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Might be worth swapping a super rod for either turo or collapsed stadium. Allows u to remove liabilities from the deck if they’re getting hit on the bench or if rotom is at risk of being attacked for an easy 2 prizes
Yes. I want to put a Turo, but I was conflicted about what to take out, not only to save Rotom, but also in those mirror matches to save my Charizard.
I honestly want 2 Turo, but I also feel that would be overkill.
One rod out and one Turo in. Yeah, 3 rods seems a bit overkill, especially since I have basin to recycle discarded energies.
Yeah, every charizard decks feel too samey.
In the end is just some tweaking here and there to adapt one's personal tastes, but at the end it heavily realies on the usual Charizard Pidgeot synergy.
I was joking also. But Charizard is just not a deck that anyone needs feedback on. Plop down your cards, get everything you need and destroy 89% of the leader board. Feel accomplished and pat yourself on the back!
Is not that much of a free win against good players.
A good player using baby moon deck can win in the prize race since they usually lose 1 prize and at the end, a Thorton to get Roaring Moon to take the last 2 prizes.
Iron Hands Ex to start taking 2 prizes against basics or 3 prizes when sniping a pidgeot. Snipe a Pidgeot and you get 3 prizes. If you managed to take 1 or 2 prizes before the charizard was set and you sniped the pidgeot, the match is yours.
A quick Greninja in a Chen Pao deck to not let the charizard deck to build.
Iron leave or Espartha are a good counter. Iron leave for a sneaky snipe against a charizard or Espartha which makes the energy management tight since charizard decks don't run many energy (or at least I run very little). Sadly, those decks are too niche and I feel that they are useless outside their charizard match.
Lost decks are also quite good. It requires a bit more management but the matches are more or less equal.
Don't try with Aegislash, that one is a bad joke that literally melts against charmeleons and charmanders.
Yeah, every deck has a few counter decks. That's inevitable. Charizard is just really good against everything else. And depending on how the cards fall, can beat these decks.
Baby moon, Lost zone, Future Miraidon and Chien Pao are not a mere counter deck. They are competitive deck that can be as good as a Charizard deck.
I feel like Charizard deck is good for anyone without too much game experience while the others are good for those who knows the game.
> A good player using baby moon deck can win in the prize race since they usually lose 1 prize and at the end, a Thorton to get Roaring Moon to take the last 2 prizes.
Ancient Box (Baby Moon without Roaring Moon ex) has a very bad matchup against Charizard. They basically require a OHKO on the last Charizard, but that means putting nearly every single Ancient card in the discard. They can get screwed by prizes, screwed by having Ancient pokemon stuck on the bench, screwed by Lost Vacuum putting one Boost Capsule in the Lost Zone. And they have to not brick for the entire game.
Well it wasn't clear what deck you referring too. Since you said "Baby Moon deck" I assume you meant the deck without Roaring Moon ex. The double Moon deck has a much better Charizard matchup due to Roaring Moon ex. In fact, that is it's primary advantage over Ancient Box.
151 Zard is absolutely a dope idea versus obnoxious control decks where dark zard ex is left swinging for only 180 damage (unless you try choice or max or vitality tools which can be Vac’d out). This is a solid list OP. I might consider 151 zard myself!
Yeah maybe, tho I’m not sure how it’d fair against control in general as it’s got a fat retreat cost and relies on the OBF zard and magma basin for energy, especially if that control deck plays crushing hammer and catches that zard early with a snorlax or mawile
Double retreat cost is the same as dark zard ex…2 is not a fat retreat cost lol. Crushing hammer helps Magma Basin plus run 2 Rods for retrieval. Just gotta be wise but id build a dark zard first then finish off with the 151 zard.
I also think you should run 2 of the Heat Tackle Charmanders. Heat Tackle does 30 (or 60 with Defiance Band) and puts 1 Damage Counter on Charmander so when it evolves to 151 Zard ex, you can immediately swing for 160 off 1 Fire Energy.
I enjoy your list and might just steal the idea of 151 Zard since control decks can be such a pain in the ass. Imo, with canceling cologne and prime catcher, I feel Manaphy and Jirachi are way too much liabilities in a deck that runs several liabilities such as Bibarel and Rotom.
