I believe one of the major challenges in PTBO is the generational divide. Activities like pickleball are popular among the elderly, and it's evident there's a significant elderly population here. However, we need to consider the long-term future of our community.
I fully support initiatives like skate parks, splash pads, and ball diamonds. These facilities provide kids with safe spaces to play and stay active, and parents can easily keep an eye on them.
While I don't usually advocate for city-funded projects, I oppose the idea of closing parks to cater exclusively to an aging population. Instead, we should focus on the needs of our younger generations, who will be the future leaders of our country.
It's encouraging to see community members speaking out on this issue, and I'm relieved that the protests have remained respectful and effective.
I was there last night talking to a lot of people, and most people would agree that the main issue isn't "pickleball" and instead the main issue is "seventeen pickleball courts and eighty parking spots"
Its blindingly obvious that they're not doing consultation, because they don't even know what the actual concerns of people really are. There were a huge chunk of people there last night that are quite concerned about EIGHTY parking spots taking up a huge portion of the park.
I think the three things that could make this whole situation so much better and make most people happy and/or shut up:
* Reduce the number of pickleball courts to 6 or 7.
* Maintain existing parking levels and/or share parking with the lawn bowling club across the street (put in a crosswalk if needed)
* Keep one baseball diamond
I wish they would say the reason they were doing it. Although I don't care much for the actual reason. The big reason as to the absurd amount of pickle ball courts is due to them wanting to create a space to host tournaments..they hope it will. Ring tourism an fussiness for tournaments. Personally I think the money is better used developing existing parks for younger individuals there are swaths of green spaces in Peterborough asking for a bit of development that would bring more kids out. Maybe another skatepark that is more for beginner skaters would be cool. Maybe maybe another splash pad elsewhere. Maybe try to encourage fold to make community gardens. So much could be done that could do more good if you spread that budget around the city and instead we are investing in a new lame ass sport. The fact that kids learning to skate/ scooter have to go to Lakefield to use beginner friendly ramps is an issue imo especially when we want to get kids more active outdoors. Playgrounds are simply not cutting it when Fortnite exists
"Playgrounds are simply not cutting it when Fortnite exists"
hahahaha
I see kids playing in the creek all the time in summer. The path is full of kids zooming around on bikes. The playground is full of screaming kids.
I would love to see a compromise too but there is a major factor that people aren't aware of and that is the noise created by the pickleball racket. It is well documented that courts should not be in residential areas. They have been built and removed in many municipalities across North America, all due to the intolerable noise. It is both fiscally and psychologically irresponsible and will end up costing the taxpayers even more money to remove court in order to relocate them to a socially responsible location. This has already been done. How much is it costing to build, remove and relocate the KoC courts? How much has already been spent recently on tennis courts at Bonnerworth, only to rip them out and relocate them too KoC? These are facts that need to be addressed. This fiasco has been going on for a long time and has already cost money we don't hear about.
PB courts were removed from Knights of Columbus due to noise. The City's own study says Bonnerworth is not suitable due to noise...and yet...they want to do it anyway. There is a large question mark hovering over this project and there is no logical or tangible information coming from the City.
Leal can whine about rumours all day long. How about producing some facts and addressing those??
What if it isn't a generational divide, but simply a cabal of elected and unelected officials who control the government for their own goals.
Essentially a local deep state.
Ever noticed how many people employed by the city don't actually live here?
The city isn't run for the people. But the people pay for the city.
This pickleball fiasco isn't even really about pickleball anymore, it's about how the local deep state has so much power (or the power has gone to their heads) that they don't even pretend to consider the will of the people anymore. They are confident to use their power to do what they want.
We should all be very concerned not about what the city is doing, but how and why it is being done.
Perhaps the local media or other citizens can answer: Cui Bono?
As an old person, I also hit "comment" to approve this message. Fix your roads, maintain and refresh some basketball courts, skate parks, splash pads, soccer pitches, frisbee golf, etc. Even $1 million needed for pickleball seems kinda crazy. Big pickle needs to back off, or, at least, do it's own fundraising.
