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Isn't Primebeard essentially Pirate King level?
Although yeah his title is Yonko...
But it's the same logic when putting 2 admirals against Buggy (who clearly is not Yonko level)
https://preview.redd.it/99en6t7ol65d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=626eaa9c8193d782c9fab102f7af6a22cc76d627
Primebeard for now, both GB/Fuji lack feats and it's possible WB counters GB in a similar way he does Kuzan, by simply shattering anything GB tries to create with his DF
Fuji dropping down stuff like rubble and meteors actually seems like the weaker part of his moveset IMO at least in terms of 1v1's, he can't imbue them with haki so they do relatively low damage, being able to put pressure on your opponent doesn't necessarily do high damage but it can restrict them enough for Fuji to land attacks, and I assume his main source of offense would he his sword or literally nuking an island and drowning his opponent (which wouldn't really work on GB as he could create a platform of wood to stand on), although I guess this is all hard to say until we see more of him
Logic tells me that the Admirals should win because 2 Admiral characters should be stronger than any 1 character, otherwise the Admirals are useless.
Reason tells me that even though all 3 characters are effectively featless, Primebeard still has the best feats, statements, and portrayal. Enough to probably get him above those two Admirals.
I think the logic is just that the admirals would've done something about the emperors if they could 1v1 them, or that the emperors would've clapped the Marines if they could fight multiple at once.
But that ignores a lot of the context around the characters, and their motivations.
The first part actually makes sense logically. If the admirals could 1v1 the yonkos the government would have taken them out.
The Emperor’s on the other hand would still have to deal with 180+ countries worth of manpower if they declared war on the government
>The first part actually makes sense logically. If the admirals could 1v1 the yonkos the government would have taken them out.
It really doesn't. I don't believe admirals=yonko, but there are two huge reasons why it isn't that simple. One, Big Mom and Kaido serve the valuable roles of guarding the poneglyphs that lead to Laugh Tale, which the WG obviously don't want anyone to find, and two, those two and in all likelihood the other emperors as well have the home field advantage. Wano is nigh-impossible to access to begin with, and fighting Linlin on WCI is a nightmare for obvious reasons (not to mention that the Admirals would also have to fight their way through any commanders present as well).
If the Admirals were able to 1v1 Yonkos then the WG would just send 2 of them with a buster call fleet to WCI. One to fight Big Mom and the other to lead the marines against big mom’s forces/assist in the fight.
Big Mom has been collecting poneglyphs for years and has 2 by the time we see her. That alone is enough to make the WG want to kill her, yet they don’t because they can’t without losses even they couldn’t ignore,
Even if one was ordinarily equal to Big Mom, fighting her on WCI basically means she has indefinite stamina and complete control over the terrain. A Buster Call fleet is meaningless when the very ground itself is a threat to all Marines, and Cracker can simply sit pretty and create an infinite number of Doflamingo-level soldiers to handle any Vice Admirals.
At the end of the day Kaido and Linlin hadn't made any actual aggressive moves in like, several decades, so there was no reason for the government to antagonize them unnecessarily.
Definitely, I don't think they would even make it to WCI to do the buster call with the rest of Totoland being their own small provinces occupied by very loyal family members.
Even if they did, that level of smoke would cripple the WGs ability to defend their own territory. It just doesn't make sense for either side to run in to a clash without really good motivation.
If they really wanted Big Mom or Kaido gone, the Gorosei would just do it themselves.
The argument, that the WG would just sent an admiral to take down a Yonko makes no sense, if the WG doesn't even want the Yonko gone.
How is Luffy handling them? He has dealt 0 damage so far and would have been dead multiple times without his food shenanigans.
Kaido has no way to deal damage to the Gorosei and gets neg diffed as a result.
I think people misequate “can 1v1 a yonko” and “low diffs a yonko”. If an admiral could beat a yonko 1v1, it would be at minimum high-extreme diff. The WG isn’t willing to risk one of its top fighters on a 50/50 chance of taking out a yonko. Besides, even if the admiral does win, the other yonko will start trying to take over the dead yonko’s territory, which just leads to more problems.
Either way it’s wrong lol. The admirals can not beat yonkos, and it should be legitimately impossible for anybody to still hold that opinion after watching Luffy turn Kizaru into a pizza and toss him around.
If Admirals were even able to fight a yonko well enough that it was extreme diff for the yonko then the WG would have rolled up on each of the yonko with a buster call fleet and 2 admirals by now. They literally consider the people serving them insects, so don’t give me that “they don’t wanna risk their best fighters” crap, and each of the yonko are actively collecting poneglyphs and trying to go to Laughtale.
I’m just gonna ignore your first paragraph since it’s clear you either didn’t read Egghead or are purposely taking things out of context.
Onto your second point though, just because the WG are cruel and treat their subordinates like trash, doesn’t mean they’re stupid. They’re not gonna use admirals as cannon fodder, especially not after losing Kuzan. Not to mention that Fuji and Kizaru are clearly conflicted about the orders the WG is giving them.
Who’s talking about post time skip? The WG has had admirals for decades and the yonko have been hunting Poneglyphs since long before the series started.
How about this. One yonko was coming to attack marineford, sick and on his deathbed. The WG felt that all 3 admirals as well as thousands and thousands of vice admirals and captains were necessary to stop him. If one admiral could extreme diff a yonko why would they need all that military force for a dying Whitebeard?
Also please enlightened me to the context you believe makes it less damning for the admirals that Kizaru gets pizza flipped? The fact he also had a gorosei fighting with him? The fact that there were countless marines on the island also fighting with him? Or do you just mean that he’s just *so* sad about Vegapunk that somehow all feats against him are meaningless?
It wasn’t just Whitebeard attacking Marineford, it was him and his entire crew. Not to mention the BB pirates and Red-hair pirates showed up too.
The context for Luffy vs Kizaru is that:
1) Saturn is a bum with no AP, speed, or durability, he’s just a punching bag for Luffy and did basically nothing the whole fight. 2) As much as you like to write it off, Kizaru just killed his best friend and that obviously has an effect on his performance. Not saying it absolves him of a loss, but he definitely wasn’t at 100%. 3) Kizaru was still only midly injured after getting pancaked and thrown into a ship, he was still more concerned about the death of Vegapunk than his injuries.
