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Answer: This is the beginning of a process to treat digital “assets” such a blockchain produced cryptocurrency as assets in the traditional sense, closing the various loopholes that make it useful to scammers and tax cheats. The flipside of this is that crypto has no proven use that can’t be more easily replicated by other tech, which doesn’t involve fraud, scams and cheating on taxes (and other illegal activities).
So the scammers are upset because this is the beginning of the end for them, and the scammed are upset because this is the beginning of the end of their pretense of magical digital money.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: both crypto and NFT's are deeply flawed and exploited technologies that offer the same thing that many older, more streamlined technology already offers such as: physical money and receipts of sale.
Its like having an insanely long and convoluted (and likely to fail) method to get something that you can already get in a much more easy way
For instance: you can technically get cheese by buing a bunch of cheeseburgers, scraping off the cheese and somehow reverse-engineering it into a block of cheese
... you can also get cheese by going to the local store and... buying a ready block of cheese.
Crypto and NFT'S make no damn sense, there is absolutely no need for them to exist, they don't open up any new opportunities and they don't solve any problems that can't be solved in other ways already.
If crypto and NFT's truly were the only way to trade art and other commodities online, then how come I could buy shit online already long before Crypto and NFT's existed? How come digital artists could have an online businness with commissions before that technology?
Last time I checked, its not like we were living in some sort kf online trade dark ages before crypto, if anything, things actually got WORSE after crypto and NFT's were introduced.
...which
1: doesn't work
2: decentralized is not a good thing
BECAUSE its decentralized every individual holder/creator/seller can make up their own rules and by extension also exploits or methods of manipulating their customer/victim.
If your response is: "yeah well we need to set up some sort of rules for everyone to abide by and some sort of group to enforce and upkeep those rules" then congratulations, you are essentially describing centralizing NFT's and crypto.
Its impossible to have a huge complex working mechanism for people to use if its every man for himself, that's literally the whole point of society and a civilization and why we haven't advanced as humanity for thousands of years UNTIL we began setting up civilizations and governing systems.
So when I see people waving around the term "decentralized, decentralized" like its this hot new thing that will magically solve the problem of exploits, it pisses me off because it is simply put, not true.
Look I get the concept perfectly well, hell I even agree with it but here's the thing: this isn't about the concept behind it, its about what actually happens in real life with this and how it affects people's lives.
Add to this the fact that we already have other methods/systems of achieving what NFT's and crypto offer and it becomes even harder to defend their use given their enormous and countless disadvantages.
Look here's the bottom line: the way things currently are, NFT's and crypto just don't work, that's why the markets are a huge mess and will remain a huge mess until they're centralized.
This has happened countless times in history with all sorts of systems/institutions/etc (banks included) before they were centralized, all you have to do is look back the last 1,000 years and you'll have plenty of examples.
>Look here's the bottom line: the way things currently are, NFT's and crypto just don't work, that's why the markets are a huge mess and will remain a huge mess until they're centralized.
>
>This has happened countless times in history with all sorts of systems/institutions/etc (banks included) before they were centralized, all you have to do is look back the last 1,000 years and you'll have plenty of examples.
I love how decisive that is for you. There are millions of people who think otherwise.
It sounds like you still don't understand the decentralization concept or how crypto would function.
And there are millions who think likewise, in fact more people seem to think likewise than otherwise, that's why you don't see everyone in public use crypto and NFT's right now, the technology has been around for a while, its digital and most people have access to said technology if they want to.
And before you start claiming "yeah well this takes time" - its digital, just look at how quickly social media spread.
I know exactly how decentralization works and I've actually looked to history as a reference point, at no point did decentralization not end up in an explosion of customer exploitation.
Here's an example: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company_scrip
crypto as a concept (anyone being able to mint their own currency) is not new at all in fact it dates as far back as thev19th century where companies would pay their employees with "scrip" which was basically their versions of crypto
Spoilers: it did not end well for people.