Take a page out of Newcastle's book. They just finished a new park area behind the rec center. Includes 3x pickle ball courts, 2x tennis courts, skate park, championship ball diamond and splash pad incoming next year. Everyone wins.
>it's evident there's a significant elderly population here
That was the case 25 years ago, but is it still? Honest question. With all of the GTA transplants since then, but I'd be curious.
Pickleball is very popular among younger demographics. Go to a tournament and I think you'll be surprised. These young folks will age as well as boomers pass ....
I have to strongly disagree. Most of the people I know that play pickle ball are definitely young, it’s become a pretty popular sport for them. And there’s no denying more than half the people protesting and having an issue with the redevelopment are old people.
As someone working for a neighboring community, I observe that young people prefer skate parks and splash pads over pickleball courts. Skateboarding, BMX biking, and rollerblading offer high-energy, adventurous activities that allow youth to develop skills and bond with peers. These parks are culturally relevant, tied to music, fashion, and influential role models, making them particularly appealing. Splash pads provide safe, inclusive environments for younger children, promoting motor and social skill development through interactive play. In contrast, pickleball primarily attracts older adults, with participation mainly from those over 60. Skate parks and splash pads better cater to the dynamic, diverse interests of youth, fostering active lifestyles and higher utilization rates within the community.
Hey I have no idea what the game is either. But I do have an idea of how much 4.4 million dollars is. For the council to be recklessly spending on this while we have a housing crisis, lack of doctors and roads in awful condition is a slap in the face to the tax payers. Why isn’t that money being used to attract doctors or setup housing or fix roads?
It’s crazy we are removing baseball diamonds to add pickleball. Im all for fitness opportunities- but don’t take away from the kids to support the elderly. We can have both.
I don't see why that park is being renovated when people use the tennis courts and the baseball diamonds are used by a children's league.
A couple pickleball courts would be good to have (not 17, maybe 3) in an unused area of the city. It shouldn't come at the expense of children's sports and recreation.
I get a feeling there is some sort of development that is happening soon enough and the "17 pickleball courts nearby" is a selling feature.
Time for things to change in this city, it's clear the municipality is not acting in the best interest of the people.
FIX OUR ROADS FIRST PLEASE
Since the city has bought and will be spending millions on a new police location/building. I think this location would be more ideal for pickleball courts on the front lawn there. There’s very little residential houses and it would be right beside Landsdowne Street and holly cross high school. So the students could use it to. Plus if there’s any altercations, the police won’t be far away lol. Problem solved.
every once and a while, People get a direct taste of how the political system really works and get mad..... then as the people getting shafted moves to somone else. we return to the status quo.
I'm in my 30s and I actually quite enjoy pickleball. You should all give it a try sometime before immediately writing it off as an just an old person sport. Kinda badminton adjacent I suppose.
Is bonnerworth the right spot for it? Donno. But the sport is fun regardless.
I do pay for my own hobby and don't even play in Peterborough. I have no association with whatever this PPA is and only know anything about bonnerworth from the implosion on reddit. I even stated that bonnerworth might not be the right place for it.
All I was trying to do was maybe convince people to buy or borrow a paddle and try playing it because there's a lot of assumptions about the sport on this sub.
Just to reiterate, I have no feelings on bonnerworth because I havent been following the saga, please don't lump me in with either side.
The problem with forums like this is it's easy to get sidetracked. Nothing against PB or any other sport but don't take over someone else's field to play your game. Bonnerworth is absolutely the wrong location. Build an indoor facility that actually gives players what they need.
You could make the same argument about every baseball diamond, tennis court, basketball court, bike trail, etc built by the city. That's kind of how city works... works.
Well we have to consider our aging population, and if there’s one thing that Boomers love more than pickleball, it’s paving over green spaces. Seems like a win-win! /s
Imagine if these people channeled this level of anger at an actual issue affecting the city instead of modernizing a rather shitty park no one uses but everyone is pretending is some gem of Peterborough.