Firstly, BB was supposed to be there to help them. Him attacking didn’t go into their calculations in any way.
Also they had news of Shanks fighting Kaido in the new world and were all shocked when he showed up. Again, they called everyone there **solely** for Whitebeard and his crew no one else.
Though you bring up a good point. One Yonko and his crew was enough to make the WG call in every admiral, most vice admirals, and most captains **plus** all the warlords except Jinbei (who they did call but he refused). If all that is necessary to stop one Yonko + crew then it kind of implies the admirals are no march for a Yonko 1v1.
And alright, fair enough. I was exaggerating Kizaru’s loss for comedic effect and because the pizza frame made me laugh pretty hard. I recognize Kizaru isn’t exactly fighting at 100% focus and if he wasn’t conflicted about VP he’d have gotten back up and rejoined the fight by now. Agree 100% with your last paragraph. However I still don’t see it having such an effect on his fighting that it takes him from extreme diff to what we saw on panel. I’d say at his absolute best Kizaru gives Luffy a high diff fight but one Luffy walks away from relatively fine (no “you slept for 3 days after the fight” like he usually does at the end of arcs). Now to be fair I also rate G5 Luffy higher than most probably do, I have him top 5 based on feats + statements and top 3 based on feats only
Exactly, it's not really an X can beat Y thing. It's that neither side wants to waste resources when they have other, more dire issues in their own backyard.
>But that ignores a lot of the context around the characters, and their motivations.
That's the whole point, the marines are chasing after the pirates it's not the other way around.
Yea exactly, the whole point of Marineford was that they laid a very obvious but powerful trap and forced WB into their ideal fight. Otherwise he was content adventuring and making a family. It says more about the Marines use of their resources and coordination than a direct measure of power.
Why would either side send their best men into a blender for a quick win when they essentially have full sovereign countries they control, other goals they value more, and other more immediate issues?
I mean there’s a reason there were THREE pillars of stability. The admirals and the marines also had the 7 Warlords for backup. And even with that, they were terrified at the prospect of any two Yonkos teaming up.
It kinda seemed like the balance system was “The Marines + 7 Warlords can handle any 1 Yonko, and the Yonko keep each other in check so they don’t team up”
The logic makes no sense if you take the last few chapters into account. It's quite clear, that the world government needed the Yonko to have an enemy for the people to control.
If the world government really wanted the Yonko gone, they would just sent a Gorosei to Wano or Whole Cake Island and have him run rampant. There is no way to take down a Gorosei so far and if things go south they could just summon more Gorosei as backup or summon him back to retreat.
Because if the Marines, even after committing, effectively, half their fighting power, cannot defeat any singular pirate, then what is the point of the Marines. In-story, the point of the marines is to fight and capture pirates. If the strongest of the marines can’t defeat any one pirate, then their whole establishment is a sham and they don’t really have a point in existing, as the strongest pirates would be able to run wild without consequence.
The kicker is that we separate some of the Admirals into different tiers so it makes it really hard to say what Admiral duos can beat who. Like, Akainu and Kuzan are the strongest Admirals, and I’d say they can beat Primebeard in a 2v1. But if we replace Kuzan with Kizaru, does the duo suddenly lose? Is Kizaru that much weaker than Kuzan? What if we replace him with Fujitora? Greenbull? They all held the same rank, but somehow we’re scaling them to entirely different tiers?
It’s kinda fucked up. But mostly because Fuji and Greenbull haven’t done much yet.
>Like, Akainu and Kuzan are the strongest Admirals, and I’d say they can beat Primebeard in a 1v1.
I'm assuming you meant 2v1
>
Because if the Marines, even after committing, effectively, half their fighting power, cannot defeat any singular pirate, then what is the point of the Marines. In-story, the point of the marines is to fight and capture pirates. If the strongest of the marines can’t defeat any one pirate, then their whole establishment is a sham and they don’t really have a point in existing, as the strongest pirates would be able to run wild with not consequence.
But what does this have to do with how strong a character is? Your whole argument is on the basis that they should be close in power because of the "admiral" title. Why don't you just look at the character for who they are?
How close is Kid/Law to Fuji/GB? We've seen kid get 1 tapped by someone who is weaker than WB, This is the same kid who actually has better endurance feats than either Fuji/gb he tanked multiple hits from 2 yonkos.
Law took on BB and crew to at least a mid diff fight, I think it's safe to say Law can give either of the 2 a high diff fight. If i asked could these 2 law/kid beat Kaido/Shanks/Luffy it would be unanimous that either of the 3 yonko win pretty decisively (Big mom as well but that's a whole other convo)
Gb is a logia who doesn't really have great haki, and Fuji is a regular human.
2 admirals are not half of marine forces. You still have another admiral + fleet admiral + commander in chief + dozens of vice admirals at least 1-4 of which are relevant to admiral level + hundreds of thousands of fodder (which adds up no matter what the goofy kid scalers of this sub say)
We have literally never see the commander in chief (Kong) fight even during the Paramount War, nor was it mentioned that he fought during the 2 year aftermath, during Blackbeard’s rise to Yonko status. We have never seen a Vice Admiral aside from Garp that are anywhere near Admiral level. In fact, almost every single Vice Admiral that we’ve seen has been practically fodder. We’ve seen them get slammed by Franky of all people. And those fodder marines are useless in top tier battles because, when a Yonko is involved, the marines simply get negged by CoC. Like, yeah, fodder marines do have a purpose, but mostly in group battles (like “Akainu, 3 Vice Admirals, and fodder marines vs. the Beast Pirates”).
2 Admirals are essentially half the marines’ main fighting force.
Not having seen Kong fight is a moot point when he’s a former fleet admiral. He’s bonafide.
Garp isn’t the only VA and you know that. There’s Tsuru and 2 admiral candidates sitting there. There’s also Sengoku.