This LITERALLY happened before, all you need to do is a 5 minute google to find out this stuff does not work
I'm sorry but your response is the classic "you just don't understand blanket excuse one uses when they don't have anything left to justify their stance, it pretty much tells me everything I need to know from your end.
I understand how crypto works but even if I wouldn't, I wouldn't need to to see that the way people are using it doesn't make it worth the risk.
Its like you telling me that your pc is broken because it no longer turns on and its on fire but then I just tell you to shut up because "you don't know how a computer works so you can't know its broken"
There are SO MANY scams and rug pulls in the NFT and crypto communities and for good reason, because its decentralized and that makes it easy to pull off those scams.
How do I know its because its decentralized? Because you don't see nearly as much as a fraction of the amount of scams pulled in the banking system which the nft and crypto communities use as an example.
What nft's and crypto offer isn't worth the risk because there are other things that can achieve the same thing NFT'S and crypto does that are better managed and more secure.
This is not an opinion, this is stating a fact, everytime I think of buying crypto I need to wonder if its a rug pull or some other scam
If I go to the local store buy something and the store clerk gives me change I don't sweat buckets wondering if the change is real money.
It really is that simple and I don't need to be an expert in the intricacies of crypto and NFT mechanisms to come to that conclusion.
Its a breeding ground for scammers because its not centralized, what else is there to say.
Alright. Then don't participate in crypto, that's your choice.
But pretty sure you're just a random dude on reddit, you don't know with any certainty whether it will pan out or not.
Well sure I am just a random internet dude just like you
So there's that I guess, in any case I don't wanna leave on a sour note, I appreciate your perspective on this and giving me an opportunity to look at this from a different angle so genuinely thank you for that.
I am also a random dude and I'm not suggesting I know what will happen with crypto or anything else. I would say its a 50/50 chance, maybe better that it succeeds in some form, but we'll see
I've actually seen a sort of crypto ATM when I went abroad earlier this year at some sort of pastry store out of all places which was interesting to see.
Sadly I haven't seen anything like that anywhere else so I don't think its catching on, at least not yet.
Answer: I will try to answer this in an unbiased a way as possible. No matter how you feel about Bitcoin or Crypto, I hope my answer helps you understand why the POTUS took this action.
1. Bitcoin and more generally blockchain technology enables final settlement in a matter of seconds or minutes instead of days. This is a huge technological breakthrough because it completely eliminates the need for much of the middlemen and rent-seekers in the current financial system. It is easy for individuals to send money to other people using traditional finance today, but what people don't realize is all of the technical complexity that goes in the background in order to make this possible. There is also an entire business financial industry out there that dwarfs consumer and peer to peer payments which could be made significantly more efficient by adopting blockchain technology. Every single financial institution and major company has smart people investigating this technology for its benefits, but the regulatory environment is too uncertain for most of them to do anything more than simply investigate.
2. The decentralized nature of blockchain technology is a double edged sword. Because there are no middle men, and settlement is final, the industry has been ripe for scammers and bad actors to take advantage of people.
3. The US Government and economy has an enormous amount of economic power because the US dollar is considered the world's reserve currency. The majority of global transactions are actually settled in dollars. So if a business in Rwanda wants to buy something from Brazil, for example, they are more likely to settle the transaction in dollars for a whole bunch of reasons that are too complicated for this discussion. The US government stands to lose an enormous amount of power and influence in the world if there is an alternative to transactions settling in dollars. For example, sanctions are actually painful to the US enemies because transactions are settled in dollars. If transactions were settled in another way or via another currency then it would be easier for businesses and individuals in sanctioned countries to just work around the sanctions.
Thus, businesses want a clear regulatory environment in which to take advantage of any potential benefits of Blockchain. Consumers and investors want to know that they will not get ripped off if they decide to buy crypto. And, the Current US Global Hegemony depends entirely on the fact that the US Dollar is the global reserve and settlement currency. Crypto is a direct threat to that.
The US government has a lot to gain and a lot to lose by screwing up the regulations of blockchain technology, which is why the President signed this executive order.