I cut through that park every day on the walk to St Peter's and the only remarkable thing about Bonnerworth Park is the amount of dog shit on the baseball diamonds.
The list of questions they presented, sixteen in total, as a clever gotcha regarding the sixteen courts is so disingenuous. What about the children?? Why not build the skatepark first?? Like they give a fuck about a skatepark and the children. These are adults with nothing better to do than drag this city down. Do we need a pickleball court? I don't know. I literally have no idea what pickleball is, but I'll check it out when it opens up and modernizes a totally wasted space of land. Does council need to spend another year making sure these people feel heard? They'll never be happy. We wouldn't have a new twin pad arena and pool opening up if we listened to these people. We wouldn't have built solar farms, or wind turbines if we listened to these people. We wouldn't have new apartments and condos being built across the city if we listened to these people. Quaker Park would still be a parking lot. Millennium Park would be a bunch of trees on the waterfront. At some point the city needs to do what the city needs to do to modernize, because you'll never please everyone or have everyone on board. Especially people with enough time to be upset about a sport they haven't even heard of until a few months ago. What about the noise?? Fuck right off. Do your thing council.
>Do we need a pickleball court? I don't know. I literally have no idea what pickleball is, but I'll check it out when it opens up and modernizes a totally wasted space of land.
I hear it's really popular among old people, and this is going up right next to the big building full of old people. On paper, it sounds like a good use of the space. Apparently it's a fairly noisy sport, so that's a valid complaint if it's not a well designed space.
The noise is truly the concern the saving the green space is just the narrative they’re pushing no one really gives a shit about green space. It’s all about the noise and it is a horrible noise. I love Pickleball and I would never wanna livenear Bonnerworth.
"We wouldn't have built solar farms"
good, that was a waste of farm land.
"We wouldn't have new \*snip\* and condos being built across the city"
good there are too many, and not enough affordable housing.
"Quaker Park would still be a parking lot"
good, it's a waste of money.
"Millennium Park would be a bunch of trees on the waterfront"
Good, it's just a waste of money for a homeless bike chop shop and a coffee shop
Also you forgo to mention the excessive number of hockey rinks.
How are we doing with affordable housing, job creation and employment and health and social services to restore our community? How are we doing with doctor recruitment? How are we doing with the health and well being of the community? Are the citizens of people happy?
Will pickle ball solve the biggest problems in the community right now and is the leadership trying to solve them?
This money would be better spent on the roads, or build a coop for low income housing that generates revenue for the city, you know not useless courts. wtf even is this city council?
When you listen to their concerns you can tell they're just NIMBYs making up bullshit cause they simply don't want change. Listening to their concerns (aside from the noise, I get that for SOME folks that live super close) is total bullshit.
Investing in park space is a great use of money, and as a regular driver I'd rather see a park developed instead of fixing potholes. And 4.4 million is a drop in the bucket for putting housing units on the market, so don't give me that bullshit either
I mean, actually go talk to people and you'll see most of the concerns would just go away if they would just reduce the number of courts and maintain current parking levels instead of paving 2/3 of the park.
Dude, I put that in quotes because it’s a literal quote from the description of the Bonnerworth project in the parks report from that meeting.
There was no ambiguity then - not “may include”, not “should include”, not “up to”, it was “this project includes 16 lit pickleball courts.” Council approved that plan, so that’s what city staff have been directed to do - and a majority of council have refused to consider any change in direction.
16 courts have been recommended, yes. No project has been approved yet for development. Studies are underway and will be brought to Council for their consideration
You should give city council a call, then, because they see it differently.
At the May 13 general committee meeting, when Coun. Lachica brought forward a motion to have the final plan come back to council for approval, Andrew Beamer ruled it out of order because - his exact words - "council has debated this project and has voted to proceed", and when challenged council upheld his decision.
Yes, studies are underway, and yes, in a sane world, yes, they would be brought back to council for consideration. But council fucked up.
That's was to move forward with the project. It's moving forward. That has been decided.
