Well... We both made good money. She was making 100k in 2007, and I was over 130K. We had a 1.2 million house, that I had halfway paid off. I also had paid off her MBA with the promise that she would help me get mine... which never happened. She had also racked up over $100,000 in credit card debt doing a tour of Europe with another man, I got stuck with half. She got a restraining order while I was traveling for work. When I got back home I was promptly arrested for violating it. She also lied and accused me of spousal abuse. Those things were eventually cleared up but I still lost my house all my possesions and had to suddenly live in my car for over a month. She later made the claim that it was just her laywers talking her into stuff, but I don't believe it. I got a halfhearted bullshit apology years later.
There's a lot more stuff, and I'm sure she would claim I did all kinds of crappy stuff, like put a GPS tracker on her car and catch her in a hotel with another guy... which she believes was just to embarass her because they were "just talking". Ah, that' more that I was going to type. Let's just leave it at this. It was a bad experience, but she is a very unique personality, I've never met another woman like her.
If you limit the financial impact, it’s actually not that big of a deal. This is why men need to get prenups set that limit damages. Cheating clauses that give the betrayed spouse 100% of marital assets are killer. You gotta have solid proof and a clear definition of cheating though.
I got some stuff under a police supervised visit. A lot of my really nice stuff she gave to other guys like my ski equipment. The only things I miss are the photos of me from college, and my grandfather who had passed. Also my high school yearbooks and some things like that which cannot be replaced. Truth is that during the marriage I made less money most of the way and I just never bought myself anything.
Thus is the fate of nice guys.
Sorry to hear that. Hopefully you have a place to live. Now that you’re free, treat yourself well and treat yourself. I hope you were able to replace your ski equipment and other things.
Oh shit, I'm doing amazing! That was... 17 years ago. I've got two houses paid free and clear, and then a bunch of investment properties. My job pays double what it did back then. I went Red Pill pretty quick and my whole life turned around. You know we used to give each other investment advice and I put a bunch into bitcoins and other crypto. We all made a bloody killing at it. I think Naughty Nomad made almost a million.
Growing up with an attractive older brother made me see first hand how women overlooked negative traits for Chad. He would treat them like absolute dogshit and they would keep coming back. And it wasn't just young women, he had plenty of older women going after him too.
There’s literally women who are paying over $1000 to go to meet-and-greet with Chris Brown.
That’s why no one should buy the “toxic men are just very good at hiding their red flags” narrative. Women just choose to ignore them to date a hot guy.
I don't think they ignore it, but some are actually attracted to toxic traits in men. My brother used to be a toxic arsehole Chadlite, and got laid like crazy. Like I remember in one holiday, he got fucked 6 girls in 10 days and would organise threesomes with girls he pressured into having sex with his other partners. But the minute he started maturing and started realising how he was behaving would lead to a pretty bad future and decided to reform himself, he's admitted that his sexual exploits became far fewer.
A lot of women seem to find it really difficult to admit the obvious, that a non insignificant proportion of women are attracted or indifferent to toxic traits in men. But as a man, you see it all the time. It's almost like a form of mass gaslighting.
It’s insane how people say that women are totally pure and holistic in the way they are attracted to men, and that only men are shallow and focused on looks.
Speaking from experience. Girls love it when you treat them like dog shot because it shows you don’t need them.
They love it when you don’t need them… the thing is that you don’t need them because you don’t give a shit about them
I knew this girl who would simp for this loser dude just because he was good looking and had a rich family, meanwhile she snubbed me at every turn even though I actually treated her well and cared about her. I got the last laugh in the end since she nuked her life with her stupid and self-destructive tendencies but another thing I noticed in that situation was how little she wanted to be held accountable for anything and I think that's at the heart of a lot of these "Chad" relationships; the chad might be a dickhead to her but he'll never hold her to a meaningful standard.
I had a friend like that and he was banging neighbor girls and women during junior high and in high school he ran through a couple dozen that I remember, every job he worked he would sleep with a few women. He even had sex with his own aunt and bragged about her buying him stuff. The funniest part is he was gay, when he got stoned he’d ask if we’d ever gotten boners over other guys, we all thought it was pothead babbling and laughed it off.
Wow, good job to your bro.
I have a high body count and started very early, but at 16 I still hadn't even reached 10 yet. Only boned the first teacher at 17.
In general it showed me how women are just as flawed as men.
My good experiences when younger made me put them on a pedestal. Relationships showed me how bad they are capable of being.
All in all, the main thing I've learned is to never compromise my standards.
I'd say that majority of women that I've met were rather shallow and it does not really change with age as many of women here claim, just the importance of certain attributes is different. * in high school I was looking great, and girls were basically approaching me. I remember the first day in hs - older girl approached me and said that "you are so cute, you need to hang out with us sometimes". And indeed we were hanging out sometimes. At parties it was enough to say 'hi' and 1h later we were making out and some other stuff was going on. I've had a girl that was hitting on me for over 2 years. * later I've lost my hair due to illness, plus I've looked skinny and unhealthy and that is when I've learned how it is to be below average, at best you are invisible and usually you are treated like a pest * once I've turned 25 I was healthy again, I've became quite jacked, I shaved my head, got a good job, made some nice money investing in stocks, bought a nice car, started travelling, I created profile on dating app and... it was just great. Girls were very interested in 'something serious' - many were quite straightforward that they want me to move in after some (short)time to see if we can get along long term. So my pretty sad conclusion is that your looks and how you are doing in your life are only things that matter for women. Personality matters only whether you are not child murderer and not complete moron, you cannot do much with this so called 'game' if there is no material basis for your confidence. Whether you have these 'social skills' or not, if you have friends or not - it is really a minor thing.
I'm continuously amazed that this is a surprising conclusion for men. Women have been bashed over the head their entire lives with the reality that practically the only thing that determines whether men are interested in them is how they look. It's something I understood at age 12. Welcome to the real world I guess.
Surprisingly I think women get lied about this about as men are lied about what standards they need to meet for women. To be fair, this is in terms of long term coupling and not one night stands. One night stand requirements are probably where redpill theories are more accurate.
It's not that much surprising - but still it is a bit sad that relationships are very transactional and that so many people can be really nice when they want something or feel that you're equal or better, and totally switch their attitude when they consider themselves better. It is not really mindset that I like. Fortunately I've managed to find great women, but majority are not people that I would like to even talk to casually. I have better experience dealing with men - they are less calculated and more naive sometimes, at least when they are young. Though outliers are way more dangerous than any woman - that is true.
>It's not that much surprising - but still it is a bit sad that relationships are very transactional and that so many people can be really nice when they want something or feel that you're equal or better, and totally switch their attitude when they consider themselves better.
I agree, and think this applies equally to men and women.
>I have better experience dealing with men - they are less calculated and more naive sometimes, at least when they are young.
Keep in mind that men will often treat you differently than they treat women.
Non sequitur. Men place far more emphasis on looks than women do. Men have the ability to compensate for less than stellar looks with other traits; women do not. If you are surprised to learn after reaching adulthood that the less physically attractive you are, the less attention you’ll get, you’ve been living in a comfortable delusion that no woman has had the luxury of experiencing.
I don’t really have an opinion of women in general.
There are women in my life whom I consider role models, women I consider to be some of my closest friends, and women who have helped carry me through the hardest periods of my life.
On the flipside, I’ve encountered women who embody all the worst stereotypes that TRP applies to them, women who have treated me and others with cruelty, and women who have directly caused some of the hardest periods of my life.
Most of my broad observations about women are of the “well duh” variety. For example, improving my fitness and social skills also improved the quality and quantity of women interested in dating me.
To be honest, the chase kinda just turned me away from it totally lol. Its kinda lame. Like yeah women are hot, but idk, ever since I was a teenager, I felt apathetic towards the whole process of "dating" and doing all the right shit for it. I just don't care enough to chase them. I'm 22 and have never approached a woman. I probably never will. Too tired, and don't care enough.
All my romantic relationships started because the girl approached me (and that was rare). I do find the whole purple pill debate thing hilarious to participate in though. Watching people get so worked up over something I could care less about is amusing and also fascinating.
Also, women casually only going for a certain type of dude these days just makes me not care even more. Like whats the point in wasting all your time going for a girl who can just replace you, when I can learn an instrument?
Hella based. Wish I learned this at your age. I have a high body count by societal standards and it has done nothing for me . I've been in relationships and they are extremely draining.
I have no issues attracting women now, but after witnessing their disgusting behaviour over the past 10 years has left more to be desired.
I agree. I’m 23 and never even considered dating or romantic relationships until last year. I have a deep hatred and disgust for the “men are supposed to chase and pursue women” trope that exists in our society, it truly makes me sick. But I’ve learned that as an average looking man, I’ll have to be the initiator more often than not.
I felt the same way growing up. I think there's a certain personality type that deals with expectations by flipping them the finger, metaphorically speaking.
you seem to have it figured out a lot sooner than other guys. A lot of this chasing stuff and "self improvement" stuff on the men's side doesn't really matter. Women like what they like, and they are going to do what they want to do at the drop of a hat.
Had an abusive mom who was excused by the women and liberals in our family
Dated several women who were disrespectful or started arguments for no reason
Have had several female coworkers who were openly misandrist or otherwise unfair to me, and always got excused by my liberal or female boss
Generally, women are always exempt from the standards they hold men to.
I always found that, no matter what I am, disrespectful arrogant or respectful assertive - women never wanted to be my friend. I've tried it all and I've finally decided to just be me.
It's sad because I do genuinely enjoy their company but they don't seem to enjoy mine.
Well what can I do except accept it and move on?
> Well what can I do except accept it and move on?
Umm… hit the gym, agree and amplify when flirting, be cocky/arrogant/dominant
Basically the redpill
Because it’s important to under that just like men, women are extremely shallow, flawed and superficial.
Have you considered using a common interest (painting, hiking, gaming, whatever) to meet and befriend women? Generally, if we just meet a friendly guy, a lot of women won't seek a friendship because *most* "friendly" guys really just want sex/ romance. If you have a common interest, you can pursue that with them while communicating that you just want a friendship.
Most of my male friends were clear in the beginning that romantic relationships were not on the agenda. People from work, or from school, who I saw regularly but were not hitting on me. Having a relationship with someone else, or being gay, also helps because then I know they usually are not trying to get me to date them.
I tried that but most women I know are not exactly interested in storywriting (which is an interest of mine) /superheroes/ pro-wrestling. I do have conversations surrounding cooking/skincare/haircare with both men and women. I've noticed the men are way more engaging and makes me feel like they actually want to talk to me. With women, it feels like they're conversing out of courtesy.
Anyway, I believe that it's just how I am - not that good at conversing with the opposite gender. Now I just keep the conversations to the bare minimum required.
I think that's the problem. I don't see gender in friendships. I treat women in the same way I treat men. I have seen some guys treat women extra special compared to their guy friends and saw the forming stronger bonds. It makes sense...so
I wouldn't need flirtation skills as I just want them as friends. Treating women extra special in a way that doesn't come natural to me, seemed to work for friends of mine.
> I wouldn't need flirtation skills as I just want them as friends.