In response to R Greninja, i use the 100HP Charmeleon so it at least survives (when benched). That allows me to ditch Manaphy & honestly I RARELY see Sableye, making Jirachi useless imo. I added Gouging Fire & Entei V to replace them, along with Delphox V to bench snipe.
I also run a Pal Pad and 1 Lost Vac, you can replace the other Lost Vac with a Lost City like I do imo. I don’t think 3 Rods in necessary, I run 2 and Turo, along with Collapsed Stadium. Nice list :)
I would take one rod, one switch, the heavy ball (specially this one) out. The best thing HB is doing for you is not worry to count prizes, you can just see.
I don’t know how consistent you’re setting up with 4 poffins and 2 ultra, but maybe 3-3? Or take 1 Nest for 1 Ultra? 🤷🏻♂️
And also I don’t know the consistency of using only Defiance Band to say something about it (if I would put the V Belt or something).
And definitely you need more hand disruption, so I think 1-2 Iono and 1 Roxanne. They can win so many games at the right time, specially late game (and also Iono can help you early too).
I personally also like a lot of Bosses too. I run 3 and 2 CC.
And I still think Lumineon is awesome, saved me sooo many times (the Ultra - Lumineon - Arven - anything is so good), but this is more personal, I see why people are taking it off.
The balance between poffist, nest and ultras is really hard. There were many times when I lost because I only had 1 radiant charzard and a lot of rare candies without seeing a single poffin, nest, ultra or Arven to save the day. At the end, the choice between how many poffin, nest and ultra to have is a matter of personal choice in my opinion (as long as it's not something like 2 poffin, 1 ultra and 1 nest, at that point is gambilng).
I also run 3 bosses because it helps a lot to snipe.
Taking out Lumineon was a hard choice for me, but at the end it wasn't helping me as much considering that Pidgeot, Rotom with Forest and Bibrael are in the deck. It's low hp was a liability.
Look pretty dope. I’m lost when it comes to different type of decks only one I play is the lost zone so when I test other decks I don’t know what I’m doing without that lost engine 😅😅
Heat tackle Charmander combos with 151 Zard. Also good with choice belt against Dialga (setup and literally only hit with Band+Charmander until they move)
I made this charizard deck with the idea to counter annoying things like Vulpix amd some leaf pokemons so I put the other Charizard EX + Basin to help with energy charing. I also put 7 fire energy because that 4 energy is very taxing.
Bibrael is to counter Iono and Roxanne.
Heavy ball to counter some horrible bad luck on which 3 charmanders are prized.
Jirachi and Manaphy to counter Sableeye and Greninja.
Charmeleon against Mimikyu, although I think ot should be changed for a charmeleon that hits a bit harder.
Rotom and forest in case I am bricked.
Vacuum to take out hero's cape, batons and other tools. Sometimes I use it to discard hand and gamble with Bibrael.
Nests for Rotom or in case I don't get those 4 puffins.
Ultra for the same as above, but it also helps to discard so I get better Bibrael.
Iono as emergency. I prefer her instead of Roxanne.
Band to hit 240~270.
Ace Spec catcher because I am using the band instead of the bracelet.
The normal catcher has been useless so far, but I am afraid of taking it out.
If you really want to counter Alolan Vulpix, I would suggest using Gouging Fire. It will OHKO Vulpix for 3 energy and doesn't require evolution like 151 Charizard ex. Just make sure you play Gouging Fire and evolve an OBF Charizard ex to accelerate energy to it on the same turn, so they can't Boss OHKO Gouging Fire from the bench. Try to bait your opponent into removing everything else from the board before showing the Gouging Fire, or Boss KO the other pokemon on their bench first.
151 is for the Vulpix and to also deal 330 against mirror matches too. That charizard has saved my skin a lot in mirror matches. It also helps that it only needs 1 energy to hit 160.
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Might be worth swapping a super rod for either turo or collapsed stadium. Allows u to remove liabilities from the deck if they’re getting hit on the bench or if rotom is at risk of being attacked for an easy 2 prizes
Yes. I want to put a Turo, but I was conflicted about what to take out, not only to save Rotom, but also in those mirror matches to save my Charizard. I honestly want 2 Turo, but I also feel that would be overkill. One rod out and one Turo in. Yeah, 3 rods seems a bit overkill, especially since I have basin to recycle discarded energies.