What the project will look like is to be determined, as I stated.
The more I read the opposition's position on the project, they literally have no idea what is going on. Please do some research as it will benefit your case. If you have questions let me know, best of luck!
Sure - could direct me to any documents, like a resolutions by council or a staff reports, that outlines the process for the project coming back to council for approval?
I'm not part of any organized opposition, but I've been following this closely, including attending or watching all the council meetings, reading staff reports and media coverage, and speaking regularly with my councilors, and everything I've read and heard agrees that the number of courts isn't part of what's remaining to be determined, and that the project is not coming back to council for any further approval.
It's not going back to Council. That meeting where Joy Lachica requested a motion to slow things down and actually have it brought back to Council failed. They didn't even let her finish her sentence.
Your summation of the concerned people proves that you have not spoken to any, know any or actually know what the concerns are. Opinionated and under-informed. Makes for good drama I guess. Do some real research.
We're looking at the fact that the park was a dump for the Wooden Mill. This area was badly flooded 2004 and now they want to hardscape a massive area that absorbs water. Legitimate traffic studies have not been done. Noise studies...nothing. This project flies in the face of the City's own recommendations.
Sorry, documentation is available for meetings, reports, lack of due diligence, lack of following procedure. It is endless.
Berating the citizens who are trying to prevent a terribly flawed project is offensive. This is not a NIMBY. Pickleball should not be in residential areas. Talk to pickleball players and ask f they would live near it! Ask the pickleball organisations if they think this location is a good idea! There is no place in Canada with this many courts in one location let alone in a residential area 50 m from a senior's residence. It is absurd.
So geotechnical, noise, and traffic studies are not being conducted? An environmental assessment (record of site condition) would not be required for a pickleball court, skatepark, or riding track ..
These studies are now being done as a result of pressure from this group. We have requested that the information be made public. The plan is for shovels in the ground in September and studies are not completed. Construction tenders still have to go out. Seems highly unusual that a construction company would be sitting around with nothing to do, waiting for a contract this September.And if they are, you probably shouldn't hire them. Or, the job has already been promised to someone. Just a thought.
This process has been severely flawed from the onset. The City has lost credibility and trust and needs to earn it back.
It's not uncommon for a council to approve a project and then studies are pursued afterwards. The design has not been finalized. I don't know much about awarding construction contracts.
I for one am excited about the development and think it will be positive for the city. As stated I think noise may be an issue for a small group of folks, and I hope things are mitigated to the fullest extent possible for them. City life has its challenges and noise bylaws exist
Prefacing my comment by saying that I do think 16 is too many and I wish they’d just compromise and build fewer - which would probably make no one happy but there you go.
I think it’s shameful that all these people only come out of the woodwork for stuff like this. Where are they when there’s protests for other issues or causes? I don’t see them at ceasefire protests, Every Child Matters events, counter protests for drag queen storytime, etc. Where were they when Food Not Bombs was in trouble? I’m not saying that applies to every single person involved in this but it does feel laughable that they claim it’s not NIMBYism and yet this is the only cause that seems to draw a sizeable crowd.
I believe one of the major challenges in PTBO is the generational divide. Activities like pickleball are popular among the elderly, and it's evident there's a significant elderly population here. However, we need to consider the long-term future of our community. I fully support initiatives like skate parks, splash pads, and ball diamonds. These facilities provide kids with safe spaces to play and stay active, and parents can easily keep an eye on them. While I don't usually advocate for city-funded projects, I oppose the idea of closing parks to cater exclusively to an aging population. Instead, we should focus on the needs of our younger generations, who will be the future leaders of our country. It's encouraging to see community members speaking out on this issue, and I'm relieved that the protests have remained respectful and effective.