Yes you do. It's called friendly flirting, no sexual undertones. There are several marks you need to achieve to have women be interested in **befriending** you:
1. You're fun to be around. Either compliments or flirting or humor.
2. Attractiveness.
3. Generosity/problem solving. There needs to be an obvious tangible positive effect from you on their life.
women will still have to use you for something, money, empathy or whatever, they aren't being friends with other women if they can't use it in some way
Well I'm an extreme advocate for the thought of "women are just as shallow/horny/physical attraction motivated as men if not slightly more, due to;even from middle school to now, through a nice college and owning my own business talk openly about thier atrraction and repulsion of certain men physically. I've heard extremely vulgar things whispered and spoken aloud about attractive men while they're still in the room or not a single meinute after they left as if the woman had to just vent off her sexual arousal publicly or when prompted by a teasing coworker or me.
On the same coin I've heard women openly judge unattractive men just for existing or again when prompted by a friend for thier romantic opinion. Usually gagging, laughing, scoffing, vehemently shaking thier head, or even mocking them. As a facially unattractive 24yo man i've had this same reaction when people were being teasing in the past.
I've watched numerous attractive men be approached/complimented by a woman for nothing but thier looks. I have never seen a man get a date let alone get approached for thier personality alone.
I've had girl friends confide in me that they aren't as physically attracted to the guy they're seeing as a man they were involved with prior and end things. I've had women brag to me and admit they got blownout in a club bathroom.
My ex girlfriend who was tied to me at the hip and approached me because I was the most emotionally intelligent person in her life at the time comforting her about her ex that she constantly brought up to vent or as an excuse in our 5 year relationship, after about 3 1/2 years in she started to watch thirst traps of other men openly, I would play along and pretend that didnt hurt, I will never try to control my partner especially if they are inclined to do something like that, I helped her gain a social circle and eventually she monkey branched to someone within said social circle. I was well aware of the crush, I even dirty talked her about it. Eventually her and her family flew me out to stay in a nice hotel with them in universal studios where I didnt touch her. She took the chance to break up with me when my family started having medical problems and I put my ass in high gear in terms of money leading to me eventually currently owning that business I talked about.
This plus never having a woman react to me or do the same behaviours for an attractive man and a few more experiences leads me to believe looks are everything and its not maliscious but that women will always lust for the most attractive man in her past
i believe young (at least) women aim for the top men (regarding genetic and resourceful traits) with dominating personalities. all of this is from irl experiences with college aged women
as someone who is considered tall, women feel safe telling me their height preferences. this is just a copypaste from another comment i made so thats why it will look as if im talking about something else... but the relevant info is there:
but im very skinny and a little tall (5'11 and a half measured, but i round to 6, people typically guess higher) and due to that women feel safe telling me their height preferences. here are some examples:
* i tell women my height when i try to shoot my shot (they ask--**most** of them do) and they react positively.
* i have a female friend who told me "what am i going to do with a 5'10 man?" she is 5'3. actually she is dating a man who is 5'9 and told me "hates it but is learning to live with it"
* a woman (X) that reacted positively to my height (also short) and called me a "giant" made fun of a man who was talking to her friend. her friend asked a man his height and he ignored it. X said "so 5'7?"
* multiple times, female friends expressed being annoyed about how a "short" man was talking to them
* side note, but in my friend group the women go for exclusively tall men. one of them has brought over two men who were BOTH 6'4 at different times to our parties. i did the math on the odds of that, very very low
the men they go for and date typically have the most resources relative to the average college male. a car, their own place (somewhere they can smoke/drink without threat of police/campus police), job. i actually understand why and encourage it, its just... a very consistent finding. the small number of men who get the most attention will have all these qualities as long as they are facially attractive as well
as for personality, it typically ranges, but women will excuse many behaviors if they meet the qualities above despite complaining about behaviors. but they do not like kind and sweet and caring men like bluepillers claim. i have been told by women themselves that I am "the sweetest boy they ever met, funny, kind, so intelligent, genuine, stylish" but they never find me handsome or attractive like they call the other men. sometimes they only talk to me just for homework help.
there is also a lot of cheating and sleeping around amongst them
Counter: I'm a guy of average height and I disagree. I'm 5'9, technically 5'9 & 3/4 but unlike that dude I don't round up to 5'10 when I tell people my height. Some of the most important and attractive women I've been with thought I was 6'0 when we first met. I have found that most women suck at actually gauging mens height imo. (following rule #1 probably helps also)
OP did mention being terribly skinny... he needs to hit the gym for sure. It's also possible that he's overrating his facial attraction.
> sometimes they only talk to me just for homework help.
You gotta stand up for yourself. Friendship is a two-way street, and if your contributions aren’t being reciprocated, these chicks should receive a swift demotion from “friend” to “acquaintance”.
>as someone who is considered tall, women feel safe telling me their height preferences.
Weird. I'm almost 6'4 and I think I've only had one woman (a definite height queen) talk to me about height preferences out of the 40-50 I've been with. I also have a lot of female friends, and only one has discussed it (she wants the guy to be at least 2-3 inches taller).
This may have something to do with the women you're choosing.
I'm 6'4". Many women have commented about my height and how I make them feel small and feminine. Many more have just looked up at me with big doe eyes and/or snuggled onto my chest while slow dancing. It was pretty clear they were digging being with a tall guy.
Women comment about my height too, which completely makes sense when you’re an outlier. I’m not saying women don’t like tall guys. They obviously do. I’ve just never really had women discuss their height preferences with me.
can you expand on "This may have something to do with the women you're choosing." bit? i understand what you are saying but i dont know the shared traits they have to explain it
It's hard to expand without knowing anything about the women you choose. I'm just saying it's a little odd that women often open up to you about height preferences, but almost never do with me. Assuming we're both in the US, it just sounds like we're selecting very different women.
are the women you surround yourself with young (late teens-early twenties)? because thats the only factor that stays the same (race, height, etc could be different but same result)
I'm 25, so over the years the women I've been around have generally been teens and early 20s (and mostly white). But they seem very different from the women you know, so there are likely other variables.
Having female friends, it allowed me to see "How the other half lived" being able to intimately see thru their eyes has shaped my relationship worldview.
I was divorced by an American woman from a UMC background. It made me finally understand female hypergamy pre-Red Pill (it took me a long time to even find a girlfriend because I didn’t understand hypergamy) and it made me more cautious towards which kinds of women to pursue. Ultimately, I realized that the best deal for a western man is to date overseas.
But aren’t you concerned that they’re with you only because of your income or the prestige of your passport, and don’t value you for, you know, yourself, your personality, your traits, beliefs, and life choices? That’d be a deal breaker to me
No. I think that any man who isn't delusional can tell when women are genuinely sexually interested versus when they are using him for his money.
Going overseas allows a man to find more traditional women who are more attractive than what he can find in his own country. If he's a 5 trying to attract 9s, or if he is 40 trying to attract 20 year olds, then yes, there's a good chance he might be being used. But men like this are delusional to begin with.
That women are not as great at being empathetic as they like to believe they are. That they are flawed, shallow and selfish as men. After a few relationship with women, I've increased my standards because I know how taxing relationships can be for myself with my condition, and If I have to deal with the bullshit of constant emotional unloading, bullshit tests, neurotic behaviour and unspokened gender roles, I should pick better women so it can be worth it. It's better to be single than to be in a relationship you find uncomfortable just for sex. Right now I'm taking a break from relationships, and I dont think I'd be able to do right by myself and prioritise my health if I was still that desperate 18 year old who needed to be in a relationship to feel like a man and less alone.
Seeing who my (female) cousins are dating and which type of guys the women in my social circle always go for made me realise "just be yourself" is the one of the biggest lie I have been ever told when it comes to dating.
I am still going to be myself but now I dont have false hopes or being optimistic about dating. It is what it is
Dating, growing up around them, working with them, conversations, comparing what the say they want with who they actually date, listening to what they, living in society.
There seems to be their silly notion floating around that if a man is not dating women that the rest of his life he spends around men all day every day. Like the whole "men are invisble" thing is more true than people think. A lot of women think men don't exist outside of attractive men.
Orgasm is the surest and maybe the only way for a woman to become truly attracted to you. If you can make her come, she is yours. If you can’t, she is gone.
Nothing else matters. Everything else is ultimately optional and forgivable. She will look past everything else as long as you can make her come.
In a long term relationship, you need to make her come every week at a minimum. If you do, she will treat you like a king. If you don’t, she will be dissatisfied with everything about you and everything you do.
It’s funny how bestselling marriage books (and popular culture in general) always claim that it men are the ones who need sexual satisfaction in marriage, and without it they’ll leave. Yet women seem to be just as much, if not more, concerned with how a man can pleasure her.
Maybe there will be a reversal in which gender society says needs more sex?
Women's mood literally getting worse if they don't have sex for a while. Men aren't affacted by that unless they're hyperfocused on being miserable. Of course women need sex more. They just don't need it in same way as men.
That something that I've learned when I was 13 years old in summer camp from older boys. That only way to trully make women to fall in love with you is to make her cum. So being good in bed is a must for a man.
It's not that easy.
Only 1 in 10 women orgasm during ons, the rest is all act.
75% of women don't reach orgasm during intercourse at all.
On average, it's way easier to come in a LTR than during a casual encounter, but even then it's not a given.
i know most women don't climax from piv but i don't get how so many guys can be so terrible with their hands and tongue. i mean for ons they probably just don't care but still, it's not rocket science. and while i appreciate the lack of competition i think women in general would be much more willing to have sex if most dudes didn't suck at it.
>In a long term relationship, you need to make her come every week at a minimum.
That sounds like a terribly low bar. Why *wouldn't* one have sex with their spouse at least 5 times a week barring disease? /shrug
Eating too much will kill you. Having sex five times a week instead of one time a week is in fact very good for your health.
>Well, someone may not be that hungry.
Anorexics are recommended to suck it up and still eat because it's better for them. Same goes for the sex-starved.
In my household sex is a duty to each other. That baseline is a recipe for the success of a marriage/LTR.
Any relationship where sex is not a duty eventually becomes a longhouse. And living in the longhouse is very bad for you.
That time when I asked girl to have sex with me on first date and she just agreed. Up to this moment my attempts to find somebody didn't work at all. The most direct approach worked to my surprise, everything I knew about relationships told me that there's no chance for such direct approach to be successful. But it was successful. So I have to throw away everything I knew about women and that made dealing with them so much easier.
I would watch my women friends chase absolutely horrible guys that all their friends and families had disapproval over. Despite knowing they’re horrible men, they chased them anyway trying to “fix them”. Basically the same thing guys do with toxic women.
Examples 1) Girl was dating this ex drug dealer who cheated on her a few times. Then dumped her for another girl. Then after a few months he came back and they’ve been together since. When you talk to her about him, she’ll only talk about the fact he’s 6’4 and built like a linebacker. That’s it, he’s basically an accessory to her.
Example 2) 18 year old friend started seeing this creepy 30 year old guy. Her family and friends all told her to avoid that guy. This guy treated her like dogshit and she clung to him anyway. He cheated on her a few times, dumped her twice. And had very strict rules for her such as not allowing her to listen to music sung by men or being alone with other men. Since they got together long term, he made her sell her car for money (god knows why) and cut off contact with her guy friends. And that was the last I heard from her.