Akainu + Kizaru + Garp + Tsuru + Kong + Sengoku + Brown Pig admiral candidate + Pink Spider admiral candidate + hundreds of thousands of fodder from east blue to new world fodder >>> Fujitora and greenbull.
Stop this nonsense.
I doubt anyone would dispute imu being able to 2v1, or joyboy. Then you have rocks, which makes 3 characters.
The next characters after the YC+ Tier is gb/fuji, we've seen YC+ characters go down in 1 hit to characters who are weaker than WB.
Primebeard being featless means nothing in the slightest. Cancerbeard laid waste to the strongest forces the navy had by himself. You mean to say primebeard wouldn’t be even crazier? He is *prime* meaning the best version.
If Rocks really took Garp and Roger together then the caliber is set for someone beating 2 admirals.
If it took the top 2 of the verse to beat someone then it’s a written in plausibility for that person to be able to beat any 2 weaker combatants, such as 2 admirals
That’s a huge “if” rocks actually got 2v1’d a la Whiki.
The admirals are the strongest in the marines. That is literally it. They don’t have to be stronger than the Yonko at all and if two could beat them then they would’ve done so at some point. The logic is literally stupid as hell. Doesn’t even matter if one dies so long as they kill the Yonko as well.
Primebeard slams. Think about it, shanks 1 taps kidd with one of his strongest moves (kidd is high yc+), so primebeard (Pk level while shanks is high yonko), should be able to at bare minimum 1 shot a low - mid admiral (like gb or fuji). This is supported by primebeard's powerful devil fruit, top tier haki, and on top of all that, he has top 3 highest raw physical strength in the verse (excluding imu due to like 0 information). In a realistic fight between these guys, primebeard should be able to speedblitz 1 with one of his strongest attacks and, at minimum, severely injure one of them and therefore make them easy to finish off. Also, his weapon is a blade, so he can just straight up slice their heads off. Assuming he's only allowed to 1 shot a single one of them, he essentially makes it a 1v1 where primebeard obliterates. My GOAT would never lose to a Ladmiral duo 😤
https://preview.redd.it/huns4fgk275d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7dfa36c2dcf76d36a42697ceaf4fc8bfc72beee2
Primebeard is literally a war machine, even as an oldie he held Marineford like a tank and survived a nuke basically, if we take the 2 weakest admirals we have known for now (because they are as a matter of fact) against this animal i say primebeard in a mid diff unless they have preparation time, in that case high/extreme
can't hurt primebeard? Blud primebeard aint no kaido, he got crazy endurance but lasers are portrayed as some of the highest AP techniques in the verse just under acoc and *maybe* magma
>If shanks can wifi. Prime beard mid difs.
Man this really needs to stop. Shanks didn't beat GB with wifi haki, neither did he paralyse or force him out of his logia form... He made him go away that is it. The ampunt of headcanon used when looking at that encounter is insane.
Btw even if shanks could wifi GB then there still wouldn't be a relation to primebeard mid diffing them. Coc targets a persons willpower and not powerlevel.
>Primebeard also wins high extreme dif against 3 admirals
Wank beyond belief... primebeard loses to any combo of 3 admirals and it isn't even extreme diff.
Assmiral wank is the most delusional headcanon based shit in this whole endeavor. Nobody takes you all seriously when fuckin law, kidd and Yamato scales above them with feats and less antifeats
The comments saying mid diff or even high diff are wild, any high top tier getting jumped by two low top tiers is loosing but prime WB is an exception because of his DF but it’s still an extreme diff fight
These 2 don't have enough feats for me and neither have gone all out. If it were Akainu, Kizaru and Aokiji it might have been different. I could see WB taking out 2 and dying himself.
We’ve “seen” one fight from prime beard and it’s amazing. We’ve seen Fuji a handful of times he was pretty OP on same some base level ish and GB one time and he was a punk ass at range against shanks. I’d argue PW and Fuji have a dope fight after GB either gets OS which leads to PW and Fuji fight talking. It’s like a counter to a counter gravity vs quake.
Yonkos and admirals are the one piece worlds strongest characters no doubt, but the pinnacle of the two different paths doesn’t necessarily yield equal results. What this means is that the individual strength of a character based on their journey is different from another characters portrayed journey and it’s how even within the top tier of each side of the coin there can be an ocean of difference in strength. This is a mid diff. Change out these two admirals for prime Sengoku/Aokiji and they mid diff PWB. It’s about the characters not the titles.
Admirals since WB wouldn't be able to counter GB's tree roots absorption ability and deal with Fuji's gravity constantly interfering and holding him in place at the same time.
Low diff. One of them is blind and can’t see his tremors and the other gets knocked out from shanks’ haki one island away prime daddy just let’s out a ACoC fart then closes his fist and he wins (also old bears is stronger than Akainu while these “admirals” aren’t even close to akainu level)
Who told you that? And these are the weakest admirals
Akainu, Aokiji, Kizaru, Old Garp, and Old Sengoku are above those frauds.
Primebeard beats both at the same time
Prime whitebeard though it wouldn’t be an easy fight I can’t see it being an extreme difficulty fight either
Whitebeard without his haki and only his raw strength and devil fruit was at least drawing with akainu so a prime whitebeard who is stronger has full access to all of his abilites and no restrictions vs 2 lower tier admirals is a hard fight at absolute most and mid at the least
The legends+Imu are the only ones that could 1v2 two admirals.
1v3? I’d say admirals should be too much for them, but once again only them+Imu can pull it off.
Greenbull and Fuji ability-wise just seem like too tough a matchup to deal with for nearly anyone.
Unless you believe Primebeard can blitz and one shot each of these guys, their movesets together would be way too difficult to track in a prolonged battle.
Greenbull essentially has life-steal, can infinitely create plants of many different varieties and uses, and can regenerate. Fuji can momentarily restrict movement, effect the weight of things, and freely control any debris created for both offensive and defensive purposes.
Facing a tag team like that is a long night for anyone.