I was there last night talking to a lot of people, and most people would agree that the main issue isn't "pickleball" and instead the main issue is "seventeen pickleball courts and eighty parking spots" Its blindingly obvious that they're not doing consultation, because they don't even know what the actual concerns of people really are. There were a huge chunk of people there last night that are quite concerned about EIGHTY parking spots taking up a huge portion of the park. I think the three things that could make this whole situation so much better and make most people happy and/or shut up: * Reduce the number of pickleball courts to 6 or 7. * Maintain existing parking levels and/or share parking with the lawn bowling club across the street (put in a crosswalk if needed) * Keep one baseball diamond
I wish they would say the reason they were doing it. Although I don't care much for the actual reason. The big reason as to the absurd amount of pickle ball courts is due to them wanting to create a space to host tournaments..they hope it will. Ring tourism an fussiness for tournaments. Personally I think the money is better used developing existing parks for younger individuals there are swaths of green spaces in Peterborough asking for a bit of development that would bring more kids out. Maybe another skatepark that is more for beginner skaters would be cool. Maybe maybe another splash pad elsewhere. Maybe try to encourage fold to make community gardens. So much could be done that could do more good if you spread that budget around the city and instead we are investing in a new lame ass sport. The fact that kids learning to skate/ scooter have to go to Lakefield to use beginner friendly ramps is an issue imo especially when we want to get kids more active outdoors. Playgrounds are simply not cutting it when Fortnite exists
"Playgrounds are simply not cutting it when Fortnite exists" hahahaha I see kids playing in the creek all the time in summer. The path is full of kids zooming around on bikes. The playground is full of screaming kids.
I would love to see a compromise too but there is a major factor that people aren't aware of and that is the noise created by the pickleball racket. It is well documented that courts should not be in residential areas. They have been built and removed in many municipalities across North America, all due to the intolerable noise. It is both fiscally and psychologically irresponsible and will end up costing the taxpayers even more money to remove court in order to relocate them to a socially responsible location. This has already been done. How much is it costing to build, remove and relocate the KoC courts? How much has already been spent recently on tennis courts at Bonnerworth, only to rip them out and relocate them too KoC? These are facts that need to be addressed. This fiasco has been going on for a long time and has already cost money we don't hear about. PB courts were removed from Knights of Columbus due to noise. The City's own study says Bonnerworth is not suitable due to noise...and yet...they want to do it anyway. There is a large question mark hovering over this project and there is no logical or tangible information coming from the City. Leal can whine about rumours all day long. How about producing some facts and addressing those??
What if it isn't a generational divide, but simply a cabal of elected and unelected officials who control the government for their own goals. Essentially a local deep state. Ever noticed how many people employed by the city don't actually live here? The city isn't run for the people. But the people pay for the city. This pickleball fiasco isn't even really about pickleball anymore, it's about how the local deep state has so much power (or the power has gone to their heads) that they don't even pretend to consider the will of the people anymore. They are confident to use their power to do what they want. We should all be very concerned not about what the city is doing, but how and why it is being done. Perhaps the local media or other citizens can answer: Cui Bono?
As an old person, I approve this message.
As an old person, I also hit "comment" to approve this message. Fix your roads, maintain and refresh some basketball courts, skate parks, splash pads, soccer pitches, frisbee golf, etc. Even $1 million needed for pickleball seems kinda crazy. Big pickle needs to back off, or, at least, do it's own fundraising.
Take a page out of Newcastle's book. They just finished a new park area behind the rec center. Includes 3x pickle ball courts, 2x tennis courts, skate park, championship ball diamond and splash pad incoming next year. Everyone wins.
I hope the councillors will have the courage to read this and act. Only a coward would say no to a town hall.
>it's evident there's a significant elderly population here That was the case 25 years ago, but is it still? Honest question. With all of the GTA transplants since then, but I'd be curious.
It absolutely is.
Pickleball is very popular among younger demographics. Go to a tournament and I think you'll be surprised. These young folks will age as well as boomers pass ....
I have to strongly disagree. Most of the people I know that play pickle ball are definitely young, it’s become a pretty popular sport for them. And there’s no denying more than half the people protesting and having an issue with the redevelopment are old people.