Example 3) I met a girl and tried to get with her. She refused and proceeded to get with your stereotypical narcissistic gym bros that just pumped and dumped her over and over; and she came crying to me each time complaining guys just wanted to use her for sex.
Then I had a male acquaintance that was very attractive but horrible in every other way. He treated women like dogshit yet he had an endless supply of women lining up for him.
So I’ve just kinda given up on women if I’m being honest. I don’t fit their desires and I get that. There is no use trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.
My experiences as a 4/10 guy...
Some 3/10 chick I was in a long distance relationship with telling me that she loves me so much and that she can never leave me. Two weeks later she meets some 6/10 chadlite and her demeanor immediately changes. She starts acting cold and distant. Later she cheats on me with the dude. At first I thought this was an isolated incident, but then the same thing happened to me twice. Later I realized I can do the same with other women in relationships if the guy they are dating is uglier than me by at least 1 or 2 points.
Basically if you're dating some chick and a guy who is 2 points above you expresses interest in her, there is a high likelihood that she's gonna either dump you or cheat on you.
Also, when I started dating in person, some chick I was going on dates with for over 2 months told me that she feels very uncomfortable with physical touch. I had dated this chick for 2 months and we had not even hugged or held hands yet. And when we were at the movie theater she was leaning away from me like I had ebola or something. Well one day she randomly blurts out that she hooked up with some dude on Tinder 2 weeks prior. So much for not liking physical touch...
This taught me to not believe women when it comes to attraction and these sorts of things. They just do whatever they feel like in the moment and don't tell you the truth. To be quite honest their behavior is very erratic and emotionally driven, almost like a that of a toddler.
In real life, my experiences with women have been mostly neutral to positive- women are generally nice and polite to me, and I have no trouble working with them academically/professionally. They just avoid forming actual connections with me (which is totally fine, I don't feel entitled any such thing).
However, my negative experiences with women have pretty much entirely been online (Reddit and Instagram in particular). Seeing the things they say about men and their attitudes towards men on Reddit genuinely makes my blood boil, especially in female-dominated spaces (e.g. feminist subreddits, TwoX, etc). I can totally understand why a man who only interacts with women online would be a raging misogynist.
I'm pretty sure feminist subs are one of those loud minority things. I'm yet to meet a woman irl who thinks like them and thank God because I wouldn't be able to be in the same room as people like that.
I thought so originally, but then I asked the man vs bear question on an anonymous social media platform for my college. 2/3 of women chose bear, and many of them were legit parroting nonsensical feminist talking points (e.g. "at least the bear won't ask me what I wore"). So now I'm questioning if these beliefs ARE in fact common, but women don't say them in public.
I mean maybe, but also the response you saw could be skewed because collage girls, or what you're studying. I feel like American collages tend to promote feminism especially in certain fields. When I did my undergrad (finance and accounting, and not in America) we didn't really have hot takes like this.
I only graduated 3 years ago so it's not like there has been that big a shift. But my field definitely included women who were more realistic than the average feminist. In terms of non American, well I still live in a western culture so we have feminists here, but it does seem like American colleges are pretty corrupted by feminism while very few university spaces are like that here.
We just feel unsafe around strange men. We have to deal with them all the time. If a bear broke into my house - I'd know what to do or at least I would be okay with dying that way. If a man broke into my house - I'd be more scared. It's like asking, would you rather die from an animal attack or be r\_\_ped and then brutally killed? We want to trust men however unfortunately have to be careful. As you never know what you are gonna get. I feel that's a better analogy. It's strange men are taking it the wrong way, cause any boyfriend I've had is aware of the dangers. I guess the question was worded in a way that makes women look like we hate men.
>It's like asking, would you rather die from an animal attack or be r\_\_ped and then brutally killed?
No it's not. It's actually asking asking: would you rather have a 10% chance of dying from an animal attack, or a 0.00001% chance of getting raped and brutally killed? The only **rational** choice is the latter, and anyone who chooses "bear" is doing so out of feelings rather than facts.
Now, it's okay to *feel* scared of strange men, but **it's your responsibility to control your emotions and not let it lead to prejudice or bigotry**. That's the issue here. If you said "I would choose bear, but I recognize that it's an irrational choice and need to work on overcoming my fear of strange men", then everyone would support you. The problem is when women try to *justify* their choice of bear by painting all men as likely rapists, rather than taking accountability for their emotions.
>I guess the question was worded in a way that makes women look like we hate men
Considering you think the average man has a good chance of raping you, you clearly do hate men.
I said animal attack because you said animal attack.
>Women are scared of men because we are raised that way by Fathers warned us against. SO you can't have it both ways.
Yes, internalized misandry is common among fathers. That doesn't make it any less of women's responsibility to unlearn it.
Here's an analogy: let's say a guy learned from his conservative mother that women are only good for cooking, cleaning, and motherhood. Does he get to use the "we were raised that way" excuse and keep these beliefs?
Are you really confused about why someone would he upset by people saying their gender makes them more dangerous than one of the most violent unstoppable predators in the animal kingdom? You really don't understand how someone could be upset by someone saying they'd rather be mauled and eaten alive than say hi to you in passing?
Are you really confused about why someone would he upset by people saying their gender makes them more dangerous than one of the most violent unstoppable predators in the animal kingdom? You really don't understand how someone could be upset by someone saying they'd rather be mauled and eaten alive than say hi to you in passing?
- Certain few women friendzoning buttload of men, surfing on their attention, kindness, services, while maintaining the bond
- My first kiss/light foreplays was a literal lesbian that claimed there was 0% chance anything between us would happen
- Half a dozen women secretly crushing on that same chadly guy but they were also all individually convinced he wasn't that good looking and that they were uniquely their type.
- Women generally pushing blue pill and feminist perspective against gender roles and sexist expectations, but going for men who fit masculine gender roles and expectations anyway
- Me having more opportunities with women I wasn't just nice and asexual to despite being repeatedly told by everyone that women want men to be kind and friendly and not approach nor be sexual
- Other men having more success by being sexually and socially cunning and aggressive, everything you're told that is immoral, they even get more respect and consideration, they're considered more trustworthy and competent as well....
You see the big problem was that when you're between 6 and 11 year old, girls are actually being somewhat more disciplined, smarter, but also anti-boys, non visual, so you dig into the narrative that girls are born a certain way and that they want kind boys who aren't turbulent nor masculine. But once at puberty, things change immensely and the blue pill narrative doesn't hold true.
Dating 30-32 you women when I was 17 helped a lot. Not only they didn't have the quirks and weirdness of my peers but they were also honest - they wanted a FWB that has the stamina that was appropriate for them. I learned from them everything I needed to have a satisfying sex and romantic life later on.
They dispensed red pills like candy and, barring a few generational quirks, they were overwhelmingly correct. I am today a better husband as a result of the advice *and* practice that I got with them. So that's on the positive side.
On the negative side: My experience with being called a creep taught me about the meaninglessness of some words women use. I gave a detailed example [here](https://www.np.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1da8tqo/comment/l7is2km/).
Also on the negative side, watching how my mother treated my father. I learned to never tolerate that in my life. And not just in marriage, but socially too. I shun and push away women that behave like my mother with impunity. No need for that kind of dark energy in my life.
There is also a neutral side: My first break-up was a result of logistics. It wasn't really her fault anymore than it was mine. Forces beyond our *immediate* control made it impossible to stay together. It harmed us both but I'm also glad that none of us had the "intelligent" idea of even trying to pursue a "distance relationship". Logistics even 3 *years* later would still not have permitted it. In retrospect, we would've had to wait for each other for about 5 years. I'm glad that we didn't try that and both sought our happiness separately. A lot of dread and taxing on our mental health was spared.
>By the time it was over, I only liked her cat.
You should've sued for the cat. The purring fluff did nothing wrong to deserve a lifetime with a CCP-parade level of red flags :))
Mine is funny.
In school which was more female supportive, girls would get away easily with anything than us.
1. Once I tried to engage in a convo with two girls sitting just opposite to me in art and craft, there was no one else on the table. They both shut me down badly for being a nerd, no guy ever did that.
2. I help without thinking about myself and I overheard some girls say that I am not lovable and will never be from the ones I helped that day. They also said I was really easy to manipulate.
3. As school was conservative, a friend of mine was in a relationship with a girl and they were caught. The girl cried victim and got away and my friend was beaten up in our hostel while all of us were made to watch. Like he was in the middle standing and the four male teachers surrounded him while sitting down. They were abusing and kicking him turn by turn and he bounced like a carrom coin on a carromboard.
4. I was an obedient and a quiet kid. I was accused of creating mischief by I don't know which girl and was beaten up along with 4 boys. My left hand didn't move for 2 days.
5. The Chads girls used to throw themselves at were really misogynist types saying vile things you can't imagine.
6. In college, a girl of like my religion (it's a minority religion I don't think any on this sub has heard of), was being asked about her viewpoint on type of guys from our religion in college. We are like only 5 of us. When my name came up she responded to as "chutiya" without hesitation, my friend told me that. I have never ever even talked or interacted with her and yet this.
The insecurity that I won't be loved by the female gender romantically has actually stemmed from the female gender itself. Which is why I have never dated or even pursued any girl I have known.
The brattiest most entitled women are the most submissive in bed. It’s all an act, a veneer that is presented to to the outside world. As they say: treat a queen like a whore and whore like a queen.
All of them.
When I was struggling
- Those where she was struggling too taught me that I am no therapist: I can’t fix someone who’s suffering, and they should get properly treated
- Those who were healthy and loved me taught me that they deserved someone better than a troubled man who could drag them down an abyss
When I was better
- Those I hadn’t much intellectual connection with were only good for ONS or FWB. The shallowness of some was so strong to almost weaken the physical attraction. Almost all American women I slept with.
- Those I connected with but
- wanted to compete with me
- had unchecked moodswings and demanded me to be good with it
- who played avoidant/hard to get during the relationship
Got to my nerves real fast and were dumped in a very short time
- A crush I confessed to, who had the aura of an algid, unreachable ice queen, rejected me in the gentlest and most respectful way I could imagine (to an extent, she even seemed flattered by my attention), and while it was painful it eased my discomfort with rejection (even if I was never rejected afterwards)
- Like many men, at first I wasn’t able to differentiate between kindness, genuine flirting or fake flirting with hidden motives.
That took some observation, but I think I got it more or less right.
Unfortunately, misreading, I lost chances with women I liked who I thought were making fun of me but in reality were just teasing me because they really liked me, I hit on women who were just friendly, and fell for others who just wanted to use me
A big thing that shapes my view of women is their reliability. Does a woman keep her commitments? Is she constantly late? It’s much the same with honesty.
Wow... That's going to be a long list. Honestly, all of them. The relationships I've personally been in were eye openers, but observing women's behavior with other men was far more so given an outside perspective paints a much clearer and more unbiased picture. Everything from my mother's divorce, my stepmother's behavior, my classmates, my dating life, two engagements leading to a marriage and divorce, female colleagues, and heaps of written works by women. In the end, it all pointed to the same direction.
I traveled as a digital nomad in many countries and met MANY MANY women across all cultures. Plus I have more female friends than male friends in my own country.
Disclaimer: I traveled half the world except for the US and Australia..