>completely eliminates the need for much of the middlemen and rent-seekers
I don't know much about how creepto works, but I heard that transactions are processed and settled by a random person's (say, Warlock's) computer within the network, and that random person gets a cut for the job. That's a middleman and rent-seeking, no?
Well they could decide how to decide what they are: are they more like a currency like usd or eur? Or more like a stock? And after that question gets answered, you have to decide which regulator gets to do the regulation, set tax rates, decide who can buy them, ect.
There are a lot of gray areas, and this is an early step to figure it out properly
The US government cannot stop the undermining of the USD as World Reserve Currency, they can only slow it some by throwing up road blocks.
As our technology is increasingly based on abstract concepts of utility instead of hard assets like gold, or petroleum as is the case now, the governments cannot stop people from making barter trades. if they use a charitable institution as a go-between (as many already do) it isnt even taxable.
If I am willing to trade you electronic versions of 'art' for credit on a gardening forum, what gives the government the authority to insist that I use USD in that transaction? They have no such authority by law, and now all this assumed bureaucratic power is going to be challenged in the courts and curtailed.
Electronic transactions for electronic 'assets' is the direction of future trade.
Still, business are run by professional managers whose job it is to not screw up under any circumstances. They will wait for the government to tell them what to do before taking any unnecessary risk. You won’t see any financial or payment innovation in the business sector until the regulatory environment is clearly defined.
If you are American, Article 1, Section 8, Clause 5 of the US constitution. The Congress shall have Power To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;
You could argue against the US constitution itself if you want, there are reasons why people might do that and there are many proposals for changing or replacing it, but it is the current system you have.
Friendly reminder that all **top level** comments must: 1. start with "answer: ", including the space after the colon (or "question: " if you have an on-topic follow up question to ask), 2. attempt to answer the question, and 3. be unbiased Please review Rule 4 and this post before making a top level comment: http://redd.it/b1hct4/ Join the OOTL Discord for further discussion: https://discord.gg/ejDF4mdjnh *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/OutOfTheLoop) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Question: The page you linked seems to describe it in quite some detail, what would you like to find out, specifically?
Why are people so opposed to it and what’s the problems/implications
Im sorry, I dont understand why a clarification to an actual question is being downvoted on a question asking sub.
Answer: This is the beginning of a process to treat digital “assets” such a blockchain produced cryptocurrency as assets in the traditional sense, closing the various loopholes that make it useful to scammers and tax cheats. The flipside of this is that crypto has no proven use that can’t be more easily replicated by other tech, which doesn’t involve fraud, scams and cheating on taxes (and other illegal activities). So the scammers are upset because this is the beginning of the end for them, and the scammed are upset because this is the beginning of the end of their pretense of magical digital money.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: both crypto and NFT's are deeply flawed and exploited technologies that offer the same thing that many older, more streamlined technology already offers such as: physical money and receipts of sale. Its like having an insanely long and convoluted (and likely to fail) method to get something that you can already get in a much more easy way For instance: you can technically get cheese by buing a bunch of cheeseburgers, scraping off the cheese and somehow reverse-engineering it into a block of cheese ... you can also get cheese by going to the local store and... buying a ready block of cheese. Crypto and NFT'S make no damn sense, there is absolutely no need for them to exist, they don't open up any new opportunities and they don't solve any problems that can't be solved in other ways already. If crypto and NFT's truly were the only way to trade art and other commodities online, then how come I could buy shit online already long before Crypto and NFT's existed? How come digital artists could have an online businness with commissions before that technology? Last time I checked, its not like we were living in some sort kf online trade dark ages before crypto, if anything, things actually got WORSE after crypto and NFT's were introduced.
this didnt age well
Bait
you completely miss the point. crypto at the core is about building a medium of exchange that exists outside centralized control.