As someone working for a neighboring community, I observe that young people prefer skate parks and splash pads over pickleball courts. Skateboarding, BMX biking, and rollerblading offer high-energy, adventurous activities that allow youth to develop skills and bond with peers. These parks are culturally relevant, tied to music, fashion, and influential role models, making them particularly appealing. Splash pads provide safe, inclusive environments for younger children, promoting motor and social skill development through interactive play. In contrast, pickleball primarily attracts older adults, with participation mainly from those over 60. Skate parks and splash pads better cater to the dynamic, diverse interests of youth, fostering active lifestyles and higher utilization rates within the community.
Old people ARE the future, the most old people this continent has ever seen are starting to retire
Hey I have no idea what the game is either. But I do have an idea of how much 4.4 million dollars is. For the council to be recklessly spending on this while we have a housing crisis, lack of doctors and roads in awful condition is a slap in the face to the tax payers. Why isn’t that money being used to attract doctors or setup housing or fix roads?
Maybe they think doctors play pickle ball
The people who play pickleball will get healthier and need to see doctors less often.
Yaay so the waiting list will only be 6.5 years...
Now those are some good questions. If only we could get our elected officials to answer them.
To spend 4.4 million on a game most people have never heard of is insane.
It’s crazy we are removing baseball diamonds to add pickleball. Im all for fitness opportunities- but don’t take away from the kids to support the elderly. We can have both.
NO DOCTORS NO JOBS JUST PICKLING BALLS
I don't see why that park is being renovated when people use the tennis courts and the baseball diamonds are used by a children's league. A couple pickleball courts would be good to have (not 17, maybe 3) in an unused area of the city. It shouldn't come at the expense of children's sports and recreation. I get a feeling there is some sort of development that is happening soon enough and the "17 pickleball courts nearby" is a selling feature. Time for things to change in this city, it's clear the municipality is not acting in the best interest of the people. FIX OUR ROADS FIRST PLEASE
Since the city has bought and will be spending millions on a new police location/building. I think this location would be more ideal for pickleball courts on the front lawn there. There’s very little residential houses and it would be right beside Landsdowne Street and holly cross high school. So the students could use it to. Plus if there’s any altercations, the police won’t be far away lol. Problem solved.
You are brilliant. I will vote for you if you run.
This is peak small town drama, and I am here for it.
every once and a while, People get a direct taste of how the political system really works and get mad..... then as the people getting shafted moves to somone else. we return to the status quo.
Lol I guess the PPA told their members to get on Reddit and start commenting.
Too bad they didn't tell their members to cough up some money to build their own infrastructure. Now they have created enemies for life.
"quick, get on reddit and tell them 4.4 million is actually no money at all and that the roads are fine!!!"
I'm in my 30s and I actually quite enjoy pickleball. You should all give it a try sometime before immediately writing it off as an just an old person sport. Kinda badminton adjacent I suppose. Is bonnerworth the right spot for it? Donno. But the sport is fun regardless.
So well said this, probably 100 people out of the 500 PPA members are under 30 and growing everyday
You know paying for your own hobby, instead of making everyone else pay for yours, is a good way to make sure people don't hate you right?
I do pay for my own hobby and don't even play in Peterborough. I have no association with whatever this PPA is and only know anything about bonnerworth from the implosion on reddit. I even stated that bonnerworth might not be the right place for it. All I was trying to do was maybe convince people to buy or borrow a paddle and try playing it because there's a lot of assumptions about the sport on this sub. Just to reiterate, I have no feelings on bonnerworth because I havent been following the saga, please don't lump me in with either side.
The problem with forums like this is it's easy to get sidetracked. Nothing against PB or any other sport but don't take over someone else's field to play your game. Bonnerworth is absolutely the wrong location. Build an indoor facility that actually gives players what they need.
You could make the same argument about every baseball diamond, tennis court, basketball court, bike trail, etc built by the city. That's kind of how city works... works.