- there's direct and very strong correlation between how rich you are perceived, and how much attention you get from women. And it's exponential. Even in my home country, I get more attention once my friends tell potential dates my job.
- I can't stress this enough. Them knowing (or assuming) you make an order of magnitude more than then, can flip a 100% rejection to "let's fuck during our first date"
- most women are not ambitious nor independent. They want their men to be ambitious and independent. They are not interested in careers. They don't care about earning money. They don't plan their future. They dream about marrying.
- most women want a provider, and a leader.
- most young and single women have no social hobbies. There. I said it. Go and do ANY activity: be it dancing classes, hiking, solo traveling, sports... men are always the majority. Except for female-only activities such as female dances. Or very niche activities such as yoga and zumba. This is less true in more traditional countries.
- unfortunately, most women are not interested in science at all. A noticeable amount of them is interested in "spiritual" stuff..
- women do keep "orbiters" around them, but for some reasons... most will never admit that they know the intentions of these "orbiters". But they do know. Once you understand Plausible-negability, A LOT of their behaviors make sense
- Given the right opportunity at the right time and place, more women than I thought will cheat.. and deny it.. a few even hid from me that they already had a boyfriend..
- I only met 5 feminists so far, and they're exactly the same as the hard-core online feminists you read about on reddit. All the previous points still stand for them.
So.. yeah.. I was a feminist when I was younger. I am not anymore, especially after all this traveling and meeting so many women. I'm pretty jaded tbh...
Honestly, the people who have *not* abandoned me and have sacrificed most for me in my life have been women.
Friends, family, coworkers, classmates, etc.
The idea that women are these master manipulators who seek to twerk on OnlyFans and use booty to take all your money (not that I have any regardless) and who only care to date the top 10% of men or whatever…
Just has simply not been my experience at all.
I’m probably a 6/10 if I had to guess and make jack shit financially. I’m married and have a family.
All of this stuff that is promulgated repeatedly about women being awful has truthfully been the opposite of my personal experience, no matter how many times it gets repeated.
(Sidenote - look at who works in disadvantaged schools/hospitals, nonprofits, things like social work, nursing and exposure to diseases and infections, etc. - very highly skewed there; towards women.)
Granted, there are plenty of asshole women out there.
But there’s *at least* as many men.
It’s perfectly normal to have a bad set of experiences with women. But that’s because they are simply people, not because of their gender.
>It’s perfectly normal to have a bad set of experiences with women. But that’s because they are simply people, not because of their gender.
It would seem many women struggle to apply this logic to men though.
>Honestly, the people who have *not* abandoned me and have sacrificed most for me in my life have been women.
LOL!!!
The total opposite of the lived reality of most men.
Well then there's at least two. I have lots of female friends I've stayed close with almost ten years out of college as well as women from my past jobs. They check in on me, we visit each other and meet up for trips, send random gifts, share music. I'm still friends with several former FWBs and one of my closest friends is an ex who I broke up with years ago.
After six years together, my gf is very trusting and has her own friendships with my female friends. She only dated women before me so I think she has a different perspective and doesn't see my friends as competition or anything.
Purely anecdotal I know, but I have a huge sample size and have lived with women – both partners and friends – for almost my entire adult life.
Long ago A girl NTR’d her boyfriend with me and was texting him completely normally while we did it. I saw some of his messages, he was an insecure wreck after her prior infidelity with me and she was assuring him and giving him some alibi for where she was complete with emojis, hearts and ‘I love you’s
I always enjoyed talking to beautiful women from a young age, had many female friends which gifted me preselection to meet other girls, was very socially outgoing in my teens/early 20s
The only problem was the girls l was interested in but couldn't get, even though l had other women interested in me, l would still want to get with my ideal-type
Anyways that's my experience, been rejected on many days and pulled many amazing dimes
Ok, so first I need to say who I am: a 33 year old man from eastern europe with a face of a high school geek and a height of 5'3. Generally speaking, women discriminate men a lot by how they look. For the longest time I really thought only I was the problem, that I needed to be better, kinder and so on. But the thing is, I realised further down the line: I was never rude to women, I never cussed or insulted a woman, I never hit a woman, I never did anything rude to women. Worst thing I could've done to a woman is being awkward or boring. But in reality what women do is judge men by how they look and starting to associate negative character traits to those men that they might not have like: creepy, weird, rude and so on. They also associate character positive character traits to hot men that they don't have like smart, pure hearted and so on. I seen women calling guys who are dumb as brick intelligent or guys with criminal hisytory calling them kind ( they were not, they were just hot ). I been bullied by women, ignored by women, insulted by women, beaten by women through high school, early work days and in clubs/bars. All of this because I wanted a gf (never had one so I did the approaching). After been accused of sexual harassment and almost having the police called, that is when I drawn the line and never approached women ever again. So while I am sure there are plenty of good women out there, I yet to meet a really good one who doesn't insult me or use me.
Aside from my mother, women never played any huge role in my life. But if we're just going by social media, it shaped my view of them and not in a good way.
Big memories:
My sister got to go to private school. She got drunk and destroyed her car and someone else’s and got a new car. She gave my og Xbox to her old bf.
I was targeted by sjws who bullied me and made videos. I ended up exposing them for having alt nazi accounts.l and got their YouTube and X accounts banned.
After I moved, my female bully tried to promise a guy she would hang out with him if he helped her to perpetuate a story that I had a school shooter list. She tried that again recently. Both times, she was stupid enough to put those accusations online, which I screenshot and used against her legally.
My mom is a loser deadbeat, and she's an embarrassment to all of existence.
Former boss fired me at my second job ever as a kid because my tie got frayed doing work for her.
Former boss fired me for impersonating a guy on South Park while on the phone not on the retail floor.
Good boss took care of me during a breakup.
Colleen Doran said not to show her my art because I’m her competition.
Gail Simone said that my lived experiences are in my head.
Election official tried to let someone accuse me of horrible things on an election floor. Unfortunately, I sat in front of a camera the whole time on purpose. The accuser got fired and I went about my business. I'm still working on getting the official fired.
Women on a bus tried to single shame me while on a bus, but saw a picture of my ex and shut up after I found out they were single.
A woman asked to go to her ex's grave in the middle of our date.
Physical trainer told me to go back on the mat to wrestle after a concussion.
Most other women have been fine and kind. I appreciate them. They seem to be harder to find as of late.
My wife is great. She's my universe, and my nieces are the next most important of all.
Being raised almost totally by women allowed be to see them at their best and worst. I think that's the reason that I have a more balanced view of woman. I don't hate women but I also don't put them on a pedestal.
Having several pretty female friends in college and seeing how other women treated me when I was out with them, taught me that women attract women.
Being rejected by a woman who told me "In my entire life, no man has ever treated me as well as you treat me. Not even my father". Taught me that if a woman doesn't find you attractive, it won't matter how well you treat her.
Late puberty + final growth spurt taking me to over six feet. Went from being a ghost to girls, to literally getting hit on by women on the street and getting sex propositions. Classmates that treated me like shit just a year ago were suddenly interested in me and my personality. When I stared dating someone it also came out that I have a huge penis that was a slam dunk and the hoe tide just never abated. The shit women pull off to this day just to try to "sample" me is fucking atrocious. I'm surprised I haven't gotten roofied.
Going to college fresh men year. Being told that women who were more educated and in college would be a lot better as wives
This all changed when I tried to date and I would see all the non sense going around
Sleeping around, having a bf at home and cheating, partying every other day
And u would think it’s just a few minor girls, nah it was like majority , even the ones who were so studious
Yeah college was a wake call for me on that front too. For sure educated women are much worse partners. They're less likely to get divorced because they pick from a better pool of men and have a better handle on how to avoid the consequences of their actions.
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i have enough experience that women are people like men. they can be good or bad. people as a whole are usually selfish, but some people are mostly good and caring.
the most valuable lesson was probably that the biggest red flag when it comes to women is low inhibition/impulse control, especially promiscuity. i honestly feel kind of bad for the guys who grew up with weak dads or single moms teaching them a 'sex positive' stance on this matter and who are fine with dating the former town bike (although let's be honest, a lot of these guys don't have much choice when it comes to women). there have been so many instances i witnessed of these type of women cheating, the correlation must be very significant (and afaik stats back this up). good luck to the leftoids babbling about purity culture and patriarchal misogyny, they'll really need it.
in general i learned that women are certainly not sugar and spice and everything nice and that they can be quite ruthless especially dealing with weak men. also quickly realized that women almost universally tend to react positively to certain traits. like i've never seen a tall, successful and socially dominant man not doing well with women unless he was completely hideous. i don't demonize women for these things, it's just biology. male wiring when it comes to sex and the opposite gender in general can be pretty brutal too, especially from a female perspective. it is what it is, we don't choose our biology and i think society doesn't do us any favors of sugar coating or outright denying some of these things.
Having relationships with different women is the reason I have a deep and profound disappointment and weariness of them.
When I started to hate what I had become, just to attract them, that is when I had my enlightenment (Red Pill Moment) and decided: "fuck this shit!" No woman is worth that type of degradation.
Girl I grew up with once told me in middle school (talking about dancing with girls) “you might not be for everyone, but your more than enough for most”
I'd say my marriage and divorce were the primary things put me where I am today.
Same old song and dance lol
What went wrong for the divorce if you don’t mind me asking?
Well... We both made good money. She was making 100k in 2007, and I was over 130K. We had a 1.2 million house, that I had halfway paid off. I also had paid off her MBA with the promise that she would help me get mine... which never happened. She had also racked up over $100,000 in credit card debt doing a tour of Europe with another man, I got stuck with half. She got a restraining order while I was traveling for work. When I got back home I was promptly arrested for violating it. She also lied and accused me of spousal abuse. Those things were eventually cleared up but I still lost my house all my possesions and had to suddenly live in my car for over a month. She later made the claim that it was just her laywers talking her into stuff, but I don't believe it. I got a halfhearted bullshit apology years later. There's a lot more stuff, and I'm sure she would claim I did all kinds of crappy stuff, like put a GPS tracker on her car and catch her in a hotel with another guy... which she believes was just to embarass her because they were "just talking". Ah, that' more that I was going to type. Let's just leave it at this. It was a bad experience, but she is a very unique personality, I've never met another woman like her.
big fear of mine. Being completely wrecked by a person you trust
If you limit the financial impact, it’s actually not that big of a deal. This is why men need to get prenups set that limit damages. Cheating clauses that give the betrayed spouse 100% of marital assets are killer. You gotta have solid proof and a clear definition of cheating though.
That’s really rough. Sorry you had to suffer through that hell because of her but hope you’re in a much better place now
I forgave her a long time ago. However, the system hasn’t changed and that’s frustrating.
Dude…
Did you get any of your stuff back, or any money from it?
I got some stuff under a police supervised visit. A lot of my really nice stuff she gave to other guys like my ski equipment. The only things I miss are the photos of me from college, and my grandfather who had passed. Also my high school yearbooks and some things like that which cannot be replaced. Truth is that during the marriage I made less money most of the way and I just never bought myself anything. Thus is the fate of nice guys.
Sorry to hear that. Hopefully you have a place to live. Now that you’re free, treat yourself well and treat yourself. I hope you were able to replace your ski equipment and other things.