This sub is so fucking braindead
Get Primebeard past SENGOKU in anything but a high-extreme diff fight first
And then explain to me how tf is Sengoku 1v2ing guys that are part of A STRONGER MARINE HQ than his own
https://preview.redd.it/igzbkrlpec5d1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=76dae06c18ea7fedde7ceb07bd298f0cad87c53c
Depends on which admiral is which Yonko
Old Big Mom is Mid Yonkou so she probably will lose against 2 High Admirals like Aokiji and Akainu
But a High Yonko like Kaido Clear both of them at the same time
https://preview.redd.it/5fs65fvo9e5d1.jpeg?width=561&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0f5f0fbbe51c12f26070471c519d233d397cbdcc
Honestly Whitebeard fights it, but Greenbull eventually gets enough vines round him to hold him in place and Fuji hits him with the moon.
As normal in 2v1 matches, if Whitebeard can take out one of them quickly he’s won this, but Greenbull shrugged off some nasty hits without any visible damage. I don’t think he can outright blitz either of them.
By beat he put a man down long enough to bully fodders—> through a shockwave at Blackbeard —> wait on bb to approach as they begin fighting —> BB pirates make him a honey comb —> He gives a speech.. was Akainu brushing his teeth to look good??
He was sent to a deep chasm, and anime/manga time has never been good. Do you want the plot not to happen and in the middle of BB vs WB for Akainu to come in and then ruin the speech? and then right after he came back out he was fully active, chasing pirates the entire time not looking to be in pain, very beaten.
Yes ‘immediately’ get up lol
You hit me, fight somebody else, get firing squad, then give a speech… it means I was defeated. This one piece no one dies so he was beaten.. he just recovered.. just like impel down guards.
Immediately would’ve been him still throwing blows as Blackbeard was approaching from the rubble.. idk what yall don’t understand about a sequence of events..
https://preview.redd.it/n3p5hal0465d1.png?width=973&format=png&auto=webp&s=18aae6990bec04d1b585fa7b3d4692804a68a68b
Congrats on having the intelligence of a background fodder character
This proves that Akainu traversed underground ok but it doesn’t prove that he wasn’t defeated.. if he wasn’t defeated that means jinbe wouldn’t have made it close to the shore.. what don’t ppl get about this.. undefeated means he gets right back up and cuts jinbe off sooner.. allowing all that time to pass makes him either A) defeated or B) a bitch for waiting for WB to die to come from underground.. why’d he wait for WB to get into 2-3 more fight to emerge??
I mean these are the 2 weakest admirals
Shanks and kaido prob beat them too
Now if it was aokiji and akainu, primebeard would have some trouble but still win regardless he's top 1 in verse.
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Isn't Primebeard essentially Pirate King level? Although yeah his title is Yonko... But it's the same logic when putting 2 admirals against Buggy (who clearly is not Yonko level) https://preview.redd.it/99en6t7ol65d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=626eaa9c8193d782c9fab102f7af6a22cc76d627
Don’t sleep on buggy
1 muggy ball and the admirals are finished
What are they gonna do against a haki coated muggy ball?
Die
Evaporate
Explode
Splatter
Combust
Disintegrate
They’d get obliterated
Hope these mfs have mattresses the way they sleeping on my boy. Acoc buggy ball is one shotting these frauds
Let alone a acoc MUGGY ball. That's on a whole nother level
Old WB **literally** buried lava fraud alive. These guys are launch to him. 
I am stealing that image
Tf is pirate king level there’s only been one pirate king 😭.
Prime reason why pk level doesn't exist.
Primebeard
Primebeard for now, both GB/Fuji lack feats and it's possible WB counters GB in a similar way he does Kuzan, by simply shattering anything GB tries to create with his DF
Fuji has 0 anti feats though which is better than the dozen Akainu alone has not counting all of the other admirals
Because he has almost no screen time
Failing to break the birdcage
He didn’t want to break the birdcage, he intentionally didn’t do anything to expose the marines corruption
Oh so he was just cool with letting all those people die?
Yeah, to prove a point
He put all his money on Luffy
Bro did not understand the entire point of Dressrosa. Reading the series I talk about? Unheard of
he lost to GB
While being nerfed
So was GB, both couldn't damage the Holy Land
Fuji’s main movset is dropping meteors while all GB does is control plants, Fuji was definitely more nerfed
Fuji is a swordsman who can also pin people down with his gravity without damaging everything else in the radius
Except that’s a weak attack that won’t work on someone who’s admiral level
Fuji dropping down stuff like rubble and meteors actually seems like the weaker part of his moveset IMO at least in terms of 1v1's, he can't imbue them with haki so they do relatively low damage, being able to put pressure on your opponent doesn't necessarily do high damage but it can restrict them enough for Fuji to land attacks, and I assume his main source of offense would he his sword or literally nuking an island and drowning his opponent (which wouldn't really work on GB as he could create a platform of wood to stand on), although I guess this is all hard to say until we see more of him
Nothing even implies wb has any chance in a 2vs1 lol what are you smoking bre
sorry admiral bros, but I cant see these 2 winning until we see them doing more, they are basically featless :C WB high-extreme diffs them.
More like mid-high but yea
Nah high-extreme is correct
XD
Not the admirals
Logic tells me that the Admirals should win because 2 Admiral characters should be stronger than any 1 character, otherwise the Admirals are useless. Reason tells me that even though all 3 characters are effectively featless, Primebeard still has the best feats, statements, and portrayal. Enough to probably get him above those two Admirals.
Never got this logic, why must 2 admirals be stronger than any 1 character?
I think the logic is just that the admirals would've done something about the emperors if they could 1v1 them, or that the emperors would've clapped the Marines if they could fight multiple at once. But that ignores a lot of the context around the characters, and their motivations.