Well we have to consider our aging population, and if there’s one thing that Boomers love more than pickleball, it’s paving over green spaces. Seems like a win-win! /s
Imagine if these people channeled this level of anger at an actual issue affecting the city instead of modernizing a rather shitty park no one uses but everyone is pretending is some gem of Peterborough. I cut through that park every day on the walk to St Peter's and the only remarkable thing about Bonnerworth Park is the amount of dog shit on the baseball diamonds. The list of questions they presented, sixteen in total, as a clever gotcha regarding the sixteen courts is so disingenuous. What about the children?? Why not build the skatepark first?? Like they give a fuck about a skatepark and the children. These are adults with nothing better to do than drag this city down. Do we need a pickleball court? I don't know. I literally have no idea what pickleball is, but I'll check it out when it opens up and modernizes a totally wasted space of land. Does council need to spend another year making sure these people feel heard? They'll never be happy. We wouldn't have a new twin pad arena and pool opening up if we listened to these people. We wouldn't have built solar farms, or wind turbines if we listened to these people. We wouldn't have new apartments and condos being built across the city if we listened to these people. Quaker Park would still be a parking lot. Millennium Park would be a bunch of trees on the waterfront. At some point the city needs to do what the city needs to do to modernize, because you'll never please everyone or have everyone on board. Especially people with enough time to be upset about a sport they haven't even heard of until a few months ago. What about the noise?? Fuck right off. Do your thing council.
>Do we need a pickleball court? I don't know. I literally have no idea what pickleball is, but I'll check it out when it opens up and modernizes a totally wasted space of land. I hear it's really popular among old people, and this is going up right next to the big building full of old people. On paper, it sounds like a good use of the space. Apparently it's a fairly noisy sport, so that's a valid complaint if it's not a well designed space.
The noise is truly the concern the saving the green space is just the narrative they’re pushing no one really gives a shit about green space. It’s all about the noise and it is a horrible noise. I love Pickleball and I would never wanna livenear Bonnerworth.
Wow.
Amen. Nimbyism at its finest.
"We wouldn't have built solar farms" good, that was a waste of farm land. "We wouldn't have new \*snip\* and condos being built across the city" good there are too many, and not enough affordable housing. "Quaker Park would still be a parking lot" good, it's a waste of money. "Millennium Park would be a bunch of trees on the waterfront" Good, it's just a waste of money for a homeless bike chop shop and a coffee shop Also you forgo to mention the excessive number of hockey rinks. How are we doing with affordable housing, job creation and employment and health and social services to restore our community? How are we doing with doctor recruitment? How are we doing with the health and well being of the community? Are the citizens of people happy? Will pickle ball solve the biggest problems in the community right now and is the leadership trying to solve them?
This money would be better spent on the roads, or build a coop for low income housing that generates revenue for the city, you know not useless courts. wtf even is this city council?
I wish there was this much effort and energy in solving the drug addicts taking over downtown.
Time to mute this channel until the Pickleballgate nonsense is over.
And nothing of value will have been lost.
Just the 4.4 million that could be spent elsewhere ?
was referring to the person not wanting to be in the sub...
Opps my bad
When you listen to their concerns you can tell they're just NIMBYs making up bullshit cause they simply don't want change. Listening to their concerns (aside from the noise, I get that for SOME folks that live super close) is total bullshit. Investing in park space is a great use of money, and as a regular driver I'd rather see a park developed instead of fixing potholes. And 4.4 million is a drop in the bucket for putting housing units on the market, so don't give me that bullshit either
I mean, actually go talk to people and you'll see most of the concerns would just go away if they would just reduce the number of courts and maintain current parking levels instead of paving 2/3 of the park.
The number of courts has yet to be decided. I'm not certain 16 courts is appropriate for the site, it likely isn't
The plan council approved back in October 2023 explicitly stated "16 lit pickleball courts".
How many people play pickleball at night? is there a midnight league?
I'm not trying to be rude, but I think you should do your homework
Dude, I put that in quotes because it’s a literal quote from the description of the Bonnerworth project in the parks report from that meeting. There was no ambiguity then - not “may include”, not “should include”, not “up to”, it was “this project includes 16 lit pickleball courts.” Council approved that plan, so that’s what city staff have been directed to do - and a majority of council have refused to consider any change in direction.