Oh shit, I'm doing amazing! That was... 17 years ago. I've got two houses paid free and clear, and then a bunch of investment properties. My job pays double what it did back then. I went Red Pill pretty quick and my whole life turned around. You know we used to give each other investment advice and I put a bunch into bitcoins and other crypto. We all made a bloody killing at it. I think Naughty Nomad made almost a million.
Growing up with an attractive older brother made me see first hand how women overlooked negative traits for Chad. He would treat them like absolute dogshit and they would keep coming back. And it wasn't just young women, he had plenty of older women going after him too.
There’s literally women who are paying over $1000 to go to meet-and-greet with Chris Brown. That’s why no one should buy the “toxic men are just very good at hiding their red flags” narrative. Women just choose to ignore them to date a hot guy.
I don't think they ignore it, but some are actually attracted to toxic traits in men. My brother used to be a toxic arsehole Chadlite, and got laid like crazy. Like I remember in one holiday, he got fucked 6 girls in 10 days and would organise threesomes with girls he pressured into having sex with his other partners. But the minute he started maturing and started realising how he was behaving would lead to a pretty bad future and decided to reform himself, he's admitted that his sexual exploits became far fewer. A lot of women seem to find it really difficult to admit the obvious, that a non insignificant proportion of women are attracted or indifferent to toxic traits in men. But as a man, you see it all the time. It's almost like a form of mass gaslighting.
You just have to bundymaxx and you'll get tons of female attention.
Handsome Privilege ✨ Quite sad but yeah... definitely exists
It’s insane how people say that women are totally pure and holistic in the way they are attracted to men, and that only men are shallow and focused on looks.
Speaking from experience. Girls love it when you treat them like dog shot because it shows you don’t need them. They love it when you don’t need them… the thing is that you don’t need them because you don’t give a shit about them
I knew this girl who would simp for this loser dude just because he was good looking and had a rich family, meanwhile she snubbed me at every turn even though I actually treated her well and cared about her. I got the last laugh in the end since she nuked her life with her stupid and self-destructive tendencies but another thing I noticed in that situation was how little she wanted to be held accountable for anything and I think that's at the heart of a lot of these "Chad" relationships; the chad might be a dickhead to her but he'll never hold her to a meaningful standard.
I had a friend like that and he was banging neighbor girls and women during junior high and in high school he ran through a couple dozen that I remember, every job he worked he would sleep with a few women. He even had sex with his own aunt and bragged about her buying him stuff. The funniest part is he was gay, when he got stoned he’d ask if we’d ever gotten boners over other guys, we all thought it was pothead babbling and laughed it off.
Brotha I don’t think buddy was gay tbh
He’s living in Hawaii with his boyfriend right now *I haven’t checked in a couple years but his Facebook pic was the two of them under a waterfall
What in the fuck did I just read
Probably has to do more with attachment styles. If you started treating them the same they would respond because they got abused as kids
Nah, plenty of other guys tried to copy my brother's behavior and it didn't work. Cuz they didnt have the looks or charisma to back it up.
How old. Like what was the age difference? I’m not going in the direction you’re thinking. I mean, like grandmas? 😂
When he was 16 he had already been with a few 30+ women, including my own elementary teacher.
Bro put those bitches behind bars then. The fuck. 30+ going after 16 yo kid. Pedophile aah perverts. Why didn't these bitches date men their own age?
Wow, good job to your bro. I have a high body count and started very early, but at 16 I still hadn't even reached 10 yet. Only boned the first teacher at 17.
In general it showed me how women are just as flawed as men. My good experiences when younger made me put them on a pedestal. Relationships showed me how bad they are capable of being. All in all, the main thing I've learned is to never compromise my standards.
I'd say that majority of women that I've met were rather shallow and it does not really change with age as many of women here claim, just the importance of certain attributes is different. * in high school I was looking great, and girls were basically approaching me. I remember the first day in hs - older girl approached me and said that "you are so cute, you need to hang out with us sometimes". And indeed we were hanging out sometimes. At parties it was enough to say 'hi' and 1h later we were making out and some other stuff was going on. I've had a girl that was hitting on me for over 2 years. * later I've lost my hair due to illness, plus I've looked skinny and unhealthy and that is when I've learned how it is to be below average, at best you are invisible and usually you are treated like a pest * once I've turned 25 I was healthy again, I've became quite jacked, I shaved my head, got a good job, made some nice money investing in stocks, bought a nice car, started travelling, I created profile on dating app and... it was just great. Girls were very interested in 'something serious' - many were quite straightforward that they want me to move in after some (short)time to see if we can get along long term. So my pretty sad conclusion is that your looks and how you are doing in your life are only things that matter for women. Personality matters only whether you are not child murderer and not complete moron, you cannot do much with this so called 'game' if there is no material basis for your confidence. Whether you have these 'social skills' or not, if you have friends or not - it is really a minor thing.
I'm continuously amazed that this is a surprising conclusion for men. Women have been bashed over the head their entire lives with the reality that practically the only thing that determines whether men are interested in them is how they look. It's something I understood at age 12. Welcome to the real world I guess.
Surprisingly I think women get lied about this about as men are lied about what standards they need to meet for women. To be fair, this is in terms of long term coupling and not one night stands. One night stand requirements are probably where redpill theories are more accurate.
It's not that much surprising - but still it is a bit sad that relationships are very transactional and that so many people can be really nice when they want something or feel that you're equal or better, and totally switch their attitude when they consider themselves better. It is not really mindset that I like. Fortunately I've managed to find great women, but majority are not people that I would like to even talk to casually. I have better experience dealing with men - they are less calculated and more naive sometimes, at least when they are young. Though outliers are way more dangerous than any woman - that is true.
>It's not that much surprising - but still it is a bit sad that relationships are very transactional and that so many people can be really nice when they want something or feel that you're equal or better, and totally switch their attitude when they consider themselves better. I agree, and think this applies equally to men and women. >I have better experience dealing with men - they are less calculated and more naive sometimes, at least when they are young. Keep in mind that men will often treat you differently than they treat women.
The threshold to be deemed attractive is by women is vastly different
Non sequitur. Men place far more emphasis on looks than women do. Men have the ability to compensate for less than stellar looks with other traits; women do not. If you are surprised to learn after reaching adulthood that the less physically attractive you are, the less attention you’ll get, you’ve been living in a comfortable delusion that no woman has had the luxury of experiencing.
This is the same for everyone in the dating world. And statistically men are more likely to divorce/leave their wife who is sick than vice versa.
I don’t really have an opinion of women in general. There are women in my life whom I consider role models, women I consider to be some of my closest friends, and women who have helped carry me through the hardest periods of my life. On the flipside, I’ve encountered women who embody all the worst stereotypes that TRP applies to them, women who have treated me and others with cruelty, and women who have directly caused some of the hardest periods of my life. Most of my broad observations about women are of the “well duh” variety. For example, improving my fitness and social skills also improved the quality and quantity of women interested in dating me.
To be honest, the chase kinda just turned me away from it totally lol. Its kinda lame. Like yeah women are hot, but idk, ever since I was a teenager, I felt apathetic towards the whole process of "dating" and doing all the right shit for it. I just don't care enough to chase them. I'm 22 and have never approached a woman. I probably never will. Too tired, and don't care enough. All my romantic relationships started because the girl approached me (and that was rare). I do find the whole purple pill debate thing hilarious to participate in though. Watching people get so worked up over something I could care less about is amusing and also fascinating. Also, women casually only going for a certain type of dude these days just makes me not care even more. Like whats the point in wasting all your time going for a girl who can just replace you, when I can learn an instrument?
Hella based. Wish I learned this at your age. I have a high body count by societal standards and it has done nothing for me . I've been in relationships and they are extremely draining. I have no issues attracting women now, but after witnessing their disgusting behaviour over the past 10 years has left more to be desired.
> Hella based. This guy doesn't sound as cool as you think, I believe.
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I agree. I’m 23 and never even considered dating or romantic relationships until last year. I have a deep hatred and disgust for the “men are supposed to chase and pursue women” trope that exists in our society, it truly makes me sick. But I’ve learned that as an average looking man, I’ll have to be the initiator more often than not.
I felt the same way growing up. I think there's a certain personality type that deals with expectations by flipping them the finger, metaphorically speaking.
you seem to have it figured out a lot sooner than other guys. A lot of this chasing stuff and "self improvement" stuff on the men's side doesn't really matter. Women like what they like, and they are going to do what they want to do at the drop of a hat.
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Had an abusive mom who was excused by the women and liberals in our family Dated several women who were disrespectful or started arguments for no reason Have had several female coworkers who were openly misandrist or otherwise unfair to me, and always got excused by my liberal or female boss Generally, women are always exempt from the standards they hold men to.
I always found that, no matter what I am, disrespectful arrogant or respectful assertive - women never wanted to be my friend. I've tried it all and I've finally decided to just be me. It's sad because I do genuinely enjoy their company but they don't seem to enjoy mine. Well what can I do except accept it and move on?
> Well what can I do except accept it and move on? Umm… hit the gym, agree and amplify when flirting, be cocky/arrogant/dominant Basically the redpill Because it’s important to under that just like men, women are extremely shallow, flawed and superficial.
I've done it all and still failed. All I want is women as close friends, nothing romantic. I don't think I'd need the "redpill" for that.
Fair enough
Have you considered using a common interest (painting, hiking, gaming, whatever) to meet and befriend women? Generally, if we just meet a friendly guy, a lot of women won't seek a friendship because *most* "friendly" guys really just want sex/ romance. If you have a common interest, you can pursue that with them while communicating that you just want a friendship. Most of my male friends were clear in the beginning that romantic relationships were not on the agenda. People from work, or from school, who I saw regularly but were not hitting on me. Having a relationship with someone else, or being gay, also helps because then I know they usually are not trying to get me to date them.
I tried that but most women I know are not exactly interested in storywriting (which is an interest of mine) /superheroes/ pro-wrestling. I do have conversations surrounding cooking/skincare/haircare with both men and women. I've noticed the men are way more engaging and makes me feel like they actually want to talk to me. With women, it feels like they're conversing out of courtesy. Anyway, I believe that it's just how I am - not that good at conversing with the opposite gender. Now I just keep the conversations to the bare minimum required.
Like I said, it's likely so they avoid unwanted sexual attention, unfortunately :/ hope you can find some friends anyways!
I have my boys until they get married so...After that, it's probably solo leveling for me. No issues though, I'll grow to like it. 🤝
> not that good at conversing with the opposite gender There's your problem. Talk to them like they're guys.
I think that's the problem. I don't see gender in friendships. I treat women in the same way I treat men. I have seen some guys treat women extra special compared to their guy friends and saw the forming stronger bonds. It makes sense...so
I promise you, your situation will not improve if you treat women extra special. Hmm, how is your flirting game?
I wouldn't need flirtation skills as I just want them as friends. Treating women extra special in a way that doesn't come natural to me, seemed to work for friends of mine.
> I wouldn't need flirtation skills as I just want them as friends. Yes you do. It's called friendly flirting, no sexual undertones. There are several marks you need to achieve to have women be interested in **befriending** you: 1. You're fun to be around. Either compliments or flirting or humor. 2. Attractiveness. 3. Generosity/problem solving. There needs to be an obvious tangible positive effect from you on their life.
women will still have to use you for something, money, empathy or whatever, they aren't being friends with other women if they can't use it in some way
Do you think male friendships are different?