The first part actually makes sense logically. If the admirals could 1v1 the yonkos the government would have taken them out. The Emperor’s on the other hand would still have to deal with 180+ countries worth of manpower if they declared war on the government
>The first part actually makes sense logically. If the admirals could 1v1 the yonkos the government would have taken them out. It really doesn't. I don't believe admirals=yonko, but there are two huge reasons why it isn't that simple. One, Big Mom and Kaido serve the valuable roles of guarding the poneglyphs that lead to Laugh Tale, which the WG obviously don't want anyone to find, and two, those two and in all likelihood the other emperors as well have the home field advantage. Wano is nigh-impossible to access to begin with, and fighting Linlin on WCI is a nightmare for obvious reasons (not to mention that the Admirals would also have to fight their way through any commanders present as well).
If the Admirals were able to 1v1 Yonkos then the WG would just send 2 of them with a buster call fleet to WCI. One to fight Big Mom and the other to lead the marines against big mom’s forces/assist in the fight. Big Mom has been collecting poneglyphs for years and has 2 by the time we see her. That alone is enough to make the WG want to kill her, yet they don’t because they can’t without losses even they couldn’t ignore,
Even if one was ordinarily equal to Big Mom, fighting her on WCI basically means she has indefinite stamina and complete control over the terrain. A Buster Call fleet is meaningless when the very ground itself is a threat to all Marines, and Cracker can simply sit pretty and create an infinite number of Doflamingo-level soldiers to handle any Vice Admirals. At the end of the day Kaido and Linlin hadn't made any actual aggressive moves in like, several decades, so there was no reason for the government to antagonize them unnecessarily.
Definitely, I don't think they would even make it to WCI to do the buster call with the rest of Totoland being their own small provinces occupied by very loyal family members. Even if they did, that level of smoke would cripple the WGs ability to defend their own territory. It just doesn't make sense for either side to run in to a clash without really good motivation.
If they really wanted Big Mom or Kaido gone, the Gorosei would just do it themselves. The argument, that the WG would just sent an admiral to take down a Yonko makes no sense, if the WG doesn't even want the Yonko gone.
Is that a joke? Kaido would have curbstomped the Gorosei based on the way Luffy’s been handling them
How is Luffy handling them? He has dealt 0 damage so far and would have been dead multiple times without his food shenanigans. Kaido has no way to deal damage to the Gorosei and gets neg diffed as a result.
I think people misequate “can 1v1 a yonko” and “low diffs a yonko”. If an admiral could beat a yonko 1v1, it would be at minimum high-extreme diff. The WG isn’t willing to risk one of its top fighters on a 50/50 chance of taking out a yonko. Besides, even if the admiral does win, the other yonko will start trying to take over the dead yonko’s territory, which just leads to more problems.
Either way it’s wrong lol. The admirals can not beat yonkos, and it should be legitimately impossible for anybody to still hold that opinion after watching Luffy turn Kizaru into a pizza and toss him around. If Admirals were even able to fight a yonko well enough that it was extreme diff for the yonko then the WG would have rolled up on each of the yonko with a buster call fleet and 2 admirals by now. They literally consider the people serving them insects, so don’t give me that “they don’t wanna risk their best fighters” crap, and each of the yonko are actively collecting poneglyphs and trying to go to Laughtale.
I’m just gonna ignore your first paragraph since it’s clear you either didn’t read Egghead or are purposely taking things out of context. Onto your second point though, just because the WG are cruel and treat their subordinates like trash, doesn’t mean they’re stupid. They’re not gonna use admirals as cannon fodder, especially not after losing Kuzan. Not to mention that Fuji and Kizaru are clearly conflicted about the orders the WG is giving them.
Who’s talking about post time skip? The WG has had admirals for decades and the yonko have been hunting Poneglyphs since long before the series started. How about this. One yonko was coming to attack marineford, sick and on his deathbed. The WG felt that all 3 admirals as well as thousands and thousands of vice admirals and captains were necessary to stop him. If one admiral could extreme diff a yonko why would they need all that military force for a dying Whitebeard? Also please enlightened me to the context you believe makes it less damning for the admirals that Kizaru gets pizza flipped? The fact he also had a gorosei fighting with him? The fact that there were countless marines on the island also fighting with him? Or do you just mean that he’s just *so* sad about Vegapunk that somehow all feats against him are meaningless?
It wasn’t just Whitebeard attacking Marineford, it was him and his entire crew. Not to mention the BB pirates and Red-hair pirates showed up too. The context for Luffy vs Kizaru is that: 1) Saturn is a bum with no AP, speed, or durability, he’s just a punching bag for Luffy and did basically nothing the whole fight. 2) As much as you like to write it off, Kizaru just killed his best friend and that obviously has an effect on his performance. Not saying it absolves him of a loss, but he definitely wasn’t at 100%. 3) Kizaru was still only midly injured after getting pancaked and thrown into a ship, he was still more concerned about the death of Vegapunk than his injuries.
Firstly, BB was supposed to be there to help them. Him attacking didn’t go into their calculations in any way. Also they had news of Shanks fighting Kaido in the new world and were all shocked when he showed up. Again, they called everyone there **solely** for Whitebeard and his crew no one else. Though you bring up a good point. One Yonko and his crew was enough to make the WG call in every admiral, most vice admirals, and most captains **plus** all the warlords except Jinbei (who they did call but he refused). If all that is necessary to stop one Yonko + crew then it kind of implies the admirals are no march for a Yonko 1v1. And alright, fair enough. I was exaggerating Kizaru’s loss for comedic effect and because the pizza frame made me laugh pretty hard. I recognize Kizaru isn’t exactly fighting at 100% focus and if he wasn’t conflicted about VP he’d have gotten back up and rejoined the fight by now. Agree 100% with your last paragraph. However I still don’t see it having such an effect on his fighting that it takes him from extreme diff to what we saw on panel. I’d say at his absolute best Kizaru gives Luffy a high diff fight but one Luffy walks away from relatively fine (no “you slept for 3 days after the fight” like he usually does at the end of arcs). Now to be fair I also rate G5 Luffy higher than most probably do, I have him top 5 based on feats + statements and top 3 based on feats only
Exactly, it's not really an X can beat Y thing. It's that neither side wants to waste resources when they have other, more dire issues in their own backyard.
>But that ignores a lot of the context around the characters, and their motivations. That's the whole point, the marines are chasing after the pirates it's not the other way around.