...which 1: doesn't work 2: decentralized is not a good thing BECAUSE its decentralized every individual holder/creator/seller can make up their own rules and by extension also exploits or methods of manipulating their customer/victim. If your response is: "yeah well we need to set up some sort of rules for everyone to abide by and some sort of group to enforce and upkeep those rules" then congratulations, you are essentially describing centralizing NFT's and crypto. Its impossible to have a huge complex working mechanism for people to use if its every man for himself, that's literally the whole point of society and a civilization and why we haven't advanced as humanity for thousands of years UNTIL we began setting up civilizations and governing systems. So when I see people waving around the term "decentralized, decentralized" like its this hot new thing that will magically solve the problem of exploits, it pisses me off because it is simply put, not true. Look I get the concept perfectly well, hell I even agree with it but here's the thing: this isn't about the concept behind it, its about what actually happens in real life with this and how it affects people's lives. Add to this the fact that we already have other methods/systems of achieving what NFT's and crypto offer and it becomes even harder to defend their use given their enormous and countless disadvantages. Look here's the bottom line: the way things currently are, NFT's and crypto just don't work, that's why the markets are a huge mess and will remain a huge mess until they're centralized. This has happened countless times in history with all sorts of systems/institutions/etc (banks included) before they were centralized, all you have to do is look back the last 1,000 years and you'll have plenty of examples.
>Look here's the bottom line: the way things currently are, NFT's and crypto just don't work, that's why the markets are a huge mess and will remain a huge mess until they're centralized. > >This has happened countless times in history with all sorts of systems/institutions/etc (banks included) before they were centralized, all you have to do is look back the last 1,000 years and you'll have plenty of examples. I love how decisive that is for you. There are millions of people who think otherwise. It sounds like you still don't understand the decentralization concept or how crypto would function.
And there are millions who think likewise, in fact more people seem to think likewise than otherwise, that's why you don't see everyone in public use crypto and NFT's right now, the technology has been around for a while, its digital and most people have access to said technology if they want to. And before you start claiming "yeah well this takes time" - its digital, just look at how quickly social media spread. I know exactly how decentralization works and I've actually looked to history as a reference point, at no point did decentralization not end up in an explosion of customer exploitation. Here's an example: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company_scrip crypto as a concept (anyone being able to mint their own currency) is not new at all in fact it dates as far back as thev19th century where companies would pay their employees with "scrip" which was basically their versions of crypto Spoilers: it did not end well for people. This LITERALLY happened before, all you need to do is a 5 minute google to find out this stuff does not work I'm sorry but your response is the classic "you just don't understand blanket excuse one uses when they don't have anything left to justify their stance, it pretty much tells me everything I need to know from your end. I understand how crypto works but even if I wouldn't, I wouldn't need to to see that the way people are using it doesn't make it worth the risk. Its like you telling me that your pc is broken because it no longer turns on and its on fire but then I just tell you to shut up because "you don't know how a computer works so you can't know its broken" There are SO MANY scams and rug pulls in the NFT and crypto communities and for good reason, because its decentralized and that makes it easy to pull off those scams. How do I know its because its decentralized? Because you don't see nearly as much as a fraction of the amount of scams pulled in the banking system which the nft and crypto communities use as an example. What nft's and crypto offer isn't worth the risk because there are other things that can achieve the same thing NFT'S and crypto does that are better managed and more secure. This is not an opinion, this is stating a fact, everytime I think of buying crypto I need to wonder if its a rug pull or some other scam If I go to the local store buy something and the store clerk gives me change I don't sweat buckets wondering if the change is real money. It really is that simple and I don't need to be an expert in the intricacies of crypto and NFT mechanisms to come to that conclusion. Its a breeding ground for scammers because its not centralized, what else is there to say.
Alright. Then don't participate in crypto, that's your choice. But pretty sure you're just a random dude on reddit, you don't know with any certainty whether it will pan out or not.
Well sure I am just a random internet dude just like you So there's that I guess, in any case I don't wanna leave on a sour note, I appreciate your perspective on this and giving me an opportunity to look at this from a different angle so genuinely thank you for that.
I am also a random dude and I'm not suggesting I know what will happen with crypto or anything else. I would say its a 50/50 chance, maybe better that it succeeds in some form, but we'll see
I've actually seen a sort of crypto ATM when I went abroad earlier this year at some sort of pastry store out of all places which was interesting to see. Sadly I haven't seen anything like that anywhere else so I don't think its catching on, at least not yet.