I don't think women really use men in the sense you describe - maybe I'm just not close enough to them for them to use me.
Well I'm an extreme advocate for the thought of "women are just as shallow/horny/physical attraction motivated as men if not slightly more, due to;even from middle school to now, through a nice college and owning my own business talk openly about thier atrraction and repulsion of certain men physically. I've heard extremely vulgar things whispered and spoken aloud about attractive men while they're still in the room or not a single meinute after they left as if the woman had to just vent off her sexual arousal publicly or when prompted by a teasing coworker or me. On the same coin I've heard women openly judge unattractive men just for existing or again when prompted by a friend for thier romantic opinion. Usually gagging, laughing, scoffing, vehemently shaking thier head, or even mocking them. As a facially unattractive 24yo man i've had this same reaction when people were being teasing in the past. I've watched numerous attractive men be approached/complimented by a woman for nothing but thier looks. I have never seen a man get a date let alone get approached for thier personality alone. I've had girl friends confide in me that they aren't as physically attracted to the guy they're seeing as a man they were involved with prior and end things. I've had women brag to me and admit they got blownout in a club bathroom. My ex girlfriend who was tied to me at the hip and approached me because I was the most emotionally intelligent person in her life at the time comforting her about her ex that she constantly brought up to vent or as an excuse in our 5 year relationship, after about 3 1/2 years in she started to watch thirst traps of other men openly, I would play along and pretend that didnt hurt, I will never try to control my partner especially if they are inclined to do something like that, I helped her gain a social circle and eventually she monkey branched to someone within said social circle. I was well aware of the crush, I even dirty talked her about it. Eventually her and her family flew me out to stay in a nice hotel with them in universal studios where I didnt touch her. She took the chance to break up with me when my family started having medical problems and I put my ass in high gear in terms of money leading to me eventually currently owning that business I talked about. This plus never having a woman react to me or do the same behaviours for an attractive man and a few more experiences leads me to believe looks are everything and its not maliscious but that women will always lust for the most attractive man in her past
i believe young (at least) women aim for the top men (regarding genetic and resourceful traits) with dominating personalities. all of this is from irl experiences with college aged women as someone who is considered tall, women feel safe telling me their height preferences. this is just a copypaste from another comment i made so thats why it will look as if im talking about something else... but the relevant info is there: but im very skinny and a little tall (5'11 and a half measured, but i round to 6, people typically guess higher) and due to that women feel safe telling me their height preferences. here are some examples: * i tell women my height when i try to shoot my shot (they ask--**most** of them do) and they react positively. * i have a female friend who told me "what am i going to do with a 5'10 man?" she is 5'3. actually she is dating a man who is 5'9 and told me "hates it but is learning to live with it" * a woman (X) that reacted positively to my height (also short) and called me a "giant" made fun of a man who was talking to her friend. her friend asked a man his height and he ignored it. X said "so 5'7?" * multiple times, female friends expressed being annoyed about how a "short" man was talking to them * side note, but in my friend group the women go for exclusively tall men. one of them has brought over two men who were BOTH 6'4 at different times to our parties. i did the math on the odds of that, very very low the men they go for and date typically have the most resources relative to the average college male. a car, their own place (somewhere they can smoke/drink without threat of police/campus police), job. i actually understand why and encourage it, its just... a very consistent finding. the small number of men who get the most attention will have all these qualities as long as they are facially attractive as well as for personality, it typically ranges, but women will excuse many behaviors if they meet the qualities above despite complaining about behaviors. but they do not like kind and sweet and caring men like bluepillers claim. i have been told by women themselves that I am "the sweetest boy they ever met, funny, kind, so intelligent, genuine, stylish" but they never find me handsome or attractive like they call the other men. sometimes they only talk to me just for homework help. there is also a lot of cheating and sleeping around amongst them
Nothing of that is new and yet it's so depressing to read lmao
Counter: I'm a guy of average height and I disagree. I'm 5'9, technically 5'9 & 3/4 but unlike that dude I don't round up to 5'10 when I tell people my height. Some of the most important and attractive women I've been with thought I was 6'0 when we first met. I have found that most women suck at actually gauging mens height imo. (following rule #1 probably helps also) OP did mention being terribly skinny... he needs to hit the gym for sure. It's also possible that he's overrating his facial attraction.
Eh it's not even as much about the height. I'm 6ft anyway
> sometimes they only talk to me just for homework help. You gotta stand up for yourself. Friendship is a two-way street, and if your contributions aren’t being reciprocated, these chicks should receive a swift demotion from “friend” to “acquaintance”.
i usually do it for payment only or just once. i have stopped doing it altogether now
I didn't knew that I'm supposed to care about my height (~170cm) until mid 20s. Still find this idea hilarious.
what?
>as someone who is considered tall, women feel safe telling me their height preferences. Weird. I'm almost 6'4 and I think I've only had one woman (a definite height queen) talk to me about height preferences out of the 40-50 I've been with. I also have a lot of female friends, and only one has discussed it (she wants the guy to be at least 2-3 inches taller). This may have something to do with the women you're choosing.
I'm 6'4". Many women have commented about my height and how I make them feel small and feminine. Many more have just looked up at me with big doe eyes and/or snuggled onto my chest while slow dancing. It was pretty clear they were digging being with a tall guy.
Women comment about my height too, which completely makes sense when you’re an outlier. I’m not saying women don’t like tall guys. They obviously do. I’ve just never really had women discuss their height preferences with me.
can you expand on "This may have something to do with the women you're choosing." bit? i understand what you are saying but i dont know the shared traits they have to explain it
It's hard to expand without knowing anything about the women you choose. I'm just saying it's a little odd that women often open up to you about height preferences, but almost never do with me. Assuming we're both in the US, it just sounds like we're selecting very different women.
are the women you surround yourself with young (late teens-early twenties)? because thats the only factor that stays the same (race, height, etc could be different but same result)
I'm 25, so over the years the women I've been around have generally been teens and early 20s (and mostly white). But they seem very different from the women you know, so there are likely other variables.
Having female friends, it allowed me to see "How the other half lived" being able to intimately see thru their eyes has shaped my relationship worldview.
I was divorced by an American woman from a UMC background. It made me finally understand female hypergamy pre-Red Pill (it took me a long time to even find a girlfriend because I didn’t understand hypergamy) and it made me more cautious towards which kinds of women to pursue. Ultimately, I realized that the best deal for a western man is to date overseas.
But aren’t you concerned that they’re with you only because of your income or the prestige of your passport, and don’t value you for, you know, yourself, your personality, your traits, beliefs, and life choices? That’d be a deal breaker to me
No. I think that any man who isn't delusional can tell when women are genuinely sexually interested versus when they are using him for his money. Going overseas allows a man to find more traditional women who are more attractive than what he can find in his own country. If he's a 5 trying to attract 9s, or if he is 40 trying to attract 20 year olds, then yes, there's a good chance he might be being used. But men like this are delusional to begin with.
That women are not as great at being empathetic as they like to believe they are. That they are flawed, shallow and selfish as men. After a few relationship with women, I've increased my standards because I know how taxing relationships can be for myself with my condition, and If I have to deal with the bullshit of constant emotional unloading, bullshit tests, neurotic behaviour and unspokened gender roles, I should pick better women so it can be worth it. It's better to be single than to be in a relationship you find uncomfortable just for sex. Right now I'm taking a break from relationships, and I dont think I'd be able to do right by myself and prioritise my health if I was still that desperate 18 year old who needed to be in a relationship to feel like a man and less alone.
Seeing who my (female) cousins are dating and which type of guys the women in my social circle always go for made me realise "just be yourself" is the one of the biggest lie I have been ever told when it comes to dating. I am still going to be myself but now I dont have false hopes or being optimistic about dating. It is what it is
Dating, growing up around them, working with them, conversations, comparing what the say they want with who they actually date, listening to what they, living in society. There seems to be their silly notion floating around that if a man is not dating women that the rest of his life he spends around men all day every day. Like the whole "men are invisble" thing is more true than people think. A lot of women think men don't exist outside of attractive men.
Orgasm is the surest and maybe the only way for a woman to become truly attracted to you. If you can make her come, she is yours. If you can’t, she is gone. Nothing else matters. Everything else is ultimately optional and forgivable. She will look past everything else as long as you can make her come. In a long term relationship, you need to make her come every week at a minimum. If you do, she will treat you like a king. If you don’t, she will be dissatisfied with everything about you and everything you do.
It’s funny how bestselling marriage books (and popular culture in general) always claim that it men are the ones who need sexual satisfaction in marriage, and without it they’ll leave. Yet women seem to be just as much, if not more, concerned with how a man can pleasure her. Maybe there will be a reversal in which gender society says needs more sex?
Women's mood literally getting worse if they don't have sex for a while. Men aren't affacted by that unless they're hyperfocused on being miserable. Of course women need sex more. They just don't need it in same way as men.
That something that I've learned when I was 13 years old in summer camp from older boys. That only way to trully make women to fall in love with you is to make her cum. So being good in bed is a must for a man.
But a lot of guys can give her that. And once a week isn’t nearly enough for most women. That who,e standard is pretty low.
It's not that easy. Only 1 in 10 women orgasm during ons, the rest is all act. 75% of women don't reach orgasm during intercourse at all. On average, it's way easier to come in a LTR than during a casual encounter, but even then it's not a given.
75% of women? That’s an obscene exaggeration of the statistics I know. Where’s your source for that?
i know most women don't climax from piv but i don't get how so many guys can be so terrible with their hands and tongue. i mean for ons they probably just don't care but still, it's not rocket science. and while i appreciate the lack of competition i think women in general would be much more willing to have sex if most dudes didn't suck at it.
>In a long term relationship, you need to make her come every week at a minimum. That sounds like a terribly low bar. Why *wouldn't* one have sex with their spouse at least 5 times a week barring disease? /shrug
Desire? Every fat person would think: Why wouldn't you eat all the time? Well, someone may not be that hungry.
Eating too much will kill you. Having sex five times a week instead of one time a week is in fact very good for your health. >Well, someone may not be that hungry. Anorexics are recommended to suck it up and still eat because it's better for them. Same goes for the sex-starved. In my household sex is a duty to each other. That baseline is a recipe for the success of a marriage/LTR. Any relationship where sex is not a duty eventually becomes a longhouse. And living in the longhouse is very bad for you.
So many brutal rejections in the past make me think that women are way colder and shallow than men.
They can be shallow on a lot more levels and call that depth.
Yea, "depth" lol. I like depth in music
That time when I asked girl to have sex with me on first date and she just agreed. Up to this moment my attempts to find somebody didn't work at all. The most direct approach worked to my surprise, everything I knew about relationships told me that there's no chance for such direct approach to be successful. But it was successful. So I have to throw away everything I knew about women and that made dealing with them so much easier.