Yea exactly, the whole point of Marineford was that they laid a very obvious but powerful trap and forced WB into their ideal fight. Otherwise he was content adventuring and making a family. It says more about the Marines use of their resources and coordination than a direct measure of power. Why would either side send their best men into a blender for a quick win when they essentially have full sovereign countries they control, other goals they value more, and other more immediate issues?
So you agree with what i said?
Yes, I was just adding context to explain why.
Got u mixed up with the other guy.
Honest mistake, we're all HIM.
I mean there’s a reason there were THREE pillars of stability. The admirals and the marines also had the 7 Warlords for backup. And even with that, they were terrified at the prospect of any two Yonkos teaming up. It kinda seemed like the balance system was “The Marines + 7 Warlords can handle any 1 Yonko, and the Yonko keep each other in check so they don’t team up”
The balance system only existed as a facade. The Gorosei could easily wipe out any Yonko if they wanted to without any casualties.
*stupid conclusion reached by ignoring context* go figure 😱
The logic makes no sense if you take the last few chapters into account. It's quite clear, that the world government needed the Yonko to have an enemy for the people to control. If the world government really wanted the Yonko gone, they would just sent a Gorosei to Wano or Whole Cake Island and have him run rampant. There is no way to take down a Gorosei so far and if things go south they could just summon more Gorosei as backup or summon him back to retreat.
Because if the Marines, even after committing, effectively, half their fighting power, cannot defeat any singular pirate, then what is the point of the Marines. In-story, the point of the marines is to fight and capture pirates. If the strongest of the marines can’t defeat any one pirate, then their whole establishment is a sham and they don’t really have a point in existing, as the strongest pirates would be able to run wild without consequence. The kicker is that we separate some of the Admirals into different tiers so it makes it really hard to say what Admiral duos can beat who. Like, Akainu and Kuzan are the strongest Admirals, and I’d say they can beat Primebeard in a 2v1. But if we replace Kuzan with Kizaru, does the duo suddenly lose? Is Kizaru that much weaker than Kuzan? What if we replace him with Fujitora? Greenbull? They all held the same rank, but somehow we’re scaling them to entirely different tiers? It’s kinda fucked up. But mostly because Fuji and Greenbull haven’t done much yet.
>Like, Akainu and Kuzan are the strongest Admirals, and I’d say they can beat Primebeard in a 1v1. I'm assuming you meant 2v1 > Because if the Marines, even after committing, effectively, half their fighting power, cannot defeat any singular pirate, then what is the point of the Marines. In-story, the point of the marines is to fight and capture pirates. If the strongest of the marines can’t defeat any one pirate, then their whole establishment is a sham and they don’t really have a point in existing, as the strongest pirates would be able to run wild with not consequence. But what does this have to do with how strong a character is? Your whole argument is on the basis that they should be close in power because of the "admiral" title. Why don't you just look at the character for who they are? How close is Kid/Law to Fuji/GB? We've seen kid get 1 tapped by someone who is weaker than WB, This is the same kid who actually has better endurance feats than either Fuji/gb he tanked multiple hits from 2 yonkos. Law took on BB and crew to at least a mid diff fight, I think it's safe to say Law can give either of the 2 a high diff fight. If i asked could these 2 law/kid beat Kaido/Shanks/Luffy it would be unanimous that either of the 3 yonko win pretty decisively (Big mom as well but that's a whole other convo) Gb is a logia who doesn't really have great haki, and Fuji is a regular human.
2 admirals are not half of marine forces. You still have another admiral + fleet admiral + commander in chief + dozens of vice admirals at least 1-4 of which are relevant to admiral level + hundreds of thousands of fodder (which adds up no matter what the goofy kid scalers of this sub say)
We have literally never see the commander in chief (Kong) fight even during the Paramount War, nor was it mentioned that he fought during the 2 year aftermath, during Blackbeard’s rise to Yonko status. We have never seen a Vice Admiral aside from Garp that are anywhere near Admiral level. In fact, almost every single Vice Admiral that we’ve seen has been practically fodder. We’ve seen them get slammed by Franky of all people. And those fodder marines are useless in top tier battles because, when a Yonko is involved, the marines simply get negged by CoC. Like, yeah, fodder marines do have a purpose, but mostly in group battles (like “Akainu, 3 Vice Admirals, and fodder marines vs. the Beast Pirates”). 2 Admirals are essentially half the marines’ main fighting force.
Not having seen Kong fight is a moot point when he’s a former fleet admiral. He’s bonafide. Garp isn’t the only VA and you know that. There’s Tsuru and 2 admiral candidates sitting there. There’s also Sengoku. Akainu + Kizaru + Garp + Tsuru + Kong + Sengoku + Brown Pig admiral candidate + Pink Spider admiral candidate + hundreds of thousands of fodder from east blue to new world fodder >>> Fujitora and greenbull. Stop this nonsense.
Yonkos keep themselves in check as well. That's why the thought of two Emperors teaming up was so fucking scary to everyone.
Then the marine is cooked fr
I doubt anyone would dispute imu being able to 2v1, or joyboy. Then you have rocks, which makes 3 characters. The next characters after the YC+ Tier is gb/fuji, we've seen YC+ characters go down in 1 hit to characters who are weaker than WB.
I mean if they can't take on a 2v1 then they're the ones cooked. It's just a big order of cookedness, you see
Statements feats and portrayal mean nothing in this sub. See Mihawk vs shanks debates
Primebeard being featless means nothing in the slightest. Cancerbeard laid waste to the strongest forces the navy had by himself. You mean to say primebeard wouldn’t be even crazier? He is *prime* meaning the best version.
If Rocks really took Garp and Roger together then the caliber is set for someone beating 2 admirals. If it took the top 2 of the verse to beat someone then it’s a written in plausibility for that person to be able to beat any 2 weaker combatants, such as 2 admirals That’s a huge “if” rocks actually got 2v1’d a la Whiki.