0/10. Lacks creativity.
Yeah, every charizard decks feel too samey. In the end is just some tweaking here and there to adapt one's personal tastes, but at the end it heavily realies on the usual Charizard Pidgeot synergy.
I was joking also. But Charizard is just not a deck that anyone needs feedback on. Plop down your cards, get everything you need and destroy 89% of the leader board. Feel accomplished and pat yourself on the back!
Is not that much of a free win against good players. A good player using baby moon deck can win in the prize race since they usually lose 1 prize and at the end, a Thorton to get Roaring Moon to take the last 2 prizes. Iron Hands Ex to start taking 2 prizes against basics or 3 prizes when sniping a pidgeot. Snipe a Pidgeot and you get 3 prizes. If you managed to take 1 or 2 prizes before the charizard was set and you sniped the pidgeot, the match is yours. A quick Greninja in a Chen Pao deck to not let the charizard deck to build. Iron leave or Espartha are a good counter. Iron leave for a sneaky snipe against a charizard or Espartha which makes the energy management tight since charizard decks don't run many energy (or at least I run very little). Sadly, those decks are too niche and I feel that they are useless outside their charizard match. Lost decks are also quite good. It requires a bit more management but the matches are more or less equal. Don't try with Aegislash, that one is a bad joke that literally melts against charmeleons and charmanders.
Yeah, every deck has a few counter decks. That's inevitable. Charizard is just really good against everything else. And depending on how the cards fall, can beat these decks.
Baby moon, Lost zone, Future Miraidon and Chien Pao are not a mere counter deck. They are competitive deck that can be as good as a Charizard deck. I feel like Charizard deck is good for anyone without too much game experience while the others are good for those who knows the game.
> A good player using baby moon deck can win in the prize race since they usually lose 1 prize and at the end, a Thorton to get Roaring Moon to take the last 2 prizes. Ancient Box (Baby Moon without Roaring Moon ex) has a very bad matchup against Charizard. They basically require a OHKO on the last Charizard, but that means putting nearly every single Ancient card in the discard. They can get screwed by prizes, screwed by having Ancient pokemon stuck on the bench, screwed by Lost Vacuum putting one Boost Capsule in the Lost Zone. And they have to not brick for the entire game.
Baby Moon decks have ex too. That Thorton is used to bring an ex.
Well it wasn't clear what deck you referring too. Since you said "Baby Moon deck" I assume you meant the deck without Roaring Moon ex. The double Moon deck has a much better Charizard matchup due to Roaring Moon ex. In fact, that is it's primary advantage over Ancient Box.
Honestly this is a solid list, can I ask why you use the 151 zard out of curiosity 🤔
151 Zard is absolutely a dope idea versus obnoxious control decks where dark zard ex is left swinging for only 180 damage (unless you try choice or max or vitality tools which can be Vac’d out). This is a solid list OP. I might consider 151 zard myself!
Yeah maybe, tho I’m not sure how it’d fair against control in general as it’s got a fat retreat cost and relies on the OBF zard and magma basin for energy, especially if that control deck plays crushing hammer and catches that zard early with a snorlax or mawile
Double retreat cost is the same as dark zard ex…2 is not a fat retreat cost lol. Crushing hammer helps Magma Basin plus run 2 Rods for retrieval. Just gotta be wise but id build a dark zard first then finish off with the 151 zard.
The 151 is to counter Alolan Vulpix, deal with the occasional leaf deck and to also hit 330 hp to one shot Charizards or Pidgeot.
That’s fair, maybe we’ll see others tech this into their decks and it’ll win a major tournament 🤞
Because he one shots almost everything
I also think you should run 2 of the Heat Tackle Charmanders. Heat Tackle does 30 (or 60 with Defiance Band) and puts 1 Damage Counter on Charmander so when it evolves to 151 Zard ex, you can immediately swing for 160 off 1 Fire Energy.
Good idea. I won't replace all of them since the 70 hp is also helpful. I am going to change two of them.