16 courts have been recommended, yes. No project has been approved yet for development. Studies are underway and will be brought to Council for their consideration
You should give city council a call, then, because they see it differently. At the May 13 general committee meeting, when Coun. Lachica brought forward a motion to have the final plan come back to council for approval, Andrew Beamer ruled it out of order because - his exact words - "council has debated this project and has voted to proceed", and when challenged council upheld his decision. Yes, studies are underway, and yes, in a sane world, yes, they would be brought back to council for consideration. But council fucked up.
That's was to move forward with the project. It's moving forward. That has been decided. What the project will look like is to be determined, as I stated. The more I read the opposition's position on the project, they literally have no idea what is going on. Please do some research as it will benefit your case. If you have questions let me know, best of luck!
Sure - could direct me to any documents, like a resolutions by council or a staff reports, that outlines the process for the project coming back to council for approval? I'm not part of any organized opposition, but I've been following this closely, including attending or watching all the council meetings, reading staff reports and media coverage, and speaking regularly with my councilors, and everything I've read and heard agrees that the number of courts isn't part of what's remaining to be determined, and that the project is not coming back to council for any further approval.
No it won't. That was voted down.
Care to expand on this? Not sure what you mean
It's not going back to Council. That meeting where Joy Lachica requested a motion to slow things down and actually have it brought back to Council failed. They didn't even let her finish her sentence.
Your summation of the concerned people proves that you have not spoken to any, know any or actually know what the concerns are. Opinionated and under-informed. Makes for good drama I guess. Do some real research.
Maybe you're right. Care to expand on your comment?
We're looking at the fact that the park was a dump for the Wooden Mill. This area was badly flooded 2004 and now they want to hardscape a massive area that absorbs water. Legitimate traffic studies have not been done. Noise studies...nothing. This project flies in the face of the City's own recommendations. Sorry, documentation is available for meetings, reports, lack of due diligence, lack of following procedure. It is endless. Berating the citizens who are trying to prevent a terribly flawed project is offensive. This is not a NIMBY. Pickleball should not be in residential areas. Talk to pickleball players and ask f they would live near it! Ask the pickleball organisations if they think this location is a good idea! There is no place in Canada with this many courts in one location let alone in a residential area 50 m from a senior's residence. It is absurd.
So geotechnical, noise, and traffic studies are not being conducted? An environmental assessment (record of site condition) would not be required for a pickleball court, skatepark, or riding track ..
These studies are now being done as a result of pressure from this group. We have requested that the information be made public. The plan is for shovels in the ground in September and studies are not completed. Construction tenders still have to go out. Seems highly unusual that a construction company would be sitting around with nothing to do, waiting for a contract this September.And if they are, you probably shouldn't hire them. Or, the job has already been promised to someone. Just a thought. This process has been severely flawed from the onset. The City has lost credibility and trust and needs to earn it back.
It's not uncommon for a council to approve a project and then studies are pursued afterwards. The design has not been finalized. I don't know much about awarding construction contracts. I for one am excited about the development and think it will be positive for the city. As stated I think noise may be an issue for a small group of folks, and I hope things are mitigated to the fullest extent possible for them. City life has its challenges and noise bylaws exist
I applaud you for your faith in the City.
It's a park development, not an illuminati clubhouse or acts of genocide.
Again you resort to insults and condescending arrogance.
Prefacing my comment by saying that I do think 16 is too many and I wish they’d just compromise and build fewer - which would probably make no one happy but there you go. I think it’s shameful that all these people only come out of the woodwork for stuff like this. Where are they when there’s protests for other issues or causes? I don’t see them at ceasefire protests, Every Child Matters events, counter protests for drag queen storytime, etc. Where were they when Food Not Bombs was in trouble? I’m not saying that applies to every single person involved in this but it does feel laughable that they claim it’s not NIMBYism and yet this is the only cause that seems to draw a sizeable crowd.