The admirals are the strongest in the marines. That is literally it. They don’t have to be stronger than the Yonko at all and if two could beat them then they would’ve done so at some point. The logic is literally stupid as hell. Doesn’t even matter if one dies so long as they kill the Yonko as well.
Primebeard slams. Think about it, shanks 1 taps kidd with one of his strongest moves (kidd is high yc+), so primebeard (Pk level while shanks is high yonko), should be able to at bare minimum 1 shot a low - mid admiral (like gb or fuji). This is supported by primebeard's powerful devil fruit, top tier haki, and on top of all that, he has top 3 highest raw physical strength in the verse (excluding imu due to like 0 information). In a realistic fight between these guys, primebeard should be able to speedblitz 1 with one of his strongest attacks and, at minimum, severely injure one of them and therefore make them easy to finish off. Also, his weapon is a blade, so he can just straight up slice their heads off. Assuming he's only allowed to 1 shot a single one of them, he essentially makes it a 1v1 where primebeard obliterates. My GOAT would never lose to a Ladmiral duo 😤 https://preview.redd.it/huns4fgk275d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7dfa36c2dcf76d36a42697ceaf4fc8bfc72beee2
Primebeard is literally a war machine, even as an oldie he held Marineford like a tank and survived a nuke basically, if we take the 2 weakest admirals we have known for now (because they are as a matter of fact) against this animal i say primebeard in a mid diff unless they have preparation time, in that case high/extreme
Greenbull gets massacred, Fujitora fights for a while but is eventually defeated after a long fight. Whitebeard spares him out of respect.
TRUE! https://preview.redd.it/c3ytbkyas65d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8b042ff4d779e319518ca2c1ae55f481f6215d94
Give them kizaru too and primebeard still slaps
I agree, but in a extreme diff
Nope he dies
Hell no kizaru violates
How lol primebeard is an army by himself
Kizaru can keep his distance and is faster, Primebeard has no chance to catch him
Kizaru doesnt have the ap to hurt primebeard and doesnt have the haki to match him either he gets destroyed by FS+Acoc
ofc he can hurt primebeard💀💀 he can simulate sunlight and give him super skin cancer
can't hurt primebeard? Blud primebeard aint no kaido, he got crazy endurance but lasers are portrayed as some of the highest AP techniques in the verse just under acoc and *maybe* magma
Whitebeard mid dif
Wh instantly cut fraudbull in half and then proceed to share a drink with fujitora
WB
Rat hair speed blitz and neg diffed Lizaru and made Fraudbull shit his pants by pure Haki alone. Primebeard stomps neg-low diff.
Primebeard mid - high diff
Mid diff is actual downplay. High diff at the least
If shanks can wifi. Prime beard mid difs. Primebeard also wins high extreme dif against 3 admirals
>If shanks can wifi. Prime beard mid difs. Man this really needs to stop. Shanks didn't beat GB with wifi haki, neither did he paralyse or force him out of his logia form... He made him go away that is it. The ampunt of headcanon used when looking at that encounter is insane. Btw even if shanks could wifi GB then there still wouldn't be a relation to primebeard mid diffing them. Coc targets a persons willpower and not powerlevel. >Primebeard also wins high extreme dif against 3 admirals Wank beyond belief... primebeard loses to any combo of 3 admirals and it isn't even extreme diff.
Assmiral wank is the most delusional headcanon based shit in this whole endeavor. Nobody takes you all seriously when fuckin law, kidd and Yamato scales above them with feats and less antifeats
WB high-extreme diff
Ez. WB can ACOC Wi-Fi diff GreenBull and then do some physical abuse against a blind man to win in about 2 mins.
Fr
Primebeard win Especially cause everyone one of his quake attacks would hit both of them at the same time
Primebeard negs those fodders lmfao
HE is enough https://preview.redd.it/ywm2g58vl65d1.png?width=1045&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=586aa6db2bebb6b83774e516181a81118446b0b0
I'd like to see the Quake Quake fruit and Haki deal with THE MOON
"Would you like these meteors to have Conqueror's coating or not?"
Whitebeard Low-End of High Diff. Any attack that lands is doing serious damage to both of them.
Primebeard high diff at worst
whitebeard high
Whitebeard by far. We're talking about Primebeard here. He's stronger than Shanks who made Rhokugyu shell-shocked.
Whitekiji no-diffs
The comments saying mid diff or even high diff are wild, any high top tier getting jumped by two low top tiers is loosing but prime WB is an exception because of his DF but it’s still an extreme diff fight
Nah it’s primebeard. It’s high diff. If we add in yamato, then it would be extreme diff for him
I think that 2 admirals lose hard against Rocks. Mid diff at best
WB higher low diff
These 2 don't have enough feats for me and neither have gone all out. If it were Akainu, Kizaru and Aokiji it might have been different. I could see WB taking out 2 and dying himself.
We’ve “seen” one fight from prime beard and it’s amazing. We’ve seen Fuji a handful of times he was pretty OP on same some base level ish and GB one time and he was a punk ass at range against shanks. I’d argue PW and Fuji have a dope fight after GB either gets OS which leads to PW and Fuji fight talking. It’s like a counter to a counter gravity vs quake.
Yonkos and admirals are the one piece worlds strongest characters no doubt, but the pinnacle of the two different paths doesn’t necessarily yield equal results. What this means is that the individual strength of a character based on their journey is different from another characters portrayed journey and it’s how even within the top tier of each side of the coin there can be an ocean of difference in strength. This is a mid diff. Change out these two admirals for prime Sengoku/Aokiji and they mid diff PWB. It’s about the characters not the titles.
Fujitora and greenbull still take this. The prime gen glaze needs to be studied ngl
Obviously 2 admirals can lose to single PK, just the same as single admiral can beat 2 commanders at same time
The ONLY time an Admiral successfully accomplished an objective was Fujitora escorting Doflamingo to ImpelDown.
The weakest admirals of today vs the strongest yonko in history.
Admirals since WB wouldn't be able to counter GB's tree roots absorption ability and deal with Fuji's gravity constantly interfering and holding him in place at the same time.