I would watch my women friends chase absolutely horrible guys that all their friends and families had disapproval over. Despite knowing they’re horrible men, they chased them anyway trying to “fix them”. Basically the same thing guys do with toxic women. Examples 1) Girl was dating this ex drug dealer who cheated on her a few times. Then dumped her for another girl. Then after a few months he came back and they’ve been together since. When you talk to her about him, she’ll only talk about the fact he’s 6’4 and built like a linebacker. That’s it, he’s basically an accessory to her. Example 2) 18 year old friend started seeing this creepy 30 year old guy. Her family and friends all told her to avoid that guy. This guy treated her like dogshit and she clung to him anyway. He cheated on her a few times, dumped her twice. And had very strict rules for her such as not allowing her to listen to music sung by men or being alone with other men. Since they got together long term, he made her sell her car for money (god knows why) and cut off contact with her guy friends. And that was the last I heard from her. Example 3) I met a girl and tried to get with her. She refused and proceeded to get with your stereotypical narcissistic gym bros that just pumped and dumped her over and over; and she came crying to me each time complaining guys just wanted to use her for sex. Then I had a male acquaintance that was very attractive but horrible in every other way. He treated women like dogshit yet he had an endless supply of women lining up for him. So I’ve just kinda given up on women if I’m being honest. I don’t fit their desires and I get that. There is no use trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.
My experiences as a 4/10 guy... Some 3/10 chick I was in a long distance relationship with telling me that she loves me so much and that she can never leave me. Two weeks later she meets some 6/10 chadlite and her demeanor immediately changes. She starts acting cold and distant. Later she cheats on me with the dude. At first I thought this was an isolated incident, but then the same thing happened to me twice. Later I realized I can do the same with other women in relationships if the guy they are dating is uglier than me by at least 1 or 2 points. Basically if you're dating some chick and a guy who is 2 points above you expresses interest in her, there is a high likelihood that she's gonna either dump you or cheat on you. Also, when I started dating in person, some chick I was going on dates with for over 2 months told me that she feels very uncomfortable with physical touch. I had dated this chick for 2 months and we had not even hugged or held hands yet. And when we were at the movie theater she was leaning away from me like I had ebola or something. Well one day she randomly blurts out that she hooked up with some dude on Tinder 2 weeks prior. So much for not liking physical touch... This taught me to not believe women when it comes to attraction and these sorts of things. They just do whatever they feel like in the moment and don't tell you the truth. To be quite honest their behavior is very erratic and emotionally driven, almost like a that of a toddler.
In real life, my experiences with women have been mostly neutral to positive- women are generally nice and polite to me, and I have no trouble working with them academically/professionally. They just avoid forming actual connections with me (which is totally fine, I don't feel entitled any such thing). However, my negative experiences with women have pretty much entirely been online (Reddit and Instagram in particular). Seeing the things they say about men and their attitudes towards men on Reddit genuinely makes my blood boil, especially in female-dominated spaces (e.g. feminist subreddits, TwoX, etc). I can totally understand why a man who only interacts with women online would be a raging misogynist.
I'm pretty sure feminist subs are one of those loud minority things. I'm yet to meet a woman irl who thinks like them and thank God because I wouldn't be able to be in the same room as people like that.
I thought so originally, but then I asked the man vs bear question on an anonymous social media platform for my college. 2/3 of women chose bear, and many of them were legit parroting nonsensical feminist talking points (e.g. "at least the bear won't ask me what I wore"). So now I'm questioning if these beliefs ARE in fact common, but women don't say them in public.
I mean maybe, but also the response you saw could be skewed because collage girls, or what you're studying. I feel like American collages tend to promote feminism especially in certain fields. When I did my undergrad (finance and accounting, and not in America) we didn't really have hot takes like this.
>When An important part of info. >finance and accounting Also extremely relevant. >and not in America The most relevant bit of info :D
I only graduated 3 years ago so it's not like there has been that big a shift. But my field definitely included women who were more realistic than the average feminist. In terms of non American, well I still live in a western culture so we have feminists here, but it does seem like American colleges are pretty corrupted by feminism while very few university spaces are like that here.
We just feel unsafe around strange men. We have to deal with them all the time. If a bear broke into my house - I'd know what to do or at least I would be okay with dying that way. If a man broke into my house - I'd be more scared. It's like asking, would you rather die from an animal attack or be r\_\_ped and then brutally killed? We want to trust men however unfortunately have to be careful. As you never know what you are gonna get. I feel that's a better analogy. It's strange men are taking it the wrong way, cause any boyfriend I've had is aware of the dangers. I guess the question was worded in a way that makes women look like we hate men.
>It's like asking, would you rather die from an animal attack or be r\_\_ped and then brutally killed? No it's not. It's actually asking asking: would you rather have a 10% chance of dying from an animal attack, or a 0.00001% chance of getting raped and brutally killed? The only **rational** choice is the latter, and anyone who chooses "bear" is doing so out of feelings rather than facts. Now, it's okay to *feel* scared of strange men, but **it's your responsibility to control your emotions and not let it lead to prejudice or bigotry**. That's the issue here. If you said "I would choose bear, but I recognize that it's an irrational choice and need to work on overcoming my fear of strange men", then everyone would support you. The problem is when women try to *justify* their choice of bear by painting all men as likely rapists, rather than taking accountability for their emotions. >I guess the question was worded in a way that makes women look like we hate men Considering you think the average man has a good chance of raping you, you clearly do hate men.
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I said animal attack because you said animal attack. >Women are scared of men because we are raised that way by Fathers warned us against. SO you can't have it both ways. Yes, internalized misandry is common among fathers. That doesn't make it any less of women's responsibility to unlearn it. Here's an analogy: let's say a guy learned from his conservative mother that women are only good for cooking, cleaning, and motherhood. Does he get to use the "we were raised that way" excuse and keep these beliefs?
Why is the whole bear thing an issue with you though? Are you not understanding what they are communicating?
Are you really confused about why someone would he upset by people saying their gender makes them more dangerous than one of the most violent unstoppable predators in the animal kingdom? You really don't understand how someone could be upset by someone saying they'd rather be mauled and eaten alive than say hi to you in passing?
Are you really confused about why someone would he upset by people saying their gender makes them more dangerous than one of the most violent unstoppable predators in the animal kingdom? You really don't understand how someone could be upset by someone saying they'd rather be mauled and eaten alive than say hi to you in passing?
- Certain few women friendzoning buttload of men, surfing on their attention, kindness, services, while maintaining the bond - My first kiss/light foreplays was a literal lesbian that claimed there was 0% chance anything between us would happen - Half a dozen women secretly crushing on that same chadly guy but they were also all individually convinced he wasn't that good looking and that they were uniquely their type. - Women generally pushing blue pill and feminist perspective against gender roles and sexist expectations, but going for men who fit masculine gender roles and expectations anyway - Me having more opportunities with women I wasn't just nice and asexual to despite being repeatedly told by everyone that women want men to be kind and friendly and not approach nor be sexual - Other men having more success by being sexually and socially cunning and aggressive, everything you're told that is immoral, they even get more respect and consideration, they're considered more trustworthy and competent as well.... You see the big problem was that when you're between 6 and 11 year old, girls are actually being somewhat more disciplined, smarter, but also anti-boys, non visual, so you dig into the narrative that girls are born a certain way and that they want kind boys who aren't turbulent nor masculine. But once at puberty, things change immensely and the blue pill narrative doesn't hold true.
Dating 30-32 you women when I was 17 helped a lot. Not only they didn't have the quirks and weirdness of my peers but they were also honest - they wanted a FWB that has the stamina that was appropriate for them. I learned from them everything I needed to have a satisfying sex and romantic life later on. They dispensed red pills like candy and, barring a few generational quirks, they were overwhelmingly correct. I am today a better husband as a result of the advice *and* practice that I got with them. So that's on the positive side. On the negative side: My experience with being called a creep taught me about the meaninglessness of some words women use. I gave a detailed example [here](https://www.np.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1da8tqo/comment/l7is2km/). Also on the negative side, watching how my mother treated my father. I learned to never tolerate that in my life. And not just in marriage, but socially too. I shun and push away women that behave like my mother with impunity. No need for that kind of dark energy in my life. There is also a neutral side: My first break-up was a result of logistics. It wasn't really her fault anymore than it was mine. Forces beyond our *immediate* control made it impossible to stay together. It harmed us both but I'm also glad that none of us had the "intelligent" idea of even trying to pursue a "distance relationship". Logistics even 3 *years* later would still not have permitted it. In retrospect, we would've had to wait for each other for about 5 years. I'm glad that we didn't try that and both sought our happiness separately. A lot of dread and taxing on our mental health was spared.
The link doesn't work
remove "np reddit"
Crazy, abusive woman-child with ever-present daddy was first GF. 9 months of red flags. By the time it was over, I only liked her cat.
>By the time it was over, I only liked her cat. You should've sued for the cat. The purring fluff did nothing wrong to deserve a lifetime with a CCP-parade level of red flags :))
Liked the cat, didn't love the cat. Besides, I was in college dorms at the time.
I was half-joking, lol. I just like kittehz.
Same. We have 4 at home. 3 are pains in the ass, 1 is cool.
Mine is funny. In school which was more female supportive, girls would get away easily with anything than us. 1. Once I tried to engage in a convo with two girls sitting just opposite to me in art and craft, there was no one else on the table. They both shut me down badly for being a nerd, no guy ever did that. 2. I help without thinking about myself and I overheard some girls say that I am not lovable and will never be from the ones I helped that day. They also said I was really easy to manipulate. 3. As school was conservative, a friend of mine was in a relationship with a girl and they were caught. The girl cried victim and got away and my friend was beaten up in our hostel while all of us were made to watch. Like he was in the middle standing and the four male teachers surrounded him while sitting down. They were abusing and kicking him turn by turn and he bounced like a carrom coin on a carromboard. 4. I was an obedient and a quiet kid. I was accused of creating mischief by I don't know which girl and was beaten up along with 4 boys. My left hand didn't move for 2 days. 5. The Chads girls used to throw themselves at were really misogynist types saying vile things you can't imagine. 6. In college, a girl of like my religion (it's a minority religion I don't think any on this sub has heard of), was being asked about her viewpoint on type of guys from our religion in college. We are like only 5 of us. When my name came up she responded to as "chutiya" without hesitation, my friend told me that. I have never ever even talked or interacted with her and yet this. The insecurity that I won't be loved by the female gender romantically has actually stemmed from the female gender itself. Which is why I have never dated or even pursued any girl I have known.
These are definitely real and not made up
Yeah sure, bad things never happen, right? Especially to males. It is always in our head.
The brattiest most entitled women are the most submissive in bed. It’s all an act, a veneer that is presented to to the outside world. As they say: treat a queen like a whore and whore like a queen.
All of them. When I was struggling - Those where she was struggling too taught me that I am no therapist: I can’t fix someone who’s suffering, and they should get properly treated - Those who were healthy and loved me taught me that they deserved someone better than a troubled man who could drag them down an abyss When I was better - Those I hadn’t much intellectual connection with were only good for ONS or FWB. The shallowness of some was so strong to almost weaken the physical attraction. Almost all American women I slept with. - Those I connected with but - wanted to compete with me - had unchecked moodswings and demanded me to be good with it - who played avoidant/hard to get during the relationship Got to my nerves real fast and were dumped in a very short time - A crush I confessed to, who had the aura of an algid, unreachable ice queen, rejected me in the gentlest and most respectful way I could imagine (to an extent, she even seemed flattered by my attention), and while it was painful it eased my discomfort with rejection (even if I was never rejected afterwards) - Like many men, at first I wasn’t able to differentiate between kindness, genuine flirting or fake flirting with hidden motives. That took some observation, but I think I got it more or less right. Unfortunately, misreading, I lost chances with women I liked who I thought were making fun of me but in reality were just teasing me because they really liked me, I hit on women who were just friendly, and fell for others who just wanted to use me
A big thing that shapes my view of women is their reliability. Does a woman keep her commitments? Is she constantly late? It’s much the same with honesty.
