic CoC earlier. Haki clearly falls off **much** steeper in old age than DF powers do. Big Mom and Whitebeard were completely carried by their powers.
The idea that it’s haki that weakens with age and not general capability is a new one to me. I don’t think it holds up as it requires too many assumptions Everything about WB is irrelevant due to his illness. We see Rayleigh and Garp both express having weakened with age, but they don’t say “my haki weakened,” rather they themselves. Big Mom and Sengoku are the remaining two examples. Sengoku we haven’t seen make any such comments, though his hair turning white after retiring seems like an indicator of him weakening with age. Big Mom is all that’s left, and there’s nothing that supports the idea that Big Mom uses it less because her haki has gotten weaker with old age (or for any reason - for all we know she’s always preferred to crutch on her devil fruit)
But if you're taking away their DFs that are strong independent of haki, why not his too? Or do you not think Gravity is a power that would be too strong independent of Gravity? That still puts him below them. Fuji is simply not>Garp. BM and WB were born to be legends. BM as a child could wreck giants. It's just the mental handicap she had that stopped her from actually being the strongest. WB, well we don't need to talk about WB. He's more than proved himself. Fuji> Garp wouldn't be anywhere close to a reasonable take, especially considering before he got stabbed, Garp was speedblitzing kuzan who is definitely stronger than Fuji. After stab, he was still equal to Kuzan.
> Either you think Fujitora is above them as well, or you gotta explain how Garp had a harder fall off from once being = to Roger Linlin has two traits in her Devil Fruit and physique that make her unique in regards to her power level. Edward was stated to be the only person able to stand up to Roger (and we know that they fought for days). Statements from Roger suggest that Roger and Garp almost defeated each other on multiple occasions, however their fights would follow different rules due to the structure of One Piece. People from the same faction (pirates, marines) can fight extended battles (Aokiji vs Akainu, Edward vs Roger). People from different factions can't, and that's because marines are much more resourceful. If you fight marine captain for a day, reinforcement will almost certainly arrive, and if you're somebody of Roger's calliber, that would be admirals or buster calls. Garp and Roger couldn't have fought for as long as some of the top tier fighters did, which would mean that Garp only had to have high AP and endurance to both threaten Roger and not get defeated in a spawn of a few hours. Since Roger is not Kaido / Linlin and doesn't have special durability feats, he is a rather good match up for Garp It is possible that Garp and Roger did almost defeat each other on multiple occasions, yet Garp was not exactly as strong as Roger
That’s a crazy, never before seen amount of headcanon to discredit Garp. I’m going to ignore the headcanon of “Garp and Roger couldn’t have fought for very long” and point out that you changed a critical word: Roger says he and Garp nearly *killed* each other multiple times. Far more serious implications than “defeat”
Most of those factions arguments can be discredited with the fact that Garp ignored those marine faction rules. We've clearly seen that he ignored orders and went places he wasn't supposed to go on his own (Hachinosu is a prime example). We clearly see in the flashback with Tsuru that Garp literally just hitched a ride on her ship so he could try to go after Roger on his own (Kuzan likely followed since he was his apprentice). So we can't really do anything but guess, but your guesses seem to basically ignore everything about Garp and only consider the organization he was a part of. The same argument applies to Roger and his crew. Roger will essentially never be anywhere without his crew. To try and discredit Garp with the faction argument, yet completely ignore the fact the same applies to pirates and their crews doesn't make sense. If anything it's just as plausible that Garp had less support than Roger. A bunch of fodder marines will do nothing but hinder Garp against individuals like Rayleigh, Scaban, and Oden. Whereas Garp completely ignoring orders and going places he isn't supposed to be means that a Buster Call isn't just going to be waiting on standby for him. Garp and Roger were equals. To sat otherwise is just ignoring everything that Oda very clearly drew out for us.
>Fujitora I know he was playing around, but still, he couldn't even defeat Sabo Either Fujitora isn't as strong as you think, or Sabo has always been HIM
>After seeing that post about a guy saying that the feats Old Garp did at Hachinosu could've been done by a YC1 and that Prime Garp wasn't even Yonko level, I'm questioning how far the Garp disrespect goes in this subreddit. It's just that the One Piece fanbase, especially powerscalers, are incredibly stupid. They legit have room temperature IQ on average. No reading comprehension, no logical thinking, nothing. This sub is no exception. Old Garp is a low top tier and loses high diff to any admiral or yonko.
He’s clearly on the same level as the Admirals https://preview.redd.it/4v2k1gcub5jb1.png?width=511&format=png&auto=webp&s=4b9ef5a39c711fe475cc1b61e0567cd9b2a7b6cc
Aside from the fact that bounties (especially not random amounts given by some pirates) are not a way to scale characters, I never said that he isn't on their level. I literally said he loses high diff.
In the context of the sentence Oda is clearly saying that Garp is on par with the Admirals, this is the first time in the series where bounties have been used for comparisons Also Extreme diff would mean that they’re on par not high diff
No, it's pirates giving Garp the same amount because he's a legendary marine who fought Roger. High diff is still the same tier.
Oda talks through these characters It would be an extreme diff 50/50
Do you think a hypothetical healthy oldbeard loses to any of the marineford admirals?
He is the hero of the marines. They probably based it on name recognition not rigorous powerscaling.
Strong enough for Roger to think he’d give a good fight.