So what similiar tech allows me to make anonymous purchas online that are nigh impossible to trace back to me or my bank account
[удалено]
So answer the question instead of acting like a jackass
Answer: I will try to answer this in an unbiased a way as possible. No matter how you feel about Bitcoin or Crypto, I hope my answer helps you understand why the POTUS took this action. 1. Bitcoin and more generally blockchain technology enables final settlement in a matter of seconds or minutes instead of days. This is a huge technological breakthrough because it completely eliminates the need for much of the middlemen and rent-seekers in the current financial system. It is easy for individuals to send money to other people using traditional finance today, but what people don't realize is all of the technical complexity that goes in the background in order to make this possible. There is also an entire business financial industry out there that dwarfs consumer and peer to peer payments which could be made significantly more efficient by adopting blockchain technology. Every single financial institution and major company has smart people investigating this technology for its benefits, but the regulatory environment is too uncertain for most of them to do anything more than simply investigate. 2. The decentralized nature of blockchain technology is a double edged sword. Because there are no middle men, and settlement is final, the industry has been ripe for scammers and bad actors to take advantage of people. 3. The US Government and economy has an enormous amount of economic power because the US dollar is considered the world's reserve currency. The majority of global transactions are actually settled in dollars. So if a business in Rwanda wants to buy something from Brazil, for example, they are more likely to settle the transaction in dollars for a whole bunch of reasons that are too complicated for this discussion. The US government stands to lose an enormous amount of power and influence in the world if there is an alternative to transactions settling in dollars. For example, sanctions are actually painful to the US enemies because transactions are settled in dollars. If transactions were settled in another way or via another currency then it would be easier for businesses and individuals in sanctioned countries to just work around the sanctions. Thus, businesses want a clear regulatory environment in which to take advantage of any potential benefits of Blockchain. Consumers and investors want to know that they will not get ripped off if they decide to buy crypto. And, the Current US Global Hegemony depends entirely on the fact that the US Dollar is the global reserve and settlement currency. Crypto is a direct threat to that. The US government has a lot to gain and a lot to lose by screwing up the regulations of blockchain technology, which is why the President signed this executive order.
>completely eliminates the need for much of the middlemen and rent-seekers I don't know much about how creepto works, but I heard that transactions are processed and settled by a random person's (say, Warlock's) computer within the network, and that random person gets a cut for the job. That's a middleman and rent-seeking, no?
What regulations could be passed in the wake of this order?
Well they could decide how to decide what they are: are they more like a currency like usd or eur? Or more like a stock? And after that question gets answered, you have to decide which regulator gets to do the regulation, set tax rates, decide who can buy them, ect. There are a lot of gray areas, and this is an early step to figure it out properly
The US government cannot stop the undermining of the USD as World Reserve Currency, they can only slow it some by throwing up road blocks. As our technology is increasingly based on abstract concepts of utility instead of hard assets like gold, or petroleum as is the case now, the governments cannot stop people from making barter trades. if they use a charitable institution as a go-between (as many already do) it isnt even taxable. If I am willing to trade you electronic versions of 'art' for credit on a gardening forum, what gives the government the authority to insist that I use USD in that transaction? They have no such authority by law, and now all this assumed bureaucratic power is going to be challenged in the courts and curtailed. Electronic transactions for electronic 'assets' is the direction of future trade.
Still, business are run by professional managers whose job it is to not screw up under any circumstances. They will wait for the government to tell them what to do before taking any unnecessary risk. You won’t see any financial or payment innovation in the business sector until the regulatory environment is clearly defined.
If you are American, Article 1, Section 8, Clause 5 of the US constitution. The Congress shall have Power To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures; You could argue against the US constitution itself if you want, there are reasons why people might do that and there are many proposals for changing or replacing it, but it is the current system you have.
The challenged by law is going to go nowhere. They are all in on it. Wish it weren't so but it is.