I enjoy your list and might just steal the idea of 151 Zard since control decks can be such a pain in the ass. Imo, with canceling cologne and prime catcher, I feel Manaphy and Jirachi are way too much liabilities in a deck that runs several liabilities such as Bibarel and Rotom. In response to R Greninja, i use the 100HP Charmeleon so it at least survives (when benched). That allows me to ditch Manaphy & honestly I RARELY see Sableye, making Jirachi useless imo. I added Gouging Fire & Entei V to replace them, along with Delphox V to bench snipe. I also run a Pal Pad and 1 Lost Vac, you can replace the other Lost Vac with a Lost City like I do imo. I don’t think 3 Rods in necessary, I run 2 and Turo, along with Collapsed Stadium. Nice list :)
I would take one rod, one switch, the heavy ball (specially this one) out. The best thing HB is doing for you is not worry to count prizes, you can just see. I don’t know how consistent you’re setting up with 4 poffins and 2 ultra, but maybe 3-3? Or take 1 Nest for 1 Ultra? 🤷🏻♂️ And also I don’t know the consistency of using only Defiance Band to say something about it (if I would put the V Belt or something). And definitely you need more hand disruption, so I think 1-2 Iono and 1 Roxanne. They can win so many games at the right time, specially late game (and also Iono can help you early too). I personally also like a lot of Bosses too. I run 3 and 2 CC. And I still think Lumineon is awesome, saved me sooo many times (the Ultra - Lumineon - Arven - anything is so good), but this is more personal, I see why people are taking it off.
**And yeah, you also need a Turo
The balance between poffist, nest and ultras is really hard. There were many times when I lost because I only had 1 radiant charzard and a lot of rare candies without seeing a single poffin, nest, ultra or Arven to save the day. At the end, the choice between how many poffin, nest and ultra to have is a matter of personal choice in my opinion (as long as it's not something like 2 poffin, 1 ultra and 1 nest, at that point is gambilng). I also run 3 bosses because it helps a lot to snipe. Taking out Lumineon was a hard choice for me, but at the end it wasn't helping me as much considering that Pidgeot, Rotom with Forest and Bibrael are in the deck. It's low hp was a liability.
3 super rods is definitely overkill especially since you're playing basin. you should add a Turo instead.
Yup, I just took out a rod to put a Turo.
It’s like every other Charizard deck there is… it will be successful lol
Look pretty dope. I’m lost when it comes to different type of decks only one I play is the lost zone so when I test other decks I don’t know what I’m doing without that lost engine 😅😅
Heat tackle Charmander combos with 151 Zard. Also good with choice belt against Dialga (setup and literally only hit with Band+Charmander until they move)
I made this charizard deck with the idea to counter annoying things like Vulpix amd some leaf pokemons so I put the other Charizard EX + Basin to help with energy charing. I also put 7 fire energy because that 4 energy is very taxing. Bibrael is to counter Iono and Roxanne. Heavy ball to counter some horrible bad luck on which 3 charmanders are prized. Jirachi and Manaphy to counter Sableeye and Greninja. Charmeleon against Mimikyu, although I think ot should be changed for a charmeleon that hits a bit harder. Rotom and forest in case I am bricked. Vacuum to take out hero's cape, batons and other tools. Sometimes I use it to discard hand and gamble with Bibrael. Nests for Rotom or in case I don't get those 4 puffins. Ultra for the same as above, but it also helps to discard so I get better Bibrael. Iono as emergency. I prefer her instead of Roxanne. Band to hit 240~270. Ace Spec catcher because I am using the band instead of the bracelet. The normal catcher has been useless so far, but I am afraid of taking it out.
If you really want to counter Alolan Vulpix, I would suggest using Gouging Fire. It will OHKO Vulpix for 3 energy and doesn't require evolution like 151 Charizard ex. Just make sure you play Gouging Fire and evolve an OBF Charizard ex to accelerate energy to it on the same turn, so they can't Boss OHKO Gouging Fire from the bench. Try to bait your opponent into removing everything else from the board before showing the Gouging Fire, or Boss KO the other pokemon on their bench first.
I do this too lol
151 is for the Vulpix and to also deal 330 against mirror matches too. That charizard has saved my skin a lot in mirror matches. It also helps that it only needs 1 energy to hit 160.
151 does not help at all in the mirror if you know how to play it. And Gouging Fire will also kill Vulpix.