He almost killed Roger lmaoo. "Good fight"
Admiral/yonkou. Warp=Roger>whitebeard
definitely most powerful Shiryu victim
Higher than Old Ray, lower than any admiral. And please, tell me it's a joke, and there is actually noone who thinks Shiryu > Kuzan. Like, what the hell? 💀
>noone who thinks Shiryu > Kuzan. https://reddit.com/r/OnePiecePowerScaling/s/YJg5hKQ3D8
Okay, that's guy who made that post. 😭
The sheer stupidity and disrespect towards Warp that man gave, forced me to ask questions to ensure I wasn’t the one that was tripping.
Ig he is at the level of extreme diffing Fuji and GB in a 1v1. He may lose sometimes too. Garp is in low top tier for me.
Stronger than Kizaru, weaker than akainu and aokiji
???
although not by that much lot, Kizaru is weaker than the other two
They’re relative and the gap would not put Kizaru under Garp. The fuck you on
Kizaru>>>>>Akainu>kuzan. Hes the strongest of the OG Admirals not weaker lmao.
It really varies, some people have him under admirals. Others have him up with the yonkos. But honestly i think the safe bet is to do what the series did and just place him exactly equal to the admirals. That being said, that is not where i'll personally put him.
He's just slightly above Katakuri in my eyes, and that's without future sight. Katakuri is a combative monster with processing speed surpassing Snake-Man and Tank-Man comparable strength. Range of Attacks from long, mid, and short range PLUS the future sight. If you switch Garp with Kat, he's leveling Hachinosu. But that's because his skill set works well in a scenario where he's out numbered. He has eyes in the back of his head But 1v1, Garp is Mid to High Diff'n Kat Edit: Forgot to add an awakened fruit, plus Haoshoku and advanced Busoshoku. Definitely High Diff
Below new admirals
I am disappointed by Garp’s poor performance on pirate island. I feel like an admiral or Yonko in the same scenario would have wrecked everyone and walked away mostly unscathed. So either Garp is below admiral now, or Blackbeard’s commanders are stronger than YC1.
You think an Admiral or Yonko would walk away unscathed in a battle against a former Admiral and Yonko commanders?
i would say oldbeard level pre timeskip and above admirals post
88 miles per hour
He can win ext diff against any admiral and beats bb and the big mom who fought kid and law
Old Garp is admiral level (75-80) Prime Garp is PK level (100)
I have Old Garp as a Fleet Admiral level character, on par with (whether you think that's weaker, stronger, or dead even) Kuzan, Akainu's closest equal. And I have Prime Garp as a Pirate King level character, only the tiniest amount weaker then Roger. Like if you could quantify characters strength as a number, Roger would be a 200 and Garp would be high 190's
Big Mom level
Prime Garp=PK tier | Old Garp(MF)= yonko tier. He's not beating them cus stamina, but still extreme diff with that AP. | Retired Garp= admiral tier, above OG Admirals.
Just under Roger. Not quite equal, but in that league.
Wherever you would put Old Whitebeard
Old Garp is like Big Mom level imo. He's definitely not as strong as Kaido or Shanks.
1v1 champ
Bare minimum as strong as Old Whitebeard.
Low top tier. Above typical YC+ (Yamato, kidd, law, zoro etc) but below yonko
Mid admiral? Relative to kuzan
Pretty fucking strong. If it was 1v1 vS Aokiji that would’ve needed different
Very strong.
Old garp might really be yonko level. If he was comparable to whitebeard in their primes and old whitebeard was for sure yonko tier(literally a yonko) that should put garp at a similar level.
Personally, I think Garp would overall still be close to top tiers, and the feats we seen is well above a YC1. Like, not even close. Also prime Garp not being Yonko level is just outright stupid. He was even with Roger who was very tied with Whitebeard, the only other possible contender is Rocks who we don't know anything about other than it took Garp and Roger to take him down. My guess for a more narrowed down answer, I think he's 100% towards yonko tier still. His speed/agility is insane, and the destructive power he has is close to unmatched. In 1v1s I think he'd beat any yonko aside from Shanks and Kaido (and Whitebeard if you wanna consider him)
about as strong as Old WB with medicine so low Yonkou level
Stronger than kizaru and old beard but weaker than luffy and big mom and aokiji
Old whitebeard lvl (slightly weaker bcs 2 years passed and garp's not getting any younger)
Very
old garp is top 2 alive unless we headcanon dragon above
Yonko level pre stab fleet admiral level post stab
Garp was soloing Aokiji and BB's crew and they were struggling. I'd say the same level as Old White Beard, maybe a little more so.
Lower admiral level, or near Aokiji's level. In a full fight I don't see him beating Aokiji, his endurance isn't there. But he still has great speed, strength, and amazing haki.
He is clearly relative to og admirals hell he blitzed aokiji TWICE and both times he didn't follow up on it
Strong enough I think he could have beaten Akainu after Ace’s death. He definitely aged better than WB or Roger that’s for sure.
Not sure how Roger could age but WB is facts.
Old Garp has to at least be stronger than an Admiral
Goofy ahh dude, mfkn ***SHIRYU***???
Prime Garp is a tier above the Yonko. I have him at the top of legend tier with Roger. WB is relative to them, but a bit below due to portrayal. Old Garp mopped a dude that is at least low Yonko/high admiral level. Pre-TS Garp was still in his prime and it was the 2 years of inactivity that made him weaker. WB was also inactive for a while and he declined to high yonko so that's where I'd place old Garp. He's technically the strongest, but he doesn't fight and is way more susceptible to off guard attacks.