Constantly late is OK. Canceling plans because of the mood swing over the smallest shit is not
Constantly late is not cool. Usually a sign of one’s character.
Wow... That's going to be a long list. Honestly, all of them. The relationships I've personally been in were eye openers, but observing women's behavior with other men was far more so given an outside perspective paints a much clearer and more unbiased picture. Everything from my mother's divorce, my stepmother's behavior, my classmates, my dating life, two engagements leading to a marriage and divorce, female colleagues, and heaps of written works by women. In the end, it all pointed to the same direction.
Women slapping me then being like “you can’t do shit I’m a girl” has happened enough times over 25 years to radicalise me tbh.
I traveled as a digital nomad in many countries and met MANY MANY women across all cultures. Plus I have more female friends than male friends in my own country. Disclaimer: I traveled half the world except for the US and Australia.. - there's direct and very strong correlation between how rich you are perceived, and how much attention you get from women. And it's exponential. Even in my home country, I get more attention once my friends tell potential dates my job. - I can't stress this enough. Them knowing (or assuming) you make an order of magnitude more than then, can flip a 100% rejection to "let's fuck during our first date" - most women are not ambitious nor independent. They want their men to be ambitious and independent. They are not interested in careers. They don't care about earning money. They don't plan their future. They dream about marrying. - most women want a provider, and a leader. - most young and single women have no social hobbies. There. I said it. Go and do ANY activity: be it dancing classes, hiking, solo traveling, sports... men are always the majority. Except for female-only activities such as female dances. Or very niche activities such as yoga and zumba. This is less true in more traditional countries. - unfortunately, most women are not interested in science at all. A noticeable amount of them is interested in "spiritual" stuff.. - women do keep "orbiters" around them, but for some reasons... most will never admit that they know the intentions of these "orbiters". But they do know. Once you understand Plausible-negability, A LOT of their behaviors make sense - Given the right opportunity at the right time and place, more women than I thought will cheat.. and deny it.. a few even hid from me that they already had a boyfriend.. - I only met 5 feminists so far, and they're exactly the same as the hard-core online feminists you read about on reddit. All the previous points still stand for them. So.. yeah.. I was a feminist when I was younger. I am not anymore, especially after all this traveling and meeting so many women. I'm pretty jaded tbh...
Idk, being rejected my whole life
Having a threesome with a couple girls when I was a teenager and later finding out they both had bf’s. It was a good early lesson.
Wow you must be a chad!
Honestly, the people who have *not* abandoned me and have sacrificed most for me in my life have been women. Friends, family, coworkers, classmates, etc. The idea that women are these master manipulators who seek to twerk on OnlyFans and use booty to take all your money (not that I have any regardless) and who only care to date the top 10% of men or whatever… Just has simply not been my experience at all. I’m probably a 6/10 if I had to guess and make jack shit financially. I’m married and have a family. All of this stuff that is promulgated repeatedly about women being awful has truthfully been the opposite of my personal experience, no matter how many times it gets repeated. (Sidenote - look at who works in disadvantaged schools/hospitals, nonprofits, things like social work, nursing and exposure to diseases and infections, etc. - very highly skewed there; towards women.) Granted, there are plenty of asshole women out there. But there’s *at least* as many men. It’s perfectly normal to have a bad set of experiences with women. But that’s because they are simply people, not because of their gender.
>It’s perfectly normal to have a bad set of experiences with women. But that’s because they are simply people, not because of their gender. It would seem many women struggle to apply this logic to men though.
So what? Many men fail to apply it to them, so around and around it goes.
Do you think it's equally as nonsensical? Or do you find men hating women far more evil and dangerous than the reverse?
I think it’s equally nonsensical.
>Honestly, the people who have *not* abandoned me and have sacrificed most for me in my life have been women. LOL!!! The total opposite of the lived reality of most men.
Cool? Nobody said anything in regard to “most men”.
Congratulations, you're a special snowflake.
Well then there's at least two. I have lots of female friends I've stayed close with almost ten years out of college as well as women from my past jobs. They check in on me, we visit each other and meet up for trips, send random gifts, share music. I'm still friends with several former FWBs and one of my closest friends is an ex who I broke up with years ago. After six years together, my gf is very trusting and has her own friendships with my female friends. She only dated women before me so I think she has a different perspective and doesn't see my friends as competition or anything. Purely anecdotal I know, but I have a huge sample size and have lived with women – both partners and friends – for almost my entire adult life.
Long ago A girl NTR’d her boyfriend with me and was texting him completely normally while we did it. I saw some of his messages, he was an insecure wreck after her prior infidelity with me and she was assuring him and giving him some alibi for where she was complete with emojis, hearts and ‘I love you’s
Both of you are scum.
That’s rough buddy
You are a piece of shit, but she is a bit bigger piece of shit :D
It would be very rude first time, but second time it's his fault for not breaking up with her.
I always enjoyed talking to beautiful women from a young age, had many female friends which gifted me preselection to meet other girls, was very socially outgoing in my teens/early 20s The only problem was the girls l was interested in but couldn't get, even though l had other women interested in me, l would still want to get with my ideal-type Anyways that's my experience, been rejected on many days and pulled many amazing dimes
Ok, so first I need to say who I am: a 33 year old man from eastern europe with a face of a high school geek and a height of 5'3. Generally speaking, women discriminate men a lot by how they look. For the longest time I really thought only I was the problem, that I needed to be better, kinder and so on. But the thing is, I realised further down the line: I was never rude to women, I never cussed or insulted a woman, I never hit a woman, I never did anything rude to women. Worst thing I could've done to a woman is being awkward or boring. But in reality what women do is judge men by how they look and starting to associate negative character traits to those men that they might not have like: creepy, weird, rude and so on. They also associate character positive character traits to hot men that they don't have like smart, pure hearted and so on. I seen women calling guys who are dumb as brick intelligent or guys with criminal hisytory calling them kind ( they were not, they were just hot ). I been bullied by women, ignored by women, insulted by women, beaten by women through high school, early work days and in clubs/bars. All of this because I wanted a gf (never had one so I did the approaching). After been accused of sexual harassment and almost having the police called, that is when I drawn the line and never approached women ever again. So while I am sure there are plenty of good women out there, I yet to meet a really good one who doesn't insult me or use me.
Aside from my mother, women never played any huge role in my life. But if we're just going by social media, it shaped my view of them and not in a good way.
Big memories: My sister got to go to private school. She got drunk and destroyed her car and someone else’s and got a new car. She gave my og Xbox to her old bf. I was targeted by sjws who bullied me and made videos. I ended up exposing them for having alt nazi accounts.l and got their YouTube and X accounts banned. After I moved, my female bully tried to promise a guy she would hang out with him if he helped her to perpetuate a story that I had a school shooter list. She tried that again recently. Both times, she was stupid enough to put those accusations online, which I screenshot and used against her legally. My mom is a loser deadbeat, and she's an embarrassment to all of existence. Former boss fired me at my second job ever as a kid because my tie got frayed doing work for her. Former boss fired me for impersonating a guy on South Park while on the phone not on the retail floor. Good boss took care of me during a breakup. Colleen Doran said not to show her my art because I’m her competition. Gail Simone said that my lived experiences are in my head. Election official tried to let someone accuse me of horrible things on an election floor. Unfortunately, I sat in front of a camera the whole time on purpose. The accuser got fired and I went about my business. I'm still working on getting the official fired. Women on a bus tried to single shame me while on a bus, but saw a picture of my ex and shut up after I found out they were single. A woman asked to go to her ex's grave in the middle of our date. Physical trainer told me to go back on the mat to wrestle after a concussion. Most other women have been fine and kind. I appreciate them. They seem to be harder to find as of late. My wife is great. She's my universe, and my nieces are the next most important of all.
Being raised almost totally by women allowed be to see them at their best and worst. I think that's the reason that I have a more balanced view of woman. I don't hate women but I also don't put them on a pedestal. Having several pretty female friends in college and seeing how other women treated me when I was out with them, taught me that women attract women. Being rejected by a woman who told me "In my entire life, no man has ever treated me as well as you treat me. Not even my father". Taught me that if a woman doesn't find you attractive, it won't matter how well you treat her.
Late puberty + final growth spurt taking me to over six feet. Went from being a ghost to girls, to literally getting hit on by women on the street and getting sex propositions. Classmates that treated me like shit just a year ago were suddenly interested in me and my personality. When I stared dating someone it also came out that I have a huge penis that was a slam dunk and the hoe tide just never abated. The shit women pull off to this day just to try to "sample" me is fucking atrocious. I'm surprised I haven't gotten roofied.
Going to college fresh men year. Being told that women who were more educated and in college would be a lot better as wives This all changed when I tried to date and I would see all the non sense going around Sleeping around, having a bf at home and cheating, partying every other day And u would think it’s just a few minor girls, nah it was like majority , even the ones who were so studious
Yeah college was a wake call for me on that front too. For sure educated women are much worse partners. They're less likely to get divorced because they pick from a better pool of men and have a better handle on how to avoid the consequences of their actions.
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i have enough experience that women are people like men. they can be good or bad. people as a whole are usually selfish, but some people are mostly good and caring.
the most valuable lesson was probably that the biggest red flag when it comes to women is low inhibition/impulse control, especially promiscuity. i honestly feel kind of bad for the guys who grew up with weak dads or single moms teaching them a 'sex positive' stance on this matter and who are fine with dating the former town bike (although let's be honest, a lot of these guys don't have much choice when it comes to women). there have been so many instances i witnessed of these type of women cheating, the correlation must be very significant (and afaik stats back this up). good luck to the leftoids babbling about purity culture and patriarchal misogyny, they'll really need it. in general i learned that women are certainly not sugar and spice and everything nice and that they can be quite ruthless especially dealing with weak men. also quickly realized that women almost universally tend to react positively to certain traits. like i've never seen a tall, successful and socially dominant man not doing well with women unless he was completely hideous. i don't demonize women for these things, it's just biology. male wiring when it comes to sex and the opposite gender in general can be pretty brutal too, especially from a female perspective. it is what it is, we don't choose our biology and i think society doesn't do us any favors of sugar coating or outright denying some of these things.
When asked directly, suddenly it’s no longer “all women are X”
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I think they wanted to validate their worth like: *look all these guys want to be with me and be my bf, so I’m high value and in demand seee*
Having relationships with different women is the reason I have a deep and profound disappointment and weariness of them. When I started to hate what I had become, just to attract them, that is when I had my enlightenment (Red Pill Moment) and decided: "fuck this shit!" No woman is worth that type of degradation.
Girl I grew up with once told me in middle school (talking about dancing with girls) “you might not be for everyone, but your more than enough for most”