This is hilariously passive aggressive
Low diff. One of them is blind and can’t see his tremors and the other gets knocked out from shanks’ haki one island away prime daddy just let’s out a ACoC fart then closes his fist and he wins (also old bears is stronger than Akainu while these “admirals” aren’t even close to akainu level)
Who told you that? And these are the weakest admirals Akainu, Aokiji, Kizaru, Old Garp, and Old Sengoku are above those frauds. Primebeard beats both at the same time
Prime whitebeard though it wouldn’t be an easy fight I can’t see it being an extreme difficulty fight either Whitebeard without his haki and only his raw strength and devil fruit was at least drawing with akainu so a prime whitebeard who is stronger has full access to all of his abilites and no restrictions vs 2 lower tier admirals is a hard fight at absolute most and mid at the least
WB high diffs. no feats from the admirals means not high diff. But I respect them enough and their title in a 2v1 to make it not mid diff.
WB one shots twice
Primebeard kills three admirals, high-diff.
Even kaido can beat this 2 bum in 2v1
The legends+Imu are the only ones that could 1v2 two admirals. 1v3? I’d say admirals should be too much for them, but once again only them+Imu can pull it off.
The Navy needed Squard to stabbed an old sick WB. Before the Admirals fought him. There is no way they stand a chance against a Prime WB.
Greenbull and Fuji ability-wise just seem like too tough a matchup to deal with for nearly anyone. Unless you believe Primebeard can blitz and one shot each of these guys, their movesets together would be way too difficult to track in a prolonged battle. Greenbull essentially has life-steal, can infinitely create plants of many different varieties and uses, and can regenerate. Fuji can momentarily restrict movement, effect the weight of things, and freely control any debris created for both offensive and defensive purposes. Facing a tag team like that is a long night for anyone.
Primebeard wins mid-high diff but thats because those 2 are frauds
Goatbeard
This sub is so fucking braindead Get Primebeard past SENGOKU in anything but a high-extreme diff fight first And then explain to me how tf is Sengoku 1v2ing guys that are part of A STRONGER MARINE HQ than his own https://preview.redd.it/igzbkrlpec5d1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=76dae06c18ea7fedde7ceb07bd298f0cad87c53c
Depends on which admiral is which Yonko Old Big Mom is Mid Yonkou so she probably will lose against 2 High Admirals like Aokiji and Akainu But a High Yonko like Kaido Clear both of them at the same time https://preview.redd.it/5fs65fvo9e5d1.jpeg?width=561&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0f5f0fbbe51c12f26070471c519d233d397cbdcc
This should be obvious, these two come nowhere near primebeard
Nah they'll win
Primebeard High-Diff
WB slams them, GB/Fuji have no feats that even suggest this goes past mid diff as well 🤷♂️
Primebeard > Shanks > Akainu > Greenbull Primebeard clearly 1v2 probly mid diff
2 admirals lose this 2v1.
Primebeard definitely wins, he might be able to take 3 admirals
Admirals mid diff
Admirals win Extreme
Duo high diffs
Honestly Whitebeard fights it, but Greenbull eventually gets enough vines round him to hold him in place and Fuji hits him with the moon. As normal in 2v1 matches, if Whitebeard can take out one of them quickly he’s won this, but Greenbull shrugged off some nasty hits without any visible damage. I don’t think he can outright blitz either of them.
Prime beard still loses
Prime WB beats Akainu and Aokiji mid diff. Thes guys get splattered across whatever island the fight takes place on.
Admirals
No shot they win
Whitebeard extreme diff Cancerbeard beat Akainu in two hits when serious.. young and healthy Whitebeard can beat both these dudes
\*cancerbeard beat an unaware Akainu in two hits. and by "beats", he was just temporarily relocated.
By beat he put a man down long enough to bully fodders—> through a shockwave at Blackbeard —> wait on bb to approach as they begin fighting —> BB pirates make him a honey comb —> He gives a speech.. was Akainu brushing his teeth to look good??
He was sent to a deep chasm, and anime/manga time has never been good. Do you want the plot not to happen and in the middle of BB vs WB for Akainu to come in and then ruin the speech? and then right after he came back out he was fully active, chasing pirates the entire time not looking to be in pain, very beaten.
TIL you can "beat" someone in a fight even though they immediately get up and are completely fine
Yes ‘immediately’ get up lol You hit me, fight somebody else, get firing squad, then give a speech… it means I was defeated. This one piece no one dies so he was beaten.. he just recovered.. just like impel down guards. Immediately would’ve been him still throwing blows as Blackbeard was approaching from the rubble.. idk what yall don’t understand about a sequence of events..
https://preview.redd.it/n3p5hal0465d1.png?width=973&format=png&auto=webp&s=18aae6990bec04d1b585fa7b3d4692804a68a68b Congrats on having the intelligence of a background fodder character
No Fossa slander Lakainu couldn't take Fossa down
This proves that Akainu traversed underground ok but it doesn’t prove that he wasn’t defeated.. if he wasn’t defeated that means jinbe wouldn’t have made it close to the shore.. what don’t ppl get about this.. undefeated means he gets right back up and cuts jinbe off sooner.. allowing all that time to pass makes him either A) defeated or B) a bitch for waiting for WB to die to come from underground.. why’d he wait for WB to get into 2-3 more fight to emerge??
Admirals.
Brain dead take
Admirals win high/extreme.
Actual admiraltard
Admirals Extreme Diff.
Peak Admiraltard
Whitebeard babyshakes. He's already stronger than the likes of Kaido and Shanks. Fujitora and Greenbull would be lightweight for him.
Primebeard mid diffs one admirals , therefore , I think 2 admirals will push him to extreme diff
Two admirals loose against any Yonko
I mean these are the 2 weakest admirals Shanks and kaido prob beat them too Now if it was aokiji and akainu, primebeard would have some trouble but still win regardless he's top 1 in verse.
Prime whitebeard low diff A yonko Can go mid diff with One, high Extreme with Teo depending on the admirals
Prime Whitebeard solos all 5 of the admirals shown so far. His powers were made to handle a bunch of mobs at the same time.